Dealing with wife's affair.

[merrmeade]

Your account of what has been going on is fairly accurate.

I am not able to understand all her feelings, but the one feeling you told me about is something that had not even occurred to me. So, thanks for making me aware of that possible feeling.

The tricky part is that she is obviously not going to tell me about that feeling, even if I ask her to honestly tell me all her feelings. Its like asking a thief to reveal if they have plans to steal.

 

You are right in the fact that she may be in that bubble and the only way to break that bubble may be to start walking. If she cares enough about the relationship, she would stop me. The question is how long I should give her?

 

One way of dealing with it is how I have.... I have given her the ultimatum of 6 months. If I start to notice her behavior changing towards me in the next couple of weeks, I will know that she has either taken heed or that she is not interested in saving the relationship or she is just being comfortable and wanting the convenience of the relationship.

 

Another way is to serve her the divorce papers soon, maybe in the next couple of weeks. I was trying to find out if I can change my mind about the intent to divorce once the papers are already served? (For example if she makes a conscious choice to do what I need to see she truly cares about the relationship). If so, how long would I have to change my intent and how would I inform the court of my change in intent?

Ask the lawyer about changing your mind.

 

But I think you're missing something else fundamental here. You can't control or manipulate love out of her. This sounds like you're serving her divorce papers IN ORDER to get her to conform to your expectations? I don't think anyone meant that. Whatever she gives you under those conditions would have questionable value in my opinion. You want a mature, independent woman who WANTS to show you that she cares, not a confused, insincere submissive person that acts out of fear. Whatever she demonstrates from that kind of coercion would not be the love and mutual caring that you want. She's an independent, sentient being with her own free will. You're hoping she'll recommit her love and affection to you, but it's only meaningful if she offers it of her own free will, not because you gave her ultimatums.

 

This is not to say she doesn't owe you, but you're working ultimately for a climate of trust and respect. Intimidation won't help that. She owes you, yes, big time. But you still can't expect love on demand.

Edited December 19, 2015 by merrmeade

[lolablue17]

A mistake, sorry

Edited December 19, 2015 by lolablue17

[S2B]

Have you explored the reason why she may not be respecting you is due to you not taking charge? Not taking action?

 

The cheater here is driving this bus - she about to crash the bus yet you are the passenger sitting in the back just waiting to see if she may become a better driver when she doesn't look like she intends to change her driving skills - yet you're not getting into the drivers seat.

[farsidejunky]

She claims the relationship was the cause of her unhappiness and that I was too controlling as a husband (in reality, I think I just ran a tight ship at home, financially and in terms of controlling wants).

I have made changes to better match her expectations in the relationship.

Correspondingly, I have insisted that she now pay for half of all monthly expenses and she has agreed. For the last 15 years in the marriage, I have paid for every single expense, even though she was an earning family member for atleast half of those years. I put my foot down and told her that at the moment, she is nothing more than a room mate or stranger to me and under these circumstances (and even if under the circumstance of being an equal opportunity gender) its fair that she pay half of all expenses, going forward.

 

Let us see if she is now able to match my expectations in terms of the effort she can put in, to repair the emotional damage she has caused. I can certainly give her a chance, but she is almost at the end of the rope. In the meantime, I'm preparing for the possible outcome of divorce, as I need to understand everything I need to about the process (and the financial ding) anyway.

 

I just want to be sure that I gave her enough of a chance and be satisfied with my own efforts. I have always lived my life with no regrets and won't change that now.

 

"All things in good time", I tell myself.

 

Don't you find it ironic that she says you were controlling, yet she is literally begging you to control the reconciliation?

[farsidejunky]

I think your assessment is spot-on and 100% accurate. I will give her say upto 6 months to get her act together after which I will start divorce proceedings. At that time, she could choose to hold on to her self indulgent behavior if she wants to, but it would be clear that I cannot live with a self indulgent wife anymore. My gut feeling is that she may need 6 months to recover from her self indulgent attitude. The reality is that in the last 15 years she has been an overly submissive wife (in most ways), and really has not taken the opportunity to exercise her independent identity (not because I did not give her an opportunity, but probably because I just ran a tight ship financially, because I was in charge of paying all bills). My gut feeling (which has also been confirmed by the psychologist) is that her current behavior is probably just a reaction of the pendulum swinging in the extreme opposite direction for a while, in which she wants to feel an overly sense of self indulgence. I think the pendulum may return to its normal and resting position in some time, but it may take a few more months, perhaps 6 months.

