What if Men Had to Follow Female Beauty Rules?

[TheBigQuestion]

 

Also, this isn't a thread about the pressures of both genders by society as a whole. It's just about the pressures women have to face when it comes to beauty. That's just one small aspect of the whole thing.

 

I agree. But then again, it's pretty tough for any thread on this board to NOT turn into a gender-based pissing contest.

[AD1980]

 

Not to mention the whole idea that men stand around talking about women's bodies with one another. A lot of men have done that in front of me and talked about how certain physical attributes made them barf or something when they saw a woman naked. I've had some of those attributes and it hurt really bad when I heard them say that. They are things I'd have to get surgery to fix. Girls sometimes talk about how hot this or that guy is, but they usually don't sit around talking about how certain physical attributes in men make them want to barf.

 

 

Please women are just as harsh as Men..Ive heard women talk about how ugly some guys face is numerous times..Ive seen people get rejected and been rejected myself harshly by numerous times by women acting like how dare i even invade their airspace just for approaching them even though i was nothing but nice and complemenatary just because im not attratcive to them..

 

You act like women have no standards of beauty for Men when Male height or lack of is probably the biggets phyiscal dealbreaker in the dating world..Im 5'7 1/2-5'8 and probably about half the female population wouldnt even give me a chance off my height alone..

 

SO if u want to keep pretending the male gender is all shallow pigs and women are these compassionate creatures who love a guy for whats on the inside then you can continue being dellusional..

[Enchanted Girl]

Please women are just as harsh as Men..Ive heard women talk about how ugly some guys face is numerous times..Ive seen people get rejected and been rejected myself harshly by numerous times by women acting like how dare i even invade their airspace just for approaching them even though i was nothing but nice and complemenatary just because im not attratcive to them..

 

You act like women have no standards of beauty for Men when Male height or lack of is probably the biggets phyiscal dealbreaker in the dating world..Im 5'7 1/2-5'8 and probably about half the female population wouldnt even give me a chance off my height alone..

 

SO if u want to keep pretending the male gender is all shallow pigs and women are these compassionate creatures who love a guy for whats on the inside then you can continue being dellusional..

 

No, you guys just keep putting words in my mouth. It's a lot about the fact that you don't want to admit that women have a lot of pressure to be beautiful on them.

 

First of all, more than once I have stated that both men and women put the pressure on women to be beautiful. So I wasn't even saying that all men are pigs or something. I wasn't even putting all the blame on them.

 

Secondly, I am the biggest supporter of the idea that there are exceptions to everything. Also, I never said that men didn't have ANY standards of beauty on themselves. Just like I don't think women never get pressured to make money. They do sometimes by certain romantic partners and people, although I don't think it's as big of problem for women as it is for men though.

 

Thirdly, if you were rich, no one would give a crap about your height. Tom Cruise is shorter than you. Do you know how many women have lusted over him over the years? There is a reason for that.

 

@TheBigQuestion: I think I'm starting to see that. I'm fairly new, joined this place this month and I thought that when I first started posting in this section that the gender war thing was a rare thing. It seems rampant now.

[Untouchable_Fire]

Yea, that's why men have so many eating disorders and body dysmorphic disorder, right? =/ I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but it's definitely not as common because they don't have the same degree of pressure. You're just being purposefully ignorant about it and not even giving reasons as to why you believe society is this way.

 

A HUGE number of men have these issues, but they don't talk about it and don't get treatment or even acknowledgement. Fact is that if a guy has mental issues... the attitude is "rub some dirt on it"

 

I've seen you yourself be very callous and disregarding of the guys here who have issues. They have these issues because of low self esteem and poor experiences with women.

 

The only part I can agree with you on is that men are expected to make a lot of money. If you were a billionaire, you could spend lots of your money purposefully making yourself more ugly and still get women to date you on a regular basis, very beautiful women, too. A lot of women would rather a man that was rich than a man that was handsome if they had to choose.

