SidLyon Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 There's something here very reminiscent of the way I think my H was before d-day. He had been living a lie for so many years it was second nature to him. He did not confess to me - I found out - but once I found out a little of what he'd been up to he confessed everything including stuff I would never have found out myself. He had been unhappy in our marriage for many years but like you apparently could not really put a finger on what was really the problem in his life. He had a good wife, gorgeous children, no financial or work problems etc etc. He was also taking more and more risks that I would find out - he has since wavered about whether he wanted me to find out or wanted to continue living the lie. He says it was enormously relieving to have it out in the open although the distress of me and our children was horrible for him to deal with. Anyway once I did find out he said the path was immediately obvious to him and that was to go NC with all other women (there was really only one main one) and to go all out to work on our marriage. He has now been doing this for 8 months. He has become open with me in a way that he never was before. Much of this has been painful for me especially as I was dealing with the enormity of his betrayal and the double life he was leading. His own father also went through something similar when my H was a teenager so he has experiences it himself and also watched his own mother fall apart - as I did for several months. My advice is to tell your wife - that is what I would have preferred rather and the years of betrayal. Be blunt; tell her the marriage is not working and you have looked elsewhere. Gauge your own reaction - if you want to leave do it and if you don't, go all out to work on the marriage while accepting that she has the power and right to end it. If she says from the start that she wants the marriage to end don't initially assume that it will end - keep trying - you will have to plead for yourself. On the other hand if you can't stay then make that clear and just go. S
2sunny Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 i never encouraged him to tell her... that is his decision... besides he already stated that he wouldn't tell her - so why argue that point when he stated his position. i only encouraged him to take action on being the man he wants for himself. i don't see anyone pounding him here - maybe you haven't really seen how bad that can look when a poster gets the feathers all ruffled... but it's not pretty. this is still very productive as the OP seems genuinely honest and trying to be willing - he may not yet be ready - but he's at least giving it consideration... that is progress.
annieo Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 I just wonder, OP, if your marriage is truly not working. Or if you just have this compulsion to seek out that high you get when you meet someone new. It is a physical, as well as emotional, experience, and I am convinced that it can be "addictive", even if the chemicals we are after are produced by our own brains. Speaking from some first hand experience, I know what it's like to miss that thrill of a new person, new eyes looking at you, someone who has never heard your stories a million times, someone whose stories you have never heard before, that amazing sense of discovery. I'm getting better (with age and some disillusioning experiences) to recognize the difference between real love/connection and "wow, who are you? You like me, too?" Fortunately for me, most of my wandering has been in my head, and I was able to control my behavior. In your case, I think you ought to come clean with you wife and then try to honestly work out who it is you are, what you need, what she can live with. I wish you the best, buddy, I think I understand what your real problem is.
whichwayisup Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 I will also add, NS7 seems like a tough guy and can take whatever is thrown at him here. What's been said has been respectful and honest. Maybe harsh at times, but noone is calling him names. He knows what he has to do, he just has to let go of the fear and of the unknown, take a chance.
65tr6 Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 Look in the yellow pages under therapist and call one. OR Send the OW a NC letter then block her from your email and phone. Neither. First confess to your wife and THEN follow up with NC note/MC. You are still in an active affair. Can you deny that ? You are fooling yourself if you think you can send an NC note on your own and stick with it. You seriously need help with this addiction. Who better than your own dear wife (of X years) to help you through this ? You are the man (as my 6 year old calls me and it makes me feel very proud by the way) of the house. You are the example for your kids. I have read pages and pages where you indicate that you want to change. Where is the ACTION ? It is easier than you think it is to confess. You just need to do it. I agree with other posters, you got lot of great advice and support.
confusedinkansas Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 In your case, I think you ought to come clean with you wife and then try to honestly work out who it is you are, what you need, what she can live with. I wish you the best, buddy, I think I understand what your real problem is. Yeah - & has anyone read about the South Carolina Governor who cheated on his wife...... Here's basically what he's saying to his wife (which is pretty much what you're all saying that OP should say to his wife.) "Hey, Honey, I found my soul mate & I am madly in love, we've been having an affair for X-Years......BUT hell, I think I'll settle for YOU & we'll give it the old college try & work things out....wadda ya say" .... It might be how he FEELS right now, doesn't mean he has to come out & say it! How would that make ANYONE FEEL? Like SH*IT! I'm sure. I go back to my original on this one........DON'T TELL!!!!! (We all know you're not going to tell- but many keep saying you should....so I just thought I'd throw out this example)
Reggie Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 Actually, if that is what the governor of SC feels, his wife should know, so she can direct her life with accurate info. I bet most BSs would rather hear the truth than continue to waste their lives living a lie. Yes, it hurts, but the damage is significantly less than wasting additional years living a lie.
