Back again

[Blackknight]

They are divorced, her ex is dating other women while having sex with her. There is absolutely no reason for her to make herself vulnerable to someone who may not want her back. That's like telling her to jump in a fire and not expect to get burned.

 

I personally can't support a FWB situation if both parties are not on the same page. She's having sex with him in hopes of winning him back. If he felt the same he wouldn't be seeing and possibly sleeping with other women. The other issue is that Sofie is worried about discussing the situation with her ex. Without communication this is going to end badly. I'd hate to see Sofie have to start the healing process over again from square one.

I don't know why we bother. This poster doesn't care one wit about sophie or her feelings. Or open honest communication. He just wants to see her stay in an unhealthy place because she is the and always be the bad guy to him.

[Blackknight]

Start on even ground, but the BS has to forgive, first. How is that even? Sofie cheated, so she needs to make the extra effort, and be willing to be the vulnerable one.

 

Being vunerable doesn't mean excepting an unhealthy unbalanced situation. In fact being being vunerable as you propse is being open and honest eveb at the risk of losing him. Seeking him out for sex to win him back isn't being vunerable. Because it is sex and if he is having sex with multiple people he obviously doesn't require a relationship to do so.

[Blackknight]

Either she wants her marriage back or she doesn't. Her ex was NOT in healthy relationship where he was respected and loved... instead he was, emotionally abused and disrespected. That crap doesn't fix itself overnight! I think your advice borders on tone deaf and self centered.

 

"If you love someone let them go and if they come back then they are yours."

 

 

 

I know this situation sucks, but you have to decide soon whether you want him back or not. If you play hard to get.... then he might just drop you completely or it might spur his interest.

 

As a guy who has kinda been through this... the affair probably destroyed his self esteem. I went though a period of dating women just to rebuild my confidence. By that point my xWife and I were so embroiled in a bitter divorce that you could not have paid me to go back. Had she been more like you... I can honestly say I would have had a tough choice.

Oh here it is. Let's guilt sophie into sex with her husband because if she doesn't put out she obviously doesn't want him back. Would you give this advice to your teenage daughter? "Listen dear, you cheated on your bf and so be a booty call for him for as long as he calls even if it makes you feel used or sad or cheap. Because it will restore his manhood and he might take you back if you do what he wants with no complaints or expressin of feelings"

[JustJoe]

Oh here it is. Let's guilt sophie into sex with her husband because if she doesn't put out she obviously doesn't want him back. Would you give this advice to your teenage daughter? "Listen dear, you cheated on your bf and so be a booty call for him for as long as he calls even if it makes you feel used or sad or cheap. Because it will restore his manhood and he might take you back if you do what he wants with no complaints or expressin of feelings"

More fairy tales. Instead of going off into outer space, perhaps it would be better to give the OP the advice she seeks?

[JustJoe]

Sofie, what I'm going to say is speculation on my part, so take it as you like. You are attempting to justify your feelings by blaming your ex. Stop this immediately, as it will only seem to him as if you are reverting to your former selfish behavior.

Your ex husband , obviously still has feelings for you or he wouldn't be seeing you. this is very positive, and should be reinforced. Making demands on him regarding exclusivity, is very premature, and at this point, would not be viewed positively

Your ex husband is seeing you because he cares about you, he is seeing other women because he doesn't trust you.

Before you discuss where your relationship is going, you must prove that you have changed enough for him to take a leap of faith with you. So, it is my opinion, that you be patient, avoid making demands, and continue to put his interests foremost, UNTIL trust has been re-established. By doing so, you will prove that you are a worthwhile person, increase your self image, and THEN you can discuss the relationship and it's boundaries, within a positive, loving atmosphere. It will take time, but if you were a faithful person, it wouldn't be necessary, would it?

Edited October 19, 2014 by JustJoe

[AlwaysGrowing]

She is sleeping with him and wants a relationship. He is just screwing her. Do you think he is daft? Does not know it hurts her?

 

I am not projecting anything. She says it hurts her. My feeling is he knows it. That is punishment. It is even possible she is punishing herself by taking scraps. Neither of these scenarios help anyone heal and move on.

 

Saying he is deliberately hurting her to punish her is projecting.

 

Sophie admits that she is the initiator most hook ups.

 

How she feels afterwards is hers to own....not her XH.

 

All because someone feels something doesn't make it true.

 

Feelings are real. Not necessarily truth..and most are not static. A poor compass to use on its own.

[2.50 a gallon]

I really don't think he is trying to punish her. I think this might be a good thing, as man he is reclaiming what used to be his. A possible first step towards getting back together.

