Perspective from a MM and ?'s

[psm04]

 

What % of fault do you think is MM vs OW?

 

It really depends. If the MP either lied about their marital status or made false promises about leaving, etc., then the fault is entirely with them. However, in a situation where the MP did not lie, and his/her AP knew the reality, it's both parties' "fault". In my situation, both of us were and still are married. We never told each other we were going to leave. As time went on though, we talked about wanting to, but couldn't. We would always say 'nothing will ever happen', and feel terrible. Although I have times when I'm really mad at him, after reading this, I'm not sure whether he deserves that. I mean, if he tries to start the A again while choosing to stay married, then I'll be mad. But I can't fault him for what happened. I was an equal and consenting partner. I'm just really hurt and heartbroken. I'd have loved to be with him in a different time and place, but I'm just not willing to be someone's second life or fantasy.

[hollyhillcourt]

Do most OW enter into an A with the end goal of the MM leaving their M for them?

 

Do most OW enter the A knowing that he is a MM?

 

What % of fault do you think is MM vs OW? I can see where most here and society as a whole say 80% MM, BS may think opposite

 

I am not sure of any real statistics but I would guess out of all A's the MM leaves his wife for the OW 10-15% of the time, and 50% of them want to but don't.

 

If things do not work out with my M I do not expect the OW to be waiting around for me, and I would only reach out to her if she was not with anyone else, but still fully expecting her to tell me, no thanks. We did not end badly it was hard for each, we knew we put ourselves into a very difficult situation.

 

I can only speak for me, but the answer to your first two questions is: No. It was not obvious he was married, no ring and then when I found out, he did the whole 'I told her I wanted a divorce' song and dance mixed-in with the 'but I need to wait two months until the youngest is back at college' shuck and jive.

 

For number three, it is not my place to assess fault. I save that for work. It happened, so analyzing the fault aspect is really a waste of time.

 

I told my exMM that he should not leave for me. He should leave for himself if that is what he truly wants to do. I, personally, do not see success for us as a couple if he left for me. There are just too may issues to overcome there.

 

Your ending is like my ending. There was no anger, it was just over. And it wasn't necessarily easy bc/after time, of course you have feelings. I've said this before on here - you will always hear from an ex. It only a matter of time. It's not about if, it is about when.

[AlwaysGrowing]

The crux of this, and what I just have never understood, is the ability to love someone and still pursue love with another. As a former MP, I could not be in love with my husband to sleep with another man. Because, as you are fully aware, there is a great deal of disrespect one is dishing but screwing someone behind their back. So to love someone, to be in love with them, I know for myself I have to respect them as well. And I can't respect someone and cheat on them at the same time. It just doesn't work for me.

 

Looking at it another way, if I value something, I am not going to do something to put my ability to possess/have/hold/be part said value in jeopardy. Because I have deemed it a priority and worthy/valuable. If I don't see the value in it, then I am going to be more laissez faire with it. I will put it aside for awhile, forget about it, etc. But I can't value something and then do things that are in complete juxtaposition to it. That, to me, is like trying to turn right and left at the same time. Just not possible.

 

 

I get not loving someone, or respecting them...heck..even outright disliking someone. What I don't get with your thought process..is how does that now translate into DISRESPECTING them.

 

Not to mention the disrespect you show yourself, by engaging in hurting another so profoundly.

 

I can dislike someone, and not go take a hammer to their car. In the end, all that showed was who I am, and what I am capable of. Doesn't say one blessed thing about them.

[AlwaysGrowing]

What % of fault do you think is MM vs OW? I can see where most here and society as a whole say 80% MM, BS may think opposite

 

OMG....adults are 100% responsible for their actions and words. Each party is responsible for the hurt they caused.

 

People will do/think anything to minimize how they conduct themselves.

 

If people spent more time focusing on how they are walking through this life, the legacy they are leaving, if they are leaving darkness or light, maybe the world will start being a kinder place.

