Why do a lot of women expect MORE for LESS?

[Robert Z]

And "hold me, kiss me, screw me, pay me" is so romantic?

 

I was a loyal husband who loved my wife. But of course we can expect cheap shots from those on the defensive. I'm guessing this all rings a bell.

 

 

She cut me off beginning on our wedding night. If I was the problem and was all along, then she was nothing but a prostitute anyway.

[Els]

The teen years after puberty are really the only time women can bond to a mate fully...after this many women become wholly opportunists looking for walking wallets and baby daddies.

 

You do realize that what you term a 'walking wallet' and 'baby daddy' IS the traditional definition of a husband back in the good ol' days that you desire to return to, right?

 

Anyway, I have a question for you. How many women do you actually know in real life, aside from relatives? The truth, now.

[Snaggletooth]

Man, I didn't get laid on my wedding night. She informed me that she had a new medical problem. And that was the lie she use throughout our entire marriage. That was the beginning of the end of our sex life. After five years I was barely getting laid at all. Any time I pushed for more she got angry and nasty and started making all sorts of accusations. And NOT ONCE did she ever offer any alternatives.

 

Honestly, I am pretty sure that she planned the whole thing.

 

When we divorced and she was accusing me of all sorts of stuff, I pointed out that in spite of having a virtually sexless marriage, I never cheated on her. Her response was basically to F off, that she had to go without sex too. When I think of all the times I could have cheated but instead chose to be a loyal husband who has a wife with a medical problem, I want to shoot myself all over again.

 

Sh*t, that brings back some memories. I never married my ex but the day I sold my apartment, bought a house and put her name on the deeds she flipped the switch and changed the moment the keys were handed over. She didn't even move in until the place was cleaned. Suddenly confessed to a "medical condition" and turned into a selfish, jealous, moody, spiteful, accusatory, bone idle, near frigid nightmare who didn't want to work and spent her days sat on her arse drinking gin and tonics whilst squawking for sports cars, holidays, and more, and more and more whilst doing less and less and less. For four years we'd been living together with no sign of any of that but as soon as her name was on a dotted line.....

 

It was then years of pounding stress from doing the work of two and trying to understand and tolerate her "condition". When we split she told a pack of lies to have me thrown in a cell. Wasn't until I later gained internet access and was able to research her condition that I realised it was a load of horse sh*t.

 

 

My sister was even worse to her husband, quit work, parked her arse in front of the shopping channel, denied him sex for four years and even deadbolted the doors in the evenings to force him into showering outside under a freezing cold hose pipe as she didn't want the oil and grease from his work in the house. She put demand after demand on him whilst refusing to allow him to even sleep next to her as the stress had given him eczema as she didn't want his "leper flakes" in the bed. She eventually had an affair with his best mate, booted her husband from the house, tried to deny him access to the kids and moved his mate in.

 

You never truly know what you are getting involved with until the dotted line is signed.

[skydiveaddict]

I'm not afraid of women.

 

Show her that post of yours and you will be.

[skydiveaddict]

I'm not afraid of women.

 

Bravely spoken. "fools rush in where angels fear to tread."

[littleblackheart]

No advice is being asked, no opinions other than those who agree with the OP are sought, no real solutions are being offered, ... Shouldn't these types of thread to under the 'rants' section?

[braindamage]

Men are equally good at pulling off this kind of crap - who cares? If you're involved with someone that's just using you for money, sex or whatever then get rid of them.

[Lernaean_Hydra]

No advice is being asked, no opinions other than those who agree with the OP are sought, no real solutions are being offered, ... Shouldn't these types of thread to under the 'rants' section?

 

Since LS doesn't have a "trite, petulant whine" section I suppose you're right.

 

Men are equally good at pulling off this kind of crap - who cares? If you're involved with someone that's just using you for money, sex or whatever then get rid of them.

 

This isn't even a men do it too, issue. I'm more concerned with the fact that the general idea seems to be if a woman sleeps around at some point in her life, she doesn't "deserve" to settle down with a stable partner later on.

 

I just...I don't know, that way of thinking is so odd to me. I'm not saying men have to change the value they place on a minimal number of partners (they don't) but it seems quite ridiculous to sort of base your whole view of someone and what they do or don't deserve around something they could easily just lie about and you have no way to verify.

 

I'm a virgin by the way. Prove me wrong.

