Author giotto Posted September 16, 2019 Author Share Posted September 16, 2019 Nope, it's more like ZERO sex is unacceptable. You're skewing this for what purpose? I have to agree with this... Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted September 16, 2019 Author Share Posted September 16, 2019 Not that hard to understand. I need oxygen to live but wouldn't be happy were you to take away food and water... Mr. Lucky Well said. Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 .... Do you know how many times I have explained her to her the meaning of sex for me. It's the intimacy, the bonding at the deeper level, all things we used to have. Then she pushed me away and she blamed me for getting upset about it. She was not interested in talking about it, as sex was not important to her. In fact I believe some married women actually hate having sex. In order to give you what you wanted, she would have had to sacrifice her own needs and wants. Having sex for her probably was the opposite of intimacy and instead of deeper bonding, she may have felt it weakened bonds. The more you pressed, the more you wanted to talk about it, the worse it got. There was no point in you going on about "deeper bonding" when to her mind, "sex" was ruining things... You were projecting your feelings about sex onto her. You felt more intimacy, you felt closer, you felt "the love" when you had sex, she, I guess didn't. She would have had to do something she didn't really like doing and that for most people is hard enough to do as a one off, never mind "regularly" for years... I know it is an essential part of marriage for many men (& women), but some women, it seems, have sex down as a low priority or as time goes on, no priority at all. In fact it it can be seen as a dreadful chore, something to be avoided. Not talking may be one of her issues, but put it this way. Say she wants to go live on the coast, you don't want to. You like the beach "kind of" but you don't want to live there. She keeps bringing it up, you fend her off, until you get so fed up of the constant hassling, you stop talking to her about it. You know she would love it, but there is nothing to talk about, because as far as you are concerned you are not living on the coast full stop... 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted September 16, 2019 Author Share Posted September 16, 2019 She was not interested in talking about it, as sex was not important to her. Maybe it never was, but she didn't give me this impression in the first 10 years. But I have discovered many things lately: since she has Pure O OCD, she's been entirely preoccupied with her intrusive thoughts. It was ok with just me, then with a child, then with the second one... but with more kids, it got too much and something had to give and this was me. I'm pretty sure this is what happened... I've been reading a lot online. People with similar stories. It's actually quite chilling. Unfortunately, she couldn't talk about it, because this is a typical trait of someone suffering from Pure O. She pushed me away, but I know it wasn't her fault. Well, I know now. If, to this, we add the menopause, the empty nest and the depression, we are where we are now. She doesn't want to be fixed, so I'm not spending the rest of my life in this co-dependency. I don't know, maybe I'm a selfish human being. Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted September 16, 2019 Share Posted September 16, 2019 In order to give you what you wanted, she would have had to sacrifice her own needs and wants. Isn't this the very definition of selfishness ? Like most spouses (my wife included), I do a number of things in my marriage outside my "own wants and needs". Were any partner determined to limit him or herself solely to their own desires, successful relationships would be rare. Any LTR or marriage is necessarily about compromise, accommodation and consideration, and I'd guess this is more true the older we get and the longer we're together. A unilateral change or shutdown in any major area - sexual, emotional, fiscal, etc. - leads to a fairly predictable result. You only have to read the forums here... Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted September 16, 2019 Author Share Posted September 16, 2019 A unilateral change or shutdown in any major area - sexual, emotional, fiscal, etc. - leads to a fairly predictable result. You only have to read the forums here... Mr. Lucky And unfortunately, my case confirms this... what upset me most was that she just presented it to me, like a fait accompli... actually, I rephrase it: she never talked to me about it, she just did it and let me to guess the reasons, until I confronted her... but this was another problem she couldn't talk about. Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted September 19, 2019 Author Share Posted September 19, 2019 How would you deal with the accusation "you are leaving me just because of sex"? I've tried to explain the whole concept of bonding at a deeper level, intimacy, etc., but my wife just doesn't get it, like she didn't get it before. So, apparently, it's my fault. I know she has issues and no libido, so she can't relate to actually wanting sex, but surely it's not a difficult concept to understand? Should I accept a sexless marriage and no sex for the rest of my life at 56? My wife doesn't seem to get that she's changed the terms of our marriage and that she has to bear the consequence... Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted September 19, 2019 Share Posted September 19, 2019 You have actively ended the marriage and sent her whole "old age" into a tailspin. Of course she doesn't "get it", and all for sex, something she also doesn't 'get'. She spent decades of her life supporting a marriage, raising kids, no doubt putting her own life on hold, to have it all blow up in her face. All due to the fact you want to put your penis into her vagina... As far as she is concerned it is all totally ridiculous, of course she blames you. All this chaos and upset over some "silly sex", and at 56 too... A time when sex slows down or stops anyway, she thought she was on easy street and now you want to divorce????... Madness! from her POV. You will I guess never persuade her to see it from your viewpoint. You want to be seen as the victim, or if not that, at least to be seen as the good guy who tried everything and failed, but she doesn't see it like that. She liked the status quo, (she no doubt liked the "sexlessness"} and you from her POV, took a wrecking ball to the whole marriage... Instead of some safe security as you age, you are now both tossed into the ocean... Of course she blames you... 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted September 19, 2019 Author Share Posted September 19, 2019 You have actively ended the marriage and sent her whole "old age" into a tailspin... Of course she blames you... I get it that she blames me... but what about seeing all this from my point of view? I have spent decades of my life supporting a marriage, raising kids, and putting my own life on hold, too. Yes, I want to put my penis into her vagina... I thought this was part of a healthy marriage? A good sex life? Sex does slow down at 56... was I asking for sex everyday? It was once a month, if that. Now she has unilaterally withdrawn it from the marriage, without even consulting me. Yes, it's true, she doesn't get it at all and it's my fault I disturbed (her) status quo, taking a wrecking ball to the marriage. To be honest, it's all about her needs and what she wants. Forget about me. She is not prepared to "fix herself" for the sake of the marriage. Why should I stay, enabling her for the rest of our lives? She can enjoy her life on her own without me bothering her with my penis... Link to post Share on other sites
Marc878 Posted September 19, 2019 Share Posted September 19, 2019 You keep expecting her to "get it" but you are the one not "getting it". She doesn't care. You want to live the life of a celibate monk? If not you don't have much of a choice. Life is short. Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted September 19, 2019 Share Posted September 19, 2019 I am not suggesting you stay but expecting her not to blame you and to "get it" is a tall order IMO. You need to just move on without her "approval". Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted September 19, 2019 Author Share Posted September 19, 2019 You need to just move on without her "approval". This is what I'm doing... 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted September 19, 2019 Share Posted September 19, 2019 How would you deal with the accusation "you are leaving me just because of sex"? I would answer "Yes I am" ... Mr. Lucky 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Marc878 Posted September 19, 2019 Share Posted September 19, 2019 Talk is only keeping you tied up in your underwear. IMO you don't need to explain anything more. Just move on already. You seem to stay tied up in the hopium daze. Nothing's changed for years. Why continue this worthless banter? These threads come up all the time and it's not gender specific either. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted September 20, 2019 Author Share Posted September 20, 2019 Talk is only keeping you tied up in your underwear. I am moving on... but it's very annoying it's always my fault... Link to post Share on other sites
Marc878 Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 I am moving on... but it's very annoying it's always my fault... Of course it is and always will be. No contact will fix that. You're kids are older. Many fall into the trap of "we have kids so we have to talk, etc." Nope, you sure don't. Your kids will adjust. Life does go on. Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 I am moving on... but it's very annoying it's always my fault... Giotto, at some it has to be about moving forward. That means starting your next chapter and letting her start hers. Hope your thoughts turn towards the future... Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
Buffer Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 I am moving on... but it's very annoying it's always my fault... I am glad you are moving on, but it isn’t your fault, in her mind she is blaming you for the pressure of wanting to prove your love to her twice a month. Don’t accept the blame. Good luck Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 Getting into fights about "blame" will keep you stuck. Getting a divorce is about moving away from the past, about becoming separate people. That is achieved very often by "letting it go". You wanted sex in the marriage, she didn't, it is pretty black and white, ultimately there is/was no middle ground. You are never going to persuade her you were right, nor is she going to persuade you that she was right. So you need to "let it go. Stay away from her. You have decades in front of you, you could quite easily spend/waste the time enmeshed in misery and blame, or you could put all this behind you and look forward to a better future as an independent adult. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted September 22, 2019 Author Share Posted September 22, 2019 You have decades in front of you, you could quite easily spend/waste the time enmeshed in misery and blame, or you could put all this behind you and look forward to a better future as an independent adult. Amen to this! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