 

I am not saying this assertion is necessarily wrong, however...

 

Where is the line when this just becomes an excuse for lousy behavior?

[farsidejunky]

ten characters.

[Naively.Sensitive]

Ask the lawyer about changing your mind.

 

But I think you're missing something else fundamental here. You can't control or manipulate love out of her. This sounds like you're serving her divorce papers IN ORDER to get her to conform to your expectations? I don't think anyone meant that. Whatever she gives you under those conditions would have questionable value in my opinion. You want a mature, independent woman who WANTS to show you that she cares, not a confused, insincere submissive person that acts out of fear. Whatever she demonstrates from that kind of coercion would not be the love and mutual caring that you want. She's an independent, sentient being with her own free will. You're hoping she'll recommit her love and affection to you, but it's only meaningful if she offers it of her own free will, not because you gave her ultimatums.

 

This is not to say she doesn't owe you, but you're working ultimately for a climate of trust and respect. Intimidation won't help that. She owes you, yes, big time. But you still can't expect love on demand.

 

That is an extremely valid point. There is a college friend of mine who has been counseling and helping both of us reconnect, and this was his exact point.

His recommendation was to just reconnect "lightly", by doing things together as a family, and learning how to change some of our habits and perceptions and in the process, become ready to address the big elephant in the room, in a couple of months. The big elephant being the affair.

I bought into his approach for the last 4 months, and we have been addressing everything else (i.e. our relationship), except the affair.

 

Her justification for not being able to support, console me and help ease my pain has been the fact that I'm sometimes angry, sometimes in a lot of pain, depression, yet am expecting her to soothe me and be my medicine. I have traits of bipolar depression, where sometimes I feel neutral to positive and sometimes feel extremely negative, hurt and in pain, in traumatic situations. My wife has often used the phrase "pushing me (her) away" when she describes how I sometimes used to react to her trying to come to me or soothe me in my extreme pain. I have cried profusely in her arms, felt disgust and also felt angry soon after or sometimes while she hugged me. She says this confused her and also caused her to be afraid of me. So, for many months, we have been stuck in this deadlock in which she is expecting me to behave in a certain way to accept anything she could offer me and I'm not able to guarantee a consistent emotional reaction because of my slight bipolar tendencies, and am expecting her to understand my emotional inconsistency and be able to show her remorse, love and care to me anyway. She is aware of my bipolar depression tendencies, because I have been in depression before, 6 years ago, when a close aunt of mine passed away. I even tried to send some articles her way to explain what bipolar disorders can do to a person, but I'm not sure if she fully understands or grasps this idea that a person can feel conflicting emotions and be torn between them at many times, under such circumstances and trauma.

 

Has some other couple been in this predicament of such a deadlock? I would be very grateful to hear from you about how you handled this predicament. Can someone atleast corroborate or confirm her justification or story and if that can be possible? If it is possible that she is afraid of my emotional reactions, how could she have had the affair to begin with? (Wouldn't this fear she is claiming of my emotional reaction stopped her in her tracks?). Or is she just cooking up a story about this fear? Why would she want to cook up a story? Just to avoid supporting me in my pain?

Why would it be such a problem for her to support me and console me in my pain if she is really not afraid of me or my emotional reactions?

 

In the first 3 months after she confessed the affair, she certainly was able to help me in the way I needed help, love and support. After 3 months, could she have just become frustrated and given up on me? Why?

 

So, it seems like I'm lingering on with extreme daily suffering, along with my bipolar mood swings, waiting for her to show true remorse, support, love and sex and she is waiting for me to not feel any anger, disgust or repulsion towards her. How do we break this deadlock?

[Naively.Sensitive]

Have you explored the reason why she may not be respecting you is due to you not taking charge? Not taking action?

 

The cheater here is driving this bus - she about to crash the bus yet you are the passenger sitting in the back just waiting to see if she may become a better driver when she doesn't look like she intends to change her driving skills - yet you're not getting into the drivers seat.

