Wife had an A, can't sleep or eat!

[Bryanp]

You told her clearly that if she ever contacted the OM again you would file. She attempted to contact the OM again (supposedly for closure.....Oh please). She knew clearly what the consequences would be for this action. You then backed down again. I am sorry my friend but you know longer have any credibility. She keeps crossing your line in the sand and you continue to make up new lines. What is wrong with this picture?

[anne1707]

My first MC is next Monday, could you tell me how yours went the first time? We really need to get to MC and get something going!

 

The first one is really just scene setting almost with the counsellor maybe asking you what you each hope to achieve from the MC. It was definitely not the toughest session.

 

Remember

- a good counsellor will never ever tell you what to do. Their job is to help you figure this out for yourself

- your first counsellor may not be the one for you. If either you or your wife feel he/she is not right then ask for another. We did this and it made a huge difference to the process. A good counsellor will also not be offended by this - and actively encourage you to change counsellor so you can get as much as you can from MC

- you are both going to hear things from each other which will hurt. You both need to listen to each other and try your best not to get angry. Listen and try to understand, hug each other afterwards. Don't tear each other apart after the session about things said in the session. MC is your safe haven to talk about everything and anything.

- don't expect overnight miracles

[Hoping4Better]

If either you or your wife feel he/she is not right then ask for another. We did this and it made a huge difference to the process. A good counsellor will also not be offended by this - and actively encourage you to change counsellor so you can get as much as you can from MC

What was the reason for diff. counselor if I may ask?

[Hoping4Better]

Last few days we have been going out and try to find the spark we've lost for a few years, but she keeps saying she can't look me in the eyes even though she wants me close to her in bed, that's all she's ready for right now she says. Is this all familiar story for you guys or something I can look forward to?

[frozensprouts]

OP,

I can't say for sure what is going on in your wife's head. You sound like you feel like you don't know, and maybe she feels like even she doesn't know.

 

The problem is that you're hurt, probably feeling totally betrayed and lost, and her behavior isn't helping with that. If I may offer a suggestion...i think that you both need some time part ( even if it's just a weekend) to figure out what it is that you want. It also sounds like marriage counseling and individual counseling would also help.

 

I know it may sound counterintuative, but sometimes a wayward spouse needs to know that their betrayed spouse has been pushed to their limit and that they won't put up with anymore. My husband and i reached that point. During the final part of his affair ( before he ended it for good) I tried everything i could think of to covince him to stay. i thought that if i was just nice enough, just uderstanding enough, etc., he'd decide to stay. Finally, I just was too worn out, too sick (I lost a lot of weight because I couldn't eat), and just plain fed up , and knew i had reached the end. i told him that if he wanted to be with his other woman, then he should, and i was going to file for divorce ( even got in contact with a lawyer). For whatever reason, that seemed to be the wake up call that was needed for him to see just what he was doing. He ended his relationship with his other woman pretty much right away ( he showed me the email, and i watched him send it. He gave me access to all his email accounts, facebook, etc., and the computer password to log on was one only i knew, and he only used it in front of me. We are long past that now though, but we both still have the passwords and) full access to each other's accounts.

[Hoping4Better]

He ended his relationship with his other woman pretty much right away ( he showed me the email, and i watched him send it. He gave me access to all his email accounts, facebook, etc., and the computer password to log on was one only i knew, and he only used it in front of me. We are long past that now though, but we both still have the passwords and) full access to each other's accounts.

Congrats on 'better' R for you, yeah she also gave me access to all means of communication with OM, and I just found out she got the closure she was looking for from OM through his friend, I don't know what to believe, for all I know she had one last **** with OM before she finally ended it! So basically I was her 'maybe' plan! I am fed up pleading her to be honest with me, I think I am done at this point!

Edited May 13, 2012 by Hoping4Better

[Hoping4Better]

I hate it when all my gut instincts were right! I just found out that they'd been talking 3 more times thru his office phone since D-day! God knows what that means! So basically everything she told me was a lie, our dates were lies! Thank you all for support, I will return and let you know how the divorce is moving along, I guess.

[anne1707]

H4B

 

I'm so sorry to hear this - I was so hoping that you would both get through this together. Your wife needs to see the consequences of her continued deceit and that is going to hurt.

 

May I suggest that if you are both willing, you do still go to MC. MC can be about dealing with the end of a marriage too so may help things not get too bitter and angry if that is the way things are heading.

