Online dating is so depressing

[NJ123]

Because you're not absorbing what people are saying to you...it makes me feel like the message needs to get more harsh for you to hear it.

 

And regarding the height thing, again as I said, every time you bring up an example of something that you think is unfair, I can match it...a good friend of mine has your opposite issue. She's 6 feet tall and weighs 250 lbs. She's always been that size, even in her early 20s. She eats healthy and exercises all the time, there really is nothing she can do to change her size. Do you think she has an easy time meeting men? No, she does not. She's extremely smart, successful, funny, kind, and one of the best people I know. She rarely complains about her reality even though it causes her a lot of pain. There are people in the world who don't have life so miraculously easy, you are not the only person out there who has a difficult time dating.

 

You make mountains out of molehills. That's all. I'll just keep my opinions to myself from now on. Best of luck NJ!

 

How am I making mountains out of molehills? How are the things I'm talking about minor issues? I get they're not life or death situations or anything, but being in a relationship is supposed to be a normal & natural part of life so I'd say it's a pretty big deal. Most people don't want to be alone, and the ones that do usually already had their fair share of relationships. It shouldn't be difficult yet due to the way society is everyone makes it difficult for others unless they either get really lucky, are extremely attractive to the opposite sex where they have unlimited options, or just have a natural ability with dating where they don't have many issues with it.

[normal person]

1. But it is the main reason if they wouldn't even give you a chance without it. If everything else was legit the same about you as a person & let's say you make 25 grand a year instead of 60 grand than they wouldn't date you specifically due to that. So yeah, I'd say it is the main reason or at the least way on top of the list.

 

Amongst other things. You could say the same thing about a guy who did have a nice job but didn't meet another one of her requirements. There are plenty of guys with decent jobs who have little to no luck. It's usually a requirement, but usually not the only one either. There are a lot of things someone might look for in a person, and in the scenario you describe, having a job might make the be the last "necessity" to check off.

 

I almost feel like when I do get a better job eventually that women are going to be out to get me in terms of wanting me more for my money instead of me as a person which scares me. I feel I'll get paranoid about it that they just want me because I make good money.

 

Unless you're making a good amount (like, $125k+), which is highly unlikely with just a bachelors degree, I wouldn't worry about it. You'll likely just have an average salary and no one will be digging for gold where they don't sense any.

 

2. But I don't get how a lot of people get into relationships like that due to superficialness. Like why do rich guys put up with getting with women that are clearly with them for their money? I'd just never understand that since deep down the guy has to know unless he's completely clueless that the woman is mainly with him for his resources & power & not for him as a person. I'd have more respect for myself than to let some woman use me for my money.

 

First of all, there are lots of people out there who make lots of money, and not all their relationships are predicated on that. Even if it's an element of it, it's usually not the whole story. And the men who do know that their relationships are "bought" in a sense probably are in that spot because they couldn't do well without a ton of money, so having a trophy wife in an emotionally diluted relationship is still better than the alternative. Again, it's way more complex than this usually.

 

 

4. And that's what I mean. It feels like the job is more important than you as a person. I just don't get that at all.

 

Maybe to some, but even for those with the bigger perspective, your job is a large part of you. It will impact your/her lifestyle and comfort, ability to feed yourselves, ability to provide for your kids, and raise them comfortably and safely, etc. Those are basic biological needs and those are more important than who you are as a person.

 

Example: Let's say a woman was broke and starving, but had two offers of marriage, one from another broke, starving man with whom she had a great emotional bond with, and one from a rich guy with tons of food whom she tolerates. Who do you think she's going to marry? An emotional bond isn't going to put food on her table or gas in her tank, and survival is a greater priority than love. A woman wanting a guy with money, power, or resources isn't always superficial. It's animalistic survival instincts in a modern paradigm. Also, consider that men often prioritize sexual relationships over emotional ones. This is why women like rich, powerful, strong men. They're more likely to survive and ensure survival of their offspring.

