We got back together but I'm already unsure

[JuneL]

While I would help him solidify the plan, I wouldn’t be doing all the planning work like d0nnivain has suggested.

 

Btw, I think it’s fine taking turns doing the planning. But it sounds like this guy doesn’t want to do any planning at all.

[kathsil]

OP, I did not read everything, just the first couple of pages, but I will go against the rest here and say that the man seems inconsiderate at best. I would suggest dumping him.

 

You are dating, not married and he doesn't romance you at all. He makes no effort, is selfish. If you keep dating a guy like this you will end up a very unhappy and frustrated wife with a selfish man, who doesn't care to help, bring you flowers or generally treat you with consideration.

 

He should have asked you what is your schedule that day, if it's OK for him to hang around. He should ask you to go to dinner instead of always coming to your place and do whatever. That's not somebody I'd like as a partner, although some other people may be ok with it. That lazy behavior is certainly NOT ok when you are just dating. Not that is ok later, but people usually get lazier when they move in or marry.

 

Exactly as I think thank you!

 

I feel like he should be romancing and dating me, exactly.

 

And the thing is as I was saying in my previous post, he KNOWS how to be considerate and making an effort when he wants to lure me in, for example like inviting me out for dinner after we had an argument, but then goes back to his lazy ways afterwards.

 

This just makes me feel like I'm being played.

[kathsil]

You are entitled to want consistency. Given the pattern that you now describe, it's becoming more & more obvious to me that he will never be your guy. For whatever reason he is not motivated to give you what you crave. If you continue with him you have to recognize it will never happen.

 

I don't think this has nothing to do with me. I think it's just the way he is.

 

I remember him saying he used to have similar issues with his ex...

[JuneL]

Exactly as I think thank you!

 

I feel like he should be romancing and dating me, exactly.

 

And the thing is as I was saying in my previous post, he KNOWS how to be considerate and making an effort when he wants to lure me in, for example like inviting me out for dinner after we had an argument, but then goes back to his lazy ways afterwards.

 

This just makes me feel like I'm being played.

 

How long did he take you out on dates for, before you became official?

[kathsil]

About a month. The first time we had sex was after a night we went out for dinner and I invited him in for a night cap that was the start of everything.

 

Since that day all he wanted was to hang around at mine and no dating anymore. Just come to mine nearly every day and was already talking about moving in, until I said is too much too soon for that.

 

This is why I used the word "abusive" before, because he always kept pushing and pushing for me to give him more and kept giving less and less.

 

And the arguments started when I started to put my boundaries.

 

He basically went from making big efforts to nearly nothing, just appearing at my front door. That's why I felt so many times he is just looking for a housewife.

Edited May 2, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
quote removed

[kathsil]

Btw, I think it’s fine taking turns doing the planning. But it sounds like this guy doesn’t want to do any planning at all.

 

Yes of course it is. I don't mind doing the planning sometimes. For example if he's stressed at work or something, and I'm fine, I don't mind planning. But we need to have a balance, it seems he doesn't want to do anything.

 

Like today, I asked him what he wants to do Saturday, he said he's busy all day Saturday but we can meet in the evening and we can go to the movies or grab something to eat.

 

I replied I would like that, and that we can do one or the other, depending what time is the movie. He responded saying "that's wonderful", and nothing else...

 

Shouldn't he be saying something like "ok, I'll check movie times and get back to you on that"? But no, said nothing.

 

So I'm gonna do nothing as well.

[JuneL]

About a month. The first time we had sex was after a night we went out for dinner and I invited him in for a night cap that was the start of everything.

 

Since that day all he wanted was to hang around at mine and no dating anymore. Just come to mine nearly every day and was already talking about moving in, until I said is too much too soon for that.

 

This is why I used the word "abusive" before, because he always kept pushing and pushing for me to give him more and kept giving less and less.

 

And the arguments started when I started to put my boundaries.

 

He basically went from making big efforts to nearly nothing, just appearing at my front door. That's why I felt so many times he is just looking for a housewife.

 

Would it be okay if you reach a state in which you take turns planning dates? Because 5 months is a long time for him to keep wining and dining you.

[kathsil]

You know what? I did have a similar boyfriend years ago. He would do nothing, and I was so insecure and scared of losing him that I would do ALL the effort and planning and I was exhausted all the time and he was just happy because he just needed to show up. I once even planned an entire holiday abroad on my own for both of us and all he did was showing up.

 

So I do have a history of enabling this kind of lazy behaviour. The difference is I learned my lesson and I'm not insecure or scared anymore, in fact, I couldn't care less and I'm even considering breaking up because I want a different type of man now.

[kathsil]

Would it be okay if you reach a state in which you take turns planning dates? Because 5 months is a long time for him to keep wining and dining you.

