Do you guys like this kind of porn?

[blair08]

Very true and it reminds me of what Ted Bundy warned us about during his final interview.

 

 

And that would be what?

[Crusoe]

And that would be what?

 

That society needs protecting from itself

[Des]

You've made your own assumptions about what women like. So for you to sit there and try and discredit my point of view on the fact that I am not a man, as if the male perspective is the only one worthy of having any important

 

Here we go again. I'm not, and never was making assumptions of what women like, I never once said "this is what women like". Nor did I make any assumptions or critisisms of their character, unlike you. I hinted that a small amount of women in porn might "love" or "hate" it.

 

women should judge men based on their invested interets and actions. A man that likes hardcore porn, or even a man that spends alot of time looking at regular porn and defending it, has his priorities messed up and women should judge him and what kind of partner he would make or his thoughts on women based on what he is into sexually.

 

Seriously, date women. A lot of men, I would say most, watch porn of some sort or have. You really need to understand that your anti-porn viewpoint is quickly becoming the minority, people aren't so uptight or prudish anymore. Times are changing. You actually believe what type of porn a guy watches indicates what he thinks of women? All I can say to that is you really have some strange views of men, and you come across as very paranoid and insecure.

 

Your statement doesn't even make sense to what I posted. Which was discussing what is abnormal.

 

I'm not even going to bother...

 

What's next? Come on, you want to talk about hardcore porn, lets talk about it. What's the next step? It's certainly not going to stop at the things that are in porn now. It never does.

 

Nothing. This kind of porn is not going in any other direction. Since hardcore pornography first came into light, which in my opinion, was only about ten years ago. They have done this. They have done all that they are really going to do, in terms of "extreme sex". Like I've said, they've already punched them, made them pass out, vomit etc... But that was something entirely different, something that doesn't sell, something that misunderstands the point. It's where the line has been drawn.

 

And how much should women love it then? I guess we should be greatful a man wants to be with us even if he is smacking us and hitting us while he's doing it.

 

Man I wish you could post images on here, so I could post the facepalm image and be done with this.

 

So lets be clear, one of your very first arguements in this post was how could I possibly know what men thought or felt because I wasn't a man myself and I wasn't allowed to make assumptions based on what men choose to be interested in .But it's okay for you to make assumptions about women and what they like or don't like. You just back tracked in yuor own argument here.

 

What am I assuming? I made a few statements, based on my observation of porn as someone who watches it, as well as interviews I've seen with porn stars, as where you've probably never seen one porn movie in your life, and the only people you'll hear out are anti-porn advocates.

 

There is a very small subset of women that actually might enjoy doing it but most women that are healthy and well rounded don't go into the porn industry. Now women that let any man smack, spit on them and treat them like they are worthless has even deeper issues.

 

Now we're making some bold assumptions... Even if a woman openly chooses something, it's still wrong, because she wouldn't choose to do something like that if she was "healthy".

 

Heck, read some interviews with Jemma Jamison.

 

The world's most overrated "retired" softcore porn actress? She was big in the business in the 1990's, before any of this, and she never did anything like this to my knowledge.

 

Absolutley.

 

Good for you, good luck finding somebody who agrees or cares outside of your church group.

 

I like men that want to take action, not sit on their rumps and shrug their shoulder and scratch themselves. But that's just me.

 

Okay...

 

LOL, seriously, you don't even shell out for coffee on yoru dates?

 

Do you?

 

I guess you got to tell yourself whatevre you need to to sleep at night.

 

Same can be said for you, miss.

 

Hate to break your heart Sweetheart but when someone pinches, smacks, gags or spits on you, it doesn't feel good and it stings and can hurt to varying degrees.

 

lmao. What happened to you saying you were "into spanking", is that only of the kind that feels "good"? If you like to play rough, you like to play rough. If you don't, you don't. A small amount of pain will be involved if you're going to smack or spank someone. Not the "oh my god, you gave me a black eye" type of pain, either.

 

I also hate to break your heart but you do realize that the women in porn are paid to project an image right? They aren't paid to make them feels good. They are paid to make it seem like everything a man does them is perfect and wonderful even if he is smacking her around. Please don't buy into the fantasy. That's not real life. It doesn't feel good when a grown adult male with more strength then you wants to smack you to make himself feel good.

 

I have reason to believe you're not reading any of my posts.

 

A smack is a smack... I've seen porns where the guy asks her to keep smacking him back and spitting back in his face.

 

And I don't understand it. I don't understand why men want to abuse women.

 

Bingo. That's all you really need to say, it's obvious this cannot be explained to you, you cannot see it for what it really is, or else you're just hoping to hear the answer you want to hear.