[yellowmaverick]

My friends told me of an MM whose OW was with him for 6 years. All the time he was saying he would leave' date=' there was always a reason. She lost the chance to have children. She left him and he suddenly realised what he had lost, and he went begging to my friends to get her to talk to him. She wouldn't (he did not even know them, he was devastated) - very sad to live with that regret. I asked my friend to ask her to talk to me about it, She didn't want to remember. My friend says my MM will end up doing this. ):[/quote']

 

It is very sad when they realize what they had only after they have lost it. My WH is devastated that I don't want to reconcile with him. I think his affair will haunt him much longer than it will me.

[HopingAgain]

Do you really believe that's what all of these various As are based on though? Some of these APs are several years into these relationships, myself included. Regardless of my MMs dumb decisions, I felt that we grew stronger as time went on. Albeit I am currently devastated and wondering how I even got to this point, I don't think infatuation could've carried it this far.

 

Do I believe that Limerance is the driving force behind many (most) affairs? Yes, I absolutely do. The descriptions of the intense feelings and thoughts about AP on this board fit the description of Limerance down to the letter. But don't take my word for it, I encourage you to do your own research and try to be as unbiased as possible. Its really quite interesting.

[bentleychic]

Do most OW enter into an A with the end goal of the MM leaving their M for them?

 

Do most OW enter the A knowing that he is a MM?

 

What % of fault do you think is MM vs OW? I can see where most here and society as a whole say 80% MM, BS may think opposite

 

I am not sure of any real statistics but I would guess out of all A's the MM leaves his wife for the OW 10-15% of the time, and 50% of them want to but don't.

 

 

I can only speak for myself. I would never have gotten involved with him to begin with if that was not the promised/expected outcome. Why waste my time as a single woman with a married man otherwise? I know not every OW (not even every OW that posts here) feels that way, though. I did know mine was a MM.

 

I feel that MM and I are equally responsible for our part in the relationship.

 

From this link

How Often Do Affair Partners End up Marrying and Happy? | Affair Resources and Advice

"For every 100 people who have an affair, anywhere from 1-10 of them will marry their Affair Partner. Of those, statistics say that 75% will divorce within 5 years. So that means, MAYBE 1-3 out of 100 live “happily ever after” with their affair partner after leaving their spouse."

 

I thought these stats were interesting, too. Scary at the %'s, but interesting.

Infidelity Statistics | Statistic Brain

[HopingAgain]

I can only speak for myself. I would never have gotten involved with him to begin with if that was not the promised/expected outcome. Why waste my time as a single woman with a married man otherwise? I know not every OW (not even every OW that posts here) feels that way, though. I did know mine was a MM.

 

I feel that MM and I are equally responsible for our part in the relationship.

 

From this link

How Often Do Affair Partners End up Marrying and Happy? | Affair Resources and Advice

"For every 100 people who have an affair, anywhere from 1-10 of them will marry their Affair Partner. Of those, statistics say that 75% will divorce within 5 years. So that means, MAYBE 1-3 out of 100 live “happily ever after” with their affair partner after leaving their spouse."

 

I thought these stats were interesting, too. Scary at the %'s, but interesting.

Infidelity Statistics | Statistic Brain

 

Great post. That first article was one of the best I've read on the subject, very in tune with reality. I thought this was interesting:

 

"Some experts say that a relationship that started as an affair can work—but it’s the exception and not the rule. “Every now and then, an affair is a matter of two star-crossed lovers finally finding each other. They were never the ‘perfect’ match with their spouses or exes and everything works out despite the upheaval of breaking up, divorcing and pulling families apart.”

 

However, this is by far the exception.

 

Here are some sobering statistics (although I can’t vouch for the source or their veracity, I’ve seen these stats pretty similarly at a number of sites):

 

1. Depending on which sources I found, it’s estimated that only 1%-10% of married men who have affairs end up leaving their spouses and marrying their affair partners (I haven’t found a stat for married women). I don’t know the validity of these stats, but they feel like they are probably right.

 

2. Over 75% who marry partners they were in an affair with eventually divorce. (of course, this isn’t much higher than the divorce rate for any second marriage. Still, it’s sobering).

