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Who are the apha-men?


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Old 3rd July 2009, 9:21 AM   #181
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Originally Posted by Surfer Dude View Post
Let me put this into my SD-women analyzer:

Really feminine and high self-esteem women will embrace alpha, let him take the lead, enjoy his leadership and create a positive, satisfying relationship with him.

Women who hate alphas are mostly materialist hoes who need a doormat to walk all over on daily basis, but deep down in their being, they will secretly always wish for such an alpha to appear and take the lead. Because that's the natural way. And people who go against their nature are well... messed up!

Problem solved, case closed! Thanks Surfer!
Pretty much but the latter group will never get the apha because they are a complete turnoff to him. The most they will get is being used as a toy until he finds a real woman to settle down with. They then end up resenting and hating all men because the only ones that will want anything with them past a quick fling are whipped lap-dogs.
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Old 3rd July 2009, 10:05 AM   #182
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Perhaps people are just having a little debate, you know like we used to in the good old days

Maybe some people also feel that the terminology and idealogy behind 'alpha' is outdated, outmoded and useless in a society which is trying to move towards a sense of equality and self-realisation. Isn't that why we distance ourselves from the Animal Kingdom, because we are conscious? Using big long words doesn't really help your argument... nor does using Ricky Gervais as an Alpha example - although it did make me chuckle!

Okay that's odd you changed your post... So Ricky's a Beta now eh
? Was the last bit for me or Grogster?

Ricky Gervais is definitely a comedy alpha. David Brent was a fantastic invention of his. There's that constant sense of "he knows he's desperately uncool, but at the same time he's absolutely determined to not know it." If he weren't so anxious to be an alphamale, he'd just be a normal bloke. His desperation to be alpha is what makes him a toe-curlingly stand-out beta.

I don't get what's so terrible about using the alpha and beta categories. If you consider how men label women - they'll tend to use phrases like "ten" for women who are widely considered to be extremely gorgeous and draw a lot of men, and all kinds of terrible words for women who they would place at the bottom of the pile looks-wise. Words a lot worse than beta.

Most women aren't going to fall into either of those extremes. We might be considered reasonably hot if we're made up and dressed nicely, and a bit dire if we've just rolled out of bed with bad hair. It's the same for men. At their best, lots of men out there are a bit of all right alpha. At their worst (eg when they're clearly uncomfortable in their skin but nonetheless determined to portray themselves as something they're not) the beta qualities will come to the fore.
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Old 3rd July 2009, 11:43 AM   #183
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Tara, that was for Grog yeah but I'm obviously getting old and took a while to finish the post!

I have to say I love a good debate but I can't help feeling like the terminology here is very subjective and therefore we're all probably arguing at cross-purposes. Do a quick google search and the top hits you'll get for 'Alpha Male' are all related to men 'winning' women. In animals with social groups the Alpha Male is the dominant one and gets the first choice of mate, best food and so on. The female doesn't really have much say in the matter. In human beings, we're (at least supposed to be) a little more highly evolved and in theory value quality over quantity and we don't really have the equivalent of an 'Alpha'.

The definitions being given vary widely in this thread, based upon how you view the idea of Alpha. In fact this thread could be an interesting study in the psychology of each of us simply by looking at our definitions. Some people are listing all the qualities they find attractive in a man - and then claiming this is Alpha status. Some are saying they are dating an Alpha man or perhaps a Beta or even an Omega (which, personally, I think sounds a lot cooler... there we are I'm an Omega!) and it's hard not to feel like in some way this is a bit of an ego boost (I may be wrong).

To say that 'men label women', well I've certainly never done that and most people I know don't either. Sure, rowdy bunches of men (or women) will often score attractive people they might oggle across a dance floor and even shout numbers - but is that because of some biological urge or because society (and teen dramas) tell us that's what we're supposed to do?

Alphas are Alphas because of their position and the traits that go with that are the ones that keep them in that position (characteristics that allow them to dominate prospective challengers). While we are at it Beta refers to the second male in a hierarchy... they will most often display the same characteristics but just not be quite as tough. At some point they may even become the Alpha.
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Old 3rd July 2009, 12:17 PM   #184
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Perhaps this is her notion of an alphamale.
No actually this , and this is my notion of an alpha.

I like what Julia Roberts says in the first clip at the end, perfect!

And as much as I think HL is the bomb and I would love for him to screw my brains out that's as far as a guy like that would serve, long term someone like that is too much fruitless work.
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Old 3rd July 2009, 12:32 PM   #185
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No actually this , and this is my notion of an alpha.

I like what Julia Roberts says in the first clip at the end, perfect!

And as much as I think HL is the bomb and I would love for him to screw my brains out that's as far as a guy like that would serve, long term someone like that is too much fruitless work.
Hey, what about Andy Garcia ? Esp. from the Godfather III, but also O11. Ironically, there is nothing more alpha than tossing a woman away in the name of the pursuit of world domination .
I'm not saying that's inherently wrong , but I'd always be curious what's the underlying driving force, i.e. what's the point.

