do you just eventually give up?

[an0nym0us123]

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

I would agree with you because all of the platforms don't really allow you to sell yourself but its even more difficult in person to sell ones attributes. At the moment I am trying to win over someone from instagram of all places. There is some, actually a lot of common interests and we have actually met up before. She is early 20's which I guess is too young for me but at lease there are some fundamental shared interests so maybe some sort of friendship can come of it.

Strangely i always found myself getting more attention from late teens and early 20's women. Even as i got older.

Those currently around  30 seem almost impossible 

Either that i get quite a bit of attention from 40 plus women online

Edited May 3, 2020 by an0nym0us123

[Emilie Jolie]

1 hour ago, thefooloftheyear said:

Forget this....put this out of your mind.....its one of the most absurd things I have ever heard....I don't know what your issues are, but it absolutely has nothing to do with not consuming alcohol...

TFY

That's the bottom line; none of us who are not in ZA's position know. We don't know the emotional toll of having to deal with this stigma, or what it does to your mental health.

Also, that article shows the common denominator (not the reason or the cause) for men and, to a lesser extent women, who are in the same boat is alcohol abstinence and a rigid ethos. These combined are linked to social akwardness. It doesn't mean not drinking is a problem at all taken on its own (I'd have thought too much drinking is more of an issue anyway). 

 

[ZA Dater]

5 minutes ago, Emilie Jolie said:

That's the bottom line; none of us who are not in ZA's position know. We don't know the emotional toll of having to deal with this stigma, or what it does to your mental health.

Also, that article shows the common denominator (not the reason or the cause) for men and, to a lesser extent women, who are in the same boat is alcohol abstinence and a rigid ethos. These combined are linked to social akwardness. It doesn't mean not drinking is a problem at all taken on its own (I'd have thought too much drinking is more of an issue anyway). 

 

I think a good rule of thumb is people tend to take any form of success and that leads to confidence in whatever you are doing, when you don't get that its very difficult to carry any sort of positivity over and any sort of confidence. The thing that concerns me most is the fact I am finding fewer and fewer people I like. You described it very well when you said a sense connection, that's incredibly hard to find because more and more to me OLD feels like a shop, not happy with me, keep swiping which is easy if you are super attractive or ever moderately so but as a tall slim guy believe me I don't get any really attractive matches.

Someone once told me "go out and meet people" well that's easy when you are her, model, amazing personality, super confident, that's not so easy when you are shy and have little confidence.

[Emilie Jolie]

1 hour ago, ZA Dater said:

I have the co ordination of a hippo but even so it was these sorts of things, the sense of touch

Yoga can help with coordination and relaxation. It doesn't need to be with this particular yoga instructor; any instructor will do. One online, even. Try it in your garden if you have one, or anywhere really; it's good for the soul.

Sense of touch is super important, it's a universal language and it shows in your whole body. 

Are there sensory classes you could attend?

[Emilie Jolie]

3 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

that's not so easy when you are shy and have little confidence.

That's not easy full stop! Maybe it's not easy for her either, you don't know. It looks easy. Not the same thing. Lots of people put on a confident front for the outside world, they can be a mess on the inside whatever they look like.

I don't use OLD so I don't know what it's like, but if you get matches with women you find reasonably attractive, you must be doing something right at least. 

[ZA Dater]

2 minutes ago, Emilie Jolie said:

Yoga can help with coordination and relaxation. It doesn't need to be with this particular yoga instructor; any instructor will do. One online, even. Try it in your garden if you have one, or anywhere really; it's good for the soul.

Sense of touch is super important, it's a universal language and it shows in your whole body. 

Are there sensory classes you could attend?

I do some meditation which is nice and does relax me.

 

2 minutes ago, Emilie Jolie said:

That's not easy full stop! Maybe it's not easy for her either, you don't know. It looks easy. Not the same thing. Lots of people put on a confident front for the outside world, they can be a mess on the inside whatever they look like.

I don't use OLD so I don't know what it's like, but if you get matches with women you find reasonably attractive, you must be doing something right at least. 

The problem is I don't get those sort of matches, usually I get exactly the opposite. Again I suppose I don't know what people are actually looking for on dating apps like Tinder so I cant really do anything else than just be who I am and hope that is good enough which is mostly isn't apparently. Could be people on tinder just want to hook up, I don't know? I am of course even worse at that than I am at dating lol.

A large part of me just wants a nice dating experience for once but a lot of me is loosing belief in that being attainable. I have had nice experiences with perhaps two people in a friend zone sort of way and honestly I have enjoyed that, I could be me, being the best me I can and I am absolutely devoted to those two people because collectively they have helped me become a better person. I'd go so far as saying one of them was directly responsible for me taking a look at myself and realising I needed to improve, needed to work on things and I actually told her and thanked her for that.

Maybe my aim should be to put dating aside completely and just find some other way of filling that lonely void because as rational person I cant see anything getting any better and the more time that goes on without success the more disappointed I am likely to become.

 

[Weezy1973]

48 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

I think a good rule of thumb is people tend to take any form of success and that leads to confidence in whatever you are doing, when you don't get that its very difficult to carry any sort of positivity over and any sort of confidence.

Confidence doesn’t actually stem from past successes. It comes from a sense of self worth. The most successful people in the world actually fail the most. That’s because they’re not afraid to fail; it doesn’t impact their self worth. The reason they end up succeeding is because they learn from their mistakes, and do things differently the next time. 
 

You apparently have no interest in doing things differently, you take rejections personally (they never are) and definitely aren’t learning as you go along. You also refuse the advice from people who have succeeded falsely believing that it’s because they have some sort of magic charisma that you lack.