 

He stopped after a month... And I felt he had a goal in place (getting into my house) and once he got it, he dropped the romancing and dating stuff.

 

And no 5 months is NOT a long time for him to keep wining and dining me. There are many men who are married for years and still do it.

[DKT3]

Honestly, I haven't read this entire thread, but if I were talking to your boyfriend I would say RUN.

 

You have some really unbalanced ideas of relationships. You communicate in codes and hints and call it abuse if he is too dense to pick it up. Yet, I would strongly suggest he run.

[Twizzlestick]

Alpha/beta/energies. Mind spin. God that guy doesn’t stand a chance.

 

I think Alpha/beta is a lot of simplistic digital nonsense that’s become a trend. We’re not lions. The character in American psycho would be considered Alpha. A former soldier would also be considered an alpha. One you very much might like to date and look up to with pride he’s on your arm. One you might like to put in prison. It’s an astonishingly dire characterisation of humans and nicked from the animal kingdom of apex predators.

 

One thing that grinds my gears more than guys pejoratively calling other guys beta or alpha is women pejoratively calling men beta. But that’s my cross to bare, not a lot I can do about that and I can live with it

 

Aside from that. OP. Your partner does sound like he drags his heels. And I don’t blame you for wanting to keep things spruced up.

 

Opposingly. You come across as incredibly high maintenance and quite entitled.

 

So I think you’re both contributing and the Lego bricks don’t fit.

 

 

As a thought. The bulk of all this is criticism of the men in your life and what you want. Have you considered what your partner wants? Are you aware of what your behaviour appears like?

 

For instance, I’m not saying this true, but your partner might find you strutting around calling yourself an alpha female, who wants to be beta’d sometimes by an alpha, quite, er, irritating. Just saying, does it feature on your Radar whether you fit what your partner wants?

 

For what it’s worth I think you both seem totally mismatched. I can see from the talk about date 2 it’s already going down the same path of over amped disaster. A date shouldn’t be this stressful, let alone in the planning stage.

 

I also get the impression you don’t respect this person very much. The thread tone, the labels you’ve used (abuser, beta). With no respect it’s not fair to keep him dragging along whilst not actually holding respect and it’s not fair on yourself.

 

This guy will never be what you want. Gender stereotypes or not, you’ll just remain disappointed unless you’re willing to take on board some suggestions or change yourself. And that’s entirely up to you and of course your right to do that or not.

[Twizzlestick]

 

My husband is a United States Marine Veteran. He's one of the strongest most loyal men I know but God bless him, the man can't plan his way out of a paper bag. He just sucks at it. I tried & tried to be deferential & let him arrange our dates. All it got me was pissed off. In frustration my husband finally pled with me to not rely on him to juggle all the details I can manage with ease because it's too much for him. So I run our social lives but he gets veto power. I'm also willing to do things without him. He is an introvert who needs alone time. Occasionally I will ask him for a specific thing: please plan a date next weekend. Or I give him a multiple choice Q: do you want to do X or Y? More variables just befuddle him. It has been much better since I just do it, but we didn't get there until we really talked & admitted things that were hard to talk about.

 

In exchange for doing more planning, I got a reliable steadfast guy who has gotten me through some pretty awful times including the deaths of my parents & the destruction of my childhood home.

 

You can carry on about all the gender stereotypes all you want but until you accept more responsibility for the path of your life & you social activities you will remain stuck in this frustrating place. The choice is yours. Longing to find somebody to do things for you that you can easily do yourself is a path to everlasting unhappiness

 

This, all day long. Best advice on the thread imo

[DKT3]

Like it or not alpha/beta are personality traits that people are attracted too. Would it be better if she said strong willed or too sensitive?

[JuneL]

Alpha/beta/energies. Mind spin. God that guy doesn’t stand a chance.

 

I think Alpha/beta is a lot of simplistic digital nonsense that’s become a trend. We’re not lions. The character in American psycho would be considered Alpha. A former soldier would also be considered an alpha. One you very much might like to date and look up to with pride he’s on your arm. One you might like to put in prison. It’s an astonishingly dire characterisation of humans and nicked from the animal kingdom of apex predators.

 

One thing that grinds my gears more than guys pejoratively calling other guys beta or alpha is women pejoratively calling men beta. But that’s my cross to bare, not a lot I can do about that and I can live with it

 

Aside from that. OP. Your partner does sound like he drags his heels. And I don’t blame you for wanting to keep things spruced up.

 

Opposingly. You come across as incredibly high maintenance and quite entitled.

 

So I think you’re both contributing and the Lego bricks don’t fit.

 

 

As a thought. The bulk of all this is criticism of the men in your life and what you want. Have you considered what your partner wants? Are you aware of what your behaviour appears like?