 

Your really forgetting something big. You can't just make lots of money... you also can't be a workaholic. So you have to make lots of money without too much effort. Otherwise you won't be able to provide the required amount of attention.

 

But the point is, in society you can get away with not looking super handsome. If you have an ugly day, none of your friends are going to come up to you and pick on you for it, even though guys are exceedingly honest with one another. They may do it jokingly, but it won't be vicious, like it would be towards a girl. If I have an ugly day, men and women I don't even know might come up to me and make comments about it. If I gain weight, lots of people will lecture me about it. It doesn't matter how much I make or anything else I do, if I do not have these qualities, people are going to be upset at me for it because how dare I. I don't even have to want to date any of these people. Just being there friends is enough.

 

That is a ridiculous assumption. I work in sales and most of my buyers are female. How I look has just as much effect on how well I do as what I say does. I routinely work with colleagues who are fat or ugly... and often times they can't even get a meeting.

 

I get the exact same response when I gain weight... with the added bonus that it becomes nearly impossible to get a date.

 

How many times in your life have people told you,"Let me give you a make-over?" Me, it's been about a million because they need and want me to live up to their standard of beauty. Also, I've been told a million times,"Let's go on a diet together!" It gets old really having to hear about how everyone around me insists on helping me improve my appearance. They are just saying over and over again,"You are ugly. I have to fix you."

 

No... that's not what they are saying. Putting a new roof on a mansion is an improvement... but that doesn't mean the house was ugly to begin with.

 

Your issues come not from how those around you treat you... but in how you see yourself.

 

Not to mention the whole idea that men stand around talking about women's bodies with one another. A lot of men have done that in front of me and talked about how certain physical attributes made them barf or something when they saw a woman naked. I've had some of those attributes and it hurt really bad when I heard them say that. They are things I'd have to get surgery to fix. Girls sometimes talk about how hot this or that guy is, but they usually don't sit around talking about how certain physical attributes in men make them want to barf.

 

Seriously? Like what? I can't think of a single example of this.

 

Men get stuck on the idea of porn and it gets shoved in my face regularly as well. Men don't have porn giving them unrealistic standards to live by (except for dick size, I suppose.) Pay attention to the men in porn next time you watch it. There's a lot of them that have pot bellies and various attributes that most women don't find super attractive. Because it only matters that the girl is hot.

 

Unrealistic standards? Do you realize that Grandma porn is getting popular now...

 

Also, this isn't a thread about the pressures of both genders by society as a whole. It's just about the pressures women have to face when it comes to beauty. That's just one small aspect of the whole thing.

 

Yes, this thread is about societal gender pressures.

 

It isn't really a pissing match either.... I'm not unaware of what women face. However, you all seem totally ignorant of what men have to go through.

[Enchanted Girl]

A HUGE number of men have these issues, but they don't talk about it and don't get treatment or even acknowledgement. Fact is that if a guy has mental issues... the attitude is "rub some dirt on it"

 

I worded the way I talked about this for a reason. I purposefully stated that some men go through this as well. I just said that it was less common than it was among women. I still maintain that.

 

I've seen you yourself be very callous and disregarding of the guys here who have issues. They have these issues because of low self esteem and poor experiences with women.

 

That's your opinion. That's not factual. Also, it's bad form to argue in a debate by attacking the other person's character. It doesn't prove or disprove anything. A person can be a horrible person and still be right.

 

Your really forgetting something big. You can't just make lots of money... you also can't be a workaholic. So you have to make lots of money without too much effort. Otherwise you won't be able to provide the required amount of attention.

 

What part of this is an argument? I was talking about how men have lots of pressure by society to make lots of money. Saying that men are expected to make lots of money without too much effort is just agreeing with me . . . .

 

When I feel sorry for you guys in a certain way, why do you take it like an insult? I'm GLAD that I don't have pressure to make lots of money, but I hate that women have all this pressure to be beautiful. I'm glad to know that's a horrible way to view the world.

