amerikajin Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 I can't begin to tell you how impressed I am with the way you handled this. You made the right moves here. Well I came home today from a ball game and my wife asked me what was wrong. I told her I was not happy and then the words just started flowing out. Not angry words but even tempered words A very effective approach. Getting angry just feeds into her victimization game. You'd just be giving emotional ammunition to her, which is subconsciously what she wants. That's why she's being a bytch to you, because she wants you to fight her. She wants you to react because she's being too much of a coward to 'woman up' and tell you what's on her mind. She doesn't have the best coping skills in the world, which is one reason why your marriage is in the tank. She just expects you to figure her out, and if you don't, well then it's obviously your fault. F*ck that. Don't play her little game. Force her hand. Help her grow up. I told her that I felt very disrespected by her actions and attitude toward me. I made it clear to her that I accept some responsibility in all of this and that I am actively trying to make changes to be a better husband and person but that I thought she was failing to accept responsibility for her actions and make the needed changes to correct that and truly work on the marriage. Boo-ya! Excellent. This was handled impeccably. You're being fair, but firm. You're showing a degree of flexibility in acknowledging that it might not be all her fault, but that you're living up to your end of the commitment by making an effort to work on the marriage, and you're pointing out to her that she's not living up to her commitments. Great work! She asked me what I wanted and I told her. I need all contact to end. She said so is it an ultimatum and I said you can considered it what ever you want. I told her that she needed to make a choice either end contact and work on the marriage or keep the relationship with OM. Again, this is nearly perfect, if not outright perfect. Again, she's trying to play games with you, trying to get you to define things like 'ultimatums'. She's trying to get you to be the bad guy because she doesn't want to take any responsibility for what's going on in the marriage. You're not controlling her directly; you're controlling yourself and you're taking one of her options away in this little game of hers. I told her that I had been in contact with a lawyer and would continue to be in contact with more lawyers and in the mean time I would be proceeding further in investigating a divorce while she was making her decision. I told her I didn't expect a decision from her tonight but that I was not going to wait a month for it either. Again, this is masterfully done here. I know I advocated separation before actually filing for divorce, but you took a slightly different approach which is probably just as effective. You didn't serve her with papers, but you did tell her in no uncertain terms that you're beginning to draw your lines, and you've very clearly laid out the consequences for her -- and those consequences are severe enough that she might want to really stop and think about where all of this is going. In some respects, this approach might even be more effective than a trial separation because the reality of the consequences are close enough for her to feel but by holding back you at least give her some time to make a good decision on her own, which is what you want. And once again, you're communicating self-control. You're telling her that it's HER choice to continue to engage in behavior that destroys a marriage. Masterfully done. I did not get much anger from her or feedback either. She was just laying in bed kind of stunned. She asked me I was asking her to make a choice between her "best friend" and me and I said YES Hah! Hah! Game over -- and now she knows it. You've made it clear: "best friend" or you. She can use all the labels she wants to, and try to play the victimization card all she wants, but that's the bottom line. Her choice. I am not vindictive of her nor do I hate her, I made that clear to her, I hate the situation. I left the conversation at if you want to talk about our relationship or our divorce I will be open to talking Great work, man. Keep it up. Just remember, human psychology is a weird thing. As bleak as things look right now, this could be the start of a new beginning. Who knows...she might look back on this one day and realize that you helped push her to discover things about herself that she wouldn't have known otherwise. Hopefully she will realize that both of you will lose something if she quits on the marriage, and I think she stands to be a bigger loser.
