Why is there such a social stigma to being a virgin?

[AVarma]

You are making way too big of a deal out of this, OP.

 

That said, while it is overblown, there is a social stigma about virginity. However, these days I notice it more on the internet than in real life. It's the internet...folks say all sorts of crap. I've also noticed that virgin guys who get shamed and picked on for their virginity...being called "losers" and some such...the shaming almost always comes from OTHER GUYS, not women.

 

I've also observed it more among people in their teens and early 20s...generally amongst the people (immature guys usually) who care about things like "# of sexual partners", "length of penis", etc. People tend to stop caring about such things once they get a bit older. They may be surprised by an older virgin - let's face it, virgins 25+ years old don't exactly grow on trees - but otherwise they won't care; you're just another guy who just happens to have never gotten laid. Many women may prefer a guy who knows what he's doing in the bedroom (especially women who want the guy to take the lead), but again that doesn't automatically mean that those women believe that inexperienced guys are losers.

 

The big mistake that most virgins make is caring about it. Which usually comes across as insecurity to others, and insecurity is a turn-off to many women.

 

I think women are different in that even though they won't shame a man publicly for it they might talk about it in private. Whether or not it would be a dealbreaker I have no idea but I can imagine many of them would look down upon it.

[TigerCub]

I've seen it happen, so it's a legit concern!

Obviously taken on case-by-case basis, but I can understand that.

 

Absolutely, I don't think it would happen with all people that have had only 1 partner - but it happens enough to be a concern - and then it totally depends on each person, just how much of a concern.

[autumnnight]

Damn, until you said the "unless you have never kissed a girl" part I was feeling good about your post.

 

I'll give some perspective. I grew up in one of those Josh Harris, "every date is a potential mate," other well know Bible teachers, kind of religions where kissing before marriage was frowned upon by many many people. I actually had a Bible leader say that if you kiss a girl and do not marry her, you have kissed another man's wife.

 

I didn't go that far, but I was VERY VERY guarded, as was the man I married. This complete lack of even discussing the physical aspect of things became a horrific reality in our marriage. Also, I just do not think a person who has never even given a girl a peck on the cheek or a two-armed hug can just jump into bed and it not be so totally awkward and uncomfortable. The only way I think this works is if the girl has been equally repressed/restricted/pure/pick your adjective.

 

I am sure that Josh and the Duggars will disagree, but I do not think this complete cutting off of and denying our sexuality is healthy, and I have seen more than one marriage REALLY struggle as a result.

[AVarma]

Absolutely, I don't think it would happen with all people that have had only 1 partner - but it happens enough to be a concern - and then it totally depends on each person, just how much of a concern.

 

You know it's funny, virgins and women who are suspicious of them seem to have one thing in common, they're both inside each others heads too much.

[TigerCub]

You know it's funny, virgins and women who are suspicious of them seem to have one thing in common, they're both inside each others heads too much.

 

Maybe, or maybe these women learn from other people's mistakes - or at least take note of possible common pitfalls.

 

All depends on how you look at it.

[AVarma]

Maybe, or maybe these women learn from other people's mistakes - or at least take note of possible common pitfalls.

 

All depends on how you look at it.

 

So how can a virgin reassure you that he won't get GIGS?

[TigerCub]

So how can a virgin reassure you that he won't get GIGS?

 

Virgin or non-virgin - They can't ever promise not to get GIGS. So to answer your question - there is no way to reassure and promise on what would happen in the future. I know that anybody can get GIGS - I'm just saying that virgins run a slightly higher risk of doing that (because of the limited experience and one day wanting to experience what they missed out on before).

 

What about you - can the person you date ever promise you and reassure you that they wont have GIGS?

[AVarma]

Virgin or non-virgin - They can't ever promise not to get GIGS. So to answer your question - there is no way to reassure and promise on what would happen in the future. I know that anybody can get GIGS - I'm just saying that virgins run a slightly higher risk of doing that (because of the limited experience and one day wanting to experience what they missed out on before).

 

What about you - can the person you date ever promise you and reassure you that they wont have GIGS?

 

I'm not sure, I haven't really thought about it to be honest. You were the one who brought it up.

