Why does he retreat to his "cave" like this?!

[katiegrl]

And when you do finally get the attention from His Royal Highness that you so desperately desire, be sure to lay down on the ground so he can wipe his shoes on your back.

 

I guess some people think being completely disrespected - then blatantly IGNORED after that disrespect - is all a part of being a woman.

 

What a crock of manure.

 

I agree with you. His behavior is deplorable and unacceptable. Period. You are right on with everything you wrote.

 

 

My experience (with my current) was in the beginning of our relationship (now five+ years), sometimes I would not hear from him for a couple of days tops, no more than that.

 

 

To me that was no biggee. And it never happened on the weekends, maybe like a Monday and Tuesday, would hear from him Wednesday.

 

 

Again, IMO no biggee....I was busy too. With friends, work, etc. I didn't stress about it.

 

 

But this is just unacceptable. His snapping at her, no response to her card, disappearing over the weekend....now going on what, five days?

 

 

Deplorable, unacceptable.

Edited August 17, 2015 by katiegrl

[GreenEyes1005]

You keep referring to the fact he "chased you for over a year" as if that's supposed to make some sort of difference in how he behaves once he's in a relationship with you.

 

 

It doesn't, it makes no difference whether he chased you for a year or ten years. In fact, if you want to attach any relevance to it, it's that his chasing you for a year indicates he enjoys THE CHASE, and now that he's actually in a relationship with you, after the honeymoon period, he feels differently.

 

 

But nevermind that, the ONLY thing that matters now is that he has disappeared. And his disappearance has NOTHING to do with your showing up at his office unexpectedly, or your replying to his snarky comment with your own snarky comment, etc.

 

 

He has disappeared because he feels boxed in, suffocated and mostly likely wants OUT.

 

 

He snapped at you on Thursday because you invaded his space and he felt emotionally suffocated by that....and that may have been his breaking point. So he snapped.

 

 

I realize you've done it before and he was receptive, but that before he began to feel boxed in, etc.

 

 

Please stop assuming he has disappeared because of your tiff, that was just a "symptom" of the much larger "disease".....that being he feels emotionally stifled, boxed in and wants out. At least for right now.

 

 

My guess is he much preferred chasing you because while he was chasing you, you were a challenge, there was no relationship, no chance of feeling emotionally suffocated, no threat to his freedom, etc.

 

 

I think he's been feeling this for awhile, but never shared with you. He compensated by telling you (and himself) that you were the best thing ever, etc. Very typical of men with commitment issues.

 

 

Then it all came crashing down on him....and he needs space. So he's disappeared.

 

 

Maybe someday you will understand this. I hope so.

 

 

I keep referring to the "chasing for over a year" thing because most of my guy friends who know about this have said they're in disbelief that a man would chase someone that long only to flake out in the end.

 

Your commitment-phobe theory makes sense, I'm not saying it doesn't and I'm also not in denial over it. Clearly he needs space and isn't wanting to be in contact or he would be, which supports him feeling boxed in emotionally. I wish he would've been up front about that instead of snapping and disappearing though.

 

It's inevitable that I'll see him again or hear from him since our companies work together, so I don't want to say anything b*tchy or anything. I guess I just need to assume he's ending things without saying anything and get him out of my head.

[Sweet Workaholic]

I personally failed in my marriage - no, not cheating, just wasn't a good partner. So perhaps I shouldn't speak. But I have several friends in very happy marriages of decades. All of them have had moments as bad or worse than this. Humans are flawed, and all of us are unkind sometimes. I think he's being unkind and disrespectful, but i wouldn't kick him to the curb yet. When he returns, does he apologize & want to do better? Can he be kinder in the future? Can he grow & change? That's what I'd want to know.

 

Is he a commitment phobe? Maybe. If so, that'll become clear soon.

 

I'm not saying it's definitely going to be fine. I'm just not ready to call it over yet.

[Gaeta]

I keep referring to the "chasing for over a year" thing because most of my guy friends who know about this have said they're in disbelief that a man would chase someone that long only to flake out in the end.

 

Your commitment-phobe theory makes sense, I'm not saying it doesn't and I'm also not in denial over it. Clearly he needs space and isn't wanting to be in contact or he would be, which supports him feeling boxed in emotionally. I wish he would've been up front about that instead of snapping and disappearing though.

