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My counselor told me it was normal to mourn the loss of the AP, She said it's normal to feel all over the place because I'm mourning the loss of the A (Even though it being over is what I want!) and the potential loss of my M if we can't work it out.

 

9 days out of 10 I feel like I'm doing well. I am able to push the OM from my mind and reserve all my focus on healing the M and focusing on my family and myself.

 

On that 10th day I feel really ****ty. Today is a ****ty day. It's early, so I'm sure it will pass, and anytime I find a way to move forward I will. I feel ****ty because I miss him and ****ty FOR missing him. It's a lose lose for me today :(

 

I think thinking of the OM today was triggered by seeing a post from him to a mutual friend on social media. We are not friends on social media, but because our hometown is small, we have a lot of mutual friends. I remembered that if you block someone you no longer see their posts or comments on even your mutual friends pages. so I blocked him today. We never really engaged at all on social media except in the very beginning, so I didn't even think about blocking him until I saw that one comment on a mutual friends post and thought "OH YEAH! I CAN BLOCK HIM AND NOT HAVE TO SEE HIS POSTS WITH MUTUAL FRIENDS!"

 

Unfortunately, the damage was already done for today so I'll take a few minutes to be sad, and post here, as Loveshack has been like a rock for me to lean on and support me. I really appreciate having a place that I can go and vent the good and the bad and get honest feedback from you all.

 

I really wish sometimes that there really was a switch that you could easily flip to turn feelings off for someone.

 

This is the reason not only NC is preached but that 100% NC can not happen unless the AP is blocked from all means of contact.

 

 

Yet sadly some WS's never block the AP right away.

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This is the reason not only NC is preached but that 100% NC can not happen unless the AP is blocked from all means of contact.

 

 

Yet sadly some WS's never block the AP right away.

 

Because they want the ap to reach out, even if they have no plans to respond or engage. The validation from this person is still very important.

 

Alsudduth you can't control your feelings, but you have total control on how you handle them. Your response is good in my book. Blocking, acknowledgement, sad then move on with your day. Dwelling or beating yourself up just gives it more power, more mind space. Feel your feeling then move on.

 

Maybe next time you get this you simply tell yourself, I'm human, and move on. Maybe you won't Even spend the time enough to write this post about it.

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Jersey born raised

Does your sense of loss mean the person or the way you felt when in contact. Men especially will say love when they mean how they feel when with the person.

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Thank you Lobe. I realize that the way I communicate with my H doesn't help me get what I need. I have a way of giving him an easy answer as part of the question...

 

 

Me - "Do you not wear your ring anymore because I hurt you so bad? Did you take it off in a fit of anger, feeling it was a symbol of our marriage that I betrayed?

 

Him - "Yeh!"

 

Me - "Is it going to take time for you to build trust in me before you wear it again?

 

Him - "Yeh!"

 

Me - "Thank you. Know I know."

 

 

Of course our conversations are me bs & him infidelity. There are so many questions that I desperately need the answers to. We have a 'conversation' (as above) & I often feel better....until I think about it & realize that NOTHING has really been said!

 

Communication after affairs is so hard! For me anyway.....

There's a special place in heaven for this kind of honesty.
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I had the most awful dream last night. Talk about insecurities and sub conscious coming to the surface.....

 

In my dream, I found out my H was cheating and was planning to leave me for the OW (who was absolutely beautiful). I got very angry and lashed out at the OW and my H and we started going through a very nasty divorce (This is not something I would ever see myself doing in real life).

 

At some point in the dream my H and myself were somewhere and the OW showed up....skip to some kind of big accident (I think it was like some kind of explosion near where we were) and the OW died. My H and I ended up staying together for the kids, but we were very miserable.

 

I woke up very sad.

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understand50
I had the most awful dream last night. Talk about insecurities and sub conscious coming to the surface.....

 

In my dream, I found out my H was cheating and was planning to leave me for the OW (who was absolutely beautiful). I got very angry and lashed out at the OW and my H and we started going through a very nasty divorce (This is not something I would ever see myself doing in real life).