[TigerCub]

I'm not sure, I haven't really thought about it to be honest. You were the one who brought it up.

 

 

Yeah I brought it up in terms of answering the question - that it would honestly be one of my concerns about dating a virgin.

 

But overall, I just don't think ANYONE can reassure their partner or promise their partner that they wont get GIGS. And maybe I would use that reasoning to convince myself to give dating the virgin more of a shot - because there are no guarantees with anyone - but I just don't know...

[E-Squared]

This is kinda the problem here - you've somewhat latched onto the one post that outlines why they don't want a virgin. You did that on the last page with Katzee aswell. You're looking for a stigma to be angry with, finding it in the women who have no interest in virgins.

 

If the girl you hit it off with in the club doesn't want you because she thinks whatever she thinks due to you being a virgin then move onto one who doesn't care! Because they are out there - I would have never gotten laid if I didn't. And I never would have maintained a more confident disposition if I punished myself by trying to prove my worth to the girls who didn't want to f-ck a male virgin, for whatever reason.

 

As the poster said, its her preference. Just like guys who don't want promiscuous girls or whatever. I'm sure you have yours, as I have mine. You have the choice of how to deal - seeing an escort probably isn't the best course of action. Just keep an even keel about it - don't care about it and you'll be fine.

 

EDIT: and FYI, I have had girls outline to me the same things Katzee and almond have said in this post. They thought I would be too clingy, not manly enough or incapable of handling a relationship, sexually or otherwise. I didn't need to argue with them, I can't change how someone thinks. But I ignored it in the long run because I felt confident enough in myself eventually to know that I wasn't incapable, or clingy, or any other negative connotation that would be associated. You don't have to prove that to them. People are gonna want what they want. Focus on the ones who want to f-ck you, not the ones who don't.

This has been a hangup for me for quite some time. Even though I said that I don't actively pursue women because I don't have much drive or interest, another reason is because I am afraid that when the truth comes out, she won't want to talk to me anymore. I have said in other threads that I get defensive when people talk about sex when I am around, whether they want a story about what I have done or if I am asked if I am a virgin (A question I absolutely despise). Even when I am around people who discuss sex, I feel that I need to excuse myself because I would have nothing to add to the discussion.

 

I did say that I have made out with a few women before. I have done some sexual things before, but nothing to the point where my pants came off. So it isn't like I am totally inexperienced, though I guess in some women's eyes, guys need to have some sort of resume or a list of exes to qualify for their standards, which is fine, but I have that bit ingrained in my head that I feel really behind other people who have done the deed. I remember having been given crap from a woman about me being a virgin, and I got rather defensive with her. Same thing happened with another woman who I talked to, asked the dreaded virgin question and I got a little defensive. I remember some other women who asked it casually because they wanted to know out of curiosity, and I still got defensive with them. Notice a pattern?

 

I carry myself confidently for the most part, but come on, there are confident people who still have insecurities.

[ThaWholigan]

This has been a hangup for me for quite some time. Even though I said that I don't actively pursue women because I don't have much drive or interest, another reason is because I am afraid that when the truth comes out, she won't want to talk to me anymore. I have said in other threads that I get defensive when people talk about sex when I am around, whether they want a story about what I have done or if I am asked if I am a virgin (A question I absolutely despise). Even when I am around people who discuss sex, I feel that I need to excuse myself because I would have nothing to add to the discussion.

 

I did say that I have made out with a few women before. I have done some sexual things before, but nothing to the point where my pants came off. So it isn't like I am totally inexperienced, though I guess in some women's eyes, guys need to have some sort of resume or a list of exes to qualify for their standards, which is fine, but I have that bit ingrained in my head that I feel really behind other people who have done the deed. I remember having been given crap from a woman about me being a virgin, and I got rather defensive with her. Same thing happened with another woman who I talked to, asked the dreaded virgin question and I got a little defensive. I remember some other women who asked it casually because they wanted to know out of curiosity, and I still got defensive with them. Notice a pattern?

 

I carry myself confidently for the most part, but come on, there are confident people who still have insecurities.

