Do men avoid settling as women get older?

[Disenchantedly Yours]

That is life. It has been shown that lust and infatuation last up to two years and tends to give way to calmer, friendlier love.

 

Sanman, we get it "that's life", "nothing you can do about it", "shut up and don't talk about any issue because "that's life"". Heck, if you even really felt that way you wouldn't even be on this board. If you really felt that way you wouldn't say alot of the comments you do when it's *you* as a man that experiences issues. If you don't want to talk about social or romantic issues then don't. But stop running around this board with your all encompassing "that's life" comment and expect it to de suede real discussion. We get it..you think life is set in stone in only one way. Then leave and let the rest of us talk about what we want to talk about.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

Or maybe she is ready for kids at 29, or he wants to also wait 5 years, or he wants kids at 70. These are hard to qualify. That said, I did point out earlier that many men like to go a bit slower even in their 30s than women that age prefer.

 

That's not totally true. Alot of my male friends talk about how they don't want to be 40 before having their first kid, that they are getting older, that they are worried cause they are loosing some hair. Men feel the bite just the same. But men are less inclined to admit it becaue of their own insecurities. I don't know any man that I heard say he wants to wait until he is 40 before he starts having a family.

[Beachgirl8]

I would postulate that a man who ONLY has an interest in women significantly younger than him does not possess the depth of character to ever get tO the level of deep, real love.

I'd say the same for women who only have an interest in dating wealthy men.

 

They are called shallow for a reason.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

What is wrong with guys over 50? Are they not attractive enough for Veronica? See how this argument works. We can all throw this back at each other.

 

And lets be honest, that's all you and some of the other guys here are really interested in. You aren't interested in women as people or their struggles or even liking women very much. What you and some of the other guys choose to focus on instead of treating women like they matter is just 'throwing it back at them" because you can't think of anyone outside of yourself.

[Disenchantedly Yours]

DY, your posts strike me as so negative

 

It isn't about doing laundry from young (omg...). It is about LOVE, man!

 

Love is blind. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. When the person you LOVE ages, you simply don't care. They are beautiful to YOU.

 

Come over to the marriage board and ask the long-married guys if they are attracted to their wives....

 

It is negative but that's how it appears XXOO. Maybe the married guys are attracted to their wives but are they only attracted to them becaue they've been with them since they were young? And are they not most likely looking at porn of much younger women inbetween sessions with their wives?

 

It is much harder being a woman in his world and with all that, men still complain about how difficult it is for them. They just flat out don't much care about women beyond what they shallowly want from women.

[zengirl]

Plenty of guys are interested in women as people. Plenty of men are interested in women their own age. Of course, it becomes harder for everyone as masses of people go off the market; that's just a numerical fact. But the only thing applying generalizations this way does is make your life unhappy and tell the universe to reinforce such beliefs by bringing you those kind of men.

 

I believe there are lots of great men out there, and I know lots of great men. If I only believed there were shallow, selfish, petty, horrible men out there, I bet those would be the men I noticed! Just how the mind works. You think about brown things in the room, you suddenly see more brown things and miss all the blue ones.

[Sanman]

Deeper love. Real love.

 

Absolutely!

[Mme. Chaucer]

Plenty of guys are interested in women as people. Plenty of men are interested in women their own age. Of course, it becomes harder for everyone as masses of people go off the market; that's just a numerical fact. But the only thing applying generalizations this way does is make your life unhappy and tell the universe to reinforce such beliefs by bringing you those kind of men.

 

I believe there are lots of great men out there, and I know lots of great men. If I only believed there were shallow, selfish, petty, horrible men out there, I bet those would be the men I noticed! Just how the mind works. You think about brown things in the room, you suddenly see more brown things and miss all the blue ones.

 

That is the truth, zengirl.

 

As we get older, it gets a lot tougher to find a good mate for many reasons. The fact that there are men out there who only want to be with women much younger than themselves is pretty low on the list.

 

As zengirl says, the pool is drastically decreased, and the raging hormones that are at work urging a lot of pairing off in the younger years are not so lively anymore.

 

When we are older, WE find it harder to "settle" if we have learned much at all in our lives. We KNOW what we like, and what is not going to work. When we were younger. I think if we are healthy, we might have learned how to be happy in our own company and be past the idea that we "need" to be married in order to be complete.

