rainfall Posted May 6, 2007 Share Posted May 6, 2007 Well what about your minister? Nah, they masturbate too, so can't them either. And could we please not go into what they think about during ... I don't go to church so I do not have a minister. I'm not sure if my bf reads this. He knows I post here and he knows my user name but the subject has really never come up. Link to post Share on other sites
rainfall Posted May 6, 2007 Share Posted May 6, 2007 That sux. Has this worked for ANYONE? Are there any men out there who would be totally ok with only viewing naked pics/vids of their SO for the rest of their lives? I would totally be . I have actually done this for my bf now that he no longer looks at porn. I choose to believe him that he no longer looks at porn no matter what any of the other people on here want to tell me. Link to post Share on other sites
littlepiggy1 Posted May 6, 2007 Share Posted May 6, 2007 That sux. Has this worked for ANYONE? Are there any men out there who would be totally ok with only viewing naked pics/vids of their SO for the rest of their lives? I would totally be willing to do this for him, but not if it's only going to inevitably set me up for more heartache. You're setting up a standard that doesn't really exist (except in rare cases). Everything I've read on human sexual behavior suggests we are simply not wired to be 100% monogamous. Certainly we enter such relationships, sometimes for life, but there is no magical switch in the brain that causes people to cease thinking about and even wanting others in a sexual way. And this goes for the vast majority of men and most women, too. Again, it's basic biology. To fight against it is like fighting against our need to eat or sleep. I think you may just have to go through your own paradigm shift or search for the rare, elusive male that can fulfill your expectations. It's just that I used to assume he never thought of anyone but me. I really and truly believed it because he told me so. He told me before we ever started dating that he wasn't into porn--he deleted w/out me asking because I was "all he needed". No. He told you what you wanted to hear. This is what guys do. We know women are on average more sensitive about these issues than guys, so we do what we can to avoid creating a conflict and hurting our SOs. Is it the most ideal thing? Maybe, maybe not. People aren't exactly rational, especially when it comes to love. But then I just get so resentful, thinking about how I would give him that gift (fulfilling his fantasies), and then he would just turn around and go watch some random sluts, who don't even know he exists, do the same thing for him (as well as lots and lots of other guys they don't even know or care about). Kind of like giving him a priceless urn or something and then he goes to Walmart and buys some cheap crappy vase made in china. The problem is you're making this all about you, when it isn't. He's not doing it because he's necessarily dissatisified with you or wants you to necessarily fulfill all his fantasies. He's doing is because it's something else. It could be because of solo masturbation. It could be because of a base desire to impregnate other women. It could be because he can explore fetishes he doesn't necessarily want to act out in real life. This notion of being his single, sole source of sexual stimulation for life is just plain unrealistic. I also feel like a gift is being taken away from me. Like, he's looking at me, telling me how hot, how beautiful, how sexy I am and "omg, it's so hot when you do that", etc., and then he gives that to some random b*tch on a computer screen that doesn't even know she's getting that kind of attention from him. It means something to me and makes me feel incredibly special, and then someone who doesn't even know or care that's she's getting it is getting MY gift. Does this make any sense? I probably sound really dumb and immature, I know. But I really think this is exactly the root of what bothers me about porn. If I could get past this, I think I would stop caring if he looks or not. It doesn't sound dumb or immature. It sounds like you've elevated sex to a higher plane of existence. When really, it's not *that* special. Link to post Share on other sites
littlepiggy1 Posted May 6, 2007 Share Posted May 6, 2007 I choose to believe him that he no longer looks at porn no matter what any of the other people on here want to tell me. Well, of course, you have to believe him or you'd have no relationship. As I said before, the truth in your situation matters less than what you perceive. Link to post Share on other sites
littlepiggy1 Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 I'll bet if you decided to walk around the house naked ALL the time, he'd never, ever, ever tell you to put on clothes. I dunno about that. Link to post Share on other sites
che_jesse Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 I really dont understand why these threads get so big every time. Why cant we all just accept that some people like porn.... But then I just get so resentful, thinking about how I would give him that gift (fulfilling his fantasies), and then he would just turn around and go watch some random sluts, who don't even know he exists, do the same thing for him (as well as lots and lots of other guys they don't even know or care about). This is totally wrong, what you give him is a million times better then what pron gives him. Belive me, I'm in the middle of a high risk pregnancy and my hubby and I have not been able to have sex for months now. I dont care how much he jerks to what type of pron because a hand job from me does more for him then any random porn. Your boyfriend would always choose you over porn, if he dosent you are with the wrong person. Link to post Share on other sites
