For those of you using dating apps, how are you getting dates?

[Sony12]

13 minutes ago, basil67 said:

Chemistry is what happens when everything falls into place.  But each trait on it's on may not inspire chemistry.  

Personally, I find charm a turnoff, just as I'm not attracted to a guy who's smooth.  They seem contrived.

Chemistry is generally just a vague term people use to say they are drawn to someone. And all the things we have been talking about are a part of drawing people to one another.

[mark clemson]

On 2/27/2024 at 2:50 PM, seamusharper said:

Why are you always assuming I'm doin PUA stuff? Since when is working on one's charm and humor a predatory PUA technique? 

I literally asked the girl at the barn out to dinner. Please tell me how that was a PUA tactic?

I think predatory may be more in the "intent" than in the characteristics themselves. That said, it's really not predatory to want to casually date as you seem to, and you are being open about your intentions for the most part.

The unfortunate problem is exactly as you have stated - men who want to casually date are in excess supply on the dating apps (AND in in-person meetings) so women have their pick of them. Hence my advice to work on attractiveness as a priority - I believe this will help you stand out and "be selected".

Another way to go is to dissemble (in your case) and suggest that you're interested in LTRs (which you eventually probably will be) and are fine with kids, etc. That should also increase your "hit rate" with women, but some might suggest doing that IS predatory, as you're promising something you're unlikely to deliver. Unfortunately, it's also something that (I believe) can work reasonably well if one is not overly attractive. (For clarity, I'm not saying you SHOULD do this, I'm saying it's probably an effective strategy for some less ethical men.)

There ARE men who are looking for LTRs and don't mind kids, etc - I know one in my friend circle who recently married a divorced mother of one. Unfortunately for women I think they are a bit rarer in the dating pool as they tend to either stay in relationships or get snapped up relatively quickly by the most attractive single moms, etc. They also tend to have kids of their own, as my friend does.

In some ways biology doesn't make it easy on either sex.

Edited February 29 by mark clemson

[seamusharper]

2 hours ago, mark clemson said:

I think predatory may be more in the "intent" than in the characteristics themselves. That said, it's really not predatory to want to casually date as you seem to, and you are being open about your intentions for the most part.

The unfortunate problem is exactly as you have stated - men who want to casually date are in excess supply on the dating apps (AND in in-person meetings) so women have their pick of them. Hence my advice to work on attractiveness as a priority - I believe this will help you stand out and "be selected".

Another way to go is to dissemble (in your case) and suggest that you're interested in LTRs (which you eventually probably will be) and are fine with kids, etc. That should also increase your "hit rate" with women, but some might suggest doing that IS predatory, as you're promising something you're unlikely to deliver. Unfortunately, it's also something that (I believe) can work reasonably well if one is not overly attractive. (For clarity, I'm not saying you SHOULD do this, I'm saying it's probably an effective strategy for some less ethical men.)

There ARE men who are looking for LTRs and don't mind kids, etc - I know one in my friend circle who recently married a divorced mother of one. Unfortunately for women I think they are a bit rarer in the dating pool as they tend to either stay in relationships or get snapped up relatively quickly by the most attractive single moms, etc. They also tend to have kids of their own, as my friend does.

In some ways biology doesn't make it easy on either sex.

Other than my self-confidence, externally I can't really squeeze out any more attractiveness on my part. I've done everything a man can do be get physically attractive, the rest is just internal work I have to do.

I am open to a LTR and I'm approaching each person with the potential of the interaction ultimately evolving into that and if said person is around my age, I make it a point to be as honest as I can from the very beginning to asses what it is they want and whether or not that coincides with what I want.

Things are very, very weird in the dating world right now as everyone here knows. I know many men and women that have completely checked out and have resigned to the fact that they'll be single for the rest of their lives. I know a number of VERY attractive women that have elected to be sugar babies for the rest of their lives and have no interest in relationships, marriage, etc.

Truthfully, at some point, I do want a LTR -> marriage -> kids but I will also say the prospect of marriage scares the s*** out of me. We have a number of clients that have gone through divorce and they will never recover financially or psychologically from the ordeal. I've suffered for a good chunk of my life already, I don't want to have to go through more if it in the second half of my life. 

Who knows what will happen. Regardless, I am working on myself as much as I can and being honest with everyone I interact with.

[Sony12]

1 hour ago, seamusharper said:

Other than my self-confidence, externally I can't really squeeze out any more attractiveness on my part. I've done everything a man can do be get physically attractive, the rest is just internal work I have to do.

I am open to a LTR and I'm approaching each person with the potential of the interaction ultimately evolving into that and if said person is around my age, I make it a point to be as honest as I can from the very beginning to asses what it is they want and whether or not that coincides with what I want.

