Art_Critic Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 love is a trick to make you reproduce with someone. you don't have to trick me into reproducing with you Otter.. Link to post Share on other sites
Author alphamale Posted February 28, 2006 Author Share Posted February 28, 2006 love is a trick to make you reproduce with someone. actually, love is just a trick Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Why is everyone so cynical? Is it wrong to believe that love doesn't have to be something ugly, something that you must manipulate from a distance? I may be young, I may be idealistic and naieve, but my first love, at least, has been something beautiful. Not perfect, no, but it has survived conflicts and grown, not lessened. Why? Not because I tried to pull strings from afar, or try to follow some predetermined rules. No. It has grown because I waited until I knew myself before I began dating, and waited for someone worthwhile, who I am not afraid to give my heart to. Someone with morals, and who cares deeply for me, and who loves to have fun and can work hard. Someone I can trust, and who would not throw my love away easily or on a whim. He, too, shares my faith that love is something rare and something to be treasured. Is it so impossible for someone to love genuinely, or to be happy? Maybe you cynics are right, and I will end up as you some day, bitter-hearted and turning love into some sort of shallow game. But it hasn't happened yet, and I don't intend to let it happen easily. I'm sure you won't unless you go through similar things. But why get so upset that other people have had their faces stomped into the dirt by people who professed to love them ? I cannot force myself to believe that drivel any more. To believe it would make me mopey and depressed all the time. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Why is everyone so cynical? Were older.. it's not being cynical at our age.. it's called being realistic Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 you don't have to trick me into reproducing with you Otter.. Aw, art. You always know what to say. "Let's reproduce." That would be an interesting line to use. Quite direct. Link to post Share on other sites
Nur Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 What I do not understand is why is it that those who *are* cynical, bitter, etc. keep plugging away at love? They don't keep plugging away at love. They turn it into something more base and shallow... they make it a set of rules to follow, or a knack, or a set of trickery and manipulation to keep someone around long enough to fill some physical needs and leave once they get sick of them. This is not love. You cynics forget... yes, many do divorce, and the statistics are disconcerting. But what about the ones who made it? My parents found each other, my mother after one bad marriage and my father after two, and what they have is like nothing neither of them knew before. I have an English teacher who has been married to his wife since Grad school, and they still talk about each other all the time and are very much in love, calling each other their "soul mates." It doesn't happen all the time, but it does happen. But never to those who start believing that love doesn't exist, or try to turn it into some sort of joke. If love doesn't exist, then what do those people have? You can't call it some sort of 50-year infatuation; those "chemical" distortions you speak of return to balance after a time. By the way, the teacher I speak of is retirement age, older than most of you, I'd bet. And he is quite "realistic." I don't think that this cynicism is a function of age, just bitterness and bad experiences, most likely brought on by the type of people reading Alpha's guide, who don't believe in love at all. But not everyone is like that. Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 They don't keep plugging away at love. They turn it into something more base and shallow... they make it a set of rules to follow, or a knack, or a set of trickery and manipulation to keep someone around long enough to fill some physical needs and leave once they get sick of them. This is not love. You cynics forget... yes, many do divorce, and the statistics are disconcerting. But what about the ones who made it? My parents found each other, my mother after one bad marriage and my father after two, and what they have is like nothing neither of them knew before. I have an English teacher who has been married to his wife since Grad school, and they still talk about each other all the time and are very much in love, calling each other their "soul mates." It doesn't happen all the time, but it does happen. But never to those who start believing that love doesn't exist, or try to turn it into some sort of joke. If love doesn't exist, then what do those people have? You can't call it some sort of 50-year infatuation; those "chemical" distortions you speak of return to balance after a time. What I fail to understand is why you're so pissed off that people have been hurt by others so severely that they can no longer make an emotional connection like that any more. SORRY that I was raped, violated, beat up, and ground into the dirt. Can you find it in your heart to forgive me?? snort. Link to post Share on other sites