rainfall Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 Well, of course, you have to believe him or you'd have no relationship. As I said before, the truth in your situation matters less than what you perceive. If he did look at porn we would both be better of not being together. If he wants to look at porn he should find someone willing to put up with that kind of behavior or who does that herself. Link to post Share on other sites
littlepiggy1 Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 If he did look at porn we would both be better of not being together. If he wants to look at porn he should find someone willing to put up with that kind of behavior or who does that herself. In the long run, sure. But the reality of human relationships isn't quite so simple. Link to post Share on other sites
rtHawk Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 That sux. Has this worked for ANYONE? Are there any men out there who would be totally ok with only viewing naked pics/vids of their SO for the rest of their lives? I would totally be willing to do this for him, but not if it's only going to inevitably set me up for more heartache. I just can't shake the feeling of betrayal that porn leaves me with. I really want to, but for some reason I just can't. I don't want to limit and control him and have it turn to resentment (we've been there). I also don't want to limit him and have it turn into desire that wouldn't have been there otherwise (like the desire to cheat, or a heightened desire to see other women naked...). I just feel like he's constantly thinking about what other women look like naked and that porn is fueling this. Like, the more naked women he looks at, the more his brain is "trained" to envision anyone naked. But maybe I have it all mixed up. Maybe the less porn he looks at, the more he's going to start envisioning what all the women around him look like naked.....perhaps? I feel that I may be making a bigger deal about porn than *normal*, mentally healthy males make of it (not talking about addictions, etc. here, just normal guys w/ normal sex drives). Like, it's a bigger deal to me than it is to them and I think about it's impact on their thoughts more than it actually impacts their thoughts. In other words...yeah, sure, guys like boobies and all, but maybe I'm just assuming they think about it/care about it more than they really do. Am I?? It's just that I used to assume he never thought of anyone but me. I really and truly believed it because he told me so. He told me before we ever started dating that he wasn't into porn--he deleted w/out me asking because I was "all he needed". So now I've gone overboard in the other direction, so as not to be so "stupid" again, I guess. I'm battling some major resentment that is affecting our sex life. I want to give him what he wants, the fantasies he wants. A lot of it is stuff I'm not into and it would be strictly for HIM, because I love him. And I would enjoy it to just because I would enjoy turning him on. But then I just get so resentful, thinking about how I would give him that gift (fulfilling his fantasies), and then he would just turn around and go watch some random sluts, who don't even know he exists, do the same thing for him (as well as lots and lots of other guys they don't even know or care about). Kind of like giving him a priceless urn or something and then he goes to Walmart and buys some cheap crappy vase made in china. (I'm an interior design major....it's the best analogy I could come w/ atm...haha). But same thing goes for something as simple as showing off my body for him. It's JUST for him....a priceless gift....and they are giving it away to anyone. And he's looking. It's like my gift doesn't matter. I also feel like a gift is being taken away from me. Like, he's looking at me, telling me how hot, how beautiful, how sexy I am and "omg, it's so hot when you do that", etc., and then he gives that to some random b*tch on a computer screen that doesn't even know she's getting that kind of attention from him. It means something to me and makes me feel incredibly special, and then someone who doesn't even know or care that's she's getting it is getting MY gift. Does this make any sense? I probably sound really dumb and immature, I know. But I really think this is exactly the root of what bothers me about porn. If I could get past this, I think I would stop caring if he looks or not. Does anyone understand where I'm coming from? How do I get past this? I really want to. I don't want to be bitter and narrow minded and I don't want to be uptight and controlling. I love him and I don't want to leave him over something as incredibly dumb as porn. **PS--I'm not trying to be argumentative, disagreeable, or prove myself right, or anything like that. I'm really trying to come to terms with all this so that I can improve my R w/ my bf, and I just really need someone to put it to me in a way I can understand an accept.... I get you completely and understand totally and feel very much the same way... some of us do and some of us don't-- it seems we though expend an awful lot of energy and have an incredible amount of strife to endure -deal--tolerate--understand-cope with porn while our SO's basically just keep doin' with out much for an attempt to work it thru without lying or beign deceptive... and as much as I hate it, I rather it out in the open between us and from him than hidden and secreted,, the hiding feels much worse--trust me! I really appreciate some of the same women posters who so patiently continue to respond and try to support and offer insight.... I know you must want to knock us upside the head, but