Why does God let bad things happen to innocent people?

[Moose]

****Backs away holding hands out with palms facing outwards****

 

Whoa!

 

No need to be so hostile. That reaction was totally uncalled for.

 

I WOULD take it personally, but you told me not to, remember? Funny, seeing as you aren't being quite as rude to anyone else who dares to question you on this thread.

Sorry, didn't mean to come off so hostile.....I just get a little flustered sometimes.....I'm getting attacked from all sides and noone seems to understand where I'm coming from.

 

But that's ok by me. I've learned that 13 year old, "kids" are alot more intuitive than what we give them credit for. Everyone can go ahead and sweet talk her all they want. I'll just sit back and watch every idea, suggestion, and bits of advice get chucked right out of her window.....

[Storyrider]

I'm not sure which thread you're talking about. But I'd certainly like to look at it if you can find it and see in what context I posted in.

 

It was Underpants' thread with the link to the John Lennon Youtube. I think it has been deleted b/c I can't find it.

 

You said the problem of evil has been solved, no one is debating it any more, that free will causes all evil and God and/or Christ have nothing to do with it.

[sb129]

Sorry, didn't mean to come off so hostile.....I just get a little flustered sometimes.....I'm getting attacked from all sides and noone seems to understand where I'm coming from.

 

But that's ok by me. I've learned that 13 year old, "kids" are alot more intuitive than what we give them credit for. Everyone can go ahead and sweet talk her all they want. I'll just sit back and watch every idea, suggestion, and bits of advice get chucked right out of her window.....

 

I appreciate that.

 

yes, they may be, but they don't think the same way as adults do, nor are they as articulate in general.

 

I agree- you have to WANT to help yourself to do so.... but I have never been in such a difficult situation, and I am finding it hard to judge or appreciate how hard it must be if you are in such a position.

[Yosef]

Tsk tsk tsk... Sympathy isn't always the solution, but it's always necessary.

 

Well, I do agree some part to your strategy, Moose. Some people are just so banged up that sympathy is like wiping sludge from a dirty window with a dry rag. I recently had an experience with a friend who was really in grief about her cousin's death, and I tried to be sympathetic for days. One day she told me she wanted to be so sad she would never feel sad ever again, and I had to yell at her for that, and I never yell at people. She actually began listening to what i was saying and now she's doing great.

 

Of course, if I weren't sympathetic or empathetic at all about her situation, the possibility of me helping would have dropped to nil. She thanked me for being so sympathetic and not giving up on her.

[b0iiana]

Sorry about the language and slang I was using

 

Um, no comment about the other posts...

[Moose]

and I am finding it hard to judge or appreciate how hard it must be if you are in such a position.

Whoah. Sorry about the language i've been using guys...

Look Boiina.....this is going to be hard for me to say, but it needs to be said.

 

I was in your situation, and at the same age. I was raped myself. Yes, from a man. It's not easy for me to say that on a public forum. At 14, he shot me in the elbow. At 15 he broke my nose for the 11th time. I left. I should've left at 13 right after the rape. Knowing at 15 what I was capable of doing on my own, I now know that the same could be done at 13.

 

There are a lot of great people at LS that can and will help you. But you have to be willing to make some changes in your life......

 

If I were you, (and remember, I was you).....I'd start by leaving.....now.

[b0iiana]

Look Boiina.....this is going to be hard for me to say, but it needs to be said.

 

I was in your situation, and at the same age. I was raped myself. Yes, from a man. It's not easy for me to say that on a public forum. At 14, he shot me in the elbow. At 15 he broke my nose for the 11th time. I left. I should've left at 13 right after the rape. Knowing at 15 what I was capable of doing on my own, I now know that the same could be done at 13.

 

There are a lot of great people at LS that can and will help you. But you have to be willing to make some changes in your life......

 

If I were you, (and remember, I was you).....I'd start by leaving.....now.

 

You mean runaway? Ive attempted that three times already...

[Moose]

You mean runaway? Ive attempted that three times already...

No. Running away isn't going to work. You need to go to the authorities. I know you probably don't want to get anyone into trouble, but this is your life we're talking about.

 

The authorities will make sure you're in a safe enviroment. It sounds like your mum is trying to get you into boarding school which would be good, but you will need to totally change your lifestyle and start fresh...we will be here at LS to help you through that.....

[b0iiana]

No. Running away isn't going to work. You need to go to the authorities. I know you probably don't want to get anyone into trouble, but this is your life we're talking about.

 

The authorities will make sure you're in a safe enviroment. It sounds like your mum is trying to get you into boarding school which would be good, but you will need to totally change your lifestyle and start fresh...we will be here at LS to help you through that.....

 

Im not going to take your advice since you've been s**t to me.. Sorry

 

And I so am not going to boarding school. I'm going to Westlake next year where I have heaps of friends...... and foes, lol...

[Moose]

Fell for it again .....you got me....good luck to you!

 

Now....tell me I'm wrong!

[Moose]

That certainly shut everyone up didn't it??