Edited November 4, 2009 by Des

[Jersey Shortie]

Ted Bundy was a pathological liar who, encouraged by James Dobson (of Focus on the Family), tried to slough off the blame for his crimes on pornography. It was a cynical ploy to save his own life.

 

Andrea Yates drowned five of her children because she thought God wanted her to. Mentally unbalanced people can be set off by anything. Or should we ban the Bible as well as well as porn?

 

Oh yeah, there are people in any sector that can be extremists. And I am not saying every man that looks at porn is going to rape, kill or hurt a woman. But there are actual real live studies that link hardcore porn use to men that have committed major crimes.

 

---------------------------------------------------------

 

Here we go again. I'm not, and never was making assumptions of what women like, I never once said "this is what women like". Nor did I make any assumptions or critisisms of their character, unlike you. I hinted that a small amount of women in porn might "love" or "hate" it

 

LOL, you infact did say women like it, several times. If you don't remember I can go back and swift through the comments to tell you were you said it.

 

And that's very pc of you to not make any kind of assumptions or critizims of people's characters based on what they are into but it's completely unrealistic and we both know it's not evey true. Maybe you don't make them about porn because you seem to have extra sympathy for porn use. But I am sure you make many conclusions about women based on what they prove to be invested or interested in.

 

And honestly, women should totally make conclusions about men who show what they are invested and interested in.

 

Seriously, date women. A lot of men, I would say most, watch porn of some sort or have. You really need to understand that your anti-porn viewpoint is quickly becoming the minority, people aren't so uptight or prudish anymore. Times are changing. You actually believe what type of porn a guy watches indicates what he thinks of women? All I can say to that is you really have some strange views of men, and you come across as very paranoid and insecure.

 

I've had other people respond to me in the same way. "date women if you don't like!" Wahwah. As if to insinuate that men can't be men without looking at porn. I think this is actually an insecure emotional response to something men know is a weakness for them and not one to be proud of.

 

Again, you pull out your own assumptions while previously you prattled on about how there shouldn't be made judgements on men for their porn use. But again, it's okay for you to judge me and say I am a prude because I actually dare to question how men can feel about women who enjoy porn that's there to degrade and abuse them.

 

Am I paranoid? No. What I am is a girl in the 21st century living in an area where the male population has a fantasy world at their finger tips the minute they want it and are infact relying on it more heavily then ever before and alot of that fantasy world is about setting up uprealistic standards about how women should look at act to be sexy. I'm sorry you can't open up your mind enough to admit to that. Am I insecure? For sure I am insecurea bout some things. Everyone of us is. That does not embarress me or change the valid points I make here. Am I insecure about pornography? Yeap. I, and most women out there don't live up to the ideals and standards men have set for us. We fail. So men can turn to porn though where they can look at and pretend they are with the type of womem they really want to be with. Which apparently is 18 year old girls with implants being gagged or other heavily abusive acts. You are darn right I question that.

 

Nothing. This kind of porn is not going in any other direction. Since hardcore pornography first came into light, which in my opinion, was only about ten years ago. They have done this. They have done all that they are really going to do, in terms of "extreme sex". Like I've said, they've already punched them, made them pass out, vomit etc... But that was something entirely different, something that doesn't sell, something that misunderstands the point. It's where the line has been drawn.

 

Well a guess you have a million years of change and evolution not on your side. Because the current equation makes no bones about the fact that things "progress". Even if that progression is not positive. If there are things like hitting women, choking them and men trying to tell themselves that women love this, I can't even imagine what is going to become the "norm" for the future and how twisted our minds will be. The internet is fairly new and we have yet to see generations of young boys who grew up with it since they were born and how their interent exposure has changed them. And lets be honest, men today look at more porn more then ever. It's pretty sad.

That's somethiong you won't touch or deny.

 

Man I wish you could post images on here, so I could post the facepalm image and be done with this.

 

That's because you can't think of anything to say.

 

 

What am I assuming? I made a few statements, based on my observation of porn as someone who watches it, as well as interviews I've seen with porn stars, as where you've probably never seen one porn movie in your life, and the only people you'll hear out are anti-porn advocates

 

What kind of interviews where these? Because you can't honest think that a por star is going to give a real honest completely unbared interview and defame the exact industry she is trying to make money in right? I hope your not that naive.

 

And yeap, I hav seen a porn movie. when I first struggled with this issue and learned that men spend alot of time valuing their porn, I looked at it online to get a better idea of what men liked and hoped to gain insite.

