Girlfriend finally admitted she has some secrets...

[No_Go]

Thanks Jen, this honestly gives me peace in mind; seems like my deal breakers will be "non-expungable".

 

My ex claimed that his most serious crime (counterfeiting?) was expunged because it he was under age and it was his first one. I did multiple checks on him afterwards and although I discovered ~20 misdemeanors (mainly alcohol/drugs-related), I really couldn't found this major crime of him... But it makes me paranoid just thinking about it up to date...

 

Nothing terribly serious. (e.g. there will be no deals from a judge to have murder expunged for "being good" for a year or two after. That's usually what those deals are for - after a single 'poor judgment' offense, you show that you're no longer going to head down the road of shoplifting or whatever for x period of time and if you do your record for that offense is expunged.)

 

Misdemeanors like public intoxication aren't terribly serious to begin with, so that'd be entirely believable.

[Gary S]

To have a happy and healthy relationship that can last, you need a partner with integrity, that means being honest.

 

However, it's not your partner's responsibility to reveal their whole life to you, their whole autobiography.....there is not time for that anyway.......she only has a limited time with you, so choosing to share the positive rather than the negative is the best thing to do....what she's doing is right and smart.......why share negative stuff that can't be changed and could turn you off? That stuff is for a counselor's ears only. You should be happy you have a smart girlfriend, and not throwing her under the bus like you are doing.

 

Openness and honestly are two different things, that's why we have two different words. Your girlfriend is right....perhaps you should listen to her.

[deadelvis]

To have a happy and healthy relationship that can last, you need a partner with integrity, that means being honest.

 

However, it's not your partner's responsibility to reveal their whole life to you, their whole autobiography.....there is not time for that anyway.......she only has a limited time with you, so choosing to share the positive rather than the negative is the best thing to do....what she's doing is right and smart.......why share negative stuff that can't be changed and could turn you off? That stuff is for a counselor's ears only. You should be happy you have a smart girlfriend, and not throwing her under the bus like you are doing.

 

Openness and honestly are two different things, that's why we have two different words. Your girlfriend is right....perhaps you should listen to her.

 

What is the difference between openness and honesty?

Google defines honesty as:

the quality of being free of deceit and untruthfulness; sincerity.

 

While the definition of openness uses lots of phrases like:

 

Affording unobstructed entrance

Lacking effective regulation

Accessible to all

 

I'd say she was definitely "open" in the past. As for being honest, well... is it honest to keep secrets? Not really.

[Satu]

Sounds great as a fortune cookie... but ummm... When you lied about how I got the dent on my car after you borrowed it... I let it slide. But when you fail to mention being a sex worker and having sex with hundreds of guys to pay for your heroin addiction... that's not really in the same ballbark.

 

I'm not saying she ever borrowed my car and put a dent in it. And I doubt she ever did heroin. A couple of our close friends overdosed on heroin and we've talked about it a lot. I don't think she was ever a junky... but pretty much everything else is up for speculation.

Here's another fortune cookie for you:

 

She doesn't have to tell you *anything* she doesn't want to tell you.

 

Can you grasp that, or do believe that your compulsion to relentlessly interrogate her about her past overrides her right to privacy?

Edited September 4, 2015 by Satu

[kismetkismet]

You don't trust her. Whether she deserves your trust or not isn't really the issue because it doesn't seem like you ever will. She's not going to tell you the rest of her past, and you are going to obsess about it until she does (forever). It's not even about what/who is right or wrong here... You're clearly unhappy and there doesn't seem to be any way of solving that. I would move on.

[jen1447]

Thanks Jen, this honestly gives me peace in mind; seems like my deal breakers will be "non-expungable".

 

My ex claimed that his most serious crime (counterfeiting?) was expunged because it he was under age and it was his first one. I did multiple checks on him afterwards and although I discovered ~20 misdemeanors (mainly alcohol/drugs-related), I really couldn't found this major crime of him... But it makes me paranoid just thinking about it up to date...

 

Was it specifically counterfeiting (printing fake money) or sth like uttering and publishing? Some crimes have scary sounding names but aren't necessarily that bad, like uttering and publishing can be writing a bad check.

 

Good job getting the misdemeanors btw, they're usually not as easily accessible as felonies. (Everyone loves to hear about felonies, but not many are interested in misdemeanors. )

[deadelvis]

Here's another fortune cookie for you:

 

She doesn't have to tell you *anything* she doesn't want to tell you.

