My Wife is No Longer in Love with Me

[UntoldStory]

"...However, sadly, my story isn't one of those. We worked our asses off, and we're still getting divorced...."

 

If I am not wrong , were not you having an affair while you were working so hard on your marriage ?

 

 

Best of luck

 

Don't mean to t/j but felt I should respond. I did have an EA that helped me recover from my own depression and showed me my marriage was in deep trouble. I chose not to disclose the EA to stbxh because xMM had nothing to do with the problems we finally attempted to address head on and fix. The problems had always been there and I had been emotionally dead for about 5 years before we went to MC (and IC for both of us). But to address the point: During the period I was in MC with sbtx, I was in NC with xMM. Have since been in periods of LC/NC, but NC again now.

[jstobo]

OK, bare with me as this may be long. Yesterday, I felt we should still meet with our mediator to get the financials in order. One of the concerns my W has is about my bonuses. She made a comment like how would she know if I receive a bonus. I asked if that means she doesn't trust me. She retracted the comment and apologized for making it. My W is an artist and she teaches abstract art lessons and of course sells paintings. I created her site, FB page, Blog, business accounts, e-mails...everything. The e-mails still go to my computer but I haven't looked at that e-mail in months.

 

My W told me she sold one of her big paintings to a client, because I saw her taking it out of my car. For some reason I looked at the business e-mail yesterday and saw an exchange between her and the client. The facts are, she sold 5 paintings to this client. Big ones!! Last night, she happened to e-mail me about the numbers I sent our mediator about her income. I got to reply about her possibly selling paintings and such. I made an example of the ONE painting she sold to the client. She said that painting was good, but all it did was make up for a few classes this month she lost due to sports. I had proof she received confirmation from the client wanting to buy the paintings and her response to the client about it. She chose to withhold that information from me. I calmly replied it was too bad she wasn't comfortable sharing the information because I would have been excited for her. She responded with I must have read the clients e-mail before she did which was a bummer. My response was, it is a bummer because the facts are she responded to the client before she response to me. She responded with, Oh, I still didn't give her a chance.

 

My current viewpoint is, she is proving to still be untrustworthy. I have made all these changes to improve our relationship and she has proven to not be changing for me. When someone shows you their true colors, believe them!!

[ShatteredReality]

OK, bare with me as this may be long. Yesterday, I felt we should still meet with our mediator to get the financials in order. One of the concerns my W has is about my bonuses. She made a comment like how would she know if I receive a bonus. I asked if that means she doesn't trust me. She retracted the comment and apologized for making it. My W is an artist and she teaches abstract art lessons and of course sells paintings. I created her site, FB page, Blog, business accounts, e-mails...everything. The e-mails still go to my computer but I haven't looked at that e-mail in months.

 

My W told me she sold one of her big paintings to a client, because I saw her taking it out of my car. For some reason I looked at the business e-mail yesterday and saw an exchange between her and the client. The facts are, she sold 5 paintings to this client. Big ones!! Last night, she happened to e-mail me about the numbers I sent our mediator about her income. I got to reply about her possibly selling paintings and such. I made an example of the ONE painting she sold to the client. She said that painting was good, but all it did was make up for a few classes this month she lost due to sports. I had proof she received confirmation from the client wanting to buy the paintings and her response to the client about it. She chose to withhold that information from me. I calmly replied it was too bad she wasn't comfortable sharing the information because I would have been excited for her. She responded with I must have read the clients e-mail before she did which was a bummer. My response was, it is a bummer because the facts are she responded to the client before she response to me. She responded with, Oh, I still didn't give her a chance.

 

My current viewpoint is, she is proving to still be untrustworthy. I have made all these changes to improve our relationship and she has proven to not be changing for me. When someone shows you their true colors, believe them!!