 

5. I just don't want to pay for these sites after seeing how much shallowness there is on these places. For instance why would I bother paying $50 a month or whatever it is for match.com when I'm disqualified right from the start from about 90% of the women on there because they deem me as too short or don't make good enough money for them. I'd literally be throwing my money away.

 

That's understandable. So don't do it, then. Plenty of them are free, by the way.

Edited September 17, 2016 by normal person

[NJ123]

Amongst other things. You could say the same thing about a guy who did have a nice job but didn't meet another one of her requirements. There are plenty of guys with decent jobs who have little to no luck. It's usually a requirement, but usually not the only one either. There are a lot of things someone might look for in a person, and in the scenario you describe, having a job might make the be the last "necessity" to check off.

 

 

 

Unless you're making a good amount (like, $125k+), which is highly unlikely with just a bachelors degree, I wouldn't worry about it. You'll likely just have an average salary and no one will be digging for gold where they don't sense any.

 

 

 

First of all, there are lots of people out there who make lots of money, and not all their relationships are predicated on that. Even if it's an element of it, it's usually not the whole story. And the men who do know that their relationships are "bought" in a sense probably are in that spot because they couldn't do well without a ton of money, so having a trophy wife in an emotionally diluted relationship is still better than the alternative. Again, it's way more complex than this usually.

 

 

 

 

Maybe to some, but even for those with the bigger perspective, your job is a large part of you. It will impact your/her lifestyle and comfort, ability to feed yourselves, ability to provide for your kids, and raise them comfortably and safely, etc. Those are basic biological needs and those are more important than who you are as a person.

 

Example: Let's say a woman was broke and starving, but had two offers of marriage, one from another broke, starving man with whom she had a great emotional bond with, and one from a rich guy with tons of food whom she tolerates. Who do you think she's going to marry? An emotional bond isn't going to put food on her table or gas in her tank, and survival is a greater priority than love. A woman wanting a guy with money, power, or resources isn't always superficial. It's animalistic survival instincts in a modern paradigm. Also, consider that men often prioritize sexual relationships over emotional ones. This is why women like rich, powerful, strong men. They're more likely to survive and ensure survival of their offspring.

 

 

 

That's understandable. So don't do it, then. Plenty of them are free, by the way.

 

Unfortunately the guys with decent jobs that have no luck are either not attractive enough for the women they're going after or they just have terrible personalities. A guy that's making 75k a year for instance should have no problem getting a woman these days unless it's a problem with his personality or he's deemed as unattractive or his own standards are extremely high.

 

I'd be perfectly fine making 60-70k for instance. I don't even spend a lot of money anyways so I'd save up quite a bit within a few years time span on that type of salary. I just don't want a woman to be with me mainly or a huge part of the reason being my job though is what gets to me.

 

And I'd say that's fair to say depending on what the woman does herself. For instance if the guy is making a few hundred grand a year & she either doesn't work or has a low paying job than odds are she's with him mainly for his money or at least it's a huge part of the reason. Would that same woman have went with him on a 50k salary compared to a 250k salary? If she makes big money herself than that's fair enough.

 

Basically it would depend on what she does herself for a living. If I was making good money my standards would go up in terms of how much she makes herself unfortunately only because I'd be worried she's using me otherwise & not because I'd think I'm better than someone that would make a lot less than me.

 

And I'm not going to do it since it's not worth spending money knowing that the vast majority of them I couldn't even message knowing I don't fit their criteria in terms of height and/or income.

[Blanco]

I think you're putting the cart before the horse as it relates to worrying too much about a woman using you for money. Even if you eventually make a high salary, that's likely going to be years from now. In other words, don't exhaust yourself worrying about hypotheticals.

[NJ123]

I think you're putting the cart before the horse as it relates to worrying too much about a woman using you for money. Even if you eventually make a high salary, that's likely going to be years from now. In other words, don't exhaust yourself worrying about hypotheticals.

 

True, but it's hard not to when I see how so many women require it as part of their basic standards these days. If I'm going to make a lot of money, I'm not going to let some woman be a part of that while that's a big part of the reason they're with me when I had to work my ass off to get there. I'd have more respect for myself than to let someone waltz into my life just because they view me as a good option because I make good money.