Things are very, very weird in the dating world right now as everyone here knows. I know many men and women that have completely checked out and have resigned to the fact that they'll be single for the rest of their lives. I know a number of VERY attractive women that have elected to be sugar babies for the rest of their lives and have no interest in relationships, marriage, etc.

Truthfully, at some point, I do want a LTR -> marriage -> kids but I will also say the prospect of marriage scares the s*** out of me. We have a number of clients that have gone through divorce and they will never recover financially or psychologically from the ordeal. I've suffered for a good chunk of my life already, I don't want to have to go through more if it in the second half of my life. 

Who knows what will happen. Regardless, I am working on myself as much as I can and being honest with everyone I interact with.

Young women electing to be sugar babies likely has little to nothing to do with how difficult it is for them to get dates. And more to do with the fact that they just like men spending money on them. They are probably more capable of getting nice things by doing that than they are by dating men their own age.

[seamusharper]

10 minutes ago, Sony12 said:

Young women electing to be sugar babies likely has little to nothing to do with how difficult it is for them to get dates. And more to do with the fact that they just like men spending money on them. They are probably more capable of getting nice things by doing that than they are by dating men their own age.

Most definitely. I know they have their pick of men for sure. It's just staggering how many have elected to adopt that lifestyle indefinitely. I know things can change but of the few I've spoken to, they've renounced "vanilla" dating, marriage, etc. and plan to be sugar babies for as long as they can keep it up. 

[Sony12]

26 minutes ago, seamusharper said:

Most definitely. I know they have their pick of men for sure. It's just staggering how many have elected to adopt that lifestyle indefinitely. I know things can change but of the few I've spoken to, they've renounced "vanilla" dating, marriage, etc. and plan to be sugar babies for as long as they can keep it up. 

Well people in general aren't having kids as early as they once did. Even couples who are in a regular relationship aren't having kids in their 20's anymore (if they choose to have them at all). 

Many of the women you talk to that say they are like that likely just put an extremely high importance level on material things. To them at this stage of their life having nice things is more important than having a relationship that could lead to marriage. And I imagine half of them are also dating a guy their own age as well on top of the sugar daddy they have of whom they are probably a little more attracted to.

 

Edited February 29 by Sony12

[seamusharper]

4 minutes ago, Sony12 said:

Well people in general aren't having kids as early as they once did. Even couples who are in a regular relationship aren't having kids in their 20's anymore (if they choose to have them at all). 

Many of the women you talk to that say they are like that likely just put an extremely high importance level on material things. To them at this stage of their life having nice things is more important than having a relationship that could lead to marriage. And I imagine half of them are also dating a guy their own age as well on top of the sugar daddy they have of whom they are probably a little more attracted to.

 

Yup, they usually have multiple sugar daddies along with a guy they're dating outside of the sugar relationship.

[Sony12]

4 minutes ago, seamusharper said:

Yup, they usually have multiple sugar daddies along with a guy they're dating outside of the sugar relationship.

 

If you are finding a lot of those types of women I suggest you start looking in different areas as women like that are huge red flags. There have always been women like that though and if you are coming across a lot of them it really speaks more about the people you are looking at than anything else.

[seamusharper]

33 minutes ago, Sony12 said:

 

If you are finding a lot of those types of women I suggest you start looking in different areas as women like that are huge red flags. There have always been women like that though and if you are coming across a lot of them it really speaks more about the people you are looking at than anything else.

These aren't women in my social circle haha. Most of them have popped up on apps and we connect, only for me to find that out about them (they were expecting me to be a sugar daddy), some are on forums, Reddit, etc. 

[FredEire]

On 2/29/2024 at 9:32 PM, Sony12 said:

 

If you are finding a lot of those types of women I suggest you start looking in different areas as women like that are huge red flags. There have always been women like that though and if you are coming across a lot of them it really speaks more about the people you are looking at than anything else.

Yeah they are exploiting desperate old men for their own benefit, what makes anyone think if they end up getting involved with them they're not just going to be exploited also? Not the kind of people you want in your life.

[Els]

On 3/1/2024 at 6:53 AM, seamusharper said:

Most definitely. I know they have their pick of men for sure. It's just staggering how many have elected to adopt that lifestyle indefinitely. I know things can change but of the few I've spoken to, they've renounced "vanilla" dating, marriage, etc. and plan to be sugar babies for as long as they can keep it up. 

It's more staggering to me how some people (usually men) can feel happy knowing that the other person is only spending time with them and having sex with them because they're getting a paycheck from it, and they'd be gone as soon as they didn't. Like, what kind of person can do that long-term and not have it completely destroy their self-esteem?

