Why does he retreat to his "cave" like this?!

[GreenEyes1005]

So the worst possible scenario happened yesterday and I had to see him and interact with him at work. Each of us was professional and fine, but within an hour and a half he was sending me texts asking why I gave his personal number out (which I did not do). I don't get his angle!

 

On another note, I got asked out on a date tonight, so there's that!

[CarrieT]

Ignore, ignore, ignore.

 

You do not owe him any explanation.

[katiegrl]

So the worst possible scenario happened yesterday and I had to see him and interact with him at work. Each of us was professional and fine, but within an hour and a half he was sending me texts asking why I gave his personal number out (which I did not do). I don't get his angle!

 

On another note, I got asked out on a date tonight, so there's that!

 

Who does he think you gave his personal number to, and hy did he think that? Did you ask? Did he explain?

 

GE, this is what's happening. Even though HE is the one who disappeared... HE is still conflicted and he is pissed at YOU, because in his distorted mind, you are the one who is causing him to be so conflicted!

 

He is also pissed at you because you have not chased him down, are happy, going on with your life, and are moving on!

 

He would have loved nothing more than to continue this push/pull bullshyt.... with you chasing and him running. Good for you for not falling for that crap...

 

So he makes up a story about you giving someone his number, as an excuse to contact you and express his pissed off feelings ....without having to tell you the REAL reason he is pissed off! As explained above.

 

It is all bullshyt, and is SO typical of classic commitment phobe behavior. His behavior here is textbook! It is uncanny how textbook it is. Textbook commitment phobe all the way!

 

Agree with Carrie, just ignore..... but please know you are the one who has "won" this battle...which is kinda of what it is with commitment phobes ....an emotional battle. A tug of war. Fight or flight.

 

Changing subjects ...have fun on your date tonight!!!! :bunny:

Edited August 30, 2015 by katiegrl

[GreenEyes1005]

Who does he think you gave his personal number to, and hy did he think that? Did you ask? Did he explain?

 

GE, this is what's happening. Even though HE is the one who disappeared... HE is still conflicted and he is pissed at YOU, because in his distorted mind, you are the one who is causing him to be so conflicted!

 

He is also pissed at you because you have not chased him down, are happy, going on with your life, and are moving on!

 

He would have loved nothing more than to continue this push/pull bullshyt.... with you chasing and him running. Good for you for not falling for that crap...

 

So he makes up a story about you giving someone his number, as an excuse to contact you and express his pissed off feelings ....without having to tell you the REAL reason he is pissed off! As explained above.

 

It is all bullshyt, and is SO typical of classic commitment phobe behavior. His behavior here is textbook! It is uncanny how textbook it is. Textbook commitment phobe all the way!

 

Changing subjects ...have fun on your date tonight!!!! :bunny:

 

No, I didn't ask why he thought that or who he thought I gave it to or any of that. I didn't do it so I responded with "What? No I did not. You should know better." He responded with "ok" and that was it. It was ridiculous!

 

Katiegrl I love your ability to analyze this man lol. And your information helps me understand things better so it doesn't suck as much. What exactly is he "conflicted" about? And if you can, please elaborate on his "textbook" behavior. I'm not very skilled on commitment phobic men's tendencies or why they do what they do, but it's interesting, and as I said it helps to understand. Am I supposed to expect him to pop up in the future or do they ever get tired of going after the same person for extended periods?

 

The date starts in t minus 30 minutes!! Eeeeee!

[katiegrl]

GE, my bf and I are on our way out too.....but I will try to respond in more detail tomorrow.

 

There are a couple of books I recommend reading:

 

Men Who Can't Love (how to recognize a commitment phobic man), and

 

He's Scared, She's Scared (understanding hidden fears that sabotage relationships).

 

Both are available on Amazon in paperback. NY Times bestsellers when first published.

 

Also, if you could meet my brother, not to date, but to be friends with, he is a huge commitmentphobe!

 

A lot of what I know comes from him, and from the above books.

 

My bf was (is) also a bit of a commitment phobe and so am I !! He was not as bad as your ex though, at least not as far as I know. He is 43 now, he may have been when he was younger though.

 

He has done a lot of internal work on himself and understands his tendencies to subconsciously push people away when they get close though, he has really evolved, as have I.