[NJ123]

Basically, you have high standards you refuse to compromise on, and it bothers you that women will not compromise on their standards to date you.

 

Well, what exactly do I have to compromise on then? I want to know specifically but I assume you're implying that I'd have to settle for someone I'm not attracted to which would make dating completely pointless to begin with. And the standards with the women in particular on that site disqualify me for something I have no complete control over to begin with.

Edited September 17, 2016 by NJ123

[Blanco]

True, but it's hard not to when I see how so many women require it as part of their basic standards these days. If I'm going to make a lot of money, I'm not going to let some woman be a part of that while that's a big part of the reason they're with me when I had to work my ass off to get there. I'd have more respect for myself than to let someone waltz into my life just because they view me as a good option because I make good money.

 

It's commonly accepted that financial security from a partner is more important to the average woman than it is to the average man.

 

It's not a catch-all situation, but the average guy is going to usually value a woman's appearance more than her job security; the average woman is going to usually value a man's financial security more than his appearance. That doesn't mean the man doesn't care at all about what the woman does for work, and it doesn't mean that the woman doesn't care at all what the man looks like.

[Blanco]

And I'd say that's fair to say depending on what the woman does herself. For instance if the guy is making a few hundred grand a year & she either doesn't work or has a low paying job than odds are she's with him mainly for his money or at least it's a huge part of the reason. Would that same woman have went with him on a 50k salary compared to a 250k salary? If she makes big money herself than that's fair enough.

 

Unless the woman is a sociopath, it becomes obvious pretty quickly if she's just in it for the financial and lifestyle perks.

 

You need to accept the reality that a man making a high salary is almost never going to hurt his chances with most women. It may not be why the woman wants to be with him, but it'd likely be a total lie if that woman said those circumstances didn't hurt the guy's appeal.

 

Obviously there are women out there who chase the all mighty dollar in relationships, but it's extreme to suggest that a man making a high salary should dismiss any woman who's making significantly less than him.

[NJ123]

Ugly women cannot help but be ugly, either. Yet, you are upset that pretty women you are attracted to will not lower their standards and date someone they are not attracted to; you.

 

If I had to rate myself on looks I'd give myself a 7 & been told I'm cute/handsome multiple times by women. I get a decent amount of matches on Tinder, but that app is based on just looks & hookups way more than relationships. And the women on Tinder don't get to see how tall I am or what I do for work right away. And a lot of the women on there also use it just for ego boosting & don't respond a lot of the time. What women are getting turned off by with me I'm highly assuming is due to my height and/or what I do for work. Basically with OLD like OKCupid, they just see my height & my job & automatically disqualify me because they know they can easily find someone taller & with a better job due to all the options at their disposal.

[NJ123]

Unless the woman is a sociopath, it becomes obvious pretty quickly if she's just in it for the financial and lifestyle perks.

 

You need to accept the reality that a man making a high salary is almost never going to hurt his chances with most women. It may not be why the woman wants to be with him, but it'd likely be a total lie if that woman said those circumstances didn't hurt the guy's appeal.

 

Obviously there are women out there who chase the all mighty dollar in relationships, but it's extreme to suggest that a man making a high salary should dismiss any woman who's making significantly less than him.

 

For me personally, I'd probably dismiss them because I'd want to make sure she's with me because she genuinely likes me & not the main reason being how much I make. My standards would go up to where I am at in my life. Right now I wouldn't care how much a woman makes because I don't make much myself so it would be hypocritical of me to ask that out of someone. So if I somehow met someone now where she doesn't make much, but I all of a sudden got a great job of course I wouldn't leave her. But if I was still single and started making good money, my standards would go up in terms of what her job is.

[Blanco]

So it's wrong for women to dismiss you because you don't make enough money, but it would be OK for you to dismiss a woman because she doesn't make enough money? Got it.

