Holiday Planning with a Seperated Person

[wildsoul]

WS, I think wwisup is right on this one. Its a dinner... not that big of a deal..plus there will be many more. its better to choose your battles, and this one may not be really worth it. Appriciate all he HAS DONE, he has made so much progress, getting his own place and all the changes in his life. Its not an easy road. If he is really that close to the family and they dont know about the seperation yet, because the w may still be keeping it from them, let this one holiday go. Christmas is much more fun anyway!!!

Okay, but let me explain why it's a big deal, then tell me if you still think it's worth letting go.

 

I've got an icky childhood wound from my dad. He violently abandoned my mom, brother, and me on xmas eve when I was 15. I've spent many years replaying that scene in one way or another. After a lot of work, I've healed it up pretty good. Now, I know that I need to take excellent care of myself during xmas. I can really enjoy it now. But I absolutely know I cannot tolerate being abandoned by him on xmas. This was so important, that I made it a line-item in our reconcillation this Sept.

 

He promised me in no uncertain terms that would be with me xmas eve and day no matter what. Further, he's been telling me how this will be the greatest holiday of my life and so forth.

 

So for me, the fact that he's waffling on Thanksgiving is even more worrisome than normal. I see his taking a stand for T-day as being in alignment with what he has been telling me about the holidays, indicative that he is really separated, and also a good sign that he will keep his word on xmas.

 

Conversely, if he doesn't spend T-day with me, then I have a MONTH to worry about whether he will keep his word about xmas. As horrible as having this disappointment is NOW (really stressful time in my life in other ways) I think I'd feel practically suicidal if we play out him abandoing me at xmas. It's especially upsetting as I've tried taking pre-emptive action and discussed this with him.

 

So given what I just told you, would you think it is advisable to consider letting T-day slide, but still trust that he will keep his promise about xmas?

[whichwayisup]

The problem is, he is in NO position right now to be making you any promises. He will unfortunately back out on you, he's shown you this already. I just have a bad feeling about this, and WS, I hope I'm wrong!

[Mino]

WS, If This is the case that Christmas means so much to you, I would suggest two things to you. Book a trip during the christmas holidays with him, therefore he is locked in, or do not rely on him at all if the dissapointment would be to much for you to handle. Plan a trip on your own, without him... Dont set yourself up for the disappointment, but take the control of your happy holidays in your own hands...

[whichwayisup]

Until he is officially divorced, I wouldn't count on him for much. He isn't committed to you (yet) even if he says he is, his actions once again, show you that he isn't. He is thinking of himself, his wife and her family first.

 

Sadly, that includes Christmas. His Christmas isn't just about his wife, it's about the extended family, cousins, his wife's siblings, etc..etc.. He need to sort this out and decide once and for all WHO he wants.

[whichwayisup]

Book a trip during the christmas holidays with him, therefore he is locked in,

If he isn't sure, he will cancel on that too. Locking him in on a vacation isn't a good idea and nor will it MAKE him go. This is the type of man who will DO what he wants and noone is going to force him into anything he doesn't want to do. That's why I keep saying until he is officially divorced. He WANTS to spend time with his wife and her family during the holidays. He loves her family like his own.

[Mino]

Its kinda of wierd on my end, I have not even discussed Holidays with mine... I dont think I am ready for all that YET:eek: I have made plans with my family which does not include him, and I am assuming he will go to his family with his child, assuming also that she will be there...IS that bad or what???

[whichwayisup]

or do not rely on him at all if the dissapointment would be to much for you to handle. Plan a trip on your own, without him... Dont set yourself up for the disappointment, but take the control of your happy holidays in your own hands...

 

This I agree with 100%. DO NOT LET THIS MAN RUIN YOUR XMAS! Make plans with close friends, and don't even think suicidal thoughts during the holidays! Don't go there..

[norajane]

Okay, but let me explain why it's a big deal, then tell me if you still think it's worth letting go.

 

I've got an icky childhood wound from my dad. He violently abandoned my mom, brother, and me on xmas eve when I was 15. I've spent many years replaying that scene in one way or another. After a lot of work, I've healed it up pretty good. Now, I know that I need to take excellent care of myself during xmas. I can really enjoy it now. But I absolutely know I cannot tolerate being abandoned by him on xmas. This was so important, that I made it a line-item in our reconcillation this Sept.

 

He promised me in no uncertain terms that would be with me xmas eve and day no matter what. Further, he's been telling me how this will be the greatest holiday of my life and so forth.

 

So for me, the fact that he's waffling on Thanksgiving is even more worrisome than normal. I see his taking a stand for T-day as being in alignment with what he has been telling me about the holidays, indicative that he is really separated, and also a good sign that he will keep his word on xmas.

