Overwhelmed - MM has ended our affair

[Pili-Pala]

I feel for you. My XMM was not my direct boss but he was more senior to me and we worked very closely together. I would also say I admired him and he was a very good friend. But towards the end of the A I started to see more of his "true colors" at work - a tendency to lie etc. before then I was pretty much blinded to his faults! I also love my job and didn't want to leave. In the end he was the one that left.

 

All I can say is that it is going to be extremely TOUGH on you working that closely with him. In fact it will be torture. You will go to work each day telling yourself you can do this and you can be strong. But then you will see him or hear his voice and your resolve will waver. He'll send you an email asking how you are and it will be near on impossible not to get sucked back in. It will continue to be an emotional up and down rollercoaster and he will continue to go home to his wife at the end of each day.

 

I know you don't want to leave your job and I completely understand. I was the same. I didn't want my xMM to leave work either. I was fully in a bargaining stage with myself towards the end thinking I still want to be able to see him at work and have him in my life in some capacity even if we can't be together. I have come to the realisation recently that having him out of my life fully, with no constant triggers is the ONLY way forwards. Away from the hurt, the pain and the guilt. It's still a work in progress for me and I have a LONG way to go. But things will never be the same for you again at work now that this has happened. You will always be longing or wanting something different. And your MM will continue to give you the odd high but will continue to disappoint and frustrate you. I wish you all the best and hope LS can be of some help to you!

 

 

Thanks Grey Cloud - it's funny how hearing about someone in a similar situation can be so comforting yet make you feel so stupid/naive at the same time. We all think we are so special/unique At least at first I am guessing. I think in an odd way what I find useful reading through all the posts on this forum is the realisation that we really weren't special and unique at all - in many ways its all common as muck! As awful as that is to accept - and I don't think I am quite there yet. I still feel deep down a bit of me thinks "ahh but we *were* a bit unique".... I need to get to get on top of that! At least I am rolling my own eyes to my own comment there, that has to be some progress...

[Pili-Pala]

I'm sorry to hear you are going through this. You aren't alone. I too am the other woman and my MW (yes fell in love with my same sex best friend!) ended it. I'm a mess. It's been ended for months, but the problem is we keep flirting and kind of get back then end it again. Well, it's been pretty much done for a while now. It's so hard. I will have to say this week does feel a little easier then last. I guess keep distractions at the forefront. Try to find some of the things you don't like about MM and dwell on those so that you don't just think about the good things. It will get better. Just know you aren't alone.

 

I actually wrote a list of hates about a year ago. I found it out last night and found it pretty powerful. But after I finished reading it (its surprisingly long and petty) I thought to myself "ah but he was so cute with it all though wasn't he.."

 

... Guess i got to keep on reading it! Maybe every night before bed

[Lovetoohard]

Thanks Grey Cloud - it's funny how hearing about someone in a similar situation can be so comforting yet make you feel so stupid/naive at the same time. We all think we are so special/unique At least at first I am guessing. I think in an odd way what I find useful reading through all the posts on this forum is the realisation that we really weren't special and unique at all - in many ways its all common as muck! As awful as that is to accept - and I don't think I am quite there yet. I still feel deep down a bit of me thinks "ahh but we *were* a bit unique".... I need to get to get on top of that! At least I am rolling my own eyes to my own comment there, that has to be some progress...

 

Nope, definitely not special and unique. While the facts may be slightly different, most stories follow the same trends and get to the same final conclusion.

 

Like you, my career is my life. I may not be sure of much, but my career is my source of confidence and something that I am incredibly proud of. I almost ruined it be dating my married colleague. We worked very closely together and his office was a mere 3 doors down from mine. He adored me and was my biggest cheerleader and I was the same for him. We learned so much from each other and worked incredibly well together. As much as we tried to keep our work life and personal life separate, they were too intertwined and when I walked away from the A, it was hell. I felt terribly guilty because there were people in the office that commented on how he was suddenly so withdrawn and visibly miserable, as opposed to his usual, jokey and outgoing self. I couldn't keep it together for long either and was so incredibly distracted and gutted. It was impossible to maintain a purely professional conversation. The wound stayed open and continued festering every single day. I eventually had to avoid projects with him, group lunches, conferences, etc. I started walking the long way so I wouldn't walk past his office. I would have so much anxiety even going to the coffee room or printer because i'd bump into him there often. The sound of his voice would make me want to cry. It was incredibly isolating. He seemed to get it together, at least outwardly, after a few weeks, but I could't seem to catch up. There were times I would try to salvage the friendship aspect of things by talking to him under the pretext of work-related stuff, but almost always, some painful reference to our relationship would come up. We would never have the same work relationship we did before. To make matters worse, I made the mistake of confiding in a work friend (that's how messed up I was) who turned out to be a snake and before I knew it, a lot of people in the office knew. It was mortifying.

 

We no longer work together, and I can tell you that I truly didn't start the healing process until then. I didn't leave of my own volition and like you, couldn't really lateral into an equally awesome position...I was laid off, which turned out to be a blessing in disguise. I'm well on my way to healing and even have LC with my xMM calling occasionally (he's the one that's initiated contact each time) but I have no desire to fall back into that mess and am now strong enough to not let the calls phase me. The time and distance from him has given me a chance to re-establish my boundaries, let my emotions stabilize and see the reality of our relationship. Thankfully, my career is back on track, but it was a hard lesson learned.

 

It's not going to be an easy road ahead of you. I consider myself to be a pretty strong and confident woman and this episode really brought me down to my knees. Keep your conversations purely professional and brief and avoid any social scenarios, even if it's within the work context. You will have to try your hardest to not succumb to your emotional state and reach out to him. This is your career, your life. Nothing is worth ruining something you've worked so hard for, especially an affair.

Edited March 5, 2016 by Lovetoohard

[Grey Cloud]

Nope, definitely not special and unique. While the facts may be slightly different, most stories follow the same trends and get to the same final conclusion.

