A Feeling Of Guilt - Why I Don't Know

[oldshirt]

If jm feels like him and his wife have come to an amicable agreement on who gets what and custody, I don't think he needs to play hardball. But I agree with this if she does. I know lots if people who divorced without it costinf a fortune. More than the $400 people. And I so know people who had to battle it out in court. Guess who has the better coparenting relationship?

 

It's fine and great to strive for an amicable divorce and to have a cooperative and mutually compassionate coparenting relationship.

 

Just do with your own counsel watching your back and your back alone.

 

Sharing a lawyer is like sharing a toothbrush or sharing toilet paper.

[Furious]

I'm getting things ready to drop 3k on a lawyer. If I can get her on board with a clean divorce perhaps we can both split the same lawyer or find a way to divorce a lot cheaper. She's already cost me a lot of money.

 

Have you looked into arbitration. An impartial arbitrator is a a third party who will meet with you both to iron out a fair settlement between you two. It's less expensive than hiring divorce lawyers.

 

If arbitration does not work out, you will know that you must hire your own lawyer to represent you.

 

Do you live in a no fault state?

[drifter777]

jm: Are you still sleeping in the same bed with her?

 

You're making a lot of noises about divorce but aren't really doing much. Its like your waiting for the perfect time to pull the trigger. There never is a perfect time. You should pack and leave as soon as possible. Be committed to getting this done so you can move on. Rent a room or stay with a friend or family but get out. When you do this your wife can't ignore reality. You won't have to guard your sperm. Get on with it.

[jm2013]

jm: Are you still sleeping in the same bed with her?

 

You're making a lot of noises about divorce but aren't really doing much. Its like your waiting for the perfect time to pull the trigger. There never is a perfect time. You should pack and leave as soon as possible. Be committed to getting this done so you can move on. Rent a room or stay with a friend or family but get out. When you do this your wife can't ignore reality. You won't have to guard your sperm. Get on with it.

 

We do sleep in the same bed yes. I made this mistake before. I found myself punishing myself because of her crappy decision. Why would I do that again? I do plan on pulling the plug out of this. I still have to sell my house unless she's going to magically come up with the money to buy it out. There is a lot of stuff I have to do before I just pack up my bags and move out again. There's a lot more that needs to be done.

[jm2013]

Also, do you guys think it is normal for somebody to tell you they don't want you then try and snoop on them? I couldn't really sleep last night and I was checking out my phone and I felt this presence hovering over my shoulder and I was like wtf are you doing lol. So random. This sucks too she painted spots around the house with test paint. I have to repaint the whole damn house. She's on a roll.

[Selfish]

Also, do you guys think it is normal for somebody to tell you they don't want you then try and snoop on them? I couldn't really sleep last night and I was checking out my phone and I felt this presence hovering over my shoulder and I was like wtf are you doing lol. So random. This sucks too she painted spots around the house with test paint. I have to repaint the whole damn house. She's on a roll.

 

She told you she doesn't want you?

 

Are you texting/communicating with your ow? Because if you are she may sense it.

 

You said you were letting her stay in the house. What does it matter if she is thinking of repainting it?

 

Do you not have a spare room? Basement? Couch? If not buy a really nice one and start an in house seperation. Stop pretending for your daughter. If anything it will keep her from being blindsided. But stop sleeping with your wife. You really don't understand that all these actions are sending your wife different messages. She may think you're just in a stage.

 

And did you confront her about the bib?

[Confused48]

jm: Are you still sleeping in the same bed with her?

 

You're making a lot of noises about divorce but aren't really doing much. Its like your waiting for the perfect time to pull the trigger. There never is a perfect time. You should pack and leave as soon as possible. Be committed to getting this done so you can move on. Rent a room or stay with a friend or family but get out. When you do this your wife can't ignore reality. You won't have to guard your sperm. Get on with it.

 

 

How can you say this to him? What one word of the above could not be said to you and apply to you? Yet you stay. So how can you tell him to go when you don't take your own advice.

 

It is easier said than done.

[Selfish]

How can you say this to him? What one word of the above could not be said to you and apply to you? Yet you stay. So how can you tell him to go when you don't take your own advice.

