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3 months later and where I am at.


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HurtOfGlass

Pardon me but the take away I got from your reply is lust.

 

You are physically attracted to both your AP and H. Fair enough.

 

You do know that this is potentially dangerous? I mean besides your H and AP, there are many handsome, sexy man out there who you can meet? If that does happen will you feel the need to sleep with him too?

 

Forgive me for being so brazen.

 

I believe your are doing IC. But have you actually admitted about your lustful nature to your counselor and husband?

 

You know sex is not just the physical aspect. The emotions that run with it is what makes it such a wonderful experience. I slept with 22 sex workers. But none of those encounters were as enjoyable as the one with my exGF I recently had. Infact after the sex with the sex workers, I felt dirty and disgusted with myself.

 

But during sex with my GF nothing was in our mind except us and the deep love we fell for each other. I was totally giving myself to her.

 

Maybe you should open up more with your husband. Look in to his eyes when you two make love, feel the emotions. Let him see the love you have for him.

Even outside the bedroom, you can show him how much you love him by giving him random smiles, during dinner taking his hands and kissing it, cuddling on the sofa and watch TV together.

 

My point is the more you give yourself to him, the less need you will feel the pull of attraction to your exMM.

 

Good luck

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You do realize that open means he can sleep with other women right?

 

I ask because your posts are so full of entitlement that I'm not sure you really get it, nor do I think you would be ok with him being involved.

 

When I was knee deep in my affair, I remembered thinking I wished he would have his own affair. I even suggested that if I didn't know it would be ok.

 

He got feed up with me filed for divorce and started having sex with a lot of women. It almost killed me. I used this same line of misguided logic that you are now. You don't want an open marriage, your far too selfish for that. I get that, I was there. Your problem is somewhere along the line you decided you should have whatever you want no matter the rules.

 

This attitude will leave you all alone with a bag full of regrets. Your husband will have his limit.

 

It is entirely possible that on a subconscious level I feel entitled. I will read up on that for sure but in my conscious thought I know I don't deserve my husband, my kids, my life. And my husband most certainly doesn't deserve me.

 

As to the part about your husband having sex with lots of women that is quite different because he divorced you first. I find the thought of my husband having sex with someone else a turn on. I'd want to know though but wouldn't have to. Being alone and full of regrets is only a fraction of what I deserve.

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That one statement is all your husband needs to hear from your mouth. I give you credit for your honesty but I don't have a lot of hope for your marriage. My bet is your husband will take himself out of infidelity before he agrees to swinging. If you put more value on O/M than you do on your marriage and family than that should be your focus. I know you deserve to have them both because you want both and it's your life. The truth is most men don't like sharing their wives. Sounds like O/M might be willing to share you because it doesn't sound like he is satisfied with just one woman. I have a very bad feeling about how this is all going to end.

 

Just to add to lovinDKT3's comment, alone with a lot of cats.

 

My husband knows my feelings on this. I just need to get the courage to actually table a discussion. But I know you are right, he won't share. You say most men won't share but I think most people in general won't share. Jealousy and social constraints make sure of that. And then biggest of them all religeous constraints. I don't believe sharing is for everyone and if my husband isn't willing to give this a test period I will respect that.

 

I like cats. Doesn't really have the sting to the insult for me.

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Pardon me but the take away I got from your reply is lust.

 

You are physically attracted to both your AP and H. Fair enough.

 

You do know that this is potentially dangerous? I mean besides your H and AP, there are many handsome, sexy man out there who you can meet? If that does happen will you feel the need to sleep with him too?

 

Forgive me for being so brazen.

Chemistry is far more important to me than physical beauty and I cannot define it. Someone can be very hot but I feel no physical lust for them. Not to mention the fact I'm a four or five and not going to have a ten want me. My husband is far better looking than me but prefers cute over gorgeous. I have no desire to go looking for men I have chemistry with and it has only happened four times in my life that it is mutual. For all my lust I am sexually inexperienced with a count of 2. I honestly just want the open marriage to see if it kills my attraction to MM for good.

 

I believe your are doing IC. But have you actually admitted about your lustful nature to your counselor and husband?I'm no longer in IC. My shrink was really just trying to keep me alive and faithful to my husband.