Author Shockedhusband Posted June 3, 2009 Author Posted June 3, 2009 If the OP files for divorce, then that's a choice he has made. He has to accept responsibility for that choice. Filing for divorce right after discovering an emotional affair doesn't necessarily accomplish anything. I think it's easier to accept responsibility for a hard choice like filing for divorce when you know in your heart that you've truly made an effort to salvage the relationship, and that it was your partner's choice to continue violating your trust to the point where you had no choice but to make a decision to move on with your life. Yes, I have made a choice, a very tough choice to not accept the status quo. I made that decision knowing that it may end my marriage and I will have to deal with the psychological, physical, and financial consequences of what I have done. I have a great support network of friends and family that will help me get thoough those consequences if it comes to that and that makes me feel even more comfortable that I made the right decision. Brooks Hadley said it best in the Shawshank Redemption " Either get to living or get to dying"
amerikajin Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 Yes, I have made a choice, a very tough choice to not accept the status quo. I made that decision knowing that it may end my marriage and I will have to deal with the psychological, physical, and financial consequences of what I have done. I have a great support network of friends and family that will help me get thoough those consequences if it comes to that and that makes me feel even more comfortable that I made the right decision. Brooks Hadley said it best in the Shawshank Redemption " Either get to living or get to dying" You're making all the right moves as far as I can tell. I was only pointing out that it's ultimately a decision that one makes to file for a divorce and that people who file for divorce should always understand that. A partner might have cheated, but that doesn't by itself automatically lead to divorce. Someone has to take that next step to pick up the phone and contact an attorney. I'm just pointing out that this is a conscious decision, and that if someone does it, they ought to be comfortable with it. I don't think it's enough to say 'My partner cheated...I had no choice but to divorce her/him.' Divorce is a choice. That's all I'm saying. I think you're handling this thing impeccably. I think you're showing a remarkable tendency for restraint and measured reactions. You're keeping your head on through what must be an extremely emotional time. I don't think there's anything else you can do at this point except to wait and see how she reacts.
Snowflower Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 Just remember, human psychology is a weird thing. As bleak as things look right now, this could be the start of a new beginning. Who knows...she might look back on this one day and realize that you helped push her to discover things about herself that she wouldn't have known otherwise. Hopefully she will realize that both of you will lose something if she quits on the marriage, and I think she stands to be a bigger loser. Wow, aj this post was really good. Great advice. Especially this part quoted here. I know this part will help me when I analyze my own situation. I just might print it out! I think you will help shocked and a lot of others that read this thread who are going through something similar to keep going, keep trying no matter what happens to their marriages ultimately.
Dexter Morgan Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 no Dexter he is her "best friend" I still have not heard a word from her today, we have marriage counseling tonight and I am going to rehash all of this again there. I think you need to bring up to the therapist, although if he/she is blaming you don't know what good it will do, that you are appalled about her answer of him being her "best friend" and that she is looking for excuses to still be in contact with him. But it all boils down to 1. No contact 2. Taking ownership of her actions and decisions 3. Being open and honest about all future contact (as they work together) 4. Dealing with her depression I did not get an indication from her one way or another which way she was leaning. I don't know if she didn't say anything becuase she was shocked or becuase she had already made up her mind and wanted me to make the final decision. You could see it both ways, with me making the final decision maybe she can trick herself into feeling better about all of this by telling herself that I decided to give up on the marriage. I am really not sure where her head is at right now, but I can tell you I feel much better about the situation. It feels like a weight has been lifted off on my shoulders. well you stick to a deadline for an answer, OR, see what happens in therapy. Whatever happens, as a side note, I wouldn't put up with the therapist putting the blame on you.
Dexter Morgan Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 A very effective approach. Getting angry just feeds into her victimization game. You'd just be giving emotional ammunition to her, which is subconsciously what she wants. That's why she's being a bytch to you, because she wants you to fight her. well if one assumes the bolded part to be true, then isn't that his answer right there?? If she is wanting him to fight her, it means she is looking for an excuse to leave.