 

Well I think that it's something you should work on rather than just accepting that. Your defensive reaction is only going to serve to perpetuate your situation if every time you talk about sex you start to get funny. I can remember that feeling, but once I hit 18, even though I was nowhere near losing my virginity, I got comfortable with talking about sex at the very least because I knew the mechanics of such. It took a while for me to get comfortable being a virgin overall, but once I knew more about sex, intimacy and women in general as well as knew more about myself, it was easier.

 

Focusing in your insecurities will only make them seem like bigger obstacles. I started to focus on how to deal with them, circumvent them. They became challenges that I wanted to tackle. And even though I'm still not a super ladies man, I'm much much better now and at ease, and I had become that way even before I eventually lost my virginity.

 

And yes, everybody has their insecurities. I have mine - I still have issues with my physical appearance sometimes and also I'm unsatisfied with my socioeconomic status - but overall I'm content with facing them and overcoming them. Don't worry about what it's like in "some" women's eyes. You can't afford to - what you need to focus on is why you seize up when it comes to this issue, why it's ingrained in your head that you feel this way and learn to tackle it or at the very least learn to deal with it. It can be an ongoing process.

 

The first thing you gotta do is learn why you get so defensive about your virginity and try to prevent that. That defensiveness will be problematic.

[barcode88]

If the social stigma of being a virgin is getting to you, go see an escort. Most escorts are VERY clean compared to the type of girls who do one night stands at the bar.

[E-Squared]

Well I think that it's something you should work on rather than just accepting that. Your defensive reaction is only going to serve to perpetuate your situation if every time you talk about sex you start to get funny. I can remember that feeling, but once I hit 18, even though I was nowhere near losing my virginity, I got comfortable with talking about sex at the very least because I knew the mechanics of such. It took a while for me to get comfortable being a virgin overall, but once I knew more about sex, intimacy and women in general as well as knew more about myself, it was easier.

 

Focusing in your insecurities will only make them seem like bigger obstacles. I started to focus on how to deal with them, circumvent them. They became challenges that I wanted to tackle. And even though I'm still not a super ladies man, I'm much much better now and at ease, and I had become that way even before I eventually lost my virginity.

 

And yes, everybody has their insecurities. I have mine - I still have issues with my physical appearance sometimes and also I'm unsatisfied with my socioeconomic status - but overall I'm content with facing them and overcoming them. Don't worry about what it's like in "some" women's eyes. You can't afford to - what you need to focus on is why you seize up when it comes to this issue, why it's ingrained in your head that you feel this way and learn to tackle it or at the very least learn to deal with it. It can be an ongoing process.

 

The first thing you gotta do is learn why you get so defensive about your virginity and try to prevent that. That defensiveness will be problematic.

I tell myself this a lot. Usually I go about my days just not really caring about it, nor do I really care to meet women. That's the thing mostly, but then there are times when I start to dwell on this because I am at an age where it's more likely to have done the deed than have not. Sometimes I'll think to myself "What have I been doing lately?"

 

I also don't like how some people make these assumptions on how a guy might be too socially inept, or have some other thing that may prevent him from having sex, and it's really condescending when people make these assumptions. It's true what some say, people do suck.

 

:sick: Well the unedited post had some pretty ugly language to use about women and sex, maybe that has something to do with your situation?? Srsly I haven't learned about this huge stigma on male virgins until I came to this site, I am 25 and for sure I know 2 guys who are virgins who are my age. Yes they get some teasing which they take gracefully and none of their friends judge them for it, one of the guys is painfully shy so I am sure it is going to take him a while!! I know that "sexual prowess" is a revered trait for guys (especially among guys I think!) Guys you need to just be okay with who you are and if there is a stigma f**k that just live your life and try to enjoy it!! When you get a chance to have sex with the right girl at the right time it will be fine.

I can see that my post in response to Katzee (Before it got edited) made you cringe, which was a little out of line and vulgar. I mostly live with that mentality like you said, but I also have my moments in which I am afraid of even pursuing women because I fear that she won't like me after finding out that I'm a virgin. That is my primary concern.

 

You are making way too big of a deal out of this, OP.