 

The people that will hear me are people with logical thinking skills. There is alot of merit in what I say, even if you are someone who watches porn. And I know porn watchers that have told me I have some good points.

 

 

The world's most overrated "retired" softcore porn actress? She was big in the business in the 1990's, before any of this, and she never did anything like this to my knowledge.

 

Who cares if she was big in the 90s and was "softcore"? She talks about alot of abuse in her personal life that lead her to the business and she talks about the abuse within the business of women.

 

 

lmao. What happened to you saying you were "into spanking", is that only of the kind that feels "good"? If you like to play rough, you like to play rough. If you don't, you don't. A small amount of pain will be involved if you're going to smack or spank someone. Not the "oh my god, you gave me a black eye" type of pain, either.

 

I am in to spanking. And believe it or not, I do like more dominate men. But what goes on between men and my partner that loves me, is VASTLY different then what happens in pornos. It's the difference between a man giving an expensive present to his gf of a long time and him giving one to some girl he just met that he thought was hot. The gf isn't using him for his money, the other girl is.

 

But again, there is nothing in choking or spitting or hitting women in porn that is there because "women love it" or because they want to bring so much pleasure to women. We both know that.

 

Bingo. That's all you really need to say, it's obvious this cannot be explained to you, you cannot see it for what it really is, or else you're just hoping to hear the answer you want to hear.

 

Take your own advice.

[JackJack]

"But again, there is nothing in choking or spitting or hitting women in porn that is there because "women love it" or because they want to bring so much pleasure to women. We both know that".

 

 

This is correct. Why? Because they are in porn due to low self worth and for the money. Yes, low self worth comes first. Chances are if they had any self worth, they wouldn't seek this kind of thing out to begin with. Most porn stars stories are usually the same things or reasons why they got into it.

[Des]

Oh yeah, there are people in any sector that can be extremists. And I am not saying every man that looks at porn is going to rape, kill or hurt a woman. But there are actual real live studies that link hardcore porn use to men that have committed major crimes.

 

And I'm not saying every woman who reads and the bible is going to drown her children in the bathtub, but studies have shown...

 

And that's very pc of you

 

Maybe you don't make them about porn because you seem to have extra sympathy for porn use.

 

No, I don't just immediately formulate opinions on people who I don't know personally, therefor cannot truly judge the character of. However, having seen enough of the way you think and react, I feel comfortable in making a few assessments of your character, at least addressing the way you have come across here, which is judgmental, selfish, close-minded, paranoid, insecure and sheltered. I cannot keep responding to the same ridiculous, over the top, questions and comments you make about how you think men believe women are worthless, without believe these things about you at this point.

 

I think this is actually an insecure emotional response to something men know is a weakness for them and not one to be proud of.

 

Men have more of a weakness for sex... even before porn existed. That's a fact, I don't even think that's ever disputed. Have you ever seen those shows were attractive women can get men to buy them expensive items simply using sex appeal? Sex is a weakness for men, and women can and often do exploit it.

 

Again, you pull out your own assumptions while previously you prattled on about how there shouldn't be made judgements on men for their porn use. But again, it's okay for you to judge me and say I am a prude because I actually dare to question how men can feel about women who enjoy porn that's there to degrade and abuse them.

 

If you actively try an avoid watching porn and make generalizations about an entire sex for doing it, you are a prude.

 

Seriously, making an assumption of how an entire sex must feel about the other based on an action they take, or making an assumption on an individual based on that minority viewpoint. Which is the more ridiculous thing to do?

 

setting up uprealistic standards about how women should look at act to be sexy. I, and most women out there don't live up to the ideals and standards men have set for us. We fail.

 

Which apparently is 18 year old girls with implants being gagged or other heavily abusive acts. You are darn right I question that.

 

What's naive, is thinking that standards are actually being "set" by this porn, thinking that men actually think that reality is the same as porn. I've said it before, but I must say it again. We don't. We don't expect this, we don't demand it, most of us don't even dare ask, as if a little communication is so wrong.

 

No, we don't all have fixations on breasts, unrealistic looking women, or want women to remain 18 indefinitely. You've brought that up several times, leading me to believe maybe one of your biggest insecurities is your age. Men like all women, porn does not change that. I for one find women much older than me to be attractive... I'm not obsessed with breasts, nor do I like to see unrealistic looking women in porn.

 

The internet is fairly new and we have yet to see generations of young boys who grew up with it since they were born and how their interent exposure has changed them. And lets be honest, men today look at more porn more then ever. It's pretty sad.

That's somethiong you won't touch or deny.