Chrome Barracuda Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 Here's the million dollar question!: ...Is she even worth fighting for, knowing her nature and how much she has deceived her husband. Would any man be willingly with this woman knowing what she is truly capable of? I'd divorce her anyways' a man should have to be emotionally abused by a woman.
amerikajin Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 well if one assumes the bolded part to be true, then isn't that his answer right there?? If she is wanting him to fight her, it means she is looking for an excuse to leave. She thinks that's what she want, but it might not necessarily be what she wants in reality. She is looking for an excuse to escape from her own misery, and this is the best she can come up with because her coping skills apparently suck. She's clearly got issues that need to be resolved, and I think that's why I keep referring back to extensive marital counseling -- perhaps even individual psychiatric/mental health therapy in her case specifically. If she's suffering depression, that's a mental illness. I think we should treat illnesses if the person is willing to take the ultimate responsibility for receiving treatment, and that is the key question in all of this: is she willing to stop blaming the husband? If not, well, the writing is on the wall. If the OP wants this marriage to work, if that's what he really wants, then he might unfortunately have to accept the fact that he might have to be the stronger, more mature partner of the two in the short run. But you'll get no argument from me that he can't continue to carry a disproportionate amount of the burden for too much longer. She needs help. It's his responsibility as her husband to point that out to her, but it's her responsibility to accept that truth and do something constructive with it. But all of this "Screw the slut" type of response is actually nothing more than advocating that he just give up on his relationship. Both people took vows to be married, even when marriage becomes difficult. I know that's not the prevailing wisdom around here, but that's the way I see it.
delirious Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 She thinks that's what she want, but it might not necessarily be what she wants in reality. She is looking for an excuse to escape from her own misery, and this is the best she can come up with because her coping skills apparently suck. She's clearly got issues that need to be resolved, and I think that's why I keep referring back to extensive marital counseling -- perhaps even individual psychiatric/mental health therapy in her case specifically. If she's suffering depression, that's a mental illness. I think we should treat illnesses if the person is willing to take the ultimate responsibility for receiving treatment, and that is the key question in all of this: is she willing to stop blaming the husband? If not, well, the writing is on the wall. If the OP wants this marriage to work, if that's what he really wants, then he might unfortunately have to accept the fact that he might have to be the stronger, more mature partner of the two in the short run. But you'll get no argument from me that he can't continue to carry a disproportionate amount of the burden for too much longer. She needs help. It's his responsibility as her husband to point that out to her, but it's her responsibility to accept that truth and do something constructive with it. But all of this "Screw the slut" type of response is actually nothing more than advocating that he just give up on his relationship. Both people took vows to be married, even when marriage becomes difficult. I know that's not the prevailing wisdom around here, but that's the way I see it. I agree amerikkajon, great insight there into women. I think if he gets out the big guns, he will not win his wife back (he does love her and that is what he wants), she may be subconsciously testing him here emotionally. How much does he love her, how much does he want her - he may not have shown her for a few years. Good luck SH.
2sure Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 Some people push the need for "unconditional love" to be proved to them. They can ruin lives and relationships with their abhorrent actions but what lies beneath all the crap is this real need to have proof that the love you offer is unconditional. If this is what is happening, good luck to you.
Dexter Morgan Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 I agree amerikkajon, great insight there into women. I think if he gets out the big guns, he will not win his wife back (he does love her and that is what he wants), she may be subconsciously testing him here emotionally. How much does he love her, how much does he want her - he may not have shown her for a few years. Good luck SH. Hmmm.....so she might be testing him and his love? Wow. She cheats, repeatedly, and the idea put forth here is that she is some prize to be won back, and she should be the one to benefit with some sort of emotional extortion on her part? Its as if her cheating is getting her what she wants, and if he follows this advice, then she is learning a valuable lesson.....cheat, and get him to act as she wants. I'm not saying he needs to get out the big guns. But geez....its as if you are all telling him to appease her and bow to her manipulation.
HsMomma Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 Hmmm.....so she might be testing him and his love? Wow. She cheats, repeatedly, and the idea put forth here is that she is some prize to be won back, and she should be the one to benefit with some sort of emotional extortion on her part? Its as if her cheating is getting her what she wants, and if he follows this advice, then she is learning a valuable lesson.....cheat, and get him to act as she wants. I'm not saying he needs to get out the big guns. But geez....its as if you are all telling him to appease her and bow to her manipulation. I agree, Dex - why should BAD behavior be rewarded? I mean, I understand that we all need to know we are loved, but hello...can anyone say, "Wrong way to go about getting confirmation"? I think SH is doing what he can and is doing well. But I definitely agree that she shouldn't benefit from having betrayed him.
lostsunsets Posted June 3, 2009 Posted June 3, 2009 Akin to the shawshank redemption remark is this. When you see her tonight a your MC, tell her this regarding the OM. "Wherever you go, there you are" She can't escape her choices and who she is.
