If a man's love is based on looks, why should I get married?

[Imported]

Traits most women look for are also traits of financially successful men.

 

You can rationalize it all the different ways you want.

 

I don't blame women for wanting that, except for when things go wrong......they bail. Not all of course.

 

 

I do only go for attractive looking women. They usually think I am attractive looking as well. I don't see a problem here.

 

Now if I stay with her, there's a whole lot more reasons than how attractive she looks.

[xxoo]

Human behavior tells me the person most likely to benefit is the one most likely to file.

 

Studies show that women benefit emotionally from divorce, but suffer financially. If the marriage is bad (abuse, infidelity), the financial loss is worth it.

[xxoo]

As a dedicated gym guy, I simply cannot believe the amount of women in their 40's and 50's(some older) that train hard and look absolutely amazing!...These are women that have kids that are in their 20's and they look better than their kids!(no I am not kidding)...

 

I don't know if they have had boob jobs or some facial work, but I think most of it is just plain hard work and self pride...And I am sure their husbands appreciate the hell out of it...

 

There are so many things in this life we cant control.....this isnt one of them..

 

TFY

 

Yes, exactly this.

 

I'd rather work on looking great and keeping my husband's eyes firmly on me than worrying about aging. He clearly appreciates it.

[Eggplant]

The reason why divorce sucks for men is because:

 

1) Men tend to make more money than women (due to women taking time off to have children).

2) Children are usually awarded to women in the courts.

 

This results in alimony and child support payments, which, ultimately, allow the woman to get rich by doing nothing. In addition, if men do not pay these debts, they are put in debtors prison and are not allowed to leave the country.

 

The way to circumvent this is to marry a woman that makes more than you (and make sure that it continues this way). Also, you must always be ready for the woman to file. If she files, have your ducts in a row and hire a good lawyer. Find a reason why she is an unfit mother and get custody of the children.

 

And wa-la, now you have the kids, alimony, and child support payments coming from her.

 

Though, she will likely not be punished for not paying (since women generally receive much lighter sentences than men for the same crimes), at least YOU will not owe anything.

 

If she makes less than you because she took a hit in her career in order to be the best possible mother for your children, why wouldn't you be happy to pay alimony?

[Eggplant]

You hear this stuff all the time, and quite frankly its highly unfair and rude to characterize guys who chase attractive women with great bodies as unethical, unfaithful, weak and superficial...For some men, its very important...There is no proof they'd be less faithful or more superficial, as a matter of fact, the guys I know with attractive women with good bodies, absolutely adore the hell out of them..and have no desire to look elsewhere..

 

I mean, women have no issue with eliminating guys with small dicks or short height, right? And outside of the couple of crying asses you see post on here, most guys, including myself(5'6") have absolutely no issue with it...If that's what floats their boat, then so be it...

 

Not saying this of any poster, but I can't believe how harsh some 'regular" women are to good looking women with hot bodies.."They are all sluts and homewreckers." God forbid they could actually be honest and down to earth...

 

TFY

 

I am not at all knocking men for chasing women for their beauty. There is nothing wrong with that. I'm not blaming men for how they are. I'm just asking whether a decades-long commitment is a good idea.

 

I also hate it when people attack others out of jealousy.

[Eggplant]

To enjoy the benefits of the legal partnership until the next man whose love is based on looks comes along and provides a more enticing deal. If you accept men for who they are and use it to benefit yourself you can have some quite enjoyable, profitable and varied experiences in life. Life itself is transitory (we all die) so enjoy it to the full. If men covet you for looks, there will always be another along shortly if the current one no longer does, even when you get old and wrinkled. It goes on every day.