 

Actually, we have seen that generation, they're already here. Anyone under the age of roughly 25 has grown up in the age of Internet porn, the age of "hardcore" porn. Nobody that young has ever known any different from it at their fingertips. Where is the fabric of society beginning to unravel due to this? And no, the answer is not in the fact of this type of porn's very existence.

 

That's because you can't think of anything to say.

 

Due to your inability to understand as indicated by your responses.

 

What kind of interviews where these? Because you can't honest think that a por star is going to give a real honest completely unbared interview and defame the exact industry she is trying to make money in right? I hope your not that naive.

 

Of course, some of them share their critisisms of certain acts, certain directors, companies etc... Some openly admit to being racists, as some think "doing a scene with a black guy is sick". Believe me, they are pretty straight forward.

 

And I know porn watchers that have told me I have some good points.

 

Including me, because I have told you that. But it's where your argument is wrong that really matters, you fail to understand why people do this, or what the outcomes really are.

 

I am in to spanking. And believe it or not, I do like more dominate men. But what goes on between men and my partner that loves me, is VASTLY different then what happens in pornos. It's the difference between a man giving an expensive present to his gf of a long time and him giving one to some girl he just met that he thought was hot. The gf isn't using him for his money, the other girl is.

 

Terrible analogy. Anyway, what it seems you fail to understand so desperately, is that what anyone does with their partner under consent is their prerogative, whether or not you agree with it or see it in the same light as they do. Your opinion simply doesn't matter, and neither does mine.

 

But again, there is nothing in choking or spitting or hitting women in porn that is there because "women love it" or because they want to bring so much pleasure to women. We both know that.

 

Seriously, what are your views on the BDSM scene then? A bunch of weirdo psychological misfits who were abused as children and love to torture and be tortured? If your answer is yes, you simply fail to understand, and I see no reason to continue this debate.

Edited November 5, 2009 by Des

[Jersey Shortie]

And I'm not saying every woman who reads and the bible is going to drown her children in the bathtub, but studies have shown...

 

There is no link between reading the Bible and women drownding their children. You are taking one case and trying to make it a point. There are however statistical facts that prove a link between hardcore porn and men that commit crimes.

 

 

 

What's naive, is thinking that standards are actually being "set" by this porn, thinking that men actually think that reality is the same as porn. I've said it before, but I must say it again. We don't. We don't expect this, we don't demand it, most of us don't even dare ask, as if a little communication is so wrong.

 

Well, I safely bet I dated more men then you have.

 

 

No, we don't all have fixations on breasts, unrealistic looking women, or want women to remain 18 indefinitely.

 

Sure alot of men do. That's why most mainstream porn focuses on a small set of standards and a limited age group of women.

 

You've brought that up several times, leading me to believe maybe one of your biggest insecurities is your age. Men like all women, porn does not change that.

 

I've made no lies about me being insecure about some things. But my insecurties have nothing to do with the subject at hand. You wanting to use it as a personal attack isn't cool. You have your own personal insecurities and I am sure you wouldn't like me to use that as a reason to try and make your opinion less valid.

 

 

Actually, we have seen that generation, they're already here. Anyone under the age of roughly 25 has grown up in the age of Internet porn, the age of "hardcore" porn. Nobody that young has ever known any different from it at their fingertips. Where is the fabric of society beginning to unravel due to this? And no, the answer is not in the fact of this type of porn's very existence.

 

And young men today I find are less respectful of women then older generations. And young men today seem to have certain expectations of women that their older counter parts don't. If you don't think porn hasn't affected the way men view women, the only one who believes that here is you.

 

 

Of course, some of them share their critisisms of certain acts, certain directors, companies etc... Some openly admit to being racists, as some think "doing a scene with a black guy is sick". Believe me, they are pretty straight forward.

 

Light critisms of certain acts or directors has nothing to do with the deep seeded things that go on behind hte scenes. Frankly, I think you actually do buy into the fantasy they pretend to protray. Interesting.

 

 

Terrible analogy. Anyway, what it seems you fail to understand so desperately, is that what anyone does with their partner under consent is their prerogative, whether or not you agree with it or see it in the same light as they do. Your opinion simply doesn't matter, and neither does mine.

 

Of course what people do together under consent is their choice. However, when you take a public media, and you send a big message about how women are treated in it and how much men enjoy it, then that gives every man and owman a right to voice their opinion of it. If you were talking about what goes on between a couple behind closed doors, that is TOTALLY their business. For sure. But we are talking about an open public medium If everyone had your mind set this whole board would never exist.

[Des]

. I've made no lies about me being insecure about some things. But my insecurties have nothing to do with the subject at hand.

 

I think it has a good deal to do with it.

