I want the impossible

[LargoLagg]

It's been a couple of weeks since I saw you last. I went to a party last night, and as usual, my wife didn't want to go, and sent me alone. I needed some fun, some distraction.

 

I picked up on that too. Did anybody ever wonder how it is that I managed to get so much alone time with OW? This isn't new, and I don't particularly resent this, but it does point to a difference between the two of us.

 

I was thinking about that today, and by the time I hit the reset button, it felt like I had a new girlfriend. In a lot of ways, I did.

 

I'm not out there partying it up every night, but once in a while, it's fun to go out and do things. That's what I do. That's what I've always done. That night, like on most occasions, my choices were to go out or to stay at home and watch my wife sleep on the couch while the TV blathers on. Most nights, I'm a homebody. After a while, I'll get restless and go do something somewhere where I won't disturb her, like practice my musical instrument, read a book or work on something in the house. Or lately, post here. I seem to have more energy, probably because I exercise regularly.

 

That night, Crooked Hillary and Daffy Donald were going to go head-to-head. It was an easy choice to make.

 

As for fundamental compatibility, I'm thinking maybe we're at the cusp of change, where age and habits start to pull people in different directions, or patterns set in that don't lend themselves to togetherness.

[heartwhole]

My husband and I talk a lot about the right balance for being social together, for both of us going out alone, etc. It shouldn't be something you just ponder on your own or on here. I can relate to needing some time to reset on your own, but if your wife is never accompanying you to do anything social, then eventually you will grow further apart.

[LargoLagg]

She was simply being civil, a less restrained person would be more pointed in their language. When you continue to act inappropriately, folks are going to call you on your s**t.

 

That's fine. Feedback is a two way street. If you can dish it out, I hope you can take it too.

 

Can't help but wonder if this is what you saw or what you wanted to see. You seem determined to wallow, very little thought about how you'll reconnect with your wife...

 

Mr. Lucky

There's a lot of text in this thread, so I can't know if you've read every word. I'll reiterate. I am focused on wallowing right now. This is fresh. I could ignore it, or I could suppress it, but none of that works for me long term. Think of it like a spiritual poison is inside me, and expression is the anti-venom that gets it out.

 

I can't just flip it off like I have a switch inside. I wish I did, I'd use it. I think the existence of this website demonstrates that most people don't have that switch. If we did, life would be easy and nobody would care. If you got hurt, you'd just flip your switch. But that's not how it works. We need time to change. Now is my time.

 

I need to stay away from comments about moderation, so NOT AS A CHALLENGE, but to help you understand, I haven't been able to find the correct forum that is meant for MM wallowing. That's why you'll read these sorts of posts here. I've figured out that your focus is different, but I've got no other place to go.

Edited October 21, 2016 by LargoLagg

[Midlifecrisis1]

Lago, I completely agree that in the beginning, you need to wallow. Talk about it, talk about it a lot. Talk About it until you are sick of yourself. I wallowed for a couple of months. I still wallow when my mind isn't occupied. Therapy helps.

[LargoLagg]

My husband and I talk a lot about the right balance for being social together, for both of us going out alone, etc. It shouldn't be something you just ponder on your own or on here. I can relate to needing some time to reset on your own, but if your wife is never accompanying you to do anything social, then eventually you will grow further apart.

Thank you, you seem very measured and thoughtful. I'm taking one problem at a time, I have a lot of time to figure this all out, and I'm in no particular hurry. I'm sure this will be a lot like turning a ship, it won't turn on a dime, and we'll need to plot a course.

[LargoLagg]

I get you. I know where you are coming from.

Thanks. Probably the nicest 10 words in the entire thread! No offense, but I'd hate to live what you've described. I hope it works out for you one way or the other.

[LargoLagg]

Lago, I completely agree that in the beginning, you need to wallow. Talk about it, talk about it a lot. Talk About it until you are sick of yourself. I wallowed for a couple of months. I still wallow when my mind isn't occupied. Therapy helps.

Yeah, I think I need to talk about it until I'm as sick of hearing it as you guys are.

