Do Men Suffer As Much

[ShatteredLady]

Oh, I'm sure there are some. If you'd like to test your AP, just tell him "No more sex/physical stuff until you leave your wife". Most men will pull up stakes and move on to the next one before the dinner check comes. It sounds like your situation was different, and, yes, there are certainly those out there as well. But I have a large group of male friends and, because of the industry I'm in (high paying) a lot of them engage in affairs pretty regularly. NONE of them ever talk to me about "missing" an AP. They talk about the sex, and they miss certain things the AP did with them (sexual things). But they never say "she was an amazing person". Most men look at women who have affairs as "broken/dirty/damaged"; good for some fun in the bedroom, but without character and therefore, not worthy/deserving of their love. If you remember back to high school, think to the "easy girl" who was sleeping around. Guys all talked to her, because they thought they might "get some". But they also all talked about her, because they knew she wasn't relationship material or worthy of real love. In my experience, that's how most men view their AP's.

 

Sorry if this is harsh, and, having never been in an affair, I can't say this from personal experience. But I talk to and work with a lot of men, and I can tell you what I'm relating is near universal when talking about "their sidepieces". As I said earlier in this thread, if women knew how their AP's were talking about them, in 90%+ of the cases out there, they would NEVER consider doing it. And I know it's confusing, they are professing their undying love for you and then going to the bar with me and talking about your sexual prowess and how nice your chest is. I get it, you don't see that side of men. I do, and I hope others will heed my words; get into an affair with a MM at your own peril! If you don't, you need to be totally prepared that you'll be the butt of the joke at the bar tomorrow night when he's sitting around with me and the rest of his buddies.

 

 

In my experience this isn't true at all. It's was her "bum" that my husband wrote about to his mates!!!

 

But...is what a man reveals to his 'mates' true? I don't think so. Macho 'pride' often makes 'boy talk' the most unreliable form of communication. I've listened to it from friends who have later cried on my shoulder.

 

I do think you're completely correct in 'some' cases but completely wrong in others. We're all different. I'm a bs & I would love to believe your words but I know that they're not always true....& less true than you think. Know what I mean?

[waterwoman]

 

I do think you're completely correct in 'some' cases but completely wrong in others. We're all different. I'm a bs & I would love to believe your words but I know that they're not always true....& less true than you think. Know what I mean?

 

I am also a BS and I would hate to think that it's true! I don't want my man to be that crude and simplistic. I know my H felt pain after d-day and suffered a great deal. I just don't think it was all, or even mainly, because he was missing OW. The entire situation was messy, painful and humiliating for him and he had to revise his view of himself as a loyal, loving and honest man. He wanted it not to have happened as much as I did.

[Overtaxed]

In my experience this isn't true at all. It's was her "bum" that my husband wrote about to his mates!!!

 

But...is what a man reveals to his 'mates' true? I don't think so. Macho 'pride' often makes 'boy talk' the most unreliable form of communication. I've listened to it from friends who have later cried on my shoulder.

 

I do think you're completely correct in 'some' cases but completely wrong in others. We're all different. I'm a bs & I would love to believe your words but I know that they're not always true....& less true than you think. Know what I mean?

 

Very fair, I know there are some exceptions. But if I was a WW (or a female AP) I would operate under the assumption that I gave rather than "he really loves me". I know all the men I talk to tell their AP's about their undying love. But people who love another person don't show the sexy chats/pics to a group of guys at the bar. People who love their AP's don't talk about how much they like specific sexual acts. So, I'm pretty sure that my friends talking about this aren't doing the "macho" thing, they really are with these women just for the sex. And I'm sure the women think they are there for the emotional connection. It's sad really when you think about it, my wife was far more sexual with her AP than she "really" is. And no, it's not because I've let myself go and it's not that it dropped off after marriage. She's just not a very sexual person and never has been. But she knew that's what her AP wanted, so she became the woman he wanted. And he did the same thing, knew my wife was starving for an emotional connection, and became what she wanted. Neither of these people were "real". In an affair, oftentimes, I think everyone is lying to everyone. BS's are being lied to at the same time the AP is being lied to. It's just an ugly circle of lies and deceit all the way around.