 

 

And young men today I find are less respectful of women then older generations. And young men today seem to have certain expectations of women that their older counter parts don't.

 

Examples? Other than pornography?

 

Of course what people do together under consent is their choice. However, when you take a public media, and you send a big message about how women are treated in it and how much men enjoy it, then that gives every man and owman a right to voice their opinion of it. If you were talking about what goes on between a couple behind closed doors, that is TOTALLY their business. For sure. But we are talking about an open public medium If everyone had your mind set this whole board would never exist.

 

But your opinion is simply that this media shouldn't exist, because you find it offensive and unnecessary. You don't like that sexual ideas are being communicated, because you feel like they somehow dictate what you have to do, which they do not.

 

People come here because they don't know how to work out their own relationship problems, I don't see what that has to do with my mindset. Because frankly, I'm the one arguing for a medium that communicates ideas.

 

Maybe this board is scary, what if someone gives the wrong advice and something blows up in someone's face!?!

[clv0116]

.... I'd really love to experiment in the bedroom and have sex a lot if I had the opportunity.

 

Did your dick stop working or something?

[Els]

There are however statistical facts that prove a link between hardcore porn and men that commit crimes.

 

Interesting studies, those must be. Care to link?

 

If you don't think porn hasn't affected the way men view women, the only one who believes that here is you.

 

You must have forgotten all the rest of us who gave up reasoning with you a long time ago, JS. Well, anyway, hi! I'm one of them.

[Crusoe]

I agree with JS, 15 years ago I probabaly wouldn't, but older, wiser and having seen the changes in young mens attitudes I do.

I employ lot of young fellas, I also help run a sports club for young lads and sometimes their attitudes toward women are shocking. Currently one of them cannot understand why his girlfriend dumped him for having sex with her whist she was asleep. Another talks incessantly of wanting do his girl in the backside then get her to blow him. Most of them talk of gangbanging, spit roasting, fisting, deepthroating, and they think it is the norm. Back in my day if a fella spoke of such things he would be soon find himself with no friends, now fellas congratulate each their for getting their "wings".

Young minds are easily influenced, if they are exposed to violence and violent sex throughout those influencial years they can easily accept it as how a man should be. The more sensible, those with a stronger sense of self and older minds will see these images as fantasy, but many do not.

Years back, before we knew smoking was bad for us, how many thought it was cool to smoke because their favourite film star did? I know sitting on the school bus with smoke in mouth I was Steve Mcqueen, Paul Newman, Brando, Bogie etc. Same as when I started drinking, I was Jack Nicholson, O Toole, Reed, Burton. Drugs, I was Hendrix, Morrison, Coleridge, etc. For a long time all three of those things became quite socially acceptable and a lot of people did them. Now what if violent porn becomes socially acceptable? It is currently accessible to any kid with a computer, and time after time I am hearing kids wanting to replicate what they have watched the night before. Every day I am reading stories of rape, gangrape, date rape, asleep or unconsious rape, every day I am hearing of girls getting slapped, punched and beaten. These used to be rare occurances, not any more. Not only that, many of these crimes are being committed by kids, 12 13 14 15 16 year old kids. Where do these kids get those ideas if not from porn?

Personally I cannot understand how a fella gets turned on by images of men choking women until they puke, but that is not why I am against violent porn. I am against it because of the message it gives to the kids watching it and the harm it will eventually do to society. You can't stop kids from watching it and quite simply, Monkey see, Monkey do.

Edited November 6, 2009 by Crusoe

[JerseyShortie]

I think it has a good deal to do with it.

 

I think it's men like you that would like to try to pain such a narrow picture to make yourself feel better about your own porn use then understand what it's like as a woman, to see how men like to treat, use, humilate, degrade, and abuse women in something that's a billion dollar industry and very popular with all walks and types of men. But you don't have to look at it from that perspective because you aren't the gender being degranated.

 

I will never lie and pretend I don't have insecurities. We all do. And I I didn't admit to having insecurities, THAT'S when you should be questioning my comments here. Because that would mean I was being unrealistic, and not human and twisting a perception to suit my own agenda. What I am doing, is being completely honest. Yeap. I have insecurities. I will NEVER be embarressed about it. I will always try to work on them. But having insecurities, doesn't always mean they are unwarrented, unnatural, or aren't prayed upon by specefic medias. So you can try to make it *appear* that my insecurties make my comments less valid. But the truth is, my willinging to be honest about my insecurities makes my opinion MORE valid. Because I am not holding anything back and lying to suit my purpose. ANd even seperate from insecurties? We all come from different life points. That makes none of us objective. Especially not you Des.