 

Hate to say, "I told you so".....pour my heart out to the world to help out, and let this, "poor little girl" stomp all over it......oh well! "whatever"......

 

Correction though, Mum isn't taking her to boarding School....it was counceling....my bad. I do hope she at least goes to that!

[White Flower]

Im not going to take your advice since you've been s**t to me.. Sorry

 

And I so am not going to boarding school. I'm going to Westlake next year where I have heaps of friends...... and foes, lol...

OK, Boiiana, I understand that it is difficult to take advice from someone who has been harsh with you. But Moose really did reach out and try to connect with you on your level just now which was a very hard thing to do. It was his way of saying he's been there and done that so he knows that you can overcome all this too.

 

I agree that you should go to counseling on a regular basis and boarding school might even be good, too. Getting away from people (who you love even) who don't protect you may help you get true focus in your life because you'll be in a safe place. Don't be so caught up in your present friends. You will make friends wherever you go and the ones you leave behind will still be there if they are your true friends. Trust me, I've reconnected with friends from grade school.

 

And to Moose and the others: she is a child. Nobody guided her to do the right thing before so she doesn't know good advice when she hears it. We can only do our best to repeat it over and over until she hears it and finally believes that she has some sort of power to help herself. Let's not blame the victim, yet, let's convince her that she doesn't have to be the victim anymore.

[White Flower]

I would welcome her with open arms, and heart if she sounded sincere.

I am so sorry you went through what you did as a child. I really hope that your experience can be used to help others.

 

I pray for Boiiana and hope that her angry rant was just a step to dealing with the core issue. In fact, I think I'll take a moment to pray for all who post on LS because most of us are here due to some kind of pain or another. Take care.

[Moose]

I am so sorry you went through what you did as a child.

It's ok, really it is. I hated to tell everyone, but people were ganging up on me like I didn't know what the hell I was talking about. (And the fact that she doesn't have PM yet.)

I really hope that your experience can be used to help others.

It has, hundreds of times over.

In fact, I think I'll take a moment to pray for all who post on LS because most of us are here due to some kind of pain or another.

That's awesome! Thank you so very much!

[Yosef]

I pray for Boiiana and hope that her angry rant was just a step to dealing with the core issue. In fact, I think I'll take a moment to pray for all who post on LS because most of us are here due to some kind of pain or another. Take care.

 

 

We're all just a bunch of misfits that do all we can do watch each others' backs. We're a community of people looking for help, for a second chance, and for a hope that can only be found by asking people who know what we've gone through:D

 

I'll pray too, that sounds really nice right now. Thank you LoveShack and thank you God (don't worry, you don't have to agree with the God part if you don't want to, but at least pay your respects to LoveShack every once in a while).

[disgracian]

This, "little girl" is using language and slang that's conducive to the life style she chose. She will reap what she sows.

There's that boundless compassion again. She chose to be raped and abused according to you, and is just reaping what she sowed. I have nothing but utter contempt and disgust for you, Moose. You shame your religion and your species with your heartlessness.

well.. i chose to abuse alcohol and smoke.. i chose to have sex with other guys after the rape... and stuff

Her "choices" that you beat her over the head for were made after the abuse, by which time the damage had already been done. Strange that you quoted this, since you took no notice in your rush to villify her.

 

I know I'm a bit late on this one (the horse has already bolted so to speak), and this will probably earn some wrath from the moderators here, but I don't particularly care. I am truly disgusted beyond my ability to express, and I had to get this off my chest. It's certainly no worse thank kicking a 13-year old rape victim while she's down.

 

Cheers,

D.

[Yosef]

Sorry Moose, but I'm siding with disgracian on this one. My heart sank when I read your comment. I do not call names, and I do not scorn with wrath. I only wish you learn to be more empathetic and open-minded in the future, for your sake as well as other peoples'.

[Green]

god told me it was because he had a plan

[Moose]

Well, it's too bad you people feel that way. The truth is the truth. I didn't call her any names, and I didn't scorn her. I just know what I see and I call it like it I see it. And she's even proven me to be right.

 

I never said she chose to be raped either. All you're doing, (disgracian) is trying to get everyone fired up against me again. I kind of expect that from you now anyways.

 

Oh, and don't worry, I don't think the moderators will reprimand you for your post, if they read my response, they'll know you didn't take any skin off my back.

 

Besides, they're too smart to see what you're trying to do anyway.

[Storyrider]

I don't think her last post proves anything except that she's messed up and she isn't handling it very well.

 

She's a minor. I don't know about the laws in NZ, but in the US she's too young to drive.

 

You can't really hold her accountable in the way that you are, Moose. I'm not saying she shouldn't make better choices, of course she should. But you're addressing her like she's an adult who should know better. She clearly doesn't.

[Moose]

Tell you what Storyrider, since I have 6 children, 5 that are still alive the ages of 20, 17, 13, 12 and 9 years of age.....and I left home, (before I could legally drive myself), don't you think I have a little more experience in what this girl is going through than you?

 

I'm not adressing her like she should know better, I'm adressing her as one who knows what she's thinking and where she's heading if she doesn't change course.....but she has to do this herself.

