sex & marriage: a wife's view

[xxoo]

Moral: People should have more oral sex.

 

I could live with that!

 

 

I agree with the sentiment--but oral sex is still very much penetrative sex from a woman's pov. If anything, it feels even more potentially vulnerable to me (which is part of the appeal when I am into it).

[carhill]

Well, on the topic of penetration, let's see how well Jeff's wife enjoys having her security penetrated without her permission. Women seem to forget that they penetrate a man's psyche and emotional well-being with their behaviors and words. Responsibility. Own it

[xxoo]

Well, on the topic of penetration, let's see how well Jeff's wife enjoys having her security penetrated without her permission. Women seem to forget that they penetrate a man's psyche and emotional well-being with their behaviors and words. Responsibility. Own it

 

Very true. And a man can do that to a woman as well.

 

I don't wish to defend women who stop having sex during marriage. I'm a big advocate of digging deep to id the issues (on both sides), and working out ways to get everyone's needs met.

[grogster]

I agree with the sentiment--but oral sex is still very much penetrative sex from a woman's pov. If anything, it feels even more potentially vulnerable to me (which is part of the appeal when I am into it).

 

 

Darn! Well, this discussion has certainly been penetrating, and in a positive way.

 

I suspect that gender-based biological differences, aggravated by relationship trust, power and respect issues, lie at the core of most festering sexual withdrawal battles.

 

My only point is that women not ignore (or devalue or disparage) male sexual drive in favor of amorphous, often unexpressed female intimacy needs.

 

Man does not live by hugs alone.

[carhill]

Man does not live by hugs alone.

 

I would've killed for a hug. Honestly.

 

Here's a quote from the OP:

 

I have come to think that, via my experience and those of my friends, that women's sexual interest in her mate might just die on the vine. It's certainly not my husband's fault. It's not that there are any of the typical causes blamed on the lack of intimacy. There seems to be little hope of "fixing" the problem.

 

Usually, there's 'blame', but here we see none. We see a woman who apparently gets her intimacy needs met and is aware that her sexual interest has waned and has little hope of fixing it. Where does that leave her H? OP, have you ever specifically communicated to your H how you feel about him meeting your needs for intimacy? If yes, how did that conversation go? Have you proactively solicited his feelings? What say him?

[jennie-jennie]

LOL @ eat that. I agree -- it does appear to be being used as an excuse to not have sex with Jeff period. Nobody should put up with that. I think people should speak their minds. If Jeff's wife is insistent on the fact she only thinks he does things for her because he wants to have sex with her, he could prove to her otherwise by not doing things for her at all. Or visiting the attorney, which seems to be the choice. Only he knows when enough is enough.

 

In my own relationship, there's been no discussions and no sex for a while. It's not that I'm withholding sex. He's not asking for sex. It's very strange. I imagine it will all come to a boiling point eventually.

 

Samantha, are you positive your husband is not having an affair? My MM is not asking for sex either.

[Samantha0905]

Samantha, are you positive your husband is not having an affair? My MM is not asking for sex either.

 

Never positive jennie. Everyone who knows him says he would never. I tend to think the same for the most part, but I would never say NEVER. I do wonder, at times, if he hasn't had me followed and doesn't know about the affair. Perhaps he's waiting me out. I'm waiting him out because I get sick of him not communicating. We're quite a pair. If I thought he was having an affair I would probably ask. If he moved into an apartment, I would have certainly asked why are you moving into an apartment?

 

Another friend says she doesn't think my husband thinks I have it in me to have an affair. She thinks he idealizes me. He did say something the other day that made me wonder if he doesn't know I'm seeing a counselor. I said something about a dream I had and he said, "Why don't you go see a counselor and get him to interpret your dreams?" It seemed unusual out of nowhere, but who knows?

[Toodamnpragmatic]

I'm thinking more along the lines of an ass**le.

 

This morning I take her to work. We get into it over stupid crap and she tells me I only do nice things because I want sex. I was totally floored.

 

I ask her, so Valentines day, when I bought you flowers, took you out to dinner and gave you your stupid 1/2 carrot-Yesterday, Today and Tomorrow diamond necklace, that was because I wanted sex? Yes, she replied. Then when I brought you flowers to your work last week, just because I wanted to, that was because I wanted sex? Yep, she says. So when you called me from work and told me you were hungry and asked me to drop what I was doing and bring you breakfast, that was because I wanted sex too? Pretty much she says.

 

I am so hurt over this. I felt like ripping off that stupid necklace and throwing it out the window. I am so pissed and hurt right now. I never should have done those things for her. I don't think that I'll be doing anything like this for her again. It was a waste of resources and time and emotions, spent on someone who thinks the worst of me.

 

I'm thinking on asking her for a divorce. I'm done with this relationship.

 

I posted a thread a while back (if someone can find it bring it up and see the females feigning ignorance) asking male's Expectations when you buy a big ticket item, plan/pay a vacation or the things you do for your spouse...... Damn right you love the person, care for them and want them happy, relaxed and thankful.....