But at the end of the day it's a trade, and if both parties are consensual adults then, well, each to their own I'd say. I can understand for sure that sugaring would be a more appealing option than a very traditional arranged marriage, since at least the sugar baby retains her independence and autonomy, and has some time away from the man. Fortunately, those aren't the only two options that women have, and most of us pick neither.

On 3/1/2024 at 8:08 AM, seamusharper said:

These aren't women in my social circle haha. Most of them have popped up on apps and we connect, only for me to find that out about them (they were expecting me to be a sugar daddy), some are on forums, Reddit, etc. 

Yes, that's probably the majority of matches you'll get if you're a 34-yo man on dating apps looking for women in their mid 20s... they specifically go for higher age ranges because there's a higher chance of the men being able and willing to spend money on them.

43 minutes ago, FredEire said:

Yeah they are exploiting desperate old men for their own benefit, what makes anyone think if they end up getting involved with them they're not just going to be exploited also?

Eh, the old men are hardly the innocent victims here, I'd think. They know full well what they're getting into - or they would, if they tried even the slightest bit to do any thinking with their upper head. If there's any exploitation going on, it's going both ways.

[FredEire]

8 minutes ago, Els said:

It's more staggering to me how some people (usually men) can feel happy knowing that the other person is only spending time with them and having sex with them because they're getting a paycheck from it, and they'd be gone as soon as they didn't. Like, what kind of person can do that long-term and not have it completely destroy their self-esteem?

But at the end of the day it's a trade, and if both parties are consensual adults then, well, each to their own I'd say. I can understand for sure that sugaring would be a more appealing option than a very traditional arranged marriage, since at least the sugar baby retains her independence and autonomy, and has some time away from the man. Fortunately, those aren't the only two options that women have, and most of us pick neither.

Yes, that's probably the majority of matches you'll get if you're a 34-yo man on dating apps looking for women in their mid 20s... they specifically go for higher age ranges because there's a higher chance of the men being able and willing to spend money on them.

Eh, the old men are hardly the innocent victims here, I'd think. They know full well what they're getting into - or they would, if they tried even the slightest bit to do any thinking with their upper head. If there's any exploitation going on, it's going both ways.

I absolutely agree. I'd never want to be a sugar daddy and being an older single man with money would make me paranoid that no woman I met actually liked me. Which is why I plan to not be single and if I am then I plan to be relatively broke 😂

I also don't like or understand strip clubs, prostitution or Onlyfans. A woman who has absolutely no desire to be with you, has likely been with 10s of other clients the same night and may well be a victim of sex trafficking, what's sexy or appealing in the slightest about any of that?

Sure, majority of sugar daddies just want to be serviced by younger attractive women and couldn't give af that they're only there for the money. I'm only saying that if you're someone who's not a soulless millionaire and might actually develop feelings for a woman, being a sugar baby's side piece might not be the best option.

[Els]

2 minutes ago, FredEire said:

I absolutely agree. I'd never want to be a sugar daddy and being an older single man with money would make me paranoid that no woman I met actually liked me. Which is why I plan to not be single and if I am then I plan to be relatively broke 😂

Haha! I think for most people (unless you're, say, Mark Zuckerberg or something), being in a relationship with a woman close to your age who also has a career of her own will probably keep you quite safe from the sugar crowd. You don't HAVE to be broke.
 

Quote

 

I also don't like or understand strip clubs, prostitution or Onlyfans. A woman who has absolutely no desire to be with you, has likely been with 10s of other clients the same night and may well be a victim of sex trafficking, what's sexy or appealing in the slightest about any of that?

Sure, majority of sugar daddies just want to be serviced by younger attractive women and couldn't give af that they're only there for the money. I'm only saying that if you're someone who's not a soulless millionaire and might actually develop feelings for a woman, being a sugar baby's side piece might not be the best option.

 

Agreed completely.

[FredEire]

39 minutes ago, Els said:

Haha! I think for most people (unless you're, say, Mark Zuckerberg or something), being in a relationship with a woman close to your age who also has a career of her own will probably keep you quite safe from the sugar crowd. You don't HAVE to be broke.
 

Agreed completely.

Haha yeah it was in jest, but if I could just be wealthy enough to comfortably pay off all my bills and not wealthy enough to have sugar daddy status, I'll be a happy man 😂

[seamusharper]

5 hours ago, Els said:

It's more staggering to me how some people (usually men) can feel happy knowing that the other person is only spending time with them and having sex with them because they're getting a paycheck from it, and they'd be gone as soon as they didn't. Like, what kind of person can do that long-term and not have it completely destroy their self-esteem?