[sillyanswer]

Notice I did NOT say "ALL".

 

 

This is confusing.

 

 

This is confusing.

 

 

This is confusing (and stupid).

 

Thoughts?

 

You're clearly confused.

 

 

 

 

I saw that you made a rant about women but with a "not all women" disclaimer. Clearly the solution to your confusion is to not try to have relationships with the women you described if you don't like or understand their behaviour, and instead to try to have relationships with women from the other group.

 

I'm not making a judgement about the women you've described, other than that they clearly aren't for you if you have such negative views about them. They'll be okay - there are plenty of men out there who will appreciate them.

[skydiveaddict]

No advice is being asked, no opinions other than those who agree with the OP are sought, no real solutions are being offered, ... Shouldn't these types of thread to under the 'rants' section?

 

I Think it's in the right place. no one ever reads that rant section.

 

Besides, OP is in over his head. Next thing you know he will have a frying pan imbedded in his skull.

[braindamage]

This isn't even a men do it too, issue. I'm more concerned with the fact that the general idea seems to be if a woman sleeps around at some point in her life, she doesn't "deserve" to settle down with a stable partner later on.

 

I just...I don't know, that way of thinking is so odd to me. I'm not saying men have to change the value they place on a minimal number of partners (they don't) but it seems quite ridiculous to sort of base your whole view of someone and what they do or don't deserve around something they could easily just lie about and you have no way to verify.

 

IDK, perhaps he is one of the chumps who 'never got it for free' and now he's angry with women because of that. I presume the notion that because they didn't give it to him he gets some sort of satisfaction from the idea that they later on can't get a stable relationship. Ofcourse it doesn't work that way in reality and suppose that's what's making him all cranky.

[elaine567]

Notice I did NOT say "ALL".

It happens in several forms. In long term relationships and marriage, women often become less sexual and affectionate over time.. while expecting their husbands/boyfriends to become more loving, caring and committed over time.

 

I believe that for women there are two different types of sex, there is the reflex, bodily function, "scratch an itch" type of sex, and there is affectionate, loving, caring, intimate sex.

 

When a man in a relationship starts showing that the sex is just bodily function sex, then that can be a huge turn off for some women, especially if that woman has committed herself to a relationship.

Porn addiction can add to that turnoff, and it can re-confirm her suspicion that sex to a man has become like having a pee or a crap, a necessary physical act that doesn't actually need her input, as it will happen anyway.

 

From - being loving, caring, intimate, raunchy, exciting and something special between two people who love each other - sex can degenerate into what looks like primarily a male physiological act.

 

Women tend to want to have attention, love and affection with sex, if what they thought was love and affection, turns out to be a glorified regular wank, it can be off putting to say the least.

[Woggle]

Men need to walk with the first sign of a woman pulling a bait and switch. Also if she is not making an effort to be more loving then you need to stop making the effort. Give back what you get.

[autumnnight]

I do not know why some women behave this way. Sadly I have seen this not just in dating but also in marriage with a few women. The most common scenario seems to be that once she becomes mom she stops being wife, which is very sad.

 

However, I know many many women who continue to love and care for their SO, even in the face of diminishing attentiveness by the men in their lives. There are many women who sincerely honor their commitment to their SO throughout the relationship and take it seriously. And I have never met a man with the character, strength, openness and positivity to be worthy of one of these women have any trouble finding them. If the only type of women a man seems to find are the ones described in the OP, that likely says just as much about the man as it does the women.

[nofeelings22]

Notice I did NOT say "ALL".

 

It happens in several forms. In long term relationships and marriage, women often become less sexual and affectionate over time.. while expecting their husbands/boyfriends to become more loving, caring and committed over time.

 

This is confusing.

 

Then you have the age issue. Many women become more picky and have higher standards as they age. Yet they offer less to a man.. especially if he wants many kids as her reproductive years are ending (if not ended).

 

This is confusing.

 

And finally.. there is the situation where a woman will be very "loose" or promiscuous in her youngest and most attractive years.. giving her body away like candy. Then suddenly when she decides she is ready to get "serious":laugh: .. she makes the new man "earn" or "work for" her body. In other words.. he must now pay for something others got free.

 

This is confusing (and stupid).

 

Thoughts?