Author Shockedhusband Posted June 4, 2009 Author Posted June 4, 2009 Well we had marriage counseling last night and I was a bit disappointed becuase we did not really talk about what I said to her until the end. My wife said that all of her anger was due to the fact that I talked with her mother. She has told her mother just enough for her mom to know that there is an OM and that there were some text messages but not really anything more because she believes that all of this is between her and I and that this is a private matter and other people don't need to know about it. Her mother came to me with questions and I answered them for her and tried to give her mom hope that this would work out. He asked me what my understanding of what my wife has done is. I told him that at some point she felt neglected at home and some time through all of that she decided to give up and accept that things wouldn't change. She had a previous platonic friendship with the OM through work and she began to confide in him and that relationship grew stronger and deeper and that in turn made her happy and she was now getting her emotional needs met from him. My wife agreed to this statement. He then asked my wife is she would be upset if that is what I told her mother She said probably not This is exactly what I told her mother, I reiterated this to my wife. My wife is hell bent on believing that I am trying to get her mom to act against her. I don't think she wants her mother to know anything becuase I think she knows her mother will see right through this facade my wife is putting up and she will call her out on it. Which in some instances she has. I think deep down my wife feels guilty for what has happened but she refuses to deal with it. She is extremely unhappy about the ultimatum that I put out for her she even compared it to her asking me to give up my relationship with my fraternity brothers. Not even close, they were friends before I met my wife wife and the whole relationship dynamic is completely different than what she has with her the OM It is sad but as long as she refuses to deal with her problems and accept her portion of the blame in all of this she is going to loose someone who truly cares for her and really wants her to be happy.
Owl Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 Don't wait on MC to deal with this issue. Did you talk with MC at all about your "ultimatum"? Here's what you need to do. You need to tell her...and then you need to tell him...exactly where you're at. That this is no longer "all about how she feels". Tell them that you're rapidly approaching the point where you're no longer going to fight this...that you're rapidly losing love for her because of her actions and behaviors...and that at this point, you're no longer willing to play this game. She ends her relationship with OM...PERIOD. It doesn't matter if she calls him OM, "friend", or the Pink Panther...her relationship with him is destroying your marriage, and you're no longer willing to keep fighting to save the marriage in the face of that relationship. PERIOD. Don't negotiate any further. State your boundaries, state the consequences of crossing those boundaries, and follow through when/if they are violated. DONE.
seibert253 Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 Don't wait on MC to deal with this issue. Did you talk with MC at all about your "ultimatum"? Here's what you need to do. You need to tell her...and then you need to tell him...exactly where you're at. That this is no longer "all about how she feels". Tell them that you're rapidly approaching the point where you're no longer going to fight this...that you're rapidly losing love for her because of her actions and behaviors...and that at this point, you're no longer willing to play this game. She ends her relationship with OM...PERIOD. It doesn't matter if she calls him OM, "friend", or the Pink Panther...her relationship with him is destroying your marriage, and you're no longer willing to keep fighting to save the marriage in the face of that relationship. PERIOD. Don't negotiate any further. State your boundaries, state the consequences of crossing those boundaries, and follow through when/if they are violated. DONE. Right on the mark. Also, point out to your counselor and your wife, that healing and repair cannot and will not begin until NC with OM is maintained. No if's ands or buts. I would lay it on the line right in your next session. If she does not agree to NC and maintain it, then we're all just wasting our time.