 

Ok....well....remember how I told you to cover your bases in case things do eventually go south and don't get fixed? Sounds kinda like that's what she's doing also. My H is self employed...I know if we break down our finances he takes out direct expenses before counting the income - the cost of the item sold, and the costs related to the sale - fees and taxes, postage and packaging. His income is extremely fluid...which is why I still work full time. He can float all our bills one month and then not even pay for gas for three months in a row - so on that count I don't think the sale of her paintings should be a huge huge deal. I don't agree with her lying. I don't feel that was the right move...it does seem her fears are still guiding many of her actions...that being one of them. And how you handle this being another. You're angry - which you have a right to be. So tell her calmly that you don't like that she lied to you. And BE angry - but don't blow up about it. I'm sorry but the blow up fights are a long ways off from happening in your marriage without it driving a wedge. Even now in mine if my H blows up I get some of those old fears back...only now I have learned if I actually let him see my reaction he wakes up quicker to what he's doing - before I always hid it. She may not show you her true reaction either...she may just climb back into her shell.

 

Obviously the paintings will be factored in when you meet with the mediator. Tell her next time not to try to cover it up and that you promise to be reasonable about these things...that even if things don't work out you want to be amicable, so if she'll trust you about your bonuses then you will expect her honesty about the paintings...that's not unreasonable and it's still leaving her options...tell her otherwise your bonuses don't count and then you won't care about her paintings.

[jstobo]

Ok....well....remember how I told you to cover your bases in case things do eventually go south and don't get fixed? Sounds kinda like that's what she's doing also. My H is self employed...I know if we break down our finances he takes out direct expenses before counting the income - the cost of the item sold, and the costs related to the sale - fees and taxes, postage and packaging. His income is extremely fluid...which is why I still work full time. He can float all our bills one month and then not even pay for gas for three months in a row - so on that count I don't think the sale of her paintings should be a huge huge deal. I don't agree with her lying. I don't feel that was the right move...it does seem her fears are still guiding many of her actions...that being one of them. And how you handle this being another. You're angry - which you have a right to be. So tell her calmly that you don't like that she lied to you. And BE angry - but don't blow up about it. I'm sorry but the blow up fights are a long ways off from happening in your marriage without it driving a wedge. Even now in mine if my H blows up I get some of those old fears back...only now I have learned if I actually let him see my reaction he wakes up quicker to what he's doing - before I always hid it. She may not show you her true reaction either...she may just climb back into her shell.

 

Obviously the paintings will be factored in when you meet with the mediator. Tell her next time not to try to cover it up and that you promise to be reasonable about these things...that even if things don't work out you want to be amicable, so if she'll trust you about your bonuses then you will expect her honesty about the paintings...that's not unreasonable and it's still leaving her options...tell her otherwise your bonuses don't count and then you won't care about her paintings.

 

The new me handled it exactly how you said. I told her it was too bad she didn't feel comfortable telling me. And my last e-mail to her was stating "congratulations, that's exciting." No blow up and nothing accusatory. But unfortunately the lie has put my wall right back up. I now question her true motives. I'm not going to say anything, but I will change my actions. I am really questioning whether or not I want to be with this woman. I'm going to take some time to think about things. If she withdraws, well that's OK. I just don't feel like sending her compliments and affection right after she lied about this. Not to mention, she has not shown any remorse or even acknowledged any wrong doing.

[ShatteredReality]

The new me handled it exactly how you said. I told her it was too bad she didn't feel comfortable telling me. And my last e-mail to her was stating "congratulations, that's exciting." No blow up and nothing accusatory. But unfortunately the lie has put my wall right back up. I now question her true motives. I'm not going to say anything, but I will change my actions. I am really questioning whether or not I want to be with this woman. I'm going to take some time to think about things. If she withdraws, well that's OK. I just don't feel like sending her compliments and affection right after she lied about this. Not to mention, she has not shown any remorse or even acknowledged any wrong doing.