 

The "dating younger" thing - it's a preference. As long as I haven't grown attached to somebody, I am perfectly okay with letting anyone who has a strong preference which is not me move on. Also, I have no problem doing the same. No harm, no foul.

[Sanman]

And you are one to be very vocal about that issue Sanman..should we chalk up your opinion and feelings on that to just being bitter? Try to extend women the same curtesy.

 

 

Why would I be bitter about that? I am one of those successful men....it is Dr. Sanman after all. I may not always like it, but don't try and change society though. I simply found a good woman who liked me for a variety of reasons and am happy in my relationship.

[Sanman]

It is negative but that's how it appears XXOO. Maybe the married guys are attracted to their wives but are they only attracted to them becaue they've been with them since they were young? And are they not most likely looking at porn of much younger women inbetween sessions with their wives?

 

It is much harder being a woman in his world and with all that, men still complain about how difficult it is for them. They just flat out don't much care about women beyond what they shallowly want from women.

 

Oh, please qualify that statement. You really do sound like the male virgins on this board.

[Beachgirl8]

Plenty of guys are interested in women as people. Plenty of men are interested in women their own age. Of course, it becomes harder for everyone as masses of people go off the market; that's just a numerical fact. But the only thing applying generalizations this way does is make your life unhappy and tell the universe to reinforce such beliefs by bringing you those kind of men.

 

I believe there are lots of great men out there, and I know lots of great men. If I only believed there were shallow, selfish, petty, horrible men out there, I bet those would be the men I noticed! Just how the mind works. You think about brown things in the room, you suddenly see more brown things and miss all the blue ones.

 

Exactly! There are lots of great men, and great women.

 

The ones who deconstruct the primary value of a member of the opposite sex down to age/ money/ looks are just good examples of the type of people to avoid.

[dasein]

Well, we all know that's what the only thing the guys here care about is themselves

 

Starting in HS, the general value of men runs from senior to freshman, only the cream of the crop freshman and sophomore men get any experience at all with women, few execeptions. This is because of women going for what they want.

 

In college, same thing, the general value of men runs from senior to freshman, junior and senior men find an overabundance of interested women, freshman and sophomores either have to work harder, are the cream of the crop to begin with, or just do with a drastically reduced pool of prospects. Some women start dating older men now, far outside their age range, including professors and others in the college community as a matter of THEIR CHOICE to do so. This is because of women going for what they want.

 

College graduation, early work, women dictate that the age gap divides even further, they accept men who are 5-10 years older, supervisors at work, men with more career establishment and money. For the men who haven't gotten an SO by now, this can be a bleak time for average, normal men. This is the primary time when women are also sowing oats with the "bad boys" and dismissing attention from "boring" men in their own age range and dating market value consistently. This is where angry virgins are created, they realize, "this is BS, why am I continually passed by by women on my level?" This continues throughout the 20s. With few exceptions, men have little innate sexual power and control, women have near complete control and power. This is because of women going for what they want.

 

Then the thirties come, and let the "foot stamping" begin! As the power shifts to something approaching an equal playing field, suddenly it's all about "men are selfish," "men only care about what they want," "men are superficial," "men devalue and degrade older women." All this in response to the hideous prospect of a more EQUAL distribution of sexual power between the sexes, of men having ANY measurable sexual and dating selection power. The rationalizations, guilt trips, stamping and pouting are palpable. Men here and elsewhere start to realize the truth, women today don't want to function in equal environments, they want it all. Zero sum. Any choice or reality of aging that forecloses their options is some oppressive thing that men have done to them, or the result of some bad attitude, or other flaw in men. They fail to be able to conceptualize how WOMEN'S choices for decades, women's going for what THEY want, has been an equal foundation of the given reality. Everything is the fault of faulty men, and if the actual reality doesn't comport with that, they wil literally try to shriek some alternate reality into existence.

 

And as some have said over and over in this thread, "too bad, so sad." If you don't like the given reality, it's certainly your right to complain about it. But doing so without realizing and accepting your own gender's role, not bad behavior, not selfish blameworthy actions, just role in the cultural dynamic we live in is merely rationalization, blameshifting, and laughable hot air. Part of the answer to this thread and all the back and forth is "you made your own bed, now sleep in it." But I suppose the realization of that truth, crystal clear once one thinks about it, is somehow "hatred," or "misogyny?" Bulls-t.

