sigh...update on OKC guy

[shadowplay]

As you'll recall we had our scrabble date set for last night.

 

Our predate texting was revealing in some ways, so I'll include it. Basically, I'd like feedback on whether I was overreacting or jumping to conclusions at certain points.

 

By 6:45 he still hadn't contacted me to confirm. Finally, I sent him a text: "So...what are we doing?" He wrote back: "I thought you were picking this one."

 

This bothered me, since I was hoping he'd take some initiative or it'd be a mutual effort -- I was the one to suggest scrabble when we first talked about the date. I wrote back: "Is there anything you'd like to do?" And he replied: "you suggested scrabble/boggle; I enjoy both games." I wrote: "Ok, when/where?" 45 minutes went by and he hadn't responded. It was now close to 8. I texted: "how about _____ cafe?" No response. It was nerve wracking for me, because after every text it seemed entirely possible that I'd never hear from him again.

 

Finally twenty minutes later: "Finishing up dinner now. I just have a small travel scrabble game here and bananagrams." I didn't understand why he evaded my cafe suggestion. I was concerned he didn't want to go out with me, that he just wanted to get me to his place with as little fuss as possible. But, because I've been trying to nab my negative thoughts, I chided myself for being overly cynical.

 

Let me say that I knew I wasn't going to have sex with him tonight. Not only was I not feeling quite ready, it wasn't even an option because I have my period. This fortunately gave me a legit excuse. So I felt comfortable with going to his place, since I knew it couldn't get past a certain physical level. My only concern is he'd think I was making up the period thing, and consider me a tease. But I asked a guy friend, and he said it was fine, and he should understand.

 

I was hoping he'd be cool with the cafe idea, so we could focus on just getting to know each other. In other words, I was open to either place but I wanted to see which he would choose since it might help me better understand how he viewed our interaction. That's why I was a bit disappointed when he told me to do all the planning.

 

I sent him a text that said we could play the game at either x cafe or at his place. He responded: "we can just do it here. I need to tidy up a bit first, but whenever you want to come over is fine."

 

I wrote: "want to rent a movie?" (he lives a block from a movie store). He replied: "I have trouble knowing what you'd like to watch; do you want to pick one up on your way over?" I was getting increasingly frustrated as he seemed reluctant to put in any effort. Me: "I don't have a membership (which is true). I could always give you some suggestions?" Him: "I do not either." Me: "OK, nevermind then."

 

I waited another 1/2 an hour to get back to him, as I mulled over whether to even go. I decided that if I did go, it would only be to have a good time and to see if I liked him. I was trying to figure out whether I was capable of that despite my irritation from our text conversation. Do you guys think it was reasonable for me to be annoyed, btw?

 

Finally, I psyched myself up for it and went. The thought I took with me was that I would just observe his behavior and decide if I liked him. I'd think about it as me giving him a chance, rather than the reverse (how I'd usually view it).

 

When I got to his building it was 10:20. I texted him that I was waiting on the bench outside. He told me his apartment number and that he'd buzz me up. I was disappointed that he didn't just meet me downstairs. Overreaction? He also didn't wait for me in the hallway, or have his door propped open, which I thought would have been the polite gesture. But again, maybe I'm being silly. I don't know the etiquette.

 

He was watching ESPN when I arrived. I joined him on the couch and he made a bit of chit chat, and asked me some questions about my classes. I asked him if he had anything to drink (was hoping it would relax me). He offered some wine. Btw, I had "pregamed" with some vodka before I left. Not much, but enough to calm my nerves some.

 

We played boggle and then scrabble (one game each), and I pummeled him at both. I was surprised, because he said he was great at scrabble, but then again I've never lost the game to anyone in real life. After we finished, I suggested we watch a movie on tv. He offered something on demand, and we sat through a two hour, awful sci-fi thriller that neither of us had heard of. We sat with our arms side by side on the couch, just barely touching, but he didn't make a move for most of the movie. Finally, at the end, he took my hand or put his hand on my leg, I can't remember. It was 2am now. I was getting sleepy. At some point he said: "I should get to bed soon." I was thinking, I don't get this guy. If he's hinting that he wants me to leave, then why did he invite me over in the first place? We were still holding each other lightly. I kissed him, and we started making out. He seemed into it.