 

Understandable. I think when you pull away it will hurt her and she will reach out, though...which could be a good thing if you decide you do want to be with her - bad if you don't. I wouldn't send her compliments or affection right after catching her in a lie either - and my H didn't either. As a matter of fact...any additional lies made him question if he wanted to keep working on things or not and pull away also. We made an agreement...my lies were out of fear (I would not tell him I ran into my sister at the store because I would fear he would think I lied about why I needed to go to the store. But running into her would keep me there longer and I would lie about why I was there longer. Stuff like that - little now but big then). So we came to an agreement that if I did lie I would approach him as quickly as I could muster up but no more than 48 hrs and tell him that I had something to tell him that he wouldn't like. I would then either tell him right then or take a breather for a little bit (still dealing with it that same day) and then tell him the lie. He would then retreat to the garage for his initial reaction and write furiously in his journal...probably things I am glad I never heard/read....and come back with a reaction that was more appropriate to the situation instead of a complete overreaction. I had to admit to lying about pulling $ out of our acct when I first got my check and putting it away...I was covert - $20 extra in a shopping trip or something like that...he was hurt at first but eventually after we had made up the $ I put away fixed the car and paid for an anniversary trip to the beach, so ultimately it was a positive...the lies won't be able to continue if you two reconcile. She just needs to know why she's doing it...if it's out of fear then that can be solved...if it's something else then that's a little different.

[jstobo]

We spoke a bit yesterday and hammered some things out. We may be back on track, but I don't know yet. She is still being guarded and distant. It's very difficult for me to handle. Since she doesn't tell me what she is thinking or feeling, I'm left just having to trust her intentions. Very tough after all she did the last 6 - 7 months. But I have to say, she never did anything close to what some of the other posters have described. I have far less to forgive.

 

I need to introduce a new wrinkle I haven't mentioned yet. I met a woman a month ago when my marriage was apparently over and we were going through mediation. Obviously it was too soon, but it just happened. When my W came back, I was happy to be given the opportunity to put my family back together. I told the other woman what happened and she did the right thing by saying you can't go forward until you are clear on your past. Let me be clear, there wasn't anything physical with this woman. We were truly getting to know each other and take things slow. But I haven't been able to stop communicating with her. She has responded positively to our communication and I am being extremely open and honest with her. I am very conflicted as to what is the right thing to do. It isn't hard to compare. My W spends a day not contacting me or acting guarded and I gravitate towards the other woman. My W opens up and gives a little, I gravitate towards her. Right now, the other woman is winning because my W is guarded or distant 80% of the time.

 

I would like to give my W a chance, but she is kind of blowing it right now. I am so tempted to tell her about this other woman, but I know that is a bad idea. The reason I want to, is when I found out about her EA I got a major wake up call and stepped it up big time. I can't help but think that may happen to her.

[ShatteredReality]

We spoke a bit yesterday and hammered some things out. We may be back on track, but I don't know yet. She is still being guarded and distant. It's very difficult for me to handle. Since she doesn't tell me what she is thinking or feeling, I'm left just having to trust her intentions. Very tough after all she did the last 6 - 7 months. But I have to say, she never did anything close to what some of the other posters have described. I have far less to forgive.

 

I need to introduce a new wrinkle I haven't mentioned yet. I met a woman a month ago when my marriage was apparently over and we were going through mediation. Obviously it was too soon, but it just happened. When my W came back, I was happy to be given the opportunity to put my family back together. I told the other woman what happened and she did the right thing by saying you can't go forward until you are clear on your past. Let me be clear, there wasn't anything physical with this woman. We were truly getting to know each other and take things slow. But I haven't been able to stop communicating with her. She has responded positively to our communication and I am being extremely open and honest with her. I am very conflicted as to what is the right thing to do. It isn't hard to compare. My W spends a day not contacting me or acting guarded and I gravitate towards the other woman. My W opens up and gives a little, I gravitate towards her. Right now, the other woman is winning because my W is guarded or distant 80% of the time.

 

I would like to give my W a chance, but she is kind of blowing it right now. I am so tempted to tell her about this other woman, but I know that is a bad idea. The reason I want to, is when I found out about her EA I got a major wake up call and stepped it up big time. I can't help but think that may happen to her.

 

So YOU are now the one having an EA. The marriage isn't over yet and - while I COMPLETELY understand - that's what this is. If this woman truly likes you then she should have no problems with you putting this thing completely on hold and not contacting her for a month or so. She WILL cloud your judgement. Right now you two have the "beginnings" of a relationship - how is that ever going to feel worse than the "reparing" stage of a relationship? It won't. Not ever. So...choose. If you want to keep working on things with your wife keep working on things with her. If you want to pursue a future with OW then do that instead...then tell your wife you tried and you're done waiting for her to come around. Because of the uniqueness of you two being separated I wouldn't see an obligation to tell her about OW but that's up to you.

