It's always the man's fault...

[Divasu]

Am sure it's not just when she is "exhausted" that a woman holds it from a man.

 

Do explain.

[xxoo]

Am sure it's not just when she is "exhausted" that a woman holds it from a man.

 

Holds what from a man? Obligatory sex?

 

Why does he even want it if she isn't into it?

[Taramere]

It amuses me how so many women in the thread proved the point Gloria was trying to make. People focusing on his spreadsheet and not the fact that his wife tells him to F off when he tries to get laid.

 

Where does it say that she told him to F off? She made excuses or indicated non verbally that she didn't want to have sex - or, occasionally they would have sex. That's avoiding the issue of not wanting to have sex with him, but it's not the kind of aggressive or contemptuous response you're attributing to her.

 

If somebody is consistently turning you down for sex, it's because they don't want to have sex. Of course in a marriage that is a big problem. You don't address a problem like that for berating somebody for it. That's not going to bring attraction back into the relationship. You address it openly - that the person doesn't seem attracted any more, that it's not a situation you're happy to carry on with indefinitely and that you want to have a serious talk about the future of the relationship to see if anything can be salvaged.

 

It's one thing to support somebody feeling angry, hurt and frustrated about sexual rejection....but this guy handled the situation very poorly. Are people trying to argue that nobody other than a small handful of women on Loveshack would find his behaviour weird? People on Reddit laughed and mocked it because it was laughable and mockworthy behaviour.

 

Have any of us engaged in risible behaviour when we were upset about something and beyond being reasonable about it? Probably all of us have, and probably all of us would seek some forgiveness and understanding from those close to us. Fair enough - but it's a bit much to expect people on the internet who don't know this guy and have no relationship with him to react with anything other than laughter. That's not to say it's funny that the guy was experiencing sexual rejection from his wife most of the time. However, life sucks for plenty of people a fair bit of the time. It doesn't mean we all have some carte blanche to react to life sucking by behaving in weirdly childish ways without being laughed at for it.

 

The bottom line is that is that this guy's wife was not under a duty to comply with sexual requests whenever they were made of her, or even most of the time they were made of her. It's not unreasonable for a woman to say no to sex if she doesn't want to have sex. She has that right. If she keeps saying no to a partner, then evidently there's a problem - but that's not a problem that's going to be fixed by presenting her with a spreadsheet of complaints about it.

 

All this thread seems to be aiming to do is to fan flames of anger and resentment about sexual rejection and against women generally, without looking to identify any realistic and mature methods of dealing with unfortunate situations like this.

[Tayken]

The bold, that's the "fault".

 

Identifying "fault" isn't always a bad thing. When something is in your control, that gives you power to change it. Men can have a better experience of marriage if they change those things under their control, from choosing a partner to communication and so on (and the same is true for women).

 

If men or woman avoid accepting any fault, their situation will never improve.

 

Now lets go to the root cause of this....parenting and moms especially letting their daughters dictate right under their nose, and them trying so hard to be besties with their daughters starting with facebook.

 

If little suzie has been brought up to think everything she does is alright, that attitude will follow her into relationships. I dare any woman here to argue that the dads don't at least discipline

[xxoo]

Now lets go to the root cause of this....parenting and moms especially letting their daughters dictate right under their nose, and them trying so hard to be besties with their daughters starting with facebook.

 

If little suzie has been brought up to think everything she does is alright, that attitude will follow her into relationships. I dare any woman here to argue that the dads don't at least discipline

 

Or fathers/sons

 

Or fathers/daughters

 

Or mothers/sons

 

Obviously the issues are not limited to one gender. Personally, I'm pleased to know men young men and women who are being raised well. Maybe it's a reflection of my social circle.

[Gloria25]

Where does it say that she told him to F off? She made excuses or indicated non verbally that she didn't want to have sex - or, occasionally they would have sex. That's avoiding the issue of not wanting to have sex with him, but it's not the kind of aggressive or contemptuous response you're attributing to her.

 

If somebody is consistently turning you down for sex, it's because they don't want to have sex. Of course in a marriage that is a big problem. You don't address a problem like that for berating somebody for it. That's not going to bring attraction back into the relationship. You address it openly - that the person doesn't seem attracted any more, that it's not a situation you're happy to carry on with indefinitely and that you want to have a serious talk about the future of the relationship to see if anything can be salvaged.

 

It's one thing to support somebody feeling angry, hurt and frustrated about sexual rejection....but this guy handled the situation very poorly. Are people trying to argue that nobody other than a small handful of women on Loveshack would find his behaviour weird? People on Reddit laughed and mocked it because it was laughable and mockworthy behaviour.