[wmacbride]

That's fine. Feedback is a two way street. If you can dish it out, I hope you can take it too.There's a lot of text in this thread, so I can't know if you've read every word. I'll reiterate. I am focused on wallowing right now. This is fresh. I could ignore it, or I could suppress it, but none of that works for me long term. Think of it like a spiritual poison is inside me, and expression is the anti-venom that gets it out.

 

I can't just flip it off like I have a switch inside. I wish I did, I'd use it. I think the existence of this website demonstrates that most people don't have that switch. If we did, life would be easy and nobody would care. If you got hurt, you'd just flip your switch. But that's not how it works. We need time to change. Now is my time.

 

I need to stay away from comments about moderation, so NOT AS A CHALLENGE, but to help you understand, I haven't been able to find the correct forum that is meant for MM wallowing. That's why you'll read these sorts of posts here. I've figured out that your focus is different, but I've got no other place to go.

 

 

What i think people are trying to tell you is that wallowing serves no purpose. It won't change anything.

 

What sorts of actions, beyond posting here, are you taking to try and figure out what you want to do next? Ruminating about your EA won't make you feel any better.

 

In the past, what would you do to get over a breakup? How would you soothe your feelings and move forward?

 

for what it's worth, there are forums for men in your position, but I get the feeling you want to hear certain things, and that is not what they are giving you.

 

One more thing ( and you are really not going to like this, but please think about it before you respond)

 

You are married, and you owe your wife a hell of a lot better than this. If you've got problems with her,how about you talk to herand not another women or strangers on a internet forum. As it stands right now, you have, in effect, punished her for being who she has been all along. You are placing the blame for your actions at her feet " if she wasn't such a homebody, I wouldn't have cheated".

 

You are quite lucky that you have a wife who trusts you as much as she does. Why can't you put that same trust in her and tell her how you feel? Until you do, don't punish her for not intuitively knowing what's going through your mind.

 

( btw, the letter you wrote about meeting another woman at a party and spending the evening talking with her goes to show that your ex-ow isn't quite as special to you as you thought)

[wmacbride]

Thank you, you seem very measured and thoughtful. I'm taking one problem at a time, I have a lot of time to figure this all out, and I'm in no particular hurry. I'm sure this will be a lot like turning a ship, it won't turn on a dime, and we'll need to plot a course.

 

Where is the "we"in all of this? All you are talking about is "me"

 

- all your statements are about you, how you feel, how you want to go out, how you don't just want to stay at home.

 

What about how your wife feels? Where are your "we" statements? The only time I've seen you bring your wife's feelings in to this is when you are trying to use them to rationalize your actions.

 

How about " I screwed up. Yes, there are things about my wife that aren't exactly suited to me, so I will need to talk to her and find ways to move forward as a team"

[wmacbride]

Yeah, I think I need to talk about it until I'm as sick of hearing it as you guys are.

 

One more response ( you're going to hate me now, if you didn't already ).

 

I've noticed a pattern that you like the responses that give you sympathy and a pat on the back, and you make snarky remarks to anyone who holds your feet to the fire.

 

Ask yourself this. The people who are holding your feet to the fire, what are their stories? Most of them have been able to move forward form the A, whether they are a bs, a ws or an ow/om. Why do you think that is?

 

Recovering form this sort of thing is really hard but it can be done. The key ( and this is something I was told by the counselors we saw, a psychologist and also my child's therapist- for a different issue- is that you can't luxuriate in grief. Grief can feed on itself, and become almost comforting. At some point, you have to stop allowing yourself to ruminate, and make a conscious decision to move on. That doesn't mean that you never think about it,but that you have to wean yourself off of the self pity. One tool that was recommended to us was to allow yourself a set period of time each day to grieve in some way that is healthy. Keep that up for a week or more. If you find your mind drifting back, force yourself to think of something else. It doesn't matter what.

The next week, allow yourself less time each day for grieving

The same the next week, but even if you don;t feel like grieving, force yourself to at that set time.

The next week, when that time of day rolls around,decide if it you want to grieve or if there is something else you'd rather do.

 

- I say weeks, but use whatever length of time you need. The key is to not wallow, as you have to teach yourself a new behavior pattern.