 

What you are really asking me is to admit that women don't have as much pressure as men do, which I won't. I'm not even saying that women have MORE pressure than men do in ALL aspects of society. I'm just saying they have more pressure in this ONE area.

 

I get the exact same response when I gain weight... with the added bonus that it becomes nearly impossible to get a date.

 

You get people watching what you eat? Your father saying to you,"That will go straight to your thighs." People ripping out food from your hands? People asking you every day if you want to go on a diet with them? People telling you that you are unlovable?

 

No... that's not what they are saying. Putting a new roof on a mansion is an improvement... but that doesn't mean the house was ugly to begin with.

 

It does mean what I said. This is an area where I was complaining about how girls treat each other when it comes to looks. They never say these things to friends they consider pretty. A bunch of girls have seen the movie Clueless where they makeover a nerdy girl and they think it's their job to makeover nerdy/ugly girls.

 

And usually when they talk about it, they tell me all about all my blemishes and how to improve them.

 

They've never once said,"You're beautiful already, but-" It's always about how I am ugly in this way or that.

 

Your issues come not from how those around you treat you... but in how you see yourself.

 

So all this talk about the pressure men have to face in society . . .

 

They just come from you and how you see yourself. Not from those around you.

 

Is that how I'm supposed to relate to your complaints?

 

Seriously? Like what? I can't think of a single example of this.

 

What example am I supposed to give you? I know times that men have talked about appearance in front of me, many, many times, but I don't want to talk about it because the issues I have with my body are private things.

 

I guess I could find a thread on an old forum I posted on possibly if it's still around. I remember one of these conversations happening there.

 

Unrealistic standards? Do you realize that Grandma porn is getting popular now...

 

Let's have a show of hands of how many people like Grandma porn in this thread then. If it's so common, then it should be a lot.

 

Yes, this thread is about societal gender pressures.

 

It isn't really a pissing match either.... I'm not unaware of what women face. However, you all seem totally ignorant of what men have to go through.

 

I'm not ignorant of anything. This is JUST talking about appearance. Look at the title of the thread and the article on the first page.

 

If the title of the thread was,"If women had the pressure to make as much money as men do", I would not be claiming that women had more pressure in that area because that would be insane. They don't.

[TheBigQuestion]

This thread just makes me wonder about a lot of things, especially what the male posters say. If you ask any guy here, you'd think that no one under 5'7" ever gets a date, no one who is a student (and usually fairly poor) can get dates, no one without a really outgoing and fantastic personality gets a date, and so forth. I just find this incredibly hard to believe, and it makes me wonder where on planet Earth all you dudes live. I've known plenty of guys under 5'7" who don't have much trouble finding women who are interested. Plenty of average looking/goofy guys who have had (or have) girlfriends. Virtually everyone in my friend group is either a grad student, finishing undergrad, or relatively underemployed, yet lots of them have girlfriends or, if they choose to, can sometimes find FWB, etc. Yes, some of these guys are better looking than others, some are taller than others, but NONE of them are wealthy, their personalities vary greatly, and the vast majority do not have super model good looks and chiseled abs. So please, someone tell me where this insanely defeatist attitude comes from again?? Because it has no basis in reality.

 

And as I've said many times, I'm not exactly living in the boonies here. I spent my entire life in the NYC metro area, and now live 5 miles from Philadelphia. These are not the friendliest dating grounds, and it seems like most of my acquaintances generally do alright. That's not to say there aren't dry spells, frustration, fights with girls, or that they never get cheated on, but still, this is such a ridiculous and fictitious attitude.

[Enchanted Girl]

This thread just makes me wonder about a lot of things, especially what the male posters say. If you ask any guy here, you'd think that no one under 5'7" ever gets a date, no one who is a student (and usually fairly poor) can get dates, no one without a really outgoing and fantastic personality gets a date, and so forth. I just find this incredibly hard to believe, and it makes me wonder where on planet Earth all you dudes live. I've known plenty of guys under 5'7" who don't have much trouble finding women who are interested. Plenty of average looking/goofy guys who have had (or have) girlfriends. Virtually everyone in my friend group is either a grad student, finishing undergrad, or relatively underemployed, yet lots of them have girlfriends or, if they choose to, can sometimes find FWB, etc. Yes, some of these guys are better looking than others, some are taller than others, but NONE of them are wealthy, their personalities vary greatly, and the vast majority do not have super model good looks and chiseled abs. So please, someone tell me where this insanely defeatist attitude comes from again?? Because it has no basis in reality.

