Would you stay in a sexless marriage?

[troggleputty]

 

Your issues against women are clearly showing in the completely different way you respond to me and to a male poster having the same problem.

 

ROFLMAO. I don't have "issues against women." You have a sexually dysfunctional relationship with your husband. You put it out there on the internet.

 

Why don't you show this thread to your h and see what he thinks about it?

 

 

 

You are blaming me for the issue saying I'm resentful and angry and that is why he isn't having sex with me and questioning how willing I really am. Ridiculous. You should work on your own issues before giving anyone else advice.

 

You're the one who accused your own husband of probably preferring it if you just "laid there like a starfish."

 

Not me.

[mem11363]

I am absolutely committed to the notion of "in sickness and in health".

 

Giotto has a wife who is completely full functioning in her life - work - socially and with their kids. But when it comes to sex she claims she is mentally "ill". And she has been full functioning for most of their mostly sexless marriage.

 

I don't buy it. I believe she has an issue with sex - but that doesn't make her ill and therefore entitled to a free pass regarding his needs. It simply means she doesn't want to have sex with him and she has told him she is too old for a therapist to help her. And she has also told him that being sexless is completely normal and many people live happy sexless lives and he should just adjust.

 

From stats in the US - about 15% of marriages are sexless and in MOST of those marriages the person being rejected is profoundly unhappy.

 

And this is becoming a problem for both genders - plenty of women come on here and post just like G does.

 

Ok. I agree with Mem's post...however..you said yourself G that you are worried about your wife right? Despite everything that's going on with you, you are worried about her mental health..

 

If you are married to someone who is mentally ill - potentially, then I think you owe it to your kids at least to try and help get that part sorted out. I'm not saying she's right, or behaving well...nothing like that. Just, what if you leave her?

 

Say you do leave, and she has a nervous breakdown, or worse...say she gets sectioned for her own protection. I don't know how serious it is, but all I can tell you is that it's UNLIKELY that you know either at this point in time. it's not up to you to try and 'sort her out' at this point in time - she needs to get professional help to do that, but from what you said it's unlikely she is going to do anything about it.

 

At the moment it seems like you are the stronger one emotionally, so it falls on you to act on this. It's not a great position to be in, and it may cause you further hurt. You honestly should try to sort it out though because whatever happens you still have to function as parents even if you decide it is over.

 

That part - the practicalities, the day to day, work and so on....that just gets harder when you are apart. Please be careful...I know you're very hurt yourself (and you should get some outside help too), but to do nothing, and just leave her would be something you could regret in the long run.

 

Is there anyone she trusts or is close to that you can talk to - Mum, sister or friend? Maybe you should get a second opinion from someone close if you're not sure.

[SarahRose]

I am absolutely committed to the notion of "in sickness and in health".

 

Giotto has a wife who is completely full functioning in her life - work - socially and with their kids. But when it comes to sex she claims she is mentally "ill". And she has been full functioning for most of their mostly sexless marriage.

 

I don't buy it. I believe she has an issue with sex - but that doesn't make her ill and therefore entitled to a free pass regarding his needs. It simply means she doesn't want to have sex with him and she has told him she is too old for a therapist to help her. And she has also told him that being sexless is completely normal and many people live happy sexless lives and he should just adjust.

 

From stats in the US - about 15% of marriages are sexless and in MOST of those marriages the person being rejected is profoundly unhappy.

 

And this is becoming a problem for both genders - plenty of women come on here and post just like G does.

 

 

As I mentioned on another one of G's threads, she seems to play the sick/victim card a lot and it works.

 

I too think she is using it to avoid things she doesn't want to do. She seems fine doing things she wants to do.

 

I don't know what the answer is for G.

[mem11363]

G,

How long has your wife been on anti anxiety meds?

 

Maybe i'm wrong - but I thought she shut sex down a long long time ago and way before she started taking any meds.

 

Is she on birth control pills? If so, you might consider a vasectomy - I had a v a long time ago. bc pills can kill libido.

 

None of this changes my view - she is able to enjoy sex with you - she knows that one hour a week totally changes how YOU feel the other 100+ waking hours each week. She seems fine refusing you the 1 hour that makes you happy the other 100. That is not a lack of lust, it is a surplus of selfishness and indifference to you.