Owl Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 CIK...the ONLY thing that not telling will accomplish with a serial cheater is to set the stage for the cheating to continue. PERIOD. If this were a "one time mistake", I could ALMOST agree with you. But you're just glossing over the fact that this man has continually LIED TO HIS WIFE ABOUT EVERY ASPECT OF HIS TIME AWAY FROM HER for virtually their entire marriage. If he doesn't make the change to honesty...he's going to keep lying to her forever...about anything and everything that he wants to. Can't you see how encouraging him NOT to tell just sets the stage for him to keep right on doing what he's been doing?!?! It doesn't set the stage for positive change...it sets the stage for him to keep the situation exactly as it has been. Not telling will just cause the situation to continue...ESPECIALLY in the case of a serial cheater. If this were a one time slip...MAYBE your advice might help him...but it's not a 'one time slip'...it's a clear and true indication of his character and morals up to this point. If he doesn't make THIS change...NOTHING will change.
confusedinkansas Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 CIK...the ONLY thing that not telling will accomplish with a serial cheater is to set the stage for the cheating to continue. PERIOD. So what you're saying is that IF he tells her he will be 100% cured....It will be a MIRICLE! I doubt it. I'm not glossing over the fact that IN THE PAST he WAS a serial cheater. I just think that IF he is willing to stop the patterned behavior, (which it sounds like he's trying to do) move forward & leave the past IN THE PAST, where it belongs - then all's good! IF he is going to continue to be a serial cheater - He'll do it whether he tells her or not. DUH!
Owl Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 So what you're saying is that IF he tells her he will be 100% cured....It will be a MIRICLE! I doubt it. I'm not glossing over the fact that IN THE PAST he WAS a serial cheater. I just think that IF he is willing to stop the patterned behavior, (which it sounds like he's trying to do) move forward & leave the past IN THE PAST, where it belongs - then all's good! IF he is going to continue to be a serial cheater - He'll do it whether he tells her or not. DUH! You clearly don't WANT to get it. If he tells her...and if she decides to remain married...then she's going to be working to ENFORCE changes in his behavior. He's going to have to PROVE that he's trustworthy now, when he's never had to do so in the past. Given that he doesn't have much self-control...having that additional set of "eyes" watching him...helping him to remain trustworthy...will increase the chances that he DOES make a real change. As far as "always being a serial cheater"...well clearly if that's his CHOICE...then he should divorce, rather than focus on fixing a marriage he'll never honor anyway. How does your suggestion of hiding help him change what he's doing?
IfWishesWereHorses Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 How does your suggestion of hiding help him change what he's doing? Like you said Owl, we're talking about a serial cheater here. Not your garden variety affair. No one wakes up one day and decides to be a serial cheater any more than they are going to just decide to give it up (with any success). Serial cheaters usually have some type of personality disorder, generally they are either sex or love addicts and usually with a comorbitity of some other addictions (gambling, drugs, alcohol). Telling his wife isn't going to change that, change him, or solve his problems. His wife can't save him from himself, there is nothing in this world she can do for him. Dealing with an affair is difficult enough, finding out that someone you've been married to has a completely different side to them, isn't at all the upstanding person you've thought them to be, has problems which prevent them from being in a monogomous relationship ever with anyone and it's very likely that its unfixable, is more grief than one person ought to have to deal with especially all at once. Expecting his wife to police him is asking her to enable and accept responsibility for an addict. Nothing short of him asking for a divorce could be fair, and it saves her from ever having to find out that her H has a side she'ld rather not know.
confusedinkansas Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 How does your suggestion of hiding help him change what he's doing? I get what you're saying. I understand accountability. But.... I just think that a cheater is going to cheat whether someone is watching over their shoulder or not. Cheaters are very sneaky bastards (i was one myself) IF he really wants to change he needs to change within & do it himself - or if he chooses, with the help of a professional. Having her police his comings & goings I don't believe will make a hill of beans worth of difference. That's going on the assumption that if he chooses to tell her she'd be willing to stay & work things out. The bottom line is -he seems to not be 100% sure he even wants to be in the marriage & he's not going to tell her anyway.