[YellowShark]

I hate it when all my gut instincts were right! I just found out that they'd been talking 3 more times thru his office phone since D-day! God knows what that means! So basically everything she told me was a lie, our dates were lies! Thank you all for support, I will return and let you know how the divorce is moving along, I guess.

 

 

What total drag. Sorry to hear that she *still* hasnt got the message or realized what she has done to the marriage. But this time no more Mr. Nice Guy. Ok? Since she refuses to go NC with OM, and continues to lie to you, fine. Don't let the door hit her butt on the way out.

[Hoping4Better]

I know it may sound counterintuative, but sometimes a wayward spouse needs to know that their betrayed spouse has been pushed to their limit and that they won't put up with anymore.

What a crazy morning! As of now, I still haven't slept and just got done talking about MC and agreed upon taking this one day at a time.I told W I am going to hold off on the D papers I drew up this morning before W got home - went with non-complicated uncontested D, just need to be signed by us both. W cried, pleaded, cried and pleaded some more to give marriage a chance, at least get to the first MC. Talk about turnaround, huh?! When I asked her about calls W made to the office, W said each time it was a brief because it was receptionist answering so she couldn't get to talk to OM. And it was - each time only 1 min then no further tempting calls to any of OM's other numbers - don't know how I could miss that. W wanted a closure and let OM know how much he hurt her. I know W more than anybody and I know she isn't lying to me.Still long road ahead but I am hoping we are headed at least in the right direction.

[Bryanp]

Wow so she wanted closure...oh please. I am sorry my friend but you are plan B. If the OM said come and live with me she would have gone. You deserve better.

[jh52]

What a crazy morning! As of now, I still haven't slept and just got done talking about MC and agreed upon taking this one day at a time.I told W I am going to hold off on the D papers I drew up this morning before W got home - went with non-complicated uncontested D, just need to be signed by us both. W cried, pleaded, cried and pleaded some more to give marriage a chance, at least get to the first MC. Talk about turnaround, huh?! When I asked her about calls W made to the office, W said each time it was a brief because it was receptionist answering so she couldn't get to talk to OM. And it was - each time only 1 min then no further tempting calls to any of OM's other numbers - don't know how I could miss that. W wanted a closure and let OM know how much he hurt her. I know W more than anybody and I know she isn't lying to me.Still long road ahead but I am hoping we are headed at least in the right direction.

 

You need to re-read your own thread. You said " I know W more than anybody and I know she isn't lying to me." She has lied to you during the duration of her affair -- the false R -- everything. Yet you say this. Please admit you don't know her -- and that she is/has lied. Only then can you make a decision. I would still proceed with the filing of divorce -- it can be cancelled at any time before it goes final. I say that because it shows that you mean what you say to your wife -- you said it -- now back it up -- otherwise she will take this affair further underground. If you file -- it may wake her up out of the fog -- show her that you mean what you say -- that you can be a man --and stand up to her and no longer accept her cheating/lying ways. You decide !! Good Luck.

[Hoping4Better]

You need to re-read your own thread. You said " I know W more than anybody and I know she isn't lying to me." She has lied to you during the duration of her affair -- the false R -- everything. Yet you say this. Please admit you don't know her -- and that she is/has lied. Only then can you make a decision. I would still proceed with the filing of divorce -- it can be cancelled at any time before it goes final. I say that because it shows that you mean what you say to your wife -- you said it -- now back it up -- otherwise she will take this affair further underground. If you file -- it may wake her up out of the fog -- show her that you mean what you say -- that you can be a man --and stand up to her and no longer accept her cheating/lying ways. You decide !! Good Luck.

You are right, I think I will, first I have to come her down and make her agree to my terms and sign it.

[Hoping4Better]

Boy, it's getting uglier and uglier: I just found out going thru phone records one more time, noticed that she might have bought a Tracfone, spent 7 min. trying to load it from her phone 2 days ago! No proof yet, I think it might be at her work locker, so I need to catch her somehow to confront her. I DID make mind up about filing, I have to approach this cautiously.

[Bryanp]

This is exactly what I said previously about you threatening to file if she contacted him again and she did and you did not follow through. She perceived this as weakness about you to follow through on your threat. When you draw a line in the sand you cannot keep moving the line every time it is crossed or you lose all credibility which is probably what just happened again.