 

If things don't change, I plan to leave a lot earlier than that... my youngest turned 9 last Tuesday...

[She's_NotInLove_w/Me]

From stats in the US - about 15% of marriages are sexless and in MOST of those marriages the person being rejected is profoundly unhappy.

 

I would be willing to bet the number is likely more than double the 15% if we isolate those marriages that are longer than 5 years in duration and define sexless as 'less than once monthly.'

Edited February 27, 2010 by She's_NotInLove_w/Me

[mem11363]

I am just going with the published stats. And the definition of sexless is 10 times/or fewer a year - so about the same as your monthly number.

 

Not sure what is normal - the people who come to this board are very much not a random subset of the population.

 

The subset of folks I know - mostly college grads married to other college grads - do not have a rapid drop in relations after 5 or 10 or even 20 years. Sure there is a gradual drop - but not down to almost nothing - my opinion once a month is a very ugly number for the person who has a typical drive.

 

I also think there are 2 things people often don't address in a blunt manner before marriage: fitness expectations and sexual expectations

 

There really are two kinds of folks sexually (partner focused and self focused)

- partner focused: believe sex is an obligation and if asked, they are responsible for pleasing their partner absent physical illness

- self focused: believe sex is something they have every right to deny their partner on an open ended basis - basically they have no responsibility to do anything they don't feel like doing

 

 

I would be willing to bet the number is likely more than double the 15% if we isolate those marriages that are longer than 5 years in duration and define sexless as 'less than once monthly.'

[angie2443]

giotto, I'm going to remind you of this post, which appears to encompass the entire issue. Your wife is on libido killing meds. She's not doing this to hurt you deliberately. But if she goes off the meds, she's living a life full of anxiety.

 

What a horrible position to be in.

 

Wow! I missed this post. This would explain a lot. It is a horrible position to be in.

[mem11363]

Does not justify such a cold harsh refusal to love a spouse - clearly her body gets aroused and G gets her over the finish line.

 

Situation reversed, if G were impotent and his wife wanted him to please her (hand/mouth, other) once a week he would gladly do it.

 

This is not a physical thing - it is a love thing. And THAT is why it feels so bad for the person being refused.

 

Wow! I missed this post. This would explain a lot. It is a horrible position to be in.

[silverfish]

I am absolutely committed to the notion of "in sickness and in health".

 

Giotto has a wife who is completely full functioning in her life - work - socially and with their kids. But when it comes to sex she claims she is mentally "ill". And she has been full functioning for most of their mostly sexless marriage.

 

I don't buy it. I believe she has an issue with sex - but that doesn't make her ill and therefore entitled to a free pass regarding his needs. It simply means she doesn't want to have sex with him and she has told him she is too old for a therapist to help her. And she has also told him that being sexless is completely normal and many people live happy sexless lives and he should just adjust.

 

From stats in the US - about 15% of marriages are sexless and in MOST of those marriages the person being rejected is profoundly unhappy.

 

And this is becoming a problem for both genders - plenty of women come on here and post just like G does.

 

She's not functioning normally at all - she's been on ADs for years according to G, and yes women have the same problem with their men, it not a 'man V woman thing' it a people thing.

 

She's 47, ADs, has 4 kids, and works nights to keep going... both sides of the story Mem....have you considered hers?

 

I'm not far off his Ws age when their littlest must have been born, and..no thanks I was done having my kids years ago myself....thats a lot for Gs wife to cope with and there are consequences for that as I'm sure you must be aware, physically, sexually, financially etc...it all adds up

 

Sorry G but theres a lot more going on here than just sex

[JamesM]

giotto, I'm going to remind you of this post, which appears to encompass the entire issue. Your wife is on libido killing meds. She's not doing this to hurt you deliberately. But if she goes off the meds, she's living a life full of anxiety.

 

What a horrible position to be in.

 

Agree.

 

While I cannot say that it is the reason why she has not interest in sex, one could infer that anxiety, obsessive thoughts (which may be OCD), switching shifts (which is almost as bad as third shift...the body never knows what to expect), and who knows what else is contributing to it.