[Overtaxed]

I am also a BS and I would hate to think that it's true! I don't want my man to be that crude and simplistic. I know my H felt pain after d-day and suffered a great deal. I just don't think it was all, or even mainly, because he was missing OW. The entire situation was messy, painful and humiliating for him and he had to revise his view of himself as a loyal, loving and honest man. He wanted it not to have happened as much as I did.

 

I don't doubt for a second that your husband felt immense pain after d-day. But I doubt it was because he was deeply in love with the AP; I think it's exactly what you said. He was terribly disappointed in himself, ashamed of what he did, horrified at what it did to you (the woman he actually does love) and terrified of losing you because he was after another woman for sex.

 

I just responded to another poster who said that their experience was not like what I laid out. And there are some exceptions. But, ladies, please, believe me. I know dozens of men who have something "on the side". Not one of those men is in love with their AP. Because, if they were, they'd never tell me about it, and, even more so, they'd never talk about them like they do in front of me and other men. Please, if you're going down this road believe me, if you're sleeping with a married man, he almost certainly considers you disposable at best, trash at worst. You should have seen the things my wife's AP said to her. Totally over the top expressions of love and caring, right out of a romance novel. If you read his words literally; you would have thought this guy was the most in love man you've ever met.

 

And then d-day comes. He drops my wife like she has the plague. And then he denigrates her to an absolutely ridiculous degree to his wife (she and I are in contact, which is how I know this). My wife pursued him for years, he had to quit his job because of her, she's a predator.. None of which was true; his wife didn't want to see the TXT messages because, I think she knew what the truth was but couldn't stand to face it (this was his 3rd affair that she knew of). So she called me up mad as a hornet about my "sl*t of a wife". I just let her believe it, she'd already made up her mind to R, and I'd offered the truth; she didn't want it. But my point is this; if you saw the things they said to one another, you'd think this man would walk through fire to get to my wife; nothing would keep him from her. And yet, when the chips are down, my wife was nothing to him; he roasted her to death to his wife and made her into a trashy wh*re in her eyes. And you know what? That is much closer to the way he really saw her.

 

I'm sorry ladies, I really am. If you don't want to be this person, don't get into an affair with a married man. No, not all men are like this, but, if you do step into something with a married man, you have to expect that you're pictures will be shared at the bar, and, if the wife finds out, you'll be made out to be one step above a prostitute. It's sad, yes, but this is how men, for the most part, are when they are looking for something on the side.

[SeenNotHeard]

I don't doubt for a second that your husband felt immense pain after d-day. But I doubt it was because he was deeply in love with the AP; I think it's exactly what you said. He was terribly disappointed in himself, ashamed of what he did, horrified at what it did to you (the woman he actually does love) and terrified of losing you because he was after another woman for sex.

 

I just responded to another poster who said that their experience was not like what I laid out. And there are some exceptions. But, ladies, please, believe me. I know dozens of men who have something "on the side". Not one of those men is in love with their AP. Because, if they were, they'd never tell me about it, and, even more so, they'd never talk about them like they do in front of me and other men. Please, if you're going down this road believe me, if you're sleeping with a married man, he almost certainly considers you disposable at best, trash at worst. You should have seen the things my wife's AP said to her. Totally over the top expressions of love and caring, right out of a romance novel. If you read his words literally; you would have thought this guy was the most in love man you've ever met.

