writergal Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 15 Things Christians say to Atheists (and shouldn't) 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Allumere Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 15 Things Christians say to Atheists (and shouldn't) OMG...where do mountains come from? really. That is just an idiot.....LOL 1 Link to post Share on other sites
writergal Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 8 reasons your religion may be harmful... Link to post Share on other sites
writergal Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 OMG...where do mountains come from? really. That is just an idiot.....LOL LOL I know! But it's a good example of the stupid questions that Christians ask Atheists to prove. Link to post Share on other sites
VeronicaRoss Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I'm just wondering why you're posting in a Spirituality section. Do you know why? Religion and spirituality are two different and only potentially related concepts. Each religion is a specific instance of one view of God as expressed through social rules of conduct -- they can vary wildly one from the other. Spirituality is about one's relationship with God and not tied to specific social rules of conduct. And it's not 'Christians' that have the bad name. It's the fundamentalist Christians (and Muslims) that appear to desire nothing more than their religion being the dominant social force in society and politics that have earned a great deal of distrust. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
pie2 Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Then you were apparently not raised in a fanatically Christian household or have parents and community who refuse to acknowledge you unless you embrace their religion. Hey, you can't assume anything about my upbringing. :p:o People have free will when they aren't pressured into religion or when they are allowed out find the religion of their choice without pressure from others. I guess I don't agree that free will is actually being violated (at least in the US). It's very rare that someone would actually have to choose religion or their life would be in danger. There are all sorts of civil protections against those kinds of violations. Nonetheless, there are consequences to making that sort of decision. But we're still allowed a choice. Even in places less fanatic, people who think for themselves or are Athiests/ non religious are pursued for conformity as though they can't possibly know what they want or they are stupid, bound by the devil if they do,not want to be saved. It is alarming how not respecting another persons beliefs and lifestyle choices can feel invasive There are many atheist families that would shun a child in an instant if he became religious. Like what if the son of an atheist decided to join Westboro...just imagine how quickly he could be ostracized! Not saying that's right or wrong, just saying it happens, and it happens on both sides of the debate. Link to post Share on other sites
pickflicker Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Hey, you can't assume anything about my upbringing. :p:o I guess I don't agree that free will is actually being violated (at least in the US). It's very rare that someone would actually have to choose religion or their life would be in danger. There are all sorts of civil protections against those kinds of violations. Nonetheless, there are consequences to making that sort of decision. But we're still allowed a choice. There are many atheist families that would shun a child in an instant if he became religious. Like what if the son of an atheist decided to join Westboro...just imagine how quickly he could be ostracized! Not saying that's right or wrong, just saying it happens, and it happens on both sides of the debate. America is perfectly happy for you to exercise freedom of religion. As long as it's Christianity. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
writergal Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Bill Maher...this clip discusses the reasons why I don't like religion and think that it's detrimental to society. Bill Maher // #GOD is a Psychotic Mass Murderer - YouTube 2 Link to post Share on other sites
writergal Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 (edited) More reasons why I can't stand religion...again Bill Maher cleverly explains the reasons better than I could. (Notice how the Evangelical minster REFUSES to answer Maher's questions directly, and how he tries to change the subject to avoid having to answer honestly. In other words, he DEFLECTS which is standard for Evangelicals and other Christians who refuse to have a two-way conversation with someone who disagrees with their POV.) Bill Maher Takes On Evangelical Minister Bible 'Hates Fags,' God's A 'Psychotic Mass Murderer' - YouTube Edited March 23, 2014 by writergal 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Grumpybutfun Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Hey, you can't assume anything about my upbringing. :p:o I guess I don't agree that free will is actually being violated (at least in the US). It's very rare that someone would actually have to choose religion or their life would be in danger. There are all sorts of civil protections against those kinds of violations. Nonetheless, there are consequences to making that sort of decision. But we're still allowed a choice. There are many atheist families that would shun a child in an instant if he became religious. Like what if the son of an atheist decided to join Westboro...just imagine how quickly he could be ostracized! Not saying that's right or wrong, just saying it happens, and it happens on both sides of the debate. Death is not the only way to take someone's free will from them. Many would rather die than be alone, be ostracized or lose their family/love especially as brainwashing usually is occurring during this relgious conditioning. We will just have to disagree this point pie2. None of this makes me hate anyone....just as I said in my first post. Best, Grumps 2 Link to post Share on other sites