 

It's inevitable that I'll see him again or hear from him since our companies work together, so I don't want to say anything b*tchy or anything. I guess I just need to assume he's ending things without saying anything and get him out of my head.

 

First. The fact he chased you for 1 year means nothing. When a man chases a woman he has a fantasy image of her and how it would be with her. After 5 months dating you he's not on that mode anymore. He knows the real you, he knows your flaws and tics, the fantasy image of you is gone. That is why a lot of relationship don't make it to 6 months. Once that fantasy image has dissipated and you're left with the real person in front of you that's when you 1) end the relationship 2) take it to the next level.

 

If you are considering this man for a long term relationship. The kind you get married to and have children with, I warn you seriously this is not the kind of partner you'll be able to rely on.

 

Like I said in my other post. If he has not called then contact him (No text) and tell him you need to talk and you do it in person.

[bcnguy]

To the OP... I gotta admit the first thing that crossed my mind after reading your post was PTSD.

 

I mean, while it's true we guys generally need more space (esp. introverts), I think that a week NC is just too much. Not to mention all the rest you described. Of course many other things could explain all this behavior, but I find it abusive nonetheless.

 

Best of Luck.

[katiegrl]

To the OP... I gotta admit the first thing that crossed my mind after reading your post was PTSD.

 

I mean, while it's true we guys generally need more space (esp. introverts), I think that a week NC is just too much. Not to mention all the rest you described. Of course many other things could explain all this behavior, but I find it abusive nonetheless.

 

Best of Luck.

 

PTSD?

 

What the hell would him suffering from post traumatic stress disorder have to do with him being an insensitive douche and disappearing?

 

I fail to see the correlation.

 

And what in any of the OP's posts suggest he experienced some sort of past traumatic event that would cause PTSD?

 

Sorry, makes no sense.

 

And to GreenEyes - I disagree with Gaeta that you should contact him. Right now he does not wish to talk to you, obviously.... therefore he won't be receptive.

 

If you want to talk, wait for him to contact you, then talk.

 

If he never calls again, so be it. Move on.

Edited August 18, 2015 by katiegrl

[bcnguy]

PTSD?

 

What the hell would him suffering from post traumatic stress disorder have to do with him being an insensitive douche and disappearing?

 

I fail to see the correlation.

 

And what in any of the OP's posts indicate that he experienced some sort of a traumatic event that would cause PTSD?

 

Sorry, makes no sense.

Her description of his behavior reminds me a lot to it. I have quite an experience on that unfortunately.

 

I just said that was my first reaction and I haven't read anything that dismisses it cos we know nothing about him or his past and it is just another possibility to me.

 

Anyway, I forgot to say she should ask him directly what worries him so much.

[katiegrl]

Her description of his behavior reminds me a lot to it. I have quite an experience on that unfortunately.

 

I just said that was my first reaction and I haven't read anything that dismisses it cos we know nothing about him or his past and it is just another possibility to me.

 

Anyway, I forgot to say she should ask him directly what worries him so much.

 

How so? In what way?

 

Can you clarify?

 

Truth is, it could be anything. Her description of his behavior suggests TO ME he has commitment issues...and I explained why I feel that way.

 

To someone else who has experience with Borderline Personality Disorder, they might think it's that. Etc. Etc.

 

I have worked with those who suffer from PTSD, and based in my experience, I see no correlation.

 

But if you do, your entitled to that opinion. We can agree to disagree.

Edited August 18, 2015 by katiegrl

[elaine567]

Yes, I get what others are saying re man caves, commitmentphobes, jerks, faders etc. And all completely suggestions completely plausible.

 

Two things I also thought about.

One - his family are here visiting, have you ever met his family?

Could it be he has been getting ear-ache or instructions from them to dump you, and he has now listened and the manufactured argument over work, was his chance to fade and he took it?

Families can exert great influence, or they can just provide enough support for someone to actually DO something about a situation.

Two - he was mightily upset about you showing up to his work unexpectedly, and that needs looked at.

A "normal" man would just say "Babe, I'm sorry I am completely snowed under here and I need to finish this tonight. I'll text/call when I am free."