 

And then d-day comes. He drops my wife like she has the plague. And then he denigrates her to an absolutely ridiculous degree to his wife (she and I are in contact, which is how I know this). My wife pursued him for years, he had to quit his job because of her, she's a predator.. None of which was true; his wife didn't want to see the TXT messages because, I think she knew what the truth was but couldn't stand to face it (this was his 3rd affair that she knew of). So she called me up mad as a hornet about my "sl*t of a wife". I just let her believe it, she'd already made up her mind to R, and I'd offered the truth; she didn't want it. But my point is this; if you saw the things they said to one another, you'd think this man would walk through fire to get to my wife; nothing would keep him from her. And yet, when the chips are down, my wife was nothing to him; he roasted her to death to his wife and made her into a trashy wh*re in her eyes. And you know what? That is much closer to the way he really saw her.

 

I'm sorry ladies, I really am. If you don't want to be this person, don't get into an affair with a married man. No, not all men are like this, but, if you do step into something with a married man, you have to expect that you're pictures will be shared at the bar, and, if the wife finds out, you'll be made out to be one step above a prostitute. It's sad, yes, but this is how men, for the most part, are when they are looking for something on the side.

 

I see the points as you have laid them here OT. My perspective is not every MM spews words of love and neither does the OW. I guess I am somewhat a realist in that I didn't believe for a moment my AP loved me, he liked me, yes, but love? No way. Rightly or wrongly my empathy runs deep for those who have listened to the lines, believed them, and thought they were star crossed lovers.

[ShatteredLady]

Very fair, I know there are some exceptions. But if I was a WW (or a female AP) I would operate under the assumption that I gave rather than "he really loves me". I know all the men I talk to tell their AP's about their undying love. But people who love another person don't show the sexy chats/pics to a group of guys at the bar. People who love their AP's don't talk about how much they like specific sexual acts. So, I'm pretty sure that my friends talking about this aren't doing the "macho" thing, they really are with these women just for the sex. And I'm sure the women think they are there for the emotional connection. It's sad really when you think about it, my wife was far more sexual with her AP than she "really" is. And no, it's not because I've let myself go and it's not that it dropped off after marriage. She's just not a very sexual person and never has been. But she knew that's what her AP wanted, so she became the woman he wanted. And he did the same thing, knew my wife was starving for an emotional connection, and became what she wanted. Neither of these people were "real". In an affair, oftentimes, I think everyone is lying to everyone. BS's are being lied to at the same time the AP is being lied to. It's just an ugly circle of lies and deceit all the way around.

 

 

My husband is a passionate atheist who quoted scripture (after googling 'love scripture') to his OW. He loathes country music but quoted lyrics (after googling 'country love lyrics') to woo her. I have to agree that there is a huge amount of make believe in SOME (if not MANY) affairs.

 

I also believe that many MM use so many justifications (I'm not talking about exit affairs) to soothe their guilt & moral crisis that they place the bs in the gutter to the OW. I have no doubt that my H did start to believe the fantasy until he was hit with the reality of loosing me.

 

I can't argue with the statistical evidence that most MM throw the OW under the bus come d-day but I do believe emotions often become involved. I don't believe that the vast majority of men are that shallow...maybe I'm a completely hapless romantic & naive!!

 

I do know in person even serial cheats who (very occasionally) 'catch feelings'. I have to agree for a multitude of different reasons that women should protect their hearts & tell MM to get-stuffed right at the start. The probability of a happy ending are so very slim.

 

However, no matter what the % are it's not impossible for a MM to fall in love with a OW & no matter what you say an OW deep in the fog is going to believe that she is the statistical anomaly. It's human nature.

 

It often breaks my heart to read this forum. I HATE that my H was one of 'those' men. Sometimes I wonder if it would have been better if he did truly love her & left. At least all the agony would have meant something. OW & bs alike are going to hate your truth. We don't want to see a huge % of men in that light. I'm not gay & I don't want to be alone....what's the answer?