 

As a husband, I would try to get her help for these issues before I wrote the mother of my children off. It would be awful if you left and these problems were fixed and your wife was her old self...and another man benefited. Your thoughts would be...if only...

 

If you see improvement in her mental health and yet no improvement in her sexual health, then perhaps you could consider other options.

 

Situation reversed, if G were impotent and his wife wanted him to please her (hand/mouth, other) once a week he would gladly do it.

 

We don't know that. When a man is impotent, is he excited to have any sort of sexual play with a woman...especially knowing that he cannot finish? If I read many threads here and on other boards from women, an impotent man does not want sex at all as it is a reminder that he is not a complete man.

 

When men or women have no desire for sex, it is hard for them to go through the motions.

 

Besides, giotto doesn't want one sided sex. I have no doubt that his wife knows this.

 

 

This is not a physical thing - it is a love thing. And THAT is why it feels so bad for the person being refused.

 

Again, we don't know that. But even still, ladies, correct me if I am wrong...women need that emotional connection to sex. If giotto's wife is having emotional issues within herself having nothing to do with him, or she is having anxiety issues and OCD...and has no libido, then sex is the farthest thing from her mind.

 

I feel the frustration from giotto, but I certainly think this is the time to offer possible angles to be tried. Pushing giotto out of the house before he knows for certain that his wife truly does not love HIM and her lack of interest in sex is about him. Again, if he finds out that it has nothing to do with him and everything to do with her, then he will be depressed to find this out after he has gone.

 

Even as one who has gone through some dark times and as one who lives in a less than perfect marriage in the sex department, I cannot advocate writing off a marriage without exhausting every possible solution.

[giotto]

many valid points... I'm picking one fairly randomly, so I can explain things a bit further...

 

Even as one who has gone through some dark times and as one who lives in a less than perfect marriage in the sex department, I cannot advocate writing off a marriage without exhausting every possible solution.

 

absolutely, James, but our problems started over 15 years ago... it's a long time. When she went off sex after the second child, I tried to talk to her and get to the root of the problem, but she shut me out... she said she was fine... funnily enough, a year later she starts taking ADs...

 

she is always been a very private person, but this inability to discuss things has ruined our marriage. This is clearly a problem which she has inherited from her childhood, when she had to protect her feelings and herself... it's a defense mechanism.

 

And you are right... it's not just a sex problem... it's been wrong for many years. I just put too much pressure on her about sex and now she hates it... she doesn't hate the actual act, but what it might happen if she turns me down. After trying very hard to understand the reasons, I became very resentful about the whole issue. I wasn't a pleasant person to be around. I admit it. But I've been starved of love all my life.

 

My mother was a cold and distant person. Very mechanical in her family duties. She did everything for us, but I never remember her cuddling me. Ever. And then I pick a person who is the exact replica of my mother's. All this yearning for love has never been fulfilled in its entirety. It's a huge hole in my soul.

 

So, wife is a tangle of issues... anxiety, defense mechanisms all over the place, inability to show love and affection. Fear of confrontation. And then there's me. A guy who only wants to be loved and nothing else.

 

I don't really know the extent of her mental problems. I can't draw a line between emotional abuse, lack of libido, mental impact. I have no idea and she won't talk openly about it.

 

I have suggested therapy and doctor... she has promised she'll sort her meds out (possibly having a little time out to see if she can live without them) and she'll see a therapist. In the meantime, there is not very much I can do about it. And remember, I can't even mention it too often in case she takes it the wrong way.

 

If you really want to know how I'm feeling, I can tell you that I'm very down at the moment. I've been waiting so long for things to change that I find it impossible to be positive about anything. The emotional gap is huge. The emotional frustration is torturing me. I'm at breaking point... but if she is ill, it would horrendous to bail out. I would feel like a coward...

Edited February 28, 2010 by giotto

[giotto]

I've actually decided I want a divorce... can't take this anymore... will be telling the wife later on... sorry.

[Luv2dance]

I've actually decided I want a divorce... can't take this anymore... will be telling the wife later on... sorry.

