What is meant by "gentleman" and "chivalrous" in women's OLD profiles?

[amaysngrace]

In other words, utterly ridiculous and unrealistic expectations which will never be achieved by any real world man. At least not one that she will ever meet in her lifetime.

 

Are you kidding? My sons have most if not all of those qualities but I'm certain will achieve them in their lifetimes as they're both still young.

 

Although my oldest has been to Puerto Rico.

[S_A]

As a crusty old feminist, I disagree. This is the hallmark of a woman who wants the spoils of what feminists have achieved for women without accepting the equality part. My feminist daughter very much pays her own way - it's all about fairness.

 

This is why I say femenism does not elevate women up to the level of men, it brings women down to our level instead. Men should be begging for the opportunity to pay for dates with your daughter. It should be this way because women have much more at stake as well as all the leverage.

 

My beef with femenism has nothing to do with "man-pride." No. I have an issue with individuals and groups of people (i.e. women) who have absolutely no clue what they are worth to the rest of society and, as a result, under-value themselves.

 

I remember leaving my local Trader Joe's one time and a married couple walked out ahead of me. The wife had the groceries, the baby, and loaded the SUV. The douchey husband trailed her while he was looking at his phone. Welcome to our femenist world ladies! I think femenism did help women, but the problem is that femenism did not end when it should have and has now probably done more harm to women than good.

[CautiouslyOptimistic]

I'm still trying to figure out what's wrong with Puerto Rico.

 

 

And I'm not sure I'd read Pride and Prejudice at gunpoint.

 

LOL Puerto Rico is awesome!

[Shining One]

Next time you meet a woman for the first time, demonstrate that you're a gentleman by undoing her bra with one hand.

[NuevoYorko]

In other words, utterly ridiculous and unrealistic expectations which will never be achieved by any real world man. At least not one that she will ever meet in her lifetime.

 

I believe that was meant to be what is called "tongue in cheek."

[kendahke]

It means they're letting it be known to those who are not in their lane to stay out of their lane and don't hit them up with a bs "hey" message. This has nothing to do with being a "princess", which is a lazy, pouty, tantruming fallacy.

 

And a sugar daddy has nothing do with being a gentleman. That conflation shoots a hole in that argument.

 

It's about warding off the f-boys who are in their lane, getting in the way and wasting their time. The men who understand this understand and aren't put off by it. The guys who don't, complain.

[elaine567]

I believe that was meant to be what is called "tongue in cheek."

 

It may be slightly tongue in cheek but this is from the magazine Country Life so I guess not so tongue in cheek as you would imagine perhaps.

It is an "elitist" magazine about the finer things in life.

I would guess many reading it would not consider that list "ridiculous at all.

[Michelle ma Belle]

Well, I'm 48 and was born of a generation where men were raised to be gentlemen. I was blessed to have had a father who exemplified chivalry and what being a gentleman really looked like and felt like. I was then lucky enough to marry a man who echoed those same qualities I grew up knowing. I just assumed the way I was raised and the men I was surrounded with were the norm.

 

NOT.

 

Unfortunately, when I returned to dating again after my divorce 8 years ago, finding men like my father and brother and my ex husband has been harder than finding a tic on a sheepdog.

 

My father is a staunch feminist who raised me to be a strong fearless and independent woman. He also taught me that chivalry should never been seen as a threat to my being a feminist. That the two aren't mutually exclusive and instead work in harmony in order to achieve a happy and mutually fulfilling relationship.

 

SevenCity, given you're about the same age as me and dating women in their 40's (did I remember that correctly?) I suspect they too are looking for men who remind them of their fathers. Although it does appear that being called a gentlemen is up for interpretation these days and often depends on who you're talking. Very much like trying to define feminism. Everyone seems to have their own spin on what it means to them.

 

Regardless, I didn't get sugar daddy from that at all.

 

But I also feel like you're not painting a very accurate picture for us either.

[knabe]

A man who has a calculator out at the first date is quite decidedly NOT a gentleman. And that has nothing to do with sugar daddies or gold diggers.

 

Keeping score is about being insecure, jaded, and emotionally unintelligent. And most women don't like that.

[stillafool]

I would guess they want a guy with some class about him.

A guy that is relationship material, a guy who is not into casual sex, nor swears his head off nor acts like a jerk.

A guy who knows how to treat a woman well and with respect.

 

Elaine, did they also have a list of what a lady should be? I would be curious to see that list too.

[elaine567]

 

Regardless, I didn't get sugar daddy from that at all.

 

But does that not illustrate the fundamental disconnect.

 

She is looking for a "gentleman" and a man who is "chivalrous" equates in the "all about sex" or the "jaded" male mind to mean she is looking for a sugar daddy or needs all her meals paid for her...

