The inevitable happened

[road]

I'm going to make a Dr. apt this week to get on an anti depressant for awhile.

 

I made a list of weekly goals I can accomplish that will make me feel better...and my sister in law recently backed out of being my H's workout buddy since they have such different goals...so starting Tuesday (I bowl on Mondays) I am going to start working out with my H. I hope that will be a good thing for us.

 

- On that note, how would you guys approach this....This is one of the things that annoys me about my H.

He's been getting really into working out and planning his diet around his workouts, which is fine I don't have a problem with that, In fact the last time I was going to go shopping I asked him to sit down with me and meal plan so we can come up with acceptable meals for the whole family because it would be more cost effective, and we wouldn't be in the kitchen over and over. Anyway - that didn't happen and he went to the store last night and bought over 70 buck of food....just for him. to plan his own meals for breakfast/lunch/dinner with no thought to me and the kids...because "he didn't want to spend more than he already had"

 

When he does stuff like this, it makes me feel like he wants to live like a bachelor only having to think of himself, and then I wonder why I'm trying so hard to keep it together if it isn't what he wants?

 

 

Good that you will work at the same time.

 

 

However this bowling.

 

 

Mixed league?

 

 

Why are you not bowling with your BH?

 

 

Bad idea you bowling. Because it leaves your BH home wondering what you are doing. Does nothing to repair the broken trust your affair created.

[alsudduth]

Quality time is not about talking about the affair.

 

 

 

So how many times have you done family outings? Not asked, but went?

 

We don't always talk about the affair. I check in every other week after my apts to bring up anything I've been having trouble talking to him about, and give him an opportunity to talk about anything bothering him.

 

As for family outings - we as an immediate family are very close. We haven't had a lot of time to do family specific outings with school and him working a ton of overtime lately.

 

But - when we have time we go to dinner (both as a family and together) The kids went camping with their grandparents over the weekend and so my husband and I had the weekend together. He worked most of it, but we did communicate better I feel over the weekend. We take the kids to the movies often, or just to walk around the mall. (We live in a very hot climate, so outdoor activities are a no go right now)

[alsudduth]

Good that you will work at the same time.

 

 

However this bowling.

 

 

Mixed league?

 

 

Why are you not bowling with your BH?

 

 

Bad idea you bowling. Because it leaves your BH home wondering what you are doing. Does nothing to repair the broken trust your affair created.

 

I have been bowling for over a year - with one of my best friends, her husband and her sister in law's husband. My H is fine with this, I have asked him to join, but he has a bad shoulder and can't bowl for long periods of time. I have asked him to come and just visit with us. but he is just not interested in that. I am not worried about the bowling being an issue, I have asked him a few times if it bothers him - usually before I sign up for the next league I check in to make sure he is ok with me continuing to bowl in the league. He used to be an avid bowler - I also text him and send him updates of how I'm doing in my games (along with pictures so he knows I'm actually there) and tell him that I wish he would come sometimes so he can hang out with us. He is always welcome to come, I have nothing to hide there. (or anywhere now)

 

Interesting side note about bowling - my grandparents used to big bowlers also. I was helping my mom clean out my grandparents home after my grandfather passed - and found a news clipping from a long time ago (Before my husband and I had even started dating) of my grandparents with HIS grandparents. They use to bowl in a league together. so I have an old newspaper clipping of our grandparents together from years before we started dating. I think it is pretty cool.

[alsudduth]

As of right now he is still not willing to go to counseling. I have an apt. this morning with my counselor though. I'll bring it up to her. Thanks!

 

So my counselor said his action was selfish. She said I shouldn't have let it go, and that I've lost my voice due to feeling guilty. She says I have to put my foot down if I want him to participate in the relationship. (and of course there is no guarantee, but that I will regret it if I don't tell him what I need)

 

She said the worst that will come of telling him how I feel is that he will say no, or tell me it's over - and that that is a possibility I'm aware of happening anyway - there is nothing I can do about his actions or what he chooses to do, so to not be shy in telling him what I want and expect out of the relationship.

 

she told me not to forget that he had an affair also, and to not let my guilt over my bad choices turn me into a doormat.

[DKT3]

I really think your therapist is horrible. Allowing him some time doesn't make you a doormat.

 

I thought you were impatient, but now I'm starting to think you Are a control freak, and you not having some measure of control is making you batty..