 

At some point in the dream my H and myself were somewhere and the OW showed up....skip to some kind of big accident (I think it was like some kind of explosion near where we were) and the OW died. My H and I ended up staying together for the kids, but we were very miserable.

 

I woke up very sad.

 

alsudduth,

 

Dreams can be helpful, but most of the time they need to stay in the night and forgotten.

 

I wish you luck...

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So I had another apt with my counselor yesterday, I was really all over the place with our conversation but the end result was that I may have to gently guide conversations with my H and that at some point she feels we have to get back into MC.

 

So last night after we got the kids in bed, I asked my H where he sees our relationship progressing in the next 3 months or so. His expected response was "I don't know" so here is the gist of how the rest of our conversation went....

 

Me: Where would you like to see us in the next 3 months?

 

Him: I don't know.

 

Me: Think about it for a minute

 

Him: (about 4 minutes later) I'm not sure what to think. I'm still really upset about everything that happened.

 

Me: That's understandable, my choice to have an affair has put us in a downward spiral once again in our relationship, and I'm doing everything I can to make that right.

 

Him: I know you are

 

Me: But my biggest fear is that if you continue to be so closed off to me, that the next girl that comes along that "understands you" or "knows what you must be going through" is going to easily get her hooks into you because we haven't been having the tough conversation we need to have.

 

My goal for myself is that in a few months if someone asks how we are doing I can legitimately say we are doing ok, not great as I know that will take time, but I want to honestly say that we are doing ok and that eventually we will be great and mean it.

 

All the work I'm doing to try and make things right, will mean nothing if you are not open to committing to work with me.

 

In the last 2 months since this has all come out, have you had more happy days with me or more days that you want out?

 

Him: I'm not sure. I don't think I really think about it that way.

 

Me: Have you thought at all about why you are still here with me?

 

Him: Not really......Well maybe a little.

 

Long pause in conversation....

 

Me: Do you want to talk about what a divorce would look like for us?

 

Him: Why?

 

Me: Maybe the thought of getting a divorce is too overwhelming, and knowing how things would go in the event it happens would make your decision a little easier.

 

Him: It's just signing some papers and sh**.

 

Me: I think it's a little more involved than just signing some papers and sh**

 

Long pause....

 

Him: I think I'm just too lazy to get a divorce....But then again being married seems too hard too.

 

Me: Well, I would rather do all the legwork for you in filing for divorce than have you stay because you are too lazy to go through the process.

 

Him: I knew you were going to say that.....

 

After that I was just pretty defeated, there was not much more to say at that point. I thought to myself for a long while about how if this is the end for us, that I can accept it gracefully, spent some time thinking about some of our better moments....by then my head was hurting from holding in tears, so I got up and got some Ibprofren, when I came back in I asked if he was ready to turn the lights out for bed and he said yes....So we turned out the lights, I gave him a kiss and said good night. He said good night and then said he loved me....I said I loved him too.

 

 

This morning he was extra affectionate in the way he complimented me and telling me he loved me....That has left me more confused than anything....What is going through his head?

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I think that conversation was awesome btw....trust me, he is thinking more and more about this than what he is able to talk to now.

 

You are painting a picture for him that he can't ignore and that is the why you felt more affection from him....he was thinking about this thus the actions.

 

I have said several times on this forum, you are defined by your actions, not your words.....you saw some of his actions change....great progress.

 

Just remember, your A didn't start and stop in a matter of a few days, take time and patience as this is his pace. Let him digest what you said.

 

You did well!!

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I've never been a woman, but I think the internal battle that a BH fights is different.

 

If Im being honest, I'm going to say your husband is looking for a reason to stay, right now he is using "too lazy".

 

I think it's a mistake on your part to bring up divorce in any manner, if he leads the conversation there it's one thing. You suggesting it could come across as it being something you're interested in, and from following your post you clearly are not.

