"Looking for a professional"

[GunslingerRoland]

I was just going to type this so you saved me time. Thank you.

 

I agree that education has value outside of the way it can be monetized. So yes, I do think trade schools and career-oriented schools are good for some people, and they can teach valuable skills that can support a good living, but other folks value a well-rounded education, including knowledge and appreciation of history, art, literature, politics, science, etc. And yes you CAN obtain knowledge outside of a college setting, but I don't think there's any substitute for spending your young adult years with other young adults all learning and growing together. It shapes you as a person.

 

(and yes, you should avoid going into debt to do it)

 

 

But if you go to university to take a "professional career" like engineering, science or management, you are going to be doing classes in those fields. You will not be taking classes on history, art, literature or politics any more than the mechanic at the community college down the road will. It seems like a really weak argument for wanting to date someone with a degree.

 

 

I mean, I have a degree in my field, but none of the stuff I learned in university would ever come up as a topic of conversation on a date with someone...

[MidwestUSA]

But if you go to university to take a "professional career" like engineering, science or management, you are going to be doing classes in those fields. You will not be taking classes on history, art, literature or politics any more than the mechanic at the community college down the road will. It seems like a really weak argument for wanting to date someone with a degree.

 

 

I mean, I have a degree in my field, but none of the stuff I learned in university would ever come up as a topic of conversation on a date with someone...

 

I have a BS in Chemistry. I took Art history, American history, Russian history, Crime and Punishment, Asian Philosphy, Astronomy, Sociology, Psychology, and I don't recall what else. Oh, those three semesters of French! Oui Oui! Ack, Computer programming (Fortran, LOL! Punch cards! Hanging chad!). Only 44 of 162 hours were chemistry.

 

So yea, we gotta fill up with electives. And those were the books I saved, not the chemistry, calculus, diffEQ, physics, statics and dynamics books. They were good for starting bonfires.

[xxoo]

But if you go to university to take a "professional career" like engineering, science or management, you are going to be doing classes in those fields. You will not be taking classes on history, art, literature or politics any more than the mechanic at the community college down the road will. It seems like a really weak argument for wanting to date someone with a degree..

 

Of course they take those classes. It's called the Core Curriculum at many universities, and is what students take in freshman and sophomore year.

[RecentChange]

But if you go to university to take a "professional career" like engineering, science or management, you are going to be doing classes in those fields. You will not be taking classes on history, art, literature or politics any more than the mechanic at the community college down the road will. It seems like a really weak argument for wanting to date someone with a degree.

 

I mean, I have a degree in my field, but none of the stuff I learned in university would ever come up as a topic of conversation on a date with someone...

 

Since when? While they may not take an excess of classes in those fields, in the US at least, even those pursuing the hard sciences need to take 'gen ed" classes which include history, art history etc.

 

I took a honors course on the Holocaust to satisfy my history requirement, and Mexican Art History for my art requirement (would you like to discuss the city buried under Mexico City, or the curious origins of the Olmec?). I am pretty sure those sort of classes are not required when getting an IT cert, or a mechanic's certification at a JC.

 

Meanwhile I have a degree in Sociology, and topics covered in the various classes I took while earning my degree (even the gen ed requirements and electives) come up in conversation quite often!

 

I have an interest in geology, and took a number of geology classes as electives - I enjoy pointing out the natural features and discussing their formation when out and about, or perhaps the various faults we have in CA, and their capacities to produce a "big one".

 

I discuss the merits of "surveys" and polls (especially those reported by the news), using what I learned in my social statistics classes.

 

The Death and Dying course was amazing, and I often share valuable insights I acquired while taking that course.

 

I could go on and on. Even though I graduated many years ago, spending that many hours in classes, learning, discussing, immersing one's self in education adds a depth that is hard to replicate otherwise.

 

And as far as this:

 

Save

Edited July 16, 2016 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[GunslingerRoland]

It depends on the program, some have very few elective courses. And for many/most in those types of degree programs they fill them with things that are more relevant to their career.

 

 

I would definitely not make the assumption that someone with a STEM degree took a single history or art class in their program.

 

 

I took some interesting electives, for purely personal interest, but again that was because of my personal interest in the subjects. I could have also become a mechanic and taken similar classes in my spare time.

[RecentChange]

It depends on the program, some have very few elective courses. And for many/most in those types of degree programs they fill them with things that are more relevant to their career.

 

I would definitely not make the assumption that someone with a STEM degree took a single history or art class in their program.

 

Again, in the US - they are required. Here - University of California Berkeley.