 

Like you, my career is my life. I may not be sure of much, but my career is my source of confidence and something that I am incredibly proud of. I almost ruined it be dating my married colleague. We worked very closely together and his office was a mere 3 doors down from mine. He adored me and was my biggest cheerleader and I was the same for him. We learned so much from each other and worked incredibly well together. As much as we tried to keep our work life and personal life separate, they were too intertwined and when I walked away from the A, it was hell. I felt terribly guilty because there were people in the office that commented on how he was suddenly so withdrawn and visibly miserable, as opposed to his usual, jokey and outgoing self. I couldn't keep it together for long either and was so incredibly distracted and gutted. It was impossible to maintain a purely professional conversation. The wound stayed open and continued festering every single day. I eventually had to avoid projects with him, group lunches, conferences, etc. I started walking the long way so I wouldn't walk past his office. I would have so much anxiety even going to the coffee room or printer because i'd bump into him there often. The sound of his voice would make me want to cry. It was incredibly isolating. He seemed to get it together, at least outwardly, after a few weeks, but I could't seem to catch up. There were times I would try to salvage the friendship aspect of things by talking to him under the pretext of work-related stuff, but almost always, some painful reference to our relationship would come up. We would never have the same work relationship we did before. To make matters worse, I made the mistake of confiding in a work friend (that's how messed up I was) who turned out to be a snake and before I knew it, a lot of people in the office knew. It was mortifying.

 

We no longer work together, and I can tell you that I truly didn't start the healing process until then. I didn't leave of my own volition and like you, couldn't really lateral into an equally awesome position...I was laid off, which turned out to be a blessing in disguise. I'm well on my way to healing and even have LC with my xMM calling occasionally (he's the one that's initiated contact each time) and I have no desire to fall back into that mess. The time and distance from him has given me a chance to re-establish my boundaries, let my emotions stabilize and see the reality of our relationship. Thankfully, my career is back on track, but it was a hard lesson learned.

 

It's not going to be an easy road ahead of you. I consider myself to be a pretty strong and confident woman and this episode really brought me down to my knees. Keep your conversations purely professional and brief and avoid any social scenarios, even if it's within the work context. You will have to try your hardest to not succumb to your emotional state and reach out to him. This is your career, your life. Nothing is worth ruining something you've worked so hard for, especially an affair.

 

Wow Lovetoohard, again so many similarities!! I like how you said our stories are all different but follow the same trends and same final conclusion.

 

It's also hard keeping it together at work when you are distracted and in an emotional state. In the height of my A I was so consumed by my co-worker who I was sending messages back and forth to every few minutes, that in my distracted state I emailed a highly confidential business document to the wrong person! And then the very last day xMM was in the office I was sitting at my desk and big fat tears were rolling down my cheeks. I couldn't control or stop them and I have always been the strong, professional, confident person at work. When others came to talk to me I said I was coming down with a terrible cold and they were like "your eyes are all puffy" etc. it was mortifying!

 

Pilli -I agree that healing cannot really begin until you are separate from each other's lives. Until then, try and follow all the good advice you are getting from people who have been in your shoes.

[whatatangledweb]

I have to ask..if his wife outs the affair to your company, will this effect your job ? Especially with him being your boss? I hope it does not happen but many wives have done it.

[13Hearts]

I understand why you are all telling me I should leave my job. Believe me I do. Heck if I was a friend advising myself I would be saying the exact same thing. But it's really not as simple as that. I work for a market leader. I am top of my game. I am headhunted on a weekly basis and no one can offer me anything near as good as I have. As pathetic as this may sound to some people, all I have is my career. Maybe that is why I am not married and don't have a family.. but I love my job. I really do love it. Why should I give that up? Why should I let him have everything and leave myself with nothing? I won't do that, no way.

 

Also, I know it might sound like I am making excuses (and I know this sounds bad, and I can hear the comments already) but he is genuinely the best boss I have ever had. I completely admire him as a colleague - perhaps this is even how I found myself in this situation in the first place. I really want there to be a way I can get through this and still have my job. If he leaves, he leaves - that is not in my control and I will accept that, but why does it have to be that I have to go? I had a fling with a colleague in the past (not married) which fizzled out (more his side then mine) and we work together now brilliantly. There has to be way I can make this work - especially as I am normally such a strong and adaptable person.

 

I appreciate the comment that I have to stop all contact on a personal level and keep it all on a professional level. I can see that I have to do this. But it is so so hard. I was having such an awful day at work today - everything that could go wrong was going wrong. Normally I would turn to him and it was so hard not to be able to do that. I did cave. I admit it. It was just one cutting comment in an email amongst work related stuff, that I immediately regretted....

 

What I want to know is how can I stop myself from doing that? How can I stop myself from telling him how hurt I am, how badly I think of the way he treated me?

 

I know there is nothing to be gained from it. I know it won't change anything. I know I should have some pride and not let him see how hurt I am but it is so so hard. I honestly think if he had just told me, after he'd moved back into the family home after that one night in a hotel, if he had just told me then he couldn't leave I would have accepted it. I never asked him to leave, I never expected it. I would have held my hands up and thought I knew what I was getting myself into and this is how it goes. But to have spent the last two weeks telling me he was going to leave, finding a flat, putting everything in motion and then not to go through with it - that is unforgivable behaviour. That is just cruel. How do you just accept that someone has treated you like that and that's what it was and move one?

 

I also know that I can't get involved again - I completely agree with that comment! If he comes back to me then I have to be resolute that unless he can show me he has left his wife that there is no "us". But that is going to be tough! I think I need to prepare for it as many of you seem so certain it will happen - and perhaps, as I have said, I have been there before - so how can I make sure I stand by this and not cave?

 

 

I don't understand the comment about "he has kids, move on". I don't accept the fact that kids are a reason to live in misery. I don't have children and so perhaps that is why I will never understand that. But I come from an extended family of "broken" marriages and all the children are happy and successful and have good relationships with both their biological parents. I think its about how you handle the break up of that family - its about love and effort and patience. It can be done.