 

3. 80% of those who divorce during an affair regret the decision."

 

Me and my former AP ( I was the WS in my former marriage) have been married 4 years this year (together 10) and already have been at the brink of divorce so the stats seems to be very accurate.

[AlwaysGrowing]

Bentley, thanks for the links, very informative.

 

 

For many married persons or aps...its just lifes simple rule...wherever you go, there you are.

 

And that is why most affairs do not turn into LTR, the dysfunction was not solely, partly or sometimes not all the bs . It was with those that decided it was okay to hurt others so that they can be "happy" (however you define that)

[Cali408]

Good Love Bad, I too am an WH. I had an affair for 5 years, was caught, took 2 off and started again, got caught again.

 

I had the same feelings you have. Probably still do. But I'm doing really well getting over it the second time around. You are feeling sorry for yourself and playing the victim, but you also feel ashamed and want to get verbally smacked around on her. Yep, check, check.

 

You love her more than your wife, check, been there. Mentally pine for affair partner, check.

 

I've been there and am going to help you.

 

1. As the great JLola on here has stated, it's your brain chemistry. You are an addict. You love the way you feel when you are with her. Like no one else, you've told her more than anyone. Sex is the best, it's all a mindphuc.

 

2. You will think of her all the time. You need to not daydream and pine for her. Understand, you've made your choice. If you're gong to leave, do it. If not then accept the situation is hopeless and let go. You say your wife is perfect. Live in the moment and accept the present. Not the fog. Yeah you screwed up. Stop dwelling on it be the best person you can be today.

 

3. Be grateful. Think every single day of the good things that happened in your life that day. Be thankful and know that on that day, you were a good husband. Repeat tomorrow.

 

4. No phone contact, no texts, no facebook, no emails, bread crumbs, tweets, pictures of yourself. Go underground on social networks. Better yet, delete accounts. No peeking on internet. NO PEEKING

 

5. Date your wife. Ask her out. Pretend it's your first date again.

 

6. Love yourself. By getting over her, you are treating yourself right because you won't be emotionally suffering.

 

7. When you feel weak, come back to the forum for reaffirmation.

[psm04]

 

1. As the great JLola on here has stated, it's your brain chemistry. You are an addict. You love the way you feel when you are with her. Like no one else, you've told her more than anyone. Sex is the best, it's all a mindphuc.

 

2. You will think of her all the time. You need to not daydream and pine for her. Understand, you've made your choice. If you're gong to leave, do it. If not then accept the situation is hopeless and let go. You say your wife is perfect. Live in the moment and accept the present. Not the fog. Yeah you screwed up. Stop dwelling on it be the best person you can be today.

 

3. Be grateful. Think every single day of the good things that happened in your life that day. Be thankful and know that on that day, you were a good husband. Repeat tomorrow.

 

4. No phone contact, no texts, no facebook, no emails, bread crumbs, tweets, pictures of yourself. Go underground on social networks. Better yet, delete accounts. No peeking on internet. NO PEEKING

 

5. Date your wife. Ask her out. Pretend it's your first date again.

 

6. Love yourself. By getting over her, you are treating yourself right because you won't be emotionally suffering.

 

7. When you feel weak, come back to the forum for reaffirmation.

 

This is great. I can relate to all these things. The difference is that I'm a woman, but the feelings are all the same. I have a hard time with point 4 though. I just checked his and her FB profiles again just a few mins ago. And they don't even have their profiles public to where I can see anything! I think step 4 is my final step towards healing.

[herenow]

I

 

I do 100% realize I'm acting selfish I have tried to do the right thing after doing a very wrong thing and I'm struggling with it, that is not a pat on the back just what I am feeling. I realize the OW may be gone and do hope she finds someone to give her everything I couldn't, I wish that for my wife too.

 

To try and answer some of the ?'s the OW was not married, the A was many years off and on..."