 

PS bowling is terrible, maybe because I sux at it.

[alsudduth]

I really think your therapist is horrible. Allowing him some time doesn't make you a doormat.

 

I thought you were impatient, but now I'm starting to think you Are a control freak, and you not having some measure of control is making you batty..

 

PS bowling is terrible, maybe because I sux at it.

 

 

I don't think I'd go so far as to say I'm a control freak, but maybe feeling a little out of control of the situation is true....

 

Here is the thing. My H and I have been struggling for years now, following the same pattern over and over. One of us hurts the other, the other shuts down until the other breaks or until they make their own hurtful mistake and then repeat. I'm just over that, and I don't want to fall into the same pattern. I'm trying to break a cycle.

[Scarletwolf]

snip

 

 

*If you really wanted to end it, you'd just end it.

 

But you don't, so you haven't.

 

 

Take care.

 

As rough as this sounds, it's totally true. I never hesitated to end a fifteen year old marriage because I was done with the lies and the could be situations.

[alsudduth]

I really think your therapist is horrible. Allowing him some time doesn't make you a doormat.

 

I feel like I should clarify. Him needing time is not what I'm talking about here. My guilt over what happened causes me to withdrawal and feel like I don't have a place to voice my opinion or tell him when he does something that bothers me.

[harrybrown]

I have been bowling for over a year - with one of my best friends, her husband and her sister in law's husband. My H is fine with this, I have asked him to join, but he has a bad shoulder and can't bowl for long periods of time. I have asked him to come and just visit with us. but he is just not interested in that. I am not worried about the bowling being an issue, I have asked him a few times if it bothers him - usually before I sign up for the next league I check in to make sure he is ok with me continuing to bowl in the league. He used to be an avid bowler - I also text him and send him updates of how I'm doing in my games (along with pictures so he knows I'm actually there) and tell him that I wish he would come sometimes so he can hang out with us. He is always welcome to come, I have nothing to hide there. (or anywhere now)

 

Interesting side note about bowling - my grandparents used to big bowlers also. I was helping my mom clean out my grandparents home after my grandfather passed - and found a news clipping from a long time ago (Before my husband and I had even started dating) of my grandparents with HIS grandparents. They use to bowl in a league together. so I have an old newspaper clipping of our grandparents together from years before we started dating. I think it is pretty cool.

 

 

this is what caused a D in my family.

 

the wife was caught having an A with another member of the team.

 

She was sitting on his lap when my son walked in on her.

 

I paid for the D. Not a good idea. if you want to R.

Edited September 19, 2016 by harrybrown
edit

[alsudduth]

this is what caused a D in my family.

 

the wife was caught having an A with another member of the team.

 

She was sitting on his lap when my son walked in on her.

 

I paid for the D. Not a good idea. if you want to R.

 

This would never happen. Even if I was single there would never be anything with anyone that I bowl with. Ever. I am 115% positive. And again, my kids come with me sometimes, and my husband is welcome anytime. He can pop in even unannounced and I would be happy to see him there

[alsudduth]

I go back and forth on this, but today I'm really feeling like I can't do this. I don't know if I have it in me to have this cloud over us for forever. I have read lots of posts about how in order for R to work, there has to be a solid foundation in the beginning. I don't know if we have that.

 

I asked my H a question about something during the time we were going to counseling and when he had asked for a divorce - he said that he never thinks about that time. I told him that I think about it all the time. I told him that go back and forth with feeling like I hate the OW and wishing I could be her. I don't feel like he has ever liked me the way that he seemed to like her. He said "Why do you keep holding onto that sh^*"

 

Isn't that up to me? Just like him getting to be angry and upset for as long as it takes him? Why is it okay for him to tell me to get over it already when he can't do the same?

[BluesPower]

It is not. But you know that you guys did not handle his affair the right way either.

 

This is going to take a lot of work. You are the latest affair, so yours has the most impact right now. It is not fair, or right, it just is.

 

Is he still not into the R 100%? He needs to be if he want the marriage to work out.

 

I also don't think that you had to have a good foundation for R to work. I think you have to love each other. If you do I think you can build a better marriage, in the long run.

 

But, if you do not love each other then you really should call in the dogs and piss on the fire. Because it will never work.

[alsudduth]

 

Is he still not into the R 100%? He needs to be if he want the marriage to work out.