truly, this is BIG for us--it really affects our sense of self with and without our SO. t doesn't sound dumb or immature. It sounds like you've elevated sex to a higher plane of existence. When really, it's not *that* special. there belies part of the difference.... for us it is THAT special! heck if it isn't that special than what the want and urge for porn if sex isn't that special... but actually porn isn't that special really--it is scripted/acted sex----lights action camera or the other way around actually--- whereas for us, sex is about intimacy, love, committment and all those good things.... He may have in his head very incredible memories of nights you two have spent together. But I guarantee he does not have ONE single memory of a really special wank to porn. that would be so wonderfu if it be true, but why then are certain porn women so idolized, favorites, house hold names.... certainly not because they don't remember them and all the wanks they had to one of their body parts.[ QUOTE].fantasy is irrelevant and I wouldn't even be able to tell you what they look like becasue I rarely picture their faces or even bodies - height, weight, hair color, muscles, no muscles, whatever??? none of that is what turns me on. that is you! and as much as it would feel better to know that it works that way for the guys or my SO really, most guys reponded to the ? about what they get turned on by and they said, the porn woman, and certain body parts. And I believe men need the erotic visuals to take them over the edge because their imaginations just aren't enough - or they are too used to having the visual to do without it. more likely the too used to part rather than the lack of imagination...and more than likely, the ease with which the access.... like I said, why bake the bread at home if you can get loaf at the corner store.??? I too am not tryig to be argumentative or prove right or wrong... it acutally helps me and maybe others like me to try and work thru these feelings in this type of setting instead of harboring more resentment than already exists and dumping it out on my SO or since he is not open to discussion about this, at least there are kind men --honest, I think, men and women who are willing to share their thoughts, op and insights. Link to post Share on other sites
rainfall Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 In the long run, sure. But the reality of human relationships isn't quite so simple. For some people maybe. However for some people it is that simple. Maybe some people are willing to put up with porn use or put up with fights over porn use everyday, however some people would rather not deal with that crap. Link to post Share on other sites
rtHawk Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 Your boyfriend would always choose you over porn, if he dosent you are with the wrong person. first, I truly hope you have a safe and unremarkable HR pregnancy! with a happy healthy baby !!!!!! and you are right about what we give as being better that what any porn could ever offer but...... our SOs choose us annnnnnnnddddddd porn.... that is the problem! Link to post Share on other sites
norajane Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 I get you completely and understand totally and feel very much the same way... some of us do and some of us don't-- I really appreciate some of the same women posters who so patiently continue to respond and try to support and offer insight.... I know you must want to knock us upside the head, but truly, this is BIG for us--it really affects our sense of self with and without our SO. I too am not tryig to be argumentative or prove right or wrong... it acutally helps me and maybe others like me to try and work thru these feelings in this type of setting instead of harboring more resentment than already exists and dumping it out on my SO or since he is not open to discussion about this, I don't expect to change anyone's mind so they see things the way I do. At best, I hope to offer my perspective as evidence that there ARE other perspectives. Meaning, even though you see your bf's porn use as something threatening, that does not mean his use IS actually threatening to your relationship based on how he sees porn. Even though you believe it means he thinks you aren't enough or that sex with you isn't good or whatever it is you are dwelling on that hurts you most about it, that doesn't mean HE thinks you aren't enough, or that sex with you isn't good, or that he intends it in a hurtful way. It's important to accept that he has a perspective and - even though you don't agree with it or understand it - HE sees things that way. So when he tells you the porn girls mean nothing, even though you don't know how that could possibly be true, that is indeed how he sees them. If you can't accept that he is telling you the truth when he says porn is a tool and not a problem, fine, don't accept it and leave him. Link to post Share on other sites
rtHawk Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 I don't expect to change anyone's mind so they see things the way I do. At best, I hope to offer my perspective as evidence that there ARE other perspectives. Meaning, even though you see your bf's porn use as something threatening, that does not mean his use IS actually threatening to your relationship based on how he sees porn. Even though you believe it means he thinks you aren't enough or that sex with you isn't good or whatever it is you are dwelling on that hurts you most about it, that doesn't mean HE thinks you aren't enough, or that sex with you isn't good, or that he intends it in a hurtful way. It's important to accept that he has a perspective and - even though you don't agree with it or understand it - HE sees things that way. So when he tells you the porn girls mean nothing, even though you don't know how that could possibly be true, that is indeed how he sees them. If you can't accept that he is telling you the truth when he says porn is a tool and not a problem, fine, don't accept it and leave him. thanks NoraJane for your perspective and attempts at eye and mind opening. I appreicate it much! I love him way more that he loves his porn; so it is a constant struggle and coping for me... the hx of our R and what we have gone thru, (too many details etc to get into--) basically pushed how I deal with this over the edge, but his ++++++++ still all outway this one -. Link to post Share on other sites