 

And I think it's easier for men to defend porn because they rather defend it then be sincerely honeset about it. Their need to masturbate to it is more important to being real men, stepping up to the plate and respecting women even when no one is looking.

 

And that's just it Crusoe, I have also had those experiences of hearing men talk about women and men refer to porn ALOT! And they think it's funny. Well, it's not funny. It's hurtful .Sorry to break your heart guys but women don't want a fist in their vagina. And they don't want to be abused just to make you feel like your dominate and worthy of being a man. And I totally get what Crusoe is saying about young kids. THere was a group of 15 year old boys in teh news that violated a 9 year old girl with a broom. Don't dare tell me those boys came up with those ideas all on their own. And again, liek Crusoe said, children are only a reflection of society. But sadly, I think most men rather defend their right to porn, then be realistic about how it's affecting their own sons or daughters.

Edited November 6, 2009 by JerseyShortie

[A O]

I think it's men like you that would like to try to pain such a narrow picture to make yourself feel better about your own porn use then understand what it's like as a woman, to see how men like to treat, use, humilate, degrade, and abuse women in something that's a billion dollar industry and very popular with all walks and types of men. But you don't have to look at it from that perspective because you aren't the gender being degranated.

Time for a little context, especially for the folks unfamiliar with JS.

 

JS operates at the extreme end of the sexual spectrum, where to "think" is to act. Now, as for porn, when used respectfully, legally and in a balanced manner, porn use is perfectly healthy. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

 

I will never lie and pretend I don't have insecurities. We all do. And I I didn't admit to having insecurities, THAT'S when you should be questioning my comments here. Because that would mean I was being unrealistic, and not human and twisting a perception to suit my own agenda.

I first came across you four years ago now. You haven't changed one bit I see. Agenda's close to the mark.

 

So you can try to make it *appear* that my insecurties make my comments less valid. But the truth is, my willinging to be honest about my insecurities makes my opinion MORE valid.

You're about as insecure as Superman. It's a red herring. You have anger, quite possibly, hatred, that's closer to the truth, to your reason for being.

 

And I think it's easier for men to defend porn because they rather defend it then be sincerely honeset about it. Their need to masturbate to it is more important to being real men, stepping up to the plate and respecting women even when no one is looking.

Shaming men is a bit old hat.

 

And I totally get what Crusoe is saying about young kids. THere was a group of 15 year old boys in teh news that violated a 9 year old girl with a broom. Don't dare tell me those boys came up with those ideas all on their own.

We had an incident similar to this over ten years ago before the age of mass internet porn.

 

And again, liek Crusoe said, children are only a reflection of society.

Crusoe has a point, but he's overdoing it somewhat. There are not hordes of young men out there raping girls, left right and centre. Simply isn't happening. The majority of young men treat women with respect across the board. Those that don't, their actions are due more to poor parenting and a lack of suitable role models in their formative years, rather than anything porn had to offer.

 

 

.

[Jersey Shortie]

You have 7 posts, how could you know me 4 years ago?

 

Now, as for porn, when used respectfully, legally and in a balanced manner, porn use is perfectly healthy. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

 

 

Porn is anything but respectful, so using it "respectfully" is a bit or an oxymoron. Now, I do think having an interest in seeing others have sex and want not IS normal. I do not think the medium of what porn is, is normal or healthy or balanced.

 

You're about as insecure as Superman. It's a red herring. You have anger, quite possibly, hatred, that's closer to the truth, to your reason for being.

 

I thought Superman was a secure fellow. I love when guys like you come along and tell me I'm the one that has hatred when I'm not the one that gets off on seeing men treated poorly. I'm not the one that gets off on women stereotyped into a rigid ideal of sexuality, called sexual names in porn that are meant to be demeaning, and the various other acts we talked about in this thread. But I'm the one with anger because I'm bothered by it. And because I question how men really feel about women because men with wives, gfs and daughters are okay with getting pleasure from it. Love that. Really I do. I'm the one with anger because I dare to speak up on this subject I'm the one with anger but I'm not the one that gets off on men being abused, humilated and degraded for my benefit. What's more angry? Talking, albeit, yes, volatilely about a topic that often has women being the one in secondary positions or watching and defending a media that represents women as nothing more then sperm recepticals and being smacked around. So yes, I love when guys like you come along and call me the angry one. Because it is just so backwards.

 

 

Shaming men is a bit old hat.

 

Unimportant point. Both men and women try to "shame" the other sex into behaving more in the way they want them to behave. If you even want to call it "shame". I think it's actually about keeping each side in check so their selfish desires don't take over how they treat the other gender. And like it or not, porn really is an extreme selfish desire.