 

He said he still cannot justify putting his ring back on, and he still refuses to go to marriage counseling....so I'd say no he isn't 100% into an R.

 

I also don't think that you had to have a good foundation for R to work. I think you have to love each other. If you do I think you can build a better marriage, in the long run.

 

But, if you do not love each other then you really should call in the dogs and piss on the fire. Because it will never work.

 

I think we love each other very much, I don't think I could ever not love him and vice versa....but I don't know if at this point it's enough to keep us together.

[turnera]

He doesn't love you. He loves having you around. For HIS benefit.

 

If he loved YOU, he would be doing whatever it takes to help you feel better.

[Jersey born raised]

His response to you left me stone cold. He now knows what it feels like to be the BS and yet he does not realize what his EA (PA ?) if tatbisbthe case what is his hang up about your EA?

 

Turnera is right. This marriage is for and about him. If he does not file you need to.

[Jersey born raised]

Bye the way he does not love you, he loves you for how you make it feels about himself. He reminds me about the CW song "stupid boy" by Keith Urban.

[DKT3]

I would not say he doesn't love his wife, we all show love differently. What I get is he is conflict avoiding. From what I've read he doesn't want to talk about either affair.

 

Als I truly believe that your issue is you two are really speaking a different language. After all the years together you still don't seem to know how to communicate to him or how he trys to communicate with you..

[alsudduth]

He does love me. I do not doubt that. And I love him, without a doubt. The problem is in realizing that it may not be enough. The fact that I'm willing to give up so soon, the fact that he IS capable of putting effort into things he is passionate about, the fact that our relationship has never been something he's put a lot of effort into, the hurt I still feel from 3 years ago and beyond....all those things make me feel like this isn't going to work.....and then my daughter does something like make a scrapbook for our anniversary (which was Friday) celebrating how much she loves us, and we run with our tails tucked between our legs from the decision to stay or go.

 

I've started to re-read the book "Too Good to leave, Too Bad to stay" I'm hoping I can get some answers.

 

I'm very remorseful for having an affair, I wish I hadn't complicated our relationship with that hurt, but it does mean that now I have to consider as some have posted, that based on the aftermath of everything from the last 3 years and beyond, is there a chance that we are meant to even stay together?

[road]

He does love me. I do not doubt that. And I love him, without a doubt. The problem is in realizing that it may not be enough. The fact that I'm willing to give up so soon, the fact that he IS capable of putting effort into things he is passionate about, the fact that our relationship has never been something he's put a lot of effort into, the hurt I still feel from 3 years ago and beyond....all those things make me feel like this isn't going to work.....and then my daughter does something like make a scrapbook for our anniversary (which was Friday) celebrating how much she loves us, and we run with our tails tucked between our legs from the decision to stay or go.

 

I've started to re-read the book "Too Good to leave, Too Bad to stay" I'm hoping I can get some answers.

 

I'm very remorseful for having an affair, I wish I hadn't complicated our relationship with that hurt, but it does mean that now I have to consider as some have posted, that based on the aftermath of everything from the last 3 years and beyond, is there a chance that we are meant to even stay together?

 

You can read books.

 

 

You can think you realize this or that.

 

 

You cannot force recovery.

 

 

What to I mean?

 

 

Example: Why do they not put the horses behind the wagon?

 

 

Horses pull better then they can push.

 

 

A WW can not push a BH through recovery.

 

 

Though a WW can lead by example and pull a BH into recovery and working on making the marriage better.

 

 

Dealing with the affair not going anywhere then stop pushing that. Instead do things to make the marriage better. Interact the way you want BH to do with you. This is leading by example. Get out and do things as husband and wife. Make life good. This will not happen in one step. Though never taking steps the trip will never get done.

 

 

Why stay married if life sucks? If life sucks why reconnect in bed? Keep hitting BH with little nuggets of life with WW can be better than before D day.

[DKT3]

He does love me. I do not doubt that. And I love him, without a doubt. The problem is in realizing that it may not be enough. The fact that I'm willing to give up so soon, the fact that he IS capable of putting effort into things he is passionate about, the fact that our relationship has never been something he's put a lot of effort into, the hurt I still feel from 3 years ago and beyond....all those things make me feel like this isn't going to work.....and then my daughter does something like make a scrapbook for our anniversary (which was Friday) celebrating how much she loves us, and we run with our tails tucked between our legs from the decision to stay or go.