[thatone]

Thanks for posting this.. it definately squares with my experience of online dating... which is why I don't do it anymore.

 

The men there are in hardcore fantasy land. It's not about compatibility for them...

 

Funny thing is... these same guys come here and whine about how low their response rate is on OLD...

 

Attractive women their own age (the ones they'd be most compatible with) won't touch them because these men ooze insecurity. I can't tell you how many men I 'nexted' when I saw their posted age-range or their 'young at heart' BS in their profiles.

 

I'd much rather be 'alone' than deal with a man-boy who needs to date younger to validate his self-worth...

 

You are a very smart and articulate woman... and objectively speaking, attractive too. You are on the right track...

 

the vast majority of women on the dating sites are in fantasy land as well. they get a huge ego boost from the hundreds of messages they get but most never consider the fact that 80% of those guys are morons, liars, married men looking for affairs, etc.

 

when i used the dating sites i didn't apply the theory of messaging everything with a pair of boobs that i would sleep with, i pretty much limited messages to people i had something in common with. as a result my response rate i would guess was around 30%, about 30% of those turned into actual dates. that's not terribly different from the numbers you'll see approaching women on the street.

 

of course the pool is going to be limited outside of major cities and i have 3 to pick from (2 in my area and a third i travel to regularly) so i get why men message EVERYONE to see who bites especially if they live in smaller towns, it makes sense, but it doesn't really give a high likelihood of success, it's just perpetuating delusion (like the average/below average women on the dating sites who sift through those messages every day to check and see if brad pitt has emailed them are perpetuating delusion).

[Metis]

It's undeniable that women, during a certain period in their lives, age faster than men. It's also undeniable that women's fertility declines sooner. And of course, it's true that our culture looks approvingly on relationships between middle-aged and even elderly men and much younger women while treating similar relationships when the genders are reversed as weird or inappropriate. Those are all givens that make it harder for a woman in her mid-thirties to "settle down" than a woman in her early twenties.

 

However, if we are truly serious about being steely-eyed realists and staying out of the fantasy land, let's not pretend that men's asses age like wine, either. It's a fact, for example, that the rates of male sexual dysfunction rise sharply after the age of 40 and the rise accelerates across older age brackets. In post-menopausal women (and that's women who are generally in their 50's and 60's, not in their 30's or 40's -- which shows that in some respects, women actually age slower than men), sexual dysfunction is usually easily fixed with estrogen therapy. Treating sexual dysfunction in men, however, is complicated, fraught with serious side effects and generally less successful. So there is that.

 

Latest research also shows that, contrary to previously held opinions, advanced paternal age is a significant factor in certain severe birth defects, including Down's Syndrome, cognitive disabilities and autism-spectrum disorders. (And by "advanced paternal age", we mean 35+.) So, while a man in his 30's or 40's may be better able to support small children than a man his 20's, a young woman in her prime child-bearing years would be ill-advised to marry a significantly older man if having healthy children is a priority. So there is that.

 

There is also evidence that the male organism begins to undergo certain physiological changes around the late-30's mark that make a steady increase in the accumulation of abdominal fat virtually unavoidable. In other words, men get fat, and continue to get fat, unless they take drastic measures, which entail steadily increasing one's level and duration of exercise -- incidentally, as one gets older and less capable of strenuous exercise. And with weight gain, of course, come hypertension and diabetes -- conditions that hit men like a tzunami wave in their early to mid-50's. These conditions, too, entail sexual dysfunction (not to mention significantly higher rates of physical disability), and medications used to treat them frequently cause impotence. So there is that.

 

Note, that when I talk about weight gain in men, I'm not just talking about physical attractiveness, so any talk of women being willing to settle down with ugly men would be simply irrelevant here. Weight gain in middle age is associated with really, really bad and incurable health problems that lead to disability and impotence, and are a royal pain in the tukhos to deal with.

 

Sure, you can find older men who are sexually healthy and very fit. However, such men are exceptional. They are the way they are despite their age, not because of it -- and that's exactly the distinction that all those men who gloat about what big shots they are or will be in middle age fail to grasp.