 

My way of taking action and charge initially was this:

 

1) Feeling a lot of pain, anger, disgust, some hatred and putting her on the spot to tell me every detail of what, why, how, etc. She did tell me everything in her confessions which I literally had to threaten out of her.

I even recorded her confessions (with her consent ofcourse), because I used to keep asking some questions repeatedly and we figured I could just hear a recording of her confession again if the same questions kept bothering me.

2) Also feeling compassion, and a sense of being able to get over this trauma, as well as assuring her that I could eventually forgive her if she helped me do it.

3) Demanding and sometimes even begging that she support me in any way that I needed, including spending lots of time with me, hugging me, having sex with me (I asked her how many times a week she would herself have wanted to, in a passionate relationship, even if this affair would have not happened, and she told me about 3 times a week), and making sex videos together (with her consent). Apart from this, we also used to schedule family time together, with the kids, but about 2 hours a day were spent on our needs to reconcile in any way that was needed by me.

4) Requesting her to bear with my emotional mood swings because of my bipolar emotional reactions. In my worst moments, I would give her a silent treatment and on a few occasions even left home to go to sleep in a park, returning the next morning. In my best moments, I would be positive, seek her help, and assure her that everything would eventually work out.

5) Seeking out additional help and support from selected family members and close friends, as even with her level of support, my pain and trauma was so great that her support could not keep up with my rate of recovery and I needed more support from close friends and family.

6) Going for individual counseling as well as a few sessions of joint counseling with her.

7) Reading web articles on affair recovery, together with her as well as individually.

8) Meeting for lunch during our lunch hours, from work, talking, discussing our recovery, but sometimes also overreacting during these lunch hours in which we had some fights.

 

We were packed, in terms of time, and I was doing everything that I could think of to get over and "take charge". Are there some aspects of my taking charge that obviously were bad ideas? Was I taking too much charge? I also did let her drive, as I mentioned earlier, because we each had our own lists about what was needed in terms of recovering from the affair itself as well as repairing the relationship that she felt was responsible for leading to her affair.

 

So, could it really be that she felt I did not take enough charge?

Or could she have thought that I was not able to manage my emotional pain or my bipolar mood swings (which are just a reality for me)?

[Naively.Sensitive]

I am not saying this assertion is necessarily wrong, however...

 

Where is the line when this just becomes an excuse for lousy behavior?

 

That is why I'm making it clear to her at all opportunities that I'm not able to go on living like this and need to start seeing reconciliation about her efforts to get her act right and supporting me in any way that I need support, even facing my emotional bipolar reactions under such traumatic circumstances.

 

I don't know how else to make this line clear to her, other than just serve her with the divorce papers. But even doing that (serving her with the papers), may just push the wrong buttons in terms of extracting her fear based reactions, rather than any genuine feelings and emotions within her.

[Marc878]

K then accept living in limbo land.

 

I think you know the answer here.

 

She had the affair, still has the power, what do you have?????

 

Living your life to suit her????

[io2iio]

The fact is that you are trying to change her behavior based on your needs. People don't change that quickly and you certainly cant force it on her. Even if she changes, would you still be able to accept the injustice that was done to you.

[S2B]

My way of taking action and charge initially was this:

 

1) Feeling a lot of pain, anger, disgust, some hatred and putting her on the spot to tell me every detail of what, why, how, etc. She did tell me everything in her confessions which I literally had to threaten out of her.

I even recorded her confessions (with her consent ofcourse), because I used to keep asking some questions repeatedly and we figured I could just hear a recording of her confession again if the same questions kept bothering me.

2) Also feeling compassion, and a sense of being able to get over this trauma, as well as assuring her that I could eventually forgive her if she helped me do it.

3) Demanding and sometimes even begging that she support me in any way that I needed, including spending lots of time with me, hugging me, having sex with me (I asked her how many times a week she would herself have wanted to, in a passionate relationship, even if this affair would have not happened, and she told me about 3 times a week), and making sex videos together (with her consent). Apart from this, we also used to schedule family time together, with the kids, but about 2 hours a day were spent on our needs to reconcile in any way that was needed by me.