 

I get that a relationship ending sucks, we've all been there- the thing for you is that you have someone else's feelings to consider, and you are already falling into the trap of blaming your wife for your actions. You are ruminating,and that helps no one.

[merrmeade]

I've wondered if some day they'll do studies that show that wayward spouses are missing the ability to project into the future because, when you describe feeling that first tug, I doubt that few of us don't know how that feels, BUT ....

... when I first felt that tug, I probably should have made myself scarce, but I didn't. .

... when I felt it, my mind raced down the events and tragedies and all the people destroyed to the very end of having answered such a tug, and I turned away every time. I look back now a little bitterly at those decisions because now I know that my husband did not make himself scarce ever. Sometimes he was even answering tugs when I was resisting them. But do I wish I'd gone ahead? No. And I'm not bragging or proud of it. I just would've dreaded feeling the awful I knew I'd feel at some point more than the promise of the tug. Although, sure give me psychic powers and let me see the future with my multiple-wayward spouse and I'd be jumping at those tugs, but what world is that in?

 

But, OP, this is pretty telling...

I know what I'm supposed to do. I need to take a little time to let myself feel some loss. I need to start feeling grateful for what I've kept. I need to get busy, reconnect on some level with the wife.

... THE wife??? No comment. I think it speaks for itself.

[Lion Heart]

That's fine. Feedback is a two way street. If you can dish it out, I hope you can take it too.There's a lot of text in this thread, so I can't know if you've read every word. I'll reiterate. I am focused on wallowing right now. This is fresh. I could ignore it, or I could suppress it, but none of that works for me long term. Think of it like a spiritual poison is inside me, and expression is the anti-venom that gets it out.

 

I can't just flip it off like I have a switch inside. I wish I did, I'd use it. I think the existence of this website demonstrates that most people don't have that switch. If we did, life would be easy and nobody would care. If you got hurt, you'd just flip your switch. But that's not how it works. We need time to change. Now is my time.

 

I need to stay away from comments about moderation, so NOT AS A CHALLENGE, but to help you understand, I haven't been able to find the correct forum that is meant for MM wallowing. That's why you'll read these sorts of posts here. I've figured out that your focus is different, but I've got no other place to go.

 

LargoLagg

 

Wallow! That's awesome. IMO you are grieving when you wallow so GOOD get it ALL out.

 

And you ARE in the right forum again IMHO so phooey to those who don't get you.

 

I'm so IMPRESSED that you're here writing out ALL your feelings.

 

WELL DONE YOU!

 

:-))

Lion Heart

[LargoLagg]

One more response ( you're going to hate me now, if you didn't already ).

 

I've noticed a pattern that you like the responses that give you sympathy and a pat on the back, and you make snarky remarks to anyone who holds your feet to the fire.

 

Ask yourself this. The people who are holding your feet to the fire, what are their stories? Most of them have been able to move forward form the A, whether they are a bs, a ws or an ow/om. Why do you think that is?

 

Recovering form this sort of thing is really hard but it can be done. The key ( and this is something I was told by the counselors we saw, a psychologist and also my child's therapist- for a different issue- is that you can't luxuriate in grief. Grief can feed on itself, and become almost comforting. At some point, you have to stop allowing yourself to ruminate, and make a conscious decision to move on. That doesn't mean that you never think about it,but that you have to wean yourself off of the self pity. One tool that was recommended to us was to allow yourself a set period of time each day to grieve in some way that is healthy. Keep that up for a week or more. If you find your mind drifting back, force yourself to think of something else. It doesn't matter what.

The next week, allow yourself less time each day for grieving

The same the next week, but even if you don;t feel like grieving, force yourself to at that set time.

The next week, when that time of day rolls around,decide if it you want to grieve or if there is something else you'd rather do.

 

- I say weeks, but use whatever length of time you need. The key is to not wallow, as you have to teach yourself a new behavior pattern.

 

I get that a relationship ending sucks, we've all been there- the thing for you is that you have someone else's feelings to consider, and you are already falling into the trap of blaming your wife for your actions. You are ruminating,and that helps no one.