 

Conversely, if he doesn't spend T-day with me, then I have a MONTH to worry about whether he will keep his word about xmas. As horrible as having this disappointment is NOW (really stressful time in my life in other ways) I think I'd feel practically suicidal if we play out him abandoing me at xmas. It's especially upsetting as I've tried taking pre-emptive action and discussed this with him.

 

So given what I just told you, would you think it is advisable to consider letting T-day slide, but still trust that he will keep his promise about xmas?

 

DO NOT GIVE HIM THIS MUCH POWER!

 

Don't put this on him, or on anyone. No one can carry the responsibility for making sure you don't feel abandoned on Christmas. No one. And you shouldn't put it on them. That's not fair. And, no matter WHO you put it on, they will disappoint you at some point.

[whichwayisup]

Its kinda of wierd on my end, I have not even discussed Holidays with mine... I dont think I am ready for all that YET I have made plans with my family which does not include him, and I am assuming he will go to his family with his child, assuming also that she will be there...IS that bad or what???

 

See, you're going on with your life - Not letting HIM dictate. If he wants to be with you, he knows where to find you.

 

Hang in there mino. And don't think of him spending time with his kid as meaning him bonding with his wife. He isn't with her, he's moved out, yes? Then chances are, they are doing this for their childs sake, to make it easier on him/her. They will always co-parent together, that part will be there forever.

[wildsoul]

The problem is, he is in NO position right now to be making you any promises.

Yet another reason why his choice about T-giving is a defining moment. Although it's not been completely lost on me that he could spend T-day with me and still flake on xmas!

 

It just sucks that I thought we were further along than we are. He already walked the guantlet of not spending his 50th birthday with her and her family. He was separated and spent 4 days with me. Then he didn't spend her bday (that same month) with her either. I was feeling pretty good about that progress. T-day "should" have been just another progression of undoing holiday traditions. Ah, but it was harder for him than he or I thought.

 

I already know I deserve better than this, yet because of all the complications that go with affairs, separation, and divorce it seems hard. There is what "I deserve," but then there is also the reality that I'm dating someone who isn't ready to give me what I deserve.

[norajane]

The problem is, he is in NO position right now to be making you any promises. He will unfortunately back out on you, he's shown you this already. I just have a bad feeling about this, and WS, I hope I'm wrong!

 

He's already told her what's going to happen at Christmas -

 

He lamented that it's harder than he thought, and he can see that even though he's told her about not being there for xmas already, based on last night he thinks that will be an even worse fight between them.

 

ws, don't count on him for Christmas, and don't set it up in your head that he's abandoning you. Make your own plans and don't invite him.

[wildsoul]

Book a trip during the christmas holidays with him, therefore he is locked in...

Hunh. During our holiday discussions last week he said, "I was thinking maybe you and I should book a trip to ___." I put the nix on travel because I'm financially tight and said it would be nice to spend time here. But I was also thinking that maybe he was thinking of a way to lock it in and have an excuse to say no to his x.

[Mino]

See, you're going on with your life - Not letting HIM dictate. If he wants to be with you, he knows where to find you.

 

Hang in there mino. And don't think of him spending time with his kid as meaning him bonding with his wife. He isn't with her, he's moved out, yes? Then chances are, they are doing this for their childs sake, to make it easier on him/her. They will always co-parent together, that part will be there forever.

I know that now , it all about the child, but to be honest, I am not ready to introduce him to my family..and I dont want to meet his family yet..everything is still to fresh... and he needs to be D first before I would even consider bringing him home to meet my family

[whichwayisup]

This is why slowing things down and having less expectations, is better for you. He isn't committed to you, and he can't be until he is divorced. I hate to keep harping on that point, but the bottomline is - He's still married WS.

 

His progress all depends on how much he truly wants his marriage and life to be over with his wife. You have no control over this and I'm sure this is driving you nuts. He isn't moving as quickly as you want him to be moving along.. Problem is, the more you push, the more he will do nothing. Noone likes to be told what to do and when to do it, etc.. You gotta back off and make your plans without him.

 

It isn't what you deserve, but if you plan on sticking around and waiting for him, then ride it out, but by DETACHING yourself and putting yourself first, instead of relying on him for all your happiness.

[whichwayisup]

I know that now , it all about the child, but to be honest, I am not ready to introduce him to my family..and I dont want to meet his family yet..everything is still to fresh... and he needs to be D first before I would even consider bringing him home to meet my family

 

You two seriously need to slow down and date eachother, when the D is final. No rush on meeting parents, his folks etc. Just enjoy getting to know eachother and spending time together in a more normal setting. Problem is, you two are still more or less in A mode.

[2sunny]

well there are a lot of assumptions and speculation being thrown around for very little info he gave out.

 

personally why would he wait around all day to continue a conversation that could be finished over the phone? something smells bad about this whole thing. why does he need to be in front of her to talk about it yesterday or today? i bet he stays tonight with her too. just my gut though.

 

if it were me i would call his W and ask her for clarification. she's the only one you'll get the truth from - so go right to the source and find out what the facts are surrounding the holiday and what the plan is.