 

And as I've said many times, I'm not exactly living in the boonies here. I spent my entire life in the NYC metro area, and now live 5 miles from Philadelphia. These are not the friendliest dating grounds, and it seems like most of my acquaintances generally do alright. That's not to say there aren't dry spells, frustration, fights with girls, or that they never get cheated on, but still, this is such a ridiculous and fictitious attitude.

 

Yea, my boyfriend is 5'5". I actually like it. I'm 5'4" and I don't need to stand on my tip toes to kiss him or struggle with all the various problems with sex positions or whatever that my friends talk about going through with a guy that is much taller than them.

 

Although you do make a point. Maybe everyone in this thread (and I'm not discluding me) is just feeling sorry for themselves and insecure. LOL.

 

I'm not going to lie. I seem like a strong person probably when I debate people, but I'm very, very insecure.

[TheBigQuestion]

Yea, my boyfriend is 5'5". I actually like it. I'm 5'4" and I don't need to stand on my tip toes to kiss him or struggle with all the various problems with sex positions or whatever that my friends talk about going through with a guy that is much taller than them.

 

Although you do make a point. Maybe everyone in this thread (and I'm not discluding me) is just feeling sorry for themselves and insecure. LOL.

 

I'm not going to lie. I seem like a strong person probably when I debate people, but I'm very, very insecure.

 

It's just an ongoing theme on this board. There's a lot of male posters who seem to have so much trouble even getting a girl to look their way, and then blame it on other stuff that SOME guys who are successful with women often have. I don't have chiseled abs, oodles of charisma, nor can I afford to spend $10,000 per night at fancy clubs, yet I do well for myself. Apparently I need at least 2 out of 3 of these things to get involved with (to some degree or another) a decent woman.

[USMCHokie]

Your experience is the exception not the rule. There is probably an unseen variable as well .

 

Then my experience and observation must also be the exception, because I notice the same things in general whereever I go...men of all varieties, looks, statuses, social classes, etc. are generally able to find women...at the end of the day, it's all about your attitude...

[TheBigQuestion]

Your experience is the exception not the rule. There is probably an unseen variable as well .

 

How exactly is my experience an exception?? Every variable that supposedly makes guys more attractive, I've had acquaintances or friends that lack it who have at least mild to moderate success with women. Height? My 5'2" friend who has had two decent looking girlfriends since I've known him. Money? Virtually no one I know at my age (23) is independently wealthy; most scrape by with refunds from financial aid or work menial jobs due to the economy despite being college educated. Physique? I've known plenty of skinny, un-toned guys (myself included) who have attracted women and often kept them, and several chunkier guys as well. Massive amounts of charisma? Again, it varies depending on which individual is in question. Great, engaging personality? I know guys with highly outgoing personalities who can't get a woman at all and quieter guys who seem to get a lot of attention for esoteric reasons. Nice car? The guys I know with steady girlfriends drive, to the best of my memory, a Ford Focus, a Toyota Camry, a Nissan Sentra, an old Ford Taurus, and so forth.

 

You seriously can't paint this sort of thing with broad brushes. I think YOUR perspective is warped and false. However, I AM interested in knowing what you think this unseen variable is.

[Untouchable_Fire]

I worded the way I talked about this for a reason. I purposefully stated that some men go through this as well. I just said that it was less common than it was among women. I still maintain that.

 

Understand that I'm not debating you per/se. I may disagree with you on some items... I'm much more trying to get you to open your eyes.