[Whoknew30]

Very fair, I know there are some exceptions. But if I was a WW (or a female AP) I would operate under the assumption that I gave rather than "he really loves me". I know all the men I talk to tell their AP's about their undying love. But people who love another person don't show the sexy chats/pics to a group of guys at the bar. People who love their AP's don't talk about how much they like specific sexual acts. So, I'm pretty sure that my friends talking about this aren't doing the "macho" thing, they really are with these women just for the sex. And I'm sure the women think they are there for the emotional connection. It's sad really when you think about it, my wife was far more sexual with her AP than she "really" is. And no, it's not because I've let myself go and it's not that it dropped off after marriage. She's just not a very sexual person and never has been. But she knew that's what her AP wanted, so she became the woman he wanted. And he did the same thing, knew my wife was starving for an emotional connection, and became what she wanted. Neither of these people were "real". In an affair, oftentimes, I think everyone is lying to everyone. BS's are being lied to at the same time the AP is being lied to. It's just an ugly circle of lies and deceit all the way around.

 

 

I come from a HUGE family that's predominantly men, they ALL cheat & their friends...since I've been a girl, no one has ever filtered what they said around me & now I'm the one everyone goes to bc I don't repeat what they tell me...on top of many of their male friends...& you're right to a point. The only girl's they're showing pics of are ones they don't care about (I've seen such pics) but every man I know that's had multiple A always has the one they end up caring about...that's the one the other men won't hear about at all...that's the one they only talk about to the closest woman in their life, that won't tell on them...in my circle that's me.

 

Also it depends why a man is having an A, if it's only based on ego, he doesn't care. If it's bc he really is unhappy in life (regardless the reason) it changes things tremendously.

[FoundMyStrength]

I'm sorry ladies, I really am. If you don't want to be this person, don't get into an affair with a married man. No, not all men are like this, but, if you do step into something with a married man, you have to expect that you're pictures will be shared at the bar, and, if the wife finds out, you'll be made out to be one step above a prostitute. It's sad, yes, but this is how men, for the most part, are when they are looking for something on the side.

 

This may be true, especially for some xMM. But my experience, and those of others on this board, points to something more complicated, at least for some men. I think my xMM genuinely and unexpectedly fell in love with me (we had a relatively brief, mostly EA). We had one instance of a PA that we both regretted immensely. I do believe if we had continued having an EA/PA, his feelings for me would have changed with time. I think it is understandably difficult to for a man to view a woman as an object of love if they continue to actively help you harm their wife. Instead of being the lovely person they fell in love with, you become tainted.

 

I think the sex thing muddles this even more, and brings out the usual just-below-the-surface tropes of madonna and wh*re. In an affair, the wife will always be the madonna, and the one who continues in a sexual affair will always be the wh*re in a man's mind. Which is why women get thrown under the bus in such an awful, hurtful way, no matter how complicated the man's feelings actually were. I honestly don't think it is always as simple as you make it -- but I do think that even men who view their OW fondly find it difficult to respect them if the OW continues with the affair.

[ShatteredLady]

I come from a HUGE family that's predominantly men, they ALL cheat & their friends...since I've been a girl, no one has ever filtered what they said around me & now I'm the one everyone goes to bc I don't repeat what they tell me...on top of many of their male friends...& you're right to a point. The only girl's they're showing pics of are ones they don't care about (I've seen such pics) but every man I know that's had multiple A always has the one they end up caring about...that's the one the other men won't hear about at all...that's the one they only talk about to the closest woman in their life, that won't tell on them...in my circle that's me.

 

Also it depends why a man is having an A, if it's only based on ego, he doesn't care. If it's bc he really is unhappy in life (regardless the reason) it changes things tremendously.

 

 

I couldn't agree more! Because I grew-up surrounded by men (actually the faithful type which is why I'm "hapless") messed-up men seem to gravitate to me as a friend.

 

I can't count the number of times I've watched men continue the facade of being an emotionless (except for his wife) sex-fiend around other men only to cry on my shoulder about a woman who started as a 'meaningless affair' but who he grew to really care about.