As for her dating others, he would be gone for good.

[Blackknight]

Saying he is deliberately hurting her to punish her is projecting.

 

Sophie admits that she is the initiator most hook ups.

 

How she feels afterwards is hers to own....not her XH.

 

All because someone feels something doesn't make it true.

 

Feelings are real. Not necessarily truth..and most are not static. A poor compass to use on its own.

 

So she should ignore her feelings which directly affect her self worth and continue to do something that is causinf self harm because feelings aren't important. People seem to think her husband is a prize she should do anything to get even sacrifice her self esteem. I think instead of trying to use sex to get him back she should stop the actions that bring negativity into her life and focus on being a person who can hold her head high.

 

Being in a sorta fwb situation while desperately hoping for more yet hearing all about the other conquests is not healthy or good for anyone. And just because she cheated doesn't mean she has to accept it.

[AlwaysGrowing]

So she should ignore her feelings which directly affect her self worth and continue to do something that is causinf self harm because feelings aren't important. People seem to think her husband is a prize she should do anything to get even sacrifice her self esteem. I think instead of trying to use sex to get him back she should stop the actions that bring negativity into her life and focus on being a person who can hold her head high.

 

Being in a sorta fwb situation while desperately hoping for more yet hearing all about the other conquests is not healthy or good for anyone. And just because she cheated doesn't mean she has to accept it.

 

Being an adult...I can hold two or more ideas in my head at the same time.

 

1. How Sophie feels afterwards is not healthy.

2. Her husband is not responsible for how she feels afterwards..as it was her decision.

3. Her husband need not be cast in the role of punish-er just because Sophie feels bad afterwards.

 

My other posts in this thread advocate dealing with her negative view of herself.

[DKT3]

This thread seems to keep going in circles. What I don't understand is how some have made this purely about sex even when she says it isn't.

 

What's at issue is she doesn't want him spending time with other woman, something that she lost her right to object to when her affair resulted in divorce. Of course she doesn't have to sleep with him if his seeing others bring her pain, she doesn't however have any say in him seeing other women.

 

Telling her she is being used or punished is just wrong since none of us know what her ex's mindset is.

 

This leads to her options, she can accept that he is seeing other women, or move on. I sense that she is looking for a way to stop it with out risking him walking away. The truth is she would have an issue with him seeing other women without having a continues sexual relationship with him. Why? Because it isn't about the sex, its about the fear that she is losing him.

[WisdomSeeker]

The solution to the OP's problem seems very simple from my perspective. If the casually intimate relationship with her ex-husband is creating feelings of degradation and worthlessness in Sophie, she should of course discontinue those interactions. It is her priority to look after her psychological health.

 

That said, she must also understand that withdrawing from the arrangement may compromise her goal of eventually reconciling with her former spouse. It is true that Sophie's penance for her adultery was the destruction of her marriage. It is also true that, having paid such a debt, it is not unfair for her to desire a new relationship with her ex-husband with a relatively clean slate. Is such a thing possible beyond abstraction? Who is to say? Crime and punishment are wonderfully neat things in the world of philosophy, but they are seldom so tidy in the real world.

 

I imagine that Sophie's ex would take quite the offense at being told that he must now recommit to Sophie exclusively after having suffered her infidelity. I would. In fact, I would have great difficulty detaching myself from other women for the sake of jumping in fully with a previously unfaithful partner.

 

I'm not saying that my reaction would be righteous. I'm simply saying what that reaction would be. It's up to Sophie to make her choice. What does she value more at this point? Does she want to stop her emotional pain and step away from her ex (and potentially sacrificing any chance of reconciliation), or does she want to continue this path in the hopes that it will end as she wishes?

[No Limit]

its about the fear that she is losing him.

 

But wasn't it clear from the very beginning that the chances for reconciliation are slim, at best? In the thread in which she told him - far too late - about everything, he didn't talk to her, gave no sign at all that he'd be interested in the marriage anymore, didn't even want to hear her out or anything at all. This is basically their/her 2nd attempt at hysterical bonding.

 

Sorry but losing him was quite a clear point on the list of "What I lose with my affair". The only problem I see here is that Sofie still hasn't let go of the idea to be married/together and play cozy little family. And whatever sort of 'intimacy' she's trying to keep by being FWB isn't real; any evening he could meet a woman that will pique his interest, sweep him off his feet, and it'd be gone. Since she obviously can't demand exclusivity from him, I think it's time to finally let go; it might spare her a lot of pain.