[NJ123]

So it's wrong for women to dismiss you because you don't make enough money, but it would be OK for you to dismiss a woman because she doesn't make enough money? Got it.

 

I just knew you were going to say that but my reasoning is WAY different than what a woman's is. A lot of women view guys that don't make a lot of money as unattractive in general & not ambitious. But my reasoning is due to not getting screwed over by someone that doesn't even genuinely like me or find me attractive. Why would I want to be with someone that's with me mainly for my money?

[JuneJulySeptember]

It quite possibly is your height turning women off. I have an Asian friend who is 5'5 and he has a hard time dating because of it.

 

I bolded the important part. I have seen women on OLD that I would consider a 7, but that was before I could see how fat she was. Immediately that 7 became a 4 or 5. Women probably see you the same way. Good looking, but just too short. And with that against you, it's gonna be much harder to score with the hotter ladies. Have to find some that don't mind your height, and I have seen a few of them.

 

Your post seems extreme but I think it's spot on.

 

I think women view guys who are short and not the race they desire just as guys view overweight women. It's just a lot more PC to say that women don't want short guys than to say guys don't want overweight women. Which is to say, you are 'done' at first sight.

 

Meh, it is what it is.

 

I think OLD is a tremendous tool for that very reason. There were times in life that I got to know a woman well and became attached to her, attracted to her, and fell for her.

 

The hard truth of the matter is she probably crossed me off from day one.

 

Again, it is what it is. Learn to live with what you got.

[NJ123]

It quite possibly is your height turning women off. I have an Asian friend who is 5'5 and he has a hard time dating because of it.

 

I bolded the important part. I have seen women on OLD that I would consider a 7, but that was before I could see how fat she was. Immediately that 7 became a 4 or 5. Women probably see you the same way. Good looking, but just too short. And with that against you, it's gonna be much harder to score with the hotter ladies. Have to find some that don't mind your height, and I have seen a few of them.

 

Yeah, I'd say that's probably accurate & the most realistic answer. It's just the difference is women that are overweight have a chance to make themselves more desirable with trying to lose weight while a guy that's short will forever be undesirable to a huge amount of women no matter what lifestyle changes they make in any way.

[Blanco]

I just knew you were going to say that but my reasoning is WAY different than what a woman's is. A lot of women view guys that don't make a lot of money as unattractive in general & not ambitious. But my reasoning is due to not getting screwed over by someone that doesn't even genuinely like me or find me attractive. Why would I want to be with someone that's with me mainly for my money?

 

No one is saying that you should be with someone that's mainly in it for your (non-existent) money. What I am saying is that it's stupid to write off women, who might otherwise be compatible with you, just because they don't earn enough money.

 

Gold-diggers aren't tough to decipher. Unless the guy is a moron, he should be able to weed out these types of people before they have the opportunity to screw him over.

 

You seem prone to generalizations. That's a dicey way to navigate through life, because you end up pigeon-holing people you don't even know. Like I said, a man's high income is almost never going to be a strike against him when it comes to appealing to the average woman, just like a woman's beauty is almost never going to be a strike against her when it comes to appealing to the average man. That doesn't mean that the woman is only really in it for the money or the guy is only really in it because she's hot.

 

Your inexperience with women, relationships, and dating in general has made you way too analytical about hypothetical situations.

[NJ123]

A woman generally knows pretty much immediately whether or not she will have sex with you. A guy has to make a good first impression, then try not to screw things up.

 

 

 

You admit you cannot change these things. Once you know that much, it is time to stop dwelling on it. Focus on the things you can change. Letting this bother you will just put a big chip on your shoulder, making you even more unattractive to women.

 

Yeah I get what you mean. The only time I ever even think about this height thing is when I'm on online dating or when I see other people talk about it. I just have to find someone that doesn't care about height.

[NJ123]

No one is saying that you should be with someone that's mainly in it for your (non-existent) money. What I am saying is that it's stupid to write off women, who might otherwise be compatible with you, just because they don't earn enough money.

 

Gold-diggers aren't tough to decipher. Unless the guy is a moron, he should be able to weed out these types of people before they have the opportunity to screw him over.