But for some reason he didn't want you there and showed you that in no uncertain terms , and maybe I have been on LS too long, but a co-worker affair could explain a lot, the pissy attitude to you showing up suddenly at his work, and the fade.

Or he had some other love interest due to appear to see him there, or hiding in a cupboard even, and he had to get rid of you pretty quickly out that door.

[bcnguy]

Ok my bad I thought I was answering to this thread...

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/543546-why-does-he-always-need-space

 

I am sorry OP, both tabs in my browser mentioned "caves" and I got all confused.

 

If an admin could delete my previous posts I would appreciate it.

[Gaeta]

 

 

And to GreenEyes - I disagree with Gaeta that you should contact him. Right now he does not wish to talk to you, obviously.... therefore he won't be receptive.

 

I am for her to contact him because she's in an emotional turmoil and it needs to end. By giving him his <space> she is putting his needs in front of hers. She needs closure on what is going on. They have been dating for 5 months, not 5 dates. She deserves some respect and an explanation. He's a man or he's a boy? If it were me at this point I would drag him out of his cave by the hair (figure of speech). I would go see him and tell him if it's the kind of man he wants to be than it's over.

[katiegrl]

I am for her to contact him because she's in an emotional turmoil and it needs to end. By giving him his <space> she is putting his needs in front of hers. She needs closure on what is going on. They have been dating for 5 months, not 5 dates. She deserves some respect and an explanation. He's a man or he's a boy? If it were me at this point I would drag him out of his cave by the hair (figure of speech). I would go see him and tell him if it's the kind of man he wants to be than it's over.

 

I hear ya ... but if he's not ready to talk, which he doesn't appear to be otherwise he would be calling, I highly doubt she's gonna get any closure.

 

She might get ignored ..... or her head bitten off ....or some assinine excuse that makes no sense anyway, making her feel WORSE than she feels now.

 

And I for one, would not want her feeling worse than she does already.

 

Waiting for HIM to contact her is better, because if he's the one to make contact, clearly he's ready to talk and will be more receptive and open to what she has to say.

 

And she can then get her closure. Patience is her friend here IMO.

 

In the meantime, she should consider it over, and take steps to move on..

 

Again, my opinion.

Edited August 18, 2015 by katiegrl

[GreenEyes1005]

I hear ya ... but if he's not ready to talk, which he doesn't appear to be otherwise he would be calling, I highly doubt she's gonna get any closure.

 

She might get ignored ..... or her head bitten off ....or some assinine excuse that makes no sense anyway, making her feel WORSE than she feels now.

 

And I for one, would not want her feeling worse than she does already.

 

Waiting for HIM to contact her is better, because if he's the one to make contact, clearly he's ready to talk and will be more receptive and open to what she has to say.

 

And she can then get her closure. Patience is her friend here IMO.

 

In the meantime, she should consider it over, and take steps to move on..

 

Again, my opinion.

 

Gaeta and katiegrl, thank you ladies for continuing to comment! I have appreciated both of your comments a lot!!

 

Right now I have mixed opinions about what to ultimately do, but as of this instant, I'm not contacting him and haven't heard from him since 10:15 Thursday night. I think it's ridiculous that he's being this way, BUT I do see some signs of the commitment-phobe theory. It's conflicting because HE is the one who pursued me, HE texted/called/made plans first 90% of the time, and there was never any pressure on him from me to discuss getting more serious. HE is the one who said he liked me first, he didn't want to date other people, etc.

 

He has been insecure at times, almost wanting reassurance that I only want to be with him, but I have been patient and reassured him when he's been that way. I don't know his entire relationship history in detail, but I do know that he lived with his last ex (this was years ago) and they ended things because they argued everyday. As far as I know, he hasn't dated anyone long-term since that relationship. He also grew up in a home where his parents had a "bad marriage" (his words). I haven't ever doubted his interest in me up until this point because

not only did he pursue the heck out of me even when I was interested in others, but because he never dated anyone else the entire year I wasn't taking him seriously. Maybe I was mistaken in my thinking, but it is what I thought.