No, that's all right, I think you mean well.

 

I guess the way I'd say it is this: if I'm wallowing, then yeah, I suppose I'm looking for something. I was about to say sympathy, but that's not really it. I guess if somebody seems to understand, that scratches my itch.

 

As to the rest of it, there are enough of you who sing the same tune, such that I have to give credence to your point of view. It's not that I really don't want to think about it, or that I'm necessarily even defensive, although I can see some of that in my posts too. I'm just not focused on that, you know? I'm kind of a laser beam right now, and my goal is to clear my head. At that point, I don't think I'm done, but I'll be ready to deal with my decisions, view them coldly. Right now, I'm not quite ready to do that, so I resist your counsel with argument. It's not because you're wrong, but I'm just not in the mood to hear it yet. I'm feeling just a little sorry for myself, because life feels unfair. It isn't, I was the one who said "I DO" with the best of intentions, I just feel that way. Job#1 is to not feel that way anymore. I don't know if the squabbling hurts or helps.

 

In terms of blaming my wife, I don't think that's right, she didn't set me up or encourage me in any way. If anything, she may have been an unwitting accomplice, but that's about as far as I can go.

 

I don't know how long this will take. I did go out with "the wife" tonight, we had a pretty good time, it was nice. We're back now, she's sleeping on the couch, and I'm just posting a little before we go to bed.

 

OK, that's it, see you all on the flip side.

[LargoLagg]

I've wondered if some day they'll do studies that show that wayward spouses are missing the ability to project into the future because, when you describe feeling that first tug, I doubt that few of us don't know how that feels, BUT ....

That's a little black and white. I'd say that the studies will show a spectrum of abilities that show a variance in how far people are able to see into the future, and what triggers this response. For example, for you,

... when I felt it, my mind raced down the events and tragedies and all the people destroyed to the very end of having answered such a tug, and I turned away every time. I look back now a little bitterly at those decisions because now I know that my husband did not make himself scarce ever. Sometimes he was even answering tugs when I was resisting them. But do I wish I'd gone ahead? No. And I'm not bragging or proud of it. I just would've dreaded feeling the awful I knew I'd feel at some point more than the promise of the tug. Although, sure give me psychic powers and let me see the future with my multiple-wayward spouse and I'd be jumping at those tugs, but what world is that in?

and for me I had to feel it for a while, apparently for many others, the trigger is the OM/OW demand for something more, and I guess the rest have to get caught. Now, that's would be a study!

But, OP, this is pretty telling... ... THE wife??? No comment. I think it speaks for itself.

Meh. It's an idiom. It's known to bother some men, and ALL WOMEN.

[merrmeade]

That's a little black and white. I'd say that the studies will show a spectrum of abilities that show a variance in how far people are able to see into the future, and what triggers this response. For example, for you, and for me I had to feel it for a while, apparently for many others, the trigger is the OM/OW demand for something more, and I guess the rest have to get caught. Now, that's would be a study! Meh. It's an idiom. It's known to bother some men, and ALL WOMEN.

That is a good point, and something I hadn't given a lot of thought to. For me, there were a couple of potential OMs that are coming back to me now - a couple of old boyfriends, a friend of my husband's. But there's actually no need to analyze each one. With the help of circumstance and distance, I simply shut them down because that's what my mother taught me, and others don't count if I wasn't attracted. Those were slam-dunks.

 

But now? I don't know what would've happened with technology. Internet and no-cost long-distance allow easy access, encourage contact, facilitate "OM/OW demand for something more." Maybe it would've been harder, but I doubt it.

 

Your emphasis on the OM/OW tug, pull and demand makes me also realize my husband didn't lie when he described the aggressive tactics of one of his OWs - a demand he clearly didn't resist - and it doesn't explain the others.

 

Just musing and I still say it comes down to - what you think you ought to do before it happens.

Edited October 22, 2016 by merrmeade

[LargoLagg]

Another day, another weird coincidence. Have a great weekend, everybody!

[Noirek]

Meh. It's an idiom. It's known to bother some men, and ALL WOMEN.