Author Shockedhusband Posted June 4, 2009 Author Posted June 4, 2009 Owl, That has been done I had talked privately with the MC a week before this session last night and he told me that he was going to focus on the "chronic" issue with our relationship this past session to make sure my wife wasn't tuning out due to talk of the affair. I agreed that it was probably a good idea. I gave my wife the ultimatum with consequence of divorce on tuesday and didn't have a chance to contact the MC to let him know about that. My personal deadline to for my wife's decision is next Friday.
Owl Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 Don't give her a week to choose between OM and you. That gives her time to work out options. Tell her that she needs to decide NOW...that you're going to expect her decision THIS Friday...so that the two of you can use this weekend to implement whatever has to happen. Either it's her telling OM that it's over and sending an "NC letter"....or its her looking for a new place to live and packing out her stuff. Don't give her time to 'comfortably' make a decision...that just gives her time to work out a gameplan to screw you over, if that ends up being her choice. Take the decision making power back, and keep it...and do so by keeping this moving forward at a pace that suits YOU...not her. Waiting that long is just going to give her that much time to do damage control to prevent you from getting what you need out of this situation.
Dexter Morgan Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 I think deep down my wife feels guilty for what has happened but she refuses to deal with it. I don't think she is feeling guilty. I think she is angry she got caught and is probably angry that you aren't giving her an excuse to run to the OM. I think she is all about excuses and is angry now because she realizes she has no excuse and you aren't giving her any. Except the ultimatum, but if she uses this excuse to run to OM, then she knows there is no coming back. Especially once the OM get tired of having sex with the same woman for too awful long. She is extremely unhappy about the ultimatum that I put out for her she even compared it to her asking me to give up my relationship with my fraternity brothers. Not even close, they were friends before I met my wife wife and the whole relationship dynamic is completely different than what she has with her the OM that and I highly doubt you have sex with your fraternity brothers or are attracted to them in any way. She is grasping at straws...anything to justify keeping the OM in her life. She isn't willing to get rid of OM, and even if she did, she'd be resentful and wishing she didn't have to give him up. She'd only be giving him up to stave off divorce.....not because she wants to. So what is there really left? get rid of her. It is sad but as long as she refuses to deal with her problems and accept her portion of the blame in all of this she is going to loose someone who truly cares for her and really wants her to be happy. well let her find that out. make her lose you, let her go be with the other man, and when the other man realizes, "hey, I just wanted something on the side....not a full blown committment", or that over time its no longer exciting for him...or her, then it will hit her...and by then, too bad, so sad.
Dexter Morgan Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 My personal deadline to for my wife's decision is next Friday. good, cuz you shouldn't have to wait any longer than that. honestly, you shouldn't have to wait for an answer at all. After next Friday, if she doesn't give you an answer.....and answer this honestly, are you prepared to file for divorce?
amerikajin Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 My wife said that all of her anger was due to the fact that I talked with her mother. She has told her mother just enough for her mom to know that there is an OM and that there were some text messages but not really anything more because she believes that all of this is between her and I and that this is a private matter and other people don't need to know about it. Her mother came to me with questions and I answered them for her and tried to give her mom hope that this would work out. There's a pattern emerging here, and that pattern is that she is doing all that she can to deflect attention from herself. She is going to great lengths to justify and rationalize what she is doing because she mentally pulled away from the marriage long ago. Your wife is not a bad person, but she's the kind of person who apparently needs a lot of emotional support. She strikes me as extremely insecure, and she depends on other people to make her happy. You're justifiably angry at her right now, but if you can take the long-term view of things, there's a chance you can recover your marriage and maybe somehow even emerge stronger from all of this. But this behavior of hers is unacceptable and, understandably, testing the limits of your tolerance. This is exactly what I told her mother, I reiterated this to my wife. My wife is hell bent on believing that I am trying to get her mom to act against her. I mentioned this a while back actually. You're an even bigger devil in her eyes now because she does indeed believe that you're turning everyone against her. Part of this is an insecure woman who, deep down inside, knows she is wrong