AMarriedMan Posted September 24, 2019 Share Posted September 24, 2019 Women seem to do very well on their own, men not so much. After divorce, yes. I wonder why that is. Could the divorce laws and courts have something to do with that? Link to post Share on other sites
HappySenior Posted September 25, 2019 Share Posted September 25, 2019 You have actively ended the marriage and sent her whole "old age" into a tailspin. Of course she doesn't "get it", and all for sex, something she also doesn't 'get'. She spent decades of her life supporting a marriage, raising kids, no doubt putting her own life on hold, to have it all blow up in her face. All due to the fact you want to put your penis into her vagina... As far as she is concerned it is all totally ridiculous, of course she blames you. All this chaos and upset over some "silly sex", and at 56 too... A time when sex slows down or stops anyway, she thought she was on easy street and now you want to divorce????... Madness! from her POV. You will I guess never persuade her to see it from your viewpoint. You want to be seen as the victim, or if not that, at least to be seen as the good guy who tried everything and failed, but she doesn't see it like that. She liked the status quo, (she no doubt liked the "sexlessness"} and you from her POV, took a wrecking ball to the whole marriage... Instead of some safe security as you age, you are now both tossed into the ocean... Of course she blames you... Just a note - it does happen in reverse. My previous husband had a low libido and I managed to blow up the marriage by being oversexed and making it a priority. He refused to get treatment and I pretty much "went my own way" and had an online affair. Making him unhappy and driving him into a work affair (and marriage). At least Giotto's marriage is the norm and he will get lots of understanding from other men. Imagine the reverse and as a woman trying to tell people you messed up your marriage because not enough sex! I didn't know what I had, because he was such an ideal partner. Willing to "adjust" to everything but the one thing he couldn't help. I had embedded ideas about what love was supposed to "look like" and I just didn't see it. Link to post Share on other sites
preraph Posted September 25, 2019 Share Posted September 25, 2019 How would you deal with the accusation "you are leaving me just because of sex"? I've tried to explain the whole concept of bonding at a deeper level, intimacy, etc., but my wife just doesn't get it, like she didn't get it before. So, apparently, it's my fault. I know she has issues and no libido, so she can't relate to actually wanting sex, but surely it's not a difficult concept to understand? Should I accept a sexless marriage and no sex for the rest of my life at 56? My wife doesn't seem to get that she's changed the terms of our marriage and that she has to bear the consequence... Because you're just talking about me, me, me. None of that is true for her. She may very well "get it," but it conflicts with her own needs, which you don't get at all. I've seen on here over and over where men say they need sex to feel intimate and feel loved, and they act like that should override whatever the woman's needs are for herself. It doesn't. And I think many women doubt that that is even the honest truth. I think many women have seen how men will have sex even when they're in a bad mood or mad at them or have it cheating with someone they barely know and know it's not always about feeling loved and intimate but often just to have an orgasm. All that said, she'd probably be better off without the tension in her life and so would you, so hope you have an amicable divorce. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted September 27, 2019 Author Share Posted September 27, 2019 Because you're just talking about me, me, me. None of that is true for her. I do get that, but we are married. Obviously, we have different concepts of what marriage should be and I accept that. But they are not compatible. Since she can do without the sex and I can't, I don't have much choice (apart from living like a monk for the rest of my life). What troubles me is that she believes I'm leaving her just because of sex, because she is seeing the whole thing through her interpretation of sex. I tried to explain it to her, but she doesn't want to see it/doesn't understand. Fair enough. It's true I'm leaving her because of sex, but sex is an important part of the marriage for me and without it it's not a marriage to me, but friendship. Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted September 27, 2019 Share Posted September 27, 2019 Because you're just talking about me, me, me. None of that is true for her. She may very well "get it," but it conflicts with her own needs, which you don't get at all. Somehow the wife's needs are important but giotto's are not. Even when you've been married decades, a marriage is still about "us", not "me". His wife has turned a blind eye to the intimacy the relationship needs, forget what giotto wants. If she wants to focus solely on what she wants, have to do it as a single person. She'll have plenty of time and, as you pointed out, fewer conflicts... Mr. Lucky 2 Link to post Share on other sites
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