 

This is also what I find so hard - that he has made this decision that I believe is wrong. He meant a lot to me. We were friends. It's so hard to stand by and watch a friend choose a path that is not right. Even as I type that I think to myself, "but who am I to say what is the right path? I am not in their mind and heart. I can't possibly know what the right path is, only they can"... ok. That is true. But I know he wants to leave. I know he doesn't want to stay in this marriage, he just doesn't have the guts to take that leap of faith. To put that effort in. I agree that it is about him not wanting to reveal himself as the selfish man he is - he would rather keep up the face of a "happy family man" whilst knowing in himself it is all a sham and be miserable. Be a martyr. That is hard to stand on the sidelines and accept. Ok, I can't be responsible for someone else's happiness - no, I can't. I know that. But knowing that doesn't make it easy. It's frustrating. It's infuriating. It's above all desperately sad.

 

 

I am rambling now. But thank you for all your comments and support. I still feel such a mix of emotions - I seem to be running through the full spectrum in ten minute cycles: pain, sadness, anger, hope, relief, confusion, regret, optimism, desperation, longing, loss.... but truly thank you for being there and for all your words. Even if at the moment, in my current mindset, I can't see the wood for the trees.

 

You don't have to leave your job. What you have to do to stay where you are and still maintain your sanity is grow. Recognize and acknowledge your self. What I mean is, figure out why you had an affair with a married man with children. For me, it was weak boundaries and no life outside of work. And the fact that XMM pursued me, hard, and fell in love with me. It is very difficult to turn your back on someone in love with you. Be willing to let go of basking in his infatuation with you.

 

Acknowledge the dynamic between you. But learn to respect its power and guard yourself against falling prey to it again. Harness the you that you became when you were with him and realize that that was all you; it had nothing to do with him. He was just the conduit for you to see that part of you. Allow yourself to be that person with others. Recognize where or how the intense feelings gave you the illusion of power, and then release that; release ever believing you had control.

 

Discover, acknowledge, and become clear about what you want in and for your life. Write those things down. Build a dream board to make it more concrete in your mind. Focus on those things as your goals. Every morning when you wake up, think about those goals and ask yourself whether or not he fits into the equation that will get you to your goals. Don't focus on HIS possibilities; focus on YOURS. Don't redefine your equation or your goals around his limitations; instead, require him and everyone else you meet, to fit into YOUR plan for how you want your life to work. Evaluate everyone this way. Keep only those people who can contribute to or fit in your plan.

 

I think that very quickly you will see just how "compatible" MM and you actually are.

 

Why are you hurt? You don't need him to do anything to feel at peace, in balance, worthy, or going places. Are you operating out of an old male-female relationship model? Are you playing weak damsel waiting to be chosen by a strong man who is desired by all? That's a very old fashioned, out-dated way of thinking. Hell, YOU are the one who is the catch here, not him. Don't think in old ways. You don't need him to feel better; you need your GFs.

 

He hasn't treated you in any way to be upset about. He is dealing with his life, his decisions, his responsibilities, his family, his children. Those things are independent of you. You do NOT fit into his equation. You need to understand and accept this. You are an interloper into his marriage and family. Is that the plan you had for yourself and your life? HIS decisions have NOTHING to do with you and therefore should not be hurting you. It's silly for you to place the blame on him for your feelings. Accept control of your own feelings and gain control of them by changing the way you think.

 

This isn't complicated. Don't continue to complicate it with immature and out-dated ways of thinking. I believe that EVERYONE that comes into your life carries with them a lesson. What is the lesson he was meant to bring you? Can you be still enough, quiet enough, curious enough, and brave enough to see yourself for who you are, acknowledge what on earth you have been doing, and recognize how you need to grow?

[13Hearts]

Wow Lovetoohard, again so many similarities!! I like how you said our stories are all different but follow the same trends and same final conclusion.

 

It's also hard keeping it together at work when you are distracted and in an emotional state. In the height of my A I was so consumed by my co-worker who I was sending messages back and forth to every few minutes, that in my distracted state I emailed a highly confidential business document to the wrong person! And then the very last day xMM was in the office I was sitting at my desk and big fat tears were rolling down my cheeks. I couldn't control or stop them and I have always been the strong, professional, confident person at work. When others came to talk to me I said I was coming down with a terrible cold and they were like "your eyes are all puffy" etc. it was mortifying!

 

Pilli -I agree that healing cannot really begin until you are separate from each other's lives. Until then, try and follow all the good advice you are getting from people who have been in your shoes.

 

We all sound so alike. Women with careers that are their top priority who have affairs with MM. Why? Is it because we don't have time for a FT husband, so borrow someone else's a few times a week? Why don't we choose single guys to become infatuated with?

 

I wish we all lived in the same city so we could all go out and talk about our affairs

[Grey Cloud]

We all sound so alike. Women with careers that are their top priority who have affairs with MM. Why? Is it because we don't have time for a FT husband, so borrow someone else's a few times a week? Why don't we choose single guys to become infatuated with?

 

I wish we all lived in the same city so we could all go out and talk about our affairs

 

Lol, wouldn't that be fun. We could go out for a drink, talk about our affairs and if a married man came over to chat up us we would tell him to F off!!

 

Interesting point you make 13 Hearts about women with careers, the difference being with me is that I DO have a FT husband at home. I think I had lost "me" for quite a few years taking time away from my career to have babies etc. I love my kids and don't regret it for one second but I was never cut out to be a stay at home mother. I remember resenting my H for being able to maintain his life as normal and mine dramatically changed. Plus he expected us to fall into traditional patterns of him being the breadwinner and me being the housewife. When I returned back to work I felt like that aspect of myself returned - I wasn't just a wife or a mother but an independent woman who could contribute to intelligent conversations and make important decisions. Step in xMM co worker who stroked my ego in this regard - telling me I was smart, fun, confident and sexy. Meeting unmet emotional needs I wasn't getting at home. Ironically his wife is a stay at home mother. So from his point of view he got a life of domesticated bliss at home and a totally different OW at work.

 

Anyway, sorry to hijack this thread. It just resonated with me what 13hearts said in an earlier post about taking the bits of the person you liked about yourself in the A and carrying it forward in the future without the dependency on the MM to make you feel that way.