 

Have any of us engaged in risible behaviour when we were upset about something and beyond being reasonable about it? Probably all of us have, and probably all of us would seek some forgiveness and understanding from those close to us. Fair enough - but it's a bit much to expect people on the internet who don't know this guy and have no relationship with him to react with anything other than laughter. That's not to say it's funny that the guy was experiencing sexual rejection from his wife most of the time. However, life sucks for plenty of people a fair bit of the time. It doesn't mean we all have some carte blanche to react to life sucking by behaving in weirdly childish ways without being laughed at for it.

 

The bottom line is that is that this guy's wife was not under a duty to comply with sexual requests whenever they were made of her, or even most of the time they were made of her. It's not unreasonable for a woman to say no to sex if she doesn't want to have sex. She has that right. If she keeps saying no to a partner, then evidently there's a problem - but that's not a problem that's going to be fixed by presenting her with a spreadsheet of complaints about it.

 

All this thread seems to be aiming to do is to fan flames of anger and resentment about sexual rejection and against women generally, without looking to identify any realistic and mature methods of dealing with unfortunate situations like this.

 

Well, again, that's another difference between the sexes. While women enjoy sex, the majority don't see it as a priority. Men need sex not only cuz of the physical satisfaction, but that's where men get their "validation" and "affection" from their women. Men don't need hugs, flowers, and romance over sex. They need SEX.

 

There was a sex and the city where Charlotte's brother divorced and Samantha had sex with him, well Charlotte was busy talking about how much of a ho Samantha is and her brother got mad. He said Samantha was the best thing that happened to him, cuz his ex-wife to be had stopped having sex with him and all he wanted was SEX.

 

I've also noticed that when women don't have sex with their men, it makes them aggressive. I guess that prompts men to do unreasonable things just cuz they want the sex. And, top that with him fulfilling his end of the marriage (i.e. paying the bills, "romancing" her, communicating with her etc.), if I was a guy I'd be pretty upset that she just tells me to "blow off" when all I wanna do is have sex with the woman I love. So, the "spreadsheet guy's wife" pretty much gave him the big "F-off" by blowing him off for sex.

[xxoo]

Did you read the article? That guy got turned down for sex almost every night of the week, once so that she could watch a re-run of Friends. I would have been livid. If my GF tried that crap with me, I would just quit paying the bills, and when she asks why the electric is shut off, I'd make up excuses why it didn't get paid. I think his spreadsheet idea was a good one. It let her know exactly how screwed up her behavior was.

 

If a wife does not want to have sex with her husband anymore, which is obviously the case in this situation, the onus is not on the husband to solve the problem. Whatever problem was going on, she should have dealt with it before she turned the poor sap down 24823049 times.

 

1. The tv show thing seems stupid to me. Both my partner and I would simply approach again after the show.

 

2. Maybe she did try to solve the relationship problem 2486336766 times. Too bad she doesn't have a spreadsheet.

[Divasu]

Times I "wasn't" in the mood is when we fought or, I was just plain exhausted. I mean, he'd want to do the naughty several times a day, every day, if time permitted and that was impossible for me to maintain.

Edited November 23, 2014 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Cleaning up Off Topic posts

[Divasu]

Now lets go to the root cause of this....parenting and moms especially letting their daughters dictate right under their nose, and them trying so hard to be besties with their daughters starting with facebook.

 

If little suzie has been brought up to think everything she does is alright, that attitude will follow her into relationships. I dare any woman here to argue that the dads don't at least discipline

 

I love your sweeping generalizations. You know what my father did to my mother? He took her mother's inheritance and used it for his business that my mother never saw a penny of. He stole financially from my mother.

 

But you're right, mother's overcompensate with their children. I know my mother did due in part due to a lack of an equal partnership with a husband who emotionally, verbally and physically abused both her and her children.

 

So please, stop holding others accountable for the very same generalizations you spew out.

[ThaWholigan]

There was already a thread about this a while back - feel the same way I do now. Obviously there's a strong miscommunication between the two but a spreadsheet is a retarded way of going about it. We do not know who's fault it is - we can assume that she may be turned off by him for whatever reason, but we don't know if that's his fault or not.

 

In regards to relationships, I find that miscommunication and inability to navigate incompatibility is the fault in relationships - that can be on the man, or the woman, or (usually) both parties. There will be obvious cases, like on this site, where the man can be at fault. But it seems the amount of times where this is so gets exaggerated conveniently whenever this kind of topic comes up. Perhaps the only difference is that a woman is the OP.