 

Can you grasp that, or do believe that your compulsion to relentlessly interrogate her about her past overrides her right to privacy?

 

Surely you can admit that "none of your business" is not the guiding principle of a healthy long term relationship.

 

I only became obsessed with her past because I knew in my gut she was lying. And since that intuition was right, that doesn't make it a compulsion. That makes it common sense.

[Rejected Rosebud]

Sounds great as a fortune cookie... but ummm... When you lied about how I got the dent on my car after you borrowed it... I let it slide. But when you fail to mention being a sex worker and having sex with hundreds of guys to pay for your heroin addiction... that's not really in the same ballbark.

.

Who ON EARTH are YOU to judge her?? She is not even your girlfriend anymore (thank God). She has no compunction to reveal any more things about her past or herself to you so you can trash her further. You have zero business with this girl. Her life is none of your business AT ALL. Leave her alone!!! You don't even like or respect her!

[Satu]

You don't trust her. Whether she deserves your trust or not isn't really the issue because it doesn't seem like you ever will. She's not going to tell you the rest of her past, and you are going to obsess about it until she does (forever). It's not even about what/who is right or wrong here... You're clearly unhappy and there doesn't seem to be any way of solving that. I would move on.

He's painted himself into a corner.

 

He can't accept her as who she is, and he can't end it.

 

QED.

[deadelvis]

He's painted himself into a corner.

 

He can't accept her as who she is, and he can't end it.

 

QED.

 

No, I can't accept not knowing who she is. The difference is subtle but important. If she told me the truth I could then decide if I can accept her based on the truth. But you can't accept someone for "who they are" if they aren't giving you an accurate portrayal of themself.

[Satu]

Snip

 

I only became obsessed with her past because I knew in my gut she was lying. And since that intuition was right, that doesn't make it a compulsion. That makes it common sense.

No. That's not it.

You are behaving the way you are, because of *who* you are.

[William]

Folks, since this has all been hashed over in the past, we won't revisit the specifics of the secrets, rather focus on the relationship, potentially reconciling based on the first sentence of the thread, and this content:

 

"I'm deeply confused about this. I have three options

 

1. Accept that I will never know the truth about her past and be happy with our life together in the present. "ask me no questions and I'll tell you now lies"

 

2. Demand the truth. Risk being lied to again, or at very best have her tell me things about her past that will forever ruin my image of her.

 

3. Walk away."

 

So, we'll consider all arguments about, and editorial comments regarding, past secrets to be resolved and focus on the relationship moving forward, wherever it goes. Also, please read back up the page for responses from the thread starter as they are published by moderation.

 

Lastly, postings are subject to this announcement, which you'll find at the top of the forum this topic is posted in. Thank you!

Edited September 4, 2015 by William

[elaine567]

You are here expecting someone to say "Don't believe her, she has no dark secrets".

 

I don't really know what deadelvis wants to tell the truth.

My thoughts are that deadelvis got together with this woman with the dark secrets, as he wanted a thrill, he wanted this freaky freak who was going to lead him into dark places, he himself couldn't imagine ever existed.

The more daring, the more dangerous, the more dubious, the better, taking things to the absolute limit.

BUT she had had enough of the wild life, she wanted love and vanilla, domesticity and normality with deadelvis. #1

Deadelvis was gutted, she was no freaky freak, just a mentally ill (bipolar, anxiety and BPD [/url]) woman on medication and in therapy #235, with a history of being abused (raped twice #39 ) a promiscuous past #39, including being paid for sex #206 and a desire to forget. #235

So I guess he feeds his obsession with what she MAY HAVE done, what she WAS capable of as a younger woman, and his imagination runs wild.

He gets his kicks I guess from this apparently never-ending discovery of her "secrets", as opposed to the everyday reality.

[jen1447]

Surely you can admit that "none of your business" is not the guiding principle of a healthy long term relationship.

 

I only became obsessed with her past because I knew in my gut she was lying. And since that intuition was right, that doesn't make it a compulsion. That makes it common sense.

 

Not really. The significance of the thing you're concerned (obsessing?) about determines the legitimacy of your concern. e.g. if you obsessively worried that she was using sugar in her coffee instead of sweet-n-low and then one day DISCOVERED IT WAS TRUE - ALL TRUE!!!, that wouldn't magically transform concern from a weird compulsion into common sense.