 

The book "He's Scared, She's Scared" is on our coffee table and we both refer to it a lot, even though we live together ....believe it or not. But that's another thread!

 

Ciao for now, and again have fun tonight! :bunny:

Edited August 30, 2015 by katiegrl

[katiegrl]

I will answer this though.

 

He is *conflicted* about his feelings for you ... while at the same time, the nearly paralyzing anxiety he feels once he gets into a relationship.

 

That "boxed in" feeling, emotionally suffocated, loss of freedom, responsibilities, etc.

 

At first, he enjoys it, it is what he wanted after all, but once in, and often times, just as the RL is about to move to the next level (three months)....it overwhelms him to the point he needs to run, often with no explanation, just like your ex did. (He IS your ex at this point, right?)

 

Even the argument HE initiated before he *took flight* is typical!

Edited August 30, 2015 by katiegrl

[GreenEyes1005]

I will answer this though.

 

He is *conflicted* about his feelings for you ... while at the same time, the nearly paralyzing anxiety he feels once he gets into a relationship.

 

That "boxed in" feeling, emotionally suffocated, loss of freedom, responsibilities, etc.

 

At first, he enjoys it, it is what he wanted after all, but once in, and often times, just as the RL is about to move to the next level (three months)....it overwhelms him to the point he needs to run, often with no explanation, just like your ex did. (He IS your ex at this point, right?)

 

Even the argument HE initiated before he *took flight* is typical!

 

 

Hope you and your man had a fun night out Katiegrl! My date wasn't anything extraordinary, but it was nice to get out and about with a nice guy.

 

I looked up both of those books this morning and will be checking them out! I also found an article online about commitment phobic men that seems awfully familiar. :/

 

It seems as if M (the guy I was involved with) likes/liked me, but his fears of commitment as a whole outweigh that. There has been no formal break up, but we are most definitely broken up as far as I'm concerned.

 

I'm looking forward to more of your analyses!

[katiegrl]

Hope you and your man had a fun night out Katiegrl! My date wasn't anything extraordinary, but it was nice to get out and about with a nice guy.

 

I looked up both of those books this morning and will be checking them out! I also found an article online about commitment phobic men that seems awfully familiar. :/

 

It seems as if M (the guy I was involved with) likes/liked me, but his fears of commitment as a whole outweigh that. There has been no formal break up, but we are most definitely broken up as far as I'm concerned.

 

I'm looking forward to more of your analyses!

 

I am glad you checked out the books!

 

The first one "Men Who Can't Love" is a quick, fun read, you will definitely identify with many of the stories presented in there. It took me maybe 2-3 hour to read, tops, but super eye-opening!

 

Happy reading!

[GreenEyes1005]

Okay Katiegrl... I've been reading up on this stuff and it IS ringing very true. That being said, this is an incredibly awkward situation. Since Friday there has been zero communication between he and I (unsurprisingly).

 

Today (less than an hour ago), he CALLED me to discuss a work issue. Last week he completely bypassed me and went to my boss, which seemed blatantly like he was avoiding me. But yet today he returned to calling me.

 

WHAT THE HECK?! And WHY?! This is so awkward!

[Gaeta]

Okay Katiegrl... I've been reading up on this stuff and it IS ringing very true. That being said, this is an incredibly awkward situation. Since Friday there has been zero communication between he and I (unsurprisingly).

 

Today (less than an hour ago), he CALLED me to discuss a work issue. Last week he completely bypassed me and went to my boss, which seemed blatantly like he was avoiding me. But yet today he returned to calling me.

 

WHAT THE HECK?! And WHY?! This is so awkward!

 

It looks very simple to me.

 

Last week he was still very raw that's why he didn't deal with you. Now things have calm down (for him) and he's ok with dealing with you at work.

 

Life goes on, it doesn't mean he wants to rekindle your relationship

[Redhead14]

I will answer this though.

 

He is *conflicted* about his feelings for you ... while at the same time, the nearly paralyzing anxiety he feels once he gets into a relationship.

 

That "boxed in" feeling, emotionally suffocated, loss of freedom, responsibilities, etc.