 

You seem prone to generalizations. That's a dicey way to navigate through life, because you end up pigeon-holing people you don't even know. Like I said, a man's high income is almost never going to be a strike against him when it comes to appealing to the average woman, just like a woman's beauty is almost never going to be a strike against her when it comes to appealing to the average man. That doesn't mean that the woman is only really in it for the money or the guy is only really in it because she's hot.

 

Your inexperience with women, relationships, and dating in general has made you way too analytical about hypothetical situations.

 

I suppose so but I'd just need to know for sure that they genuinely like me though. I've heard a lot of horror stories of guys getting screwed over in terms of the women only being with the guys because they were a safe bet for her in terms of her being secure while likely never giving them the time of day in the past or cheating on him since she"s not that into him but just wants the security.

[nymphetgrown]

I just knew you were going to say that but my reasoning is WAY different than what a woman's is. A lot of women view guys that don't make a lot of money as unattractive in general & not ambitious. But my reasoning is due to not getting screwed over by someone that doesn't even genuinely like me or find me attractive. Why would I want to be with someone that's with me mainly for my money?

 

How do you know?

 

If you can't tell whether she wants you for love or money, why date anyone who makes less than you do?

 

For the right person -- practical, thrifty, genuinely warm and loving, and yes, a healthy weight for height or only a little bit over -- I would find a way to make us work on 25K. And I do mean US dollars. Get a flat instead of a house, find small jobs I can do with my own health issues, enjoy the same inexpensive fun I do now but share it. I'd say "only run one car" but I have got dirt-cheap insurance and the car's paid off, so it's silly not to keep her on the road!

 

Being 4'11", I can date short guys, but I won't date the ones who are bitter about it. That bitterness makes you more unattractive than any lack of education. You've got to love who you are. You've got to find who you are, really -- what you love doing, what you'd like to bring into another person's life. Who are you underneath the fear of dying alone?

 

I'm still answering these questions myself, but I feel like I'm a lot of the way to knowing. It's scary and awesome at the same time.

[NewLeaf512]

What do you mean exactly? If I were to guess you think that the women I find attractive are the ones that most guys would find attractive?

 

You gave a pretty reasonable list, but, I doubt women put their alcohol consumption frequency on their profile, the reason they are divorced and some other highly personal things.

 

What must be giving you the go or no go sign in the first instance are how well they match with your looks requirements.

 

There seems to be some shame in saying it.

 

I don't do OLD but if I did here would be one of mine: no comb overs. I wouldn't care if a man was bald or had hair, just please no combover!

[NewLeaf512]

I suppose so but I'd just need to know for sure that they genuinely like me though. I've heard a lot of horror stories of guys getting screwed over in terms of the women only being with the guys because they were a safe bet for her in terms of her being secure while likely never giving them the time of day in the past or cheating on him since she"s not that into him but just wants the security.

 

It's a very slim chance indeed that a woman will want to / will try / will bother with trying to screw over a 30 something who lives with his parents, has a very low salary, and no real prospects of becoming a high earner because he has no degree and seems to be quite inert and lacking in ambition. The women who go for you will be sincere.

[NewLeaf512]

Unless the woman is a sociopath, it becomes obvious pretty quickly if she's just in it for the financial and lifestyle perks.

 

You need to accept the reality that a man making a high salary is almost never going to hurt his chances with most women. It may not be why the woman wants to be with him, but it'd likely be a total lie if that woman said those circumstances didn't hurt the guy's appeal.

 

Obviously there are women out there who chase the all mighty dollar in relationships, but it's extreme to suggest that a man making a high salary should dismiss any woman who's making significantly less than him.

 

It's a true fact that women on average earn .62 for every £1 a man makes in the same role (as you kind of point out )

 

What is you are a supremely affluent woman? OP that's not a bowl of cherries either. Nigh on impossible to date

[NJ123]

It's a very slim chance indeed that a woman will want to / will try / will bother with trying to screw over a 30 something who lives with his parents, has a very low salary, and no real prospects of becoming a high earner because he has no degree and seems to be quite inert and lacking in ambition. The women who go for you will be sincere.