[Pili-Pala]

I have to ask..if his wife outs the affair to your company, will this effect your job ? Especially with him being your boss? I hope it does not happen but many wives have done it.

 

I think this will be ok. It did cross my mind when she emailed me - but the email she sent me makes me think she won't do anything more. I think had she known it was two years, and not just the 3months as she thinks it was, and had he left her then I might be more concerned. But as I mentioned, he had a short affair before with someone in work and she never did anything like that then and past behaviours are normally good indicators.

 

If she did though what then? Well, I think I'd be ok. It is not going to surprise anyone on here when I say I work in an industry that is literally littered with interwork relationships - not just affairs but actual marriages etc. Many of employees (including senior staff) are in affairs, relationships, marriages with their subordinates. To put it plainly they wouldn't care we had an affair - they care a bit more when one of the people are quite a few layers down in management from the other, as then this opens a big can of worms on confidentiality and disclosure as well as more concerns around sexual harassment/abuse of power. But the level he and I am would be ok, they might just rejig a reporting line which would be fairly easy and we sort of had half done ourselves already to protect ourselves on that (at my suggestion not his).

 

With regards to everyone else and my reputation etc... I think everyone has their suspicions anyway. In fact I know they do. No one has ever treated me differently with this gossip other then perhaps to come to appeal to me to try to persuade him to action things as they know we have a "special" working relationship. There is a joke in work that if you get me on board you get him on board - but then the actual joke is if you get me on board you get anyone on board, as I am quite respected in my field. Sadly people will enjoy the gossip and I might lose a bit of personal respect from a few people ... but no, I don't think it will be detrimental to me other than perhaps my pride getting a little knock.

 

You don't have to leave your job. What you have to do to stay where you are and still maintain your sanity is grow. Recognize and acknowledge your self. What I mean is, figure out why you had an affair with a married man with children. For me, it was weak boundaries and no life outside of work. And the fact that XMM pursued me, hard, and fell in love with me. It is very difficult to turn your back on someone in love with you. Be willing to let go of basking in his infatuation with you.

 

Acknowledge the dynamic between you. But learn to respect its power and guard yourself against falling prey to it again. Harness the you that you became when you were with him and realize that that was all you; it had nothing to do with him. He was just the conduit for you to see that part of you. Allow yourself to be that person with others. Recognize where or how the intense feelings gave you the illusion of power, and then release that; release ever believing you had control.

 

Discover, acknowledge, and become clear about what you want in and for your life. Write those things down. Build a dream board to make it more concrete in your mind. Focus on those things as your goals. Every morning when you wake up, think about those goals and ask yourself whether or not he fits into the equation that will get you to your goals. Don't focus on HIS possibilities; focus on YOURS. Don't redefine your equation or your goals around his limitations; instead, require him and everyone else you meet, to fit into YOUR plan for how you want your life to work. Evaluate everyone this way. Keep only those people who can contribute to or fit in your plan.

 

I think that very quickly you will see just how "compatible" MM and you actually are.

 

Why are you hurt? You don't need him to do anything to feel at peace, in balance, worthy, or going places. Are you operating out of an old male-female relationship model? Are you playing weak damsel waiting to be chosen by a strong man who is desired by all? That's a very old fashioned, out-dated way of thinking. Hell, YOU are the one who is the catch here, not him. Don't think in old ways. You don't need him to feel better; you need your GFs.

 

He hasn't treated you in any way to be upset about. He is dealing with his life, his decisions, his responsibilities, his family, his children. Those things are independent of you. You do NOT fit into his equation. You need to understand and accept this. You are an interloper into his marriage and family. Is that the plan you had for yourself and your life? HIS decisions have NOTHING to do with you and therefore should not be hurting you. It's silly for you to place the blame on him for your feelings. Accept control of your own feelings and gain control of them by changing the way you think.

 

This isn't complicated. Don't continue to complicate it with immature and out-dated ways of thinking. I believe that EVERYONE that comes into your life carries with them a lesson. What is the lesson he was meant to bring you? Can you be still enough, quiet enough, curious enough, and brave enough to see yourself for who you are, acknowledge what on earth you have been doing, and recognize how you need to grow?

 

 

Wow 13Hearts. There is a lot of good stuff in there. Thank you. I think I am going to have to come back and read through that post a few times. It reminds me a lot of what I did last year - although we only broke up for two weeks I managed to achieve quite a lot of realisation at that point (I was in counselling before, during breakup and after we got back together) and read a really great book at the time that helped. What happened then though was my mind and outlook did change, my expectation changes, my perception changed... but I still went back, only with less expectations and a different outlook!

 

The challenge this time is how do I get back on this path of realisation and discovery but absolutely not go back? From everyone's posts I am starting to think that maybe I can't stay in my job and this is distressing me even more then the affair being over! But it's true, it will be a scab. It is an eternal temptation. I do think if I applied a certain behaviour and thought process I could get back the working relationship we had - but perhaps part of me will always want more. And how will I deal when he has another affair? As he will. I have no doubt. His marriage is completely broken.

 

Why am I hurt? I am honest enough with myself to recognise a lot of the hurt is coming from a feeling of rejection. That I wasn't enough and having a self confidence knock. I am also sad because of the parts I am losing - as bad as this relationship probably was for me long term, I do feel I am losing a friend and losing a partner and yes ok, I admit it, losing the great sex too. I honestly don't feel like I will find anyone else. I know everyone says this and people roll their eyes and say of course you will - but I really don't feel that way right now. Before I was with MM I was single for nearly 8 years. I know I have issues there in itself to do with emotional unavailability (hence the A with MM!) that I need to work on... but that seems a long road right here from now...

 

But, 13Hearts, what your post reminded me is to "control the controllable". You are right, his decision is nothing to do with me. It's his stuff and this is my stuff. I should not blame him for how I feel. How I feel is to much extent my choice. This situation was due to choices I made and I can just as well make choices to get me out of it. If I choose not to leave work then that is my choice, but I guess I have to find a way to make that choice work for me, and make other choices that will make it work.