 

Back to the not a woman thing. One of the most difficult things about marriage is the difference in how men and women process pain and suffering. Women tend to want to talk through things, while the majority of men internalize, thinking their way through. This creates a great deal of insecurity in women.

 

It's key that you watch for signs. If he continues to show emotions, mostly anger, then he is still in. If you're still riding the roller coaster it means he is still processing through it. Still looking for his reason to stay. Once you notice an even calmness, then you're in trouble. This likely means he has come to terms with what it's like to be apart.

 

You seem impatient to me. I know you say it will take time, but I get the feeling your looking for some validation that you're doing the right things. Relax, be patient. Understand that all you can do is be a better you, you can't make him be better.

 

Stay focused on the fact that he is there, don't be giving him any ideas of divorce, as I said the danger is it coming across as something you want and you are choosing OM. Danger, even if your true intentions are to make it easier for him.

Edited by DKT3
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I've never been a woman, but I think the internal battle that a BH fights is different.

 

If Im being honest, I'm going to say your husband is looking for a reason to stay, right now he is using "too lazy".

 

I think it's a mistake on your part to bring up divorce in any manner, if he leads the conversation there it's one thing. You suggesting it could come across as it being something you're interested in, and from following your post you clearly are not.

 

Back to the not a woman thing. One of the most difficult things about marriage is the difference in how men and women process pain and suffering. Women tend to want to talk through things, while the majority of men internalize, thinking their way through. This creates a great deal of insecurity in women.

 

It's key that you watch for signs. If he continues to show emotions, mostly anger, then he is still in. If you're still riding the roller coaster it means he is still processing through it. Still looking for his reason to stay. Once you notice an even calmness, then you're in trouble. This likely means he has come to terms with what it's like to be apart.

 

You seem impatient to me. I know you say it will take time, but I get the feeling your looking for some validation that you're doing the right things. Relax, be patient. Understand that all you can do is be a better you, you can't make him be better.

 

Stay focused on the fact that he is there, don't be giving him any ideas of divorce, as I said the danger is it coming across as something you want and you are choosing OM. Danger, even if your true intentions are to make it easier for him.

 

 

Exactly!!!!

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I think it's a mistake on your part to bring up divorce in any manner, if he leads the conversation there it's one thing. You suggesting it could come across as it being something you're interested in, and from following your post you clearly are not.

 

I don't know if I agree with this. Maybe "divorce" wasn't the best term to use - "legal separation" might have been a little less harsh - but let's not forget a couple of very important things here, like the fact her husband had an affair, too, and alsudduth said that they both were/are aware of marital problems leading to both his and her affair.

 

As much as the idea of reconciling is appealing, there are times when the A is really just an indicator of the fact a marriage has run its course. There are people here who have ended up with relatively amicable divorces as a result of realizing that being married was not what either party wanted anymore. If her husband is just "done" and he's honestly just too "lazy" to file for divorce, it's not fair to alsudduth to be strung along indefinitely in a false R.

 

If you offered divorce as a threat or manipulation tactic it's one thing. If you offered it completely without malice and simply as a means of determining if it's actually something either party is interested in, then it can be a helpful tool in preparing for the dissolution of an unhappy marriage.

 

Alsudduth, I for one don't want to be married to someone who is only staying with me because they are too lazy to get a divorce, though my guess is your husband isn't too lazy, he just hasn't figured things out for himself yet. Most of the books I've read suggest 12 weeks as a good time to say, OK, what's the plan? I think it's good you're tabling the idea of whether or not the marriage is over, and this might be a really good time to suggest MC again.

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alsudduth, I am on the fence in a way. While DKT3 and kgcolonel make some good points. I am not sure.

 

I feel like that convo that you had with his was super, great, and wonderful. I know that it made him think. I think he is trying to decide if staying with you is the way to go or divorce. He needs to think about both.

 

He is scared of the divorce and he is concerned how hard it will be and how much money he will loose in the long run. How it will affect his family. And yes, men think that way, it is called marginal return.