 

I know it doesn't often change the final outcome but I think people are so much more complex than we like to give them credit for. These forums are full of "The Script" & rules of action (be it OW/OM, waywards or bs) I think it often helps us process & lock-away the pain BUT I firmly believe that it's so very much more complex than we want it to be at the end of the day.

 

We are raised on the limited dimensions of Hollywood & TV. When were writhing in agony we want simple answers. I know for a fact that I'm so bloody complex & a mess of contradictions. I assume that most people are the same!

 

When I read that men aren't...men are all about the sex & money it's so tempting to believe it...maybe it's only all the men I've ever known who are different but I don't think so. I hope not!! Maybe I want to keep the faith so much that I'm blind to reality....

[lftbehind]

Very fair, I know there are some exceptions. But if I was a WW (or a female AP) I would operate under the assumption that I gave rather than "he really loves me". I know all the men I talk to tell their AP's about their undying love. But people who love another person don't show the sexy chats/pics to a group of guys at the bar. People who love their AP's don't talk about how much they like specific sexual acts. So, I'm pretty sure that my friends talking about this aren't doing the "macho" thing, they really are with these women just for the sex. And I'm sure the women think they are there for the emotional connection. It's sad really when you think about it, my wife was far more sexual with her AP than she "really" is. And no, it's not because I've let myself go and it's not that it dropped off after marriage. She's just not a very sexual person and never has been. But she knew that's what her AP wanted, so she became the woman he wanted. And he did the same thing, knew my wife was starving for an emotional connection, and became what she wanted. Neither of these people were "real". In an affair, oftentimes, I think everyone is lying to everyone. BS's are being lied to at the same time the AP is being lied to. It's just an ugly circle of lies and deceit all the way around.

 

So it sounds like you have a bias, since your wife cheated on you. You want to believe that lot of men will just want to use a woman for sex. It sounds like your wife just felt more sexual with her AP. Maybe he brought out that side in her that she wasn't feeling with you.

[Overtaxed]

I honestly think we're kind of in agreement, just saying it differently. Sure, some men fall madly in love with a woman (I'm one of them, so I can speak to it from personal experience). And sometimes that woman is someone other than their wife, which, in this thread, is what we're talking about.

 

And no, not all men are animals only out for sex; not by a long shot. However, a lot of men ARE that way, driven primary by their sexual urge rather than their emotional needs. And when you get into the group of men who are married and willing/looking for an affair, the ratio gets really skewed, most of those men are going to be looking for primarily sex, because, in most cases, their emotional needs are already met by their wives. And yes, if you know he's married and sleep with him anyway, you are going to be put into the "whore" box in his mind, no matter how much he wants to respect you, he'll always struggle because you were willing to do something so awful with him. If you're married as well, I don't think it's possible to dig out of that; men will happily sleep with married women, but wife them up after they D their husband to be with them? That's a shockingly rare man (I read the stat somewhere, and perhaps someone knows it better, but IIRC, it was something like 10% of affairs result in marriage - and this would include single guys sleeping with married women, so it's probably overstated for men leaving their wives to be with the AP. And of those that do, the D rate was really high (twice as likely to result in D, which, given a D rate of ~40-50%, seems a bit impossible to me). So, somewhere between 1-3 out of 100 people will leave their spouse for an AP and be happily every after married.

 

You want to play those odds? I sure don't!

 

 

 

Cheating Spouses - 6 Reasons Why Their Affair Won?t Last

https://affairadvice.wordpress.com/2012/12/09/do-affairs-end-up-in-successful-relationships-13/

[Overtaxed]

So it sounds like you have a bias, since your wife cheated on you. You want to believe that lot of men will just want to use a woman for sex. It sounds like your wife just felt more sexual with her AP. Maybe he brought out that side in her that she wasn't feeling with you.