 

He asked me if I wanted to lie down, and when I agreed, he led us to his room. We got into his bed, kissing, but he wasn't pushy or aggressive at all. If anything, he seemed very respectful compared to other guys. When he started lightly fumbling with my pants, I told him that I had my period. He said, "OK," in his soft, accepting voice. He actually didn't sound annoyed, so I was relieved. Then he just wrapped his arms around me, and drowsily smiled at my face. I said to him, "Do you want me to go?" He said: "I need to get to sleep, but you're more then welcome to stay." I told him I'd probably stay until the morning. I woke up at 6:30, and I quietly put on my clothes. I hugged his back a bit and then told him I was leaving. He said, "OK," but didn't even say goodbye or kiss me. (Then again, I didn't really either, but I was his guest, and I did at least gently stroke his back before I left.)

 

I still don't know what to make of it. Before the date I was worried he was just interested in keeping me around as an easy lay, but his hesitation to make a first move and his polite and somewhat passive behavior when we were in bed didn't seem to fit. On the other hand, he didn't seem incredibly excited to have me there, or interested in getting to know me better, but it's so hard to tell with him because of his shyness. So I left his place even more confused than before.

 

I had vowed to wait for him to contact me again, if he ever would, but at noon today I sent him a one sentence, friendly im about the silly scrabble dream i had last night, with a smiley face attached to the end. He didn't respond.

 

I do like him overall. He just confuses me. I'm still trying to make sense of what happened last night.

 

I bet I won't ever hear from him again. I've lost whatever mojo I once had with guys. I think I'm done with online dating.

[Untouchable_Fire]

I wrote: "want to rent a movie?" (he lives a block from a movie store). He replied: "I have trouble knowing what you'd like to watch; do you want to pick one up on your way over?" I was getting increasingly frustrated as he seemed reluctant to put in any effort. Me: "I don't have a membership (which is true). I could always give you some suggestions?" Him: "I do not either." Me: "OK, nevermind then."

 

Bull. He has a membership or could easily get one, but just does not want to put out any money or effort on you.

 

At some point he said: "I should get to bed soon." I was thinking, I don't get this guy. If he's hinting that he wants me to leave, then why did he invite me over in the first place? We were still holding each other lightly. I kissed him, and we started making out. He seemed into it. He asked me if I wanted to lie down, and when I agreed, he led us to his room.

 

He basically just said "Put out or get out"... and you respond with "make out"... and eventually gave him neither...

 

We got into his bed, kissing, but he wasn't pushy or aggressive at all. If anything, he seemed very respectful compared to other guys. When he started lightly fumbling with my pants, I told him that I had my period. He said, "OK," in his soft, accepting voice. He actually didn't sound annoyed,

 

He was VERY annoyed! But has no emotional attachment to you, so it didn't bother him.

 

He is a very passive aggressive guy.

 

Forget about him. He doesn't really like you, but wont turn down easy sex. He is probably telling his friends right now about how crazy you are!

[Cracker Jack]

I guess once he found out you were on your period, he didn't care if you were there or not at that point. I think you need to seriously consider forgetting about this guy.

[shadowplay]

He is probably telling his friends right now about how crazy you are!

 

Did I really act crazy on this date? I thought I was OK.

[shadowplay]

...........................

[USMCHokie]

Ok...wow, all I can say is that this guy is just a turd...all of his behavior could be explained by any or all of the following:

 

(1) He sucks at life and/or at dating. Seriously...? He just buzzed you up into the apartment...?

 

(2) He is not at all interested. If I knew I was going to spend time with a girl for the evening, I would NOT have eaten ahead of time...sharing a meal is always something I would want to do on a date... And you may be right, he might be trying to avoid going out in public with you...

 

(3) He is just lazy. I have a feeling that if you hadn't sent that text at 6:45, you wouldn't have heard from him all night... I don't think he even wanted to leave his place last night...wouldn't go out for food/games...wouldn't walk across the street to rent a damn movie...and wouldn't even f'in step outside to greet you at the door...what a douche...

 

 

Word of advice: Stop texting. Call instead. You could have avoided so much of this bullsh*t if you just had a 5-10 minute phone conversation discussing exactly what you two wanted to do instead of d*cking around with text messages for 3 hours...