 

This may or may not make a difference to you...but for me...I was just waiting for my H to step outside the marriage. It would have been the nail in the coffin telling me that no matter how hard I held on all those years...that I break down and screw up and his true self comes right back around and does not carry "us" hardly any distance at all in comparison. I know this doesn't sound fair - and it isn't fair. I am just telling you how I saw things while I was in my fog. For 8 years I carried the marriage on my shoulders with him as a guest who could check out emotionally whenever he wanted while I continued to cater to his needs...so for me it seemed that even if it took two years to get back on track - that if in that time he chose to "check out" we were done. I just didn't have it in me to carry him one more step until I somehow recharged. I recharged once I fell back into love with him completely and entirely...I got to have a good affair - one with him...cause he was no longer that other guy, so I had to get to know a lot of his nuances just like with a new relationship.

 

Tread carefully - I know she makes you feel good - but is OW who you want or is your W who you want?

[jstobo]

Tread carefully - I know she makes you feel good - but is OW who you want or is your W who you want?

 

I totally get you Shattered. It isn't fair. She put up with my stress and lack of attention for three years. My W said and did some pretty difficult things to get past on her way out. I would work to get past those things if she cared to tell me why things are different now. She says she is being guarded, but is she? Her sister and friend tells me she is miserable. OK, but divorce IS miserable. She doesn't make enough money to support HER lifestyle. The attorney has told her the amount I am obligated to give her, which leaves her severely short. (Her and her parents made the decision to rent where she rented without my involvement, so she needs to deal with that decision) Is she miserable because she is losing her best friend and love of her life OR is she miserable because she is now going to be a financially struggling single mom? Only she can answer that. But she also has the ability to tell me why its the former and not the latter. Since she hasn't pursued me in any way during these past three weeks, my conclusion is she is miserable about being a broke single mom.

 

To really answer your question. I want my W if she truly wants to be with me. But if she continues to give me nothing, than I'll continue to think she doesn't truly want to be with me. You may not have said I love you or gave affection, but I have to believe you gave something. My W has given nothing. Truthfully, it hasn't been three weeks. This hell started 7 months ago. Can you tell I'm getting a little edgier?

 

Here's just another example, I'll leave you with. My daughter had a softball game last night. Afterwards I took the kids to dinner. On the drive over I texted my W, your welcome to join us for dinner. I get an e-mail from her about 20 minutes later saying she lost her phone and asked if I had it. I reply, No, I don't have it, but that explains why you didn't respond to my dinner invitation. She e-mails, asking if I could call it. 5 minutes later, I get a text saying she found it. Nothing else. No, thanks for the dinner invitation, but (fill in the blank). Nothing.

[change]

Right now you two have the "beginnings" of a relationship - how is that ever going to feel worse than the "reparing" stage of a relationship? It won't. Not ever.

 

As hard as it may be, I think ShatteredReality is spot on here. You've put a lot into this, Jstobo, but it's possible you don't have or want to give any more. That would be your decision and a fair decision at that.

 

Do you think you can make it with a clear head while the OW is in the picture, though? If it were me, I'd go NC with the OW for a month or so -- and tell her exactly why. I can't imagine her not respecting that. It's very hard to go back to being married, easier to move forward without at this point. But is it a decision you'll regret down the road? I could only decide that by giving the marriage my full attention, but that may just be how my mind works.

 

This may or may not make a difference to you...but for me...I was just waiting for my H to step outside the marriage. It would have been the nail in the coffin telling me that no matter how hard I held on all those years...that I break down and screw up and his true self comes right back around and does not carry "us" hardly any distance at all in comparison. I know this doesn't sound fair - and it isn't fair. I am just telling you how I saw things while I was in my fog. For 8 years I carried the marriage on my shoulders with him as a guest who could check out emotionally whenever he wanted while I continued to cater to his needs...so for me it seemed that even if it took two years to get back on track - that if in that time he chose to "check out" we were done. I just didn't have it in me to carry him one more step until I somehow recharged.