[frozensprouts]

OP,

it sounds like you are still hoping that she'll change her mind, the affair will be over, and you'll be together.

 

I totally understand how you can feel that way. But the poster who noted that once you draw your line in the sand, you can't keep moving it is right.

 

But like I said, I can see why you feel the way you do. But eventually, something's got to give...your wife needs to know that you are serious about this, and that you have made your decision and you aren't going to back down unless certain criteria are met by her. She needs to know that you aren't afraid to walk ( even if you are deathly afraid) should she keep on going the way she is.

 

I'm sorry you are in this place in your life right now. I'm sorry she is hurting you like this. The one who is supposed to love and cherish you should not be acting like this, knowing that her actions are hurting you.

[Hoping4Better]

H4B

 

I'm so sorry to hear this - I was so hoping that you would both get through this together. Your wife needs to see the consequences of her continued deceit and that is going to hurt.

 

May I suggest that if you are both willing, you do still go to MC. MC can be about dealing with the end of a marriage too so may help things not get too bitter and angry if that is the way things are heading.

So I did take your advise and went MC anyway, at the end of the session I had my wife giving up the Tracfone I talked about and verified what she said she texted. Mostly dirty talks and most importantly the breakup message. I don't know what's in store for us on next IC for each of us, i decided to give it a try. I know what most of you will say about this, but I am the one to figure out where we go from here. I will keep you guys posted on whichever it goes.

[Owl]

So she WAS still lying, even after she'd begged and pleaded with you to hold off on filing and give the marriage one more chance?

 

It's up to you...but honestly at this point, trust would be shattered and I can't imagine how I'd trust her again.

 

I know most folks don't like ultimatums...but if I were you, I'd tell her point blank...this is your last, LAST opportunity to come clean. Tell me everything right now...because if I find out ONE MORE THING, NO MATTER HOW SMALL that you ommitted or "forgot"...it's done. AND MEAN IT.

[Hoping4Better]

So she WAS still lying, even after she'd begged and pleaded with you to hold off on filing and give the marriage one more chance?

 

It's up to you...but honestly at this point, trust would be shattered and I can't imagine how I'd trust her again.

 

I know most folks don't like ultimatums...but if I were you, I'd tell her point blank...this is your last, LAST opportunity to come clean. Tell me everything right now...because if I find out ONE MORE THING, NO MATTER HOW SMALL that you ommitted or "forgot"...it's done. AND MEAN IT.

How should I approach this? So I know she bought the phone on Friday when I was out playing golf, she says only texted because she OM was 'busy' and next two nights at work, they exchanged dirty texting. She lied about giving the phone away to somebody at work and the way the affair ended was OM texting her no more texts or calls to him and to respect his wishes and to tell me this, not exactly the way she wanted to end it. This happened right after I called him 3 nights ago from a payphone so he couldn't block the number. I WANT to believe her so BAD so much that I want that golfing day let go. Yes we did have a make-up sex after MC that night, will she really go back to A? Or should I confront OM about that day to get the details?

Edited May 15, 2012 by Hoping4Better

[The Blue Knight]

How should I approach this? So I know she bought the phone on Friday when I was out playing golf, she says only texted because she OM was 'busy' and next two nights at work, they exchanged dirty texting. She lied about giving the phone away to somebody at work and the way the affair ended was OM texting her no more texts or calls to him and to respect his wishes and to tell me this, not exactly the way she wanted to end it. This happened right after I called him 3 nights ago from a payphone so he couldn't block the number. I WANT to believe her so BAD so much that I want that golfing day let go. Yes we did have a make-up sex after MC that night, will she really go back to A? Or should I confront OM about that day to get the details?

 

I agree with Owl. You can be patient and understanding as long as the wayward spouse is attempting to work on the marriage and has cut off all contact. But she's straddling the fence. She's not sure what she wants.

 

What's even more troubling is that if the OM cut this relationship off, and you do take her back, you're left to wonder if you were the backup plan all along.

[Hoping4Better]

What's even more troubling is that if the OM cut this relationship off, and you do take her back, you're left to wonder if you were the backup plan all along.

Exactly. And still wondering if I should continue with IC and MC in the coming weeks. 15 years is a long time we spent together and to throw it away in a few weeks...I f'ing HATE her!