 

This guy sucks...LAUNCH...please...you can do so much better...stop blaming yourself for this guy's jackassery...

[shadowplay]

Ok...wow, all I can say is that this guy is just a turd...all of his behavior could be explained by any or all of the following:

 

(1) He sucks at life and/or at dating. Seriously...? He just buzzed you up into the apartment...?

 

(2) He is not at all interested. If I knew I was going to spend time with a girl for the evening, I would NOT have eaten ahead of time...sharing a meal is always something I would want to do on a date... And you may be right, he might be trying to avoid going out in public with you...

 

(3) He is just lazy. I have a feeling that if you hadn't sent that text at 6:45, you wouldn't have heard from him all night... I don't think he even wanted to leave his place last night...wouldn't go out for food/games...wouldn't walk across the street to rent a damn movie...and wouldn't even f'in step outside to greet you at the door...what a douche...

 

 

Word of advice: Stop texting. Call instead. You could have avoided so much of this bullsh*t if you just had a 5-10 minute phone conversation discussing exactly what you two wanted to do instead of d*cking around with text messages for 3 hours...

 

This guy sucks...LAUNCH...please...you can do so much better...stop blaming yourself for this guy's jackassery...

 

Like you think he's afraid of going out in public with me because he thinks I'm too ugly?

[Knittress]

I see what you mean. Through most of that interaction I would've been fuming about being treated like the world's cheapest incall - but then you're describing him as not even being that sexually interested! He might be a cheapskate user like some others are suggesting, but he totally COULD just be socially awkward up the kazoo. Either way... it's kinda a turnoff, right?

 

If I were to give him the benefit of the doubt I'd speculate that maybe he's broke or innocently wanted to get to know you in a more personal setting, but doesn't have the experience to realize that alone in apartment = sexually ambiguous. (I've been, and dated that person, so it's possible) But being a guy, wasn't inclined to dissuade you if you happened to get the wrong impression.

[shadowplay]

part of me just wants to crawl in a hole and hide. I'm trying hard not to internalize, but I feel so undesirable and ugly. Doing this online dating thing took a huge amount of courage for me (given my anxiety and insecurities), and my first experience is already so bad and leaves me feeling worse than before.

 

Yesterday at the restaurant where I work, another creepy cook was hitting on me (this one even older than the other -- probably in his late fifties, early sixties), and a good half a foot shorter than me. Also, really gross with missing teeth. Seriously, the only two guys who have shown any interest in me in the last 5 months are old, creepy, and gross.

 

Why am I never good enough?

[shadowplay]

I just erased him from my phone.

[bayouboi]

Guy seems low interest and you seem too harsh on yourself. Calm down, cheer up, next I say.

[Star Gazer]

I'll be honest, as usual. You have every reason to be concerned.

 

That was by no uncertain terms a "date." There was nothing date-like about it. He waited until after he had dinner to even really entertain the idea of hanging out with you, and was only going to do so at his convenience.

 

I don't think you did anything "crazy" this time, but you did accept some doormat treatment.

 

When he said he was tired and wanted to go to bed, he wasn't asking you to leave. He was hinting that if he wasn't going to get sex, he'd rather go to sleep.

 

But despite thinking he wanted you to leave, YOU made a move and kissed him. Why?? To make him change his mind and want you to stay?? To see if he wanted to have sex with you??

 

You had sex too soon, Shadow. The chase is over for him. His behavior speaks volumes.

 

You're not really into this guy either. Just let it go... NEXT!

[USMCHokie]

Like you think he's afraid of going out in public with me because he thinks I'm too ugly?

 

Oh come on...seriously...?!

[shadowplay]

I'll be honest, as usual. You have every reason to be concerned.

 

That was by no uncertain terms a "date." There was nothing date-like about it. He waited until after he had dinner to even really entertain the idea of hanging out with you, and was only going to do so at his convenience.

 

I don't think you did anything "crazy" this time, but you did accept some doormat treatment.

 

When he said he was tired and wanted to go to bed, he wasn't asking you to leave. He was hinting that if he wasn't going to get sex, he'd rather go to sleep.

 

But despite thinking he wanted you to leave, YOU made a move and kissed him. Why?? To make him change his mind and want you to stay?? To see if he wanted to have sex with you??