 

For instance, I’m not saying this true, but your partner might find you strutting around calling yourself an alpha female, who wants to be beta’d sometimes by an alpha, quite, er, irritating. Just saying, does it feature on your Radar whether you fit what your partner wants?

 

For what it’s worth I think you both seem totally mismatched. I can see from the talk about date 2 it’s already going down the same path of over amped disaster. A date shouldn’t be this stressful, let alone in the planning stage.

 

I also get the impression you don’t respect this person very much. The thread tone, the labels you’ve used (abuser, beta). With no respect it’s not fair to keep him dragging along whilst not actually holding respect and it’s not fair on yourself.

 

This guy will never be what you want. Gender stereotypes or not, you’ll just remain disappointed unless you’re willing to take on board some suggestions or change yourself. And that’s entirely up to you and of course your right to do that or not.

 

I like this post: OP is very high maintenance while the guy is lazy and acting dense. They are the worst mismatch. I suspect part of why the guy has been acting dumb is because of her being very high maintenance. In other words, both are passive aggressive in their own ways.

Edited May 2, 2019 by JuneL

[kathsil]

I like this post: OP is very high maintenance while the guy is lazy and acting dense. They are the worst mismatch. I suspect part of why the guy has been acting dense is because of her being very high maintenance.

 

So I should accept a guy who only wants to hang around at MY house ALL the times we are together, never plans dates, never wants to go anywhere, so I'm not high maintenance? That's just ridiculous. I'm not high maintenance, I like to be treated properly which is a big difference.

[kathsil]

Alpha/beta/energies. Mind spin. God that guy doesn’t stand a chance.

 

I think Alpha/beta is a lot of simplistic digital nonsense that’s become a trend. We’re not lions. The character in American psycho would be considered Alpha. A former soldier would also be considered an alpha. One you very much might like to date and look up to with pride he’s on your arm. One you might like to put in prison. It’s an astonishingly dire characterisation of humans and nicked from the animal kingdom of apex predators.

 

One thing that grinds my gears more than guys pejoratively calling other guys beta or alpha is women pejoratively calling men beta. But that’s my cross to bare, not a lot I can do about that and I can live with it

 

Aside from that. OP. Your partner does sound like he drags his heels. And I don’t blame you for wanting to keep things spruced up.

 

Opposingly. You come across as incredibly high maintenance and quite entitled.

 

So I think you’re both contributing and the Lego bricks don’t fit.

 

 

As a thought. The bulk of all this is criticism of the men in your life and what you want. Have you considered what your partner wants? Are you aware of what your behaviour appears like?

 

For instance, I’m not saying this true, but your partner might find you strutting around calling yourself an alpha female, who wants to be beta’d sometimes by an alpha, quite, er, irritating. Just saying, does it feature on your Radar whether you fit what your partner wants?

 

For what it’s worth I think you both seem totally mismatched. I can see from the talk about date 2 it’s already going down the same path of over amped disaster. A date shouldn’t be this stressful, let alone in the planning stage.

 

I also get the impression you don’t respect this person very much. The thread tone, the labels you’ve used (abuser, beta). With no respect it’s not fair to keep him dragging along whilst not actually holding respect and it’s not fair on yourself.

 

This guy will never be what you want. Gender stereotypes or not, you’ll just remain disappointed unless you’re willing to take on board some suggestions or change yourself. And that’s entirely up to you and of course your right to do that or not.

 

It's not simplistic and is not non-sense. It's real and will help you understand who you are and what you want if you take it seriously. Not just in dating but in everything.

 

I think a lot of people confuse an alpha man with being an egotistical jer* (like someone said on "American Psycho"), and that's NOT at all what a alpha male is.

 

A alpha male is a guy who PUTS THE MONEY WHERE THE MOUTH IS.

 

A guy who does what he says, who plans, who acts, who makes, who creates. The beta male is the one that follows them.

 

He can also be the most sensitive, emotional and caring guy in the world.

 

And THAT is the type of guy I am attracted to.

 

Not a lazy guy who thinks he's entitled to stay at my house as he wishes but I'm rarely invited to his for example.

[Twizzlestick]

Like it or not alpha/beta are personality traits that people are attracted too. Would it be better if she said strong willed or too sensitive?

 

I disagree. It’s not the bracketing people are attracted to rather complex vast behavioural traits people are attracted to.

 

No one goes around with a tick sheet marking off alpha traits. To prove this, some rather nasty traits will easily fall into “alpha” as well as some good ones, yet pervesly “alpha” as a catch all is largely understood to be something of admiration within urban language.

 

It’s the problem with using simplistic models and categorisations to define incredibly complex human behaviours that have had scientists and psychologists scratching their heads for centuries.