 

At first, he enjoys it, it is what he wanted after all, but once in, and often times, just as the RL is about to move to the next level (three months)....it overwhelms him to the point he needs to run, often with no explanation, just like your ex did. (He IS your ex at this point, right?)

 

Even the argument HE initiated before he *took flight* is typical!

 

This is a hallmark trait of a man with a fear of intimacy. Usually, men with a fear of intimacy are actually in a catch-22. They want and need an emotional connection, will attempt it many times but they sabotage the relationships by pulling away often when emotional intimacy begins and those relationships end. he feels hurt and abandoned. So, now each time he attempts another relationship he is afraid of being abandoned. In between those relationships, he's enjoying freedom and space and no anxiety until he just plain gets lonely again and the cycle repeats itself.

 

This doesn't start in adulthood, however. It starts in childhood as a result of poor parental bonding or some trauma or abuse. It is likely that every relationship this man ever had from the very first one, ended because of this behavior. So, it's really not his fault. He probably doesn't even understand why he does it and therefore, he can never fix it.

[GreenEyes1005]

It looks very simple to me.

 

Last week he was still very raw that's why he didn't deal with you. Now things have calm down (for him) and he's ok with dealing with you at work.

 

Life goes on, it doesn't mean he wants to rekindle your relationship

 

 

 

I personally wouldn't want to rekindle our relationship at this point either, but I feel like he's messing with me still. Maybe he isn't, but he could've gone to my boss, my work cell, and he chose to call my personal number. Not only that, but when he called I was on the other line and he asked who I was talking to... As if that's his business anymore. Ugh.

 

My secretary also called to say that he tried to call up to the office for me, and she told him I would call him back. Then he called me. Maybe it's completely legit but it feels like a mindf*ck.

[GreenEyes1005]

This is a hallmark trait of a man with a fear of intimacy. Usually, men with a fear of intimacy are actually in a catch-22. They want and need an emotional connection, will attempt it many times but they sabotage the relationships by pulling away often when emotional intimacy begins and those relationships end. he feels hurt and abandoned. So, now each time he attempts another relationship he is afraid of being abandoned. In between those relationships, he's enjoying freedom and space and no anxiety until he just plain gets lonely again and the cycle repeats itself.

 

This doesn't start in adulthood, however. It starts in childhood as a result of poor parental bonding or some trauma or abuse. It is likely that every relationship this man ever had from the very first one, ended because of this behavior. So, it's really not his fault. He probably doesn't even understand why he does it and therefore, he can never fix it.

 

After reading up on this stuff, I agree with everything you're saying. He's referred to his parents' marriage as a "bad marriage" before, and it resulted in divorce after he was in high school so I'm sure he was witness to every bad aspect of marriage they had. He's not a big fan of his mom these days either. He will speak to her but doesn't call to catch up or anything and she lives close.

 

I guess he's just a ruined man. He's so amazing in so many ways, but he's never going to be happy at this rate.

[katiegrl]

I personally wouldn't want to rekindle our relationship at this point either, but I feel like he's messing with me still. Maybe he isn't, but he could've gone to my boss, my work cell, and he chose to call my personal number. Not only that, but when he called I was on the other line and he asked who I was talking to... As if that's his business anymore. Ugh.

 

My secretary also called to say that he tried to call up to the office for me, and she told him I would call him back. Then he called me. Maybe it's completely legit but it feels like a mindf*ck.

 

Your intuition is correct, it IS a complete mindf*ck. Again, classic commitment phobic.

 

 

Are you reading "Men Who Can't Love"? It's all right in there, in black and white.

 

 

He's trying to mess with you for sure...it's part and parcel of his conflict (within himself).

 

 

He wants you....but he doesn't at the same time... because (in his distorted view of the world) you represent commitment and THAT is something he CANNOT do. It throws him into a complete panic....which is why he disappeared without a word like he did three weeks ago. BUT he STILL has feelings...hence the conflict!

 

 

Compare it to what claustrophobics feel....but in this case...it's an emotional claustrophobia....

 

 

Don't even try to figure it out...it makes NO sense but NOTHING makes sense with these type of guys.

 

 

It's ALL right there in the book!!

 

 

Don't let him mess with you GE. Just ignore him.... PLEASE.

