Throwing in the Towel

[Inflikted]

Well-put. Great use of the word 'soul crushing.' How old are you, if I may ask?

 

I noticed an ironic thing a while back. The closest think to intimacy I've experienced has been from 'paid companionship.' The saying is, a may doesn't pay a woman for sex, he pays her to leave afterward. And I always found myself wishing they'd just stay a little longer afterward, just to avoid having to go back to being alone. The epitome of pathetic, I know.

 

26, almost 27.

 

I could never do "paid companionship". Not because of the morality or ethics of it, I just can't get past the "icky-ness" of all the other people they've done stuff with.

 

Besides, I'm incredibly unattractive, and no woman could ever enjoy "intimacy" with me. Even if I paid her for it, I couldn't bring myself to put someone through the unpleasantness of having relations with me.

[nouedis]

There's no reason as to why you should be giving up.

Keep having faith and do what you gotta do.

[mightycpa]

You are over thinking my original post. It is so difficult for some of you to grasp the concept of actually extracting oneself completely from the dating game.

 

There is no complicated psychological response here. This is a rational decision like a career change and in a sense this is what I am doing. The opportunity cost of dating is now being shifted into other ventures that promise exponential returns rather then the short term utility that comes from hook up dating.

 

Of course I will still have sexual desires. My intention is to find someone that I can have something ongoing with. There will be exchange of money, but that is the way it is. I know that is frowned upon by society, but it is no different than relationships which is also an exchange of resources/services.

If you're going to go ahead and pay money for it, why in the world would you find some ONE?

 

Please consider that question a subtle insight into your problem, writ large.

[johndoe2]

26, almost 27.

 

I could never do "paid companionship". Not because of the morality or ethics of it, I just can't get past the "icky-ness" of all the other people they've done stuff with.

 

Besides, I'm incredibly unattractive, and no woman could ever enjoy "intimacy" with me. Even if I paid her for it, I couldn't bring myself to put someone through the unpleasantness of having relations with me.

 

Eh, if it were pleasant, they wouldn't be taking money for it. I guess my thinking is, we put janitors through the unpleasantness of cleaning our fecal stains off of toilets, garbage men through the unpleasantness of handling our most disgusting refuse, masseuses, and often medical personnel for that matter, through the unpleasantness of having to handle our bodies. What is 'society' if not a system of paying others to put up with all our unpleasantness while we, in turn, deal with some form of the unpleasantness of others? I'm quite the amateur philosopher as you can see, lol.

[bene]

 

I'm in the same boat you are. Women have pretty much been abusive of me all my life because I am not a muscular jock of some sort or a rich doctor or lawyer. That's the only thing women care about.

 

 

I don't know you or your situation but this statement is simply not true. The reasons must be somewhere else but these types of generalizations just hinder people from finding the core issue why they don't find a relationship (and fixing it).

 

There are only so many "muscular jocks" and "rich doctors". In your scenario there should be an abundance of single women because there are not enough "muscular jocks" and "rich doctors" for all women. It just doesn't add up mathematically.

 

Go to any mall and you will see tons of average people in relationships, with kids and families. You probably have completely "normal" people in your own circles who have relationships without being some millionaire supermodel astronaut.

[Inflikted]

I don't know you or your situation but this statement is simply not true. The reasons must be somewhere else but these types of generalizations just hinder people from finding the core issue why they don't find a relationship (and fixing it).

 

There are only so many "muscular jocks" and "rich doctors". In your scenario there should be an abundance of single women because there are not enough "muscular jocks" and "rich doctors" for all women. It just doesn't add up mathematically.

 

Go to any mall and you will see tons of average people in relationships, with kids and families. You probably have completely "normal" people in your own circles who have relationships without being some millionaire supermodel astronaut.

 

While what he wrote may have been a bit of an exaggeration, he's not necessarily wrong. Like I said, in order for people who've never had luck dating or being social to have those things, they have to become attractive, highly interesting people. Because if you're not those things, then you're not worth anyone's time.

 

You don't necessarily need to be rich or a "jock", but if you're like me, being unattractive, uninteresting, and useless, you're never going to catch anyone's attention and win their affection. It'd be nice if we lived in a world where people were patient and understanding and willing to see the good in everyone, but in reality, people want to be with someone that stimulates them physically and mentally. If you're one of us that simply can't offer that, then you're screwed, plain and simple.