 

You need to realize that no matter how much pressure you get... the guy your dating is getting just as much if not more. And... if he admits or gives in to that pressure he is considered a weakling.

 

That's your opinion. That's not factual. Also, it's bad form to argue in a debate by attacking the other person's character. It doesn't prove or disprove anything. A person can be a horrible person and still be right.

 

I'm not attacking your character, actually I think your a really good person. Plus, I understand why you do it... and you are always very.... civil. You should be more understanding though. Not so uncaring. You will get more effect that way.

 

What part of this is an argument? I was talking about how men have lots of pressure by society to make lots of money. Saying that men are expected to make lots of money without too much effort is just agreeing with me . . . .

When I feel sorry for you guys in a certain way, why do you take it like an insult? I'm GLAD that I don't have pressure to make lots of money, but I hate that women have all this pressure to be beautiful. I'm glad to know that's a horrible way to view the world.

 

Again... it's not an argument. I just want you to know that the expectations on men is like trying to make us look left and right at the same time.

 

What you are really asking me is to admit that women don't have as much pressure as men do, which I won't. I'm not even saying that women have MORE pressure than men do in ALL aspects of society. I'm just saying they have more pressure in this ONE area.

 

Want to know what I really believe?

 

I believe that 80% of the pressure we put on women is regarding motherhood.

 

That pressure is what makes it equal. Women have less pressure to work, maintain relationships, have any kind of personality... ect. However the pressure to be a mom and a good one... makes it balance.

 

You get people watching what you eat? Your father saying to you,"That will go straight to your thighs." People ripping out food from your hands? People asking you every day if you want to go on a diet with them? People telling you that you are unlovable?

 

My father called me fat all the time if I put on weight.

 

If someone tried to take food from my hand... they risk being punched in the face. That's probably why they don't.

 

It does mean what I said. This is an area where I was complaining about how girls treat each other when it comes to looks. They never say these things to friends they consider pretty. A bunch of girls have seen the movie Clueless where they makeover a nerdy girl and they think it's their job to makeover nerdy/ugly girls.

 

I think your correct in this.

 

Although, I should point out that the young girl in clueless grew up to be gorgeous. Maybe a little too skinny, but very pretty.

 

Also, clueless was based on a novel written by a woman in the 1800's, so that idea and pressure is not new.

 

And usually when they talk about it, they tell me all about all my blemishes and how to improve them.

They've never once said,"You're beautiful already, but-" It's always about how I am ugly in this way or that.

 

Yes, but when you meet a guy he won't be looking at your flaws.

 

So all this talk about the pressure men have to face in society . . .

They just come from you and how you see yourself. Not from those around you.

Is that how I'm supposed to relate to your complaints?

 

If you win, or lose,

 

What example am I supposed to give you? I know times that men have talked about appearance in front of me, many, many times, but I don't want to talk about it because the issues I have with my body are private things.

I guess I could find a thread on an old forum I posted on possibly if it's still around. I remember one of these conversations happening there.

 

Well, I can't think those guys to be serious. We joke with each other all the time without taking it very personal. Sometimes it can seem very mean spirited though.

 

Let's have a show of hands of how many people like Grandma porn in this thread then. If it's so common, then it should be a lot.

 

C'mon, who would admit to that?

 

Besides... what guys see in porn does not reflect a standard. What it really shows is oddness and variety of what men are interested in.

 

I'm not ignorant of anything. This is JUST talking about appearance. Look at the title of the thread and the article on the first page.

If the title of the thread was,"If women had the pressure to make as much money as men do", I would not be claiming that women had more pressure in that area because that would be insane. They don't.

 

So... we will discuss and sympathize with how difficult women have it in this thread?

 

Ok, I will do that from this point.

[Mutant Debutante]

Female beauty standards are a JOKE. Seriously, if I was a twenty something female who wasn't fat that alone would be enough to have men chase after me. Men have it a lot harder but we also have it a lot better if we are GOOD. Weak men suffer... weak women see little or no consequences.

 

I personaly love that my gf wheres little or no make up most of the time. She has such natural beauty.