 

I have been reading your post, and I do believe at some point you have to do what's best for you. If you have tried all you can to make your marriage work and get no response from your wife then things will not change. I am not a fan of divorce and know that marriage is a commitment but you also have one life to live!

[Neutrino]

and if yes, why? Obviously, this stems from my situation. I need food for thought, because, at the moment, I don't really know what to do.

 

If we had sex, my marriage would be perfect... well, almost...

 

Are sex and your sex life so important to you to the extent that you would be prepared to sacrifice your family and your children for them? Is it right to "expect" sex in married life, even after many years together? Am I being selfish? Should I just support my wife regardless? Isn't love supposed to be unconditional? Should I just accept it and get it over with? Why can't I connect to my wife emotionally, without sex? Is the brother/sister type of relationship common as my wife says?

 

I still can't believe this is happening to me. I always envisaged a happy life with a woman who loved me for what I am and who I am... what have I done wrong?

 

Sorry for ranting... but please offer your POV... I need to get a clearer picture on this... your help much appreciated!

 

I have not read the whole thread, but this first post is very touching.

 

First of all - unlike what someone here said - IMO the reason is very important.... It would make a huge difference to me if my BF would not have sex with me because he had a car accident and half his body is gone, or if he just doesn't find me attractive or can not be bothered...

 

Second : Giotto, I have read a few of your threads and I feel for you - whatever you end up doing - you are facing a hard time and second-guessing your decision. I find your wife says one thing in words - and a totally different thing in actions. Of course everything you tell us here is only your side of the story from your own perspective, however - it is weird she claims to love you so much, but would not even try to sort out her problems for the sake of your relationship - shouldn't her love translate into effort to solve this problem ?

 

I realize you love her and your kids and you made promises you feel very guilty about no longer being able (or willing) to keep. You must be torn between your conscience and your feelings...

 

For some reason this thread reminded me of another thread by Elswyth : How she's unhappy being a pharmacist because she only pursued that title to make her mom happy - while I think her mom wouldn't have been so happy knowing her beloved daughter is miserable because she gave up her own wishes trying to make her mom happy.

 

I guess the common factor is that you're so busy trying to make others happy - you forgot about yourself... Over another 10 years of being consumed by those problems you may become so unhappy and bitter, you will not add happiness to anyone in your life.

 

In your place - I'd take a time out to think long and hard. Rent your own apartment or go stay with a friend who will respect your actions and leave you alone to think. See what it is like without her, it may be totally different to what you expect, but at least then you would be able to make a comparison and then a decision.

 

Like this you're just going in circles.

[silverfish]

G I hope you're ok. I guess your last post revealed that the communication issue is a massive part of this problem, and it's exactly the same way my exH behaved towards me when I tried to discuss anything he didn't want to confront.

 

I hope that by telling her you are at the point of leaving, she responds in the way I think you hope she does.

[giotto]

I hope that by telling her you are at the point of leaving, she responds in the way I think you hope she does.

 

well, she responded last time and then she reverted back to the usual... I don't trust her anymore and I don't want that... I want to be free from this depressing and humiliating situation...

[silverfish]

well, she responded last time and then she reverted back to the usual... I don't trust her anymore and I don't want that... I want to be free from this depressing and humiliating situation...

 

I left my exH for similar reasons to you, although the problem was more deep rooted in communication.... at the time I believed that it might make him take it seriously, and take action. It didn't happen.

 

I don't regret leaving at all, my kids are happier, and I am much happier now. I get on well with my exH, and we talk a lot more now than we ever did. I feel I did everything I could to sort things out, which is the main reason I can live with my decision.

 

It doesn't matter what the reasons are leading up to the divorce, but barring infidelity, it is always seems to be the person who leaves who gets painted as the bad guy. Make sure you make your reasons clear to your W, so she can see her part in this, even though you are feeling emotional and down....

[troggleputty]

I've actually decided I want a divorce... can't take this anymore... will be telling the wife later on... sorry.

 

 

Well no one can argue with this decision giotto. You've been more than patient.

 

Don't be afraid to tell your kids why you got divorced when they're old enough: "Because mommy did not want to have sex with daddy."

 

Also don't be very surprised when your (ex) wife turns up with a new "boyfriend"/lover soon after the divorce or maybe even while the divorce is in progress.