 

... maybe one day at a time though eh. If I can just get through today without constantly checking my phone, thinking he is going to call me and tell me he has left it would be a good start.

[elaine567]

I have to ask..if his wife outs the affair to your company, will this effect your job ? Especially with him being your boss? I hope it does not happen but many wives have done it.

 

She may feel it is her only way of saving her marriage, she may lose him his job too, so that may colour her decision.

I suppose it depends on her priorities or financial situation, or her mindset post-dday as to whether she would want to risk his career.

[13Hearts]

Lol, wouldn't that be fun. We could go out for a drink, talk about our affairs and if a married man came over to chat up us we would tell him to F off!!

 

Interesting point you make 13 Hearts about women with careers, the difference being with me is that I DO have a FT husband at home. I think I had lost "me" for quite a few years taking time away from my career to have babies etc. I love my kids and don't regret it for one second but I was never cut out to be a stay at home mother. I remember resenting my H for being able to maintain his life as normal and mine dramatically changed. Plus he expected us to fall into traditional patterns of him being the breadwinner and me being the housewife. When I returned back to work I felt like that aspect of myself returned - I wasn't just a wife or a mother but an independent woman who could contribute to intelligent conversations and make important decisions. Step in xMM co worker who stroked my ego in this regard - telling me I was smart, fun, confident and sexy. Meeting unmet emotional needs I wasn't getting at home. Ironically his wife is a stay at home mother. So from his point of view he got a life of domesticated bliss at home and a totally different OW at work.

 

Anyway, sorry to hijack this thread. It just resonated with me what 13hearts said in an earlier post about taking the bits of the person you liked about yourself in the A and carrying it forward in the future without the dependency on the MM to make you feel that way.

 

NO DOUBT he told you you were smart, fun, confident and sexy! Because you were! How sexy is a confident woman who contributes to something larger than herself, who is active and participating in life, making decisions that other adults are affected by!

 

My XMM also was attracted to my independence and was very complimentary. I used to think it was because he was just trying to flatter me but I see it differently now. I believe MM are attracted to independence and see women who have careers as strong and that is appealing. I think men benefit in some ways by following the traditional roles of man=provider (controlling) and woman=caregiver (subservient) but it works against them too. If everyone is always conforming to what you want or devise, when do you ever have to examine your own self? You're always "right," and so what opportunity do you have to grow? An independent woman is challenging by her very nature and people like to be challenged. Not only that, MM are just as disillusioned by traditional marriages as we are. They don't feel appreciated, they feel like they have to tow the line, and life is full of responsibilities and obligations. In an affair, you're equal; you don't owe anyone anything.

[Lovetoohard]

We all sound so alike. Women with careers that are their top priority who have affairs with MM. Why? Is it because we don't have time for a FT husband, so borrow someone else's a few times a week? Why don't we choose single guys to become infatuated with?

 

I wish we all lived in the same city so we could all go out and talk about our affairs

 

I thought a lot about this. I'm single and I had a blah dating life and hadn't met anyone that matched my ambition, energy, and complemented my personality. I'm also at the age where most of my girlfriends are married and starting families and I was starting to feel really terrible about myself. Add a competitive and close-knit environment with a man who pursued me hard in spite of my initial resistance, put me on a pedestal and fell in "love" with me, and I somehow "forgot" he was married. Maybe the "forgot" part stems from weak boundaries due to a low self esteem and the deep rooted desire to feel love, affection and admiration from a partner. It wasn't about him at all, really. It made me feel desired, alive, and powerful. At least, until reality kept rearing it's ugly head and then I just collapsed into a heap of jumbled emotions. There's no way I could build a life with a man like him ever. I only saw him in a certain context, not really for the man he really is until after the fact. This is why I have said numerous times that I don't blame xMM for being selfish as the OW is equally selfish. You were both fulfilling a deep rooted void of some sort.

Edited March 5, 2016 by Lovetoohard

[privategal]

Still maintain...leave your job.

Not because you have to...but because you get one life and you need to move on.

You never will unless you part ways for good.

[13Hearts]

Wow 13Hearts. There is a lot of good stuff in there. Thank you. I think I am going to have to come back and read through that post a few times. It reminds me a lot of what I did last year - although we only broke up for two weeks I managed to achieve quite a lot of realisation at that point (I was in counselling before, during breakup and after we got back together) and read a really great book at the time that helped. What happened then though was my mind and outlook did change, my expectation changes, my perception changed... but I still went back, only with less expectations and a different outlook!

 

The challenge this time is how do I get back on this path of realisation and discovery but absolutely not go back? From everyone's posts I am starting to think that maybe I can't stay in my job and this is distressing me even more then the affair being over! But it's true, it will be a scab. It is an eternal temptation. I do think if I applied a certain behaviour and thought process I could get back the working relationship we had - but perhaps part of me will always want more. And how will I deal when he has another affair? As he will. I have no doubt. His marriage is completely broken.

 

Why am I hurt? I am honest enough with myself to recognise a lot of the hurt is coming from a feeling of rejection. That I wasn't enough and having a self confidence knock. I am also sad because of the parts I am losing - as bad as this relationship probably was for me long term, I do feel I am losing a friend and losing a partner and yes ok, I admit it, losing the great sex too. I honestly don't feel like I will find anyone else. I know everyone says this and people roll their eyes and say of course you will - but I really don't feel that way right now. Before I was with MM I was single for nearly 8 years. I know I have issues there in itself to do with emotional unavailability (hence the A with MM!) that I need to work on... but that seems a long road right here from now...

 

But, 13Hearts, what your post reminded me is to "control the controllable". You are right, his decision is nothing to do with me. It's his stuff and this is my stuff. I should not blame him for how I feel. How I feel is to much extent my choice. This situation was due to choices I made and I can just as well make choices to get me out of it. If I choose not to leave work then that is my choice, but I guess I have to find a way to make that choice work for me, and make other choices that will make it work.

 

... maybe one day at a time though eh. If I can just get through today without constantly checking my phone, thinking he is going to call me and tell me he has left it would be a good start.

