snowcones Posted March 30, 2019 Share Posted March 30, 2019 I don't think it's unorthodox... it happens, but at 55 I think it's a bit too early... I'm pretty sure my parents were having sex in their sixties... we've been struggling for the last 15 years (at least), so this is no news. What I find disrespectful is that she withdrew the sex part without even consulting with me. She presented it as a de facto situation... also, she has said things that have put me off having sex with her ever again. So, we are separating. 55 is not too early. This stuff happens to couples in their 20's even. And it's mutual. You just had fire and your wife didn't. So you're not even separated yet? Why haven't you done it yet? Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted March 30, 2019 Author Share Posted March 30, 2019 55 is not too early. This stuff happens to couples in their 20's even. And it's mutual. You just had fire and your wife didn't. So you're not even separated yet? Why haven't you done it yet? The thing is, we were having great sex before she pulled the plug. Admittedly, not very often but it was enough for me. I just don't get it. It's not like she hated it... We are not separated yet because I was waiting for my little kid to go to uni in September... I said I would wait to see what happens... without giving a deadline. So I will wait a little bit longer. I think I owe it to her. I doubt very much anything is going to happen. She won't change her mind and it's too late anyway. I'm not going back to her. It's just matter of finding the strength to tell her, with all the drama and sadness that that will entail. Link to post Share on other sites
snowcones Posted March 30, 2019 Share Posted March 30, 2019 The thing is, we were having great sex before she pulled the plug. Admittedly, not very often but it was enough for me. I just don't get it. It's not like she hated it... We are not separated yet because I was waiting for my little kid to go to uni in September... I said I would wait to see what happens... without giving a deadline. So I will wait a little bit longer. I think I owe it to her. I doubt very much anything is going to happen. She won't change her mind and it's too late anyway. I'm not going back to her. It's just matter of finding the strength to tell her, with all the drama and sadness that that will entail. You have a loooong way to go. Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted March 30, 2019 Author Share Posted March 30, 2019 You have a loooong way to go. I'm aware of that... Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted March 30, 2019 Author Share Posted March 30, 2019 But it's also true that, for the first time in years, I feel I can finally detach and start from scratch. I've been waiting for this moment for months and months and I thought it would never happen. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 Nothing. I have an unorthodox opinion, but I think after a couple has been together for a while, they naturally start to become like roommates or like BFF's if they have an especially emotionally close relationship. Sex and passion tapers way off. Some (most?) couples are okay with this and get on just fine, because they have other reasons to stay married Here’s what you don’t understand - and I didn’t either at your age. In my 60’s, my relationship goals no different than they were in my 30’s. Within the context of age, I want to be the best emotional, sexual and life partner to my spouse I can be. Apathy isn’t a consequence, it’s a choice like everything else in life. The person I’ve chosen to spend my life with deserves better... Mr. Lucky 2 Link to post Share on other sites
snowcones Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 Here’s what you don’t understand - and I didn’t either at your age. In my 60’s, my relationship goals no different than they were in my 30’s. Within the context of age, I want to be the best emotional, sexual and life partner to my spouse I can be. Apathy isn’t a consequence, it’s a choice like everything else in life. The person I’ve chosen to spend my life with deserves better... Mr. Lucky I never said I approve of the form of relationship I described. I don't, and would never be in a marriage like that. It's still very common though. Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted April 20, 2019 Author Share Posted April 20, 2019 (edited) Everything is out and everybody knows now. My eldest daughter told everybody. My wife knows everybody knows. I guess we can separate officially earlier than I thought and I can have my life back... feels good... Edited April 20, 2019 by giotto Link to post Share on other sites
Wallysbears Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 Too bad it had to be your kid with the guts to break the news. Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted April 20, 2019 Author Share Posted April 20, 2019 Too bad it had to be your kid with the guts to break the news. It's not matter of "guts"... she decided to tell everybody because my wife kept lying to them and her sisters about our relationship. So she put the record straight, without consulting me... I didn't know she was telling lies to everyone... Link to post Share on other sites