 

In other words, men in their 40's and older have to contend with their own package of disadvantages, for which their supposed "status" (a vague term if I ever saw one) hardly provides an adequate offset. And so, if you are a man of 40 and will not even consider settling down with a woman over 25 -- hey, that's your business, and no one is in a position to judge. However, it may be a little harder to get a 25-year-old to settle down with you than you may imagine (as opposed to her being willing to **** you recreationally), and even if you succeed, the resulting marriage and family life may not be what you expect. Whatever it is, however, there is no reason to gloat over a woman of 35 being unable to settle down. Certain posters' glee over it has a distinct the-lady-doth-protest-too-matchish quality that suggests they have a vested interest in this woman's life not panning out; which wouldn't be the case if they only cared about women in their 20's.

[Quiet Storm]

Physical attraction is a tricky thing.

 

Right or wrong, our looks are often what attract a man to us. Twenty years ago, when my husband & I became a couple (me 15, him 17), my looks did play a big part in why he was attracted to me.

 

My looks may have hooked him, but my personality, the love we share, our history, the family we have built...that's what keeps him here. He is bonded to me, we are "us". A unit, a team ...circa 1991.

 

He's still very physically attracted to me. He loves watching me get dressed, he can't keep his hands off me. I take good care of myself, exercise and diet, because I was lucky to get good looks and don't want to waste them by letting myself go.

 

But I know my looks will fade eventually. So does he. And that's okay, because it's about so much more than looks now. The fact that my looks are what initially attracted him, doesn't mean that he will dump me when I age. The fact that he watches porn sometimes, doesn't devalue his love for me. The fact that he (and I) can appreciate the sight of a beautiful women...does not lessen his love or attraction for me.

 

I asked my husband about his. He said that when he started going out with me, he felt so lucky and proud that I was his girlfriend. He remembers skipping home from my house singing The Police "Walking on the Moon" because being with me literally made him feel like he was walking on the moon.

 

He said that feeling is still there. That he still feels so lucky to have me, even though I'm not the hottest girl in the neigborhood anymore. That he knows I'll get wrinkly and old...but he's fine with that and til death do us part. He is proud of us, and our relationship, and our family, and that pride doesn't lessen as I age...he's my mate for life.

 

So then I asked, "If I had met you at 35, instead of 15, would you still feel that way?"

 

Silence.

 

I say, "Tell me the truth, I can handle it."

 

"I would still be very physically attracted to you, but it wouldn't be the same. I would think about all the relationships you would have been in during that time...the other men that had been with you, and that wouldn't make you seem as special"

 

So I do think that for men, a young beautiful woman is a very valuable thing. Not only because of looks, but because to them, youth means you haven't been with as many guys. A sign of a man's insecurity? Yes. It's shallow and a double standard...but a truth nonetheless.

 

So I think when a man marries a young beauty, he often sees her as a treasure, even as she ages. I think most men would stay by her side, until the end...as long as she treats him well, remains faithful and is mentally stable.

 

Is is fair to women who have worked hard on their career, who want to wait until later to have kids, etc? No, it's not fair. They didn't know, nobody told them that men were like this...they were left to figure it out on their own.

 

These truths (men valuing youth and beauty) have been known since the beginning of time. Parents do their daughters a diservice by not being up front about these truths. Life is not a Disney movie where there will be a line of men waiting to marry a woman whenever she decides she is ready.

 

I will be honest with my daughter about how most men are on this subject (and tell my husband not to sugarcoat his talks with her, either.)

 

I will let her decide the path she wants to take in life...with ALL the facts, and not just the rainbow and unicorn version so that it's more palatable.

 

JMO.

[xxoo]

It is negative but that's how it appears XXOO. Maybe the married guys are attracted to their wives but are they only attracted to them becaue they've been with them since they were young? And are they not most likely looking at porn of much younger women inbetween sessions with their wives?

 

It is much harder being a woman in his world and with all that, men still complain about how difficult it is for them. They just flat out don't much care about women beyond what they shallowly want from women.

 

It's because they LOVE them--the individual.

 

I don't think my grandparents look at other people in their 80s and 90s and think they are incredibly beautiful, but I am sure that my grandfather looks at my grandmother and thinks she is beautiful. And not for what she does for him, but for who she is.