 

It is easier said than done.

 

Drifter feels old, he has lived his life in his mind and now is resigning himself to dying with his "blank". He doesn't want others to make the same mistake as him in staying.

[jm2013]

She told you she doesn't want you?

 

Are you texting/communicating with your ow? Because if you are she may sense it.

 

You said you were letting her stay in the house. What does it matter if she is thinking of repainting it?

 

Do you not have a spare room? Basement? Couch? If not buy a really nice one and start an in house seperation. Stop pretending for your daughter. If anything it will keep her from being blindsided. But stop sleeping with your wife. You really don't understand that all these actions are sending your wife different messages. She may think you're just in a stage.

 

And did you confront her about the bib?

 

OW and I do not communicate through our phones directly via text message. Sometimes we social media but that is all public. I suppose I could go out on the couch or basement but again, I don't feel like I should have to suppress my comfort for her. I suppose you are right about mixed signals even know I have flat out told her. As far as the painting what I meant by that is she is making more work. She will not be able to buy the house out because she cannot afford it. I have to paint it and fix a couple things and hope to sell it in the summer. She'll have to understand this must happen. We can split the money down the pipe from the sale. It should be about 25-30k plus. But by the time we get done paying a Realtor and paying that who knows how much we'll have left. We should also start liquidating a lot of junk.

[Selfish]

OW and I do not communicate through our phones directly via text message. Sometimes we social media but that is all public. I suppose I could go out on the couch or basement but again, I don't feel like I should have to suppress my comfort for her. I suppose you are right about mixed signals even know I have flat out told her. As far as the painting what I meant by that is she is making more work. She will not be able to buy the house out because she cannot afford it. I have to paint it and fix a couple things and hope to sell it in the summer. She'll have to understand this must happen. We can split the money down the pipe from the sale. It should be about 25-30k plus. But by the time we get done paying a Realtor and paying that who knows how much we'll have left. We should also start liquidating a lot of junk.

 

Why don't you buy a really nice bed? Make the basement your mancave? It must be better than sleeping next to this woman.

 

But once again, did she tell you she didn't want you or where did that come from?

 

It sucks that places have different laws sometimes. Where I live a marital home can be kept until the children are grown and then divided. Of course that requires the parent who leaves to still pay half the mortage. If they don't they only get half fair market value aT the time of seperation. My bf growing up had that. Her dad who was custodial parent stayed in the house. His wife couldn't pay her share so she only got the price it was at when she moved out. But she did have her boyfriend to live with...

 

I realize that situation does have the risk of the market collapsing and the house falling into disrepair. But really, the whole situation always has it drawbacks.

[jm2013]

Why don't you buy a really nice bed? Make the basement your mancave? It must be better than sleeping next to this woman.

 

But once again, did she tell you she didn't want you or where did that come from?

 

It sucks that places have different laws sometimes. Where I live a marital home can be kept until the children are grown and then divided. Of course that requires the parent who leaves to still pay half the mortage. If they don't they only get half fair market value aT the time of seperation. My bf growing up had that. Her dad who was custodial parent stayed in the house. His wife couldn't pay her share so she only got the price it was at when she moved out. But she did have her boyfriend to live with...

 

I realize that situation does have the risk of the market collapsing and the house falling into disrepair. But really, the whole situation always has it drawbacks.

 

No, she didn't tell me she didn't want me. I guess I could buy a nice blow up mattress lol. I don't want another bed in that house. I'll buy a good one when I get my own place. She told me she didn't want me back in 2013 by her crappy actions. I'm just finishing the job on this one. I'm going to try and execute this as nice as possible. I think when her cards all collapse in on her though I'm going to go through a little turmoil with her. I'm actually kind of freaked out what she's going to say to our daughter and what she's going to do. I've seen her in distress before and she seems unstable at times. I remember her telling me when this all unfolded that she thought about killing herself in our garage. I'm like you selfish b you can't even have consideration for our daughter? Yeah, let me off myself in the garage and have our 5 year old daughter find my dead body and freak out. Sounds legit. Some of the stuff she's has said and done over the years proves my point of how messed up she is inside. Just like her mother.