 

AND YOU WANT SEX..... Why lie about it??? Trust me, nothing would excite me more then my spouse buying a present and then asking me to f*&k her......

 

Jeff1962 you should be mad, as all males who have been sucked in to Valentine's day and other hallmark holidays, who didn't get anything for their efforts.....

Edited March 2, 2010 by Toodamnpragmatic

[carhill]

I never made the connection of 'buying' sex with gifts or acts of service but can now see I should have

 

I remember the last time I had sex as a married man. It was the evening of the day I funded our then to be 'new' home. Quite an enlightening day, that was, in retrospect. They say gifts come in all forms

[Mr. Lucky]

Expectations when you buy a big ticket item, plan/pay a vacation or the things you do for your spouse...... Damn right you love the person, care for them and want them happy, relaxed and thankful.....

 

AND YOU WANT SEX..... Why lie about it???

But I also want sex (and intimacy, friendship, consideration, etc.) on those days that I haven't "gifted" her with anything. So why is sex considered to be tied to the gift?

 

Mr. Lucky

[soserious1]

I gave my ex husband the "gift" of paying for his entire life, all I got in return was the chance to sleep on the sofa sexless for an entire yr. Now I get to keep paying him alimony, month after month as he beds much younger, much hotter women while I sit alone with a cat and my ugly aging face and body.

 

You men posting here, many of your wives are in their upper 40's and aren't at a model's weight, perhaps you might mention to them that if you should decide to divorce them, they're at great risk of being stuck sitting alone, sleeping the kids to and fro, dateless, loveless and manless while you get to go out and snag yourself a hottie who loves to spread and show you the pink!

 

I mean seriously, why not just quietly sit her down and say " we are married, I need you to commit to spending 15-20 minutes on your knees or on your back twice a week and to pretend that you enjoy doing so or we need to get a divorce lawyer"

Edited March 2, 2010 by soserious1

[soserious1]

Marrying somebody, expecting them to remain faithful to you then denying that person any sort of sexual release sometimes for years on end? to me that is the ultimate expression of hatred and contempt.

[carhill]

You men posting here, many of your wives are in their upper 40's and aren't at a model's weight, perhaps you might mention to them that if you should decide to divorce them, they're at great risk of being stuck sitting alone, sleeping the kids to and fro, dateless, loveless and manless while you get to go out and snag yourself a hottie who loves to spread and show you the pink!

 

LOL, my stbx's 51 and obese (5'1" @ 180+) last time I saw her and she's already got a new 'friend' coming over to her nice house I helped her buy. His son needed the WEP code to get his computer on the network I so nicely set up for her, so she called me to get it. She's certainly not wasting away single, even though we're not yet divorced; meanwhile, I'm pondering whether I'm healthy enough emotionally to date. That'll never be an issue for her

 

I hope CaliGuy gets well soon so I can re-install the 'person who cares the least has the most control' item back into my sig line. It's so appropriate.

[Samantha0905]

I gave my ex husband the "gift" of paying for his entire life, all I got in return was the chance to sleep on the sofa sexless for an entire yr. Now I get to keep paying him alimony, month after month as he beds much younger, much hotter women while I sit alone with a cat and my ugly aging face and body.

 

 

I'm in my upper 40's and don't have a negative self image. I'm nice, intelligent, pretty and fit. You may want to work on your self-talk.

[soserious1]

LOL, my stbx's 51 and obese (5'1" @ 180+) last time I saw her and she's already got a new 'friend' coming over to her nice house I helped her buy. His son needed the WEP code to get his computer on the network I so nicely set up for her, so she called me to get it. She's certainly not wasting away single, even though we're not yet divorced; meanwhile, I'm pondering whether I'm healthy enough emotionally to date. That'll never be an issue for her

 

I hope CaliGuy gets well soon so I can re-install the 'person who cares the least has the most control' item back into my sig line. It's so appropriate.

 

yeah? but what's her "new friend" like ? I'm tall and fairly slim and unless I'm willing to decide to date men in their late 60's/early 70's or men who are significantly disabled and in need of caretaking I'm not even being looked at twice, let alone getting men offering to "help" me do anything.

 

I'm betting her new friend is no catch whatsoever.

[carhill]

Doesn't matter. If you're selective, it necessarily means more time and effort is involved. Every woman's (and man's) needs are different. I've known plenty of women who can't be alone. My stbx isn't one of them. If there's a man around, you can bet your top dollar that he's been selected very carefully (and likely long ago) for exactly what she needs right now. That is what men are for. Meeting needs. My usefullness had ended, so it was time to move on. I accept that.

 

I hope the OP finds some commonalities in what she's reading here.....

[soserious1]

Doesn't matter. If you're selective, it necessarily means more time and effort is involved. Every woman's (and man's) needs are different. I've known plenty of women who can't be alone. My stbx isn't one of them. If there's a man around, you can bet your top dollar that he's been selected very carefully (and likely long ago) for exactly what she needs right now. That is what men are for. Meeting needs. My usefullness had ended, so it was time to move on. I accept that.