 

There are not hordes of young men out there raping girls, left right and centre. Simply isn't happening. The majority of young men treat women with respect across the board. Those that don't, their actions are due more to poor parenting and a lack of suitable role models in their formative years, rather than anything porn had to offer.

 

You don't know young men very well do you.

 

And no. most young men don't go out raping girls. It doesn't need to be such an obvious and heavy situation for it to still be disrespect. It's usually a bit more insideous then that.

[A O]

You have 7 posts, how could you know me 4 years ago?

AskMen - AllOriginall, now shortened to A O. Know you better than most here.

 

Porn is anything but respectful, so using it "respectfully" is a bit or an oxymoron.

Like any industry, elements of disrespect exist, but on the whole, there's more respect than disrespect towards those involved, henceforth, my statement stands - used respectfully, anyone of legal age can enjoy it, and plenty do.

 

I thought Superman was a secure fellow. I love when guys like you come along and tell me I'm the one that has hatred when I'm not the one that gets off on seeing men treated poorly.

Your posts are saturated with disparaging remarks towards men. Most people I've come across, since I last saw you, can argue the issue in a mostly respectful manner. The fact that you need to drench your views with disparaging remarks towards men speaks more of a bitter and angry person rather than an insecure one. And that's my point.

 

And because I question how men really feel about women because men with wives, gfs and daughters are okay with getting pleasure from it. Love that. Really I do.

You don't question - you dictate what you think we think and feel. Big difference.

 

I'm the one with anger because I dare to speak up on this subject

No, you're the one with anger because you interlace your views with constant puts downs of male behavior. Few posters act in the manner you do, and the ones that do, are seen as angry ants by everyone. In other words, your behavior dictates how you're seen as much, if not moreso than your views.

 

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[Crusoe]

Jersey, as much as I agree with you, you are banging your head against a brick wall. Some people cannot see past their own self gratification. Its not until they see the real face behind the mask of porn that they will understand. All they see is the top end, the stars that earn millions and the stars that are so desensitized to what is happening they no longer give a damn. If they could see, as I have in my travels, the bottom end of the industry they wouldn't be so keen to justify its existence. They have no comprehension of the torment and pain and suffering many of these girls go through just to get some money for some food, or for their next fix. If they could see young girls plucked off the streets under the promise of money or fame and fortune, only to be doped, torn apart and then dumped into a bin, they might change their minds. All the time there is a market for the top end, those at the bottom end will be scouring the streets for the next big star.

 

Likewise if they could see some of the results of porn exposure to impressionable minds, they might change their minds.

The day they walk through their local park to find a bunch of lads circle jerking over a young girl they just beat to the ground, they might change their minds.

The day their friends' daughter comes home from school in tears because three of her classmates jammed a pool cue down her thoat to see how many inches she could take, they might change their minds.

The day they drive a poor girl to hospital because her boyfriend tied her up and then shoved a can of hairspray into her backside, they might change their minds.

 

Until they see those things they will not understand, they will simply continue to masturbate over the glossy outer skin of the "medium" and ignore the real true nasty wretched guts of the money making machine that is modern porn.

[A O]

Some people cannot see past their own self gratification. Its not until they see the real face behind the mask of porn that they will understand. All they see is the top end, the stars that earn millions and the stars that are so desensitized to what is happening they no longer give a damn.

Disagree. You're seeing what you want to see much in the same manner as JS always does, and to which you're accusing others of doing.

 

If they could see, as I have in my travels, the bottom end of the industry they wouldn't be so keen to justify its existence.

Most pertinent point here, there are two sides to the industry. I'm with you, I'm with JS - lets clean up the bottom end of the industry, eliminate it if at all possible. But don't tell me, don't dictate to me that "all" porn is bad and disrespectful.

 

They have no comprehension of the torment and pain and suffering many of these girls go through just to get some money for some food, or for their next fix.

Again, lets deal to this. And one way to deal with this is to highlight the contrasts between the two sides of the industry (not unlike we do with the clothing industry, coffee industry and many other industries where there's a huge discrepancy between work standards and conditions).

 

But again, to cast a dark cloud over the whole industry will simply get you nowhere.

 

Likewise if they could see some of the results of porn exposure to impressionable minds, they might change their minds.

Impressionable minds tend to be that way because of poor upbringing. Porn comes after the fact. Lets deal to the cause moreso than the outlet (not unlike how drug taking, heavy drinking and the like are symptoms of a dysfunctional upbringing. You can try and put band aids on the symptoms, but that won't work as well as looking for and dealing to the root cause).