[Selfish]

Your wife never told you she didn't want you. That comment about the spying was misleading. You have all these stubborn ideas of what happened and stuff and most of them are fallable.

 

If your wife had left you that would have meant she didn't want you. Cheating and it not being an exit affair (she would have found another if it had been intended as an exit affair or she changed her mind. People do that you know) meant she was selfish and greedy. She wanted you and her lover. Now she wants you over a lover. Does she deserve you? No. But that doesn't mean she doesn't want you.

 

Remember, her affair was enough to end the marriage conscience clear on your side. Stop yourself from the twisted thinking and assumptions. There doesn't need to be more and it doesn't help to make up things just to try to feel better.

 

As to the suicide. The worst thing people do is shame and say suicide is selfish. EveN if her threats are empty. It really is. If you feel she could become suicidal over this or she makes threats call the police. They'll take her to the hospital and she will be monitered.

[Rainbowlove]

I'm actually kind of freaked out what she's going to say to our daughter and what she's going to do. I've seen her in distress before and she seems unstable at times. I remember her telling me when this all unfolded that she thought about killing herself in our garage. I'm like you selfish b you can't even have consideration for our daughter? Yeah, let me off myself in the garage and have our 5 year old daughter find my dead body and freak out. Sounds legit. Some of the stuff she's has said and done over the years proves my point of how messed up she is inside. Just like her mother.

 

I think this is the truth of your stalling and mixed signals - fear.

 

You cannot control her response to you leaving or ending your marriage anymore than you could control her from having an affair.

 

The chips need to fall where they may.

 

You left once. You know how it looks. It will get ugly. There's no way around that. She will say/do anything to keep you right where you are. She'll use your daughter. She'll use guilt. She'll use threats. She'll make promises.

 

Now, how will you respond?

 

Stop sleeping with her. Stop having sex with her.

 

If you are done, be done. File, put the house on the market, and make arrangements to be elsewhere.

 

Dragging your feet with this is only adding to more anguish and confusion.

[jm2013]

Your wife never told you she didn't want you. That comment about the spying was misleading. You have all these stubborn ideas of what happened and stuff and most of them are fallable.

 

If your wife had left you that would have meant she didn't want you. Cheating and it not being an exit affair (she would have found another if it had been intended as an exit affair or she changed her mind. People do that you know) meant she was selfish and greedy. She wanted you and her lover. Now she wants you over a lover. Does she deserve you? No. But that doesn't mean she doesn't want you.

 

Remember, her affair was enough to end the marriage conscience clear on your side. Stop yourself from the twisted thinking and assumptions. There doesn't need to be more and it doesn't help to make up things just to try to feel better.

 

As to the suicide. The worst thing people do is shame and say suicide is selfish. EveN if her threats are empty. It really is. If you feel she could become suicidal over this or she makes threats call the police. They'll take her to the hospital and she will be monitered.

 

I have many ideas of what happened. That is an unfortunate side effect of an unfaithful spouse who provides trickle truth and lies for an extended period of time. Reflective of a spouse who in their heart is not truly sorry for their errors. Just my opinion. The suicide stuff does bother me a little. I'm not sure if that was another ploy or what to make me feel stuck. I help fill in the blanks for her since she doesn't want to provide the useful information I was looking for. Now her and her AP can both die with it locked up. I don't care anymore. I think the conversation earlier this week with her mom really riddled me.

[drifter777]

You don't sound one bit like a BH committed to divorce.

 

As far as the house, sell it if you like but your WW is entitled to half the equity. And then your going to pay for a home for your daughter AND her. If she makes so much less than you that she cannot pay the mortgage on her own then you are going to pay spousal support. And child support will be there for 13 more years. You would be much better off having half the equity now to be paid to you when your D turns 18. Then WW and D live in the house until then.

 

If you want to divorce her you need to accept the financial realities. It will be tough for a couple years but you will adjust. If your WW doesn't remarry a good provider then she will be much worse off, financially, in 5 years.