[mrnova]

While what he wrote may have been a bit of an exaggeration, he's not necessarily wrong. Like I said, in order for people who've never had luck dating or being social to have those things, they have to become attractive, highly interesting people. Because if you're not those things, then you're not worth anyone's time.

 

You don't necessarily need to be rich or a "jock", but if you're like me, being unattractive, uninteresting, and useless, you're never going to catch anyone's attention and win their affection. It'd be nice if we lived in a world where people were patient and understanding and willing to see the good in everyone, but in reality, people want to be with someone that stimulates them physically and mentally. If you're one of us that simply can't offer that, then you're screwed, plain and simple.

I agree in most of this post. And then on the other hand look at all the losers of the world. Drunks,Drug dealers, and jail birds. These winners have no problem getting women. I have yet to see one single. Women will even have kids with these winners. There are no shortage of women for these winners. You mention about patient and understanding. That way of thinking went out in the 1980s when the slogan"You can be to nice". But meanwhile back at the ranch Mr. Arrogant or Mr. Big mouth have no problem with women. Women seem to love big talkers. Done everthing,done seen everybody,got everything,been everywhere. Like i siad. Mr. Arrogant. All talk,But no substance. Women love these types like bees on honey

[No Limit]

Drunks,Drug dealers, and jail birds. These winners have no problem getting women.

 

And what kind of women do they get? Those aren't girls for stable relationships or even futures, they're at the bottom of the barrel and will take whatever they can get. And they are easily influenced by words, so even if you were a smoothtalker and get her to marriage etc - the moment another shows up at some point she'll be following him, hence why girls with a little backbone and brains should be the type to look for.

[TouchedByViolet]

And what kind of women do they get? Those aren't girls for stable relationships or even futures, they're at the bottom of the barrel and will take whatever they can get. And they are easily influenced by words, so even if you were a smoothtalker and get her to marriage etc - the moment another shows up at some point she'll be following him, hence why girls with a little backbone and brains should be the type to look for.

 

I have seen many successful and smart women chase after deadbeat men. It's not as straight forward as you present it.

[DJOkawari]

Also midtwenties here and I agree with you but from a different perspective:

 

Normally I'm a lot more humble than this but I'll forgo it for the sake of the argument - I possess whatever those characteristics you were saying girls in this "hook up culture" are looking for. All of them.

 

I'm still throwing in the towel as far as dating goes. I just don't see the point of it. Many guys are willing to do anything to get laid. They'll do absolutely anything moral, amoral, whatever. They're just so desperate. The prettier girl the more guys she's got chasing her around and they'll do anything for just a sniff of her.

 

And what has the girl got to do? Keep up her appearance, send a few texts, show up for free things, not do anything particularly heinous? That's the game we're playing in our midtwenties. You can make a deep connection, she'll just keep ****ing other people. So, people say, "why aren't you ****ing other people?" ... and so you do that. Except wait. You're paying for all of these dates. Not just in money but also in time. Yeah, you're having fun, yeah you're getting laid but at what cost? Your twenties are passing.

 

The thing is you can never "go slow". There are a bunch of other guys texting any attractive girl...offering her free+fun stuff. And why would she turn it down? If i were her, i wouldnt. These people are just so nice. If you aren't there to entertain her when she'd like you to...well someone else is going to get an audition.

 

Naturally she moves on. That's okay because you moved on too. Everyone keeps building 15 second connections and running onto the next exciting thing. The excitement fades and you need a new hit.

 

It really feels like romance is dead. No person is special, there are always "other fish in the sea". But let me ask you: How special is it for a girl to tell you she loves you when she's said it to 30 other guys before? How can you appreciate a tender moment when you've had it with 30 other girls? You've opened up to so many other girls there's nothing special about the next.

 

These are the same girls that'll be around when I'm in my late twenties and thirties except the game will have changed. They'll want to settle down now...except wait there's still nothing special between us. Anything I could imagine we've both done with lots of other people. A problem for another day is the way I see it.

 

So I concluded I'm better off spending my time doing other things. I'm much more fulfilled this way. There is just so much more to the human experience than working and your desired gender. It's freeing to live outside of the sex-paradigm the mass media has enclosed us in.

 

Thoughts?

 

Sorry for the long post, I've had this on my mind for a little while.

Edited July 24, 2015 by DJOkawari

[lino]

I have seen many successful and smart women chase after deadbeat men. It's not as straight forward as you present it.

 

Drug dealers have their pick of the bunch, I've seen it a million times.