But at the end of the day it's a trade, and if both parties are consensual adults then, well, each to their own I'd say. I can understand for sure that sugaring would be a more appealing option than a very traditional arranged marriage, since at least the sugar baby retains her independence and autonomy, and has some time away from the man. Fortunately, those aren't the only two options that women have, and most of us pick neither.

Yes, that's probably the majority of matches you'll get if you're a 34-yo man on dating apps looking for women in their mid 20s... they specifically go for higher age ranges because there's a higher chance of the men being able and willing to spend money on them.

Eh, the old men are hardly the innocent victims here, I'd think. They know full well what they're getting into - or they would, if they tried even the slightest bit to do any thinking with their upper head. If there's any exploitation going on, it's going both ways.

I try not to judge but you are correct, they're literally only with you for the money. Some guys are okay with that I suppose. Honestly, a lot of these guys just didn't have normal lives until much later and so they figure with all the money they have, why not live it up and get a bunch of sugar babies? As someone in a similar position, I can see the appeal. How exactly do you get over missing out on 15 years of your life having watched everybody else have fun? What's the point of having all this money if you don't have someone to share it with? It's tempting but what has stopped me is how disingenuous it is. Sugar babies will leave you in a heart beat if the money stopped. 

I recently met a guy who is my age getting women in their mid 20s off predominantly dating apps and he's not paying them so it's definitely possible.

[ZA Dater]

13 hours ago, seamusharper said:

I try not to judge but you are correct, they're literally only with you for the money. Some guys are okay with that I suppose. Honestly, a lot of these guys just didn't have normal lives until much later and so they figure with all the money they have, why not live it up and get a bunch of sugar babies? As someone in a similar position, I can see the appeal. How exactly do you get over missing out on 15 years of your life having watched everybody else have fun? What's the point of having all this money if you don't have someone to share it with? It's tempting but what has stopped me is how disingenuous it is. Sugar babies will leave you in a heart beat if the money stopped. 

I recently met a guy who is my age getting women in their mid 20s off predominantly dating apps and he's not paying them so it's definitely possible.

I have been thinking about your post and the issue with OLD and fundamentally I think it can be a case of getting matches but none you actually find attractive. Everything you do not want and none of what you do, I think this sort of sums of OLD.

Trust me on this a sugar relationship will not work to fill that void you are feeling and having looked this before I can tell you meeting this people is a wholly false experience, you can sit and have dinner with someone gorgeous but what you cannot do is rid yourself of the feeling that it is a primarily commercial transaction rather than a date.

You need to ultimately use OLD to supplement your social life which I guess is a monumental task on its own. If you are looking for the "fun" I think OLD is even tougher because there are endless options BUT it could be argued that looking for a LTR via something like Tinder will not be easy either so perhaps the best way would be keep a fairly open mind. Whatever you do, DO not compromise on what you find attractive. 

[seamusharper]

6 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

I have been thinking about your post and the issue with OLD and fundamentally I think it can be a case of getting matches but none you actually find attractive. Everything you do not want and none of what you do, I think this sort of sums of OLD.

Trust me on this a sugar relationship will not work to fill that void you are feeling and having looked this before I can tell you meeting this people is a wholly false experience, you can sit and have dinner with someone gorgeous but what you cannot do is rid yourself of the feeling that it is a primarily commercial transaction rather than a date.

You need to ultimately use OLD to supplement your social life which I guess is a monumental task on its own. If you are looking for the "fun" I think OLD is even tougher because there are endless options BUT it could be argued that looking for a LTR via something like Tinder will not be easy either so perhaps the best way would be keep a fairly open mind. Whatever you do, DO not compromise on what you find attractive. 

Yea I've since moved off the apps. The amount of time you have to sink in is time I can use to build my social life which, as you've said, is a monumental task since I'm starting from scratch at 34.

I did match with one girl and so far our communication is great. We have a date this weekend so we'll discuss what it is we both want when we see each other in person but I think she wants a relationship that leads to marriage.

Many have warned me of sugar babies and I've heeded their warnings. I won't be going down that route, there is a lot of manipulation and deceit in that space.

I'm definitely keeping an open mind and I'm not compromising on what I find attractive. I know I'm not pursuing the girls that people think I am. I just need to work on my social life and work on approaching.

[stillafool]

2 hours ago, Katie Collins said:

I downloaded this app called Buffet. It's new to LA and it isn't trying to get money from you like Hinge or Tinder. It's fully free and cool people. Might be helpful?

Stop promoting this app.  You promoted it on all your comments.  You aren't slick and we know what you're doing.  I've reported you.