For me one of the alpha-est moments I've ever experienced was when I saw a guy on the bus stop carrying his baby. The guy was huge/athletic, very handsome, big beard, blue eyes, etc. I creamed my panties, and I'm not even a woman . Anyway, the point is that he was incredibly gentle & mellow with his baby, and very quiet and composed overall; but his presence also (politely) quietly announced "If it comes to that, I will beat you into pulp if you endanger my family, so I'd appreciate it if you don't. It'd be better for everybody that way"


But I'm a guy what the hell do I know .
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Old 3rd July 2009, 12:52 PM   #186
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I have to say I love a good debate but I can't help feeling like the terminology here is very subjective and therefore we're all probably arguing at cross-purposes. Do a quick google search and the top hits you'll get for 'Alpha Male' are all related to men 'winning' women.
I think it's probably a term men are more prone than women are to googling, and it's also a term that PUA sites are fond of. Imagine how many guys there are out there trying to sell their books or promote their blogs on this very subject. They'll all be doing whatever it is IT people do to get their books near the top of any search for terms like "alphamale" and "PUA".

Quote:
In animals with social groups the Alpha Male is the dominant one and gets the first choice of mate, best food and so on. The female doesn't really have much say in the matter. In human beings, we're (at least supposed to be) a little more highly evolved and in theory value quality over quantity and we don't really have the equivalent of an 'Alpha'.
Our code of etiquette is often geared towards preventing the offended feelings and conflict that can occur when people start to form an informal hierarchy. Except in situations where someone's paying for special treatment regardless of their personal qualities - and everyone accepts that "you get what you pay for".

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Alphas are Alphas because of their position and the traits that go with that are the ones that keep them in that position (characteristics that allow them to dominate prospective challengers). While we are at it Beta refers to the second male in a hierarchy... they will most often display the same characteristics but just not be quite as tough. At some point they may even become the Alpha.
They may well do. Men do spend a lot of time competing with eachother, and when it's the subtle form of competition it's not necessarily clear who the real winner of the "jousting match" is. One man might spend a lot of time at a party name-dropping and letting people know he has a lot of valuable possessions. He might, because of that, be deemed alpha by people who put money and contacts at the top of the list of important qualities in a man. He might be deemed insecure and embarrassing to be around by others.

A lot probably depends on whether these things come up naturally in conversation, or whether he's obviously manipulating the conversation onto topics that allow him to drop these things in. If he's seriously wealthy and well connected he might take pains to avoid talking about these things (unless asked) to avoid sounding vulgar. I think that's pretty alpha, but another person might say "nope - he's too worried about what other people think. A true alpha would talk about whatever he wants without caring if people thinks he's being boastful/vulgar/boring."

You are right, in that what we're impressed by comes from our own sets of values. Talking about what we think constitutes an alphamale gives us an opportunity to explore, discuss and challenge some of those values. And, of course, talk about ourselves.
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Old 3rd July 2009, 1:15 PM   #187
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Originally Posted by MattyTee View Post

The definitions being given vary widely in this thread, based upon how you view the idea of Alpha. In fact this thread could be an interesting study in the psychology of each of us simply by looking at our definitions. Some people are listing all the qualities they find attractive in a man - and then claiming this is Alpha status. Some are saying they are dating an Alpha man or perhaps a Beta or even an Omega (which, personally, I think sounds a lot cooler... there we are I'm an Omega!) and it's hard not to feel like in some way this is a bit of an ego boost (I may be wrong).
that's just it, it's subjective what an alpha is, practically every woman in this thread loves an alpha and says she is with an alpha. Now if we average out how that represents society in a much smaller scale that means that 95% of the women out there are going out with Alpha's? So that means that 95% of the male population are alphas?
OR it could mean that only the women who are with alphas decided to post in this thread?

I think saying you are worthy of an "alpha" around here seems to have some weight, hence the responses in this thread that are completely all over the place and so subjective to each person's interpretation.



Quote:
Alphas are Alphas because of their position and the traits that go with that are the ones that keep them in that position (characteristics that allow them to dominate prospective challengers). While we are at it Beta refers to the second male in a hierarchy... they will most often display the same characteristics but just not be quite as tough. At some point they may even become the Alpha.

Again, I have to agree with this. Last night I was out with my guy and he surprised me with a trip in October if I am up for it, he had already planned it but wants to know if I will join him. I said I would look into flights etc, his response floored me since we had been discussing this on here but he said "just say yes, don't worry about the flight information your accommodations are already taken care of and so is the flight if you say yes, being the alpha male that I am I've got it all under control" and laughed it off. Whaaat?!?!? I was floored at the last comment!!
I literally started to scan my brain to remember if I had used his computer to come on here while he had been in the shower etc. No go, thank goodness.