 

In other words, a person with a sound upbringing will turn away from the crap, disrespectful porn while enjoying the healthy, consensual, respectful stuff. And that's the way it should be.

 

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[Jersey Shortie]

Jersey, as much as I agree with you, you are banging your head against a brick wall.

 

I'm really not though. I'm expressing my opinion. And while some won't agree. Some do. And I have had both men and women tell me I make sound points on this topic or made the look at it differently. My comments aren't disparaging o men. I think more men can be better then they allow themselves to be. Porn is a weakness. Everytime a man caves to it, he's weak. He knows it. His woman knows it. Everyone knows it. That's why men aren't proud of it but soem men try hard to defend it and justify it. Some men are able to live without it. God bless there being men out there like that.

 

If someone wants to be the type of person to defend porn, then I figure because they like it and don't want someone else to rain on their parade or want to see past their own personal whims and weak desires.

 

AskMen - AllOriginall, now shortened to A O. Know you better than most here.

 

No you don't. But I have always had my suspiciousions on your real identity. *shrug*

[A O]

No you don't.

Yes I do, as the folks here will come to know.

 

But I have always had my suspiciousions on your real identity. *shrug*

I have two identities here - AO1 (my initial identity here, of which I've long forgotten the password for) and A O. On the other message board I'm either AO or ALLOriginall, the latter I stopped using a long time ago.

 

Believe you me, I don't need an alias to debate with you.

 

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[Jersey Shortie]

I'm not here to debate or fight with you. You can make whatever comments you want about me. I really don't care how you want to make me out to be just because of my opinion on this subject.

[A O]

JS:

I'm here to put your views in context, something that I'm more qualified to do than most given that I first came across you more than four years ago. I'm also here to advocate for the respectful, legal, balanced use of porn. So, if people stray from what I believe is the correct use of porn and you take them to task, then you won't get any opposition from me.

 

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[Jersey Shortie]

Really, no one cares when you came across me, not even me. WHy you feel the need to keep repeating it is kind of stalkerish. And I certainly never even talked to you that much. And again, I am not here to avoid or get into "opposition" with you. My comments and thoughts on this subject, have nothing to do with you.

[bank1260]

That's pretty sick. Not sure why any guy would be into making the woman he "loves" gag and smack her around. I know some women enjoy being spanked very hard to the point of having welts left on their ass, but I've never met a women that enjoys gagging on semen and receiving a beating.

[A O]

Really, no one cares when you came across me, not even me.

Don't care huh, then show it - leave the point alone.

 

WHy you feel the need to keep repeating it is kind of stalkerish.

Shaming is a key element to your game, an element though, that after many years of crusading I would have thought you'd have gotten rid of by now.

 

My comments and thoughts on this subject, have nothing to do with you.

Your comments have everything to do with anyone who uses porn in a healthy manner. I'm here to tell them that they're not bad, that they're not freaks, that using porn in a respectful, legal and balanced manner is perfectly normal. I'm here to help ensure that you don't scare the bejesus out of them basically.

 

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[Jersey Shortie]

Don't care huh, then show it - leave the point alone.

 

You're the one that keeps bringing it up.

 

 

Shaming is a key element to your game, an element though, that after many years of crusading I would have thought you'd have gotten rid of by now.

 

Yeah. Newsflash. Men and women use a fair amount of what you call "shaming" when it comes to the expectations they hold the opposite sex. I don't think "shaming " is the right word because it's really about keeping things balanced and fair so that either gender doesn't get out of hand. If men or women didn't have certain expectations that they expected from the opposite sex, that whether you want to admit or not, does make both men and women better people for learning how to form relationships with the other sex in a way that also fullfills their need.

 

If a woman works at trying to fullfill her partner and being exciting, and attractive and all that; then why does he still need to self-satisfy himself outside of that? It's about more and more and more and more and more....ect ect ect.

 

And I never said they were bad or freaks. Don't put words in my mouth that were never there. I don't think men are bad and I don't think they are freaks. I however DO NATURALLY question their real feelings about women considering the things they choose up to stand up for. That doesn't make me the bad guy. And you trying to put words in my mouth that were never there is quite deceitful.

 

I don't expect men to give up porn. That doesn't mean I am going to pretend that I think porn is okay or even healthy. Because I don't think the amount and variety of porn that men look at today is healthy. I understand the interest in wanting to see other people have sex or the fact that men like looking at other beautiful women. Believe me, us women never get to forget it. But I am not going to pretend that I think what the medium of porn is today, with the technology or how much men today do spend and what they spend time looking at is healthy. It's not. Sex is healthy. Even wanting to see others have it is healthy. What porn is, isn't.