KathyM Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Well, many of the Evangelical Christians I know personally have a lot of empathy for others. They bring clothing to the homeless. Cook, serve or deliver meals to the poor. Go on mission trips to build houses for people in impoverished countries. Deliver supplies, food and medicine to the poor in impoverished countries. Buy and deliver toys to poor children in this country, plus school supplies and basic needs. I know Christians who devote their life to this cause, and are doing these things on a weekly basis. I would hardly call that lacking in empathy for others. Many Christians I know also donate a lot of their money to provide for the poor. Many are also sponsoring poor children in other countries by sending money on a monthly basis for their care. I just wanted to point that out, for those who are claiming Evangelical Christians are lacking in empathy. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Janesays Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Well, many of the Evangelical Christians I know personally have a lot of empathy for others. They bring clothing to the homeless. Cook, serve or deliver meals to the poor. Go on mission trips to build houses for people in impoverished countries. Deliver supplies, food and medicine to the poor in impoverished countries. Buy and deliver toys to poor children in this country, plus school supplies and basic needs. I know Christians who devote their life to this cause, and are doing these things on a weekly basis. I would hardly call that lacking in empathy for others. Many Christians I know also donate a lot of their money to provide for the poor. Many are also sponsoring poor children in other countries by sending money on a monthly basis for their care. I just wanted to point that out, for those who are claiming Evangelical Christians are lacking in empathy. Guess what? I do all that too....WITHOUT trying to 'covert' those I'm attempting to 'help.' "I'll give your starving children something to eat if you let me ramble on about God and try to convert them to Christianity" isn't empathetic. It's self serving and predatory. 5 Link to post Share on other sites
UpwardForward Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I don't think it's 'self serving' or 'predatory' to spread the good news. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Janesays Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 (edited) I don't think it's 'self serving' or 'predatory' to spread the good news. Of course you wouldn't. You consider it 'good news.' I don't. I consider it a bunch of manipulative garbage and forcing people to kowtow to that just to get their basic needs met isn't "charity." It's borderline evil. Edited March 23, 2014 by Janesays 4 Link to post Share on other sites
OpenBook Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 But can't you see how if someone is being sincere and you "only respond to the parts I relate to," and therefore miss the main point, You're not really having a conversation? I think it's unfair, nitpicky and hypocritical to find fault with somebody's response because they don't address it the way you think they should. Who are you to dictate what people's responses should be - not to mention what the main point of somebody else's post is? as people become more humble, they realize that the Evangelical Christian they are criticizing is just a person, who is imperfect, just as they are. To me, that's part of what submission is. And I realize that non-believers sometimes have a hard time with that (I have a hard time with that!!!). So I can see why, when one does not open themselves up with a humble and submissive heart, Evangelicals can be grating and annoying. Heck, ALL people can be grating and annoying. (OK, even me ) IMO, nobody has a harder time with keeping a "humble and submissive heart" within themselves than a proselytizing evangelical Christian. I don't think it's fair or right to suggest that the targeted sinner should have a humble and submissive heart when the evangelist (and fellow sinner!) demonstrates the exact opposite traits - aggressive, obnoxious, overbearing. I'm with St. Francis of Assisi on this - it's much more effective to spread the gospel by demonstrating the nature of Christ through our own behavior and actions, rather than proselytizing it in words. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
truthbetold Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I think it's unfair, nitpicky and hypocritical to find fault with somebody's response because they don't address it the way you think they should. Who are you to dictate what people's responses should be - not to mention what the main point of somebody else's post is? IMO, nobody has a harder time with keeping a "humble and submissive heart" within themselves than a proselytizing evangelical Christian. I don't think it's fair or right to suggest that the targeted sinner should have a humble and submissive heart when the evangelist (and fellow sinner!) demonstrates the exact opposite traits - aggressive, obnoxious, overbearing. I'm with St. Francis of Assisi on this - it's much more effective to spread the gospel by demonstrating the nature of Christ through our own behavior and actions, rather than proselytizing it in words. That's exactly how it should be, Allumere also pointed that out and some on this thread are failing to recognize many Christians like myself