We have never discussed any form of alpha anything nor have I even eluded to any suggestion that might be on the table for discussion. Where did this comment come from!?!? The thing is, given my own interpretation of an alpha I don't consider him that all. He is in academics at the university level, History to be precise (not exactly a warrior-like career) so he is rather on the serious side and can be a little dry at times but has a real hunger for knowledge and all things cultural and this uncanny ability to surprise me when I least expect it both intellectually and romantically. He is probably one of the most straight-up guys I have ever met in terms of values and integrity and is not lead by his nose by anyone, when he says no he means no! He is a provider and protector and he has a body that exudes health and self love. I don't how he does it but he pumps weights 6 times a week and does not have an ounce of fat on his entire body, trust me I've looked carefully. STILL he is not the guy women gravitate towards in social situations, he is rather on the observer side if you will in terms of how he acts socially he is the one that creeps up in conversation and when he opens his mouth you are amazed he had all that passion and general knowledge behind his cool exterior. We met on our volleyball team and he was certainly not the main "dog" when it came to the dynamics with the other men on the team. Yet when I look at the definition of a beta he is certainly not a follower or an omegan Mr nice guy. So where does that leave all these labels?

Am I dating an Alpha and I don't even know it? No way!! I think I am correct in that my understanding of an Alpha is just not what I want to be associated with. We all have our understanding of that label, make the best with what you know.
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Old 3rd July 2009, 1:31 PM   #188
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For me one of the alpha-est moments I've ever experienced was when I saw a guy on the bus stop carrying his baby. The guy was huge/athletic, very handsome, big beard, blue eyes, etc. I creamed my panties, and I'm not even a woman . Anyway, the point is that he was incredibly gentle & mellow with his baby, and very quiet and composed overall; but his presence also (politely) quietly announced "If it comes to that, I will beat you into pulp if you endanger my family, so I'd appreciate it if you don't. It'd be better for everybody that way"


But I'm a guy what the hell do I know .

No offense but you'd make a good chick!
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Old 3rd July 2009, 1:43 PM   #189
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If you consider an alpha a guy you'd screw and drop because he is too testosterone driven for example, you're using a short stick to measure success.
An alpha would be the one you'd choose, regardless of what you're choosing for because he possesses the most desirable qualities for the widest variety of roles you would feel motivated to pick a person to fill.

People keep agreeing that an alpha would have the most desirable qualities, including the ones that would make his DNA top shelf.....

"It is not the strongest, nor the most intelligent of the species that survives. It is the one that is most adaptable to change."

So even if your favorite measure of the alpha type hinges on his ability to attract women, it would not be any particular type of woman. It would be the majority of almost any type of woman if you must put everything and everyone into any category. His qualities would make a potential mate feel inclined, even assured, that the most rudimentary aspects of the male/female relationship was a safe foundation to build on.

The rest is situational and personal preference at the time of choice.

Why is does it feel like some of the people weighing in on this are trying to use labels to shame their favorite targets rather than any sort of interest in the simple facts of life or pursuits for truth?
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Old 3rd July 2009, 1:45 PM   #190
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No offense but you'd make a good chick!

I'm versatile, baby !
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Old 5th July 2009, 8:03 PM   #191
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Here's a pretty intelligent discussion of what alpha is:
http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com/alphabehavior.htm

Half of the verdicts in this thread are wrong then, boo .
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Old 5th July 2009, 11:52 PM   #192
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emotionally stable, smart, witty, charming, strong physically, and a good lover....
i use to be one before my separation lol
keeping your emotion under control is the main thing for the alpha.
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Old 6th July 2009, 10:33 AM   #193
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Maybe you are dealing with a point in your life where you don't feel like you've got things under control yet.
nope. everything is well under control. job, personal life. As I said, the qualities laid out that I felt weren't what I consider "alpha male" qualities are just describing a good man.

The ones that consider themselves alpha males are cocky, arrogant. Someone else agreed, so i can't be too far off


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Maybe you know the life you want to live by are still on the trip there so that why you don't feel "alpha" yet.
nope, living the life I want. I just don't want those other qualities that I think alot of people associate with "alpha". No thanks.
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Old 6th July 2009, 10:35 AM   #194
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Being the most charming, wealthiest, funniest, best looking, the strongest physically and a hunter does not an ideal man make, those qualities alone are all superficial qualities that could easily equal "player", in my books.

that was my point. The above is what most people tend to think of when they think of the label alpha male.

its a label that can mean many things to many people. my experience anyone that considers themselves an alphamale are cocky, arrogant, but still have all the good qualities others here might consider makes an alpha.
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Old 6th July 2009, 10:47 AM   #195
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What are you people talking about? Is this the Brave New World, in which we are divided into Alphas, Betas, Epsilons, Thetas etc. formed in hatcheries? Come on people, this isn't reality!
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