 

This concept of recharging is so similar to moving on without someone. I have to say that reading this, I'm unsure when you say that you had no energy left -- did that mean you wanted to move on? My wife is trying to move on, but also not discouraging me from doing exactly what I'm doing. I don't know if it's punishment or her testing me or what. I'm curious if you did the same to you H. It also seems that having children is a monumental force to reconcile for some people; in my case, we have none.

[ShatteredReality]

I am having trouble posting...every time I tell it to quote it freezes my system and boots me...sooooooo

 

Jstobo - You mentioned that you believe I gave something rather than nothing to keep my H hanging on. The biggest difference is that I never moved out...otherwise not so much. If I made dinner for myself I made enough for two, but never went out of my way to make anything for him especially, nor did I make the foods he liked - I stuck with what I wanted and if he wanted some it was there. If he kissed me I kissed back...I responded to texts and phone calls...I really never said no to sex - but that last part is just a part of who I am anyway. I have a very high sex drive, so he was pretty much guaranteed I wouldn't refuse him that at least. I didn't initiate anything though...Had I moved out I cannot honestly say he would have chased long enough for my walls to come down...and I believe without seeing the changes so apparent it would have taken longer for them to come down...ultimately I doubt he'd have worked as hard and we most likely would not be together now. Your wife makes moves...following you until she gets her hugs..etc. It's when you "take control" that she gets nervous...Also - about not saying thanks for the invite...yeah...too much time passed. I would not have thanked you by then either. She should have thanked you when you first mentioned it before she found the phone...other than that it would have been an awkward gesture on her part - don't read into it...on the larger scale it's really nothing.

 

Change - I wanted out of my marriage. I wanted to start over. I wanted to move on. I sent our kids away so I could think clearly and we could either work things out or end it completely without scarring them more than we had to. It took a lot for him to win my heart back...even more, though, to get my head to accept what my heart wanted. If I tested or punished him it was entirely unintentional...but I cannot honestly say that some part of me didn't...

[jstobo]

Sent my W an e-mail 2 days ago about our daughter making the all-star softball team. She replied quickly saying she'll read it later that day after work. I never heard anything and the coach needed an answer. I called her and she was telling me why it was a big commitment. I told her, things are just going to get harder as the kids get older. We needed to balance what's important for them. She threw the "well it sounds like you made your decision already." Implying I'm being controlling. I said I wanted to discuss it openly. I asked, "If you felt this was too much of a commitment, why didn't you tell me? Why do I have to call you at the last minute to get an answer?" She threw back at me that I should have called if it was important enough. This is what my W does that drives me crazy. She responded saying she would read the e-mail after work, which obviously she did, and then blames me for not calling her about it. Of course that lead to more discussion about our "dating" situation. I'm pretty upset by now, because my W has not done anything to prove to me she really wants to reconcile. She just proved she hadn't changed by blaming me for something she wasn't considerate about. She has the nerve to say the reason she hasn't been doing any of those things is because I haven't changed.

 

My changes:

 

Individual counseling to help my anger

Lost 25 pounds and continue to work out

Take care of the kids 40% of the evenings, allowing her space and freedom

Reach out to her daily asking how she is

compliment her at least once a day

not accuse her of anything unless I have proof about it

taken her out on dates

ask her questions that are about her hopes and dreams

Basically worked hard to allow her to have an identity and not be threatened by it

 

I'm not perfect with all of these things, but dammit I have been trying really hard. I've been trying to be patient and allow her to take these baby steps. But when she said I hadn't changed, I found that difficult to swallow. I think its time for me to give up. She had an EA, gave me the ILYBINILWY speech, told me she wasn't attracted to me, said I'm not funny, she doesn't compliment me, took my name off our club membership without telling me, withheld financial information from me and now doesn't recognize any changes. I think it's time to believe her!!

 

The good thing here is, two months ago, I would be crying my eyes out about this. Now? I'm just mad.