4) Requesting her to bear with my emotional mood swings because of my bipolar emotional reactions. In my worst moments, I would give her a silent treatment and on a few occasions even left home to go to sleep in a park, returning the next morning. In my best moments, I would be positive, seek her help, and assure her that everything would eventually work out.

5) Seeking out additional help and support from selected family members and close friends, as even with her level of support, my pain and trauma was so great that her support could not keep up with my rate of recovery and I needed more support from close friends and family.

6) Going for individual counseling as well as a few sessions of joint counseling with her.

7) Reading web articles on affair recovery, together with her as well as individually.

8) Meeting for lunch during our lunch hours, from work, talking, discussing our recovery, but sometimes also overreacting during these lunch hours in which we had some fights.

 

We were packed, in terms of time, and I was doing everything that I could think of to get over and "take charge". Are there some aspects of my taking charge that obviously were bad ideas? Was I taking too much charge? I also did let her drive, as I mentioned earlier, because we each had our own lists about what was needed in terms of recovering from the affair itself as well as repairing the relationship that she felt was responsible for leading to her affair.

 

So, could it really be that she felt I did not take enough charge?

Or could she have thought that I was not able to manage my emotional pain or my bipolar mood swings (which are just a reality for me)?

 

You didn't answer the question.

 

 

You have lots of evidence of what hasn't worked.

 

What do you plan to do differently now to get a different outcome?

 

Stop staying stick in what isn't working! Try a new approach.

 

The approach that works best is severe consequences for the cheater! She has no reason to change a thing because you're so busy being hurt but still willing to make sure she is comfortable. Stop making her comfortable!

 

I bet she'd make effort if you packed her a bag and told her to leave immediately.

 

You've been her doormat - stop doing it that way.

[S2B]

That is why I'm making it clear to her at all opportunities that I'm not able to go on living like this and need to start seeing reconciliation about her efforts to get her act right and supporting me in any way that I need support, even facing my emotional bipolar reactions under such traumatic circumstances.

 

I don't know how else to make this line clear to her, other than just serve her with the divorce papers. But even doing that (serving her with the papers), may just push the wrong buttons in terms of extracting her fear based reactions, rather than any genuine feelings and emotions within her.

 

This is all talk and no action from you.

 

Do new action.

[Mr. Lucky]

That is why I'm making it clear to her at all opportunities that I'm not able to go on living like this and need to start seeing reconciliation about her efforts to get her act right and supporting me in any way that I need support, even facing my emotional bipolar reactions under such traumatic circumstances.

 

I don't know how else to make this line clear to her, other than just serve her with the divorce papers. But even doing that (serving her with the papers), may just push the wrong buttons in terms of extracting her fear based reactions, rather than any genuine feelings and emotions within her.

 

NS, what makes you think your wife wants to stay married to you?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Mr Blunt]

Originally Posted by Naively.Sensitive

What I'm really looking for is her willingness to do anything I need.... within legal, moral, and respectful limits of course. It does not give a person a feeling of being truly loved and cared for if you're bleeding and dying in pain and your wife wants to think about and pick and choose what is comfortable for her to do, instead of stepping up and doing what is needed to stop the bleeding, pain and suffering.

 

 

She said that she found it very hard to come to me if she felt disgust and anger from me.

 

 

I do see glimpses of her recognizing and taking responsibility, but those glimpses only manifest themselves in words (and talk) of telling me that she is sorry and asking for forgiveness. She must have done that maybe 5 times in 8 months. Not enough! And her actions and behaviors don't match her apology in words

 

 

I put my foot down and told her that at the moment, she is nothing more than a room mate or stranger to me and under these circumstances (and even if under the circumstance of being an equal opportunity gender) its fair that she pay half of all expenses, going forward.

 

You both are very weak and damaged and looking to each other for the total fix is just not going to work. Although you each can have some impact on building each other up, in the early stages, you need to work almost exclusively on yourself. I know that she caused you great pain and she claims that you were such that you caused her pains pre-affair. Who owes who what is not the best approach for now. You are both very weak and damaged and need to do whatever you need to do for yourself to get much stronger in many ways. Then you can be of more help to each other. I know that may not be what you want to hear but that is what worked for me.