rainfall Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 It's important to accept that he has a perspective and - even though you don't agree with it or understand it - HE sees things that way. So when he tells you the porn girls mean nothing, even though you don't know how that could possibly be true, that is indeed how he sees them. . If porn really means nothing to a man then he would have no problem giving it up when his so who hopefully means alot to him asks him to. Link to post Share on other sites
Jersey Shortie Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 But a woman feels so much better than masturbating. Can I do both??? Yes, obviously you can do both because this is obviously what most men do. Most men only think about what they want and need and disregard the fact of how porn can effect and hurt the woman in their life. You can do both and in that, keep reminding us real women just how worthless we really are to men. You can keep doing both and having your cake and eating it to, but it doesn't come without a price. Unfortunetly, the one paying the price isn't you. It's your SO. my quess is most men are addicted ---in different leves but nonetheless addicted. Yes I agree. I think most men, on some level, are addicted to it more then they care to honestly admit. It's really sad that so many women are hurt by porn, an unreal image of what women is, a video or a magazine and the thing that keeps getting defended is the porn. Not the real woman in their lives. You're setting up a standard that doesn't really exist..... Men set up standards that can't possibly exist themselves everyday with porn! No real woman looks like that yet it's elevated to a pedestal standards of female beauty. So at the end of the day, it's a man's world. Men luck out. They get a real woman who loves them and cares for them. They get to masturbate to all the women they wish they could have. And the one who pays the price for it is the one woman who actually gives a crap about him. Link to post Share on other sites
norajane Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 If porn really means nothing to a man then he would have no problem giving it up when his so who hopefully means alot to him asks him to. Ah, but I didn't say the porn means nothing. I said the porn girls mean nothing. There is a difference. The porn is his tool, a means to a masturbatory end (a quick, no muss, no fuss orgasm) and it's something he's relied upon to get him off instead of merely his imagination. However, the porn girls themselves don't necessarily mean anything, in that he's not lusting after them and wishing he was with them instead of his girl. Link to post Share on other sites
GregsBad Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 Ah, but I didn't say the porn means nothing. I said the porn girls mean nothing. There is a difference. This is one thing about Rain that frustrates me in this thread. She frequenly gets a quote a little twisted and then goes from there. Read Rain! Read! Link to post Share on other sites
GregsBad Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 The porn is his tool, a means to a masturbatory end (a quick, no muss, no fuss orgasm) and it's something he's relied upon to get him off instead of merely his imagination. However, the porn girls themselves don't necessarily mean anything, in that he's not lusting after them and wishing he was with them instead of his girl. I think Rain will allow her man to masturbate. And she even gets it that mastubation requires a thought process (fantasy) in order to get the brain to work the plumbing (erection). But Rain's contention is that her man must be fantasizing about no one other than Rain herself. Do I have that right Rain? Link to post Share on other sites
cn283 Posted May 8, 2007 Share Posted May 8, 2007 I think Rain will allow her man to masturbate. And she even gets it that mastubation requires a thought process (fantasy) in order to get the brain to work the plumbing (erection). But Rain's contention is that her man must be fantasizing about no one other than Rain herself. Do I have that right Rain? For some women it's easier to believe they are the only women their guy dreams, thinks, fantasizes, masturbates, and lusts for...most of the time it's not the case. It could be, but most of the time it's not. Coming at it from a different angle, I think it's far more hurtful for a woman to realize that porn is something that is so important that a guy would lie and defend it. Replace porn with anything that you don't really need and it's pretty hurtful. Also women need to feel that they are #1 in their guys life. Men don't need this as much because if you are then you know. If a woman acted more like a man in a relationship, things would be different. That's where problems arise. And instead of talking about it rationally emotions get in the way (for both parties) and nothing gets solved. Guy say "she doesn't want me to masturbate, something I think is normal and healthy" "she doesn't want me to look at porn, which is no big deal therefore she must be insecure" instead of talking about there "bond" with porn. Guys are so ashamed of "needing" porn, when if it's that important in your life you should have the communication skills to explain that. Women on the other hand say "if he watches porn, I'm not enough" and "if that's what he watches that must be what he wants" and my favorite "if he looks at porn that means he wants to sleep with other people". Instead of sitting down with their SO and listening to what they have to say. And calmly explaining how they feel and understanding that even though they feel that way, doesn't necessarily make it so. BTW everything in bold should be in a happy relationship... Link to post Share on other sites
