Are extramarital affairs really that bad?

[Ladyjane14]

Lovely post, SerialMuse. I think this is something that is so often difficult for people to understand. They seem to believe that "what people don't know won't hurt 'em".

 

But what the cheater gives to one... s/he starves from the other.

[Tomcat33]

Halfrock I gotta admit you have some pretty good arguments for your choices but something gets lost along the way. If you are doing this not for the simple pleasure of sex, if it is much more than that, then someone somewhere along the way is suffering from your infidelity mainly your partner I would hazzard to guess.

 

When I read something like this:

 

Wow, halfarock, that is so not true. I've read this statement here before, many times, but it still surprises me that people think this. I think it's just an easier thing to believe, because the damage done is more abstract than concrete prior to D-Day. In my own experience, there were all sorts of things I didn't understand, little cruelties, little distances that didn't used to be there, coming home later for dinner, little differences in the way he'd relate to me or confide in me. Those things hurt like hell, but he wouldn't explain himself when I asked him (he'd either tell me lies or tell me I was imagining it, or both), and I couldn't keep asking every day, day in and day out.

 

I can't help but wonder if you are not doing something along these lines as well? Question not affirmation. yeah?

 

It just really breaks my heart to read something like that because in a lot of cases it's this particular type of balancing act that facillitates an affair and the amount of angst and pain and scarring this produces to the person being deprived of knowlege and information, is unsurmountable.

 

I'm no morality junkie (check my history here if you will) but putting aside what's right and wrong, just from a humanistic stand point I just don't know how people can withdrawl like this from other human beings and not think that what they are doing is extremely damaging. It's not about "what they don't know won't hurt them"because it is not about fining out that an A is taking place it is about what they don't know really hurts them more. It's the not knowing the whys the hows the what's going on what is this sudden change in mood behaviour etc. To make someone out to feel like they are going crazy because of their suspicions is really one of the lowest forms of mental and emotional abuse one can perform on another human being, mainly someone you profess to love and care about.

 

 

I'm not sure this is something that happens in your situations but otherwise how do you balance the subtraction of needs from one person in order to deposit needs onto another?

 

 

On the contrary you say you care about all women in your life, if no one is being deprived of anything then you must be either really good at what you do, to the point that you can make two people very happy at the same time and still feel at ease with yourself given all the work you have to do, or someone is getting short changed somewhere down the line. I just don't see any other way around it, if there is please fill me in because I am totally missing option # 3?

[Herzen]

Is ignorance "bliss" when it involves an Affair? Most often, no.

 

An Affair can be distracting, all consuming and relentless in its demands on the WS's time, energies, focus and interests. This Great Distraction affects the family in many ways from the WS's short temper at home, lack of interest in now humdrum marital sex to spending less meaningful time with the kids in favor of hot Affair sex or just being with his new love.

 

The BS, even if ignorant of the Affair, experiences the repercussions.

 

Marriages and families are based on habit and the daily grind and it is these routines that get disrupted when the WS experiences the wonder, pleasures and intense otherworldliness of an Affair. An Affair is Oz; a marriage is Kansas.

 

The BS, moreover, can't help but notice that her WS has left Kansas and now lives elsewhere, in Oz.

 

An Affair can suck the lifeblood from a marriage. The BS is twice a victim: she's deceived and her spouse has left her emotionally and is now giving his "best" to some stranger to the marriage. He is no longer anyone's husband. The marriage is one of the undead.

 

We're not just dealing with abstract knowledge or information bytes. Real people have affairs, and real people experience the often painful and jarring consequences of these affairs.

 

If you want to cheat, cheat. But don't deceive yourself into thinking that what the BS doesn't know won't hurt her.

 

Because it will, and does.

[outofdarkness]

You can die in an automobile accident. Does that mean that you shouldn't drive? An airplane can fall out of the sky and crash into a school. Does that mean that you shouldn't send your children to school? People get scabies off of toilet seats. Does that mean that you shouldn't use the toilet?

UMMMM...look at some med sites..you CAN'T get scabies off of a toilet seat!!!!!!!!! THERE must be close personal skin to skin contact.....sorry charlie! What about crabs??? Can you get those from a toilet seat...It's people like you that keep our teens so misinformed!!!!!!!!!

[outofdarkness]

Your H brought home and gave you scabies from an affair he had?! Geez, OOD, I've read some of why you stay with this man, but really, that is awful. You're on this board a lot, and I know you probably find comfort here and that's why, and that's a great thing, but maybe if you cut down on online posting a bit, you could find some time to focus on an escape plan. Neither you nor your children should have to deal with things like this.

Well...I just took a rather long break from LS...I have been home w/ our sick son for almost a year now..and LS has been good to me..AND, I've been quietly working to better mysel so that I have choices and more stamina..