 

I glean this perspective both from having been married to someone with this philosophy as well as the wonderful volumes of data and anecdotes the internet provides to our fingertips. When I see how few women who are widely coveted for their looks maintain lifelong marriages, I find myself drawn to examining why the many who serially marry did/do so. It's still a work in progress. My main takeaway is that, generally, sometime in their 50's, these widely coveted women appear to settle in for their last marriage, some with three or four behind them, then live with that partner until one or the other is dead. This makes sense, more so now that I'm in my mid-50's and see how the aging process works on a day to day basis. Age and illness (and death in some cases) have really taken a toll on older friends and I'm beginning to see the signs in myself as well. Dollars to donuts none of my current social circle will get divorced in their lifetimes now, though nearly all have been divorced one or two (some three) times prior. With age, change is often less enticing than as a younger person, even if we still feel young and vital and all those eternal things.

 

IMO, the key is to pick a confluence of maximized looks, age, social power and financial security and go for it. Yeah, the man might base his love on looks but, if you pick right, the confluence of the other factors will keep him in the milieu unless you queer up the deal and leave yourself. If you're young, don't worry about this until you're my age, rather just enjoy men, marry whom you please and divorce them if things go sideways. Why? It works.

 

But jumping from marriage to marriage, I am not strong enough for that. Because I'd give everything I had.

[calvincline47]

If she makes less than you because she took a hit in her career in order to be the best possible mother for your children, why wouldn't you be happy to pay alimony?

 

Because this is not what I believe will happen.

 

Based on my observations, women quit working under the guise of being a better mother, but usually just use it as an excuse to be lazy and spend her husband's hard-earned money.

[carhill]

Think of it like growing a career, except socially instead of business. Some people are 'lifers' (very common in my parent's generation) and others are more mobile. The commitments, while extant, are valid and beneficial and then a change comes and people move on to new commitments. If a man loves you for your looks and stays until that changes (his love or your looks, or both), then he does. Same for you. Your love could change, or he could change or you could find him unattractive or another man more attractive and move on. Kinda flies in the face of classic romance I guess but, well, that died with lifetime employment and mom's staying at home. It's a new world. Lots of freedom, choices, and responsibilities.

[autumnnight]

Because this is not what I believe will happen.

 

Based on my observations, women quit working under the guise of being a better mother, but usually just use it as an excuse to be lazy and spend her husband's hard-earned money.

 

Generalize much? Or is it just more fun to be jaded?

 

This is why my sincere empathy for sincere men wears reeeeeaaal thin after awhile.

[Eggplant]

Because this is not what I believe will happen.

 

Based on my observations, women quit working under the guise of being a better mother, but usually just use it as an excuse to be lazy and spend her husband's hard-earned money.

 

This is a distorted view. There are probably some lazy women who might do this. In my case, I've worked hard for a career that I'm passionate about, and I would stay at home with small children only out of concern for their best interests.

 

If you cannot find a woman whom you don't think is a user, then do not get married. Part of the idea is that you trust each other to be good people.

[Eggplant]

Think of it like growing a career, except socially instead of business. Some people are 'lifers' (very common in my parent's generation) and others are more mobile. The commitments, while extant, are valid and beneficial and then a change comes and people move on to new commitments. If a man loves you for your looks and stays until that changes (his love or your looks, or both), then he does. Same for you. Your love could change, or he could change or you could find him unattractive or another man more attractive and move on. Kinda flies in the face of classic romance I guess but, well, that died with lifetime employment and mom's staying at home. It's a new world. Lots of freedom, choices, and responsibilities.

No I could never. A career is impersonal. I am ambitious in my career, mind you. And I think I will have trouble in the career world not taking things too personally. But the whole idea of being in a personal relationship is that it be personal. Otherwise what's the point?

[123321]

If you cannot find a woman whom you don't think is a user, then do not get married. Part of the idea is that you trust each other to be good people.

 

It's not just that. It's that when something like this ends it's natural for people to have hard feelings to a degree, often very strong ones. Family law gives women a huge club to work that out with, and they often use it. It's not about being a bad person, it's about being human and using what falls to hand.