[ShatteredReality]

Cool off...then send her an e-mail...or call her again. Tell her it bothered you when she said you haven't changed, that you've changed a lot and that you want nothing more than to work this out, but that you cannot keep reaching out to have her smack you down. Tell her you're not trying to be controlling...that you will give her her freedom and the divorce - unless she tells you otherwise. Tell her the last things she told you about yourself were all negative and she's given you nothing positive to hold on to in all of this time...that you love her but you think it's time to let her go. That's how you feel right? So tell her. Then leave it be...wait for a reaction...it's possible she'll just let you file and you two will go your separate ways...the other reaction could be to snap her into reality and force her hand to move forward. I believe she still cares for you but her fear has her paralyzed...something will have to give eventually...

[Richard Friedman]

How much more time are you going to waste on this same old song and dance? It's clear what's going on. Your wife is not in love with you and does not want to be with you, but has no better options. If she loved you and simply wanted you to fix some problems, don't you think she would at least reciprocate a little after the changes you've made(counselling, weight loss, etc.)? Instead she keeps you dangling on a line, giving you just enough hope so you don't cut your losses. At this point, even if she does choose you, it will be for a lack of options not genuine desire. Because you're emotionally invested in the situation you can't see the obvious. .

 

What you need to do is just start living your life. If it makes you happy, go and date other women. She is keeping you around as a fallback, so her "honesty" means nothing. If she meets a guy who gets her hot, then no doubt the very next day you'll get a message saying "Oh I think we should start dating other people. Can't appreciate what we have unless we see what's out there." By sitting on your ass you're just being a willing pawn in her game.It seems from your posts that you're a guy who actually has options. Not the usual loveshack case who wants to reconcile because he can't get laid in a whorehouse. Take advantage of them . As a man you deserve a woman who is madly in love with you, not one who settles for you, and we only live once. Don't blow it.

[Windsurf66]

OP,

 

Are you still having sex with your wife? If no, i guess there is less hope now.

 

Then why not have one last talk with her to work things out, and assess her commitment towards reconcilation. If it fails, then perhaps you should start dating again life is short, dun waste your time

 

But even if you decide to continue with reconcilation, i would still strongly suggest that you continue the friendship with the other women, so as not to put all your eggs in one basket

[ShatteredReality]

OP,

 

Are you still having sex with your wife? If no, i guess there is less hope now.

 

Then why not have one last talk with her to work things out, and assess her commitment towards reconcilation. If it fails, then perhaps you should start dating again life is short, dun waste your time

 

But even if you decide to continue with reconcilation, i would still strongly suggest that you continue the friendship with the other women, so as not to put all your eggs in one basket

 

I agree about talking to his W. If she says she wants to work on things then it's time for her to actually show it. However, if they decide on reconciliation having an EA with another woman isn't going to help at all...not one bit. Plus it completely negates everything he has gone through to get her back...

[jstobo]

Windsurf and Shattered,

 

We spoke for a while yesterday and she has described herself being in the middle. She is cautious and hopeful. She says she wants to see me be confident in the relationship and not be disappointed with her. I said it is difficult to be confident after what she did the past 6 - 7 months. Since she is unwilling to change her approach, I'm unable to change man. One of is the chicken and one is the egg.

 

I want the person who spent 13 years to break doors down to get to me if she is so miserable. I told her I will be in the middle with her though. I'm not ready to tell her no more. I am no longer going to pursue her. I will be nice, but I will not reach out to her. I will react extremely positive when and if she reaches out to me. She has to prove to me, she wants to be with me.

 

As for the other woman, I'll let the chips fall where they fall. My Wife had an EA, fell out of love with me and left our home. If my Wife doesn't understand that she risked this by making those choices, that is unfortunate.

[jstobo]

OP,

 

Are you still having sex with your wife? If no, i guess there is less hope now.

 

Then why not have one last talk with her to work things out, and assess her commitment towards reconcilation. If it fails, then perhaps you should start dating again life is short, dun waste your time

 

But even if you decide to continue with reconcilation, i would still strongly suggest that you continue the friendship with the other women, so as not to put all your eggs in one basket

 

We have not had sex in nearly two months. We just started kissing again a couple of weeks ago.