 

I've started to re-read the book "Too Good to leave, Too Bad to stay" I'm hoping I can get some answers.

 

I'm very remorseful for having an affair, I wish I hadn't complicated our relationship with that hurt, but it does mean that now I have to consider as some have posted, that based on the aftermath of everything from the last 3 years and beyond, is there a chance that we are meant to even stay together?

I really believe that the issue is a matter of not being enough patience on your side, you want it to be better now, you talk about the last three years without truly accepting that for most of that time you where involved with another man, in love and all that, if course your marriage wasn't idea, maybe partly because your husband wasn't making much if an effort, but definitely because you were not making an effort, I mean you were f-ing another man so how much effort could you have put up. Now, all of a sudden you want instant gratification, to be validated because you are finally making an effort. It doesn't work that way. You have to allow him time.

 

Honestly what you're doing is running, you may not see it that way but its what your doing. You don't truly want to face the damage, so it's easier to chalk it up and love not being enough, again absolving yourself if the actual damage you've created.

 

It's tough to truly accept (as the primary caregiver of the relationship, which most women are) that your actions have put you in this place. Not saying he didn't play a role, he did, but you have no control over that. Yet what you do have control of, you f-ed up. Until you fully authenticly accept responsibility you will be able to justify excuses and blame him or the situation.

 

Love is enough if that love motivates you to truly appreciate what it can be given you have patience and do the work.

[stillafool]

He does love me. I do not doubt that. And I love him, without a doubt. The problem is in realizing that it may not be enough.

 

 

You two love each other in a family way but are no longer in love with each other and haven't been for quite some time. I don't see them falling back in love so IMO they should file for divorce and at last find happiness.

[alsudduth]

Probably a bad idea to start a convo with him when I'm having a bad day, but here it is (Via text):

 

Me: so on a serious note - how do you feel about me going to my moms on Friday, and if I go can you pick the kids up from school on Friday?

 

Him: Go ahead.

 

Me: Ok. But how do you feel about it

 

Him: I feel like you are gonna do whatever you want to do.

 

Me: I'm not going to go.

 

Him: Why

 

Me: Because I don't need you to communicate with me to know that you aren't ok with it. Your answer to me is telling enough.

 

Him: Let me be more clear. I feel like you are going to do whatever it is you're going to do regardless of where you are.

I appreciate that you are letting me know when you get contacted. I don't know if that means you're just being open about it or if you're really not talking to him.

 

Me: Honestly it makes me feel like all the effort I'm putting into this is for nothing. I don't think your opinion of me will ever change.

I created that opinion myself so I don't blame you for feeling that way.

It just is what it is.

 

Him: You said you were very hurt when I asked for a divorce initially. That pendulum swings both ways. Probably still hurting over that and it's been three years? I feel like you're pushing me to wrap up my feelings and forgive/forget in what? A month or two? It doesn't work like that.

 

Me: I feel like I would be less hurt and possibly over it at this point if I felt like you were remorseful for everything that happened, but I don't think you feel like you did anything wrong. I don't know why you even went to counseling. I'm not asking you to forgive and forget after 3 months. I'm only asking you to communicate with me. We have 0 trust and 0 communication in our relationship. If we can't agree to work on at least one of those things, our marriage won't last.

 

Him: Your opinion about how I feel couldn't be more wrong. Which really is an affirmation to me of how you assume the worst of me while pointing your finger at me and accusing me of always thinking the worst of you.

 

Me: Well I guess those are types of problems we find ourselves in when we don't communicate

 

Him: I've said multiple times in the past my opinion of you isn't what you're thinking it is. Obviously you don't remember or don't believe what I say about so if you're not going to believe what I say why say anything about it?

 

Me: Instead of just telling me I'm wrong, how about giving me a clue

 

Him: A clue about what?

 

Me: What your opinion if me is

 

Him: I don't know what my opinion of you is recently

 

Me: If you don't know then how do you know if I'm wrong or not?

 

After a break of talking since I was at an apt:

 

Me: I'm sorry that I seem to be all over the place. I am sorry for all the pain I've caused us. I guess I'm just trying to determine also if staying together is the best answer.

 

 

------And go.

[road]

Probably a bad idea to start a convo with him when I'm having a bad day, but here it is (Via text):

 

Me: so on a serious note - how do you feel about me going to my moms on Friday, and if I go can you pick the kids up from school on Friday?