 

You can debate how significant her sexual past is to you, but you can't strip her of her autonomy, GF or not. If she doesn't want to share, she doesn't have to.

[deadelvis]

Snip

 

No. That's not it.

You are behaving the way you are, because of *who* you are.

 

I never had this with past partners. In the past it was a 5 minute conversation, usually laying in bed after sex, when we tell each other about our sexual history and share things like numbers, types of encounters etc. Anything "big" (drugs, crime, promiscuity etc.) I lay out on the on the table before things even reach the point of sex or a relationship. I've had women walk away because of my past. I could have lied or kept things secret from my past, but I would never want to start a relationship based on a deception.

[Satu]

In my opinion, relentlessly badgering someone for personal information which they clearly don't want to give you, is mental abuse.

[deadelvis]

In my opinion, relentlessly badgering someone for personal information which they clearly don't want to give you, is mental abuse.

 

In my opinion, keeping secrets or omitting things from your past is the same as lying and lying to your partner is worse then "badgering someone for personal information" so in that respect you could say she's been mentally abusing me with her constant omission of truth.

[deadelvis]

you have this car in front of you...its everything you could hope for in a car....its mileage is a bit high for its years but it runs well.....corners like a dream...purrs its way through traffic......and its yours now.....

 

then

 

 

you look at the dash board while you are driving it you think you hear a tick behind it ...a clunk you cant really explain......its probably the engine......it could be cheaper oil has been used...or maybe you put in leaded instead of unleaded......and suddenly it doesnt seem so perfect for you anymore....you get out....you take a hammer and you start hammering away at that perceived tic......instead of maybe taking it to a mechanic you ask around on car forums how to fix that tic...and you keep getting different answers to every thread you start......still doesnt explain the tic.....

 

then

 

 

you start to have an epiphany about the car.......mayeb its nto the car at all....maybe its because fo the driver there is a problem that driver is me...why couldnt i be happy with what i had ...why did i have to pull apart the car fo my dreams when that tic really didnt change anything about me driving the car, why couldnt i be satisfied i wont know every story that car has had...every drive....every long distance it has run...every corner...every little secret of the drivers who sat there in the seat before me...and why the hell am i asking people who dont even know what my car is or where my car has been or how it handles the wet.........

 

then you think

 

maybe its time i visit a true mechanic and work on my driving skills.....

 

and down the track a ways on these car forums..... we hear of a beautiful car with an experienced driver who got over an obsessive need to find that tic......the car apparently still corners like a dream...best wishes..deb....

 

Cars have Carfax. Sex offenders have Megan's Law. There's not "John's Law" website where you can look up your girlfriend and see if she was a hooker.

 

To use your analogy... what if you bought a used car and then found out it had been in major accidents and when you bought it you thought the salvage title was due to a minor collision? Every idiot knows you should never buy a car with a salvage title. But when someone passes off a beautiful car for being "well maintained" and then you find out it was totaled, rebuilt and sold as a "reliable car" you have every right to be upset.

[Versacehottie]

Privacy is a fundamental human right.

 

Yes, I agree. Just because you are dating her doesn't mean you have a right to the information in her past. *** you are frustrating.

[deadelvis]

you have this car in front of you...its everything you could hope for in a car....its mileage is a bit high for its years but it runs well.....corners like a dream...purrs its way through traffic......and its yours now.....

 

then

 

 

you look at the dash board while you are driving it you think you hear a tick behind it ...a clunk you cant really explain......its probably the engine......it could be cheaper oil has been used...or maybe you put in leaded instead of unleaded......and suddenly it doesnt seem so perfect for you anymore....you get out....you take a hammer and you start hammering away at that perceived tic......instead of maybe taking it to a mechanic you ask around on car forums how to fix that tic...and you keep getting different answers to every thread you start......still doesnt explain the tic.....

 

then

 

 

you start to have an epiphany about the car.......mayeb its nto the car at all....maybe its because fo the driver there is a problem that driver is me...why couldnt i be happy with what i had ...why did i have to pull apart the car fo my dreams when that tic really didnt change anything about me driving the car, why couldnt i be satisfied i wont know every story that car has had...every drive....every long distance it has run...every corner...every little secret of the drivers who sat there in the seat before me...and why the hell am i asking people who dont even know what my car is or where my car has been or how it handles the wet.........