 

It is the separation from XMM in my mind that allows me to not be hurt. I am emotionally independent and don't attribute any of XMM's decisions to my worth or feelings about myself. It is easy in an affair w MM to feel amazing about yourself because they are so attentive and doting and complimentary. It feels great. Plus, they buy you nice things So any rejection from them automatically makes you feel like garbage. And desperate. And anxious. Your brain can't understand what has happened because you thought he was doing all those things because of YOU, because you really are that awesome! The rejecting behavior just does not fit within the dynamic that has been set up in an affair.

 

Add to that the fact that women are bombarded with images and proof that they must compete with other women to get a man, that men are valuable and women are expendable, and you got yourself believing you must compete with other women and constantly compare yourself to other women, and of course you're going to feel like garbage because you can never be anyone but you! Women constantly cut eachother down when we should be building eachother up. We begin to win not by playing the man's game but by instead of competing with other women, we compliment.

 

Anyway... that's how I see it. I never choose available men either but I'm willing to bet women who are married say their husbands are unavailable too.

[13Hearts]

I thought a lot about this. I'm single and I had a blah dating life and hadn't met anyone that matched my ambition, energy, and complemented my personality. I'm also at the age where most of my girlfriends are married and starting families and I was starting to feel really terrible about myself. Add a competitive and close-knit environment with a man who pursued me hard in spite of my initial resistance, put me on a pedestal and fell in "love" with me, and I somehow "forgot" he was married. Maybe the "forgot" part stems from weak boundaries due to a low self esteem and the deep rooted desire to feel love, affection and admiration from a partner. It wasn't about him at all, really. It made me feel desired, alive, and powerful. At least, until reality kept rearing it's ugly head and then I just collapsed into a heap of jumbled emotions. There's no way I could build a life with a man like him ever. I only saw him in a certain context, not really for the man he really is until after the fact. This is why I have said numerous times that I don't blame xMM for being selfish as the OW is equally selfish. You were both fulfilling a deep rooted void of some sort.

 

Yeah, we use eachother to feel good in a crappy world that uses us up and spits us out and in an unfulfilling life (or marriage). How can affairs be so dysfunctional when they make you feel so awesome?

[Lovetoohard]

I wasn't in a supervisor-subordinate type situation thankfully, and xMM and I were on the same level and there was nothing stating that it was against policy. It was also common for people to date and some even resulted in marriages. But people do secretly judge based on moral grounds. I agree that it's more of a secondary concern given the culture at your workplace. That said, the thing that concerns me more is the detriment to your actual focus and drive on the job. It's extremely difficult to compartmentalize your emotions and be productive and engaged in your work day when you are continuously in his presence. Not saying you can't do it, but i'm just saying that it's incredibly difficult to focus, let alone enjoy your job.

 

The path to realization? Time and space. Lots of it. I'll be honest, if xMM and I still worked together, we would've patched things up. Maybe my circumstances were different in that I'm the one that broke it off, but the temptation would still be too strong. Also, keep in mind that even though he made the decision to call it quits, his marriage will not be an overnight fix and you are too conveniently accessible when he has a weak moment and turns to you (which he will). Affairs are addictive and it's hard to quit cold turkey. I think you can only really manage that and actively resist when you've had enough time and space to stabilize your emotions.

 

I completely understand the aspects of this person that you are losing. But they are only "parts" of that person. I felt a lot of fear, panic and anxiety of having to be single again, but it's far better than being in a painful relationship where you are on the sidelines indefinitely. I'd rather be single for the rest of my life actually, but I couldn't see with that level of clarity until I stopped hurting as much as I was after the breakup. He did you a favor by breaking it off actually. Now you're free to live your life without any expectations of him.

[elaine567]

I think when a career is important, then many women miss the boat when the first, second and third tranche of available guys toddle off down the aisle.

So when they look up from their desk, that high powered guy who would have been their ideal soul mate, is already hatching chicks with Mrs Mother Hen.

 

What are left are the commitment phobic, the nerdy, the bad guys, the hurt, the players and anyone else not particularly good marriage material and especially not good for a woman who has made herself the best she can be.

 

Meanwhile, Mr Successful with the big ego or the boring marriage, needs a new toy to play with. Enter the single career woman, loads in common, interesting, cultured, alert, intelligent, she isn't talking about kids or nappies and SHE is the prize he must have.

She in turn, is impressed that such a high quality male is interested in her after all those bozos, she is flattered, she falls headlong in love, here is her Prince Charming. They will be the power couple, they can rule the world.

Only...

Mrs Mother Hen and the chicks seem to be a fixture, why doesn't she get the hint and go away, why is he pandering to her?

Surely THIS is the real thing, why does she need to get in the way?

Then finally a crisis and he is going nowhere, the penny drops...

[Dancewithme]

Wow, OP, your employer sounds like a company that is a major worldwide industry leader near my hometown. The "affair culture" was alive and well in that place. From some executives on down, at company retreats, business trips, people had affairs, flings, etc.

 

The company kept chugging on, doing well, folks were happy... Until one wife of the CEO got wind. She got in his ear about how the company could be so respected and allow its employees to be so disrespecting of families, and that he needed to clean house. So he did. It took a while. No one was out-right fired, but... Expected promotions weren't earned, raises weren't given, unfaithful executives were relocated to undesirable locations, the most blatant offenders were encouraged to " explore their career opportunities elsewhere". It became easier for some of these folks to simply work elsewhere.

 

I knew one of the offending workers well. He was a serial cheater with ladies at his location, and from other offices when he had to travel for business. He said it was easy to do, no one cared ( but his wife!). Because his behavior was essentially validated, it was easy to hide at work. He felt like he was a god, indestructible, and entitled. He never had to do the work to heal himself. Then he was demoted, de-raised, de- everything, until he had no choice to leave.

 

It took a few years, but the culture changed. And the company thrived. It was an industry leader, so all of the smart, well educated, and high performing folks flocked there, so there was no shortage of talent.

 

I guess I went off on this tangent to say this: don't let the culture of your company make it easy for you to avoid the total healing you need to do for yourself. By seeing others engaging in this behavior, the acceptance, your MM eventually having another affair, it sounds like triggers all over the place. And death from a thousand paper cuts.