 

Actually, you're wrong. I'm a woman and the term in itself doesn't bother me at all. But rather the context. I think many here object to your wife being put on the back burner as an object of unimportance rather than a human being who is your lifelong partner with feelings.

 

But, i get it. You aren't able to talk about your OW elsewhere but you can here. I wonder if you haven't romanticised the "spark" between you more so than the lady herself. And letting go makes it all that much more sweet.

 

My mom always talks about how most men process through things one thing at a time and most women can multi focus on several things. Maybe that really is at play here. You cannot even think of reconnecting with your wife because your focus is on the OW and missing her.

 

Work through it as you must. i did.

[LargoLagg]

In any context, when used to refer to one's own wife, doesn't the term essentially objectify her? Maybe that's the objection.

 

On the other hand, doesn't the mere act of objectification also always imply ownership, aka "my"? So, in practice, "my wife" is the exact same thing, a declaration of ownership.

 

I guess the equivalent is "the hubby". I can't imagine the context in which I'd actually even think to care if that term was used by my wife to refer to me.

[aileD]

"The wife" could be anyone's wife.

[wmacbride]

It's been a couple of weeks since I saw you last. I went to a party last night, and as usual, my wife didn't want to go, and sent me alone. I needed some fun, some distraction.

 

When I arrived, the host greeted me, showed me around, and then abandoned me to the crowd as other guests arrived. I didn't really know anybody there, so I introduced myself to a couple of women sitting at a table. Try to imagine the look on my face when the first woman introduced herself with your name, spoken in your accent. I asked, and she hails from your part of your country. She was single, about your age, your height, your build. I don't know if she was hunting men last night but she took a real liking to me, and we spent much of the night talking. She wasn't you, she was a distant second, but far closer to you in fit and form than any random stranger should be. As we bantered on into the evening, I closed my eyes and just listened as your understudy prattled on, and I imagined that was you, and I remembered some of the time we spent together.

 

I went there to get away, to find something to fill the void and fate put in front of me a reminder of the very thing I'm trying to put behind me. Do you believe in signs? What did the universe try to tell me last night? That I shouldn't walk away? That you're now out at parties eager to meet new men? That I won't be allowed to forget? That there are women like you everywhere? I don't know. Maybe it was just sheer coincidence. Maybe you'll meet someone who reminds you of me.

 

I've been trying to forget you, well, that's not right, trying to find a way to feel normal again now that you're not around. I wonder sometimes if you think of me too. I have to believe you do. I miss you, OW, I really do. ox

 

I was thinking about about the letter you wrote on here to your ex-ow,and I couldn't help but find it quite odd how you met and somewhat bonded with a different women at the party you say you went to.

 

Is it normal for you to experience this sense of ( I know the word isn't right, but it's the best description I can come up with) of bonding with another woman so quickly? Do you experience the same sort of thing when you meet a man you haven't talked to before?

 

I've been married along time- close to 20 years now- and through work,volunteering and my husband's type of work, I have met and interacted with a lot of men, and women too. If, after meeting someone new, I was asked to describe the experience, it wouldn't be anything near what you described. While I might like the person, I sure as heck wouldn't be gushing about them the way you did in that letter.

 

This is why I feel your sense of boundaries is poor. that's bad, but the good thing is that it is something you can control.

 

I'm also wondering why it is the first people you introduced yourself to was a group of women. Is this typical of you, or were the men at the party few and far between?

[waterwoman]

'The wife' reduces a real woman whom you are supposed to love to a cypher, a cliche, an institution. My H rarely even calls me 'his' wife but uses my name because it reduces me to a thing rather than a person.

 

I tell you how I see this thing playing out. You will continue to secretly despise and resent your wife and sooner or later you will find another person to confide in and get close to, and this time it will go PA.

 

Or.... you could confess all this crap to your wife and explain that it was a big deal and that you are sorry and want to improve your marriage. But that would involve honesty and communication. Any chance?