 

I do think he will reappear, considering how he would always reappear over the past year, but I know things are different now so there is that possibility that he won't. At times I think I'll give him a couple weeks and then go talk to him, but other times I think he'll have contacted me by then or I won't have the courage to say anything. I really don't know what to do, but I like him and wish whatever was going through his mind was something he'd chosen to talk about.

[ilovemefirst]

My guy does it often. I frankly have had enough of it. He goes for a week at times without saying anything and then i finally just sent him a message saying, i guess you dont want to talk about the issue, so i think its best we part ways and i said goodbye. He then sent me a message saying that he does wanna talk and he was busy with work. RIGHT...anyways i ignored his message because i was really upset, then he sent me another message saying can we talk today? and i ignored that too. I will respond at some point, but i feel that this has become a bad habit and he really has no respect for me. I suggest waiting a few more days and then sending him a message and saying, i have one foot in and one foot out, i need to know where i stand. You are strong, stand your ground. If you keep wondering, its going to keep eating at you. Whatever his excuse is, he deserves to give you more respect than that.

[GreenEyes1005]

My guy does it often. I frankly have had enough of it. He goes for a week at times without saying anything and then i finally just sent him a message saying, i guess you dont want to talk about the issue, so i think its best we part ways and i said goodbye. He then sent me a message saying that he does wanna talk and he was busy with work. RIGHT...anyways i ignored his message because i was really upset, then he sent me another message saying can we talk today? and i ignored that too. I will respond at some point, but i feel that this has become a bad habit and he really has no respect for me. I suggest waiting a few more days and then sending him a message and saying, i have one foot in and one foot out, i need to know where i stand. You are strong, stand your ground. If you keep wondering, its going to keep eating at you. Whatever his excuse is, he deserves to give you more respect than that.

 

Yeah I definitely won't be around long enough for this to become a pattern. I haven't fully decided what to do about this yet, but either he'll contact me and I'll confront the issue or I'll get ahold of him and confront it. He can date me and never do this again or we can go back to being friends and he can watch me date other people. And if he's playing some lame game where he's expecting me to chase him or something it's not happening.

 

Since our companies work together and we have mutual friends, I have heard that he's been getting to work early and leaving late, which is what he does when he's stressed, so who knows what's going on. Regardless an argument is no reason to go MIA.

[Oregon_Dude]

You can't live with this uncertainty. It's anxiety-producing to a huge degree.

 

Break up with him TODAY. It will be easier to live day to day, rather than living in this awful limbo.

 

A man who loves and cares about you will not string you along and hurt you like this.

[katiegrl]

Yeah I definitely won't be around long enough for this to become a pattern. I haven't fully decided what to do about this yet, but either he'll contact me and I'll confront the issue or I'll get ahold of him and confront it. He can date me and never do this again or we can go back to being friends and he can watch me date other people. And if he's playing some lame game where he's expecting me to chase him or something it's not happening.

 

Since our companies work together and we have mutual friends, I have heard that he's been getting to work early and leaving late, which is what he does when he's stressed, so who knows what's going on. Regardless an argument is no reason to go MIA.

 

GE, you said he chased you for a year. Can you elaborate on that? How so, in what way?

 

 

The reason I ask is because you said you were friends during that year.

 

 

So....during the year you were friends, was he asking you out, and you were turning him down? Was he expressing his romantic interest in you in other ways, and you didn't feel the same and told him so?

 

 

Can you clarify how he "chased" you a bit more?

Edited August 18, 2015 by katiegrl

[Oregon_Dude]

Also.. I'm tired of hearing about people needing their "space" when they're going through stress. I can understand a few hours, or even a day. But someone who needs days on end of no contact, while they're supposedly in a relationship.. that doesn't work for me. Maybe it works for others - I don't know. I want a partner who can lean on me during tough times, who can make the distinction between life stress and how they treat me.

 

As adults, we don't take our problems out on others. That's called emotional immaturity.

 

This resonates with me because I had something similar happen, and it's going to be a big red flag for me from now on. If your partner can't say, "I'm having a really tough time right now, but I just want you to know that I love you and appreciate you being here for me"... and instead decides to retreat into a "cave" (BS invented by John Gray, BTW).. that ain't a grown-up.