 

then you think

 

maybe its time i visit a true mechanic and work on my driving skills.....

 

and down the track a ways on these car forums..... we hear of a beautiful car with an experienced driver who got over an obsessive need to find that tic......the car apparently still corners like a dream...best wishes..deb....

 

Cars have Carfax. Sex offenders have Megan's Law. There's no "John's Law" website where you can look up your girlfriend and see if she was a hooker.

 

To use your analogy... what if you bought a used car and then found out it had been in major accidents, but when you bought it you thought the salvage title was due to a minor collision? Every idiot knows you should never buy a car with a salvage title. But when someone passes off a beautiful car as being "well maintained" and then you find out it was totaled, rebuilt and sold as a "reliable car" you have every right to be upset.

[Versacehottie]

Sounds great as a fortune cookie... but ummm... When you lied about how I got the dent on my car after you borrowed it... I let it slide. But when you fail to mention being a sex worker and having sex with hundreds of guys to pay for your heroin addiction... that's not really in the same ballbark.

 

I'm not saying she ever borrowed my car and put a dent in it. And I doubt she ever did heroin. A couple of our close friends overdosed on heroin and we've talked about it a lot. I don't think she was ever a junky... but pretty much everything else is up for speculation.

 

I don't know why you are even speculating that she WASN'T a hooker. I think everyone on here who has followed your threads knows she has turned tricks. It's a logical conclusion. Duh!

[deadelvis]

Everyone thinks I'm unreasonable for wanting my partner to be honest about her sexual history... I hope those same people end up in a relationship with someone who continually lies about his past and then you wake up one day to find out he was a hit-man but he didn't consider his past to be "any of your business". I'm not sure what delusional world you live in but that's not a normal way to live your life.

[deadelvis]

I don't know why you are even speculating that she WASN'T a hooker. I think everyone on here who has followed your threads knows she has turned tricks. It's a logical conclusion. Duh!

 

Right but like I said. Turning one trick is a bit different than being a streetwalker. One trick is acceptable. 100's of John's is not ok in my book.

[Versacehottie]

I personally believe that I have a right to know, and if she told me, then I could decide if I am willing to continue a relationship. I don't think it's okay to build a relationship with someone while keeping "dark secrets" about yourself locked away. If she came forward and told me the truth I would be well within my rights to decide to continue or terminate the relationship based on that information. If I was a convicted rapist or something, I would think she deserves to know that information and make the choice herself if she wants to continue the relationship. I think saying "everyone is entitled to keep secrets about their past" is not really normal or healthy.

 

Where does that line get drawn. Is there a list somewhere of things you have to disclose like homicide and sex crimes... but everything else is off the table? What about attempted homicide, or sex crimes you never got convicted of? It's such a slippery slope.

 

A lot of people are going to say "anything that doesn't have an impact on your relationship should stay in the past" but that's also a tricky statement. If we're at the bar together and a group of guys walk in who she did a gangbang with and never mentioned... well, that's not exactly "in the past" when it's sitting across the bar from me laughing in my face.

 

Ugh, you are unreal. I don't agree with you about the privacy and right to know issue. However, taking your example, you already have enough information to know it's in that ballpark of past slutty behavior. There is no reason to know more details. Trust me, if they feel and think that way (other people) about your dating choices, you can't control it. She is already in the slut zone with her past behavior. You either deal with it or you don't. People are gonna talk.

[losangelena]

Maybe she has $100,000 of student loan debt that she'll be paying off 'til she's 80—ha! Her secret is boring AND awful.

 

Serious question, though:

 

When it comes to her past, I don't think you're ever going to feel satisfied with what she tells you. When she reveals her secrets, they'll either be too big for you to handle, or they're not going to sound heinous enough, and you're not going to believe her, and the badgering will continue.

 

But at what point do YOU say, "enough is enough?" Where are your own relationship boundaries? When do you say, "I have to have trust in my relationships, and here there is no trust, so I am moving on?"

 

Besides, what REAL point is there in knowing her past? You know her NOW, in the present. I would try judging her more on the kind of person she is TODAY, and not five, 10, 15 years ago (however old she is). If you think she's a liar, ask yourself if you want to be in a relationship with someone who lies—and if not then say goodbye.