 

You know sex is not just the physical aspect. The emotions that run with it is what makes it such a wonderful experience. I slept with 22 sex workers. But none of those encounters were as enjoyable as the one with my exGF I recently had. Infact after the sex with the sex workers, I felt dirty and disgusted with myself.

 

But during sex with my GF nothing was in our mind except us and the deep love we fell for each other. I was totally giving myself to her.

I've never slept with someone who took money for it so I don't know if that is the same as cheating. There are emotions between MM and I as we are friends. We just aren't in love.

Maybe you should open up more with your husband. Look in to his eyes when you two make love, feel the emotions. Let him see the love you have for him.

Even outside the bedroom, you can show him how much you love him by giving him random smiles, during dinner taking his hands and kissing it, cuddling on the sofa and watch TV together.

 

My point is the more you give yourself to him, the less need you will feel the pull of attraction to your exMM.

 

Good luck

Being busy with work and family has greatly reduced the pull. But believe me when I say my husband connect over sex. And we still sit on the same couch and will hold hands when out. We cuddle in bed. We talk a lot. We are best friends and lovers and really a perfect fit.

 

Except I am crazy and flawed beyond understanding. I hadn't talked to MM for a few days and I heard from him yesterday. Haven't gotten around to replying... That never happened before. But the losing interest isn't for all good reasons.

 

I wish I knew why I was like this. I really do. And I wish I knew how to fix whatever is wrong with me.

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Being busy with work and family has greatly reduced the pull. But believe me when I say my husband connect over sex. And we still sit on the same couch and will hold hands when out. We cuddle in bed. We talk a lot. We are best friends and lovers and really a perfect fit.

 

Except I am crazy and flawed beyond understanding. I hadn't talked to MM for a few days and I heard from him yesterday. Haven't gotten around to replying... That never happened before. But the losing interest isn't for all good reasons.

 

I wish I knew why I was like this. I really do. And I wish I knew how to fix whatever is wrong with me.

 

The best way to fix it is to judge it's value to you than just imagine it all gone. All you need to do is not answer O/M and you get to keep it.

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HurtOfGlass
I hadn't talked to MM for a few days and I heard from him yesterday. Haven't gotten around to replying... That never happened before. But the losing interest isn't for all good reasons.

 

Why don't you let your husband deal with the OM's communication this time?

 

If your H tells him to back off, I'm sure he will run with his tails between his legs. Most OMs are like that.

 

Have you thought about this?

 

And I am pretty sure you will not contact him unless he does. So there's a good chance it can all end if your H deals with the OM.

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Not everything is about my husband. This is about me and my corrupt nature. I have explained everything a few times. I am a broken person. My husband is happy and well despite those that believe ofherwise. And if he is not he hides it very, very well. I do no time is running out for me but I am working up the courage to request a dadt or open marriage. I don't like deception so I don't lie but I don't like hurting him either. I have a theory that subconsciously I seek this attraction because of the bad me that is turned on by cheating. If I get a green light and no longer feel the pull then I know that it isn't any special chemistry between xMM and I but just me and my horribly corrupt nature.
There are so many things wrong with how you are doing this (or perhaps you AND your husband but we only know about him through you). All of these things are problems because you and he are not getting good counseling individually and together. You are processing most of it by yourself it seems and by writing on LS; you are not working it out with your H and discussing EVERYTHING with him. There doesn't seem to be much dialogue between you about the affair, about your relationship or about yourselves as individuals. You have this conversation with us instead, I'd venture. So I wonder if you even know what you don't know about what he thinks and feels, about his pain and changing attitudes, issues of trust. Or if you want to know. What you give us about him are strangely superficial, erratic reports that say little of substance, staccatoed with mildly reassuring platitudes that he is "happy." Then, back to you and how bad you are.

 

This part reminds me of my husband. Being sorry about having been in an affair, he thinks, means self-loathing, hatred of himself as well as what he did. Perhaps, like him, you think that's what your husband wants to know and see. For me, it is and was a sorry substitute for giving me something real of himself. It was not and is not what I wanted because it stayed on his mistake - or, as you call it, evil - and destroyed all hope of dialogue. But he doesn't get it and won't go for IC, and, like you gives the excuse of money. We stopped MC as well for this reason. He probably THINKS I'm doing better than I am because he doesn't want to know. Do you want to know how your husband is doing?