 

Very possible. And I do have a bias, which I disclosed in my original post. However, this isn't as much about my wife's affair as it is about my relationship with other men who have had multiple affairs. Yes, a lot of men will use women just for sex. And a whole lot of men who are open to affairs will use women for sex and "fake" an emotional connection to keep them around. I have absolutely no doubt that both of those statements are true. And also no doubt that the statement "Some men fall deeply in love with their AP" is also true. But it's about odds/likelyhood, not the outliers. And the odds are very good that if you're a woman sleeping with a married man, he's there for the sex.

[ShatteredLady]

So it sounds like you have a bias, since your wife cheated on you. You want to believe that lot of men will just want to use a woman for sex. It sounds like your wife just felt more sexual with her AP. Maybe he brought out that side in her that she wasn't feeling with you.

 

 

I'm sorry but I can't agree with you. My real life experience tells me that a low desire person, a person who has ALWAYS been low desire, doesn't change once the dust settles.

 

I've read opinions here (from very few) that a serial cheat just hasn't met the 'right' partner, that a prude becomes a sexual dinamo with the 'right' person etc. I've simply never known this to be true.

 

At the end of the day we are who we are unless we do a LOT of work to change ourselves. There's no such thing as a knight in oh so shiny armor who's going to come along & 'fix' us. I've had friends who have chased that illusion only to find it's just that, an illusion.

 

Of course someone can build resentments & become miserable in their relationship. I think we underestimate how many people are so frightened of change that they're waiting for someone new & shiny to change them but there's a huge difference between getting back to your old self by ditching all the issues that have built-up & actually CHANGING because of another person.

 

That's why so many 2nd marriages end in divorce. You can't escape YOU. Generally people bring all the faults that broke the first marriage into the next one.

 

As always there must be exceptions to the rule but I've never met one.

[lftbehind]

Very possible. And I do have a bias, which I disclosed in my original post. However, this isn't as much about my wife's affair as it is about my relationship with other men who have had multiple affairs. Yes, a lot of men will use women just for sex. And a whole lot of men who are open to affairs will use women for sex and "fake" an emotional connection to keep them around. I have absolutely no doubt that both of those statements are true. And also no doubt that the statement "Some men fall deeply in love with their AP" is also true. But it's about odds/likelyhood, not the outliers. And the odds are very good that if you're a woman sleeping with a married man, he's there for the sex.

 

I think it's very tacky for men to be bragging about their affairs. I haven't heard any do that. I think a lot of men don't want for people to know that they are having one.

[lftbehind]

I'm sorry but I can't agree with you. My real life experience tells me that a low desire person, a person who has ALWAYS been low desire, doesn't change once the dust settles.

 

I've read opinions here (from very few) that a serial cheat just hasn't met the 'right' partner, that a prude becomes a sexual dinamo with the 'right' person etc. I've simply never known this to be true.

 

At the end of the day we are who we are unless we do a LOT of work to change ourselves. There's no such thing as a knight in oh so shiny armor who's going to come along & 'fix' us. I've had friends who have chased that illusion only to find it's just that, an illusion.

 

Of course someone can build resentments & become miserable in their relationship. I think we underestimate how many people are so frightened of change that they're waiting for someone new & shiny to change them but there's a huge difference between getting back to your old self by ditching all the issues that have built-up & actually CHANGING because of another person.

 

That's why so many 2nd marriages end in divorce. You can't escape YOU. Generally people bring all the faults that broke the first marriage into the next one.

 

As always there must be exceptions to the rule but I've never met one.

 

I don't think meeting a new person will turn us into something we're not. I think that a low desire can be because of boredom, resentments and lack of interest in the partner sometimes. Sometimes a new person will treat you better and make you more interested in sex. They can bring out another side of you that you have wanted to be able to express.

[Overtaxed]

I think it's very tacky for men to be bragging about their affairs. I haven't heard any do that. I think a lot of men don't want for people to know that they are having one.

 

I hear it often. And yes, it's terribly tacky, I agree with you completely. Even more so when it involves pictures (as it does in most of the cases).