 

Him: Go ahead.

 

Me: Ok. But how do you feel about it

 

Him: I feel like you are gonna do whatever you want to do.

 

Me: I'm not going to go.

 

Him: Why

 

Me: Because I don't need you to communicate with me to know that you aren't ok with it. Your answer to me is telling enough.

 

Him: Let me be more clear. I feel like you are going to do whatever it is you're going to do regardless of where you are.

I appreciate that you are letting me know when you get contacted. I don't know if that means you're just being open about it or if you're really not talking to him.

 

Me: Honestly it makes me feel like all the effort I'm putting into this is for nothing. I don't think your opinion of me will ever change.

I created that opinion myself so I don't blame you for feeling that way.

It just is what it is.

 

Him: You said you were very hurt when I asked for a divorce initially. That pendulum swings both ways. Probably still hurting over that and it's been three years? I feel like you're pushing me to wrap up my feelings and forgive/forget in what? A month or two? It doesn't work like that.

 

Me: I feel like I would be less hurt and possibly over it at this point if I felt like you were remorseful for everything that happened, but I don't think you feel like you did anything wrong. I don't know why you even went to counseling. I'm not asking you to forgive and forget after 3 months. I'm only asking you to communicate with me. We have 0 trust and 0 communication in our relationship. If we can't agree to work on at least one of those things, our marriage won't last.

 

Him: Your opinion about how I feel couldn't be more wrong. Which really is an affirmation to me of how you assume the worst of me while pointing your finger at me and accusing me of always thinking the worst of you.

 

Me: Well I guess those are types of problems we find ourselves in when we don't communicate

 

Him: I've said multiple times in the past my opinion of you isn't what you're thinking it is. Obviously you don't remember or don't believe what I say about so if you're not going to believe what I say why say anything about it?

 

Me: Instead of just telling me I'm wrong, how about giving me a clue

 

Him: A clue about what?

 

Me: What your opinion if me is

 

Him: I don't know what my opinion of you is recently

 

Me: If you don't know then how do you know if I'm wrong or not?

 

After a break of talking since I was at an apt:

 

Me: I'm sorry that I seem to be all over the place. I am sorry for all the pain I've caused us. I guess I'm just trying to determine also if staying together is the best answer.

 

 

------And go.

 

This is not recovering a marriage. This saying I am not serious about recovering.

 

 

Actions speak louder than words. All talk no walk gets no one very far.

 

 

No WW can get a guarantee that recovery will be successful. Either they commit to the work without a guarantee or quit the marriage.

[alsudduth]

This is not recovering a marriage. This saying I am not serious about recovering.

 

 

Actions speak louder than words. All talk no walk gets no one very far.

 

 

No WW can get a guarantee that recovery will be successful. Either they commit to the work without a guarantee or quit the marriage.

 

that's basically what I've been saying the last couple days....that I don't know if I can commit to recovery. I've spent many many many years pre affair trying to make the marriage work - if I couldn't do it then (Meaning I still made him unhappy enough to have an affair and ask me for a divorce), how am I supposed to do it now with each of us having had an affair to complicate things?

 

I get it. Actions speak louder than words, commit to a change, etc etc....that's part of the problem, why am the only one that has to do these things when he also had an affair? My point is that it won't work if I am the only one committing to making things better.

[alsudduth]

I really believe that the issue is a matter of not being enough patience on your side, you want it to be better now, you talk about the last three years without truly accepting that for most of that time you where involved with another man, in love and all that, if course your marriage wasn't idea, maybe partly because your husband wasn't making much if an effort, but definitely because you were not making an effort, I mean you were f-ing another man so how much effort could you have put up. Now, all of a sudden you want instant gratification, to be validated because you are finally making an effort. It doesn't work that way. You have to allow him time.

 

This is going to make a lot of people yell at me I'm sure - but even when I was talking to another guy (not f-ing by the way, though still I admit it was an affair) I feel like I STILL gave more effort into the marriage than he has or ever did. And I'm pretty sure my H would agree.

 

Honestly what you're doing is running, you may not see it that way but its what your doing. You don't truly want to face the damage, so it's easier to chalk it up and love not being enough, again absolving yourself if the actual damage you've created.

 

I will always regret the pain I've caused to my H, regardless of whether we stay together or not. I may very well be running, but not because I don't want to face the damage, but because I don't want to repeat history.