 

Degree requirements | Berkeley Engineering

 

If you want a degree in engineering you have to take American History, a course in American Cultures, six courses in the Humanities and Social Sciences.

[jen1447]

There seems to be a lot of secret butthurt here over use of terms ....based on what's been said, "professional" in the profile context is simply insider-speak for "I want someone like me career- and income-wise." If you've got an ax to grind over that sort of thing and you're on the outside looking in, ok, you'll be offended like any outsider, but the insiders who use the terms aren't actually trying to push you out of the 'fun clique,' they're just using secret passwords to parse the field. That doesn't offend me.

[anna121]

There seems to be a lot of secret butthurt here over use of terms ....based on what's been said, "professional" in the profile context is simply insider-speak for "I want someone like me career- and income-wise." If you've got an ax to grind over that sort of thing and you're on the outside looking in, ok, you'll be offended like any outsider, but the insiders who use the terms aren't actually trying to push you out of the 'fun clique,' they're just using secret passwords to parse the field. That doesn't offend me.

 

A-frigging-men.

 

Many of these absurdly touchy posts are, very effectively, illustrating the point.

[GemmaUK]

I've never 'looked for a professional'.

However, having had relationships with 'white collar' men and also 'blue collar' then I have found that values, life goals etc are more similar with men of a similar level to me - which is white collar.

I hate those terms but it's an easier way to explain.

[GunslingerRoland]

Again, in the US - they are required. Here - University of California Berkeley.

 

Degree requirements | Berkeley Engineering

 

If you want a degree in engineering you have to take American History, a course in American Cultures, six courses in the Humanities and Social Sciences.

 

It varies from school to school, but it's definitely not like that for most of Canadian schools.

 

 

I will say, that it is SO American that you have to take American history and American cultures classes as mandatory, lol.

 

 

Anyway this is off topic, I guess the bottom line is if you want to date a Canadian that you know has taken a well rounded set of classes you'll have to ask them specifically you can't assume it since they have a degree.

[amaysngrace]

I think it means hitman.

[GorillaTheater]

I think it means hitman.

 

 

Lawyers may still qualify, along with a few doctors I've run across.

[Els]

Interesting how this turned into a degree vs no degree thing. As far as I've seen, the traditional 'professions' listed here (law, medicine, engineering etc) don't make up the majority of degree holders, not by a long shot. I also find it really funny that STEM keeps on being mentioned as the criteria, but people just seem to have an issue with software engineers being part of that little 'clique', despite the fact that they are lumped into the 'engineering' faculty in many schools, and the "T" in STEM actually stands for 'technology'.

 

Besides, if college is the defining factor, is someone with a college degree a 'professional' if he/she works in Starbucks?

 

My conclusion is that the term just means different things to different people. If I absolutely had to put a meaning to it, I would assume it meant careers that require registration with a professional body to be maintained in order to practice (so off the top of my head, doctors, nurses, lawyers, architects, accountants). Because otherwise I can't see any clear distinctions.

[gaius]

Reminds me of Man on Fire.

 

[MidwestUSA]

Wow, I really dated myself with that Fortran punch card thing.

 

Yikes.

[Lois_Griffin]

No kidding! It's often one of many qualifications on their list. It has entitlement written all over it.

 

We all have criteria, of course, but when a woman has a LOT of criteria and lays it all out with a certain attitude, it sounds like she's saying, "I am better than everyone else. I can have anyone I choose." So, if you meet ALL of these qualifications maybe I'll respond and maybe I won't, but if you don't I'll be pissed that you have the audacity to think you're in my league.

 

Why would a person like that humiliate herself by advertising the goods on a dating site? She must not be having much success at White House galas and state dinners, eh?

 

What man in his right mind would be attracted to that?

Maybe you're unaware of the fact that there are more women graduating college then there are men.

 

There's nothing wrong with a woman not wanting to be the primary breadwinner AND be expected to have the children and raise them on top of doing everything else. She might as well be single.

[MissBee]

There seems to be a lot of secret butthurt here over use of terms ....based on what's been said, "professional" in the profile context is simply insider-speak for "I want someone like me career- and income-wise." If you've got an ax to grind over that sort of thing and you're on the outside looking in, ok, you'll be offended like any outsider, but the insiders who use the terms aren't actually trying to push you out of the 'fun clique,' they're just using secret passwords to parse the field. That doesn't offend me.

 

Pretty much.

 

That was like my dog whistle comment earlier. And it works.