[Overtaxed]

I'm sorry but I can't agree with you. My real life experience tells me that a low desire person, a person who has ALWAYS been low desire, doesn't change once the dust settles.

 

I've read opinions here (from very few) that a serial cheat just hasn't met the 'right' partner, that a prude becomes a sexual dinamo with the 'right' person etc. I've simply never known this to be true.

 

At the end of the day we are who we are unless we do a LOT of work to change ourselves. There's no such thing as a knight in oh so shiny armor who's going to come along & 'fix' us. I've had friends who have chased that illusion only to find it's just that, an illusion.

 

Of course someone can build resentments & become miserable in their relationship. I think we underestimate how many people are so frightened of change that they're waiting for someone new & shiny to change them but there's a huge difference between getting back to your old self by ditching all the issues that have built-up & actually CHANGING because of another person.

 

That's why so many 2nd marriages end in divorce. You can't escape YOU. Generally people bring all the faults that broke the first marriage into the next one.

 

As always there must be exceptions to the rule but I've never met one.

 

I give my wife credit, she did recognize this. The first few times she had sex with the AP, she thought it might be different. But by the end, she said "she" was right back where she started, doing it because he wanted to, not because she did.

[ShatteredLady]

My views are somewhat based on very honest conversations with friends who have divorced. I could quote the "right back where I started!" From many of them.

 

Sadly, the only divorced woman I know who's much happier & far more content is now single. She was just deeply unhappy for a very long time. Most women I know say all the right things in 'public' but after a bottle of wine & honest conversation it's a different story. Second marriages aren't much different than first...with the exception of history lost.

 

 

Note

We were a VERY close group of friends though. No 'shotgun' marriages. Long, deep bonds before break-up. Not saying their 2nd husband's are bad guys. They just lament what's lost after the dust settles & admit things like sex drive don't change.

I'm still with my first husband. Together since 21/22.

Edited February 13, 2017 by ShatteredLady

[lovely81]

I'm sorry but I can't agree with you. My real life experience tells me that a low desire person, a person who has ALWAYS been low desire, doesn't change once the dust settles.

 

I thought I was a low desire person because I was with someone who didn't turn me on. Got out, that changed. I also thought I liked certain music, food, art, all because I was with this one person. I think I was just too scared to leave him and find out who I really was.

[ShatteredLady]

I thought I was a low desire person because I was with someone who didn't turn me on. Got out, that changed. I also thought I liked certain music, food, art, all because I was with this one person. I think I was just too scared to leave him and find out who I really was.

 

 

I'm so sorry. That must have been awful. I'm so glad that you got-out & found yourself. Life is far too long to live like that! Never stop growing & NEVER let another person control you. Best wishes.

[Birdies]

Oh, I'm sure there are some. If you'd like to test your AP, just tell him "No more sex/physical stuff until you leave your wife". Most men will pull up stakes and move on to the next one before the dinner check comes. It sounds like your situation was different, and, yes, there are certainly those out there as well. But I have a large group of male friends and, because of the industry I'm in (high paying) a lot of them engage in affairs pretty regularly. NONE of them ever talk to me about "missing" an AP. They talk about the sex, and they miss certain things the AP did with them (sexual things). But they never say "she was an amazing person". Most men look at women who have affairs as "broken/dirty/damaged"; good for some fun in the bedroom, but without character and therefore, not worthy/deserving of their love. If you remember back to high school, think to the "easy girl" who was sleeping around. Guys all talked to her, because they thought they might "get some". But they also all talked about her, because they knew she wasn't relationship material or worthy of real love. In my experience, that's how most men view their AP's.

 

I know dozens of men who have something "on the side". Not one of those men is in love with their AP. Because, if they were, they'd never tell me about it, and, even more so, they'd never talk about them like they do in front of me and other men.