 

Noone else can do that.

[sb129]

Im not going to take your advice since you've been s**t to me.. Sorry

 

And I so am not going to boarding school. I'm going to Westlake next year where I have heaps of friends...... and foes, lol...

 

B0iiana, that kind of attitude will just have people turning their backs on you.

 

Grow up- if you want advice and you want to be treated like an adult, you have to take it like one.

 

Not everyone is going to mollycoddle you or be nice. some people are going to tell you things that you need to hear, but don't necessarily want to hear.

 

Others have been in the same (or worse) situations than you.

 

Moose is a grumpy bugger, but he understands your situation much more than I do so listen to him.

[shadowofman]

He didn't choose for you to get beaten. It was never in his plan for you to receive harassment. People get raped and hurt everyday because of the sin that has entered this world.

But it is God that creates a universe with sin. He is respondsible for setting the rules of the universe. He gave man free will. He decides what sin is and how to avoid and atone for it. He is the one that requires blood sacrifice of humans in order to cleanse ourselves from sin. Then of course, all these "evil" people need to do is accept Jesus as that sacrifice and their sins are cleansed.

He may not have choose this particular person to get the short straw, but he is fully aware that it's all going on and could in fact fix it all. If he existed that is.

 

 

Have you ever heard the phrase, "What doesn't kill you only makes you stronger"? These are experiences you could use to reach out to others who have been hurt! You've been given opportunities! The devil causes you pain. God uses that pain and allows it to manifest in you as something greater!

This phrase is Nietzsche's. An atheist!!!! Funny. The one statement of Nietzsche's that I disagree with and a Christian is using it. Your advise to this girl is commendable, but has nothing to do with God. Yes, everyone should look at the bright side, the silver lining. Use your experiences to help others, etc. You don't need gods for this.

 

God didn't want this to happen to you, but because it did, even if you don't understand why it happened now, he will use it to one day show you the gift that's been hiding dormant in your heart for so long. Look for the gift, and he will show you where it is. Find it, and he will help you unwrap it.

I love how you assume what god wants. Seems like you wish that god doesn't want bad things to happen to people. What evidence do you have that suggests this? For all you know, god's philosophy is that you have to break some eggs if you want to make an omelet. Surely seems to be the case for the people that don't live long enough to realize the "gift" in their hearts.

 

Try not to dwell on why bad things happen to you. Sadness and pain do not comfort, only make the pain worse. I had a friend who wanted to listen to sad songs to dig a hole straight through her own heart, so that she would no longer feel sad. This doesn't work. I've tried it myself, doesn't work. So please, don't feel hopeless. You have better days ahead of you. And if you're wanting to ask, "What makes you so sure? Life has sucked until now, why would it change in the future?" You'll receive your answer soon enough.

See that wasn't so hard. Good advice without delusional rambling. Don't you find this humanist approach much more concrete. Like someone could actually understand what your talking about and make an attempt at it. Telling someone to talk to imaginary people for guidence isn't going to help any situation. And trying to reconcile an all powerful benevolence with what appears to some to be a living hell on earth is rediculous. If god cared, he'd make it all better NOW.

[Yosef]

If god cared, he'd make it all better NOW.

 

That's just want everyone wants. Now, Now, Now... always. You kind of have to be open-minded and expand your horizon a little. Don't expect an instant answer but do expect an answer. It may not come now but in the future it will come, it just requires the patience that most people just don't have today.

 

I'm quite the preacher, aren't I? Still trying to learn to speak without mumbling, so-to-speak. I hope you guys continue to slap me for it, cuz it's really getting on my nerves myself.

 

This phrase is Nietzsche's. An atheist!!!! Funny. The one statement of Nietzsche's that I disagree with and a Christian is using it. Your advise to this girl is commendable, but has nothing to do with God. Yes, everyone should look at the bright side, the silver lining. Use your experiences to help others, etc. You don't need gods for this.

 

Now, i can still beleive an atheists philosophy if I'm religious, as long as it doesn't contradict with my beliefs.

 

And you're right, you dont need God to learn to help others. Tons of atheists are very selfless and enjoy being public speakers or therapists. God does help make the process easier for you to stomach, because he's there for you 24/7 if you need guidance. It's not NOW guidance, unfortunately.

[Storyrider]

Tell you what Storyrider, since I have 6 children, 5 that are still alive the ages of 20, 17, 13, 12 and 9 years of age.....and I left home, (before I could legally drive myself), don't you think I have a little more experience in what this girl is going through than you?

 

I'm not adressing her like she should know better, I'm adressing her as one who knows what she's thinking and where she's heading if she doesn't change course.....but she has to do this herself.

 

Noone else can do that.

 

Point taken. I do have two children, but you've got me beat.

 

And I would certainly never discount how your experience plays into your understanding. That is something far more horrific than anything I've ever gone through, and I truly admire you knowing what you've overcome.

 

I agree with most of the content of what you're telling her. I just hope you're saying it in a way she can hear it.