 

Lastly, the so-called "cave" is not the sole territory of men. I also really tire of hearing how men are commitment phobic, poor communicators, out of touch with their emotions. Maybe some of the men you ladies date. These stereotypes are genderless. I'm more sensitive than anyone I date - which is my problem, I'm sure. Anyway, just to say that these concepts of how men behave and how women behave are ridiculously outdated, and inaccurate. Fact is, people are often terrible communicators, selfish, and date people on the side.

 

/projection

[elaine567]

You can't live with this uncertainty. It's anxiety-producing to a huge degree.

 

Break up with him TODAY. It will be easier to live day to day, rather than living in this awful limbo.

 

A man who loves and cares about you will not string you along and hurt you like this.

 

I agree, it is very simple to go into a "cave" and refuse to talk to your partner, refuse to see them and become MIA, but no loving and caring individual would actually do that to someone they loved.

They would not leave them hanging in no man's land.

 

People who do this, do it for effect, do it as a form of abuse or do it to exercise power and control.

OR they are actually mentally ill, or suffer from a PD or are alcoholics or drug addicts.

[katiegrl]

Also.. I'm tired of hearing about people needing their "space" when they're going through stress. I can understand a few hours, or even a day. But someone who needs days on end of no contact, while they're supposedly in a relationship.. that doesn't work for me. Maybe it works for others - I don't know. I want a partner who can lean on me during tough times, who can make the distinction between life stress and how they treat me.

 

As adults, we don't take our problems out on others. That's called emotional immaturity.

 

This resonates with me because I had something similar happen, and it's going to be a big red flag for me from now on. If your partner can't say, "I'm having a really tough time right now, but I just want you to know that I love you and appreciate you being here for me"... and instead decides to retreat into a "cave" (BS invented by John Gray, BTW).. that ain't a grown-up.

 

Lastly, the so-called "cave" is not the sole territory of men. I also really tire of hearing how men are commitment phobic, poor communicators, out of touch with their emotions. Maybe some of the men you ladies date. These stereotypes are genderless. I'm more sensitive than anyone I date - which is my problem, I'm sure. Anyway, just to say that these concepts of how men behave and how women behave are ridiculously outdated, and inaccurate. Fact is, people are often terrible communicators, selfish, and date people on the side.

 

/projection

 

 

I agree with you OregonD.... and with respect to the bolded, YES, women can be every bit as commitment phobic, poor communicators, out of touch with their emotions, etc.... as men.

 

 

I myself suffer from a bit of commitment phobia....it used to be worse but it's a lot better now.... probably because my boyfriend (we live together) understands and, as such, allows me a ton of space ....as do I him too (i.e. we each retreat to our own rooms sometimes, etc.)

 

 

Our space needs match...so it works for US.

 

 

Actually though, since both our parents passed away...we are now discussing marriage which scares the bejeebees outta me.... but not as much as before.

 

 

Anyway, my responses in this thread about men's commitment issues were only because the subject of this thread (GreenEyes' boyfriend) is a man.

Edited August 18, 2015 by katiegrl

[Oregon_Dude]

Anyway, my responses in this thread about men's commitment issues were only because the subject of this thread (GreenEyes' boyfriend) is a man.

My rant wasn't directed at you, katie. So, no worries. More like a rant at the world in general Also, I've followed your posts and find you to be quite unique in your need for space in a r/s. Nothing wrong with that, as long as your needs are communicated and it works for both of you.

[ilovemefirst]

Yeah I definitely won't be around long enough for this to become a pattern. I haven't fully decided what to do about this yet, but either he'll contact me and I'll confront the issue or I'll get ahold of him and confront it. He can date me and never do this again or we can go back to being friends and he can watch me date other people. And if he's playing some lame game where he's expecting me to chase him or something it's not happening.

 

Since our companies work together and we have mutual friends, I have heard that he's been getting to work early and leaving late, which is what he does when he's stressed, so who knows what's going on. Regardless an argument is no reason to go MIA.

 

Good for you. You seem really strong. I made that mistake of letting it become a bad habit. But i am at the end of the rope now tbh. I hope he realizes that he cant just go MIA and he should just be honest with you about how he feels. It is not fair to you. But goodluck, please let us all know the outcome.