 

I don't see how you can ever be free to completely mend from your affair. And if the culture ever changes, and those who are known offenders start to feel the impact in their careers, what will happen to you? Of course this is all hypothetical, but I've seen it happen.

 

I understand being at the top of your career, and not wanting to leave it. Someone would have to pry my cold dead fingers from my job before I'd leave it. I hope you are actively in IC, and can build up a system of affirmation for you that is not career -related. Keep your distance from MM best you can. But, if it becomes to much, you may have to explore other career options.

 

Best of luck to you, and next time, Don't s**t where you eat;)

Edited March 5, 2016 by Dancewithme

[Lovetoohard]

Another thing I wanted to point out too that regardless of the seemingly lax culture regarding affairs at the workplace, a man cheating is perceived very differently than a woman cheating. Even in this day and age. It's a shame that there's a double standard for the same offense, but it's the reality. If some higher up who's in the good 'ole boys club doesn't like it and your xMM doesn't exactly defend you, they could easily find ways to make you leave.

[HappyAgain2014]

I don't understand the comment about "he has kids, move on". I don't accept the fact that kids are a reason to live in misery. I don't have children and so perhaps that is why I will never understand that. But I come from an extended family of "broken" marriages and all the children are happy and successful and have good relationships with both their biological parents. I think its about how you handle the break up of that family - its about love and effort and patience. It can be done.

 

This is also what I find so hard - that he has made this decision that I believe is wrong. He meant a lot to me. We were friends. It's so hard to stand by and watch a friend choose a path that is not right. Even as I type that I think to myself, "but who am I to say what is the right path? I am not in their mind and heart. I can't possibly know what the right path is, only they can"... ok. That is true. But I know he wants to leave. I know he doesn't want to stay in this marriage, he just doesn't have the guts to take that leap of faith. To put that effort in. I agree that it is about him not wanting to reveal himself as the selfish man he is - he would rather keep up the face of a "happy family man" whilst knowing in himself it is all a sham and be miserable. Be a martyr. That is hard to stand on the sidelines and accept. Ok, I can't be responsible for someone else's happiness - no, I can't. I know that. But knowing that doesn't make it easy. It's frustrating. It's infuriating. It's above all desperately sad.

 

I don't think most MM live in misery. Their perspective is skewed by their selfishness and for some, the affair bubble. It's so easy to say the kids are better off and everyone will adjust but that's rare with affairs. It's one thing for a couple to tell their children they are divorcing because they tried so hard but just can't make it work. I've been there and it was still the worst day of my life to break the hearts of my children by telling them.

 

It's quite a different story for dad to pack up and go to his OW while mom tries to keep it together after suffering the ultimate betrayal. Children will and do hold their parents responsible for the pain their other parent endures. Part of them never recovers from seeing that and feeling put in the middle. It changes their view of security and permanently alters their lives.

 

As for your MM's decision being wrong, you can't say that. Clearly it's right for him. What's difficult to accept is that he's not a martyr. He's the polar opposite by being selfish. I doubt his thoughts are really about his children for their sake. He doesn't want to risk being alone, risk losing his relationship with his children, lose his home, money, reputation, and even his wife. All of these are things that make him who he is so they ground him. He has worked for for all of it and he won't risk it for a possible life with another woman.

 

Don't take it personally. He's simply come to his senses and faced reality.

[Southern Sun]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is also what I find so hard - that he has made this decision that I believe is wrong. He meant a lot to me. We were friends. It's so hard to stand by and watch a friend choose a path that is not right. Even as I type that I think to myself, "but who am I to say what is the right path? I am not in their mind and heart. I can't possibly know what the right path is, only they can"... ok. That is true. But I know he wants to leave. I know he doesn't want to stay in this marriage, he just doesn't have the guts to take that leap of faith. To put that effort in. I agree that it is about him not wanting to reveal himself as the selfish man he is - he would rather keep up the face of a "happy family man" whilst knowing in himself it is all a sham and be miserable. Be a martyr. That is hard to stand on the sidelines and accept. Ok, I can't be responsible for someone else's happiness - no, I can't. I know that. But knowing that doesn't make it easy. It's frustrating. It's infuriating. It's above all desperately sad.

 

There is often a very far divide between saying you WANT something and actually taking ACTION.

 

My xMM and I tried many times to end our affair while we still worked together. We were able to do it for up to maybe 3 weeks at a stretch. I was absolutely miserable...not always because I didn't want the affair over. I recognized that it needed to end. But because we no longer had the same dynamic. We had been a fantastic team, great partners, for YEARS. And we went a mucked it up by having an affair. We actually were still really good teammates during the affair, for the most part. But the emotions that took over as we were trying to end it...they are nearly impossible to stuff down for the sake of professionalism. I tried. I wanted so badly for everything to just go back they way it was 'before.' We were friends before we crossed that line. I would have done anything to turn back time. I too had worked very hard to get to the level in my career I had attained. It seemed so unfair to give up my job just so I could recover my sanity. But I really did believe deep down that I was going to have to. I refused for a long time. I wanted to keep my job and I was also quite loyal to xMM. In the end, I didn't get to make that decision. Job lost, career gone.

 

It doesn't sound like you are in as risky a situation as I was, though I don't know that for certain. But I can't evaluate your emotional risk. Only you will know whether or not it will be worth it to you. Time will tell.

[Grey Cloud]

It is the separation from XMM in my mind that allows me to not be hurt. I am emotionally independent and don't attribute any of XMM's decisions to my worth or feelings about myself. It is easy in an affair w MM to feel amazing about yourself because they are so attentive and doting and complimentary. It feels great. Plus, they buy you nice things So any rejection from them automatically makes you feel like garbage. And desperate. And anxious. Your brain can't understand what has happened because you thought he was doing all those things because of YOU, because you really are that awesome! The rejecting behavior just does not fit within the dynamic that has been set up in an affair.