 

Those are just crappy women. I've never been married to or in a long term relationship with any woman who ever slowed down in sex any more than I did. If fact, I'd have welcomed having to earn it. Sounds like fun!

 

Go fix the car and we'll do X. Do the dishes and we'll do Y. Sound hot to me! lol

 

Anticipation is often the best part.

 

 

In all of my LTRs and my marriage, this scenario from the original post has not happened. Not once. I have never changed my affection level from day 1 nor have they changed theirs. We may have just a little less sex than when first meeting, but that's natural, because you are satisfied.

[nofeelings22]

Since LS doesn't have a "trite, petulant whine" section I suppose you're right.

 

 

 

This isn't even a men do it too, issue. I'm more concerned with the fact that the general idea seems to be if a woman sleeps around at some point in her life, she doesn't "deserve" to settle down with a stable partner later on.

 

I just...I don't know, that way of thinking is so odd to me. I'm not saying men have to change the value they place on a minimal number of partners (they don't) but it seems quite ridiculous to sort of base your whole view of someone and what they do or don't deserve around something they could easily just lie about and you have no way to verify.

 

I'm a virgin by the way. Prove me wrong.

 

Agreed. The whole premise here makes little logical or emotional sense.

[xxoo]

Those are just crappy women. I've never been married to or in a long term relationship with any woman who ever slowed down in sex any more than I did. If fact, I'd have welcomed having to earn it. Sounds like fun!

 

Go fix the car and we'll do X. Do the dishes and we'll do Y. Sound hot to me! lol

 

Anticipation is often the best part.

 

 

In all of my LTRs and my marriage, this scenario from the original post has not happened. Not once. I have never changed my affection level from day 1 nor have they changed theirs. We may have just a little less sex than when first meeting, but that's natural, because you are satisfied.

 

Your experience sounds normal to me.

 

The men who consistently have the opposite experience would do well to ask your advice in selecting partners and sustaining a sex life. My H could charge for lessons in this know-how!

[dreamingoftigers]

My husband did a bait&switch too.

We went some sex everyday before the wedding to sex weekly RIGHT AFTER.

On our honeymoon it dropped yo once every ten days.

 

Over the next couple of years he whined about stomach aches and headaches. It went down to about once a month.

 

Earlier this year we were dry for 4.5 months!

 

Going down on me has become an annual thing.

 

Then we separated. Right after he injured his spine. (Legitimately)

Now he's all about loving me and wanting his family.

 

Here's the bitter truth:

if he had put ONE IOTA of effort in our sex life....a need that I made known...the injury would just be a tough fact of life to adjust to.

 

But now he has no sensation down there.

So I am supposed to lock myself in to potential of no future intercourse to someone who spent NINE YEARS showing me how little he valued me, my needs and our sex life?

 

And no he wasn't overworked or overstressed. He sat back and largely had me supporting him for most of those years.

 

He get so pissed off in the morning if his sleep got disrupted by me taking our daughter to school or dayhome, while he slept until noon or two. He wouldn't even put his garbage into the can.

 

Ugh. BS!

 

 

 

Sh*t, that brings back some memories. I never married my ex but the day I sold my apartment, bought a house and put her name on the deeds she flipped the switch and changed the moment the keys were handed over. She didn't even move in until the place was cleaned. Suddenly confessed to a "medical condition" and turned into a selfish, jealous, moody, spiteful, accusatory, bone idle, near frigid nightmare who didn't want to work and spent her days sat on her arse drinking gin and tonics whilst squawking for sports cars, holidays, and more, and more and more whilst doing less and less and less. For four years we'd been living together with no sign of any of that but as soon as her name was on a dotted line.....

 

It was then years of pounding stress from doing the work of two and trying to understand and tolerate her "condition". When we split she told a pack of lies to have me thrown in a cell. Wasn't until I later gained internet access and was able to research her condition that I realised it was a load of horse sh*t.

 

 

My sister was even worse to her husband, quit work, parked her arse in front of the shopping channel, denied him sex for four years and even deadbolted the doors in the evenings to force him into showering outside under a freezing cold hose pipe as she didn't want the oil and grease from his work in the house. She put demand after demand on him whilst refusing to allow him to even sleep next to her as the stress had given him eczema as she didn't want his "leper flakes" in the bed. She eventually had an affair with his best mate, booted her husband from the house, tried to deny him access to the kids and moved his mate in.