but is refusing to accept responsibility for her behavior. All of this leads back to her coping skills. What she knows is that she doesn't feel well emotionally. She doesn't know exactly what the problem is; she just expects you to 'fix' it. She probably entered into marriage with this notion that you could fix her emotional problems because people who are in love, people who are married are supposed to be happy. But she isn't happy. She's wondering why. She's blaming you for not doing your job of making her happy. What she needs is for someone to show her that it's not your job to make her happy; it's HER job to make her happy. That's why counseling is critical. You don't have that kind of credibility with her anymore. You did nothing wrong, but all of this is in her head, see. That's why she needs a counselor, and that's why the counselor has to remain neutral. He can't just take your side. Moreover, there might be issues of your own that you should deal with. I don't think she wants her mother to know anything becuase I think she knows her mother will see right through this facade my wife is putting up and she will call her out on it. Which in some instances she has. Your mother will indeed see through her and call your wife out on her behavior, but don't for a moment assume that she has the power to change her daughter's behavior -- she doesn't. In some cases, it might actually backfire. Who knows, maybe your wife harbors a private grudge against your mother too. Maybe your wife would see fit to continue defying not only you but also your mother for good measure. Maybe she continues and goes all the way with this affair just to prove some point of hers. Of course it's irrational but what I'm saying is you've got to understand that you and your wife are in two entirely different places here. You're going to have to accept that you'll have to be the stronger partner for the time being, if you really want this relationship to work out. If, on the other hand, you decide that you've sustained too much emotional damage from the relationship, then nobody would hold it against you if you filed for divorce. The question is, would you somewhere down the road hold it against yourself if you didn't exhaust all reasonable efforts to repair the relationship? These are questions only you can answer and you'll have to dig deep. Having said all of that, I definitely agree to establishing clear and firm boundaries of behavior, and then making good on taking decisive action if those lines are crossed. I think deep down my wife feels guilty for what has happened but she refuses to deal with it. Your wife is probably a bit f*cked in the head, mate. Probably more so than you were aware. This isn't going to be worked out in one or two counseling sessions. The road to recovery will be long. Can you deal with that? She is extremely unhappy about the ultimatum that I put out for her she even compared it to her asking me to give up my relationship with my fraternity brothers. Not even close, they were friends before I met my wife wife and the whole relationship dynamic is completely different than what she has with her the OM Another diversionary tactic and you're right not to fall for it. She's projecting on you. She's refusing to accept responsibility for her own problems. She wants someone else to make her happy. She needs to be shown how to make herself happy. The whole frat brothers thing...she sees herself miserable and lonely and wanted you to be her lonely and miserable partner. That way you two are on an equal and level playing field. It is sad but as long as she refuses to deal with her problems and accept her portion of the blame in all of this she is going to loose someone who truly cares for her and really wants her to be happy. It is indeed sad. I think you've been handling things quite well.
amerikajin Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 Owl, That has been done I had talked privately with the MC a week before this session last night and he told me that he was going to focus on the "chronic" issue with our relationship this past session to make sure my wife wasn't tuning out due to talk of the affair. I agreed that it was probably a good idea. I gave my wife the ultimatum with consequence of divorce on tuesday and didn't have a chance to contact the MC to let him know about that. My personal deadline to for my wife's decision is next Friday. I'm not saying you're wrong to go for the divorce, but I'm just thinking out loud here. Let's say she doesn't change by next Friday and you start serving her papers. Let's say that she decides about a week or so of wrangling through attorneys that she says "I'm sorry, I'll stop seeing him. Let's go to counseling." What then? Would you give her another chance? And if you do give her another chance, what if she slips up and does something you don't like then? I'm just pointing out that while some people here have gone to their attorneys and scared their cheating spouses straight, it may not necessarily go down that way in all cases. Going for a divorce outright is basically stacking a lot of chips. I do agree with giving her some time. I don't see what the problem with that is, though I would keep the deadline to yourself. But sheesh...you've got a week. Your marriage is already messed up. You're going to need a lot of time to fix it. A week is nothing. Your call, though.