[outofdarkness]

yes, and OOD, i have stated elsewhere, that i have all these family responsiblities you speak of, and i do them alone. why should you use those as an excuse not to be romantic with your husband? dont you think that OW are sometimes tired too? the difference is we just make the effort i guess.

My apologies to all of the SWOW's!!!! I should have thought before posting that!

[Lizzie60]

My apologies to all of the SWOW's!!!! I should have thought before posting that!

 

What is a 'SWOW' ???

[halfarock]

First lets get this straight. I am not a member of the moral police squad ( since you directed this at me with a quote I have to think it was meant in response).

Only the first part was directed at you. The rest just turned into a general rant.

[outofdarkness]

What is a 'SWOW' ???

single women other women...guess I made that one up! should be smow..single MOTHER other woman!

[outofdarkness]

Your H brought home and gave you scabies from an affair he had?! Geez, OOD, I've read some of why you stay with this man, but really, that is awful. You're on this board a lot, and I know you probably find comfort here and that's why, and that's a great thing, but maybe if you cut down on online posting a bit, you could find some time to focus on an escape plan. Neither you nor your children should have to deal with things like this.

FYI...I was thinking this morning that I needed to be sure a post that when the children did get scabies when they were toddlers, our pediatrician told me they can get it from the SOIL..like outside!! LOL...I switched peds and did my own research...I knew it took skin to skin contact, but it never entered my mind that it could be my H...This was a good 10 years before D day...I simply blamed my Dad b/c at the time, my parent's were getting a D b/c HE revealed himself to be a REALLY messed up sex addict...Great excuse for my H, but a total lie...Once D day came out three years, ago the scabies is the first thing I thought of..I knew then that it was him that brought it home to us...If you all knew what a clean person I am and what a fanatic I am about keeping the house clean, you'd know that the scabies thing drove me nuts...I was soooo upset...Just had to clear that up...

[halfarock]

…you are only taking into consideration your lover's point of view; you're not taking into consideration the husband's feelings.

You’re absolutely correct. When I was high school/college age, several times girls became friends with one of my friends or brothers as a way of getting closer to me. Maybe I’m just cynical but women do use men to get what they want. I don’t think that all women get married for love. I think of many of these husbands as having had been deluded long before I came along.

 

Come clean and just admit that you simply like tapping a nice piece of ass once in a while. Hell, we all do. And yes, sometimes the temptation to oblige a married woman is rather strong, I must admit myself. But never forget that there are always consequences for your behavior. The thing about affairs is, once you make that decision to descend into the world of underground relationships, you lose control of the dynamic. The likely outcome is one helluva lot of drama.

And maybe a chaotic life is a life well lived. Every relationship I treat as an adventure. With everyone is a story just waiting to be discovered. I don’t watch television. Don’t need to. I am entertained enough by my life and the people in it. I am happy.

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not sure this is something that happens in your situations but otherwise how do you balance the subtraction of needs from one person in order to deposit needs onto another?

 

On the contrary you say you care about all women in your life, if no one is being deprived of anything then you must be either really good at what you do, to the point that you can make two people very happy at the same time and still feel at ease with yourself given all the work you have to do, or someone is getting short changed somewhere down the line. I just don't see any other way around it, if there is please fill me in because I am totally missing option # 3?

This is an issue that I think about from time to time. There is a limit on how much emotional energy I can expend and always there is one that I favor much more than the others. My natural inclination is to be a bit of a loner. I would be forever frustrated and suffocated in a continuous monogamous relationship. But with more than 3, sometimes 4 at a time and someone gets left out.

 

There is this other part that isn’t being said. Wherever I go, people like me, and greatly so. The women in my life have always been very happy when I’m around. It’s very easy for me to make others happy. Often times I think that some of the people who hang out with me do so just because they think that they can somehow capture some of my happiness. There are always old girlfriends that I am running into. It often seems as if emotions between us never end.

 

The women with whom I have the best relationships tend to be confident, independent women - women who aren’t dependent on men for their well being. Married women fit in here somewhat as they aren’t looking to me to fulfill their material needs, only their emotional ones.

 

 

 

And yes, I am very good at what I do.

[Lizzie60]

the more I think you are my male counterpart...

 

When you said that emotions never seem to end with your lovers, this is exactly the same for me... isnt't that something?

 

Most of my lovers are still contacting me from time to time...even the ones that have moved away years ago... they still send me emails asking me how things are going... that they are still thinking about the great time we had... blablabla... some are contacting me or calling me regularly... just checking if I have changed my mind and would like to get together again... some are 'begging', I am thinking of 3 actually... LOL

 

I have absolutely no enemies...

 

I also know I'm good at what I do!

[serial muse]

Maybe I’m just cynical but women do use men to get what they want.

 

This makes me very angry. But whatever.

 

I guess I have nothing else to say on this thread. It's based on a kind of cynicism toward the value of others' feelings compared with one's own that I just can't relate to. I don't see the world that way.