 

 

A previous posted stated the below which I think has wisdom

 

 

 

 

You're putting way too much thought into this. For one thing you need to focus on YOURSELF and YOUR wellbeing. From what you've said you're the one suffering, while for you wife it's business as usual. Stop focusing so much on her and stop focusing on your marriage so much for the time being until you can get yourself into a healthy state of mind. I wouldn't even approach marriage counseling until it looks like she genuinely seems like she wants to work on the marriage and she's addressed whatever issues she has in individual counseling.

 

Don't make threats. Don't give ultimatums unless you are 100% positive you will carry them out if your conditions aren't met. Remember, at this point your wife has little respect for you. And women do not want to be with men who let themselves be disrespected by their wives.

 

 

 

 

 

Originally Posted by Naively.Sensitive

Should we both independently try the same or different spiritual paths for answers to recover?

Spirituality was a very important part of my recovery. My self-esteem, self-respect, security, and trust needed a real good boost in the first years after the affair. I was able to get that after years of my changing and prioritizing. Now I am not so dependent on my wife or anyone else for the majority of my self-esteem, self-respect, security and trust. I will always be somewhat depended on people for a certain position of that but if I do not get it I will not be devastated and crushed. The more that your self-sufficiency can be filled by your creator the less devastated other people can affect you.

 

I am not saying that you can be all spiritual and not need other people it is just that good spiritual health can keep you from being crushed. I remember in the first year when I ordered information on “Broken Intimacy” because I wanted to get validation that my wife had failed and damaged intimacy in such a profound way. In addition, I wanted to see if there was a damage solution and of course I was thinking that my wife had the greatest responsibility for that solution. When I got through that information I was surprised that the one question was to me. That question was “have you broken intimacy with your God?” I thought, “now wait a minute I was not the one that betrayed my spouse”. The truth was that I had not been faithful to my God and had him, at times as plan B or C or D... I come to realize that my number one obligation was to God and myself first then all the rest came later. I realized that only God will always be loyal, always love you, you can always trust Him, always have your best interest at heart, and is powerful enough to always keep His promises.

 

 

That did a lot to fulfill the hole in my heart and soul and emotions. I still needed my wife to complete the family but it was not absolutely critical for my well-being.

 

I have a good life and am close to my family despite being betrayed over 20 years ago.

[aliveagain]

Well I've been away most of the last week at our AGM in Vancouver so I haven't posted much. Firstly doing nothing is the worst thing you can do. You can't nice them back and going on a holiday with her is a very poor consequence for her infidelity. It's been over 8 months and if she feels she still needs time to herself to figure things out then you have much bigger problems, sounds like she's getting her ducks in a row.

 

How about a new approach, file for divorce and give her 6 months to prove herself worthy of a second chance? If she can't, finish what her affair started. You can't leave the future of your life to someone that makes very poor decisions. Isn't it better to know sooner then later if she is committed to the marriage, why prolong the pain? She needs to take you seriously. If you won't fight for yourself why do you expect her to do so?

[LifesontheUp]

You are right in the fact that she may be in that bubble and the only way to break that bubble may be to start walking. If she cares enough about the relationship, she would stop me. The question is how long I should give her?

 

 

NS, I did reply to you much earlier in your thread.

 

My advice again is that she isn't remorseful so pack that bag and off she goes. Why do I say that?

 

Because at this moment in time YOU should be looking after YOU.

 

Why do you want to put up with this any longer? Are you a masochist?

 

Seriously, why do you think she will ever change? She should have been there for you by now. 8 months is a long time to let you suffer.

 

Honestly, my view is still the same after all your posts, your marriage is over.

[Ladyjane14]

I honestly don't think you're going to start feeling better until you make a decision as to whether you're 'all-in' or 'all-out'. So, no... going another six months with one foot out the door isn't going to change anything.

 

I also don't think it's realistic to expect that your formerly wayward wife can somehow heal you. Like happiness, healing comes from the inside. She doesn't have a time machine. She can't go back and un**** the guy. So, which pound of flesh can she give that will satisfy her debt to you?