Lonestar Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 woould you expect anything less from a 19 yo virgin?? What I wouldn't give to be a 19 year old naive virgin again... not that I was still a virgin at 19 in this life, but one can fantasize Link to post Share on other sites
Lonestar Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 SORRY that I was raped, violated, beat up, and ground into the dirt. Can you find it in your heart to forgive me?? snort. Otter, I forgive you. Hugs Link to post Share on other sites
Nur Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 SORRY that I was raped, violated, beat up, and ground into the dirt. Can you find it in your heart to forgive me?? You misinterpret me if you think I'm pissed off at you. I am pissed off at the type of people who did that to you -- the type of people that don't value love, or don't believe in it, and therefore don't mind hurting the people that do love them. It's like a poison. If I were to go out with guy after guy who followed Alpha's rules and tried to manipulate me, but did not feel genuinely for me, even I would most likely end up bitter and resentful, and perhaps begin to do the same to others, to stop myself from being hurt again. My point is that not all people are like that. It's wrong to believe that love doesn't exist, or to turn it into something less. It does; you must simply find someone compatible who believes the same, and who means it when he or she says they love you. Some of us do have weight behind those words. Link to post Share on other sites
lindya Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 What I do not understand is why is it that those who *are* cynical, bitter, etc. keep plugging away at love? If it's so *beep* bad then why the continual trips back to the bar? What is the point? If you're cynical of love and relationships then just be alone! Live alone, don't get involved with people on an *intimate* basis, just live your life for you and fulfill your own goals. Save all those unsuspecting innocents out there the grief from your issues and the world will be a better place. f***'s sake. Believe it or not, I have put quite a lot of effort into trying to support other people on this site and cheer them up. The moment I'm going through a downer I'm immediately given a smug little "zip it, nobody wants to hear about your issues" message. Link to post Share on other sites
SmoochieFace Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 f***'s sake. Believe it or not, I have put quite a lot of effort into trying to support other people on this site and cheer them up. The moment I'm going through a downer I'm immediately given a smug little "zip it, nobody wants to hear about your issues" message. Well, for starters, that wasn't directed at you personally but all right... My point is why do people who are so disillusioned with love and relationships keep going back for more of the same. If it isn't working then just drop out of the game. There is no mandate from anyone saying that you must participate in the *game of love*, right? What is so wrong with that? Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 What I do not understand is why is it that those who *are* cynical, bitter, etc. keep plugging away at love? If it's so *beep* bad then why the continual trips back to the bar? What is the point? If you're cynical of love and relationships then just be alone! Live alone, don't get involved with people on an *intimate* basis, just live your life for you and fulfill your own goals. Save all those unsuspecting innocents out there the grief from your issues and the world will be a better place Cuz love is worth the pain. Good or bad, whatever...Maybe not for all, but all the good experiences, the good feelings ARE worth it, even if it ends and the heart gets broken... My point is why do people who are so disillusioned with love and relationships keep going back for more of the same. If it isn't working then just drop out of the game. There is no mandate from anyone saying that you must participate in the *game of love*, right? What is so wrong with that? Because people need and desire human contact. To FEEL needed, and loved. To be desired. IT is human nature. Being hurt, wanting to be alone isn't instinct - That is learned behaviour through bad experiences and broken hearts... Link to post Share on other sites
SmoochieFace Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Cuz love is worth the pain. Good or bad, whatever...Maybe not for all, but all the good experiences, the good feelings ARE worth it, even if it ends and the heart gets broken... Because people need and desire human contact. To FEEL needed, and loved. To be desired. IT is human nature. Being hurt, wanting to be alone isn't instinct - That is learned behaviour through bad experiences and broken hearts... Need or want? There's that *N* word again... do people REALLY *need* those things? Is being in a relationship a *need* or a *want*? How about sex? Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 Need or want? There's that *N* word again... do people REALLY *need* those things? Is being in a relationship a *need* or a *want*? How about sex? There are different classifications of 'need'. What the heart wants, what the mind wants, what the body wants... Sex? Well, it depends on the person. Some don't need it after a while if they haven't had it for a long time and accept that sex isn't going to be a part of their lives. Some need it and desire it - I don't look at needing people as a negative thing. Maybe it's just how I feel about who I am. I completely admit I "NEED" my family, my friends, and most of all, my husband. It doesn't make me a wimp, nor a 'needy' person either. I 'need' them in sense because I love them all. I need my nieces, sometimes I need my mom... I need those things because it makes me feel happy. Feel wanted, feel needed...I CAN survive on my own, but I don't want to. I prefer to have people in my life, who are close to me. Link to post Share on other sites