 

I'm figuring out what I want to take up. I need to decide by December/January when classes start again for next semester. I know for myself more than anything else that I have to get a better job. If I'm going to school & women still hold it against me that I'm working a low paying job than so be it.

[NJ123]

You gave a pretty reasonable list, but, I doubt women put their alcohol consumption frequency on their profile, the reason they are divorced and some other highly personal things.

 

What must be giving you the go or no go sign in the first instance are how well they match with your looks requirements.

 

There seems to be some shame in saying it.

 

I don't do OLD but if I did here would be one of mine: no comb overs. I wouldn't care if a man was bald or had hair, just please no combover!

 

There's an in general option in terms of drinking where they state whether they don't drink, drink socially or drink often. I suppose they can lie about it where drinking socially still means getting wasted a lot. And maybe it's my looks requirement possibly but I can't help what I'm attracted to.

[lolablue17]

I'm pretty sure if I lowered my standards in terms of looks a lot I'd be able to get dates way more easily. But what's the point since I would be wasting my time & hers when I have no interest in her. I'm a bit picky maybe when it comes to looks but I'm attracted to what I'm attracted to so there's nothing I can do about it unless I settle which I won't do.

 

You just gave us a good demonstration of "How to not get girls". You don't understand why can't you get dates, but the answer is in your own attitude.

 

You say you don't want a girl that you are not attracted to. Fair enough. But you judge attraction by photos? Is this a fetish of yours to be attracted to inanimate objects? A woman is not a photo. A woman's sex appeal is her complexities. Her smile, her heart, her body language, her emotional intelligence, her wisdom...

 

In order to know if a woman attracts you, you must meet her in person. And may I add, you may want to meet her more than once, because sometimes people are frozen and stressed in the first 1-2 dates.

 

I'm an expert in photos. I can advice a woman how to look 10 times better in photos. And I know for a fact that many women look much better in reality. So for few days you talk in this thread about how hard it is to have dates while you judge them only by photos?

 

A lot of girls\women in my life i wasn't attracted to in the beginning, and became attracted to them only after knowing them for quite a while (at work for example).

 

Do you want dates? adopt a hobby that women like, and go to seminars and activities around that hobby. OLD is not for you.

Edited September 17, 2016 by lolablue17

[Kamille]

I'm not 100% up to date on the thread, but a few comments from the first few pages. I realize the woman you were chatting with has moved on. Still:

 

 

Thanks. I'm still talking with that woman from last night. I don't know what will happen but she seems interested. The only thing is I'm not sure how attracted to her I am. I don't think she's unattractive at all just I don't know if I find her attractive enough in terms of wanting a relationship with her. I know that sounds really shallow but looks are as important to me as personality/chemistry would be. I suppose I would have to meet her to see.

 

 

You're right. You can't tell from an On-line profile whether you'll truly be attracted to someone. Meeting in person is the only way to figure this out.

 

But even then, woah buddy, slow your horses! You were, at that point in the thread, corresponding with this woman for less than 24 hours. Why worry about a relationship so soon? You were getting way ahead of yourself. Your job, in the first few weeks of dating, is getting to know someone, staying open to what they have to offer and having fun with it. IN PERSON. You never know. Someone might surprise you once you meet. Which brings me to my next comment:

 

 

Well, in an update that woman just randomly stopped talking to me. I think it was due to me not having a better job since when I mentioned the whole career thing & wanting to go back to get my bachelor's degree she just seemed turned off than I never heard from her again since late last night. Oh well though.

 

Did you ask her out at any point? My guess is she realized you weren't interested enough to ask her out so she moved on to other pastures.

 

I usually stop chatting with guys if they don't take a hint and ask me out. I'm not looking for pen pals. There's only so much attraction you can build through text. The magic (or lack thereof) happens in person. So... Did you ask her out? If not, all your bellyaching about being destined to be forever alone is pure conjecture.