 

You seem mainly focused on yourself, whether it's about how bad you are or how you feel about the OM. You are sorry for what YOU did. I don't hear anything about your pain at what your husband feels and felt. There's nothing about his feelings of disrespect, loss of trust, or whatever he feels. I don't see you genuinely focused on him because you are convinced that was the damage you did and you wish with your whole being that you could do something, anything for him to make it up to him.

 

No, you seem to be alone essentially doing this your way, by yourself. You are making decisions about what you want, instead of asking what he needs. Those decisions include - what you tell and do not tell your husband. You still think this is your choice.

 

You think NC is only about making sure the A is over. It so is not. It is about giving the BETRAYED SPOUSE absolute confidence that you are committed. This includes the BS's access to all your accounts, phone and devices. It's about HIM - not you. It's for his recovery and healing, so he can get over the shock. It's not about making you good (or at least not as bad); NC is FOR THE BS.

 

So, that's all I have to say because I don't think you get the ABCs of how this works from the inside out. It all seems to be about what it looks like from the outside in. And everything on the inside is still open-ended and your secret world of what makes you feel this way or that. This is about you and not about making things right with your husband and your marriage.

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I am not working on my marriage but merely living it. There is really nothing to work on that I can see. We have sex enough for both of us, resolve our arguements swiftly, we enjoy each others company and spend most of our free time as a family or even just the two of us. My life with him is everything I have ever wanted.

 

I really don't know how to explain it but it is like there are two of me. The one me is disgusted by my behaviour and the behaviour of other cheaters. I recently watched into the woods and felt such disgust with the Baker's wife and the prince. I hated what they were doing to the Baker and Cinderella. But the other me was completely turned on and wanted the kiss. I don't like the me that finds pleasure in infidelity. But I cannot lie and pretend that I am 100% repulsed by it. I find it sexy and disgusting and so very confusing to live with.

 

Cheating has an appeal to me that I really wish it didn't. Because I feel such pain over the anguish it causes and such disgust for those of us who partake of the forbidden fruit. How can I find pleasure in something that beings so much pain? That is why I know I am very broken or in fact evil. It is the only thing that explains it.

 

Hi Noirek, I haven't read your previous threads. Just this one.

 

Have you had individual counselling? I really think you would benefit from it to work out the real you.

 

I'm gonna be the angel's advocate instead of the devil's advocate here. Maybe that's what you're after by posting? Something like a woman who always asks people "Do I look fat in this?" Fishing for compliments.

I don't think many people are outright evil because of their THOUGHTS.

I don't think many or any maybe are outright angelic either by a long shot.

 

The difference between people who strive to be "good people" or the opposite are their ACTIONS. Of course people's actions are usually derived from their thought factory.

 

If you want to change your thoughts, work on this. Get help if you want to.

 

Lion Heart.

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Do listen to Lion Heart's loving urges to get you to IC. It's what you need more than listening to me or anyone else here explain, explain, explain. I feel bad for you, for my husband and yours, for myself and for all those of us staying in one place, unable to change, unable to get the help we need and unable to help each other.

 

I started putting two IC sessions a month on a credit card. It's worth whatever the difficulty later.

 

IC makes it possible to deal with underlying issues that keep you from being yourself (your true self). It can help you figure out what you need to feel better about yourself.

 

A marriage or a reconciliation doesn't have much chance if the individual partners are (still) broken. They won't be able to help each other if they can't help themselves first.

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It is entirely possible that on a subconscious level I feel entitled. I will read up on that for sure but in my conscious thought I know I don't deserve my husband, my kids, my life. And my husband most certainly doesn't deserve me.

 

As to the part about your husband having sex with lots of women that is quite different because he divorced you first. I find the thought of my husband having sex with someone else a turn on. I'd want to know though but wouldn't have to. Being alone and full of regrets is only a fraction of what I deserve.

 

So do you want an open marriage? as a way to get past the A?

 

I guess it could work. It would not work for me but that does not mean it could not work for your family. But it could blow up if the OM tells or his wife finds out. good luck.

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Why don't you let your husband deal with the OM's communication this time?

 

If your H tells him to back off, I'm sure he will run with his tails between his legs. Most OMs are like that.

 

Have you thought about this?