 

People say that "women lose economically from divorce", which is a sort of farcical way to look at it. Basically, if you look at the statistics what that means is that instead of having their income and their husbands to spend, they now have their income and half their husbands, plus maybe some child support.

 

Sort of like how reducing a planned spending increase is a 'spending cut' to clever politicians.

[Anela]

Good job skipping over this ^

 

and ignore the 32 year old who also finds older women attractive and uses his pic for his avatar so you can see he's not an ugly fat fu*k. (I wish there was a hand clap emoticon)

 

TFY is one of the small group that seems to think that way. I think I've only recently seen you say anything about liking older women. You've done a good job of missing all of the posts about the wonders of the younger woman.

[loveweary11]

TFY is one of the small group that seems to think that way. I think I've only recently seen you say anything about liking older women. You've done a good job of missing all of the posts about the wonders of the younger woman.

 

Anela, it's all relative.

 

You're a younger woman to millions of men.

 

Men like Brad Pitt, Johnny Depp..and pretty much everyone here is a younger woman to Patrick Stewart.

 

It's not as big a deal as the offense you take toward it.

 

People have a right to date the same sex. People have a right to date different races, different religions, different languages and different socioeconomic backgrounds.

 

How can you deny people the right to date different ages? Seems like some bigotry to me.

 

The hatred you hold is readily apparent in your posts.

 

Let the anger go... you'll feel a lot better.

[carhill]

No I could never. A career is impersonal. I am ambitious in my career, mind you. And I think I will have trouble in the career world not taking things too personally. But the whole idea of being in a personal relationship is that it be personal. Otherwise what's the point?

Every association between humans is as personal or impersonal as they choose and is completely voluntary. Sure, some people delineate between business 'Hey, it's business, nothing personal' and personal, but in reality it's all personal because each interaction is between persons. Commitments are commitments; betrayals are betrayals; a bigger better deal is a bigger better deal. Humans perform such actions every moment of every day, often without any thought or consideration for the details.

 

The man looks, the man covets, the man likes the results, the man marries, the man lives his life, the man changes his mind (or not), the man moves on (or not). Life is a continuum of moments and none of them are guaranteed to follow a particular path or plan of action. The very fact that this discussion exists is the confluence of billions of bits of 'stuff' that result in this interaction at this place at this moment in time. None of them are predictable nor guaranteed to have any particular outcome. Just like a man's love.

[Anela]

Anela, it's all relative.

 

You're a younger woman to millions of men.

 

Men like Brad Pitt, Johnny Depp..and pretty much everyone here is a younger woman to Patrick Stewart.

 

It's not as big a deal as the offense you take toward it.

 

People have a right to date the same sex. People have a right to date different races, different religions, different languages and different socioeconomic backgrounds.

 

How can you deny people the right to date different ages? Seems like some bigotry to me.

 

The hatred you hold is readily apparent in your posts.

 

Let the anger go... you'll feel a lot better.

 

I was actually feeling fine until I read that post. I've had a great afternoon and evening. I am angry about other things in my life - things that I haven't been able to "just get over". If I could have, I would have. I also don't deny anyone the right to date whomever they like - I'm just tired of hearing that I'm worthless because of my age. Have you seen the anger here from men? You haven't been around long enough to have seen me empathize with the men here, only to be crapped on for it.

 

I had just come back here to tell Robert that I don't blame men for everything. Anyone who knows me, knows I'm well aware of my own shortcomings. So back off, okay? and maybe pass along this advice to the men here that you have done such a good job of not noticing.

 

I need to get back to my evening. I knew it was a mistake to pop in.

[Woggle]

So what? You really have to ignore what other people say or think. Who cares if some random guys on the internet are into younger women? I would not if I were you. I like younger women too, but my GF is actually a year older than I am. Little things like that don't matter. Sure, if someone is building their perfect partner, they might say they like younger women, taller men, bigger boobs, whatever. All unimportant. The point is, you find a person you like, a person that likes you back. All of that taller, younger, thinner nonsense goes right out the window.