 

Add to that the fact that women are bombarded with images and proof that they must compete with other women to get a man, that men are valuable and women are expendable, and you got yourself believing you must compete with other women and constantly compare yourself to other women, and of course you're going to feel like garbage because you can never be anyone but you! Women constantly cut eachother down when we should be building eachother up. We begin to win not by playing the man's game but by instead of competing with other women, we compliment.

 

Anyway... that's how I see it. I never choose available men either but I'm willing to bet women who are married say their husbands are unavailable too.

 

13 hearts - this made a lot of sense to me about the rejection and the competition aspect. Thank you!

[Pili-Pala]

I don't think most MM live in misery. Their perspective is skewed by their selfishness and for some, the affair bubble. It's so easy to say the kids are better off and everyone will adjust but that's rare with affairs. It's one thing for a couple to tell their children they are divorcing because they tried so hard but just can't make it work. I've been there and it was still the worst day of my life to break the hearts of my children by telling them.

 

It's quite a different story for dad to pack up and go to his OW while mom tries to keep it together after suffering the ultimate betrayal. Children will and do hold their parents responsible for the pain their other parent endures. Part of them never recovers from seeing that and feeling put in the middle. It changes their view of security and permanently alters their lives.

 

As for your MM's decision being wrong, you can't say that. Clearly it's right for him. What's difficult to accept is that he's not a martyr. He's the polar opposite by being selfish. I doubt his thoughts are really about his children for their sake. He doesn't want to risk being alone, risk losing his relationship with his children, lose his home, money, reputation, and even his wife. All of these are things that make him who he is so they ground him. He has worked for for all of it and he won't risk it for a possible life with another woman.

 

Don't take it personally. He's simply come to his senses and faced reality.

 

No I think you are probably right, I think misery is an extreme word. But he isn't a happy - and his marriage isn't happy. Also, I have not just gleamed this from what he has told me either (as I know many of you will think of course he said that ,they all do!) but it's actually through a lot of external 'evidence' (for want of a better word) I had around his relationship with his wife and family. But I am not dwelling on that and not talking about that as I know that you are right in that it is not for me to judge that and also as people have said it's nothing to do with me. I think it is important that I keep reminding myself every day that that is his stuff and this is my stuff. It's his choice and its his life.

 

The first time we broke up last year I actually advised and encouraged him to work on his marriage. After D-day I spent a lot of time talking to him about the possibility of him staying and what he needed to do this time that he didn't do last time - but he kept telling me he wanted to leave. What become harder was that after 5 weeks from D-day it became more and more apparent that his relationship really is broken and by the end I really thought - truly for the first time - that the only healthy resolution was for them to separate (with or without me!)…. or otherwise its going to be a really hard slog to make it work; a tremendous effort which neither of them seem particularly inclined to make.

 

But I can see that his marriage was never going to get better with me still in the picture. I can see now it was not appropriate for me to try to help him.

 

I totally agree it is not a good situation for a relationship to end due to an A. This is why I never asked him to leave for me. He said many times he was going to tell his W about us so that he could leave and I told him over and over I didn't want that. I didn't want him to leave (or even worse, get thrown out) on those grounds. If he wanted to leave as he wasn't happy in his relationship then fine, he should discuss that with his W and leave on those grounds. When we broke up last year it was because he had tried to leave - but his wife couldn't understand why he wanted to go. She asked if there was someone else, and he lied and said no, and so she felt they should just carry on living their separate cohabiting life for the sake of the kids. She didn't know about me so it made no sense to her he would break the status quo. So they stayed together, and he told me he was going to try to make things work at home, but neither of them actually changed or tried to make it work. So the A started back up.

 

I actually think that is why he got more lax about hiding the A. I totally believe that on a surface level he wanted to be found out - to be thrown out - but then D-day the reality set in I guess. The begging. The endless tears. The hysterical children. He realised he didn't want to be the person that caused all that. He was overcome with guilt. Perhaps he even started doubting he wanted to go. But over the 5 weeks he became more and more sure he wanted to separate. The day he ended it when I saw him he was still saying he wanted to leave and he just had to to do it. I think he did truly want to leave - but as people say it is not words its action and so I pushed him and said its not about what he wants it about what he will actually do. I reminded him he'd had a perfect opportunity the previous weekend (on a rare occasion that the kids were out without either of them) to talk to his wife about them separating and him taking up a flat - but he didn't do it. So I felt if he couldn't do it then, then he was never going to do it. So I pushed him and asked him to forget what he wants, and tell me what does he think he is actually going to do. That's when finally he said he didn't think he could go through with it and he wasn't going to leave. So I thanked him for clarifying it and i walked off.

 

I know he cannot fix his marriage with me in the sidelines. I know I can't keep hanging on forever for him to take action and leave. I know the A can't carry on now due to D-day. I guess when I say he ended it, it was really me. I ended it. He told me he wouldn't leave and so I ended it. Had she never found out would i still be in the A - probably. But now I need to make this the end of it. I am worried everyone keeps saying he will come back - I just want this to be the end.

 

I am hurting as I am grieving the loss of our relationship. I am hurting because towards the end of the 5 weeks he really made me believe he was going to leave and I had started to prepare for that eventuality and get my mind around it - and then when he said he wouldn't leave I felt rejected, and anger that he had strung me along. But I can see now though he was in turmoil; that perhaps he really didn't know what he was going to do, that perhaps he hadn't even admitted to himself he couldn't do it … and as someone said before, I can see now that I shouldn't blame him for how I feel. I can see now that I shouldn't take it personally, I need to see that him not leaving has nothing to do with me.

 

…But all this wisdom I am finding from listening, and reading, and talking through my situation, is so hard to action. I still hurt. I still miss him so so so much. Despite my best efforts, I still spent the whole day checking my phone. I desperately want to be able to fast forwarded to when I will feel better.

 

Thank you everyone for your continued support and words.

[13Hearts]

13 hearts - this made a lot of sense to me about the rejection and the competition aspect. Thank you!

 

Whew! I'm glad I make some sense!

[futurehistory]

Are u definetly sure that it's actually his wife who sent the email? Sounds a bit weird to me. Is there any chance it's been him sending an email?