 

And I am pretty sure you will not contact him unless he does. So there's a good chance it can all end if your H deals with the OM.

 

OBS has an annoying habit of confronting me and not her H. My H believes I am his concern not MM. If I was recieving unwelcome attention from MM he would step in right away. But he refuses to be my parent and pull the macho card. I need to end the relationship, not him. (Besides, MM wouldn't listen to him)

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There are so many things wrong with how you are doing this (or perhaps you AND your husband but we only know about him through you). All of these things are problems because you and he are not getting good counseling individually and together. You are processing most of it by yourself it seems and by writing on LS; you are not working it out with your H and discussing EVERYTHING with him. There doesn't seem to be much dialogue between you about the affair, about your relationship or about yourselves as individuals. You have this conversation with us instead, I'd venture. So I wonder if you even know what you don't know about what he thinks and feels, about his pain and changing attitudes, issues of trust. Or if you want to know. What you give us about him are strangely superficial, erratic reports that say little of substance, staccatoed with mildly reassuring platitudes that he is "happy." Then, back to you and how bad you are.

 

This part reminds me of my husband. Being sorry about having been in an affair, he thinks, means self-loathing, hatred of himself as well as what he did. Perhaps, like him, you think that's what your husband wants to know and see. For me, it is and was a sorry substitute for giving me something real of himself. It was not and is not what I wanted because it stayed on his mistake - or, as you call it, evil - and destroyed all hope of dialogue. But he doesn't get it and won't go for IC, and, like you gives the excuse of money. We stopped MC as well for this reason. He probably THINKS I'm doing better than I am because he doesn't want to know. Do you want to know how your husband is doing?

 

You seem mainly focused on yourself, whether it's about how bad you are or how you feel about the OM. You are sorry for what YOU did. I don't hear anything about your pain at what your husband feels and felt. There's nothing about his feelings of disrespect, loss of trust, or whatever he feels. I don't see you genuinely focused on him because you are convinced that was the damage you did and you wish with your whole being that you could do something, anything for him to make it up to him.

 

No, you seem to be alone essentially doing this your way, by yourself. You are making decisions about what you want, instead of asking what he needs. Those decisions include - what you tell and do not tell your husband. You still think this is your choice.

 

You think NC is only about making sure the A is over. It so is not. It is about giving the BETRAYED SPOUSE absolute confidence that you are committed. This includes the BS's access to all your accounts, phone and devices. It's about HIM - not you. It's for his recovery and healing, so he can get over the shock. It's not about making you good (or at least not as bad); NC is FOR THE BS.

 

So, that's all I have to say because I don't think you get the ABCs of how this works from the inside out. It all seems to be about what it looks like from the outside in. And everything on the inside is still open-ended and your secret world of what makes you feel this way or that. This is about you and not about making things right with your husband and your marriage.

 

Well a few things. My husband does not enjoy my self loathing so I do not do that for him. I hide it and let it out here or in my head. No one wants to be with someone who is constantly beating themselves up. I don't think people understand quite what is going on in our house. I've never been secretive with any of my devices or accounts. My husband can access them whenever he wants. I don't know if he does. He is in IT so really I couldn't hide anything from him if I wanted to. He also handles all the finances including my paychecks so there is no way for me to have secret phones or what not. This isn't because of trust issues but just because he is the money guy in our relationship and always has been. He always knows where I am... He could find my phone at any moment to see. The other day when I talked to MM it turned out he knew we were both there because he had been there a little while before and knew MM was there. I had told him I was going to that store. Anyways, I guess being an open person for the most part has its benefits. It keeps from being caught in a lie.

 

When I confessed the first time and then was caught the second time it was the worst two moments of my life. I hated the pain I saw on his face. I hated myself for being the cause of it. After the first time I never thought I'd be back here. And now I am. I have lost all faith in myself and know that even if I manage to cut things off with MM I will never be trustworthy and will never make a promise of fidelity again. And it is completely right and fair if my husband decides he doesn't want that in a wife.

 

But I will offer honesty. Not worth much but at least something.

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Hi Noirek, I haven't read your previous threads. Just this one.

 

Have you had individual counselling? I really think you would benefit from it to work out the real you.

 

I'm gonna be the angel's advocate instead of the devil's advocate here. Maybe that's what you're after by posting? Something like a woman who always asks people "Do I look fat in this?" Fishing for compliments.