 

MANY YEARS??? How much more of your wife's life do you intend to waste? You say "I...do hope she finds someone to give her everything I couldn't, I wish that for my wife too". Well why haven't you given that chance to your wife? Do you not see how incredibly destructive it is for you to treat your wife this way? Why do you continue to hide the truth from her? Are you afraid she will leave you? Don't you owe her that choice? Let your wife in on the secret and let her make her own decisions on how she wants to live her life. If she chooses to stay with you, at least she will be aware that she is with a man that has feelings for an other woman. You write on this forum like you care about her, but your actions are quite the opposite.

[TheOW]

I

 

I do 100% realize I'm acting selfish I have tried to do the right thing after doing a very wrong thing and I'm struggling with it, that is not a pat on the back just what I am feeling. I realize the OW may be gone and do hope she finds someone to give her everything I couldn't, I wish that for my wife too.

 

To try and answer some of the ?'s the OW was not married, the A was many years off and on..."

 

MANY YEARS??? How much more of your wife's life do you intend to waste? You say "I...do hope she finds someone to give her everything I couldn't, I wish that for my wife too". Well why haven't you given that chance to your wife? Do you not see how incredibly destructive it is for you to treat your wife this way? Why do you continue to hide the truth from her? Are you afraid she will leave you? Don't you owe her that choice? Let your wife in on the secret and let her make her own decisions on how she wants to live her life. If she chooses to stay with you, at least she will be aware that she is with a man that has feelings for an other woman. You write on this forum like you care about her, but your actions are quite the opposite.

 

 

He's trying to come to terms with the split and his turbulent feelings with his ow hence why he's posting in the ow/om section

[herenow]

 

 

He's trying to come to terms with the split and his turbulent feelings with his ow hence why he's posting in the ow/om section

 

I get that, but no matter why he is posting, he says he cares about his wife. If that is true, he should let her know the truth so she can take part in the decisions that effect her. He is not acting in away that is consistent with what he is posting in this section.

[herenow]

I get that, but no matter why he is posting, he says he cares about his wife. If that is true, he should let her know the truth so she can take part in the decisions that effect her. He is not acting in away that is consistent with what he is posting in this section.

[TheOW]

 

I get that, but no matter why he is posting, he says he cares about his wife. If that is true, he should let her know the truth so she can take part in the decisions that effect her. He is not acting in away that is consistent with what he is posting in this section.

 

He's already stated that he is in indecision about telling his wife and at this point I think that is for the best, if he tells her and she will go bat ass crazy he may give up the fight completely, he needs to sort himself out think carefully before he does tell her (which when/if he does the decision will be out of his control wether she stays or not) he knows deep down he wants his wife otherwise he would have left before now. He's lost (own fault I know) and is trying to figure out his feelings and self worth

[Good Love Bad]

Thanks Cali408 that is exactly what I needed to hear.

 

I don't feel I am playing the victim or feeling sorry for myself, but if others are reading that into the words that I am writing - I don't know, then maybe I am?

 

HereNow I'm not sure what my actions are other than struggling with feelings I am trying to determine what they exactly are, I'm not sure how they can't be love, but I do need to look into what others are saying and probably getting into some professional therapy.

 

I feel like to this point I have tried to do the right thing out of doing the weak and wrong thing. I am not with OW anymore I am trying to make it work with my W and M and I am now trying to deal with these feelings I have now, I guess turning here first, which will lead to some more help. Of course if I find I really do love someone else and more, I will have to tell my W this to make her own choices. To be clear I'm not patting myself on the back for any of this I'm just realizing the process and coming on here has really helped open my eyes and get a reality check.

 

I still feel you can love more than one, and know most of you will disagree and your points have given me a reason to doubt that and that is what I realize is one of many things I need to get professional help with.

 

Bottom line I get I need to focus my love and thoughts on who I am with, and forget what could have been/be with the OW cause I'm just causing more problems.

[bentleychic]

I think you can love more than one person, but I don't believe in soul mates like some seem to. I don't believe there's only ONE person out there that we're meant to be with. And I think you can love multiple people in different ways.

 

HOWEVER, I think you need to decide who you want to commit to, preferably the person that you find the strongest love feeling, connection, etc. with and stick with that one person (or at least leave the person that you don't feel is the one that you want to commit to).