 

That said, while it is overblown, there is a social stigma about virginity. However, these days I notice it more on the internet than in real life. It's the internet...folks say all sorts of crap. I've also noticed that virgin guys who get shamed and picked on for their virginity...being called "losers" and some such...the shaming almost always comes from OTHER GUYS, not women.

 

I've also observed it more among people in their teens and early 20s...generally amongst the people (immature guys usually) who care about things like "# of sexual partners", "length of penis", etc. People tend to stop caring about such things once they get a bit older. They may be surprised by an older virgin - let's face it, virgins 25+ years old don't exactly grow on trees - but otherwise they won't care; you're just another guy who just happens to have never gotten laid. Many women may prefer a guy who knows what he's doing in the bedroom (especially women who want the guy to take the lead), but again that doesn't automatically mean that those women believe that inexperienced guys are losers.

 

The big mistake that most virgins make is caring about it. Which usually comes across as insecurity to others, and insecurity is a turn-off to many women.

Excuse me, but weren't you the one who wrote this?:

 

The bottom line is that modern society expects or at least assumes that you have had certain life experiences at certain ages. Failure to meet those milestones by certain ages and you may feel like you're "behind". Sexual experience is one of those things and 90% of people (including many people who are very religious) get that out of the way in their teens or early 20s. And they're not like "oh, the clock is ticking, I need to hurry up and have sex". For most, losing virginity and getting sexual experience is just a natural occurrence that's part of them growing up and learning about life. They did not need to try very hard. They were already pretty solid in the social skills and self-confidence departments because (a) those things were focused on during their upbringing and (b) they had a decent number of friends and spent time with them outside of class doing fun activities or just shooting the sh*t. Dating, relationships, sex, heck even workplace jobs, etc...those were merely the next step; the next rung up the ladder.

 

Your sexual and intimacy tendencies are part of who you are as a person. And most people explore, journey and learn a lot about themselves during their 20s. That is why for most older virgins (25 yo and older)...there's a strong chance that the REASONS behind the lack of sex are not good and are likely going to be serious red flags and/or dealbreakers for most people of the opposite sex. And one or more of those "reasons" are very likely going to be obvious or very noticeable to most people quickly...either during the first date or even before you ask her out. She may not think "virgin"...but she will think "strange", "oddball", "awkward", "forced", maybe even "creepy". And if things do manage to progress to sex, there's a good chance she will easily recognize your lack of experience whether you tell her or not. No matter how well you "prepare" beforehand. She may or may not be OK with that.

 

There are a few older virgins that are good, confident people...but I bet they're like finding a needle in a haystack.

 

And most devout religious people get married young, so they're unlikely to be virgins past their mid-20s.

 

OP - your best chance is to just try not to make a big deal out of it. In other words, have a "so what if I'm a virgin?" mentality. However, don't lie if asked...just don't make a spectacle out of it. Just talk to, have fun with and date women like any other man. You may want to initially focus more on just meeting people in general, with no expectations. The point is to become comfortable and more confident being yourself around others (male and female)...and that will only come with time, patience and repetition.

 

Lastly, don't see a hooker...

When I read this a while back, my anger kind of kicked in because what you said is true, and it sort of hit close to home.

[ThaWholigan]

I tell myself this a lot. Usually I go about my days just not really caring about it, nor do I really care to meet women. That's the thing mostly, but then there are times when I start to dwell on this because I am at an age where it's more likely to have done the deed than have not. Sometimes I'll think to myself "What have I been doing lately?"

 

I also don't like how some people make these assumptions on how a guy might be too socially inept, or have some other thing that may prevent him from having sex, and it's really condescending when people make these assumptions. It's true what some say, people do suck.

 

It might seem condescending, but that's the kind of thoughts people have when they think of a male virgin. I hated it at first too, and that was when I was still in my teens!!! I just had to not take it too seriously. Of course, I had to make an effort to socialize, especially as I was a performing musician for a while and networking is everything. That meant meeting women too - so of course, occasionally when there was interest, I had to try and learn not to be so awkward.