I don't think many people are outright evil because of their THOUGHTS.

I don't think many or any maybe are outright angelic either by a long shot.

 

The difference between people who strive to be "good people" or the opposite are their ACTIONS. Of course people's actions are usually derived from their thought factory.

 

If you want to change your thoughts, work on this. Get help if you want to.

 

Lion Heart.

 

I am evil, or at least part of me is, because of my actions.

 

I'll be honest. Because of my location and lack of counsellers and my own preconcieved notions about them I view the whole thing similar to flushing money down a toilet. That attitude alone would prevent me from gaining anything from it. I've seen far more damage than good come from IC. We have discussed MC but because the only issue we have is me it doesn't seem to be something that would help.

 

I have to change not him and not our marriage. Me.

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So do you want an open marriage? as a way to get past the A?

 

I guess it could work. It would not work for me but that does not mean it could not work for your family. But it could blow up if the OM tells or his wife finds out. good luck.

 

I want an open marriage to take away the "forbidden"'fruit to see if that is why I am drawn to MM. Pretty crazy. Haven't had the guts to propose this theory yet. Went to last night and then we got *ahem* busy. Didn't want it to look like I was using sex to manipulate so decided to propose it tonight.

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Well a few things. My husband does not enjoy my self loathing so I do not do that for him. I hide it and let it out here or in my head. No one wants to be with someone who is constantly beating themselves up. I don't think people understand quite what is going on in our house. I've never been secretive with any of my devices or accounts. My husband can access them whenever he wants. I don't know if he does. He is in IT so really I couldn't hide anything from him if I wanted to. He also handles all the finances including my paychecks so there is no way for me to have secret phones or what not. This isn't because of trust issues but just because he is the money guy in our relationship and always has been. He always knows where I am... He could find my phone at any moment to see. The other day when I talked to MM it turned out he knew we were both there because he had been there a little while before and knew MM was there. I had told him I was going to that store. Anyways, I guess being an open person for the most part has its benefits. It keeps from being caught in a lie.

 

When I confessed the first time and then was caught the second time it was the worst two moments of my life. I hated the pain I saw on his face. I hated myself for being the cause of it. After the first time I never thought I'd be back here. And now I am. I have lost all faith in myself and know that even if I manage to cut things off with MM I will never be trustworthy and will never make a promise of fidelity again. And it is completely right and fair if my husband decides he doesn't want that in a wife.

 

But I will offer honesty. Not worth much but at least something.

 

Truth is, no one wants to be with someone that is cheating on them. They may forgive you and accept you for being a former cheater, they just won't accept you for continuing to cheat. Your all in or get the he*l out, who wants a part time spouse?

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You may offer honesty, although judging from earlier posts I not so sure. What I am sure of is you totally lack respect for your husband.

 

You are not some robot who doesn't control your actions, nor are you a monkey driven by instincts. You do what you do for one reason and one reason only you don't respect him. He hasn't shown you that he will put his foot down.

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Truth is, no one wants to be with someone that is cheating on them. They may forgive you and accept you for being a former cheater, they just won't accept you for continuing to cheat. Your all in or get the he*l out, who wants a part time spouse?

 

another part time spouse.

 

"How am I going going to be mad at my wife for coming home a 4am, when I got home at 3:45am"--Robin Harris

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You may offer honesty, although judging from earlier posts I not so sure. What I am sure of is you totally lack respect for your husband.

 

You are not some robot who doesn't control your actions, nor are you a monkey driven by instincts. You do what you do for one reason and one reason only you don't respect him. He hasn't shown you that he will put his foot down.

 

I hold my husband in very high regard. He is an amazing man and far better than I deserve. Maybe he hasn't "put his foot down" but he isn't my father. He is definitely to patient with me. I guess I am his one weakness. He is in management and very firm person. People do not walk all over him. He will probably not go for the open marriage. Actually I know he won't and it will most likely be the straw that breaks the camels back. But I cannot promise fidelity. And he needs to know that clearly. I have to make him understand just how damaged I am. I think he doesn't want to see it because he still loves the woman I used to be before I let the bad me take over. We don't have our kids tonight so...

 

I may not be able to do it. I don't want to lose him. But he does deserve so much better than me.