 

Again, just my personal opinion. Unless she stays put or attempts to talk to him we all can only give our own ideas, whether they're meant to encourage Sofie or try to prepare her for negative outcomes.

[Blackknight]

It’s after I feel completely worthless knowing I’m only good for a quick is lay. I just don’t know what to do anymore.

 

For those that are so determined it isn't about the sex. Reread her posts and specially this line. Yes, she will have a hard time with him seeing other women. But this, this is because of the sex. And just because the sex is great while it is happenin doesn't make it healthy or sustainable.

[No Limit]

For those that are so determined it isn't about the sex. Reread her posts and specially this line. Yes, she will have a hard time with him seeing other women. But this, this is because of the sex. And just because the sex is great while it is happenin doesn't make it healthy or sustainable.

 

The sex is just her last option to cling to him, hoping he'll come around. It's a part of the whole puzzle, but not the main part.

[Blackknight]

The sex is just her last option to cling to him, hoping he'll come around. It's a part of the whole puzzle, but not the main part.

 

True, but it is a big part in how she is feeling currently and what sh is using to try to cling to him.

[DKT3]

For those that are so determined it isn't about the sex. Reread her posts and specially this line. Yes, she will have a hard time with him seeing other women. But this, this is because of the sex. And just because the sex is great while it is happenin doesn't make it healthy or sustainable.

 

Talk about only reading what one wants.

 

She also says that she enjoys the sex and its has been her (all but twice) that went looking for it.

 

Again reading along she wants more then he is willing to give at this point. She wants the romantic dinners that she thinks the other women getting. If given that there is no problem. If there were no other women there is no problem. She wants the relationship that she threw away.

 

Divorce doesn't put them on equal footing, in order to get what she wants from him she has to prove herself a person worthy of his trust. That isn't equal. Its asanine to expect divorce to wipe away the issue she created. They are after all the same two people and this reconnect hasn't been going on long.

[Blackknight]

Talk about only reading what one wants.

 

She also says that she enjoys the sex and its has been her (all but twice) that went looking for it.

 

Again reading along she wants more then he is willing to give at this point. She wants the romantic dinners that she thinks the other women getting. If given that there is no problem. If there were no other women there is no problem. She wants the relationship that she threw away.

 

Divorce doesn't put them on equal footing, in order to get what she wants from him she has to prove herself a person worthy of his trust. That isn't equal. Its asanine to expect divorce to wipe away the issue she created. They are after all the same two people and this reconnect hasn't been going on long.

Just because you enjoy somethig and seek it ot doesn't make it good or healthy. And by her own admission she is sleeping with him to win him back. I think there are better less cheap ways of restartin a relationship. It isn't healthy and I can't think of a single professional that would agree with that method. If they are meant to be back together and on equel footing and in a healthy way then it will happen because he sees her as someone he wants to be with and give a second chance too. Not because of sex. My opinion is she needs to move on and find something else to do with her life besides desperately trying to win someone back who obviously is in the process of movin on. But that is her choice. If this is the obession she wants to feed then she will feed it. But I do think if the after feelings of sex are making her feel cheap then she should at least stop that.

[DKT3]

Just because you enjoy somethig and seek it ot doesn't make it good or healthy. And by her own admission she is sleeping with him to win him back. I think there are better less cheap ways of restartin a relationship. It isn't healthy and I can't think of a single professional that would agree with that method. If they are meant to be back together and on equel footing and in a healthy way then it will happen because he sees her as someone he wants to be with and give a second chance too. Not because of sex. My opinion is she needs to move on and find something else to do with her life besides desperately trying to win someone back who obviously is in the process of movin on. But that is her choice. If this is the obession she wants to feed then she will feed it. But I do think if the after feelings of sex are making her feel cheap then she should at least stop that.

 

I actually think you may be so strong on this because of how hard you had to work. Maybe you feel that it was all for nothing.

 

I never suggested she jump his bones, what I'm saying is two fold 1) if this relationship is something she wants then she will have to humble herself. Work on the wayward mindset and attitude that made her ok with cheating. 2) she is not yet in a position to make any demands on him.

 

None of which means she needs to sleep with him.

 

If my memory is working right (I am watching DD play softball, pretty mind numbing stuff) Sophie ex wouldn't even talk to her for a period of time. Now he is, he is also giving her time away from and apart from the kids. Having been in that position, that isn't moving on.

[drifter777]

She is sleeping with him and wants a relationship. He is just screwing her. Do you think he is daft? Does not know it hurts her?