 

Perhaps we're not seeing it in print, halfarock, but what you're expressing doesn't sound much like happiness. You seem to have a negative view of women (see quote above) and even of the women you're with. That doesn't seem very happy to me. It's kind of troubling, actually, but you seem very set on it, so that's that. However. If you get around to thinking about the BS' feelings on the question of "are affairs really that bad?", please do read my post.

[Tomcat33]

This is an issue that I think about from time to time. There is a limit on how much emotional energy I can expend and always there is one that I favor much more than the others. My natural inclination is to be a bit of a loner. I would be forever frustrated and suffocated in a continuous monogamous relationship. But with more than 3, sometimes 4 at a time and someone gets left out.

 

There is this other part that isn’t being said. Wherever I go, people like me, and greatly so. The women in my life have always been very happy when I’m around. It’s very easy for me to make others happy. Often times I think that some of the people who hang out with me do so just because they think that they can somehow capture some of my happiness. There are always old girlfriends that I am running into. It often seems as if emotions between us never end.

 

The women with whom I have the best relationships tend to be confident, independent women - women who aren’t dependent on men for their well being. Married women fit in here somewhat as they aren’t looking to me to fulfill their material needs, only their emotional ones.

 

 

 

And yes, I am very good at what I do.

 

That's fair your choice is to not commit to one person in particular sort of like perpetuating the honey moon stage with everyone you encounter. There are no deep ties that bind you to the responsible part of commitment, if you will for lack of better words, you just sustain that fun part and find women who will partake in this. I can't say I see it as all that bad really and in fact after looking back at all the ups and downs we experience in long term rels. I don't really see what the benefit is of a amd ltr other than to have a sidekick who you can call your friend and also share great sex with to go through life with. I mean if we really simplify what rels are that's really what it boils down to, and it's designed that way to give children stability once we chose to have them with our partners. Other than that I haven't quite figured out what the real point of a long term tie to someone is?

 

In your case you never allow things to have get to the point where you have to deal with things that could cause you pain. A psychiatrist might say you have commitment issues, a person looking at if from the outside might say you are just afraid of getting hurt and of growing up, a cynic might say you've found the formula to real happiness....not sure which school of thought I would adhere to myself but if it works for you that's irrelevant.

 

Now you're not married right? Because if you would be forever suffocted in a monogamous rel. I can't see how you would have ended up marrying?!?

 

Oh and what happens in the event you get caught by one of your ladies? Has that happened?

 

Lizzie he does indeed sound like the male version of you!

 

I wonder what would happen if the two of you went out? It would be so ironic if you ended up wanting to be exclusive.

But you both seem pretty set in your lifestyles so I just don's see why you would want to change anything. If it works for you....

[amerikajin]

And maybe a chaotic life is a life well lived. Every relationship I treat as an adventure. With everyone is a story just waiting to be discovered. I don’t watch television. Don’t need to. I am entertained enough by my life and the people in it. I am happy.

 

I see a lot of effort and attention given to your feelings, but what about the feelings of other people - don't they count? What about people who have no input as to your decision to engage in an affair, yet are left to deal with the consequences? I'm just curious: do you have any ground rules at all? How would you look a child in the eye if you knew that you were part of the affair that broke up their family?

[halfarock]

Oh and what happens in the event you get caught by one of your ladies? Has that happened?

 

Once I arrived at a dinner party with a woman(A), who I’d recently met, only to find one of my girlfriends(B) there with a date of her own. She(B) was actually one of my favorites and we had a lot of history, including the talk about where we agreed not to be monogamous. My date(A) knew a little and her(B) date was oblivious. To make matters worse I ended up seated at the table with both women on either side of me - which made me a bit uncomfortable. During the course of the evening my girlfriend(B) and I snuck off a couple of times to reassure each other of our continued affections for each other.

[bish]

This makes me very angry. But whatever.

 

Well it is true SM....women, not all I know, do use men to get what they want.

 

I truly believe my wife only wanted to marry me because she knew I could provide for her. I worked my ass off to give her what she wanted as well as my kids, only to find out she played me for a fool all along.

 

Well now she is going to lose it all and the guy she is with won't be able to provide her with crap. I am laughing inside at that one.

 

Not only that, this guy gave her a yeast infection. So not only is he a loser with no money, he doesn't wash his d!ck.

[bish]

Once I arrived at a dinner party with a woman(A), who I’d recently met, only to find one of my girlfriends(B) there with a date of her own. She(B) was actually one of my favorites and we had a lot of history, including the talk about where we agreed not to be monogamous. My date(A) knew a little and her(B) date was oblivious. To make matters worse I ended up seated at the table with both women on either side of me - which made me a bit uncomfortable. During the course of the evening my girlfriend(B) and I snuck off a couple of times to reassure each other of our continued affections for each other.

 

Why do you care about reassuring each other of anything? You already said you don't believe in being monogamous. So what is there to reassure each other of?