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I hold my husband in very high regard. He is an amazing man and far better than I deserve. Maybe he hasn't "put his foot down" but he isn't my father. He is definitely to patient with me. I guess I am his one weakness. He is in management and very firm person. People do not walk all over him. He will probably not go for the open marriage. Actually I know he won't and it will most likely be the straw that breaks the camels back. But I cannot promise fidelity. And he needs to know that clearly. I have to make him understand just how damaged I am. I think he doesn't want to see it because he still loves the woman I used to be before I let the bad me take over. We don't have our kids tonight so...

 

I may not be able to do it. I don't want to lose him. But he does deserve so much better than me.

 

You don't want to loose him but your intentionally throwing him away. I am starting to agree with you, he deserves so much better. Why don't you just do what's right and put the poor love struck man out of his misery, divorce him so he can find someone faithful and in love with him. Than you can have all the strange you want.

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You don't want to loose him but your intentionally throwing him away. I am starting to agree with you, he deserves so much better. Why don't you just do what's right and put the poor love struck man out of his misery, divorce him so he can find someone faithful and in love with him. Than you can have all the strange you want.

 

I have already answered this half a dozen times. And no, I will not be the one filing for divorce. Nothing more to say on that.

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I have already answered this half a dozen times. And no, I will not be the one filing for divorce. Nothing more to say on that.

 

I truly wish that you have an amazing life with other man or your husband, your choice. You absolutely know what your doing and I will bet that you will get your wish.

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I hold my husband in very high regard. He is an amazing man and far better than I deserve. Maybe he hasn't "put his foot down" but he isn't my father. He is definitely to patient with me. I guess I am his one weakness. He is in management and very firm person. People do not walk all over him. He will probably not go for the open marriage. Actually I know he won't and it will most likely be the straw that breaks the camels back. But I cannot promise fidelity. And he needs to know that clearly. I have to make him understand just how damaged I am. I think he doesn't want to see it because he still loves the woman I used to be before I let the bad me take over. We don't have our kids tonight so...

 

I may not be able to do it. I don't want to lose him. But he does deserve so much better than me.

 

My parting shot, the greatest disrespect you can show a spouse is cheating on them, infidelity, adultery, that's it. You think you hold your husband in high regard, lets just say we have a difference of opinion. I dealt with the cheater in my life, lets hope the three of you work it out.

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My parting shot, the greatest disrespect you can show a spouse is cheating on them, infidelity, adultery, that's it. You think you hold your husband in high regard, lets just say we have a difference of opinion. I dealt with the cheater in my life, lets hope the three of you work it out.

 

Thank you for your kindness. I know I am frustrating.

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whichwayisup
I want an open marriage to take away the "forbidden"'fruit to see if that is why I am drawn to MM. Pretty crazy. Haven't had the guts to propose this theory yet. Went to last night and then we got *ahem* busy. Didn't want it to look like I was using sex to manipulate so decided to propose it tonight.

 

Do not bring up open marriage to your husband. That's just putting the nail in your coffin and he'll probably see this as you can't and will not be faithful and committed to him.

 

Try to trust counseling. You need to.

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whichwayisup
I hold my husband in very high regard. He is an amazing man and far better than I deserve. Maybe he hasn't "put his foot down" but he isn't my father. He is definitely to patient with me. I guess I am his one weakness. He is in management and very firm person. People do not walk all over him. He will probably not go for the open marriage. Actually I know he won't and it will most likely be the straw that breaks the camels back. But I cannot promise fidelity. And he needs to know that clearly. I have to make him understand just how damaged I am. I think he doesn't want to see it because he still loves the woman I used to be before I let the bad me take over. We don't have our kids tonight so...

 

I may not be able to do it. I don't want to lose him. But he does deserve so much better than me.

 

You may hold him in high regard but your own selfishness and me me me attitude, almost like entitlement screams through your posts. You may think your H is an amazing man, kind, and patient but you don't respect him, don't respect the idea of marriage and all that entails, being committed to only him.

 

I know you don't want to be the one to pull the plug but maybe you should. Your expectations and idea of what marriage is supposed to be is not the same as your husband. He does love you but is he really aware how much you've changed and who you are now vs who you were when you married him? Staying with him would be a lie and unfair to him..

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