[Owl]

How should I approach this? So I know she bought the phone on Friday when I was out playing golf, she says only texted because she OM was 'busy' and next two nights at work, they exchanged dirty texting. She lied about giving the phone away to somebody at work and the way the affair ended was OM texting her no more texts or calls to him and to respect his wishes and to tell me this, not exactly the way she wanted to end it. This happened right after I called him 3 nights ago from a payphone so he couldn't block the number. I WANT to believe her so BAD so much that I want that golfing day let go. Yes we did have a make-up sex after MC that night, will she really go back to A? Or should I confront OM about that day to get the details?

 

You call bull(stuffing) on her obvious and blatant lie.

 

No one buys a phone to give away to a co-worker. She lied to you about giving the phone away....etc...

 

You tell her point blank...you were lying this weekend about the phone...after you had begged and pleaded with me that you wanted to work on the marriage. You went out and bought that phone after/same day that you insisted you wanted to work on the marriage...and you knew/know full well that NC with OM is the number one cardinal step towards that.

 

Like I said...tell her she's got 24 hours to come clean...or move out.

 

If she has not come clean and told you EVERY SINGLE THING by the end of that time...any lie discovered after that will be the one that led to divorce.

 

In my case, for the first few days at least after my wife DIDN'T leave to go live with OM, she was still seriously considering divorce...so the lies were fewer and infrequent, so this was less of an issue for us. BUT...she got the same ultimatum from me as well.

 

Again...recognize that YOU are the one with the decision making power here. Make it clear what you will and will not accept, and what those consequences will be if she refuses.

 

Tell her you know she was still lying over this past weekend up until you went to MC...tell her the lies end now, or the marriage does. And be ready to back that up.

[Hoping4Better]

You went out and bought that phone after/same day that you insisted you wanted to work on the marriage...and you knew/know full well that NC with OM is the number one cardinal step towards that.

 

Like I said...tell her she's got 24 hours to come clean...or move out.

 

If she has not come clean and told you EVERY SINGLE THING by the end of that time...any lie discovered after that will be the one that led to divorce.

 

Again...recognize that YOU are the one with the decision making power here. Make it clear what you will and will not accept, and what those consequences will be if she refuses.

 

Tell her you know she was still lying over this past weekend up until you went to MC...tell her the lies end now, or the marriage does. And be ready to back that up.

Owl, I appreciate thoughtful inputs each time. For the record, the crying and pleading came after I had called OM that night so she bought the phone 2 days prior. Of course, W still violated NC with OM, kept insisting she needed the closure - she chose to close by starting things back up with OM, helluva way I know

 

At the MC, that's when she admitted still having the phone in her possession and kept insisting that nothing physical happened on the golfing day. I know it is I that have to live with the consequences of my actions now, and if I decided to go forward with this overwhelming gut wrenching feeling that W cheated again but NO proof, I am the one to blame.

 

Yes, I am still hoping like a fool, I want to continue to work on this and both the counselor and I talked about trust issue and that she'd be totally transparent until W gets some of my trust back. Who knows where this will end, but one thing for sure is that I will NOT tolerate any more lies.

[Owl]

Yes, I am still hoping like a fool, I want to continue to work on this and both the counselor and I talked about trust issue and that she'd be totally transparent until W gets some of my trust back. Who knows where this will end, but one thing for sure is that I will NOT tolerate any more lies.

 

Then spell this out to her...she's got an amnesty period....right now.

 

She comes clean with everything. No more lies by omission, no more hiding ANYTHING. If there is ANYTHING about this situation that she's deliberately hidden, minimized, or obfuscated...now is the time and here is the place to get that cleared up without repercussion for having witheld that information up to this point.

 

Note: I did NOT say that you wouldn't react or respond to this additional information if it changes how you feel about continuing the marriage. I simply said that she wouldn't be penalized for having witheld it up to this point IF she discloses it now.

 

Make it clear...it's her "one chance" to finally put the lies to bed and behind you. Don't totally spring this on her...as I'd mentioned...give her 24 hours to "think about it", figure out what she needs to say to you and ensure that she's got the whole truth up front. Anytime during that period, you're willing to talk and listen.

 

After that, if she's discovered having witheld critical information...the consequences will immediately and automatically follow. If she refuses...you have your answer.

 

With me here?

[Hoping4Better]

With me here?

Yes. And if W is still insisting she told me everything? Go with?