Is anything going on

[turnera]

More than a drone?

[Drone117]

More than a drone?

 

Not sure what you mean. In my previous post I meant to say "make me seeing things". That was a typo, can't edit this post anymore.

[merrmeade]

Drone, we all had misgivings initially - because we are not used to lying, right? But then someone on here reminded us that our spouses had been lying and deceiving us overtly and by omission over and over, not to mention committing the unthinkable. You've yet to prove it, but just remember that IF it's true, you are MORE than justified.

 

2nd, don't forget, too, that your advantage if and when the time comes will be knowing what she doesn't expect you to know. She will be caught off guard and will not have time to gather her thoughts. She will look at you in surprise and doubt at first and that's when you use the doubt to say that you 'know.' She might challenge you, then you offer one more piece of true information. She has to believe that it's possible.

[Drone117]

Drone, we all had misgivings initially - because we are not used to lying, right? But then someone on here reminded us that our spouses had been lying and deceiving us overtly and by omission over and over, not to mention committing the unthinkable. You've yet to prove it, but just remember that IF it's true, you are MORE than justified.

 

2nd, don't forget, too, that your advantage if and when the time comes will be knowing what she doesn't expect you to know. She will be caught off guard and will not have time to gather her thoughts. She will look at you in surprise and doubt at first and that's when you use the doubt to say that you 'know.' She might challenge you, then you offer one more piece of true information. She has to believe that it's possible.

 

You are absolutely correct.

[Jersey born raised]

Hi Drone,

 

Thanks for the info I asked for. Could you provide some personal refrence such as cultural background from where you are from and where you live now?

 

Right now you are in the living hell of limbo.

The only way to survive is to establish goals, work towards them and get a lot of exercise.

 

I see one big mistake to you are making and it is huge. What will the terms of your divorce be. What will it cost, spousal support and for how long? Where will you live? What activities will you engage in that you will not only enjoy but enhance your life?

 

This is an option you must have in place to survive before all else. I am not saying you must divorce. I am not concern about all the what if she is and really really wants to reconcile. What if it was just a fling because of a change in work and country and she really really really is remorseful. None of that matters. What matters is a plan exists if needed. PERIOD !!!

 

Every BS thread who did have a plan in place that I have read has prospered very quickly regardless if the marriage survived or not.

Can we discuss this for a bit?

[fenix]

Hi Drone,

 

Thanks for the info I asked for. Could you provide some personal refrence such as cultural background from where you are from and where you live now?

 

Right now you are in the living hell of limbo.

The only way to survive is to establish goals, work towards them and get a lot of exercise.

 

I see one big mistake to you are making and it is huge. What will the terms of your divorce be. What will it cost, spousal support and for how long? Where will you live? What activities will you engage in that you will not only enjoy but enhance your life?

 

This is an option you must have in place to survive before all else. I am not saying you must divorce. I am not concern about all the what if she is and really really wants to reconcile. What if it was just a fling because of a change in work and country and she really really really is remorseful. None of that matters. What matters is a plan exists if needed. PERIOD !!!

 

Every BS thread who did have a plan in place that I have read has prospered very quickly regardless if the marriage survived or not.

Can we discuss this for a bit?

 

Quote for emphasis! You may not want to divorce but you need to have a plan in place. You need to know that you can leave if you want when you confront her, you need to know that your life is under your own control otherwise you may accept many things you don't want to accept just because you don't have any other option.

[elaine567]

You may not want to divorce but you need to have a plan in place.

 

Agreed.

 

OP

Many affairs are just about validation, "extra", excitement, attention etc. but a proportion are serious attempts to leave the marriage, so whilst your mindset may be "We just need to get through this, it is just a passing infatuation", her mindset may be more about ending things and moving on to pastures new.

She just needs a "bridging" relationship to give her the support she needs to end it and often an affair may do that.

It is therefore what is called an exit affair

If that is the case here, you need to be prepared for that.

[MJJean]

I will be taking to an expert about var later this week. The legality seems grey to me.

 

The VAR is for personal use. In areas where it's legality is questionable, simply use the device as an investigative tool and never reveal it as a source.

 

It is possible she is cheating. It's also possible she has emotionally checked out for whatever reasons and she is contemplating leaving you, work friend knows, and doesn't want to be the one to tell you.

[S2B]

When does she travel next?

[WilyWill]

I'm with MJJean. No-one will ever know about the VAR. It will ride in the car, well-hidden, for 1-2 days until you have closure. There's no reason for you to take the high road when she's clearly been deceptive.