 

chivalry noun

 

uk ​ /ˈʃɪv.əl.ri/ us ​ /ˈʃɪv.əl.ri/

 

very polite, honest, and kind behaviour, especially by men towards women

 

[some_username1]

It is quite funny really how we live in an era where an almost uncountable number of terms are constantly challenged because of the gender role connotations associated with them, 'lady' being a good example given by a poster earlier. And yet, perhaps the most quintessential gender role term of 'gentleman' goes unchallenged without fail.

 

Those turkeys ain't stupid enough to vote for Christmas, obviously!

[elaine567]

Elaine, did they also have a list of what a lady should be? I would be curious to see that list too.

Yes............

 

A lady . . .

1 Finds laughter is the best medicine

2 Can say ‘thank you’ no matter where she is in the world

3 Cooks perfect, crispy roast potatoes

4 Offers to split the bill

5 Knows that everyone, including herself, improves with age

6 Offers the builder a cup of tea

7 Excels at making love, lasagne and long gin and tonics

8 Can silence a man with a stare and make a dog lie down with a hand signal—and vice versa

9 Can imitate Piglet and Pooh voices for a bedtime story

10 Prefers Mr Knightley to Mr Wickham, but is secretly in love with Rupert Campbell-Black

11 Never downs a drink in one, unless it’s a shot of tequila

12 Is aware that the school run and dog walking do not require full make-up

13 Never wears shoes she can’t walk in

14 Knows when a man is spoken for

15 Can paunch a rabbit, pluck a pheasant and gut a fish, but allows men the privilege

16 Remembers her godchildren’s birthdays

17 Knows songs for a long car journey

18 Is neither early for a dinner party nor late for church

19 Doesn’t over-pluck her eyebrows

20 Knows how to deflect a lecher with grace, and a proposal with kindness

21 Comforts nervous flyers

22 Would never have Botox

23 Knows when to let a man think it’s his idea

24 Would never own a handbag dog

25 Can tie—and untie—a bow tie

26 Might not understand the rules of rugby and cricket, but enjoys the game anyway

27 Knows when to take control in the bedroom and the boardroom

28 Knows the difference between Bentley & Skinner and Baddiel and Skinner

29 Instills manners in her children, but lets their characters flourish

30 Knows when to deadhead a rose

31 Is never afraid to overdress

32 Can handle a sports car, a sit-on mower and a ski lift

33 Knows when to stop dyeing her hair

34 Teaches her son to iron his shirts and her daughter to change a fuse

35 Owns a little black dress

36 Always has a hanky

37 Knows that ‘brevity is the soul of lingerie’

38 Has kissed several frogs and made them feel like princes

39 However lucky in life, she doesn’t boast on Facebook

 

Read more at 39 steps to being a lady - Country Life

 

[Michelle ma Belle]

But does that not illustrate the fundamental disconnect.

 

She is looking for a "gentleman" and a man who is "chivalrous" equates in the "all about sex" or the "jaded" male mind to mean she is looking for a sugar daddy or needs all her meals paid for her...

 

It obviously equates to this in the OP's mind but as a rule it shouldn't.

 

That being said, just as I pointed out in my post, chivalry and gentleman are up for interpretation more often than not these days since everything seems to be code for something thanks to the digital age and dating online. Ugh.

 

Honestly, if something like this stands out in someone's profile, I would address it head on if only to ensure everyone is on the same page right from the start.

[SevenCity]

Wow I didn't realize I would get so many replies.

 

Anyway, the women referenced were 2 and 4 months respectively. I don't subscribe to the theory that I'm lucky to get a girl out on a date. I don't believe a strong partnership starts from a subservient position.

 

I realized there tend to be a lot of women at my age (40s) who feel it is the man's job to entertain them without adding value other than sex so I try to weed out ones with that mindset through profiles and pics (on private jets, spending their summers abroad, etc).

 

A friend of mine was looking to set me up with a woman he knew and her first questions were "How much does he make and does he have a boat"?. Needless to say I wasn't interested after that obvious sign of gold diggery.

 

However, some are not looking for a sugar daddy in the traditional sense, but still expect men to finance their entertainment. These are harder to spot at first glance so I filter as best I can.

 

As stated by Pete, these are obvious statements but it doesn't stop 90% from using poor descriptors in their profile "I love to laugh", "My friends and family are very important to me", "The sky is blue" lol.

 

As far as meaning they don't want to be used for sex, I would say 98% of the profiles state "Not looking for a hookup" so I don't think that is the meaning.

 

Despite some of the posts, I tend to think the two words mean "This is all on you".

[Michelle ma Belle]

Wow I didn't realize I would get so many replies.

 

Anyway, the women referenced were 2 and 4 months respectively. I don't subscribe to the theory that I'm lucky to get a girl out on a date. I don't believe a strong partnership starts from a subservient position.

 

I realized there tend to be a lot of women at my age (40s) who feel it is the man's job to entertain them without adding value other than sex so I try to weed out ones with that mindset through profiles and pics (on private jets, spending their summers abroad, etc).

 

A friend of mine was looking to set me up with a woman he knew and her first questions were "How much does he make and does he have a boat"?. Needless to say I wasn't interested after that obvious sign of gold diggery.