 

I would point out that you have a sample bias for your evidence.... 1) you work in a high-paying industry where lots of men have affairs, = sounds like your friends are kind of douchebags, so they're probably more likely to treat women this way than the normal guy 2) you say that anyone who DOES love their AP wouldn't talk to you about it in this way, = you only hear about affairs from the douchebags. Nonetheless, it's a helpful point of view, and I appreciate you sharing this inside look at douchey finance (or whatever) cheater guys.

 

I think that in general, you're right that all things being equal, a guy is more likely to be using a woman for sex and telling her what she wants to hear (even if he's doing so unconsciously rather than deliberately), than for it to be a case of star-crossed lovers.

Edited February 13, 2017 by Birdies

[DKT3]

^ I think this & what I have gone through is more the "normal" (going by my experiences) than reading all this "WS is disgusted" by their AP that as heard from BS...most people don't have long term A that their disgusted with or never cared for st one point...

 

Because you don't truly grasp it all.

 

It's not so much the AP as it is what the AP represents. By you embracing the idea that it's OK to have these glowing feelings and fond memories it actually shows a lack of empathy towards your husband. For him it's just a source of pain and displeasure.

 

Some of the WW's that see this as you are fresh out of infidelity or still holding out hope that it will still be something. You are years and years out.

[gettingstronger]

Because you don't truly grasp it all.

 

It's not so much the AP as it is what the AP represents. By you embracing the idea that it's OK to have these glowing feelings and fond memories it actually shows a lack of empathy towards your husband. For him it's just a source of pain and displeasure.

 

Some of the WW's that see this as you are fresh out of infidelity or still holding out hope that it will still be something. You are years and years out.

 

I agree, it's not really HER but who HE was at the time that brings the disgust. It's difficult to explain without sounding harsh, but my husband doesn't think of her as a person per se, but as a situation. She represents a time in his life he doesn't think fondly of, not because of her, but because of him. Maybe if/when he forgives himself, that will change. Who knows.

[PhillyLibertyBelle]

I'm sorry but I can't agree with you. My real life experience tells me that a low desire person, a person who has ALWAYS been low desire, doesn't change once the dust settles.

 

I've read opinions here (from very few) that a serial cheat just hasn't met the 'right' partner, that a prude becomes a sexual dinamo with the 'right' person etc. I've simply never known this to be true.

 

At the end of the day we are who we are unless we do a LOT of work to change ourselves. There's no such thing as a knight in oh so shiny armor who's going to come along & 'fix' us. I've had friends who have chased that illusion only to find it's just that, an illusion.

 

Of course someone can build resentments & become miserable in their relationship. I think we underestimate how many people are so frightened of change that they're waiting for someone new & shiny to change them but there's a huge difference between getting back to your old self by ditching all the issues that have built-up & actually CHANGING because of another person.

 

That's why so many 2nd marriages end in divorce. You can't escape YOU. Generally people bring all the faults that broke the first marriage into the next one.

 

As always there must be exceptions to the rule but I've never met one.

 

This is probably something you need to have experience in to really understand and in a post before you mentioned being with your WH from childhood, which may mean he's your only adult partner. I've been in 3 long term adult relationships and my libido has been different with each. Now that I have gone through menopause I have a high drive when in the years (5) leading up to it I did not.

[ShatteredLady]

No he's not my only relationship.

 

I've been thinking about this. I guess it's a very personal thing (isn't everything!). I chatted to a couple of my friends I'd discussed this with before & they both said that once the initial 'high' was over their drive has always been pretty much the same. They are both pretty low drive & its eventually become an issue in all of their relationships.

 

Being with the same person I can say that my desire ebbs & flows. I can be very high desire. Physical, medical issues have an effect but not a huge one. Emotional problems with our relationship tank my libido! I'm NOT a hysterical bonding lady really.

 

I know/have known a few serial cheats (men & women) & the partner they're with eventually makes no difference to their cheating. I don't really believe the old "once a cheat, always a cheat" UNLESS it's a serial cheat. I think it's a very different thing.