 

I find there is an equal amount of gender blaming in general whenever the topic of fault comes up. It's the man's fault if she doesn't want sex. It's the woman's fault if the man has an affair - she wasn't having sex with him. Etc, etc etc. On this site at the moment, it seems to be the women bearing more blame actually, and not the men!

 

Spin it how you want .

[Taramere]

Did you read the article? That guy got turned down for sex almost every night of the week, once so that she could watch a re-run of Friends. I would have been livid. If my GF tried that crap with me, I would just quit paying the bills, and when she asks why the electric is shut off, I'd make up excuses why it didn't get paid. I think his spreadsheet idea was a good one. It let her know exactly how screwed up her behavior was.

 

None of us know the details of their marriage. Maybe a level of mutual dislike, direspect or just discomfort had set in (it certainly sounds like it) which may not have stopped him from wanting to have sex with her, but that resulted in her not wanting to be intimate with him. If so, that wouldn't be one person's screwed up behaviour. It would be two people in a bad marriage.

 

Evidently from her husband's perspective, the problem in the marriage is that she is saying no to sex. As xxoo says, too bad we didn't get to see her spreadsheet. That might have given a clearer picture. However, his spreadsheet and his apparent perception that her not wanting to have sex with him is misbehaviour on her part and constitutes everything that's wrong with the marriage is a bit of a clue as to what kind of person this is.

 

People can withdraw sexually for all sorts of reasons. Depression, infidelity, feeling unattractive, feeling estranged from the partner/a loss of emotional intimacy. Somebody withdrawing sexually, if it has become habitual, is a sign that something's wrong in the relationship - and that's something that requires investigation. I can't fathom how somebody could encounter that kind of withdrawal from a partner and instead of trying to find out what's wrong, simply compile a list of "times you said no and excuses you gave", it to them and then stop speaking to them.

 

It seems like a bad relationship generally. On the other hand, like attracts like. It could be that this is a case of two selfish, entitled individuals coming together and being wholly unable to make a relationship work. For a situation like the one that developed between them to be addressed properly, at least one would have been prepared to take the adult "something's wrong - we need to talk". Neither of them did...but I contend that her sexual withdrawal was probably just a symptom of that bad dynamic between them rather than the only problem in an otherwise functional relationship.

[Tayken]

But you're right,

 

That is all I had needed to hear from you...come back when you are married and have kids.

 

As they say over there, have a good day!

[Divasu]

That is all I had needed to hear from you...come back when you are married and have kids.

 

As they say over there, have a good day!

 

Thanks for dismissing everything I said. You know, it took me years on here to admit to that.

 

There is one example of lack of empathy folks.

[Taramere]

Thanks for dismissing everything I said. You know, it took me years on here to admit to that.

 

There is one example of lack of empathy folks.

 

My bedtime's way overdue, and I'm going to take a break from this site for a bit - but I just wanted to give you a quick cyberhug. I know making personal disclosures online can leave a person feeling quite raw.

[Divasu]

My bedtime's way overdue, and I'm going to take a break from this site for a bit - but I just wanted to give you a quick cyberhug. I know making personal disclosures online can leave a person feeling quite raw.

 

Thank you Taramere, that means a lot. (hug back )

[OwMyEyeball]

This is a tabloid website that based their "article" on a Reddit post.

 

Just more confirmation bias for the jaded.

 

Thank you "throwwwwaway29"!

[Giggle]

And then you woke up...am I right?

 

I like sex entirely too much =oP but no, The best way I've thought to describe it is that my sense of honor just does not allow for such devious behavior. I have no desire to act like that. I have a hard time understanding how others feel it's an ok thing to do.

[Tayken]

I like sex entirely too much =oP but no, The best way I've thought to describe it is that my sense of honor just does not allow for such devious behavior. I have no desire to act like that. I have a hard time understanding how others feel it's an ok thing to do.

 

Quantity doesn't usually equal quality

[CrystalCastles]

I find there is an equal amount of gender blaming in general whenever the topic of fault comes up.

 

Yeah, I was wondering that too. This site sure has quite the collection of gender-bashing threads. Idk why it always has to be MEN vs. WOMEN. Why it always has to be the fault of a whole gender because some guy didn't get the sex he wanted. On top of that...a spreadsheet? Seriously? I'm sorry, what? :laugh:

[Radu]

There are some things that i feel many in this thread have missed and after reading it, i have to say that the OP might be right about women doing nothing that can appear to have faults.

 

Why the chart ?

It's simple, it's logical and when you want to remove emotions and want something clear ... it's a good thing.

It could very well have been a written journal.

The form matters not in this case.

 

He did not broadcast this to the world.

She did.