 

 

Some of you guys might be surprised to hear that the majority of women in the world are NOT twenty-somethings with naturally fast metabolisms (or the metabolism/muscle mass of a dude, who naturally loses weight and gains muscle easier than a girl does).

 

Also some of you are exceptions, I know, I know, I get it, BUT a lot of the guys who go around feeling righteous because they don't like women with 'too much' makeup really mean they don't like women with dark and obvious makeup. They still like the way a woman looks with some foundation and concealer and powder , maybe some lash tint and eyebrow pencil, tinted lipgloss, bronzer, and probably some nail polish, maybe a not-too-obvious French manicure.

 

Even if he genuinely likes zero makeup, men still usually prefer women with soft, dewy, hairless skin and shiny, bouncy hair and well-groomed neat hands and feet and no visible monobrow or mustache. For a lot of girls, even in their 20s, this costs money and time, gentlemen. Exfoliants, moisturizers, face peels, eye creams, cleansers, toners, oils, conditioners, leave-in conditioners, mousse, anti-frizz, gel or whatever hair product, and then there's tweezing and bleaching and shaving and waxing and filing and pumicing and blah, blah, blah. I have it on good authority that it takes more time and costs more money as women get older, if they want to keep male attention. I know women who never used to exfoliate or care about moisturizer in their 20s who started hitting it hard a decade later.

 

Anyway, all that's without one spot of makeup.

[AD1980]

What i dont undertsand is why women feel the need to be universally attractive..Its impossible..If the Man your with finds you attractive that should be enough for you..Why do you need everyones approval?

[Stung]

 

Although, I should point out that the young girl in clueless grew up to be gorgeous. Maybe a little too skinny, but very pretty.

 

Also, clueless was based on a novel written by a woman in the 1800's, so that idea and pressure is not new.

 

 

You have some good points, and I agree with a lot of what you're saying about the 'mommy standards.'

 

But, 2 things:

 

The actress who got the makeover in Clueless who you say grew up so gorgeous is pretty well-documented as having had a serious eating disorder, and plastic surgery.

 

Also in Jane Austen's novel Emma (which Clueless is based on) the character who got the 'makeover' was NOT made over for her looks, she was educated in manners/deportment/the art of conversation etc. as they were attempting to make a 'gentlewoman' out of her.

[Enchanted Girl]

@Untouchable_Fire - I agree with most of what you said except for the part that any man I would date would automatically be feeling more pressure than I would be feeling. I think it depends on the individual.

 

Also, I don't know how much pressure there is to be good Moms. I could see that being true, but it's hard for me to express my opinion one way or another. I've never been a Mom, but I guess I HAVE been pressured by my Mom to hurry up and have babies. XD

[Pyro]

What i dont undertsand is why women feel the need to be universally attractive..Its impossible..If the Man your with finds you attractive that should be enough for you..Why do you need everyones approval?

 

you don't think guys do that as well?

 

Why do you think some guys go around and get numbers and then never intend on calling any of them?

[USMCHokie]

you don't think guys do that as well?

 

Why do you think some guys go around and get numbers and then never intend on calling any of them?

 

Yep...exactly...to inflate their beliefs as to their own "universal attractiveness"...

[Enchanted Girl]

What i dont undertsand is why women feel the need to be universally attractive..Its impossible..If the Man your with finds you attractive that should be enough for you..Why do you need everyones approval?

 

The weird thing is people like to make other people doubt that.

 

I'm in an LDR and I only see my boyfriend once every six months. Because of it, both of our appearances change a whole lot sometimes inbetween our visits. Like last time he visited me, he had really long hair! I was used to him with short hair.

 

Whenever I do certain things with my appearance, like gain five pounds or do my hair a certain way or whatever, people always tell me that if he was here, he would want to break-up with me. This leads to me panicking every single time we visit one another. We have the same conversation every time. XD I say that he will hate me and he says that he hasn't been disgusted by my appearance any of the other times he's seen me so it's going to be the same this time. He's always right, too, and I always doubt it.