 

About porn--you should broaden your horizons. Go to a major site and look at the "mature" or "wife" or "milf" links. Read the comments. There is a lot of appreciation for real women, and you can find that evidence if you look for it.

 

Other than that, I cosign Zengirl's post! I know a lot of awesome men, who are wildly attracted to women over 35

[norajane]

These truths (men valuing youth and beauty) have been known since the beginning of time. Parents do their daughters a diservice by not being up front about these truths.

 

Do you truly believe girls do not know that men value youth and beauty? They are bombarded with that message constantly. Women's magazines are filled with teenage models, all of whom have been airbrushed to perfection. You will rarely find a woman on television or movies that is not young, unless she is botoxed and filler-ed and face-lifted to hell, or she is the "old crone" in the story.

 

I'm curious why you think girls don't absorb this information from, well, everywhere, throughout their lives.

[Metis]

Is is fair to women who have worked hard on their career, who want to wait until later to have kids, etc? No, it's not fair. They didn't know, nobody told them that men were like this...they were left to figure it out on their own.

 

Thing is, Quiet Storm, it's a question of priorities and trade-offs. We all accept certain risks for preferred benefits. You were lucky to marry a man who was good to you; not all men are like that. Just because a man met his wife when she was a child doesn't mean he'll stay with her forever; stories are a dime a dozen where men move up in the world and then upgrade to "better" wives. Statistics also don't bear out what you claim: it is a well-known fact that the age of the parties is, perhaps, the surest statistical predictor of their likelihood of divorce, women's ages in particular. The younger the woman at the time of marriage, the greater the likelihood that the marriage will end in divorce.

 

And so -- it would be perfectly reasonable for a woman to pursue a career and to put off having children with the understanding that settling down may be harder in the future. Relationships are a very important part of life, but they aren't everything.

 

These truths (men valuing youth and beauty) have been known since the beginning of time. Parents do their daughters a diservice by not being up front about these truths. Life is not a Disney movie where there will be a line of men waiting to marry a woman whenever she decides she is ready.

I think women are just as capable of distinguishing between life and a Disney movie as men are capable of distinguishing between life and Lord of the Rings. Most people are not morons. I don't know what exactly you want parents to teach to girls -- not to cultivate their minds, because that's not important to men? Not to pursue education, because it might interfere with you marrying at 16? Not to undertake any endeavor in life that's not relationship-oriented, because women's lives should revolve exclusively around relationships? Marry as soon as possible, because otherwise no one will ever love you? That's exactly the kind of upbringing I had. And you know what? Certainly, some **** in life may be just a fact of reality, but you don't have to accept it. Live on your own terms, I say, and cultivate yourself; if some man has a problem with it -- don't let his opinion determine the course of your life. I mean, men deserve nothing less, right?

 

I will be honest with my daughter about how most men are on this subject (and tell my husband not to sugarcoat his talks with her, either.)

My mother used to tell me: "Men like adorable idiots. Don't be an idiot, but make sure to appear like one. It flatters men's egos."

[Metis]

Do you truly believe girls do not know that men value youth and beauty? They are bombarded with that message constantly. Women's magazines are filled with teenage models, all of whom have been airbrushed to perfection. You will rarely find a woman on television or movies that is not young, unless she is botoxed and filler-ed and face-lifted to hell, or she is the "old crone" in the story.

 

I'm curious why you think girls don't absorb this information from, well, everywhere, throughout their lives.

 

^^^ THIS.

 

We all know women are valued primarily for their bodies and our minds are held to be a nuisance. Do we really have to reinforce that message?

[xxoo]

Marrying young isn't always a great choice for women. A lot of women who marry young are miserable later.

 

I married young. It was the right choice for me, and I am very confident that my H is still wildly attracted to me now that I'm near 40.

 

But I would not encourage a young girl to marry young for that reason. There are many paths to happiness, and many paths to relationship success. I'm focusing on teaching my children to be caring and authentic--and recognize the same in others. I'm hopeful

[Quiet Storm]

I'm curious why you think girls don't absorb this information from, well, everywhere, throughout their lives.

 

I think girls absorb that looks and youth are important to men, but I don't think most women would consider 30-35 as being past their prime (as a lot of men do). At 35, I don't feel past my prime...but a lot of men would see me that way.