 

I know that sounds a bit cold, but it's not meant to be. I absolutely understand what you're going through. I get it, I do. It's a traumatic stress injury, and your brain is responding accordingly... and involuntarily at times. Try The Body Keeps Score by Bessel Van Der Kolk for more information on PTSD. And if you haven't talked with your medical doctor regarding treatment of your anxiety, think about doing that as well.

 

In the meantime, try to wrap your mind around the fact that your wife can't fix this. No amount of remorse or hand-holding will undo what happened. It happened. It can't be undone. So, if you decide to proceed, you do so knowing that you're giving up the option to punish the cheater. Period. You can't reconcile *and* punish. They're two different things with two different outcomes.

 

So, here are the options:

1. Divorce, move on, and heal.

2. Reconcile, move on, and heal.

 

Pick one. The angst and limbo continue until you do. Once you've made your decision, the pain doesn't magically go away but at least you've started forward momentum.

[m.snow]

I would suggest that you seek individual counseling. And also marriage counseling but your wife must come willingly and of her own accord.

 

I suggest that both you continue going to a counselor for sometime.

Find a good one not just a family friend to avoid biases.

 

It is important to know that you must work on yourself and only you can fix you.

Just remember you are not alone in this, It happens to good people many many a times.

 

Seek to control that anger, learn to stop if you find yourself already being verbally abusive. Again I stress the importance in seeking a professional individual counselor.

[S2B]

NS, I did reply to you much earlier in your thread.

 

My advice again is that she isn't remorseful so pack that bag and off she goes. Why do I say that?

 

Because at this moment in time YOU should be looking after YOU.

 

Why do you want to put up with this any longer? Are you a masochist?

 

Seriously, why do you think she will ever change? She should have been there for you by now. 8 months is a long time to let you suffer.

 

Honestly, my view is still the same after all your posts, your marriage is over.

 

I agree.

 

And even IF she changes her ways after she's moved out I'm not sure if consider going back with anyone who would be capable of having you suffer so much while she does nothing to mend the marriage.

 

She's cold and selfish. She's should be on her own.

 

 

We have made suggestions that you can do.

 

But the issue is that you keep thinking this is for her to do. She's not doing anything. She's made her decision. It is only up to you.

Edited December 20, 2015 by S2B

[66Charger]

Sometimes we have to learn our lessons the hard way. People will do WHAT THEY WANT to do. Anything else, is just an excuse. . This OP will not listen. He is in for a hard fall. Reality will come when his wife serves him with divorce papers.

 

I have learned the hard way that when someone shows you who they are, believe them. She wants another, let her. Life can have pain, but you must start the healing. Perhaps you shouldnt try to heal the relationship, but try to heal yourself. Experience has taught me that if you wait, you will receive nothing.

 

Good luck OP. I think your title is accurate. Naive and sensitive. Doesnt make you a bad guy, but it extends your pain and unnecessary pain kills the soul.

[Ladyjane14]

I agree.

 

And even IF she changes her ways after she's moved out I'm not sure if consider going back with anyone who would be capable of having you suffer so much while she does nothing to mend the marriage.

 

She's cold and selfish. She's should be on her own.

 

 

We have made suggestions that you can do.

 

But the issue is that you keep thinking this is for her to do. She's not doing anything. She's made her decision. It is only up to you.

 

She'll eventually do something. She'll eventually leave.

 

What cheaters fear the most regarding reconciliation is that they'll never truly be forgiven and that they'll remain in the one-down position for the rest of their lives. So, in order for the process to even have a chance, that fear has to be put to rest... and you can't do that when you're acting out with bipolar mood swings.

 

It's not fair that a person who has already been betrayed ends up doing so much of the heavy lifting, but it all depends on what you're trying to accomplish. If the OP wants out of the marriage, by all means... his wife has given him ample reason to divorce her. If he wants in though, he's going to have to realize that it takes BOTH of them to make it work. He can't just sit around waiting for her to make it right... because nothing she does will change the past.

 

See, that's where we get stuck. What we really want is for the infidelity not to have happened. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, the emotional brain is in fight, flight, or freeze mode, further complicating our decision-making process going forward and hampering our ability to discern that what we want (to change the past) is impossible.