do exactly this IRL. On a forum, it's a little harder because all we do have are the typed words. kwim? Guess what? I do all that too....WITHOUT trying to 'covert' those I'm attempting to 'help.' "I'll give your starving children something to eat if you let me ramble on about God and try to convert them to Christianity" isn't empathetic. It's self serving and predatory. I think it's outstanding that you do that. I've often said I do know atheists, or other non-Christians that carry the kindness to others better than some Christians. Hopefully this comes across as intended as it's meant as an olive branch. It's seems many of the atheists are spewing back a lot of venom in this thread, just look at the youtube excerpts that are doing nothing but poking fun at Christians. It's bullying to pick on someone because of their differences. I'm sure this won't go over well but I'm going to still try, again this is a forum so I can't show you what I mean with actions I can only type words. I see the face (or try to best I can) of Jesus in everyone. Doesn't matter who, we're taught we are all brothers and sisters, no discrimination. So it's not "self serving" it's "Jesus serving" to be sure, but we are created (collective we, I get you don't adhere to that) in God's image. So for a true Christian, we should be dying to ourselves and allowing Christ to live through us, so it's not self serving at all it's just the opposite. I guess my point is, if someone sees someone else as Jesus who as noted in this thread was extremely compassionate, giving, do unto others, and he loved everyone. Why is that so horrible? Now I get if someone is shoving stuff in your face and attempting to convert you that's wrong and very annoying. And trust me as a Catholic I get the same well meaning attacks at times to covert me, because after all I'm not supposed to be considered a Christian but "Catholic" so I'm going to hell according to them! I know my truth, so I try to not let it get to me, remembering "they" really *think* they have best interests at heart. aka showing kindness. As I've mentioned in an earlier post, I do not IRL speak my faith with anyone without them coming to me first and even then I don't speak "my" specific beliefs unless asked. I must consider all walks of life in my job. How I see you is between me and God. All *you* would see IRL is kindness and respect and love towards you. And love is never (or should not be) self serving. But it's impossible to convey that on a forum especially this section without words. Link to post Share on other sites
Keenly Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I'm genuinely surprised this thread has been open this long. But if I wanted to talk in circles, I'd get on the tilt o' whirl. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
writergal Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Me too Keenly. Link to post Share on other sites
KathyM Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Guess what? I do all that too....WITHOUT trying to 'covert' those I'm attempting to 'help.' "I'll give your starving children something to eat if you let me ramble on about God and try to convert them to Christianity" isn't empathetic. It's self serving and predatory. When they deliver toys to children or help out at the homeless shelter, or send a check every month to a poor family, they are doing so out of the goodness of their heart. My mother, for years, delivered Meals On Wheels to the poor elderly. I did that at one point myself. We deliver the meals, set it up on their table, engage in brief small talk, and then are on our way to deliver to the next person. We are not there prostheletizing. When we sign up to serve meals at the homeless shelter, we are there serving food to people of all faiths. We are not there prostheletizing. When my son teaches work skills to the homeless so they could potentially get a job, he is there teaching work skills. He is not prostheletizing. When my mother is making quilts to ship overseas to the poor, she has no contact with those she is working to help. This is not self serving. It is doing God's will by serving those in need. Why do you try to find fault with that? 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Allumere Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I'm genuinely surprised this thread has been open this long. But if I wanted to talk in circles, I'd get on the tilt o' whirl. I think it's a good thing. And representative of the fact that religious vs non-religious have butted heads for a very long time. On top of annoyance and frustration there is a lot of passion behind the "why" folks think what they do and why they want people to respect that. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Janesays Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 When they deliver toys to children or help out at the homeless shelter, or send a check every month to a poor family, they are doing so out of the goodness of their heart. My mother, for years, delivered Meals On Wheels to the poor elderly. I did that at one point myself. We deliver the meals, set it up on their table, engage in brief small talk, and then are on our way to deliver to the next person. We are not there prostheletizing. When we sign up to serve meals at the homeless shelter, we are there serving food to people of all faiths. We are not there prostheletizing. When my son teaches work skills to the homeless so they could potentially get a job, he is there teaching work skills. He is not prostheletizing. When my mother is making quilts to ship overseas to the poor, she has no contact with those she is working to help. This is not self serving. It is doing God's will by serving those in need. Why do you try to find fault with that? Well, I'm glad the 5 or 6 people you know don't try to convert people. However, MOST Christian charities and organizations DO. And I'm sorry, but when you meet someone who is hungry, who is sick, who is destitute and you say to them, "You know what we're going to do? We're going to make it so you can have clean water in this town for your children.....BUT, we want you to also help us build a church here. And we're even going to build you some schools! BUT, we want to put a bunch of bibles in them and teachers that are going to brainwash your children into a religion you have no interest in. That's the price of our 'help.' You can turn us down, of course, but then you'll probably all die. Think of your children." You don't see anything incredibly manipulative and innately immoral about that? When I give, I give. I don't give with one hand and take with the other. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
writergal Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 Religion is evil and allows evil people to get away with doing evil. Look at all the priests who sexually molest their parishioners. Do you know how the Church punishes those priests? The Church gives them a large retirement sum and paid-for house, and most of the time those priests STILL are active in their parish. The Vatican is notorious for cover-ups of pedophile priests. Priests never go to jail for their pedophilia. That's why I don't like it or trust religion. That's why religion is and always will be EVIL. Period. Christianity is a plague on society for reasons that myself and others have mentioned here. Yet the religious posters in this thread remain steadfast in their denial of reality and respond to criticism by ramping up their aggressive evangelical preaching, which is a deflection tactic. Again, I'll use the quote from the tv show House, where he says, "If you could reason with religious people there would be no religious people." Just because I despise religion -- Christianity especially -- doesn't mean I don't give back to my community,and doesn't mean I'm not a kind person. I don't need to hide behind religion to do good deeds and there are plenty of non-profit organizations that are NOT religious-based which do good deeds. Common lies that "Christians" spew: -Atheists have no morals -Evolution is just a theory (micro evolution is a FACT, macro evolution is a theory). Evolution DID happen. Stop saying god created everything. There is no creator. Don't you get it? The universe created ITSELF due to national evolutionary processes. There wasn't any celestial alien being that created earth and humans and animals etc. -The U.S. was founded on Christianity. Biggest lie ever. The founding fathers of America were a mix of agnostic, atheist and deist. NOT CHRISTIAN. Christianity was written into the Constitution after-the-fact. 20 Reasons to Abandon Christianity: 20 Reasons to Abandon Christianity 1. It's based on fear. 2. It preys on the innocent. 3. It's based on dishonesty. 4. It's ego-centric. 5. It breeds arrogance and a 'Chosen People' mentality. 6. It breeds authoritarianism. 7. It's anti-intellectual and anti-scientific. 8. It's cruel. 9. It has a morbid, unhealthy pre-occupation with sex. 10. It produces sexual misery (and sexual predators). 11. It has a narrow, legalistic view of morality. 12. It encourages acceptance of real evils yet focuses on imaginary evils. 13. It depreciates the natural world. 14. It models a hierarchical, authoritarian organization 15. It sanctions slavery. 16. It is misogynistic. 17. It is homophobic. 18. The bible is NOT a reliable guide to Christ's teachings. 19. The bible is riddled with contradictions. 20. Christianity BORROWED its myths and ceremonies from OTHER ANCIENT RELIGIONS. It's not even a real religion!! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Keenly Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I'm glad you two are on my side, however sometimes you just have to see when a battle just is not worth fighting anymore. Personally, I handle conversations like this with indifference, since they will never go anywhere, and lets be honest here. Neither side is listening to the other. It's how it will always be. Link to post Share on other sites
writergal Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 I'm glad you two are on my side, however sometimes you just have to see when a battle just is not worth fighting anymore. Personally, I handle conversations like this with indifference, since they will never go anywhere, and lets be honest here. Neither side is listening to the other. It's how it will always be. I'd listen to the other side of the argument of they'd STOP PREACHING and just accept the fact that Atheists and Agnostics and Buddhists, Muslims, and other religions ASIDE from Christianity are perfectly fine. But no. All they do is argue back with more preaching nonsense. But you're right Keenly, it's a no-win situation. But why start a thread asking people to explain why they don't like religion -- Christianity especially -- if the OP and others can't handle the truth, which is that people have valid reasons for despising religion which are perfectly valid. Threads like this one is setup as an excuse to exert force on people to try and convert them over to Christianity and religion. It was a trap that I should have seen it coming, but I naively believe the OP and other religious people here wanted to have a real conversation. But I was wrong. So wrong. Link to post Share on other sites
Keenly Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 But you're right Keenly, it's a no-win situation. But why start a thread asking people to explain why they don't like religion Why make Apple Jacks when they don't taste like apple? Link to post Share on other sites
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