Owl Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 I'll be honest...if his wife were posting here asking for advice on how to deal with NS7...I'd tell her that he'll never change, and that she should file for divorce and limit the damage he can do to her. I truly believe that SERIAL cheaters don't change. He's claiming to WANT to change...I'd love to see him prove me wrong, and actually change. But he WON'T...he CAN'T...if he relies solely on his own internal methods. Even you two agree that serial cheaters can't change easily. So trying to do it the easy way...without telling his spouse...is pretty much doomed to failure. I do NOT believe its possible for him to do so. Her 'enforcing' his behavior WILL make a ton of difference, IF HE DECIDES THAT KEEPING HER IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN CHEATING. Going to a professional will actually do him no good at all if he's not willing to make TRUE changes up front. He's mentioned a therapist...but the odds are...he'll lie his butt off to anyone he goes to see...resulting in no changes at all. He won't be anymore accountable to them than he would be to his wife. He'll just be paying them a heck of a lot more.
IfWishesWereHorses Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 Then you agree that his wife attempting to police something that NS7 cannot even control himself would be futile. It would only harm her. With the best therapist/psychiatrist and even a strong will to change, his chances of any long term success are odds I doubt even he would take.
Dexter Morgan Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 you are right and if i had these fears i probably would wise up and see what i have at home.i do know what i am doing is wrong but yet i continue to do it, i am trying to break this cycle but so far i have dome nothing to help myself. ok, so you ask why you should tell your wife? you just gave the reason yourself. you continue to cheat because the threat of losing money and family isn't there. you asked how you could stop from cheating. as long as your wife doesn't know and you continue to get away with it....you won't stop.
Owl Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 Then he still should tell. So that his wife has the chance to decide for herself if she wants to continue a relationship with him based on ALL the information.
Dexter Morgan Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 Then he still should tell. So that his wife has the chance to decide for herself if she wants to continue a relationship with him based on ALL the information. and if he doesn't want to come clean and tell his wife....fine....don't. but then he can stop asking us what he can do to stop cheating. because if he doesn't have the fear of losing money, wife, kids, retirement money, 1/2 his business....he has no incentive to stop.
Reggie Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 Even if he does not change and divorces, his wife should know. Otherwise, she is going to be completely confused with the husband she loves, out of the blue, announcing he wants a divorce. I agree, she will not be able to monitor him. But, at least if he tells her he is a serial cheater, she will know it was not something she did that caused the divorce.
Dexter Morgan Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 Even if he does not change and divorces, his wife should know. yes, but he has the attitude that what his wife doesn't know won't hurt her, and that as long as he is taking care of them financially, he's a man.
bentnotbroken Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 So what you're saying is that IF he tells her he will be 100% cured....It will be a MIRICLE! I doubt it. I'm not glossing over the fact that IN THE PAST he WAS a serial cheater. I just think that IF he is willing to stop the patterned behavior, (which it sounds like he's trying to do) move forward & leave the past IN THE PAST, where it belongs - then all's good! IF he is going to continue to be a serial cheater - He'll do it whether he tells her or not. DUH! All the parts that you capped are correct with one big flaw. Until he proves otherwise his past is his present and the odds are his future also. If he wanted the behavior changed at any point, he has had the opportunity and the means to stop it. Even he admitted that without consequences he probably won't. He refuses to take responsibility for his actions. He wants someone to catch him, scold him( "You bad, bad boy! What were you thinking?! How could you?!"), and force him to do the right thing with punishment. Well who needs to be married to a child? There is a funny thing about the past that most of us tend to ignore out of convince to image making. The past is as much a part of you as the present. It is how we form our character, our opinions and our decisions are made from past actions(evidenced by his lying to his wife and getting away with it, then choosing to do it again and again because in the past he got away with it.) We can't escape the past. We can learn from it, face it, embrace it, tame it and control the repercussions( good and bad) that come from it. We can take the negatives and make them positives if you are willing to MAN UP and do what is necessary to take charge. OP hasn't showed the willingness to face anything. He hasn't faced the consequences of the actions he participated in out of fear for his own azz. He has made his needs bigger than life, not just his life, but his wife's life. He didn't consider the impact of his actions before he cheated (multiple times) and he isn't considering the impact of continuing to lie now. He only sees what makes him comfortable and able to live with himself. These actions are healthy for anyone involved, especially him. Lack of good judgement and the lies to go with the need to cover eventually spill over into other aspects of one's life. Does anyone believe for a minute that the people who lied and cheated folks out of millions of dollars where truthful with their families? Do you think they lied to family members to get what they wanted. If you have no boundaries, that includes most if not all aspects of your life. And as far as the jackazz Gov., his lies and deceit extended to his constituents. He failed them when he chose to blow off his responsibilities of running the state for a woman. He was entrusted with the respect of and trust of his wife, he betrayed her. Then he was entrusted with the love and respect of his state, he betrayed them. His character traits dictated how he treated everyone. He got away with it for 8 years, so he felt no need to do the right thing, who knew? But guess what, the truth DID come out. It took years, but it came out. He is nothing now, he no longer holds a place of respect in any one's eyes. He chose his path and everyone else suffered. His wife, his children, his friends, his state and his party. Was it worth it to keep the lies going? What was all good about it?