[Steadfast]

I do not believe in the "I'm waiting to see how you feel about us after I had an affair" line. Generally (not always) when a woman wants a man she'll move heaven and earth to get/keep him. I do understand what you're trying to do OP, but ask yourself exactly what it is you're trying to save. "Cautious and hopeful" is cheater-ism for "Don't go until I'm sure I can do better".

 

As for dating other women, that is the absolute worst thing you could do right now. You are not, and will not be ready for quite some time. You really do have enough on your plate. It is not the time to compound mistakes.

[jstobo]

I took the advice of many and will not get involved with the other woman. I don't want to look back and say I contributed to the demise of my marriage by doing the same things she did. I can keep my head high and say I still have not done anything i couldn't admit to easily and feel guilty for. I still feel the same though. My Wife is not moving mountains to get to me. I am still not going to pursue her. I dropped my kids off today and there is no reason for us to contact each other again until Wednesday when I pick them up. I'm going NC until then. I'll update you all if she reaches out to me in any way. I will be very nice and encouraging if she does, but it's time for her to prove she wants me.

[jstobo]

She sent me a nice e-mail this morning. We ended up speaking a little after. My Wife has said a few things over the past couple of weeks that weren't registering in my mind until this morning. She has made comments like, "I want to take things slow because I don't want to disappoint you again," or "I'm always frustrating you." Some other similar things of that nature. I've posted before that her sister and close friend both told me, unsolicited, that my W is miserable and she wants to work things out with me. Every time I interact with my W, I don't see misery.

 

On the phone, I told her I would like to understand better what she means about disappointing me or frustrating me. I explained that I am so proud of her and impressed with her. Sure I get disappointed and frustrated sometimes, but not all the time. I wanted a chance to work on what causes her to feel those things. I told her, I know it's a difficult question to answer on the spot so if she needed time to think about it, she can have all the time she needs. I think she appreciated that, because I usually want immediate answers. She told me she would talk to me later and we hung up. I'll keep to my word and give her the time she needs to respond.

[ShatteredReality]

She sent me a nice e-mail this morning. We ended up speaking a little after. My Wife has said a few things over the past couple of weeks that weren't registering in my mind until this morning. She has made comments like, "I want to take things slow because I don't want to disappoint you again," or "I'm always frustrating you." Some other similar things of that nature. I've posted before that her sister and close friend both told me, unsolicited, that my W is miserable and she wants to work things out with me. Every time I interact with my W, I don't see misery.

 

On the phone, I told her I would like to understand better what she means about disappointing me or frustrating me. I explained that I am so proud of her and impressed with her. Sure I get disappointed and frustrated sometimes, but not all the time. I wanted a chance to work on what causes her to feel those things. I told her, I know it's a difficult question to answer on the spot so if she needed time to think about it, she can have all the time she needs. I think she appreciated that, because I usually want immediate answers. She told me she would talk to me later and we hung up. I'll keep to my word and give her the time she needs to respond.

 

As I have said all along - her fears paralyze her. And most likely she's entered full force the guilt stage of her EA. There may be parts of that she doesn't want to share with you and you may want to respect that - I am not saying things she said or did that she doesn't want to share, but emotional things she goes through in order to work through it. It's best you don't get dragged through any of that....Even now I have times where I think of the details of the things that I did and I beat myself up over and over about how awful I was. I get into a vicious cycle in my head...

 

The guilt was there...but once I fell back head over heels for my H it was insurmountable. I flipped instantly from him not deserving me and needing to get out to OMG what did I do to this man?? That was a very difficult hump to get over...once I did I entered the phase where I began to try to prove to him I was worth sticking around for...and it's kinda funny cause it was right around 6-7 months after D Day....so maybe even after moving out she is on the same timeline....I mean I came on board to working things out earlier, but I didn't start making big efforts until around then...and I am still trying even now. I didn't try to move heaven and earth for him until I was sure I wasn't going to screw it all up again. That may sound like a cop out....but I was so scared of so many different things...sometimes you have to just face one fear at a time until you get out of the huge sandpit you got yourself caught up in.