[Drone117]

Jersey born raised and fenix: I'm really not getting that "plan your divorce" businesses. I came here to get some counsel on basically was I wrong suspecting my wife. Got some great advice and two plausible theories (more on this below) that I'm following. What does it have to do with financials of divorce, or enhancing my life after it? What exactly do I need to plan? Not going to get divorce papers drafted until I know I'm divorcing. I'd rather be addressing issues in order of priority.

 

Elanie567 and MJJean. Thanks a lot. You maybe very right in this. I have a plausible alternative to the cheating now. Not that it is more pleasant or easy to swallow. I keep asking myself what could have caused her to want to exit and can't find answers. Doesn't mean of course there are no valid reasons at list in her mind.

 

Had a chat with PI. Coincidentally he told me almost the same thing. That she might be cheating or just checked out. Or in between. In any case he'll be able to start working for me in a week. Have some homework to do in the meantime as he suggested. Some is what you have been telling me before, some is new.

 

S2B: Don't know, no date set.

[fenix]

Jersey born raised and fenix: I'm really not getting that "plan your divorce" businesses. I came here to get some counsel on basically was I wrong suspecting my wife. Got some great advice and two plausible theories (more on this below) that I'm following. What does it have to do with financials of divorce, or enhancing my life after it? What exactly do I need to plan? Not going to get divorce papers drafted until I know I'm divorcing. I'd rather be addressing issues in order of priority.

 

Elanie567 and MJJean. Thanks a lot. You maybe very right in this. I have a plausible alternative to the cheating now. Not that it is more pleasant or easy to swallow. I keep asking myself what could have caused her to want to exit and can't find answers. Doesn't mean of course there are no valid reasons at list in her mind.

 

Had a chat with PI. Coincidentally he told me almost the same thing. That she might be cheating or just checked out. Or in between. In any case he'll be able to start working for me in a week. Have some homework to do in the meantime as he suggested. Some is what you have been telling me before, some is new.

 

S2B: Don't know, no date set.

 

We are not telling you that you need to divorce her, or that you may want to divorce her either... but you may want to be prepared for that. You should check your finances and understand which steps you need to follow in the case you need to divorce (it may not be even up to you).

We all still hope your wife is not cheating, I have become a bit cynical with all the stories in this website but who knows maybe you are the exception that confirms the rule... but if your wife is cheating and you confront her you don't know how she will react... you don't know if she wants to reconcile or is just a exit affair... you don't know if she will be willing to fight to reconcile or if she will be able to do the things that you need to reconcile... or even if you will want to reconcile once you get the details.

Therefore we recommend you to do some preparation (not the divorce papers) to know what needs to be done and how it needs to be done if it needs to happen.

Anyhow... the choice is yours..

[MJJean]

Jersey born raised and fenix: I'm really not getting that "plan your divorce" businesses. I came here to get some counsel on basically was I wrong suspecting my wife. Got some great advice and two plausible theories (more on this below) that I'm following. What does it have to do with financials of divorce, or enhancing my life after it? What exactly do I need to plan? Not going to get divorce papers drafted until I know I'm divorcing. I'd rather be addressing issues in order of priority.

 

Elanie567 and MJJean. Thanks a lot. You maybe very right in this. I have a plausible alternative to the cheating now. Not that it is more pleasant or easy to swallow. I keep asking myself what could have caused her to want to exit and can't find answers. Doesn't mean of course there are no valid reasons at list in her mind.

 

Had a chat with PI. Coincidentally he told me almost the same thing. That she might be cheating or just checked out. Or in between. In any case he'll be able to start working for me in a week. Have some homework to do in the meantime as he suggested. Some is what you have been telling me before, some is new.

 

S2B: Don't know, no date set.

 

Consult with a divorce attorney to get a clear picture of the reality of divorce in your situation. You'll need that information to make informed choices and to prepare for the worst, just in case.

[Jersey born raised]

None of those who you mentioned is telling you to divorce, but to be prepared. Just as it would be a good idea to read his needs, her needs and other books mostly on how to make a good marriage better.

 

As the first winter storm past after I got my driver licensce my dad took to a mall parking lot and practice recovering from a spin out and brakeing. 44 years later I have used what I learned many times to avoid accidents.

 

Learn to live aware, to be prepared. You have a PI lined up, have a divorce plan line up, then focus on building a good marriage that is adapting to change or rebuild a damaged one. Rebuilding a damaged one will include the steps building on top of a good marriage, but the damage must be fixed first.

 

Be well

[tinkerbell16]

Red flag with the coworker. No comment like the other poster said is a comment.

You can get a good quality VAR cheap, use good batteries. Yesterday!!!! She could have a burner phone or be using a business phone.