 

I hope the OP finds some commonalities in what she's reading here.....

 

I've got no issues with being alone.. it beats being with somebody who views me merely as a means to an end.

 

I know all about having the expiration date of my usefulness expire so you've got my empathy there.

[Toodamnpragmatic]

But I also want sex (and intimacy, friendship, consideration, etc.) on those days that I haven't "gifted" her with anything. So why is sex considered to be tied to the gift?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

I realize I must be the most misogynistic, chauvinist married a-hole on LS because I am honest.

 

I do want sex on all those days I haven't "gifted" her too..... But if i plan a romantic trip/dinner/gift while showing the love and devotion I do, in addition to being the Alpha male mem11363 wants..... geez to think I am out of line to expect some sex from the woman I love and vice-versa.... How shallow a person am I????

 

I obviously have serious issues...... Sorry Jeff1962 that your wife thinks like me, and sadder that she feels pressure to have sex with her best friend/spouse....

[carhill]

I've got no issues with being alone.. it beats being with somebody who views me merely as a means to an end.

 

I join you and sympathize. Life goes on. If I were in the OP's shoes, and I was at one point, I'd be clear with my spouse and encourage him/her to make an informed choice. We did that, in MC.

[Toodamnpragmatic]

To all males who do have regular sex (I'll throw out a # 3-4/wk), and enough that they are satiated. Well those men wouldn't think like me about "gifts".....

 

Found one of my threads where I discussed this "forbidden" issue....

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t201034/

Edited March 3, 2010 by Toodamnpragmatic

[dazzle22]

I realize I must be the most misogynistic, chauvinist married a-hole on LS because I am honest.

 

I do want sex on all those days I haven't "gifted" her too..... But if i plan a romantic trip/dinner/gift while showing the love and devotion I do, in addition to being the Alpha male mem11363 wants..... geez to think I am out of line to expect some sex from the woman I love and vice-versa.... How shallow a person am I????

 

I obviously have serious issues...... Sorry Jeff1962 that your wife thinks like me, and sadder that she feels pressure to have sex with her best friend/spouse....

 

 

Someone needs to tell these women that marriage, BY DEFINITION, is supposed to be a very sexual arrangement between a man and woman. If you wanted just her friendship you would have gotten her a friendship ring. Sheesh!

 

I don't know why these women can't see that by these men asking them to MARRY them, they are telling them, I don't want you ONLY for sex. I am in it for better for worse. If I wanted you for only sex, you'd be a ONS!!

[mem11363]

If Jeff is NOT nice/loving/generous to his wife she feels unloved and doesn't want sex. If he is, she feels pressured and claims he is only trying to get her to have sex. Either way she

- refuses sex and

- tells Jeff it is because he is a bad guy - either showing no love or trying to manipulate her into having sex

 

Remember this is the same woman who told him she wanted him - and then made him wait a long time while she was in the bathroom and then flipped out on him when he joked with her about it. She only admitted being mean to him when he talked about moving out.

 

She seems very selfish and quite mean to Jeff....

 

 

I realize I must be the most misogynistic, chauvinist married a-hole on LS because I am honest.

 

I do want sex on all those days I haven't "gifted" her too..... But if i plan a romantic trip/dinner/gift while showing the love and devotion I do, in addition to being the Alpha male mem11363 wants..... geez to think I am out of line to expect some sex from the woman I love and vice-versa.... How shallow a person am I????

 

I obviously have serious issues...... Sorry Jeff1962 that your wife thinks like me, and sadder that she feels pressure to have sex with her best friend/spouse....

[Tnerforireyeh]

Look up the game "frigid woman" in the book "Games People Play" by Eric Berne.

[xxoo]

I realize I must be the most misogynistic, chauvinist married a-hole on LS because I am honest.

 

I do want sex on all those days I haven't "gifted" her too..... But if i plan a romantic trip/dinner/gift while showing the love and devotion I do, in addition to being the Alpha male mem11363 wants..... geez to think I am out of line to expect some sex from the woman I love and vice-versa.... How shallow a person am I????

 

I obviously have serious issues...... Sorry Jeff1962 that your wife thinks like me, and sadder that she feels pressure to have sex with her best friend/spouse....

 

The thing is, a gift isn't given with expectations. If a gift comes with a price tag, it isn't truly a gift.

 

From what Jeff is saying, he is truly giving gifts free from expectations, but his wife percieves an expectation of sex in exchange for the gifts. It isn't Jeff's fault that she has perception, but it isn't "mean" of her, either. It just is. It's an issue to explore. Unless Jeff is finished exploring the issues, and then that is fair enough.

 

And, yes, it is pretty sad.

[TinyLee222]

Look up the game "frigid woman" in the book "Games People Play" by Eric Berne.

 

This is so right on the money! Jeff's wife fits the description right down

to the flirting. If you haven't read the book I highly recommend it. Berne was the creator of "Transactional Analysis"." Interesting to say the least.

 

 

Lee