 

Suddenly she will be fully able to express her sexuality. Only not to you.

 

I'm sorry but that's just the way these things seem to go.

 

 

Good luck, losing half of your stuff in the divorce to her will seem painful at first, but down the road you'll know it was well worth it.

[tommyr]

well, she responded last time and then she reverted back to the usual..

 

I would say both of you reverted back to the usual: she not wanting sex, and you allowing her to live a happy sexless life while you suffer.

 

G - tell her her exactly what you have told us all here:

 

1) you love her and are happy in the marriage aside from one dealbreaker: no sex

 

2) you will not stay both married and sexless

 

3) the last time when you reconciled and resumed a normal sexlife, marriage was great until she again stopped having sex with you

 

4) you are ready to divorce over the issue

 

If she chooses to go forward with a divorce rather than agree to regular sex, well I guess the marriage is not worth saving anyway.

[angie2443]

I would say both of you reverted back to the usual: she not wanting sex, and you allowing her to live a happy sexless life while you suffer.

 

G - tell her her exactly what you have told us all here:

 

1) you love her and are happy in the marriage aside from one dealbreaker: no sex

 

2) you will not stay both married and sexless

 

3) the last time when you reconciled and resumed a normal sexlife, marriage was great until she again stopped having sex with you

 

4) you are ready to divorce over the issue

 

If she chooses to go forward with a divorce rather than agree to regular sex, well I guess the marriage is not worth saving anyway.

 

I agree with the bolded part, except for the wife bieng happy.

 

Giotto, I think these are good things to say to your wife, even if you are 100% decided on going through with the divorce, which it sounds like you are. I think letting your wife know exactly where you stand will give you both closure, making it easier for you both to move forward.

[Toodamnpragmatic]

Does not justify such a cold harsh refusal to love a spouse - clearly her body gets aroused and G gets her over the finish line.

 

Situation reversed, if G were impotent and his wife wanted him to please her (hand/mouth, other) once a week he would gladly do it.

 

This is not a physical thing - it is a love thing. And THAT is why it feels so bad for the person being refused.

 

Giotto's wife enjoys sex and orgasms...... Just does not want to have sex... That is the great paradigm hat us men can not understand or grasp. Now if Giotto, was not as excited, not impotent, but let's pretend sex (orgasm) was now a 6, not a 10, I am sure he would perservere and do it, so his spouse could have her 10......

 

PEOPLE - Get it right.... Giotto's wife still has a libido, decreased???? Maybe, but all the working parts are there.....

 

It is all in her head and she really couldn't care less to fix it.....

 

Guess what then happens???? They may get divorced, she meets someone and they are f'ing like rabbits..... I'd be so disgusted and bothered by this...... Again thanks L:izzie60 and others who have opened my eyes to that inevitability......

[giotto]

thank you.. I told her about my intentions and we had a good long discussion about it, like we never had before... I'm too drained right now to expand on this, but I'll let you know in the morning... I'm ok, really...

[WalkInThePark]

thank you.. I told her about my intentions and we had a good long discussion about it, like we never had before... I'm too drained right now to expand on this, but I'll let you know in the morning... I'm ok, really...

 

I suspect that she has now again made promises that things will get better, only to not follow-up afterwards. It's often like that: when people feel that their partner considers to leave them, they are afraid and do an effort. It would bother me if my partner always waits so long to change things.

[BettyBoop]

thank you.. I told her about my intentions and we had a good long discussion about it, like we never had before... I'm too drained right now to expand on this, but I'll let you know in the morning... I'm ok, really...

 

I hope that whatever the outcome you and your wife and family will have happy endings. In case she asks for more time (to contact an IC etc) - give her a SPECIFIC time limit if you want to. Whatever she offers in order to "save the family unit" remember that change enforces change and not comfort...

 

All I know is that the moment you know you truly want out - no amount of begging, crying or promises of change will stop you.

[SarahRose]

thank you.. I told her about my intentions and we had a good long discussion about it, like we never had before... I'm too drained right now to expand on this, but I'll let you know in the morning... I'm ok, really...

 

{{{{Giotto}}}}