 

Workplace affairs are hard to investigate especially if it's travel related. Even a PI will have difficulty. Your friend the husband of the coworker is your best bet.

 

100% no comment is a comment. She would have totally said nothing was going on if nothing was going on.

I was with my ex for almost 30 years never suspect the level of deceit and lies and projected anger and blame he did while engaging in a work affair.

Be prepared... she will lie through her teeth even if faced with facts.

[Jersey born raised]

Red flags are just a warning that something maybe occurring, nothing more. As we age, we grow and change. Being aware in marriage is knowing this and blending the individual growth together.

 

You got info on a Var, you ave hired a PI, you have plans for a divorce, so wait for the info to come to you. Put it out of your head. Read material on how to build and grow a marriage. "love busters" is often spoken highly of. It is best used before adultery though.

[Drone117]

Ok, admittedly I've been caught on analysis paralysis. Still trying to get the proof, nothing outstanding yet. Definitely not sitting on my hands. All this watching and observing brought me to the point where I realise her recent behavior is of a (still) very good partner, mother of our child, whatever, but not the wife/lover as she used to be. So my options are:

 

- She is not cheating but wants to leave the marriage. I will try to save it but I don't I can do much.

- She is cheating but this is a "one off" and she wants to stay in marriage. Could be salvageable, depending how far it went.

- She is cheating and wants to leave. It's all gone.

 

Looking at this - I really need to start preparing.

[merrmeade]

Ok, admittedly I've been caught on analysis paralysis. Still trying to get the proof, nothing outstanding yet. Definitely not sitting on my hands. All this watching and observing brought me to the point where I realise her recent behavior is of a (still) very good partner, mother of our child, whatever, but not the wife/lover as she used to be. So my options are:

 

- She is not cheating but wants to leave the marriage. I will try to save it but I don't I can do much.

- She is cheating but this is a "one off" and she wants to stay in marriage. Could be salvageable, depending how far it went.

- She is cheating and wants to leave. It's all gone.

 

Looking at this - I really need to start preparing.

Not sure I agree with all the parts of these equations. But more important, I don't think you should be trying to wrap your head around steps 8, 9 and 10 when you're still on 1, 2 and 3.

 

Maybe the only preparing you can do is to decide what you can't live with and what you must have to continue living with her. That's all you really have control over anyway. But you have hardly described all the possible outcomes.

 

I"d recommend you spend the next week reading books while waiting for what the PI finds our. Many people here recommend "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass to learn more about the affair phenomenon.

[Drone117]

Not sure I agree with all the parts of these equations. But more important, I don't think you should be trying to wrap your head around steps 8, 9 and 10 when you're still on 1, 2 and 3.

 

Maybe the only preparing you can do is to decide what you can't live with and what you must have to continue living with her. That's all you really have control over anyway. But you have hardly described all the possible outcomes.

 

I"d recommend you spend the next week reading books while waiting for what the PI finds our. Many people here recommend "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass to learn more about the affair phenomenon.

 

I tend to agree with the most part, thank you, but what possible outcomes you think I haven't described?

[fenix]

I tend to agree with the most part, thank you, but what possible outcomes you think I haven't described?

 

Many people is afraid to look to things like divorce because is scary and they don't even want to think about it. We are not telling you to serve her the papers or to have them ready but to make sure you have a exit escape if you need one. Many people stay in a ill relationship or try to reconcile for the wrong reasons (most common are children and finances). If you read this forum you will find men and women who keep in marriages where their husband/wife doesn't act remorseful, some of them keep the affair on and force their husband/wife to accept it or leave, etc...

My advise is only that you should be prepared for all the options because when the moment comes it not be even up to you if you need to divorce or not and if you are not well prepared you will be the one who suffers the consequences (specially because being a man you will have the whole divorce system playing against you)

 

This are my 0.05$ , you don't have to agree, you don't have to take any advise on here but I thought I should give you my honest advise.

[Just a Guy]

Hi Drone, I just went back and reread your OP. In it you said that your instincts( read gut feelings) were telling you that something was not right with your wife and that there was someone else that she was probably carrying on with. All I want to say ( as others too would) that you must always tryst your gut ( instincts) as it is always right. If that be the case then what some of the others are telling you is spot on. I think Merrmeade got it right when she says that you identify what you can't live with and what you must have to continue living with her. Just as you prepared yourself for the workday world by acquiring qualifications which fitted you out to be able to succeed in the work place so must you prepare yourself for the situations arising from the possible infidelity of your wife. If at the end of your investigations it turns out that she is innocent so much the better for both of you. However if it does turn out to be true then you would have the mental and possibly some emotional preparedness to face the difficult days ahead. I do hope for your sake that this dilemma facing you is resolved sooner rather than later as being in a state of suspended animation is just debilitating. Wishing you all the very best. Cheers.