 

He is wondering if it would just be better to be single and sleep around with other women.

 

And he is wondering if the two of you can have the love that you once had for one another.

 

It is hard for some men, maybe most, to talk about some of the stuff that he is thinking about. And in some ways, they really don't want to talk about his emotions.

 

I am not as bad as some men because I can usually tell you exactly how I am feeling, what you did to cause it and what you to do to fix it. It drives my wife crazy.

 

I think you just need to be patient and stay the course. It is important for you to stay consistent long term with the reissuance that he needs. Men really need that and they have a hard time asking for it.

 

My guess is that you speaking to him that night nudged him toward R for the long term, but that is just a guess. And that he wants to get laid, BTW.

 

Don't get your hopes up and take your time. You just have to see how it goes.

 

BTW, how long did it take for you to get over his "EA"?

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You seem impatient to me. I know you say it will take time, but I get the feeling your looking for some validation that you're doing the right things. Relax, be patient. Understand that all you can do is be a better you, you can't make him be better.

 

 

This is likely true. I've actually talked about this with my counselor. Not about me being impatient, though I know I am. I hate being in limbo, but I do need some sort of validation that I'm doing the right things. I feel like I'm just grabbing at straws, and while I feel that I'm doing the right things, it would make it easier to relax and be patient if I knew that my idea of doing the right things, is actually the right things to him....

 

I will definitely continue to strive to be a better me, part of that is being in tune with what he needs from me and not what I think he needs from me.

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He is scared of the divorce and he is concerned how hard it will be and how much money he will loose in the long run. How it will affect his family. And yes, men think that way, it is called marginal return.

 

No doubt it is a scary thought. It's a scary thought for me too. We will have been together 20 years in September, starting from when we were just kids really - untangling that life would be overwhelming for anyone I think.

 

 

My guess is that you speaking to him that night nudged him toward R for the long term, but that is just a guess. And that he wants to get laid, BTW.

 

I hope so, we got in a fight once last year, which we rarely do, and when we talked it out he said something to the effect of "I actually kinda like that we fought, that once we talked it out it felt more resolved and like it brought us closer" I hope that urging him to talk last night had the same affect for him. Our sex life is still fairly healthy, considering the circumstances. So we got that going for us!

 

 

BTW, how long did it take for you to get over his "EA"?

 

If I'm totally honest, I don't know that I am yet. but it has taken a back seat for now, and will be brought up when the time is right. There is a lot of back story to his affair, and how it ultimately led me to my affair.....but essentially when we first started MC, he made almost zero effort to make me feel like he was doing everything he could to make things right in that regard. I actually talked to my counselor a little about that yesterday, in that I don't feel like even now he would say that he fully understands the damage the affair did and the lack of effort to make it right did to me.

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Alsudduth, I for one don't want to be married to someone who is only staying with me because they are too lazy to get a divorce, though my guess is your husband isn't too lazy, he just hasn't figured things out for himself yet. Most of the books I've read suggest 12 weeks as a good time to say, OK, what's the plan? I think it's good you're tabling the idea of whether or not the marriage is over, and this might be a really good time to suggest MC again.

 

That's exactly it, one part of the conversation I forgot to post here was that I told him that I felt like for me anyway, there was something keeping us together still. That neither one of us agrees that staying together just for the kids is something we would do. I believe that however small it is, there is still SOMETHING there between us, and we both have to commit to growing that.

 

But regardless of my failings in the marriage, I refuse to stay married for the wrong reasons, which would be any reason that does not include love existing between him and I.

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It literally took me 15 year to figure out what I needed from my wife for all the things that she had done. Sound impossible but true.

 

I think that reassurance of your "RESPECT" for him is the most important.

 

Women want love and men want respect. Men want love too, but respect is first.

 

And, how long did it take for you to get over his affair?

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I've never been a woman, but I think the internal battle that a BH fights is different.