He sent it to her mail [her work email ... not a good idea there], and she chose to put it out there on the net.

Please feel free to try to convince me that part of the reason was not her desire to humiliate him a little.

And even if it wasn't ... she has a major problem [just as he has] that she chooses this public shaming outlet instead of going to talk to him.

 

And speaking of charts ... a woman makes an excel chart about the d*ck size of athletes, puts it on the net and she's a hero.

But now, a man makes a chart documenting his wife's behaviour, does not make it public, yet he's the villain when she does make it public ?

 

Even removing all this stuff, all this background noise, after reading the chart itself ... that relationship has major issues, and she is part of them.

[GemmaUK]

Well, in my last RS I was the one who did everything wrong.

 

 

I would have a list reeled off to me of 'incidents' each week which I had to justify.

 

 

I never knew before then that wanting time to do a load of my washing and hang it to dry was a need that was unacceptable.

Other things that were a problem were cooking, eating, cleaning, talking to friends or family, watching a TV show, reading a book, being at work, travelling to and from work, going food shopping and cutting my toe nails.

Having a shower was OK, as was sleeping but only between certain hours.

 

 

:roll eyes:

[Els]

There are always going to be people whose reason is so clouded by hatred and bitterness that they perpetually believe that men/women are always in the wrong. However, trying to one-up them by beating them at their own game doesn't exactly help in any way. If you truly believe in taking a neutral stance, then do so yourself first. Making a thread that is a blanket attack on one entire gender is really just going to exacerbate the issue you are complaining about in the first place.

 

That being said, I did read the spreadsheet story when it was first brought up and my opinion remains the same: they were both in the wrong. If it had been a woman making a spreadsheet about how often her husband takes her out on dates instead of talking to him about it first, my response would be the same.

[veggirl]

There are some things that i feel many in this thread have missed and after reading it, i have to say that the OP might be right about women doing nothing that can appear to have faults.

 

Why the chart ?

It's simple, it's logical and when you want to remove emotions and want something clear ... it's a good thing.

It could very well have been a written journal.

The form matters not in this case.

 

He did not broadcast this to the world.

She did.

He sent it to her mail [her work email ... not a good idea there], and she chose to put it out there on the net.

Please feel free to try to convince me that part of the reason was not her desire to humiliate him a little.

And even if it wasn't ... she has a major problem [just as he has] that she chooses this public shaming outlet instead of going to talk to him.

 

And speaking of charts ... a woman makes an excel chart about the d*ck size of athletes, puts it on the net and she's a hero.

But now, a man makes a chart documenting his wife's behaviour, does not make it public, yet he's the villain when she does make it public ?

 

Even removing all this stuff, all this background noise, after reading the chart itself ... that relationship has major issues, and she is part of them.

 

agreed.

 

honestly don't understand the outrage over the chart.

 

maybe because I have actually sat down to document things when I wanted to clear up a situation w/ myself and my bf. as Radu said, it removes the emotion from it which is a good thing when you are that upset.

[joystickd]

There was already a thread about this a while back - feel the same way I do now. Obviously there's a strong miscommunication between the two but a spreadsheet is a retarded way of going about it. We do not know who's fault it is - we can assume that she may be turned off by him for whatever reason, but we don't know if that's his fault or not.

 

In regards to relationships, I find that miscommunication and inability to navigate incompatibility is the fault in relationships - that can be on the man, or the woman, or (usually) both parties. There will be obvious cases, like on this site, where the man can be at fault. But it seems the amount of times where this is so gets exaggerated conveniently whenever this kind of topic comes up. Perhaps the only difference is that a woman is the OP.

 

I find there is an equal amount of gender blaming in general whenever the topic of fault comes up. It's the man's fault if she doesn't want sex. It's the woman's fault if the man has an affair - she wasn't having sex with him. Etc, etc etc. On this site at the moment, it seems to be the women bearing more blame actually, and not the men!

 

Spin it how you want .

 

Probably because frustrated men get on the net and vent more than women.

[joystickd]

On the other hand, like attracts like. It could be that this is a case of two selfish, entitled individuals coming together and being wholly unable to make a relationship work. For a situation like the one that developed between them to be addressed properly, at least one would have been prepared to take the adult "something's wrong - we need to talk". Neither of them did...but I contend that her sexual withdrawal was probably just a symptom of that bad dynamic between them rather than the only problem in an otherwise functional relationship.

 

One of the biggest problems in dating and relationships is that people don't realize like attracts like. If you really want to change the people attracted to you then change you. The moment you mention this people try everything to avoid this truth. Who you date or be in a relationship with on some leave is a reflection of you.