[ExpatInItaly]

I agree with the other posters. At this point, it's not about him being in his "cave". That's not what a "cave" is. To my understanding, being in a "cave" means needing more space than usual in a stressful period or after a disagreement but also having the ability to communicate to your loved one that you just need some "me" time - not simply ignoring your partner altogether out of anger or a need to be vengeful. That is where I think the concept of the cave is often misused and misunderstood.

 

OP, if I were you, I would be strongly leaning towards calling him and just ending it. This is ridiculous now. He's showing you that his conflict-resolution skills are awful and he can't communicate when he is upset. I feel this whole situation has been blown very much out of proportion and I would not feel confident that he could handle more serious issues maturely.

[JADIE]

Ok, so I've read this whole thread and I think you're beyond "cave issues" here. I have a caveman...I mean, my SO is an introvert who sometimes holes up on his own and leaves me wondering what the heck I did. This is a 5yr relationship with one 4-month break in it after our first disagreement, VERY similar to the one you describe here GreenEyes. He let me down a little, I got very snarky in a text and Boom, he was gone, total NC for 4 mos, refused to answer text or phonecall. Long story short, we reconciled. HIs extreme reaction had to do with how his 35yr marriage had ended and I just caught the flak from it. The backstory explains WHY I get a little sick & panicky when mine now does what I would call normal introvert-guy caving expeditions.

 

BUT, my SO never does what this guy has done to you...he's not the least bit snarky, would never say anything mean to me...when he needs time or space, he's learned to tell me (usually). It may take me some probing to get that out of him, but he does me the courtesy of communicating his need. When I get insecure about it like I did recently, jumping on the panic wagon, he is man enough to reassure me. This last time, the guy left work 2 hours early to come and talk to me about it and this guy abhors "relationship talks". I've known him 15 yrs and never seen him leave work early, ever. So this was huge to me! Then, to top it off, he was leaving next day on a trip and I snuck a relationship book (that had "hit the nail on the head" chapters in it) into his carryon. And he actually read it on his trip. And commented on it to me. This is what Effort from a man looks like. He's stepping out of HIS comfort zone to put me back in mine.

 

If your interactions with this guy over the last 18mos haven't indicated a willingness to put forth Effort for you, do not even bother to contact him for an explanation. If he'd go off like this over something so small, it's not worth the breath you'd waste asking.

[losangelena]

I knew a guy like this when I was in my early 20s. Our relationship was messy and co-dependent, but he would use abandonment as a weapon. The first time he did it, he got flaming mad and I didn't hear from him for two weeks. Then he came back and acted like nothing was wrong. Because I was so co-dependent and afraid to lose him, I allowed it, but that just set up a bad precedent of me walking on eggshells, him getting mad at something, bailing and giving me the silent treatment.

 

In the beginning I would track him down and he'd be all snitty at first but then calm down. After a while I stopped reaching out to him, and if I let it go long enough, he would completely blow up my phone until I responded and then he'd go back to acting like it was no big deal. It was a manipulative push-pull and I was constantly uneasy.

 

The absolute worst time was when we were in New Zealand (a longer, unrelated story) and I disagreed with him about something (respectfully) in front of our friends. He left in a huff, then five minutes later texted me telling me I needed to be gone from his apartment by the time he got back. He kicked me out, essentially. I went to a hotel, and as word got out what happened, a friend invited me to stay with her by the beach for a couple of days. The town she lived in was outside of cellular service, so a few days later, when she was driving me back to Auckland, my phone started going off with like 20 text messages he'd sent me the night before. Yikes. I saw him one more time before I left NZ, but that was the last time I ever saw him.

 

I wish I had been more assertive the first time he came back and demanded to know why he thought it was OK to just disappear for two weeks because of something I didn't realize I had done to make him mad. That is the most awful, passive-aggressive way to treat someone—being upset at someone and punishing them for it, but not telling them why—and it has no place in a loving relationship. My now BF did it to me once, and based on how I reacted I doubt he'll ever do it again. But that's the thing—he saw exactly how upset it made me and he's willing to be more communicative. OP, your BF does not seem willing, not even with all the olive branches you've extended. If/when he comes back, I would make it crystal clear to him that it's unacceptable behavior, and if he wants you in his life, he needs to shape the eff up.