[ladydesigner]

Bottom line I get I need to focus my love and thoughts on who I am with, and forget what could have been/be with the OW cause I'm just causing more problems.

 

Most WS's believe you can love two people at the same time, maybe some can, I know I can't. Good Love Bad would you mind if your wife too could have another lover? Just curious.

[herenow]

He's already stated that he is in indecision about telling his wife and at this point I think that is for the best, if he tells her and she will go bat ass crazy he may give up the fight completely, he needs to sort himself out think carefully before he does tell her (which when/if he does the decision will be out of his control wether she stays or not) he knows deep down he wants his wife otherwise he would have left before now. He's lost (own fault I know) and is trying to figure out his feelings and self worth

 

And you don't think the wife should have the choice to leave a man who has feelings for an OW sooner rather than later? Do you feel it's OK for him to make that choice for her? There is no fight to give up because the BW does not even know what she is fighting or if she is fighting at all. Yes, I agree this is all about his feelings with no regard for his wife. I only mention it because he claims to care about her.

[TheOW]

Johnny Depp quote which stuck with me

 

“if you love two people at the same time, choose the second. Because if you really loved the first one, you wouldn't have fallen for the second.”

[herenow]

Thanks Cali408 that is exactly what I needed to hear.

 

I don't feel I am playing the victim or feeling sorry for myself, but if others are reading that into the words that I am writing - I don't know, then maybe I am?

 

HereNow I'm not sure what my actions are other than struggling with feelings I am trying to determine what they exactly are, I'm not sure how they can't be love, but I do need to look into what others are saying and probably getting into some professional therapy.

 

I feel like to this point I have tried to do the right thing out of doing the weak and wrong thing. I am not with OW anymore I am trying to make it work with my W and M and I am now trying to deal with these feelings I have now, I guess turning here first, which will lead to some more help. Of course if I find I really do love someone else and more, I will have to tell my W this to make her own choices. To be clear I'm not patting myself on the back for any of this I'm just realizing the process and coming on here has really helped open my eyes and get a reality check.

 

I still feel you can love more than one, and know most of you will disagree and your points have given me a reason to doubt that and that is what I realize is one of many things I need to get professional help with.

 

Bottom line I get I need to focus my love and thoughts on who I am with, and forget what could have been/be with the OW cause I'm just causing more problems.

 

Why don't you ask your wife if she feels you can "love more than one"?

[bentleychic]

No one is slamming op for being involved in an affair. It's his current actions regarding not being genuine to himself or his unsuspecting but already hurt wife that seems to be the issue.

 

It is completely unfair to let the BS think that he wants to R when in reality he is broken hearted about OW. His wife is just lied to at every turn, and that simply is not ok. No person should have to go through that. His actions are extremely damaging to others, and he should understand that.

 

I'm an OW and I approve of this message.

 

I think it's time to crap or get off the pot. Fully commit 100% to the marriage or move on (with or without the OW) and let your BW move on and find someone that is willing to commit to her fully.

[Speakingofwhich]

I still feel you can love more than one, and know most of you will disagree and your points have given me a reason to doubt that and that is what I realize is one of many things I need to get professional help with.

 

Getting professional help is a great idea, Good Love Bad! Sooner rather than later, I hope.

 

If you were in your wife's place, would you want to know about her having deep feelings (love) for OM?

[ladydesigner]

It is completely unfair to let the BS think that he wants to R when in reality he is broken hearted about OW. His wife is just lied to at every turn, and that simply is not ok. No person should have to go through that. His actions are extremely damaging to others, and he should understand that.

 

Yep this happened to me and the way I found out my WH was still broken hearted was by intercepting a text HE sent breaking NC where he said he missed his *insert her nickname here* I was devastated. I thought my WH felt bad about what he had done and said he wanted to be in the M with me, he agreed to NC. His thoughts however were not NC. I am damaged from this. I always will be. My WH showed me over and over again that he wasn't sure he wanted me. I still do not know his true feelings, he tells me one thing but then I believe something else because of his past actions. OP please don't do this to your wife.