 

If you can keep your clothes, one car (if you have two) and 50% equity value in the house as of today then take it and be done. That is, if you want to divorce this woman that you still love very much. All that's happened is the veil of shock & disbelief has finally raised and you are furious at her for all she has done. Finally, real emotion. Get back into MC with her and make sure you are unable to live with her because of what she's done. You need to find out because right now your anger & hurt is blinding you. Your posts are all over the place and so is your heart. Get some help - get a grip. I'd still advise NOT SLEEPING WITH HER - but that really should go without saying.

[jm2013]

Drifter, I can't wait to come back to this thread and prove you wrong soon. Hell, I'll post a picture of my smiling face. That is what you all are going to see when I'm done with this crap fest and moved on to my real life.

[Lion Heart]

Also, do you guys think it is normal for somebody to tell you they don't want you then try and snoop on them? I couldn't really sleep last night and I was checking out my phone and I felt this presence hovering over my shoulder and I was like wtf are you doing lol. So random. This sucks too she painted spots around the house with test paint. I have to repaint the whole damn house. She's on a roll.

 

Excellent! You may get more $$ for the house if it's freshly painted. Maybe she can do the gardens too!

 

Good on you jm for making the decision to leave your WW. There are lots of things to do but these "things" can take forever then you die. Make a short list of MUST DOs then when they're ticked off its anytime after that.

 

If you're already looking outside your marriage for the next mate,it's possibly the beginnings of an EA for you. IMHO if you already know your next mate, she's gonna trust you ALOT less (well a person with a well developed character will!) if you're lining her up BEFORE you at least leave your WW. It wouldn't matter WHAT you say, it's what you DO that counts on all sides now. In my next honest opinion, your first girl after your marraige is also gonna "know" or at least think that she's a rebound or the first step into your new found sexual freedom land. Not a meaningful relationship. Let's be real honest here. She probably will be too.

 

Lion Heart.

[Lion Heart]

Jm

 

I think you'd love to listen to Dave Grolls words in "Best of you".

I'm hoping the fog has nearly cleared for you completely over your marraige but this song describes the confusion a BS can feel.

 

Another song by Lenny Kravitz "Fly away" I think encapsulates the need in us to cut loose from the pain and fly.

 

I wish you all the best. I think your struggle (manifesting in guilt) has been mainly over your daughter and that's noble. Your daughter is fortunate to have a noble daddy and she will rely on your strengths throughout her life.

 

I'm not sure how you feel about your relationship with your daughter moving on but I think you want to be as much in her life as possible. If this is the case, please allow me to share my points with you on that. Make sure to mention to any future partner that you have a daughter asap. Some women will walk away immediately and that's GOOD. You may want a LTR eventually with someone who is good for her and you. You don't have to introduce your daughter to new W straight away. As you're "looking" I wouldn't but make sure that new W knows about DD and your commitment to DD. Most importantly defend and protect your DD from any harm in your new r's. You can't control the harm exWW exposes to her but you can on your side.

 

Best wishes

Lion Heart.

[jm2013]

Excellent! You may get more $$ for the house if it's freshly painted. Maybe she can do the gardens too!

 

Good on you jm for making the decision to leave your WW. There are lots of things to do but these "things" can take forever then you die. Make a short list of MUST DOs then when they're ticked off its anytime after that.

 

If you're already looking outside your marriage for the next mate,it's possibly the beginnings of an EA for you. IMHO if you already know your next mate, she's gonna trust you ALOT less (well a person with a well developed character will!) if you're lining her up BEFORE you at least leave your WW. It wouldn't matter WHAT you say, it's what you DO that counts on all sides now. In my next honest opinion, your first girl after your marraige is also gonna "know" or at least think that she's a rebound or the first step into your new found sexual freedom land. Not a meaningful relationship. Let's be real honest here. She probably will be too.

 

Lion Heart.

 

Hi Lion Heart,

 

I'm not really looking for anything really in a relationship. I definitely won't be ready for somebody else for awhile. In due time. With that being said, I wouldn't mind wining and dining another woman for awhile to help keep occupied. I'd probably just lay that all out there.

 

Jm

 

I think you'd love to listen to Dave Grolls words in "Best of you".

I'm hoping the fog has nearly cleared for you completely over your marraige but this song describes the confusion a BS can feel.