GregsBad Posted May 8, 2007 Share Posted May 8, 2007 instead of talking about there "bond" with porn. Guys are so ashamed of "needing" porn, when if it's that important in your life you should have the communication skills to explain that. Women on the other hand say "if he watches porn, I'm not enough" and "if that's what he watches that must be what he wants" and my favorite "if he looks at porn that means he wants to sleep with other people". Instead of sitting down with their SO and listening to what they have to say. And calmly explaining how they feel and understanding that even though they feel that way, doesn't necessarily make it so. BTW everything in bold should be in a happy relationship... I agree that each should be able to communicate about this. But this was about Rain! Do you think she is open? Do you think her BF is open? I don't. I think she's got her thumb down hard on him and he's letting it happen. He was into porn before but not anymore? Gimme a break! She's demanding to be told by her husband that another woman never even comes to mind. Forget about PORN! Rain is in to controlling what's in his mind. Reminds me of Miss Piggy when she asks Kermit if she's fat. Kermit knows better than to be honest. Link to post Share on other sites
GregsBad Posted May 8, 2007 Share Posted May 8, 2007 instead of talking about there "bond" with porn. Guys are so ashamed of "needing" porn, when if it's that important in your life you should have the communication skills to explain that. Women on the other hand say "if he watches porn, I'm not enough" and "if that's what he watches that must be what he wants" and my favorite "if he looks at porn that means he wants to sleep with other people". Instead of sitting down with their SO and listening to what they have to say. And calmly explaining how they feel and understanding that even though they feel that way, doesn't necessarily make it so. BTW everything in bold should be in a happy relationship... I agree that each should be able to communicate about this. But this was about Rain! Do you think she is open? Do you think her BF is open? I don't. I think she's got her thumb down hard on him and he's letting it happen. He was into porn before but not anymore? Gimme a break! She's demanding to be told by her husband that another woman never even comes to mind. Forget about PORN! Rain is in to controlling what's in his mind. Reminds me of Miss Piggy when she asks Kermit if she's fat. Kermit knows better than to be honest. Link to post Share on other sites
rainfall Posted May 8, 2007 Share Posted May 8, 2007 I think Rain will allow her man to masturbate. And she even gets it that mastubation requires a thought process (fantasy) in order to get the brain to work the plumbing (erection). But Rain's contention is that her man must be fantasizing about no one other than Rain herself. Do I have that right Rain? I have no problem with my bf masturbating but if he is masturbating to pictures of another women that is where my problem is. Question also if you say the porn women mean nothing..... then why do you think according to most guys on here that naked pictures and videos of their SO would not be enough? If it is only the act or the body part then why can't it be their SO why does it have to be some worthless porn chick? Link to post Share on other sites
GregsBad Posted May 8, 2007 Share Posted May 8, 2007 I have no problem with my bf masturbating but if he is masturbating to pictures of another women that is where my problem is. But you HAVE said you object to his even THINKING of others. Even if NO porn is involved. Link to post Share on other sites
rainfall Posted May 8, 2007 Share Posted May 8, 2007 I have never supported PORN here. I've only spoken about the reality of masturbation and fantacies. I've only said it's rediculous for you to try to control what's in his mind while he masturbates. What he fantasizes about - even WITHOUT porn. You HAVE said in this thread that you want him to fantasize ONLY about you. So you're points we're really not only about porn, but even what's in his mind. Yes I want my bf to only fantasize about me because he has no need to think about screwing other women. I should be all he needs and wants. The reason he says he was into porn before is because he didn't get to see a naked woman in real life so he had to settle for porn..... so now that he has a real naked woman he has no need for the porn. Link to post Share on other sites
GregsBad Posted May 8, 2007 Share Posted May 8, 2007 Rain, It was suggested by you that just as a cat can be trained to fetch like a dog ... you could also train your BF to fantasize ONLY about YOU. I believe you could train a cat - I don't believe you've really trained your BF. The thought that you WANT to control someone like that is strange to me. The thought that he's letting you think so ??? Does he read this thread? Link to post Share on other sites
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