 

I assume the only way this bothers you is if you feel excluded. But why should it? Dating is all about excluding until you find what works. Getting in all kinds of debates and arguments still boils down: you likely do not fit this category, therefore you want to argue the validity of the category and other related decisions, to what, persuade us that this is a bad requirement or preference? For what?

 

If you don't like it, if you're online esp, you ignore and move on to something you do like. But folks shouldn't and will not change their preferences to fit people they want to purposely exclude lol, that's the point. If the argument is blah blah blah boo hoo but what if I'm great and they are missing out on love...I'm sure that's not the case...and if an exception is to be made, I'm sure they will make it if and when it feels right for them, not for someone else who is upset about their preferences.

Edited July 16, 2016 by MissBee

[Shining One]

There seems to be a lot of secret butthurt here over use of terms ....based on what's been said, "professional" in the profile context is simply insider-speak for "I want someone like me career- and income-wise." If you've got an ax to grind over that sort of thing and you're on the outside looking in, ok, you'll be offended like any outsider, but the insiders who use the terms aren't actually trying to push you out of the 'fun clique,' they're just using secret passwords to parse the field. That doesn't offend me.

I see nothing wrong with wanting someone "like me career and income-wise". However, how can you tell what that is when you don't say what you do and what you make? Professional looking for a professional is very vague. See the teacher/lawyer example I provided earlier. On the other hand, Graduate Degree individual making $200K looking for Graduate Degree individual making $200K is very precise.

 

Personally, when I look at a dating profile, I look through the "what she's looking for" section first. If I don't match up with those, I close her profile and move on to the next one. I've personally not seen a woman with the "professional looking for a professional" profile. Most of them list what they do from the options provided on Match and select the professions they are interested in dating. Many list their income and some list the desired incomes of their dates.

[BlueIris]

For many people, it doesn’t have anything to do with income.

[Els]

Many list their income and some list the desired incomes of their dates.

 

What, really??? That just sounds so.... crass. The more I read about OLD, the more I think it entirely dispenses with the intrigue and getting-to-know-each other parts of dating, which IMO are such a big part of it. Kinda like buying over a Japanese grill that serves wagyu filet mignon and turning it into a fast food chain selling instant burgers.

[JustGettingBy]

What, really??? That just sounds so.... crass. The more I read about OLD, the more I think it entirely dispenses with the intrigue and getting-to-know-each other parts of dating, which IMO are such a big part of it. Kinda like buying over a Japanese grill that serves wagyu filet mignon and turning it into a fast food chain selling instant burgers.

 

Don't worry, most of what people list on those are lies to get by people's filters anyway, so it not crass its total BS.

 

Wait...that's even worse, isn't it?

[Gr8fuln2020]

Another reasonable explanation for indicating one's income is to weed out potential suitors. Really. People have a personal right to decide with whom they wish to have a relationship with. Some people are used to a life style that they are not willing to compromise or dispense with. Another reasonable explanation is that that person is not willing to be in a relationship with someone who is potentially interested in slacking financially. Some people have experienced the partner that simply did not do his/her part financially. No way one would want to revisit that type of partnership....also, in an indirect way, it also sheds some light to the level of education. Frankly, there are a few legitimate reasons for indicating income. Of course, there are those who do so for selfish reasons.

[Els]

Maybe you're unaware of the fact that there are more women graduating college then there are men.

 

There's nothing wrong with a woman not wanting to be the primary breadwinner AND be expected to have the children and raise them on top of doing everything else. She might as well be single.

 

I don't know if this is necessarily true. One of our friends, a female doctor, is with a customer service guy. He comes home at 4 and handles most of the housework, cooks dinner for her. When she needed to move for her job, he quit his job to move with her. Because he handles most of the stuff at home, she is able to work in her specialty while having children, which many of her peers are unable to. I think she's pretty happy with this arrangement.

 

Of course, I'm sure there are deadbeat dads who literally do nothing, both in the house and outside of it. But I wouldn't necessarily say a man who isn't the breadwinner is automatically useless.

[jen1447]

I see nothing wrong with wanting someone "like me career and income-wise". However, how can you tell what that is when you don't say what you do and what you make?

 

That's presumably handled by the secret passwords part - eg someone who is a "professional" knows what it means to use that word. As explained/defined by Elaine and RC etc.

[Els]

That's presumably handled by the secret passwords part - eg someone who is a "professional" knows what it means to use that word. As explained/defined by Elaine and RC etc.

 

Would be funny if two people said the same thing, met up, one of them turned out to be an art history PhD and the other a software developer, and both of them disagreed with the other person's definition though...