 

 

Don't let him even GET to you.... he's not worth it.

Edited September 1, 2015 by katiegrl

[Redhead14]

After reading up on this stuff, I agree with everything you're saying. He's referred to his parents' marriage as a "bad marriage" before, and it resulted in divorce after he was in high school so I'm sure he was witness to every bad aspect of marriage they had. He's not a big fan of his mom these days either. He will speak to her but doesn't call to catch up or anything and she lives close.

 

I guess he's just a ruined man. He's so amazing in so many ways, but he's never going to be happy at this rate.

 

He isn't messing with you intentionally. It is unlikely that he is even aware of why he does what he does and its just automatic. These men are not necessarily bad people. They just don't have the capacity to fully give or enjoy tru intimacy. It's very sad really. And, its not their fault. Poor attachment in childhood does that to them. If his history is compounded by poor relationship models, trauma or abuse, he's doomed in that area.

[Oregon_Dude]

Red: please stop saying it's not his "fault". We ALL have capacity to change our "learned" behaviors. The guy runs away from any sort of perceived problem. My ex is the same. Yes, it's their fault. They act like kids. And we have the right to be angry about that.

 

But GE, there's no point in analyzing the behavior, b/c it doesn't make sense for people like you and me. He's just not a good partner. Period.

[anna121]

Don't take a call from him again on your cellphone again. Make him contact you through work routes only.

 

If you must speak to him, pretend you have another urgent matter and see if you can shift to email (if that's normal for your workplace). CC someone on your reply (again, in a way that looks legit).

 

Even better, if he tries to contact you again on a work matter, see if you can shift the reply to someone else. Maybe call in a favour or something.

[katiegrl]

He isn't messing with you intentionally. It is unlikely that he is even aware of why he does what he does and its just automatic. These men are not necessarily bad people. They just don't have the capacity to fully give or enjoy tru intimacy. It's very sad really. And, its not their fault. Poor attachment in childhood does that to them. If his history is compounded by poor relationship models, trauma or abuse, he's doomed in that area.

 

I beg to differ. He most definitely IS messing with her intentionally.

 

 

He is attempting to elicit a REACTION... and GE IS reacting.... only HE doesn't know about it because she is venting HERE and not to him.

 

 

But yes he is very aware of what he is doing...

 

 

GE, whatever you do... DO NOT show him that he is getting to you. That is what HE wants!

 

 

Right now he's going crazy because you are NOT reacting (at least not to him). So you can expect that he will amp it up until you DO react.

 

 

He's looking for a fight GE...remember what I said (what the book says) about "fight or flight"?

 

 

Well first he took flight (disappeared) and now he's itching for a fight.

 

 

Well not really a fight...but some sort of response from you. NOT because he wants to get back together.... but I do believe he is starting to miss you...and wants SOME sort of response and interaction.

 

 

Continue to NOT give him one....try to ignore him if you can.

 

 

You need to move on from this.....and the longer you focus on HIM and his crazy behavior....the more "stuck" you will be and the harder it will be to truly move on....

Edited September 1, 2015 by katiegrl

[Redhead14]

Red: please stop saying it's not his "fault". We ALL have capacity to change our "learned" behaviors. The guy runs away from any sort of perceived problem. My ex is the same. Yes, it's their fault. They act like kids. And we have the right to be angry about that.

 

But GE, there's no point in analyzing the behavior, b/c it doesn't make sense for people like you and me. He's just not a good partner. Period.

 

Nope. You and I have had proper upbringing and healthy emotional attachments since childhood and have the ability to understand what is or is not acceptable behavior and to change those things that need to change.

A person who has grown up like that and who hasn't been 'enlightned'

through counseling and subsequent self awareness cannot be held

accountable. If, however, they have been counseled and educated, they

then become responsible for at least attemting to control the behavior. Do

you hold a person who has been sexually abused and the subsequent

psychological

damage that causes responsible for it or do you blame the offender?

 

These men do not push people away as a conscious act. It happens

unconsciously. They dont know why they need to do it, they become

overwhelmed with anxiety is all they really know. They may be aware that

they do it because the women will react, but they don't usually understand

what triggers it.