 

This is encouraging - she's reaching out to you and you're handling it right - give her the time and space but also expect her to follow through...I still have high hopes for you!!

[worldgonewrong]

The guilt was there...but once I fell back head over heels for my H it was insurmountable. I flipped instantly from him not deserving me and needing to get out to OMG what did I do to this man?? That was a very difficult hump to get over...once I did I entered the phase where I began to try to prove to him I was worth sticking around for...and it's kinda funny cause it was right around 6-7 months after D Day....

 

ShatteredReality:

I'm curious - you say that you "flipped instantly". How did that happen or manifest itself? What was the 'lightbulb' that went off in your mind?

[change]

ShatteredReality:

I'm curious - you say that you "flipped instantly". How did that happen or manifest itself? What was the 'lightbulb' that went off in your mind?

 

I hope this does not constitute threadjacking, but I'm really curious, too.

 

It occurred to me yesterday that once the paperwork is started, my divorce still won't be final for at least 6 months. That's 6 months I have to keep "trying" while my stbxw "no longer has the energy to try."

 

I thought she was out there dating, fast and furious. It appears I may have been wrong, if I believe what she says. I've also placed some notes around the house that she has kept when she moved back in. No comment about them to me, and I haven't said anything to her. Same deal with other gestures.

 

This is obviously no where near how Jstobo's wife has responded; she's been way more receptive. But I'm still curious.

 

I've realized that continuing against all odds to save my marriage is a choice I'm making, not an obligation. So long as I continue to make that choice, I will continue to seek all of the feedback I can muster to make the right decisions.

[change]

On the phone, I told her I would like to understand better what she means about disappointing me or frustrating me. I explained that I am so proud of her and impressed with her. Sure I get disappointed and frustrated sometimes, but not all the time. I wanted a chance to work on what causes her to feel those things. I told her, I know it's a difficult question to answer on the spot so if she needed time to think about it, she can have all the time she needs. I think she appreciated that, because I usually want immediate answers. She told me she would talk to me later and we hung up. I'll keep to my word and give her the time she needs to respond.

 

I've gotten very little sleep lately and worked a lot, so forigve me if I'm misremembering, but didn't you have anger issues in the marriage, Jstobo? Could that be why she's hesitant in terms of disappointing or frustrating you?

[jstobo]

I've gotten very little sleep lately and worked a lot, so forigve me if I'm misremembering, but didn't you have anger issues in the marriage, Jstobo? Could that be why she's hesitant in terms of disappointing or frustrating you?

 

Yes, you are remembering correctly. I've learned through therapy that my anger issues originate from being insecure. I probably require an above average amount of verbal or physical affirmation. I'm not talking over the top, because I don't like to be suffocated like anyone else. But my Wife is a below average provider on both fronts. When I need affirmation, she doesn't give it, so I end up needing it more. That leads to insecurity, which ultimately leads to anger. With everything that has happened, I have a lot of insecurity right now about her feelings towards me. Her "take it slow" approach is giving me about 10% of what I need. Very difficult to handle.

 

I'll give you a perfect example. I called yesterday morning and asked her a few questions. I gave her the opportunity to think about them and get back to me. She said she would call me later. Those were her words. At 7:45, she texted me saying she hasn't had a kid free moment and would call me tomorrow. A secure person would probably brush it off for what it is. My insecurities take hold and take that as a clear message I am an option and not a priority. I start thinking about other things that have taken place and the insecurity turns into anger. The longer she takes to call, the harder it will be for me to be nice and loving to her when she calls. This is a perfect example of our vicious cycle.

 

I know all of you would say, why are you still chasing this woman? Well, reading back on this thread, you'll see I wasn't. I was moving on. I wasn't over her by any means, but I had accepted that our marriage was over. She came back. Since I wasn't over her, I couldn't say no to her. The part I really haven't figured out yet is why she came back, because she sure doesn't do things to show its about me versus being alone.

 

I hold on to hope that my Wife fits the story of ShatteredReality. Everytime I read a post of hers, I think I need to keep working at it and see if there are subtle changes on my W's part.

 

I'll post again when and if she calls.