Dexter Morgan Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 I'm not glossing over the fact that IN THE PAST he WAS a serial cheater. not WAS honey....IS. He recently said that he is "still going it". he hasn't stopped and wants to know how he can stop. Again, not an indication of "WAS". he still is. I just think that IF he is willing to stop the patterned behavior, (which it sounds like he's trying to do) move forward & leave the past IN THE PAST, where it belongs - then all's good! ya, cheating is always all good.........especially when one can get away with it. IF he is going to continue to be a serial cheater - He'll do it whether he tells her or not. DUH! he needs the fear of losing everything that he claims is important to him. too bad his wife doesn't find out and leave him anyway, because she deserves better. but at the very least if she knows and cracks the whip and he is faced with the REAL threat that he will lose alot, he may just stop....cuz otherwise if he gets away with it, he won't stop. it may not be a guarantee he will stop if she knows and takes his balls away from him....but it is a guarantee he will continue to cheat if he knows he can continually get away with it.
confusedinkansas Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 Even if he does not change and divorces, his wife should know. Otherwise, she is going to be completely confused with the husband she loves, out of the blue, announcing he wants a divorce. I agree, she will not be able to monitor him. But, at least if he tells her he is a serial cheater, she will know it was not something she did that caused the divorce. Oh poo foo we know that's not going to happen. He's sitting on the fence right now. Doesn't want to stay, doesn't want to leave. A very difficult predicament he's found himself in. There is a funny thing about the past that most of us tend to ignore out of convince to image making. The past is as much a part of you as the present. It is how we form our character, our opinions and our decisions are made from past actions I do agree...this is sort of like - You can't RUN from your past. BUT we still can put past bad actions behind us & move on & LEARN from them. Don'tcha think? - I still do not believe Once A Cheater Always One. Perhaps I'm being naive...But where there's a will there's a way. He wants someone to catch him, scold him( "You bad, bad boy! What were you thinking?! How could you?!") 100% TRUE...& very obvious. It's easy to get caught - if you truly want to be. I didn't care during mine whether I got caught or not - so just a little carelessness can go a long way if this is the answer to all of his troubles.
PhoenixRise Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 Yeah - & has anyone read about the South Carolina Governor who cheated on his wife...... Here's basically what he's saying to his wife (which is pretty much what you're all saying that OP should say to his wife.) "Hey, Honey, I found my soul mate & I am madly in love, we've been having an affair for X-Years......BUT hell, I think I'll settle for YOU & we'll give it the old college try & work things out....wadda ya say" .... It might be how he FEELS right now, doesn't mean he has to come out & say it! How would that make ANYONE FEEL? Like SH*IT! I'm sure. I go back to my original on this one........DON'T TELL!!!!! (We all know you're not going to tell- but many keep saying you should....so I just thought I'd throw out this example) The Gov. of SC is an a$$ for humiating his wife by saying this in public to the press...but just telling the wife how he feels is the best thing for him to do. His wife deserves to know that her husband has found his soulmate and it is not her. Now she can move forward with her life with the truth. I am sure she thinks she deserves to have a man in HER life for whom she IS his soulmate. Now she can stop wasting her time with a man who doesn't love her if she choses to leave. Whatever she decides, she NOW has all the facts. OP's wife deserves the same. OP does not have to send out a press release or call a news confrence. He just needs to give her the respect she deserves and tell her the truth.
confusedinkansas Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 And as far as the jackazz Gov., his lies and deceit .... His wife, his children, his friends, his state and his party. Was it worth it to keep the lies going? What was all good about it? I never said it was GOOD. But if he would have told everyone involved would that have made him an honerable man? Me thinks not. So it's a no win situation when you find yourself in the middle of an affair. Correct? Whether you tell or not. Whether they find out or not.
PhoenixRise Posted July 1, 2009 Posted July 1, 2009 So what you're saying is that IF he tells her he will be 100% cured....It will be a MIRICLE! I doubt it. I'm not glossing over the fact that IN THE PAST he WAS a serial cheater. I just think that IF he is willing to stop the patterned behavior, (which it sounds like he's trying to do) move forward & leave the past IN THE PAST, where it belongs - then all's good! IF he is going to continue to be a serial cheater - He'll do it whether he tells her or not. DUH! If he doesn't change the pattern, the behavior will not change. No one is saying that a miracle with happen and he will just stop if he tells. But he stands a better chance of living an honest life if he starts being honest. AND If he doesn't stop, at least his wife will know what she is dealing with.
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