[cocorico]

Lol...seeing an area code is not a sign. When something or someone is on our mind then we are quick to hone in on anything that is associated, things that we would normally be oblivious to. Years ago when I had an unplanned pregnancy and I was agonizing over what I should do it suddenly seemed like every other person I saw was either a pregnant woman or a mother with her infant. Another time I was considering buying an old Toyota Camry and it suddenly seemed like everyone was driving older Camrys, because the car was on my mind I was quick to notice any and every other car that was like it. When an old boyfriend and I broke up and he moved to another city for a short time afterwards it seemed like everybody I met had some connection to that city. They were from there or going there or had family there. See what I'm saying? These are not signs from the universe, it's just your subconscious mind zeroing in on details that it used to dismiss.

 

It's a cognitive bias known colloquially as the Baader-Meinhof phenomenon.

[LargoLagg]

I tell you how I see this thing playing out. You will continue to secretly despise and resent your wife and sooner or later you will find another person to confide in and get close to, and this time it will go PA.

I don't mean to be hurtful, but to me it sounds like you're having trouble forgiving your married man for whatever in the world he did to you. You are no doubt still hurt, still suspicious, still just waiting for him to backslide. This part of your post drips with fearful cynicism. I can only tell you that you're wrong about me, although I'm not 100% convinced you were really writing about me. If I despised and resented my wife, I would have had the physical affair. THOSE are the men who despise their wives, the ones who fail to consider them when they go from thinking about it to DOING IT.

'The wife' reduces a real woman whom you are supposed to love to a cypher, a cliche, an institution. My H rarely even calls me 'his' wife but uses my name because it reduces me to a thing rather than a person.

While I'm at it, this snippet speaks to the same problem. You are hypersensitive, and seek to impute meaning and motive into the way regular people talk. "The wife" is an American idiom, so you can be forgiven for misinterpreting that. However, your husband uttering the phrase "my wife" REDUCES YOU TO A THING? Seriously? The only "thing" you are is a poor thing, that is so damaged by her husband's infidelity that even normal phrases and discourse seem to pierce you. I don't know where you think you are in your reconciliation process, but I'd venture to say that you still have a lot of forgiving to do, and somebody is probably walking on eggshells around you. Perhaps that's deserved, I can't say.

Or.... you could confess all this crap to your wife and explain that it was a big deal and that you are sorry and want to improve your marriage. But that would involve honesty and communication. Any chance?

Well, honestly? No friggin' way. I have to weigh the benefits vs. the harm and I just think this would cause needless harm. How has knowing worked out for you? Not well, I'd venture. I can only assume that's why you're here. What if H had repented in his heart, cut things off all by himself, and worked through whatever feelings he had for his trollop and you'd never found out? Wouldn't you be happier today? Would you really want to know? You'd have to be a glutton for punishment to say yes.

[LargoLagg]

It's a cognitive bias known colloquially as the Baader-Meinhof phenomenon.

It actually sounds like the complete opposite of colloquial, but it's nice to know the name of this regardless.

[LargoLagg]

I was thinking about about the letter you wrote on here to your ex-ow,and I couldn't help but find it quite odd how you met and somewhat bonded with a different women at the party you say you went to.

 

Is it normal for you to experience this sense of ( I know the word isn't right, but it's the best description I can come up with) of bonding with another woman so quickly? Do you experience the same sort of thing when you meet a man you haven't talked to before?

 

I've been married along time- close to 20 years now- and through work,volunteering and my husband's type of work, I have met and interacted with a lot of men, and women too. If, after meeting someone new, I was asked to describe the experience, it wouldn't be anything near what you described. While I might like the person, I sure as heck wouldn't be gushing about them the way you did in that letter.

 

This is why I feel your sense of boundaries is poor. that's bad, but the good thing is that it is something you can control.

 

I'm also wondering why it is the first people you introduced yourself to was a group of women. Is this typical of you, or were the men at the party few and far between?

This post made me think about how I interact with people, both men and women. There are some similarities, but some differences too. It also made me contrast my interactions with those of other men in my social circles. I see them. I'm not quite ready to respond yet, but I wanted to acknowledge the post with thanks.

 

It was the opposite of a sausage fest, kind of a singles thing actually. Anyway, I'll get back to you on this.