 

I think many women assume that after school and career building, that there will be many men available in their age group. In reality, many of these men are already in relationships or looking for younger women.

 

In addition, I don't think a lot of women really get how the number of previous partners can devalue them (in a man's eyes). They see men having many FWB's and assume that they won't be judged for their FWB's, when they are.

 

These are hard truths that I think young girls need to know. Not so they can find a man early, but so they they can weigh the risks and benefits and make their choices with ALL the facts.

 

It doesn't have to be man or career. I got my education and built my career while I was married.

[Negative Nancy]

"I would still be very physically attracted to you, but it wouldn't be the same. I would think about all the relationships you would have been in during that time...the other men that had been with you, and that wouldn't make you seem as special"

 

So I do think that for men, a young beautiful woman is a very valuable thing. Not only because of looks, but because to them, youth means you haven't been with as many guys. A sign of a man's insecurity? Yes. It's shallow and a double standard...but a truth nonetheless.

 

Indeed it is a very nasty double standard. Because I'm sure the women he would have been with would not count whatsoever towards his own"specialness". And let me get this straight, he watches porn where girls are presented that have been with lots of men and gets off on THAT, yet at the same time he sees fit to make a nasty judgement on a woman at 35 that might have a few sexual partners? Madonna-Whore-complex much? If men wanted these so-called "pure, special women" that have waited just for him and have let no other men touch her until HE came along, as you claim, then why are so many men watching porn and even putting those porn girls above their own SOs when these exact porn girls are anything BUT virgins? and they claim it's always men that are so much more logical, yeah yeah....

 

Do you truly believe girls do not know that men value youth and beauty? They are bombarded with that message constantly. Women's magazines are filled with teenage models, all of whom have been airbrushed to perfection. You will rarely find a woman on television or movies that is not young, unless she is botoxed and filler-ed and face-lifted to hell, or she is the "old crone" in the story.

 

I'm curious why you think girls don't absorb this information from, well, everywhere, throughout their lives.

 

exactly. we hear this alot, we already know men only value youth and beauty. if women are so worthless after a certain age, i wonder what all of these men here think of their own mothers, sisters, nieces...and if they would pat their own dad on the back if he expressed such views many of the men here express towards women over 35? would it fly well with them if a stranger called their mothers or sisters a nasty, dried up old skank?

 

hey metis, good postings, alot of truths in them.

Edited November 10, 2011 by Negative Nancy

[EasyHeart]

Starting in HS, the general value of men runs from senior to freshman, only the cream of the crop freshman and sophomore men get any experience at all with women, few execeptions. This is because of women going for what they want.

 

In college, same thing, the general value of men runs from senior to freshman, junior and senior men find an overabundance of interested women, freshman and sophomores either have to work harder, are the cream of the crop to begin with, or just do with a drastically reduced pool of prospects. Some women start dating older men now, far outside their age range, including professors and others in the college community as a matter of THEIR CHOICE to do so. This is because of women going for what they want.

 

College graduation, early work, women dictate that the age gap divides even further, they accept men who are 5-10 years older, supervisors at work, men with more career establishment and money. For the men who haven't gotten an SO by now, this can be a bleak time for average, normal men. This is the primary time when women are also sowing oats with the "bad boys" and dismissing attention from "boring" men in their own age range and dating market value consistently. This is where angry virgins are created, they realize, "this is BS, why am I continually passed by by women on my level?" This continues throughout the 20s. With few exceptions, men have little innate sexual power and control, women have near complete control and power. This is because of women going for what they want.

 

Then the thirties come, and let the "foot stamping" begin! As the power shifts to something approaching an equal playing field, suddenly it's all about "men are selfish," "men only care about what they want," "men are superficial," "men devalue and degrade older women." All this in response to the hideous prospect of a more EQUAL distribution of sexual power between the sexes, of men having ANY measurable sexual and dating selection power. The rationalizations, guilt trips, stamping and pouting are palpable. Men here and elsewhere start to realize the truth, women today don't want to function in equal environments, they want it all. Zero sum. Any choice or reality of aging that forecloses their options is some oppressive thing that men have done to them, or the result of some bad attitude, or other flaw in men. They fail to be able to conceptualize how WOMEN'S choices for decades, women's going for what THEY want, has been an equal foundation of the given reality. Everything is the fault of faulty men, and if the actual reality doesn't comport with that, they wil literally try to shriek some alternate reality into existence.