 

You never truly know what you are getting involved with until the dotted line is signed.

[Rejected Rosebud]

IDK. But I wouldn't repeat any of this to your girlfriend.

 

Well that will never happen, no worries! Obviously he has no girlfriends!! and no fear of having one anytime soon!!

[Rejected Rosebud]

There are studies showing that a large percentage of women start to lose their sex drive as soon as their biological need for pair bonding is satisfied. So I tend to think us men have our lives sabotaged by biology.

No, it works out perfectly because a matching large percentage of old guys lose their ability to maintain an erection, so it's probably a grand setup for everybody!!

[Rejected Rosebud]

I'm more concerned with the fact that the general idea seems to be if a woman sleeps around at some point in her life, she doesn't "deserve" to settle down with a stable partner later on.

 

I just...I don't know, that way of thinking is so odd to me.:

That's probably because you hang around with smart people.

[NGC1300]

You do realize that what you term a 'walking wallet' and 'baby daddy' IS the traditional definition of a husband back in the good ol' days that you desire to return to, right?

 

Sure, back when 1 modest income was actually enough to raise a family.

 

Besides, in those days the woman tended to stay at home and take care of the kids, cooking, and cleaning etc. So the relationship was much more symbiotic.

 

Today, they want the man to have the prestigious career and income, but only so they can bump up their social status overnight and be seen in nice homes and driving expensive cars.

 

In the "old days" the man came home to a cooked meal. Now he has to wine and dine the woman after he gets out of work.

[Discjockey80]

You know it's interesting...in the Bible, God commands men and women (husbands and wives) not to 'deprive' each other of sex. He 'says' it as a command as part of marriage. This is significant.

 

 

The fact that God has to say it means that its a very common problem among the human race. But that he in his grander design for creation doesn't intend for it to be that way. But mankind being how it is doesn't listen or obey well and thus the problems that arise.

 

 

The sheer truth of the matter is (and I've heard this from some very wise women) is that many women don't fully realize that they are doing a lot of harm to their marriage when they deny their husbands more frequent, enthusiastic intimacy.

 

 

I heard one woman who had a sort of 'awakening' that she realized after many years how harmful this was and when recounting why she did it the matter ultimately boiled down to the fact that she was lazy.

 

 

She admitted it. She had no excuse and it wasn't that her husband was a jerk, bad guy, abusive or uncaring. She said he was attractive, decent, even sexy still but she just kicked back once she got married because she figured it didn't matter anymore. Couple that with her admitting she just bought into a lot of lies and false beliefs about sex, relationships and marriage. She said in the end it was a condition of her heart. She needed to change her perspective and attitude.

 

 

Now, I realize that when their is neglect, abuse, cruelty, etc that's a different matter.

 

 

But she related how she believes that most women in otherwise decent marriages just sit back and take a lot for granted. They don't realize how blessing a man with her sexuality can change his life. She recounted that once their sex life took a turn for the better her husband was more loving, happy, confident, masculine and he even excelled in other areas of life relating to his career.

 

 

That's a lot of power. Women have incredible amounts of power to do good in this area.

 

 

Also she noticed in addition to the relational benefits, she began actually desiring sex itself more.

 

 

So much in this world nowdays focuses on feelings. If we don't feel something we shouldn't be made to do it. Problem is in order to keep a marriage alive sooner or later almost everything has to be 'deliberate'.

 

 

Many in our new progressive culture nowdays despise rational concepts of right and wrong over emotional. Emotions are nice and good but we shouldn't live by them.

 

 

Men can also deny women sex as well. While not as prevalent, I know of instances where this has occurred. It's the same thing and many men report that once they made a deliberate choice to get physical with their wives more often, they wanted it more as well and even had deeper love for their wives.

 

 

Sex is the bond that keeps our marriages alive. We can always have platonic relationships but what sets a marriage apart from those is sex. Plain and simple. It's a good thing.

[carhill]

Why do a lot of women expect MORE for LESS?

 

Because it's human nature to seek the most benefit from the least investment or effort. Gender is essentially irrelevant. Of course, a man will perceive it to be relevant when the benefit is being extracted from him. Again, human nature!

[Mister Zen]

Mister Zen,

I find your OP rather cynical and one-sided.

 

I could quote loads of examples where the genders could be reversed.....

 

Yeah? Well go ahead then. Do it.