 

I am not projecting anything. She says it hurts her. My feeling is he knows it. That is punishment. It is even possible she is punishing herself by taking scraps. Neither of these scenarios help anyone heal and move on.

I'm not sure i agree that his motivation is purely punishment - i think he also likes the no-strings sex. But the punishment aspect is a side benefit for him. After what she did to him i'm sure his desire to punish her is powerful. I also think she is punishing herself. Maybe this FWB arrangement is necessary for them both right now. Maybe...

[Spectre]

Start on even ground, but the BS has to forgive, first. How is that even? Sofie cheated, so she needs to make the extra effort, and be willing to be the vulnerable one.

 

This is a good point, and I find it astounding people are saying the EX is the one who needs to work for her. So saying he needs to "work for it" is astounding. He doesn't need to work for anything at this point. Sorry, you f*ck up this bad? It takes a lot of groveling to fix it.

 

People telling the OP to "make him work for it" and to lie about dating other men are really just giving her the type of advice that will push the ex away even more.

 

Though I still have to say..if this guy was genuinely interested in getting back together with the OP he would not be diddling other women on the side. Sorry, I think you just need to let this guy go.

 

I also don't think he is doing it to hurt her, but I do think he probably sees it as a definite bonus to the situation. Which..well, he is free to do what he wants. He doesn't seem to be lying to her or forcing her to do anything. I think it is time to walk away, enough damage has been done.

Edited October 19, 2014 by Spectre

[Ruffian1]

Sophie

 

 

Protect your heart. You want his love back. You want "you and him" back.

But it can't go back.

He knows you want him back . . . you want him to love you exclusively. He. Knows. Even if you don't say it. Action speak way louder.

 

 

He is damaged is some ways from what happened to you two. If it bothers you that he is sleeping/dating OW, you are just setting yourself up for hurt.

 

 

He may just be using you. You love him, but you need to protect your heart also.

 

 

Back off, sex will not make it whole again. Let Him Go. Let it go.

 

 

If you feel cheap having sex with him then stop.

Pull yourself up, regroup, try to do No Contact other than kids. If he ever feels he wants to get back with you, that he could feel safe with you, he will let you know.

Edited October 19, 2014 by Ruffian1

[violet1]

I don't think he's using or punishing her. I think it's more about comfort and familiarity. Letting go of a long term marriage is never easy no matter how bad one person was hurt. I also don't think using sex as a way to hold on is healthy for either one of them either. Just my $0.02.

[NYWoman]

"So she should whore herself out . . ."

 

 

She already did that for the OM. She has already lost her husband, she can not nice him back, so if she wants him back she has to be prepared to do whatever it takes for as long as it takes.

[Sofie2013]

Sophie,

 

You said you guys started talking and then started seeing each other.

 

Whats not clear to me is did you talk about what your interactions with each other were going to look like or did you just fall into this arrangement?

 

The reason I ask, is that it has seemed to me that communication of the real and important sort is sorely lacking in this R.

 

You ex is a lawyer so I assume he communicates well for a living. Why is it that you two cant have honest communication over whats going on?

 

Since the divorce we always maintained a good friendship we would still talk to each other as friends from time to time. We have a lot of the same friends so we would see each other at different social events and we talk and joke around with each. Sometimes even flirt. But we never discussed this kind of arrangement it just kind of happened. I had a pool party for the kids he stopped by. At the end of the night my boys wanted to spend the weekend with my parents. My ex was cool with so the kids went with my parents. My ex stayed and helped me clean up a bit. With a little flirting and wine we both just went for it and he end up spending the night with me. Next time it was more planned by him I just went along with it.

 

He is a good communicator. He’s very good at getting his point and ideas a cross. But when it comes to feelings, emotions and things like that he shuts down he rather act like everything is fine then to actually talk about them and work it out. And a big reason why I don’t want to talk to him about this is I am scared of what he might say. I know sooner or later I’m going to have to talk to him about what kind of relationship we have. I just rather not have it now.

[SawtoothMars]

Oh here it is. Let's guilt sophie into sex with her husband because if she doesn't put out she obviously doesn't want him back. Would you give this advice to your teenage daughter? "Listen dear, you cheated on your bf and so be a booty call for him for as long as he calls even if it makes you feel used or sad or cheap. Because it will restore his manhood and he might take you back if you do what he wants with no complaints or expressin of feelings"

 

Look... you clearly just want her to quit and move on. If I felt that was what SHE wanted... I would give her the same advice as you.

 

She wants her marriage back. It may feel like crap for the short term, but this is pretty much her only shot. Had my cheating xWife been like OP... I very likely would have come back.