Chrome Barracuda Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 I'm not saying you're wrong to go for the divorce, but I'm just thinking out loud here. Let's say she doesn't change by next Friday and you start serving her papers. Let's say that she decides about a week or so of wrangling through attorneys that she says "I'm sorry, I'll stop seeing him. Let's go to counseling." What then? Would you give her another chance? And if you do give her another chance, what if she slips up and does something you don't like then? I'm just pointing out that while some people here have gone to their attorneys and scared their cheating spouses straight, it may not necessarily go down that way in all cases. Going for a divorce outright is basically stacking a lot of chips. I do agree with giving her some time. I don't see what the problem with that is, though I would keep the deadline to yourself. But sheesh...you've got a week. Your marriage is already messed up. You're going to need a lot of time to fix it. A week is nothing. Your call, though. So much damage is done on her part that she is doing, does she deserve a second chance? Why must it take serving divorce papers to force her to stop cheating? I dont think this marriage needs to be saved. OM???? Dude that's not just cheating that's a sex or love addiction, if she cant or wont conquer her demons, then what he just says oh well let's stay married? You ever dated a woman who's a love addict, their problems are bigger than the marriage. Even if he wanted to work it out, I dont think she's even willing to put in the work. Even now she said do you want me to give up the friendship??? like that was even an option? Of course!!!! you dumb sack of bricks, why the hell do you think he is filing for divorce for?
amerikajin Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 So much damage is done on her part that she is doing, does she deserve a second chance? I think the bigger issue here is, does the relationship deserve another chance? It's not just about her, it's about whether there is the chance of a connection between these two. I haven't seen anything yet that leads me to believe that this is beyond repair, but I'm not gonna lie: it's going to take a lot of freaking work. But you know what? That's what marriage is: a lot of freaking work. Why must it take serving divorce papers to force her to stop cheating? If he serves his wife with divorce papers and she signs them, it really isn't cheating anymore, is it? Think about that one before you respond. Dude that's not just cheating that's a sex or love addiction, if she cant or wont conquer her demons, then what he just says oh well let's stay married? Let me be clear: the OP definitely needs to be fully prepared to take complete and decisive action. I have said that from the start. It's just a matter of what action to take and when. Some have suggested immediately filing for divorce because it might scare her into straightening herself out. That indeed might happen, but there is no guarantee whatsoever about that, and if the real reason you go to an attorney is to try to scare her or manipulate her, I think you're really setting yourself up for a potentially massive dose of disappointment and confusion if things don't exactly go as planned. I mean, she could always agree to the divorce initially and then back out of it -- and then what? I mean, what if the OP didn't really want a divorce and he went to the attorney because his pride and some embittered posters on Loveshack told him that's what he ought to do (no offense)? The problem then is, at that point, he has a choice: either he can go through with a divorce he doesn't really want because his pride and ego tell him to, or then he has to go back on his word and take her back in after filing for divorce and then he ends up losing some of his credibility in the process, which makes a repeat offense more likely. That's exactly why I say it is better if he can slow this down, not speed it all up. I think people here are more worried about making sure that his penis doesn't get stepped on when they ought to be more concerned with what's going to work best in the long run. You ever dated a woman who's a love addict, their problems are bigger than the marriage. Even if he wanted to work it out, I dont think she's even willing to put in the work. There's no question that the wife's problems are bigger -- much bigger -- than the marriage. That's why she needs counseling, and she might need individualized counseling to deal with these issues outside of the marital counseling they're both doing at the moment. But how can anyone say that things aren't going to work right now? It's not realistic to expect years worth of baggage to be resolved in a matter of two counseling sessions. Christ, this isn't a freaking sitcom or a movie, folks; this is real life.
amerikajin Posted June 4, 2009 Posted June 4, 2009 Your mother will indeed see through her and call your wife out on her behavior, but don't for a moment assume that she has the power to change her daughter's behavior -- she doesn't. In some cases, it might actually backfire. Who knows, maybe your wife harbors a private grudge against your mother too. Maybe your wife would see fit to continue defying not only you but also your mother for good measure. Okay, dumb@ss alert, I meant "her mother" not yours. My bad. I need an extra cup of Joe this morning.
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