 

But, you're right, it doesnt matter because they cannot be good partners and this one is no good for the op.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Redhead14

[GreenEyes1005]

I beg to differ. He most definitely IS messing with her intentionally.

 

 

He is attempting to elicit a REACTION... and GE IS reacting.... only HE doesn't know about it because she is venting HERE and not to him.

 

 

But yes he is very aware of what he is doing...

 

 

GE, whatever you do... DO NOT show him that he is getting to you. That is what HE wants!

 

 

Right now he's going crazy because you are NOT reacting (at least not to him). So you can expect that he will amp it up until you DO react.

 

 

He's looking for a fight GE...remember what I said (what the book says) about "fight or flight"?

 

 

Well first he took flight (disappeared) and now he's itching for a fight.

 

 

Well not really a fight...but some sort of response from you. NOT because he wants to get back together.... but I do believe he is starting to miss you...and wants SOME sort of response and interaction.

 

 

Continue to NOT give him one....try to ignore him if you can.

 

 

You need to move on from this.....and the longer you focus on HIM and his crazy behavior....the more "stuck" you will be and the harder it will be to truly move on....

 

Well at least I'm not alone in thinking this feels like a mindf*ck. I spoke to him when he called (about work) as I said. I told him I'd get him more info on the issue at hand and get back to him. I would've called him after my day was almost done, but three hours later he called AGAIN.

 

These calls ARE about work, but the things that make it seem like a mindf*ck aside from the entire situation occurring are that he mentioned non-work stuff multiple times. First he asked who I was on the phone with, then later he mentioned that he was taking the afternoon off. I said I'd just leave a message on his work voicemail, but he insisted I call him on his personal phone instead. And then later when he called again he said he was at home working on projects. Then when I called him back after his second phone call, he told me he was back at work and would call me back.

 

His location is not relevant, so why even go there? I understand that he's confused and wanting to elicit some kind of reaction, but this seems like a lot of overkill. That being said, I have been calm and haven't commented on any of his little comments. This is work-related stuff and I'm the only rep in the office this week so I can't pawn it off, otherwise I would try.

 

Sigh. I care about him still but this is getting ridiculous and starting to actually p*ss me off.

[katiegrl]

Well at least I'm not alone in thinking this feels like a mindf*ck. I spoke to him when he called (about work) as I said. I told him I'd get him more info on the issue at hand and get back to him. I would've called him after my day was almost done, but three hours later he called AGAIN.

 

These calls ARE about work, but the things that make it seem like a mindf*ck aside from the entire situation occurring are that he mentioned non-work stuff multiple times. First he asked who I was on the phone with, then later he mentioned that he was taking the afternoon off. I said I'd just leave a message on his work voicemail, but he insisted I call him on his personal phone instead. And then later when he called again he said he was at home working on projects. Then when I called him back after his second phone call, he told me he was back at work and would call me back.

 

His location is not relevant, so why even go there? I understand that he's confused and wanting to elicit some kind of reaction, but this seems like a lot of overkill. That being said, I have been calm and haven't commented on any of his little comments. This is work-related stuff and I'm the only rep in the office this week so I can't pawn it off, otherwise I would try.

 

Sigh. I care about him still but this is getting ridiculous and starting to actually p*ss me off.

 

 

THIS is precisely what he wants GE. I KNOW it sounds crazy....but that's why he is doing this. He WANTS to piss you off so you REACT. Maybe get mad at him.... and then everything comes pouring out.

 

 

"Why did you just take off with no word"!!!? "Why are you trying to mess with me NOW"!! "What's going on with you"!!!!

 

 

HE disappeared without a word but you, my dear, did a fabulous job of "flipping the script," by not contacting him....NOT reacting to the insanity.

 

 

Like I said, no doubt he was expecting you to chase him down, but you didn't....you LEFT HIM ALONE. Good job!

 

 

Now HE's the one going crazy! Ha....serves him right really. Maybe next time (not with you because YOU are not going back there) he will think twice about just disappearing without a word.

 

 

What a way to end a blossoming relationship. Disappearing the way he did was just cruel.... and I have zero sympathy.

 

 

Anyway....let HIM deal with his own conflicting emotions....NOT your problem anymore.

Edited September 2, 2015 by katiegrl