 

It works somewhat more in the animal kingdom because instincts define their marked behaviour more consistently. Humans are complex and constantly live at odds with instincts.

[kathsil]

Honestly, I haven't read this entire thread, but if I were talking to your boyfriend I would say RUN.

 

You have some really unbalanced ideas of relationships. You communicate in codes and hints and call it abuse if he is too dense to pick it up. Yet, I would strongly suggest he run.

 

He asked "do you want me to come to yours or meet somewhere else"?

 

I responded: "You can come to mine and then we can go and grab something to eat".

 

That to me is not speaking in hints or codes at all...

 

If he wants to run, I'll, hold the door for him

[kathsil]

I disagree. It’s not the bracketing people are attracted to rather complex vast behavioural traits people are attracted to.

 

No one goes around with a tick sheet marking off alpha traits. To prove this, some rather nasty traits will easily fall into “alpha” as well as some good ones, yet pervesly “alpha” as a catch all is largely understood to be something of admiration within urban language.

 

It’s the problem with using simplistic models and categorisations to define incredibly complex human behaviours that have had scientists and psychologists scratching their heads for centuries.

 

It works somewhat more in the animal kingdom because instincts define their marked behaviour more consistently. Humans are complex and constantly live at odds with instincts.

 

Being alpha or beta is not about the personality traits, is the energy you are in.

 

You either make the rules or you follow someone else's rules. And that sets the tone for all your behaviour.

[DKT3]

I disagree. It’s not the bracketing people are attracted to rather complex vast behavioural traits people are attracted to.

 

No one goes around with a tick sheet marking off alpha traits. To prove this, some rather nasty traits will easily fall into “alpha” as well as some good ones, yet pervesly “alpha” as a catch all is largely understood to be something of admiration within urban language.

 

It’s the problem with using simplistic models and categorisations to define incredibly complex human behaviours that have had scientists and psychologists scratching their heads for centuries.

 

It works somewhat more in the animal kingdom because instincts define their marked behaviour more consistently. Humans are complex and constantly live at odds with instincts.

This may be you Utopian view of attraction but in reality attraction is base level, yes animalistic. Far too othen people are somewhat clueless as to why they are attracted to the people they are.

[kathsil]

I disagree. It’s not the bracketing people are attracted to rather complex vast behavioural traits people are attracted to.

 

No one goes around with a tick sheet marking off alpha traits. To prove this, some rather nasty traits will easily fall into “alpha” as well as some good ones, yet pervesly “alpha” as a catch all is largely understood to be something of admiration within urban language.

 

It’s the problem with using simplistic models and categorisations to define incredibly complex human behaviours that have had scientists and psychologists scratching their heads for centuries.

 

It works somewhat more in the animal kingdom because instincts define their marked behaviour more consistently. Humans are complex and constantly live at odds with instincts.

 

An example my guy is beta is his work. He hates it, but has been there for years. And everyday (in his words), he keeps his head down and do as he's told. Because he is in a beta energy and prefers to follow. An alpha male is the one there making the rules.

 

Hey there's nothing wrong with being alpha or beta. As I said, is an energy. There are a lot of alpha females in dating who love to plan and take charge. They love beta guys.

 

I am very feminine in dating and I like alpha guys.

 

Google "gender polarity in dating" and you'll know what I mean.

[kathsil]

This may be you Utopian view of attraction but in reality attraction is base level, yes animalistic. Far too othen people are somewhat clueless as to why they are attracted to the people they are.

 

Of course it is. It's instinctive, we're animals too.

[DKT3]

Somewhat, I dont totally disagree with twizzlesticks, attraction does grow based on personality and behavior. But the intial attraction is usually base level, instinctual, yes.

Edited May 3, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
quote removed

[kathsil]

This guy explains it quite well:

 

https://www.tonyrobbins.com/ask-tony/polarity/

Edited May 3, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
quote removed

[Twizzlestick]

This may be you Utopian view of attraction but in reality attraction is base level, yes animalistic. Far too othen people are somewhat clueless as to why they are attracted to the people they are.

 

 

Yes I think this is getting off thread topic, and I’m being somewhat straw manned on my original statement re alpha/beta

 

My Premis re alpha and beta in that post was not centered on attraction. My view is equally, not actually utopian. Am I discounting we find deep attraction with animalistic traits? Of course not. Please show me exactly where I stated such.

 

Further more. Our attraction extends way beyond animalistic traits. And that is not utopian, it’s empirically true. It’s why human relationships are so complex.

 

All of which is an aside as I wasn’t discussing the relevance of alpha/beta to attraction rather citing the modern urban language is flawed as rather undesirable characters can slip neatly into “alpha” whilst conversely it’s considered in urban circles to be a positive connotation. It drifted onto atttaction by a misinterpretation of my point.

 

But anyway, back to the thread ..