 

Also, lots of us just doubt in general that we're going to be able to keep our partner or think that our partner might find someone better if we don't keep trying to be more beautiful. I'm not going to lie. I think this sometimes.

[jamesum]

Some of you guys might be surprised to hear that the majority of women in the world are NOT twenty-somethings with naturally fast metabolisms (or the metabolism/muscle mass of a dude, who naturally loses weight and gains muscle easier than a girl does).

 

Also some of you are exceptions, I know, I know, I get it, BUT a lot of the guys who go around feeling righteous because they don't like women with 'too much' makeup really mean they don't like women with dark and obvious makeup. They still like the way a woman looks with some foundation and concealer and powder , maybe some lash tint and eyebrow pencil, tinted lipgloss, bronzer, and probably some nail polish, maybe a not-too-obvious French manicure.

 

Even if he genuinely likes zero makeup, men still usually prefer women with soft, dewy, hairless skin and shiny, bouncy hair and well-groomed neat hands and feet and no visible monobrow or mustache. For a lot of girls, even in their 20s, this costs money and time, gentlemen. Exfoliants, moisturizers, face peels, eye creams, cleansers, toners, oils, conditioners, leave-in conditioners, mousse, anti-frizz, gel or whatever hair product, and then there's tweezing and bleaching and shaving and waxing and filing and pumicing and blah, blah, blah. I have it on good authority that it takes more time and costs more money as women get older, if they want to keep male attention. I know women who never used to exfoliate or care about moisturizer in their 20s who started hitting it hard a decade later.

 

Anyway, all that's without one spot of makeup.

So you are saying that if a man doesnt like a woman with make up then he has to like women who look like trolls? What kind of logic is that?

 

You right tho that when a man says he doesnt like a woman with makeup, he means too much make up. A bit of foundation is alright.

[zengirl]

So you are saying that if a man doesnt like a woman with make up then he has to like women who look like trolls? What kind of logic is that?

 

She's pointing out that when men say they like girls who look "natural" that the actual definition of "natural" is far from what they really mean.

 

You act like women have no standards of beauty for Men when Male height or lack of is probably the biggets phyiscal dealbreaker in the dating world..Im 5'7 1/2-5'8 and probably about half the female population wouldnt even give me a chance off my height alone..

Except for the taller girls I know (those girls who would be as tall as you, as tall as you with heels-and wear heels all the time, or taller), I don't know anyone who'd have an issue with height. Usually a gal's rule is anywhere from "taller than me" to "3-4 inches taller than me" and since the average height for women in America is a little under 5'4'', that means that most men should be able to find a wide range of women who don't care too much about their height.

 

I know some tall gals who'd date a shorter guy too, but less, of course. It mostly has to do with their own insecurities/feelings about how it makes them look than anything else. The height thing is way overblown. I know loads of short guys with girlfriends and loads of tall guys without.

 

I know far more girls who'd go out with a short guy than men who'd go out with an overweight (or even average weight---you can say the averages in America for weight are out of whack, and personally, I think they are, but they are the averages) woman. And I think overweight women have a harder time than overweight men, though both have harder times than short guys in good shape.

Anyway, if men want to claim they have the greater discrimination, I'd start with balding. Then again, how many balding guys would date a balding woman?

 

So, the conclusion is that, yes, of course, both genders want someone they find attractive. I think you're the one making your height an issue in your life. Or, of course, if you're chasing the prettiest of the pretty, no wonder. I am a fairly pretty girl, and if I was only chasing Abercrombie models, I'd probably have a hard time of it -- and certainly of finding someone compatible. On the same token, I'm not going to date someone I find unattractive.

 

This thread just makes me wonder about a lot of things, especially what the male posters say. If you ask any guy here, you'd think that no one under 5'7" ever gets a date, no one who is a student (and usually fairly poor) can get dates, no one without a really outgoing and fantastic personality gets a date, and so forth. I just find this incredibly hard to believe, and it makes me wonder where on planet Earth all you dudes live. I've known plenty of guys under 5'7" who don't have much trouble finding women who are interested.