 

For the record, most of the complaints about older women are things entirely in their control. An older woman with a good attitude, a good personality, that takes care of herself? No one cares how long she has been on this planet.

 

Exactly. For most men it has nothing to do with age and everything to do with attitude. Attitude is even more important than looks with men as they get older. Once many men hit 30s a woman with a rotten attitude is something we just have no tolerance for no matter what she looks like except for shallow idiots who want to pay a 19 year old to act like she loves him.

 

There are plenty of men who are loyal and have been loyal to women they have been married to for years. I know we here about it a lot but most men who love their wives have no desire to trade them in for a younger woman. The men I know who have left their wives don't want a younger woman but some peace and quiet after years of drama.

[123321]

Exactly. For most men it has nothing to do with age and everything to do with attitude. Attitude is even more important than looks with men as they get older. Once many men hit 30s a woman with a rotten attitude is something we just have no tolerance for no matter what she looks like except for shallow idiots who want to pay a 19 year old to act like she loves him.

 

the issue that a lot of people here refuse to remember is that older people will tend to have a lot more baggage, both emotional and and in the form of kids who often are advertised as "always going to come first".

 

What guy is going to go for that? The ones with no better options. It's not just about the number, or even mostly. It's mostly about all the other crapola that comes along with it.

[Mrlonelyone]

OP

 

Why get married if the man will leave when your looks fade? Men don't marry a woman because of looks. Most men marry a woman because of how she makes him feel. Keep making your husband feel good about himself and he will stay married to you.

 

Also what Carhill says is right. Romantic relationships don't have to last to death to be worthy. Some of us get married and stay that way. Others have one romance after the other.

 

the issue that a lot of people here refuse to remember is that older people will tend to have a lot more baggage, both emotional and and in the form of kids who often are advertised as "always going to come first".

 

What guy is going to go for that? The ones with no better options. It's not just about the number, or even mostly. It's mostly about all the other crapola that comes along with it.

 

"Baggage" as you put it is also the reason that people who are older are more mature. Immaturity is born of a lack of experience which is either direct or indirect (by seeing how other peoples lives work out).

[Eggplant]

Keep making your husband feel good about himself and he will stay married to you.

This I believe. I feel like everybody really wants a partner to build up their ego.

[123321]

"Baggage" as you put it is also the reason that people who are older are more mature.

 

 

It's possible to learn without turning it into baggage.

[thefooloftheyear]

OP

 

Why get married if the man will leave when your looks fade? Men don't marry a woman because of looks. Most men marry a woman because of how she makes him feel. Keep making your husband feel good about himself and he will stay married to you.

 

Also what Carhill says is right. Romantic relationships don't have to last to death to be worthy. Some of us get married and stay that way. Others have one romance after the other.

 

 

 

"Baggage" as you put it is also the reason that people who are older are more mature. Immaturity is born of a lack of experience which is either direct or indirect (by seeing how other peoples lives work out).

 

Im not sure this is true...Men do marry women based on looks...Happens every day,,,Its very important to most men...and quite frankly it should be..

 

Has anyone ever tried to set you up with an unattractive or heavy woman? I have..and so have a lot of others...

 

Very first thing the man says...."what does she look like?"

 

They say...."Well......she has a wonderful personality....she is a great person"....

 

The next thing most men say is...."uh.....thanks, but I'm OK for now"....

 

Its just as wrong to marry for looks alone as it is for personality alone...Men are highly visual...Most men that marry a woman solely because she was sweet towards him and made him feel all spesh-ull.., usually will wind up in another woman's bed in no time, if the physical part isnt there..

 

Now lets be honest....Desirability based on physical appearance vary from one to another and what one guy thinks is an ugly dog, is another guys wet dream...So, as far as the physical/appearance side of it no one is really doomed to be alone forever...