 

If Im being honest, I'm going to say your husband is looking for a reason to stay, right now he is using "too lazy".

 

I think it's a mistake on your part to bring up divorce in any manner, if he leads the conversation there it's one thing. You suggesting it could come across as it being something you're interested in, and from following your post you clearly are not.

 

Back to the not a woman thing. One of the most difficult things about marriage is the difference in how men and women process pain and suffering. Women tend to want to talk through things, while the majority of men internalize, thinking their way through. This creates a great deal of insecurity in women.

 

It's key that you watch for signs. If he continues to show emotions, mostly anger, then he is still in. If you're still riding the roller coaster it means he is still processing through it. Still looking for his reason to stay. Once you notice an even calmness, then you're in trouble. This likely means he has come to terms with what it's like to be apart.

 

You seem impatient to me. I know you say it will take time, but I get the feeling your looking for some validation that you're doing the right things. Relax, be patient. Understand that all you can do is be a better you, you can't make him be better.

 

Stay focused on the fact that he is there, don't be giving him any ideas of divorce, as I said the danger is it coming across as something you want and you are choosing OM. Danger, even if your true intentions are to make it easier for him.

 

 

 

 

Recovery is a 2 to 5 years process. It takes years to get back to normal.

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ShatteredLady

As a woman his EA was devastating. It killed our love story. Maybe because it was with the SAME (one ex) coworker that he had his first affair with 12 years ago!

 

I completely get the whole "Women want to talk & men don't" but this is why I'm getting closer to divorce. Shouldn't a guilty man take the hit & force himself to swallow his pride & TALK! If you don't want hard emotional conversations don't destroy your woman to start with!!!

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Your husband's affair was a EA, correct?

 

Yes. As far as I have been told, nothing physical happened. They live in different states. I'm on the fence on whether I believe that or not since it seems awfully convienent that they both told their spouses they wanted out of the relationship within about a week of each other and my H had attended a VW show that happened to be in her hometown around that same time.....what would your gut tell you about that?

 

However, he swears nothing happened physically and that he did not see her when in CA. I have no proof, so I've just tucked that convienent chain of events into the back of my mind. It didn't or hasn't had any affect on the decision to go to counseling the first time around. If I were to find out now that something physical did happen then, at this point it would be just another notch in our who hurt who belt. I can't keep score anymore. It just doesn't matter. All that matters now to me is that we stop the cycle of hurting each other.

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I think your WH is keeping score and holding it over you, sort of. Not that it's a contest, but you say your resentment built partly as a result of his unwillingness to address his affair and make you feel secure, but now that you're just as guilty as him, it almost sounds like you're giving him the "upper hand." If I were to ask you if you feel like he made amends to your satisfaction, what would you say?

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I think your WH is keeping score and holding it over you, sort of. Not that it's a contest, but you say your resentment built partly as a result of his unwillingness to address his affair and make you feel secure, but now that you're just as guilty as him, it almost sounds like you're giving him the "upper hand." If I were to ask you if you feel like he made amends to your satisfaction, what would you say?

 

I would say, that he really started to make changes to the point that I knew I could forgive him. (Hence the reason I was starting to try and find a way out of the affair) but that then I jacked it all up by being too weak to end my own A until I got caught.

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I would say, that he really started to make changes to the point that I knew I could forgive him. (Hence the reason I was starting to try and find a way out of the affair) but that then I jacked it all up by being too weak to end my own A until I got caught.

 

Well, damn.

 

Do you still feel a lot of resentment or has your own guilt softened that?

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Well, damn.

 

Do you still feel a lot of resentment or has your own guilt softened that?

 

I feel like resentment is the wrong word to use now for that particular situation, I do think my own guilt has softened that a bit., with regards to his A, I think what I feel most is a longing for him to truly understand the damage it did. I feel like I can see without him even telling me how much I have hurt him with my own actions, and the fact that it took him so long to even start to try and repair the damage from his A is still hurtful to me.

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