 

You had sex too soon, Shadow. The chase is over for him. His behavior speaks volumes.

 

You're not really into this guy either. Just let it go... NEXT!

 

Do you still think it was my behavior on the second date that killed his interest? At this point, I'm not so sure.

[Star Gazer]

Why am I never good enough?

 

I wish that I understood why you feel this way, because objectively speaking you have so much going for you.

 

Remember how you said you were going to approach this "date" as a method to figure out if YOU liked HIM, not the othe way around? (Which was SO AWESOME to read, BTW!) Well, ask yourself: All of those things that irked you (the lame texting, buzzing you up, not wanting to take you out but being lazy about seeing you)...do you like him more than you did before the date? Does he excite you?

[shadowplay]

the thing that's weird to me is assuming he just wanted sex (which I agree with), why didn't he make a move on me earlier in the night? Like if his saying that he needed to go to bed was a "put out or get out" then why didn't he just get physical with me earlier, like when we were watching the movie?

[Star Gazer]

Like you think he's afraid of going out in public with me because he thinks I'm too ugly?

 

Stop this nonsense!!

 

This guy is just lazy, Shadow. He can't be bothered to treat you right because he just doesn't care. He reminds me of a guy from my past who I almost re-dated this summer. He was fine with me coming over to sit around and watch Tosh.0 and drink wine, but he couldn't be bothered to take me on a real date, because in order to do that he'd have to care about whether I stuck around. I was convenient for him. The moment I put my foot down, he made a huge improvement, but then quickly regressed. Why? Because he just wasn't all that interested.

 

Had nothing to do with how pretty or not I was/am, and it has nothing to do with your appearance either. His loss.

[shadowplay]

I wish that I understood why you feel this way, because objectively speaking you have so much going for you.

 

Remember how you said you were going to approach this "date" as a method to figure out if YOU liked HIM, not the othe way around? (Which was SO AWESOME to read, BTW!) Well, ask yourself: All of those things that irked you (the lame texting, buzzing you up, not wanting to take you out but being lazy about seeing you)...do you like him more than you did before the date? Does he excite you?

 

No, I like him a lot less now. Still, the only thing about him this time I liked was his demeanor when he was in bed. He had this quiet, gentleness about him. But I think in retrospect I was completely reading some softness into him that totally wasn't there.

 

I guess I just keep thinking with some other girl he was interested in, he'd be awesome and going all out...like he did before our first date. And that makes me a bit sad. It's like some guys will be great with a girl they like and go into schmuck mode with a girl they have less interest in.

[Sphere]

Why not try an FWB scenario and see how that works?

[USMCHokie]

Why not try an FWB scenario and see how that works?

 

I think we established earlier on that shadow and FWB situations do not peacefully coexist...

[Sphere]

I think we established earlier on that shadow and FWB situations do not peacefully coexist...

 

I wasn't here for that, I think it is the logical solution to this problem and both parties get something out of it. Unless, Shadowplays ends up falling for the person? Is that the problem?

[USMCHokie]

I wasn't here for that, I think it is the logical solution to this problem and both parties get something out of it. Unless, Shadowplays ends up falling for the person? Is that the problem?

 

Yes, emotional attachment from the sexing.

[Star Gazer]

I wasn't here for that, I think it is the logical solution to this problem and both parties get something out of it. Unless, Shadowplays ends up falling for the person? Is that the problem?

 

Even when they did have sex, neither got anything out of it...if you know what I mean. Neither finished.

 

And Shadow, like most women, isn't able to have sex and not catch feelings.

[shadowplay]

Why not try an FWB scenario and see how that works?

 

Nah, I'll just keep obsessing and hoping I can win him over if I enter that. Besides, I've realized that sex without attachment or trust is so flavorless. I think if I ever did consider a FWB, it would have to start explicitly as that. There's something gross and disappointing to me about innocent dating devolving into a FWB, especially when one party is settling for less than they want.

[newdawn]

shadow, i'm sorry, he disrespected you. this guy wants only easy sex from someone who will home deliver. please do not contact again. this one is not formed into a whole human yet, maybe never, but not your worry.

 

many men, even old ugly ones, will be attracted to you. there is nothing wrong with you for that, all men love beauty. you must discern who is your partner in this life. this takes patience, but he will be there for you at the right time. trust.