Wallysbears Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 No, it is guts. Your kids weren’t naive as to the state of affairs in the family and neither you nor your wife had the courage to say that you were staying together simply for them...until the youngest was out of the house. So your lying/hiding - wife lying and you hiding - the truth didn’t work. You owe them an apology. Both of you. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted April 20, 2019 Author Share Posted April 20, 2019 You owe them an apology. I have done that already. Not sure about my wife. The rest is harsh, but true. Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted April 20, 2019 Share Posted April 20, 2019 Your kids weren’t naive as to the state of affairs in the family and neither you nor your wife had the courage to say that you were staying together simply for them...until the youngest was out of the house. Isn't this something conveyed through deed rather than word? As a teenager, not sure how I'd process "your Mom and I have no interest in staying married but have to decided to remain together for your sake". Seems like a guilt trip waiting to happen... Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted April 20, 2019 Author Share Posted April 20, 2019 As a teenager, not sure how I'd process "your Mom and I have no interest in staying married but have to decided to remain together for your sake". Mr. Lucky It's never easy... and I thought we had sorted it. I was wrong, but that doesn't mean we only had bad times in our marriage. Recently, all my kids told me they had a fantastic childhood and that counts a lot for me. Nobody is perfect. I did my very best. I'm partially at fault for not understanding completely (due to lack of info forthcoming) and I lacked some maturity. True. She's taken a decision and she is prepared to go through with it, despite the consequences. Fair enough. Link to post Share on other sites
vla1120 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 It's never easy... and I thought we had sorted it. I was wrong, but that doesn't mean we only had bad times in our marriage. Recently, all my kids told me they had a fantastic childhood and that counts a lot for me. Nobody is perfect. I did my very best. I'm partially at fault for not understanding completely (due to lack of info forthcoming) and I lacked some maturity. True. She's taken a decision and she is prepared to go through with it, despite the consequences. Fair enough. It is good that your kids have said they had a fantastic childhood. My daughters also have stated that, from their childhood, they remember the family trips, dinner conversations, weekend events, etc., more so than the conflict. That is a good thing and I am very happy they have those positive memories. I am curious about how your kids are faring in relationships. That is where it has come out in my daughters. I hope yours have fared better than mine in their relationships! Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 I hope yours have fared better than mine in their relationships! Some interesting facts I read some time ago about the children of divorced parents: - If your parents are happily married, your risk of divorce decreases by 14 percent. - If your parents married others after divorcing, you’re 91 percent more likely to get divorced. - According to Nicholas Wolfinger in “Understanding the Divorce Cycle”, the risk of divorce is 50 percent higher when one spouse comes from a divorced home and 200 percent higher when both partners do. - In addition, children of divorce are 50 percent more likely to marry another child of divorce. - Certain studies have shown that daughters of divorced parents have a 60 percent higher divorce rate in marriages than children of non-divorced parents while sons have a 35 percent higher rate. Somewhat daunting... Mr. Lucky 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted April 25, 2019 Author Share Posted April 25, 2019 I am curious about how your kids are faring in relationships. That is where it has come out in my daughters. I hope yours have fared better than mine in their relationships! They are all going out with lovely boyfriend/girlfriends... very nice and polite. I couldn't be happier. I'm from a different European country and my children absolutely loved our summer trips to my country. Very happy memories. They are also very attached to their grandparents. All in all, pretty good! I feel a bit like... hey, wife... did you have to spoil all this? Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted June 16, 2019 Author Share Posted June 16, 2019 Update: we had the final talk the other day. It transpires that she hated me being angry and I scared her. We didn't communicate and that was her fault. She's split the blame 50/50... also, she hasn't loved me for a few years, but she stayed for the kids... Well, I've asked how long she hasn't loved me exactly and if this precedes my "angry" phase... she hasn't answered me yet... I think I know my answer... Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 Giotto, is this kind of information and engagement beneficial at this point? The tendency to revise history aside, I'm not sure how any of this helps you move forward. You've known the relationship to be dead for some time now, so this kind of postmortem doesn't seem like it contributes much. One of the dangers of "staying for the kids". Without the buffer love and consideration provides, things can get pretty brutal... Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted June 16, 2019 Author Share Posted June 16, 2019 Giotto, is this kind of information and engagement beneficial at this point? Mr. Lucky It's for my own closure. It's not to apportion blame, but to establish the facts, so I can learn from my own mistakes - if they were mistakes - and take my life forward. I understand it might be a painful revisitation, but I can't move on without knowing some basic facts. She probably won't tell me and I won't push her. Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 Update: we had the final talk the other day. It transpires that she hated me being angry and I scared her. I am not blaming you for your anger, but it seems to me many men get angry, they minimise it and think it is kind of normal, whereas many women get scared and shut up. As life goes on, the apologies and the loving, kind, fun times get less and less and all that is left to the fore is the anger... Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted June 16, 2019 Author Share Posted June 16, 2019 I am not blaming you for your anger, but it seems to me many men get angry, they minimise it and think it is kind of normal, whereas many women get scared and shut up. As life goes on, the apologies and the loving, kind, fun times get less and less and all that is left to the fore is the anger... I am the first to admit that it was wrong, nevertheless I can count on the fingers of one hand the times I got angry. I never touched her, just said stuff in anger and left the room. To me, that was a normal reaction to a situation that went on for ages. It was desperation and frustration. Of course we all have different sensibilities. I'm not proud of it but we got to that point because of her inability to deal with her issues and not communicating with me. I never got angry again and I thought we were fine, but obviously she can't forget/forgive me. Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 ...nevertheless I can count on the fingers of one hand the times I got angry. Problem is, the frequency is immaterial. If you went to the supermarket and some guy pulled a knife on you and scared you, he only needs to do it once, you are unlikely to forget that feeling of being scared. You may avoid the supermarket, give all guys there a wide berth, and by doing that you conquer your fear, but when it anger incidents happen in the home, your wife has nowhere to go. When men get very angry, they know they are not going to punch her, kick her, or stab or strangle her, but she doesn't know that, that is the issue. Most women are no match for a man so when that man snaps she knows she is powerless, that is where the fear comes from. Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted June 16, 2019 Author Share Posted June 16, 2019 When men get very angry, they know they are not going to punch her, kick her, or stab or strangle her, but she doesn't know that, that is the issue. Most women are no match for a man so when that man snaps she knows she is powerless, that is where the fear comes from. I agree with most of your post. But regarding the bit I'm quoting: after 20 years together (that's when the angry phase happened), she would know me well enough to realise that I would never punch her, kick her, stab her or strangle her. I did wrong, but it was out of frustration and lack of communication. I didn't know what was going in her head and she wouldn't tell me. In hindsight, I would have handled it very differently. Link to post Share on other sites
FMW Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 I was married for 23 years. A few years prior to divorcing my xH started having anger issues. One time he got really annoyed with me over something (I think it was probably my expressing my own annoyance over something he had done or not done that caused a problem for me) and he threw a bunch of heavy books he had in his hands forcefully on the ground and stormed out of the room, slamming the door violently behind him. I'm 5'8", not tiny or weak, but he was 6'2" and well over 200 lbs and lifted weights on a regular basis. He did NOT come close to hitting me and never had in the previous 20+ years - but that show of anger scared me and clearly I haven't forgotten it to this day. It was really unsettling. I can't give you a reasonable explanation of why it affected me the way it did, all I can tell you is it did. From there forward I was waiting for him to explode again and felt I had to be really careful about what and how I said every little thing. I'm not trying to make you feel bad giotto, just saying you should never dismiss someone's feelings about things like that. Sometimes, sure, they may just be grasping for excuses, but sometimes they may be telling you the truth. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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