 

Guys in jail also never have problems but aren't as prized as drug dealers. Ever see a guy being convicted of a violent crime go to court on his own? I bet not, there's always a partner or wife (in some cases even multiple partners) there supporting him. I wonder why this is?

Even guys convicted of raping underage children have their partners supporting them in court!

[johndoe2]

Drug dealers have their pick of the bunch, I've seen it a million times.

 

Guys in jail also never have problems but aren't as prized as drug dealers. Ever see a guy being convicted of a violent crime go to court on his own? I bet not, there's always a partner or wife (in some cases even multiple partners) there supporting him. I wonder why this is?

Even guys convicted of raping underage children have their partners supporting them in court!

This makes perfect sense if we think of human beings as what we are: animals. Who do you want guarding your litter of offspring from the careless cruelty of nature and the rest of your species, the diplomatic a d conscientious male, or the violent aggressive male who will without hesitation suffocate any creature that so much as looks at his brood? Humans are separated from the jungle a only a few thousand years of history, and in biological time, that's the blink of an eye, hence the huge disconnect between the cultural idealization of what we're supposed to do to attract mates, and what the opposite sex actually respond to. We're not as far removed from wolves and lions as we like to believe. Now someone help me turn that into a Game of Thrones reference.

[LookAtThisPOst]

This makes perfect sense if we think of human beings as what we are: animals. Who do you want guarding your litter of offspring from the careless cruelty of nature and the rest of your species, the diplomatic a d conscientious male, or the violent aggressive male who will without hesitation suffocate any creature that so much as looks at his brood? Humans are separated from the jungle a only a few thousand years of history, and in biological time, that's the blink of an eye, hence the huge disconnect between the cultural idealization of what we're supposed to do to attract mates, and what the opposite sex actually respond to. We're not as far removed from wolves and lions as we like to believe. Now someone help me turn that into a Game of Thrones reference.

 

As human, we should be above this behavior. I know I am and the rest of the law abiding humans.

 

This is what separates us from the animals.

[elaine567]

Drug dealers have their pick of the bunch, I've seen it a million times.

 

Because in some sections of society the big cheese IS the drug dealer. He is the guy with the status, he is often the guy with the money, he is the guy with the bigger house, he is the guy with the flashier car, he is the guy with the masculine attitude, he is the charmer, he is the one giving the orders to other people, and he is the guy with the balls.

He is also the guy fighting against the authorities, against the establishment and that can also be very attractive to some women, women who are themselves a bit rebellious or would like to be that way.

 

He shows many of the traits that women find attractive.

The fact his work is against the law - for some women, in some sections of the community - is no bad thing.

[DJOkawari]

It's liberating and sexy to be around someone who lives life on their own terms...for any gender+orientation I believe.

[Els]

I see absolutely nothing wrong with not focusing on dating, especially in your 20s.

 

But the question is, what are you going to focus on? Make it something good.

[DJOkawari]

I have a personal answer (a list) but rather than that I'll give a more general one:

 

I'm grown but I'm not the man I grew up hoping to be. My life isn't as I had imagined it. There are so many places and things I haven't seen or done. Im pretty bad at a lot of things I'd like to be good at. On top of it all, there are just so many things I don't know. So many things I haven't even conceived of.

 

These thoughts sound negative but I have a lot of energy, I have a lot of time, I have no dependents...it's the key moment in my life to chase these things.

 

That's what I'll be doing. I don't know if that makes "something good" but it's certainly fulfilling for the moment.

Edited July 28, 2015 by DJOkawari

[No Limit]

I have a personal answer (a list) but rather than that I'll give a more general one:

 

I'm grown but I'm not the man I grew up hoping to be. My life isn't as I had imagined it. There are so many places and things I haven't seen or done. Im pretty bad at a lot of things I'd like to be good at. On top of it all, there are just so many things I don't know. So many things I haven't even conceived of.

 

These thoughts sound negative but I have a lot of energy, I have a lot of time, I have no dependents...it's the key moment in my life to chase these things.

 

That's what I'll be doing. I don't know if that makes "something good" but it's certainly fulfilling for the moment.

 

This is it for me as well, just change the word "man" to "woman" (although to be honest, I don't feel much grown up at all). Actively working on it though.

[BronzeAgeJaeger217]

I see absolutely nothing wrong with not focusing on dating, especially in your 20s.

 

But the question is, what are you going to focus on? Make it something good.

 

Well aren't 20's the critical, prime, growth years for Dating, relationships?

[ZA Dater]

Make it something good.

 

Or just work....