 

And as some have said over and over in this thread, "too bad, so sad." If you don't like the given reality, it's certainly your right to complain about it. But doing so without realizing and accepting your own gender's role, not bad behavior, not selfish blameworthy actions, just role in the cultural dynamic we live in is merely rationalization, blameshifting, and laughable hot air. Part of the answer to this thread and all the back and forth is "you made your own bed, now sleep in it." But I suppose the realization of that truth, crystal clear once one thinks about it, is somehow "hatred," or "misogyny?" Bulls-t.

I wouldn't frame it so antagonistically, but this is basically right. Women generally have a dating advantage in their teens and twenties, men in their thirties and forties. It don't know if it's fair or unfair, but it's reality. I think it's interesting, too, that a significant number of female posters have decided to take the "old men are worthless" tack. How is that different from what you're complaining about?

 

That having been said, I think it's pretty silly for anyone (male or female) to base their choice of dating partner on a single criterion like age. That's no different than saying "I only date blondes" or "I only date people between 5'9" and 6'1"" or "I only date people who wear size 8 shoes". Besides, I know really hot women in their 40s and homely ones in their twenties. Youth doesn't always correlate with attractiveness.

 

There seems to be a tendency in this forum to look for things we can't control as an excuse for not finding a partner. It's appealing because it lets people avoid responsibility for not attracting the right people. If we can rationalize that "Men only like young women" or "Women only like rich men" or "Women won't date me because I'm not 6'7"", then we can tell ourselves that there's nothing we can do about our lack of dates, it's not our fault, and it's just not fair. I think it's better to take responsibility for ourselves and acknowledge that if we're not attracting people it's our fault and we need to fix it.

[Quiet Storm]

I think women are just as capable of distinguishing between life and a Disney movie as men are capable of distinguishing between life and Lord of the Rings. Most people are not morons. I don't know what exactly you want parents to teach to girls -- not to cultivate their minds, because that's not important to men? Not to pursue education, because it might interfere with you marrying at 16? Not to undertake any endeavor in life that's not relationship-oriented, because women's lives should revolve exclusively around relationships? Marry as soon as possible, because otherwise no one will ever love you? That's exactly the kind of upbringing I had. And you know what? Certainly, some **** in life may be just a fact of reality, but you don't have to accept it. Live on your own terms, I say, and cultivate yourself; if some man has a problem with it -- don't let his opinion determine the course of your life. I mean, men deserve nothing less, right?

 

I would never discourage a woman from being educated or cultivating herself.

 

However, you can get educated and cultivate yourself, while you are in a relationship. It doesn't have to be: Go to college, get a job, have fun being single, meet a man.

 

I just want to give my daughter all the facts. Even the ugly ones that I wish weren't true.

 

I like my career and am proud of it and my accomplishments, but it doesn't hold a candle to the pride I feel in my family.

 

As I age, I see what really matters to me. My family and children give me more joy than my career. Before I had kids, I never would've thought that.

 

I don't expect that my daughter will feel the same.

 

I just don't want her to be sitting there with her degrees and a dream job, and longing to be a mom with time running out.

[LexiB]

Can you not understand that maintaining a 15 year old relationship with the 35 year old mother of your kids is fundamentally different from contemplating starting a relationship with a 35 year old woman who has spent the last 15 years fooling around with other guys?

 

Ew.

 

Some of you men really need to get off your high horses. A lot of you, like this guy quoted, are talking as if it's a given that the floodgates of young, nubile p-y are just going to open up to you as soon as you hit middle age.

 

WRONG.

 

123321, a sentiment quite similar to what you posted can be used to explain exactly why - contrary to what you seem to expect - most 20-somethings will not be chomping at the bit for the chance to *SERIOUSLY* date a man 40+. Unless you consider being used as a human debit card a "serious" relationship.

 

The "she's used up/been around the block too many times/why should I settle when I can get the same thing in a younger body" isn't a mentality exclusive to "distinguished" gentlemen; the very women you hope to target will be viewing you with the same side eye.

 

True story. Annnnd coming from a tall, attractive, size 4, 20-something who deals with older men with this type of entitlement complex every day.

 

Food for thought.