 

However, some are not looking for a sugar daddy in the traditional sense, but still expect men to finance their entertainment. These are harder to spot at first glance so I filter as best I can.

 

As stated by Pete, these are obvious statements but it doesn't stop 90% from using poor descriptors in their profile "I love to laugh", "My friends and family are very important to me", "The sky is blue" lol.

 

As far as meaning they don't want to be used for sex, I would say 98% of the profiles state "Not looking for a hookup" so I don't think that is the meaning.

 

Despite some of the posts, I tend to think the two words mean "This is all on you".

 

Well if that is your interpretation, and I'm not saying it's wrong necessarily, then perhaps the take away from these experiences is to come right out and ask them to clarify in no uncertain terms what they mean by it.

 

I would think that dating in our 40's, if nothing else, has earned us the right to ask some pretty bold questions upfront.

 

Or is this yet another example of you not wanting to ask the hard questions for fear you'll scare them off? Kind of reminds me of our last chat in another thread about not wanting to talk about sex in advance...

[Cookiesandough]

Could be some ulterior meaning or could just be you have to fill your profile with something, so she just put she wants a gentleman. She also loves to laugh and have fun. Her family is important to her. She's down go earth. She loves to get dressed up, but she's not afraid to throw on a pair of dirty jeans either. ;-)Also, she loves to travel. Oh, and no hookups!!!

 

 

She's an open book, so if you have any questions: just ask ;-)

[knabe]

I realized there tend to be a lot of women at my age (40s) who feel it is the man's job to entertain them without adding value other than sex so I try to weed out ones with that mindset through profiles and pics (on private jets, spending their summers abroad, etc).

 

Your attitude is probably loud and clear to women. You are incredibly jaded, but I suspect you know that. I think the answer is to work on why you assume the worst in a gender you want to have sex with, and then go from there. Because assuming every woman wants an entertainment and meal ticket is decidedly NOT gentlemanly...or manly at all.

[Michelle ma Belle]

Once again, if you see a pattern developing, rather than point blame squarely on the women you're dating, take a closer look at what it is YOU'RE doing and then do it differently.

 

Easy peasy lemon squeezy.

[Gaeta]

You need to change the type of women you go after.

 

I am sure 100% all these women you talk about on here have 1 common denominator.

 

If you like a certain 'type' of women and mostly that 'type' of women come with a certain 'stereotype' then you have to accept it...or go after a different 'type' of woman.

[SevenCity]

Could be some ulterior meaning or could just be you have to fill your profile with something, so she just put she wants a gentleman. She also loves to laugh and have fun. Her family is important to her. She's down go earth. She loves to get dressed up, but she's not afraid to throw on a pair of dirty jeans either. ;-)Also, she loves to travel. Oh, and no hookups!!!

 

 

She's an open book, so if you have any questions: just ask ;-)

 

There described 99% of women's profiles!

[SevenCity]

Well if that is your interpretation, and I'm not saying it's wrong necessarily, then perhaps the take away from these experiences is to come right out and ask them to clarify in no uncertain terms what they mean by it.

 

I would think that dating in our 40's, if nothing else, has earned us the right to ask some pretty bold questions upfront.

 

Or is this yet another example of you not wanting to ask the hard questions for fear you'll scare them off? Kind of reminds me of our last chat in another thread about not wanting to talk about sex in advance...

 

I just bypass them so no asking required. I suppose I could match and ask but I tend to concentrate on profiles that don't have these phrases.

 

Oh and you'll never convince me to talk about sexual preferences prior to sex!

[knabe]

I just bypass them so no asking required. I suppose I could match and ask but I tend to concentrate on profiles that don't have these phrases.

 

Oh and you'll never convince me to talk about sexual preferences prior to sex!

 

If you bypass them....why do you care?

[SevenCity]

You need to change the type of women you go after.

 

I am sure 100% all these women you talk about on here have 1 common denominator.

 

If you like a certain 'type' of women and mostly that 'type' of women come with a certain 'stereotype' then you have to accept it...or go after a different 'type' of woman.

 

I've actually dated many different types of women from those with little money to lots. Those with stellar looks to average. Those with jobs vs careers. Various ethnic backgrounds.

 

I'm sure you're picturing me going after makeup clad, breasts heaving out, high maintenance looking women and I can assure you nothing is further from the truth as I avoid those like the plague.

 

I've been out with some women who felt complelled to contribute but it didn't work out for other reasons. I've been out with others who turned into self serving leaches.

 

I'd rather focus on the former so trying to get the "lingo" down.

 

The responses from women are appreciated but tend to be from your point of view (i.e. What you would mean). The responses from men are hopefully based in their experiences.

[SevenCity]

If you bypass them....why do you care?

 

1) Curiosity. Just like I was curious what "420 friendly" meant.

2) I was confirming if they should be bypassed or if I was misunderstanding.