Your experience is my experience. I think all the bitter experiences here are the outliers.

[Stung]

So you are saying that if a man doesnt like a woman with make up then he has to like women who look like trolls? What kind of logic is that?

 

.

 

 

She's pointing out to guys in this thread who claimed the only beauty standard is that women need only not be fat and otherwise be completely natural, that there's a flaw in their thinking. Very few women roll out of bed naturally smooth, tweezed, and dewy-skinned with perfect highlights and hairless bodies.

 

And you are underlining that point for her very nicely by saying women who DON'T go through all that time-and-money-consuming rigamarole look like TROLLS. :lmao:

Edited July 21, 2010 by Stung

[Green]

Some of you guys might be surprised to hear that the majority of women in the world are NOT twenty-somethings with naturally fast metabolisms (or the metabolism/muscle mass of a dude, who naturally loses weight and gains muscle easier than a girl does).

 

Also some of you are exceptions, I know, I know, I get it, BUT a lot of the guys who go around feeling righteous because they don't like women with 'too much' makeup really mean they don't like women with dark and obvious makeup. They still like the way a woman looks with some foundation and concealer and powder , maybe some lash tint and eyebrow pencil, tinted lipgloss, bronzer, and probably some nail polish, maybe a not-too-obvious French manicure.

 

Even if he genuinely likes zero makeup, men still usually prefer women with soft, dewy, hairless skin and shiny, bouncy hair and well-groomed neat hands and feet and no visible monobrow or mustache. For a lot of girls, even in their 20s, this costs money and time, gentlemen. Exfoliants, moisturizers, face peels, eye creams, cleansers, toners, oils, conditioners, leave-in conditioners, mousse, anti-frizz, gel or whatever hair product, and then there's tweezing and bleaching and shaving and waxing and filing and pumicing and blah, blah, blah. I have it on good authority that it takes more time and costs more money as women get older, if they want to keep male attention. I know women who never used to exfoliate or care about moisturizer in their 20s who started hitting it hard a decade later.

 

Anyway, all that's without one spot of makeup.

 

Please I just asked my gf and the only thing she said she used today was moisturizer.

 

Sorry but its true... when it comes to being considered attractive by the oposite sex... MEN have it hardest. Women take into account our looks, money, confidence.

 

Men only for the most part care about a woman who isn't fat or retarded or old.

 

I'm glad I'm a man.

[Lady vs Panda]

I asked my last boyfriend and he said he was eight inches.

 

Just sayin.

[USMCHokie]

So the conclusion one can draw from this exchange:

 

Men will think that men have it harder...while women will think women have it harder...

[sagetalk]

 

1. "To land hot girls"? Why does that even matter?

 

2. You also forget that girls have to work out, too, to stay thin AND do everything else. We work-up sweats as well and I don't lift heavy barbells and dumbbells and things, but I have lifted them.

 

3. Although I don't think this is supposed to be a competition. It was the way that article set it up, I guess and it's comic relief for women. We feel so bad about our appearances and things that it makes us feel better to think about men having to live up to the same standards as us.

 

1. You must be joking right ? Just because a guy says he wants a hot girl does not make him shallow. If a man is not attracted to the girl he's dating, then he is the definition of a moron.

 

2. True, but cardio just tires you. The kind of exercising you have to do to look ripped with muscles is 10x more painful and brutal. A girl can get skinny much easier than a guy can get ripped. Look at jersey shore, all those guys are ripped to the max and some of the girls are borderline toned. All the girls have is tons of makeup and fancy hair. I bet most of those guys had to do steriods to get as big as they are. The standard for looks on that show is way higher for the guys.

 

3. Women's standard are self inflicted in my opinion. I hate make up, fake hair, fake tans, fake breasts. Just drink water like crazy, grow your hair long, and work out. BOOM you've got at least 80% of the men in the world in your back pocket.