 

Another song by Lenny Kravitz "Fly away" I think encapsulates the need in us to cut loose from the pain and fly.

 

I wish you all the best. I think your struggle (manifesting in guilt) has been mainly over your daughter and that's noble. Your daughter is fortunate to have a noble daddy and she will rely on your strengths throughout her life.

 

I'm not sure how you feel about your relationship with your daughter moving on but I think you want to be as much in her life as possible. If this is the case, please allow me to share my points with you on that. Make sure to mention to any future partner that you have a daughter asap. Some women will walk away immediately and that's GOOD. You may want a LTR eventually with someone who is good for her and you. You don't have to introduce your daughter to new W straight away. As you're "looking" I wouldn't but make sure that new W knows about DD and your commitment to DD. Most importantly defend and protect your DD from any harm in your new r's. You can't control the harm exWW exposes to her but you can on your side.

 

Best wishes

Lion Heart.

 

My wife and I had a conversation with our pastor the other day and I had an appointment last night with our counselor. The pastor meeting was really interesting. I found him as if he was defending her in some ways but would later deny that. He basically said we had a crappy marriage which I agreed with him on. He told me to sh*t or get off the pot. I was like um ok. He then had enough self confidence to openly tell all of us she was telling the truth because he can tell when people were lying. I told him I saw those same tears, words and expressions all before and they are meaningless to me anymore. I'm not really sure how he can be so sure she wasn't lying.

 

It was interesting that just a little more information snuck out about her affair. I think she really did love this other man. Our pastor got her to admit that her feelings for him got her to break the no contact a couple of times. I know she's still lying about the run. That really pisses me off she still to this day minimizes what he was to her and can't just own up to it. I'm done with this crap. Also, I think his advice is toxic. He more focuses on the financial aspects of the divorce and how crushing it will be financially. What he doesn't understand is my thirst to make more money. It doesn't matter if I've got two women draining my paycheck. I'll just make more money. He doesn't seem to understand that. He also keeps bringing up my 70% survival in my next marriage. I asked him who said I was getting married again? LOL. It's like I'm surrounded by a bunch of debbie downers.

 

Then with my counselor last night I just told him I was done. I told him the only chance the I have together with my wife would be me divorcing and going off on my own and for some reason regaining feelings for her. It sounds completely one sided but that is how I feel. I want to be by myself now. If I'm dating other women and all I can think about is my wife then there must be something I suppose. Even so, I don't know if I'd come back to that to get screwed over. Who knows what my future holds. I'm just not going to let this woman hold me back on the things I want to do now. She's the one who changed the dynamics of our lives so I'll let her deal with those consequences. Maybe she'll think a little better next time before she joyfully spreads her legs open again for somebody else.

[Clay]

When I exposed my wife to her family they all blamed me. It was my fault she was cheating. All they could see is there loving family member was suffering. They could not see that the kids were being destroyed in all this not to mention my feelings as well. It was not only a shock to me but it was a eye opening experience. These days I think there is more of a serious bias when it comes to men and women in cheating. If a guy cheats he is the scum of the earth and he should be lashed a thousand times. If the woman cheats its her SO's fault because her needs were not being met.

 

If I was you I would just let what that pastor said roll right off your shoulder. Your going to hear alot of that and your wife will justify her actions any way she can. I would focus on making you more healthy mentally and physically and having a good relationship with your child. In the end who really cares if your stbxw ever really suffers from this. I mean honestly if she really loved you like she is saying she does now she would have never cheated in the first place.

 

Your better off moving on and finding a woman to have a healthy loving relationship with not to mention a better relationship with your child.

 

Clay

[No Limit]

I'm afraid there are going to be very few people who will tell you "What she did was atrocious and it's okay for you to pull the trigger, it's a consequence of her actions, even if she doesn't like them" or anything encouraging. Especially if she brings oh so sincere tears. Priests are probably the last people to ever be critical to someone who runs to them for help in their big acting debut.

 

She's very worried about her reputation right now. As much as she might love her OM, she doesn't love him enough to get out of her comfortable life - but that's not in her power anymore.

 

Leave, you wasted enough time on her. I highly doubt you will waste thoughts on your wife while you're out dating real women.