[tinkerbell16]

Drone,

So sorry you are going through this... one thing to consider is if she is hiding money, or taken out credit cards in her name only.

 

My ex (of almost 30 years) had a second cell phone and was still bringing me flowers and leaving love notes for me up until the end.

 

I too had a gut feeling. It was instinct. It was in small things like he was talking in a different way... using words I hadn't heard him use before... almost like he was being coached.

 

He stopped kissing me when being intimate.

 

He was "working" more.

 

He was grumpy ALL the time.

 

His interest in doing things as a family waned to almost never.

 

I never ever persuade proof because I already knew in my gut... but I learned only after the divorce that he was in a relationship with his Co worker for almost a year before we even separated.

 

So when we were on an anniversary trip and he bought me jewelry and flowers and told me he couldn't live without me and I was the love of his life and how blessed he was to have me and how I make him a better man he was already in a full on physical and emotional affair with his Co worker.

 

Looking back it is unbelievable the deceit, cover up and lies.

 

All from a man I never would have suspected was capable of that.

 

We were the picture perfect couple... he was looked upon as a really great guy with an excellent moral compass to the extent some family member do not believe he did what he did to this day.

 

Your gut is never ever ever wrong.

[BuddyX]

Drone,

So sorry you are going through this... one thing to consider is if she is hiding money, or taken out credit cards in her name only.

 

My ex (of almost 30 years) had a second cell phone and was still bringing me flowers and leaving love notes for me up until the end.

 

I too had a gut feeling. It was instinct. It was in small things like he was talking in a different way... using words I hadn't heard him use before... almost like he was being coached.

 

He stopped kissing me when being intimate.

 

He was "working" more.

 

He was grumpy ALL the time.

 

His interest in doing things as a family waned to almost never.

 

I never ever persuade proof because I already knew in my gut... but I learned only after the divorce that he was in a relationship with his Co worker for almost a year before we even separated.

 

So when we were on an anniversary trip and he bought me jewelry and flowers and told me he couldn't live without me and I was the love of his life and how blessed he was to have me and how I make him a better man he was already in a full on physical and emotional affair with his Co worker.

 

Looking back it is unbelievable the deceit, cover up and lies.

 

All from a man I never would have suspected was capable of that.

 

We were the picture perfect couple... he was looked upon as a really great guy with an excellent moral compass to the extent some family member do not believe he did what he did to this day.

 

Your gut is never ever ever wrong.

 

I asked my Wife (at the time) if there was someone else. She looked me in the eye and said "NO". Later that night she was sexting him. I knew it in my gut but could believe my little flower could do this.

[BetrayedH]

Your default position, if she is found to have been in an affair, seems to be to salvage the marriage. I think it would be wise to put a lot of thought into why you would feel that way. If your partner for all things in life has no problem lying straight to your face while conducting an affair with another man, why would you want to stay with her?

 

The answer typically has to do with fear. At that point you will feel that you've already lost everything from probably your most significant investment in life. You'll be in a scramble to try to salvage what you can. While many people discuss that a wayward spouse can be caught up in an "affair fog," I think this sense of desperation is a form of fog for a betrayed spouse. We are emotionally damaged and just want to stop the bleeding. And we further lower our value and self-esteem by being willing to accept unacceptable treatment.

 

I think your default position should be that you will not accept unacceptable behavior and will have no plans to remain in a marriage where your wife is a liar and cheater. And you should only consider staying IF she bends over backwards to convince you otherwise. That is a much healthier default position that values you.

[Jersey born raised]

The red flags you describe are more a tinted pink towards red. They could evidence of individual growth which is needed in a marriage. Individual growth must be blended into mutual growth for a marriage survive. Remember the old saying "great marriages are hard work"?

 

Again this does not mean there is nothing there, by the time a person actually seeks out and posts on these boards there almost always is. Just prepare for the worst (divorce and a post divorce life) and work for the best by reading books on building a better marriage and how to heal a marriage. Hey I got the first aid merit badge in scouts and used that knowledge all my life. I even got a guy who stopped breathing again after a severe electrical shock. It was the being prepared and drilled that enabled me to do it. At the time the training took over and I just acted while a part of me kept thinking a guy? Really a GUY? Why couldn't it have been female and blonde????

 

But the training and drilling paid off for him I acted without thought.