 

Its hard, but in order for this stuff to work in the long haul, all needs must be met....True for men or women...

 

TFY

Edited April 19, 2015 by thefooloftheyear

[PrettyEmily77]

Im not sure this is true...Men do marry women based on looks...Happens every day,,,Its very important to most men...and quite frankly it should be..

 

Has anyone ever tried to set you up with an unattractive or heavy woman? I have..and so have a lot of others...

 

Very first thing the man says...."what does she look like?"

 

They say...."Well......she has a wonderful personality....she is a great person"....

 

The next thing most men say is...."uh.....thanks, but I'm OK for now"....

 

Its just as wrong to marry for looks alone as it is for personality alone...Men are highly visual...Most men that marry a woman solely because she was sweet towards him and made him feel all spesh-ull.., usually will wind up in another woman's bed in no time, if the physical part isnt there..

 

Now lets be honest....Desirability based on physical appearance vary from one to another and what one guy thinks is an ugly dog, is another guys wet dream...So, as far as the physical/appearance side of it no one is really doomed to be alone forever...

 

Its hard, but in order for this stuff to work in the long haul, all needs must be met....True for men or women...

 

TFY

 

 

^^^ Agreed 100%. IME, most people who go for personality alone either stray or get stuck in a RL out of some self-defeating sense of higher morals.

 

 

Personally, I'll admit with no shame whatsoever that my LTRs were with men I was very attracted to physically (all were extremely handsome to me) and in personality. I didn't always get it right but at least I have no regrets. They didn't all of a sudden become ugly because we didn't work out, and they didn't become more handsome because they were nice.

 

 

I don't get this 'I used to be with high maintenance 10s but now I purposefully am with a 6 or a 7 but their personality is so nice, they make me feel so good, they have such good morals, etc. that they are a 10 in my eyes'. I want to be my guy's 10 in all aspects from the start and I'd much rather stay single than compromise or feel settled for. I'm not called Emily and I don't find myself irresistibly pretty (that's my little niece; poor choice of handle, I can see that now) but I take pride in my appearance and look after myself, my health and all things I can control.

 

No one should go for looks alone but no one should discard them either.

 

 

ETA: Sorry OP! Rant over!

Edited April 19, 2015 by PrettyEmily77

[Els]

^^^ Agreed 100%. IME, most people who go for personality alone either stray or get stuck in a RL out of some self-defeating sense of higher morals.

 

Nobody is suggesting dismissing appearances entirely, for either gender. The premise of the OP's question was under the assumption that "a man's love is based on looks", which implies that looks are the primary factor for all men if the assumption is true. This is what some of us are challenging. There is a big difference between something being 'part of the package' and it being the sole or main basis for the relationship.

Edited April 19, 2015 by Elswyth

[PrettyEmily77]

Nobody is suggesting dismissing appearances entirely, for either gender. The premise of the OP's question was under the assumption that "a man's love is based on looks", which implies that looks are the primary factor for all men if the assumption is true. This is what some of us are challenging. There is a big difference between something being 'part of the package' and it being the sole or main basis for the relationship.

 

Having read the thread, I didn't get the impression that the OP was generalising her premise to all men but maybe I got that wrong.

 

 

I've also noticed on that forum that anyone daring to say that physical appearance is their initial primary factor is deemed shallow whatever their gender. Looks and personality are both important factors to me, but I initially base my attraction on looks when I'm looking for a RL (ie not friendship); I don't have a problem saying it and I don't care much if that makes me shallow.

 

 

Even if the assumption was true for all or most people, I personally don't see the point in challenging someone else's priorities, the assumption being that my priorities would be better than theirs, and that would be presumptuous, IMO. Other people's priorities may be personalities first, they may be shared values first, they may be common hobbies or favourite music first, I won't be the one telling them they're wrong and if it works for them, I'm happy for them. All it takes is finding someone who has the same priorities as you have, whatever they are.