 

i know he won't want you to do this - but hey, at this point how could he blame you for asking? you have a right to know where things stand and planning for your future.

 

if he's mad - too bad! YOU should be the one mad right now - so your reaction (or non-reaction) is very inappropriate for a gal that is being disregarded. how would he expect anyone to stand around and do nothing about his indecisive wimpy ways?

 

wimpy men become SO unappealing to me even if they are physically the most attractive people i ever saw.

 

he's not standing up for he wants or he would have stated his position and left. this is not the truth of what's happening he's making it a softer blow for you so you'll buy into it and be understanding when he can't show up for T-day - you need to ask HER what the deal is.

[Mino]

You two seriously need to slow down and date eachother, when the D is final. No rush on meeting parents, his folks etc. Just enjoy getting to know eachother and spending time together in a more normal setting. Problem is, you two are still more or less in A mode.

You are so right wwisup!! I am trying though...I have backed of alot..But then he comes looking for me.. OUR T says we should take a six month break...ouchie...

[whichwayisup]

So, let him come look for you. Live your life Mino and don't stop for him until his D is official. I agree with the T. (What do you mean "our T". Are you two seeing a T together??)

[Mino]

So, let him come look for you. Live your life Mino and don't stop for him until his D is official. I agree with the T. (What do you mean "our T". Are you two seeing a T together??)

No, same one, but seperate...

[2sunny]

No, same one, but seperate...

 

the word is spelled sepARATe.

 

my english teacher used to say there is a rat in the word separate! he was right!!!

 

sorry to go off topic - i have a pet peeve for misspellings!

[whichwayisup]

Off topic here, but I do spell masterbate wrong. Just can't help it. LOL!

[Mino]

the word is spelled sepARATe.

 

my english teacher used to say there is a rat in the word separate! he was right!!!

 

sorry to go off topic - i have a pet peeve for misspellings!

Sorry my english is not perfect, but it is my second language:o

[Lucky_One]

Have you ever been married?

No, let me rephrase that: Have you ever been divorced?

 

Because darlin' those serious discussions with tears, upset, and angry words, alternated with attempts at resolution can go in circles all night.

 

In this particular instance, when I didn't hear from him, I worried that they might be reconciling or something. I still don't know all the facts, but I sure as hell do recognize the voice of someone who's been frustratingly trying to work through an arguement.

 

I don't want to make excuses, but again, since I've been married/divorced I DO understand that the feelings are mixed of fighting and trying to comfort each other. The only difference here is that my guy has already started a new R with me. I loathe being in this position and don't like that I got in it, but at the same time I have to be honest and say that it's perfectly freaking real that he might spend the night after a big talk like that, especially if it ended late and draining.

 

Perhaps my boundaries aren't where they could be, but I think your reply smacks of a perfectionism that doesn't allow for real life. Please, this isn't a swipe when I know you're trying to support me to have boundaries! Thank you. Yet it has a naivetee that makes me think you've never been divorced from someone that you still like as a person.

 

Yes, I have been married. I have been divorced. And I was involved in an affair. And I have a child by my xH. And I have a great BF currently. I have pretty much covered all the labels, I think.

 

And divorce is hard. And yep - those nights of fighting and crying and arguing and holding each other and making love - I remember those. But when the pushing came to the shoving and he moved out, then it was time for the marriage to be over. Arguments were about child support, visitation, division of assets, time spent with our son, time spent with his GF instead of his son. We didnt' spend the night with each other. We didn't "talk" or "fight" for 24 hours.

 

Why not? Because that portion of our lives was finished. By the time we decided to separate, there was no need to spend that much time with each other; it had all been said.

 

Obviously, they haven't said all that they need to say. Their marriage is not over - separation or not.

[Lucky_One]

Its kinda of wierd on my end, I have not even discussed Holidays with mine... I dont think I am ready for all that YET:eek: I have made plans with my family which does not include him, and I am assuming he will go to his family with his child, assuming also that she will be there...IS that bad or what???

 

I don't think it's bad. My BF and I have been dating since April, and we are both planning on spending Christmas with our own families; Thanksgiving, too. Maybe next year if we are still together, but who knows?

[wildsoul]

Why not? Because that portion of our lives was finished. By the time we decided to separate, there was no need to spend that much time with each other; it had all been said.

Gotcha. Thanks for the background explanation.

 

I think everyone's situation is a little different by the choices along the way. For example, in my guy's case, he wants to split up but she absolutely doesn't. He moved out 2.5 months ago, but it wasn't really a mutual decision.

 

As for my own story (which didn't include an A by either me or my x) we did therapy to help us exit well. I moved out very slowly, and didn't start dating until we mutually agreed that we would D. Like you, it had ALL been said.

 

Still, I'm finding out that my guy's S/D isn't as far along as I thought. I think he undersestimated it for himself too.