lindya Posted February 28, 2006 Share Posted February 28, 2006 There are different classifications of 'need'. You beat me to it, WWIU http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow's_hierarchy_of_needs Something wrong with the link. Oh well - google Maslow's hierarchy of needs, Smoochie Face. Link to post Share on other sites
SmoochieFace Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 You beat me to it, WWIU http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow's_hierarchy_of_needs Something wrong with the link. Oh well - google Maslow's hierarchy of needs, Smoochie Face. Well, how interesting. Physiological and safety needs - yep, definitely true. Love/belonging - I don't think so. Sorry. Esteem - only thing that would apply for me is self-respect. That is the only kind of respect that matters. Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I love how people take someone's life work and say, "nah. that's stupid." Link to post Share on other sites
SmoochieFace Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 I love how people take someone's life work and say, "nah. that's stupid." Who said it was *stupid*? Link to post Share on other sites
lindya Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Who said it was *stupid*? Well, this did sound as if you were dismissing the theory in the manner that people tend to dismiss things they find stupid... Love/belonging - I don't think so. Sorry. Imagine running up to a blackboard that a wild-haired professor has written painstakingly worked out formulas all over, and writing CRAP! over the top of them - with a gleeful smile on your face. That's what you just did to poor old Maslow...who was only trying to figure out what it is people need. Link to post Share on other sites
SmoochieFace Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Well, this did sound as if you were dismissing the theory in the manner that people tend to dismiss things they find stupid... Wrong. If I said it was *stupid* then your point would be valid. However, I didn't say that so your point is *buzz*. Wrong. Imagine running up to a blackboard that a wild-haired professor has written painstakingly worked out formulas all over, and writing CRAP! over the top of them - with a gleeful smile on your face. That's what you just did to poor old Maslow...who was only trying to figure out what it is people need. I'd tell the wild-haired dude to get a haircut and use some Brylcreem to keep that hair under control. Thing is, lindya, those theories are just that - theories. They are not absolutes and they do not necessarily apply to everyone. Seems to me that you glossed over the fact that I AGREE with *poor Maslow* on at least two of his points. Link to post Share on other sites
Outcast Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Oh for cripes' sakes. Here we go again. Lindya, Smooch was referring to Alpha, not you. And someone with Aspie is probably not going to be on the Maslow scale. And not all of us 'must' have all the items at one Maslow level before they can move on to others. Like anything else, Maslow's scale is not an irrefutable law of science, just a very good analysis of how many humans work. Link to post Share on other sites
SmoochieFace Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 Oh for cripes' sakes. Here we go again. Lindya, Smooch was referring to Alpha, not you. And someone with Aspie is probably not going to be on the Maslow scale. And not all of us 'must' have all the items at one Maslow level before they can move on to others. Like anything else, Maslow's scale is not an irrefutable law of science, just a very good analysis of how many humans work. That's why it's a *theory* - not an absolute truth. Link to post Share on other sites
Outcast Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 We're not dealing with logic here. The illogical (but defensive) reaction when one has been hurt or disappointed is to be angry. If your EQ isn't very high, you'll be like a little kid and think everybody who remotely resembles the person who hurt you is 'bad'. And you'll devise bogus theories about how to not get close to anyone so that you will never be hurt again to which other cynics and bitter sorts will flock. They may treat you like God's gift to humanity but real, self-actualized humans who understand that relationships are a two-way street and that blame is never fully one-sided will assess their failed relationships maturely, and learn to love better and more, not worse and less. Link to post Share on other sites
ReluctantRomeo Posted March 1, 2006 Share Posted March 1, 2006 The moment I'm going through a downer I'm immediately given a smug little "zip it, nobody wants to hear about your issues" message. I wanna hear about your issues too. *Big hug* Link to post Share on other sites
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