 

 

I've noticed lately that people are really hung up around here with the idea of "remorse" and whether or not a formerly wayward spouse is groveling enough. Sorry, but that might feel like progress to some, but for a real marriage to have any chance of satisfying the needs of both partners, the footing has to eventually become equal. Nobody is going to wear the hair shirt forever, you know.

 

So... it's not fair. Cheating never is. But when one decides to reconcile after infidelity, "not fair" just goes with the territory. After all, you're dealing with a person who has already demonstrated a shocking lack of coping skills, and then asking them not only to pull their **** together but also to single-handedly repair the damaged relationship. It's not gonna happen.

[Try]

So, which pound of flesh can she give that will satisfy her debt to you?

The OP is not looking for a "pound of flesh", he has been looking for and not seeing true remorse.

 

In the meantime, try to wrap your mind around the fact that your wife can't fix this. No amount of remorse or hand-holding will undo what happened. It happened. It can't be undone. So, if you decide to proceed, you do so knowing that you're giving up the option to punish the cheater. Period. You can't reconcile *and* punish. They're two different things with two different outcomes.

 

So, here are the options:

1. Divorce, move on, and heal.

2. Reconcile, move on, and heal.

Your advice does not apply to this situation because the wife has not been fully remorseful. Although, the wife may not be able to "fix this", she needs to at least try. As Ramius said so well in an earlier post on this thread, "A remorseful WW cries, begs, and pleads for a 2nd chance. They don't pout and throw a fit because other people found out. They don't move into a separate bedroom. They don't need time to figure out what they want. They do not come up with bull**** rationalizations about why they did it. Or what it means. Or what they think needs to happen to heal the marriage. In short.....a truly remorseful WW does the exact opposite of everything your wife is doing." Without true remorse, there cannot be true reconciliation, thus your option 2 is not really an option in this particular case.

[Try]

I've noticed lately that people are really hung up around here with the idea of "remorse" and whether or not a formerly wayward spouse is groveling enough. Sorry, but that might feel like progress to some, but for a real marriage to have any chance of satisfying the needs of both partners, the footing has to eventually become equal. Nobody is going to wear the hair shirt forever, you know.

Remorse is not "groveling". Remorse is actually feeling sorry for what you have done. Although long term "the footing has to eventually become equal", there can be no long term until the cheater shows true remorse for all that they have done. Your attitude that remorse is groveling, and that is should therefore not be a requirement of reconciliation, leads to rug sweeping and false reconciliation. Edited December 20, 2015 by Try

[Ladyjane14]

The OP is not looking for a "pound of flesh", he has been looking for and not seeing true remorse.

 

Your advice does not apply to this situation because the wife has not been fully remorseful. Although, the wife may not be able to "fix this", she needs to at least try. As Ramius said so well in an earlier post on this thread, "A remorseful WW cries, begs, and pleads for a 2nd chance. They don't pout and throw a fit because other people found out. They don't move into a separate bedroom. They don't need time to figure out what they want. They do not come up with bull**** rationalizations about why they did it. Or what it means. Or what they think needs to happen to heal the marriage. In short.....a truly remorseful WW does the exact opposite of everything your wife is doing." Without true remorse, there cannot be true reconciliation, thus your option 2 is not really an option in this particular case.

 

 

Sorry, but no. In post #132, the OP tells us:

"In the first 3 months after she confessed the affair, she certainly was able to help me in the way I needed help, love and support. After 3 months, could she have just become frustrated and given up on me? Why?"

 

So, I don't agree that there's been no remorse. The wife confessed voluntarily, she's consented to having the details of her confession tape-recorded, etc.

 

The reason why a formerly wayward spouse backs off is because one simply cannot console the inconsolable, and at that point, they don't know what else to do.

 

Getting Past the Affair: A Program to Help You Cope, Heal, and Move On -- Together or Apart by Snyder and Baucom gives a pretty good explanation of why it's important for the betrayed spouse to keep a cool head. One of the OP's demands is that his wife tolerate his mood swings, even though he's told us she finds them frightening. Putting it mildly, that's not going to create a safe environment for healing to occur.

 

Like I said earlier, she's given him ample reason to divorce her if that's what he wants. If he wants to continue on in the marriage though, he's going to have to engage the process.