 

If someone asked me about my status, I just didn't get defensive about it. You have to try and disassociate yourself from those thoughts and feelings of inadequacy. Don't think about when you "should" have done the deed - that will only fill you with regret and more self-loathing. It's attaining that balance that will be hard - meeting women while letting go of your anger about your sexual activity. You have to exercise that anger somehow.

[E-Squared]

It might seem condescending, but that's the kind of thoughts people have when they think of a male virgin. I hated it at first too, and that was when I was still in my teens!!! I just had to not take it too seriously. Of course, I had to make an effort to socialize, especially as I was a performing musician for a while and networking is everything. That meant meeting women too - so of course, occasionally when there was interest, I had to try and learn not to be so awkward.

 

If someone asked me about my status, I just didn't get defensive about it. You have to try and disassociate yourself from those thoughts and feelings of inadequacy. Don't think about when you "should" have done the deed - that will only fill you with regret and more self-loathing. It's attaining that balance that will be hard - meeting women while letting go of your anger about your sexual activity. You have to exercise that anger somehow.

I know how to socialize and I do interact with women, whether they are coworkers, classmates, female friends, even sources for a news story (Just letting you know, I am a journalism major, aspiring journalist as well because I am interning at a local publication). I interact with them. I even interact with a waitress who I fancy at a diner I go to, and it's more than me just giving her my order and stuff.

 

I know I need to channel my anger and rage. I tell myself this all the time.

[ThaWholigan]

I know how to socialize and I do interact with women, whether they are coworkers, classmates, female friends, even sources for a news story (Just letting you know, I am a journalism major, aspiring journalist as well because I am interning at a local publication). I interact with them. I even interact with a waitress who I fancy at a diner I go to, and it's more than me just giving her my order and stuff.

 

I know I need to channel my anger and rage. I tell myself this all the time.

OK, well you know what to do then. It's just a matter of finding the right channels and asking yourself the right questions so you can get the answers you seek. Anger does you no good bottled up, then unleashed in doses because someone asked you about your sex life!

 

You'll be OK, just don't let it get to you. Talk to someone if you have to and work through it.

[johan]

I don't know about social stigma. I just know I like to keep a bit of distance. I don't want any of that virgin-ness to rub off on me. Yikes, it makes me kind of shudder just to think about it.

 

Actually, I think it's just one of those things people expect you to have gotten taken care of by a certain age. I don't think people who might raise their eyebrows are all going to judge you harshly for it if you have other things going on that they can respect. But it's how people are. I had a boss once who found it hard to trust people that didn't drink with him. There was something in the character of someone who would turn down a drink, like some people might feel slighted if you turned down their hospitality or rejected a gift.

 

It's like pretty much everything else. You need to set your goals in life. Positive goals meant to build yourself up, that lead to a sense of accomplishment and self-respect. Then just live your life oriented around achieving those goals. This virgin stuff is small potatoes compared to those goals, and it will work itself out once you find your path in life. Of even less significance is what people think about your virginity. It's your life. You live it. They don't. Screw them.

[toscaroscura]

FWIW my current BF is a virgin and nope, it didn't matter one bit to me, because I loved him. In fact, I was even his first kiss!

 

Is he a little awkward? Sure, plus he has strong religious beliefs which, while not repressive, makes him take sex much more seriously. But we are very compatible, and all of his qualities are so wonderful that the virginity doesn't mean squat to me. I remember him telling me, like almost "confessing", and it was such a non issue to me.

[AVarma]

FWIW my current BF is a virgin and nope, it didn't matter one bit to me, because I loved him. In fact, I was even his first kiss!

 

Is he a little awkward? Sure, plus he has strong religious beliefs which, while not repressive, makes him take sex much more seriously. But we are very compatible, and all of his qualities are so wonderful that the virginity doesn't mean squat to me. I remember him telling me, like almost "confessing", and it was such a non issue to me.

 

Quick question, how old are you? And how old is he?

[toscaroscura]

Quick question, how old are you? And how old is he?

 

He is 23 and I am almost 36.

 

It's unusual but it works for us.

[NJ123]

FWIW my current BF is a virgin and nope, it didn't matter one bit to me, because I loved him. In fact, I was even his first kiss!

 

Is he a little awkward? Sure, plus he has strong religious beliefs which, while not repressive, makes him take sex much more seriously. But we are very compatible, and all of his qualities are so wonderful that the virginity doesn't mean squat to me. I remember him telling me, like almost "confessing", and it was such a non issue to me.

 

It does seem like some women think it's adorable or cute for a guy to still be a virgin or have very little experience after a certain age. A woman I talked to 2 years ago, wanted sex with me & was telling me how cute & adorable I was even after telling her everything. I unfortunately screwed it up on my own though due to some unfortunate circumstances at the time.

[toscaroscura]

It does seem like some women think it's adorable or cute for a guy to still be a virgin or have very little experience after a certain age. A woman I talked to 2 years ago, wanted sex with me & was telling me how cute & adorable I was even after telling her everything. I unfortunately screwed it up on my own though due to some unfortunate circumstances at the time.

 

Well, while his sheepishness about it was adorable, and HE is adorable, his virginity isn't. I'd never want him to feel patronized like that. His virginity merely IS. It's neutral.

 

The other thing is, he was a little nervous to tell me BUT he is not absolutely tortured by his virginity. He's pretty secure in who he is and it's not a problem for him.

[NJ123]

Well, while his sheepishness about it was adorable, and HE is adorable, his virginity isn't. I'd never want him to feel patronized like that. His virginity merely IS. It's neutral.

 

The other thing is, he was a little nervous to tell me BUT he is not absolutely tortured by his virginity. He's pretty secure in who he is and it's not a problem for him.

 

True. Since you're neutral about it, how many other women do you feel would be neutral about someones virginity?

[toscaroscura]

True. Since you're neutral about it, how many other women do you feel would be neutral about someones virginity?

 

I really can't say! I can only speak for myself. I know there are women out there who don't want to train a man. When I told my aunt about my BF she told me she could never date a virgin. I have a friend like that too. I have also encountered men in my life who definitely don't want to train a virgin woman! I never got the impression that the men in my life (like my friends, cousins, etc.) prized female virginity, on the contrary, they seemed to generally prefer a woman who wasn't promiscuous, but had at least had one or two BFs under her belt.

 

As far as women's attitudes toward male virgins, they just didn't want to teach a guy from square one. My aunt wants a man who knows what he's doing. She is also in her 40s though.

 

For me, the way I view sex is, no matter how many partners you've had, every new person comes with a learning curve. People are different. Sure, there's some very general mechanical skills you learn, but there is always a sort of "virginity" with every new partner as you iron out the kinks and learn about each other. I just don't sweat it at all.

 

The most important thing for me is attitude! If he has an open, healthy and eager attitude towards sex, like my BF does, then he's good to go. But weird shame, self-loathing, bad attitudes towards women and/or sex are all turn offs. These things are all independent of virginity!

[NJ123]

I really can't say! I can only speak for myself. I know there are women out there who don't want to train a man. When I told my aunt about my BF she told me she could never date a virgin. I have a friend like that too. I have also encountered men in my life who definitely don't want to train a virgin woman! I never got the impression that the men in my life (like my friends, cousins, etc.) prized female virginity, on the contrary, they seemed to generally prefer a woman who wasn't promiscuous, but had at least had one or two BFs under her belt.

 

As far as women's attitudes toward male virgins, they just didn't want to teach a guy from square one. My aunt wants a man who knows what he's doing. She is also in her 40s though.

 

For me, the way I view sex is, no matter how many partners you've had, every new person comes with a learning curve. People are different. Sure, there's some very general mechanical skills you learn, but there is always a sort of "virginity" with every new partner as you iron out the kinks and learn about each other. I just don't sweat it at all.

 

The most important thing for me is attitude! If he has an open, healthy and eager attitude towards sex, like my BF does, then he's good to go. But weird shame, self-loathing, bad attitudes towards women and/or sex are all turn offs. These things are all independent of virginity!

 

Yeah, that's pretty much what I thought. A lot of women hate the idea of having to teach a guy, like he's some 18 year old or something. Seems most women at least want the guy to have a bit of experience under his belt.