You’re extremely dug in with your beliefs and until you start acknowledging that they’re what’s getting in the way of your success (and not magic charm and charisma / looks), you’ll continue to struggle.

[Emilie Jolie]

7 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Maybe my aim should be to put dating aside completely and just find some other way of filling that lonely void because as rational person I cant see anything getting any better and the more time that goes on without success the more disappointed I am likely to become.

I hear you. I'm sorry that you are feeling that way.

If I may, I think your aim should be to live your life without hangups or worries, for yourself. As John Lennon says, “Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans.” You are a successful man in your own right, you should take pride in that, and learn to take pleasure in the little things in life. Dating is only a small part of your life, don't let it take over all of it, at least in your mind. I know this doesn't really address the loneliness; unfortunately I have no wise words to add to everything you have no doubt heard before. Still, switch things up a little, change one thing yo your normal day, challenge yourself to doing something you've never done before or that you feel self-conscious about, definitely try to explore your sense of touch more. Just live your life for the hell of it.

[basil67]

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

because more and more to me OLD feels like a shop, not happy with me, keep swiping which is easy if you are super attractive or ever moderately so but as a tall slim guy believe me I don't get any really attractive matches.

Someone once told me "go out and meet people" well that's easy when you are her, model, amazing personality, super confident, that's not so easy when you are shy and have little confidence.

OLD is exactly a shop and people are commodities.  It sits somewhere between eBay and used car sales. 

There are plenty who aren't model like with amazing personalities who meet people when out.   But it does involve doing social activities.  Anything from Toastmasters to a running club.  

[chillii]

9 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

This post did make me smile because at least there is some truth in what I am saying about not drinking being seen as an oddity in terms of meeting up with people. By clean slate I mean being able to eradicate the memories of just about every date I have been on. I would agree what you say about the peer review article in many respects and for men who land up like that I completely blame society.

I do sometimes wonder if I get passed over for not being "macho" enough but I usually just put that feeling away.

In terms of dates I would guess the most I ever had in one year was 10-15 with different people. Of the last few years I think its maybe not more than 6-7 at most so I wouldn't say I going on lots of dates.

It might surprise you and others that my idea of dating in my late teens was to try and be friends and then it would progress from that but that didn't prove to be true. But at least I did get chased a bit but at the time I was more focussed on other things to actually enjoy being chased, instead I fobbed them off. Part of me thinks I am being punished now for doing that.

 

 

You've go the non drinking idea all wrong . lt's not about not drinking , l know a few non drinkers happily married for decades, But if there is any truth in those stats it's more to do with the type of person that doesn't drink, not the non drinking , plenty of women never touch a drop , of anything, or touch anything else.  But l do know a few single non drinkers late 40s and 50ish  now been single all their life and not for lack of trying either and l can see in a heartbeat why they've had no luck. The big difference with them and others is that they are all very rigid very straight people to extreme , which is how you sound sorry to say . lt's about the personality that sometimes goes with the tea todel types.

Where as one of the married ones is my brother and he's a great bloke , very open and broadminded , great to talk to, fun , he's done a lot of stuff and doesn't look down he's nose at anyone , complete oppisite of the singles l know of , one of is a female, pretty too , but being around her is about as relaxing a a migraine she's just such a straight fussy look down her nose type, very judgemental , hence still single 48.

 

 

 

 

 

[ZA Dater]

22 hours ago, Weezy1973 said:

Confidence doesn’t actually stem from past successes. It comes from a sense of self worth. The most successful people in the world actually fail the most. That’s because they’re not afraid to fail; it doesn’t impact their self worth. The reason they end up succeeding is because they learn from their mistakes, and do things differently the next time. 
 

You apparently have no interest in doing things differently, you take rejections personally (they never are) and definitely aren’t learning as you go along. You also refuse the advice from people who have succeeded falsely believing that it’s because they have some sort of magic charisma that you lack.

You’re extremely dug in with your beliefs and until you start acknowledging that they’re what’s getting in the way of your success (and not magic charm and charisma / looks), you’ll continue to struggle.

At the end of the day how much differently and more importantly what? What is wrong with my approach to dates? I don't see anything wrong with the "strategy" but if you do please do point out what you feel is wrong. I know very well because I have tried I cant compete with the outgoing guy in terms of fun and its often said me to "make a girl laugh" well guys with that charm and charisma are a lot better at that than me and have the success to show for it. No, I am the tell it how it is sort of guy, if I can say something in 5 words I do and don't use 10.

I'd welcome my beliefs to be challenged, I'd be equally happy to be proven completely wrong but how do you suppose either of those scenarios would happen because I certainly cannot envisage either scenario happening, at least not with more than some interference from someone somewhere.

Mistakes, yes when I get a projection wrong I got back and look at the underlying factors, look at the company, look if I overstated or understated, I look at facts. When I look at dating I look at the facts according to my eyes, facts proven by my experience and again I'd love to have better experiences, please tell me where they can be found which does not involves churches, clubs, bars or meet up events or any other contrived sort of social event.

I sit at dinners from time to time, go out for time to time and I see the same things over and over again. Sure, they might not be your reality but they are mine. We all have selling points, I have mine you have yours but ultimately you are only ever going to sell if someone actually likes this selling points, you can think they are fantastic but if the market doesn't agree you wont ever sell that item. My selling features, the market doesn't like the and I don't really like the market so there is a stale mate. Either I concede my selling points are worthless or I concede I cant compete in the sector of the market I like. Those are cold realities, no emotion at all.

A great thing is to be proven wrong, a great thing it so prove others wrong but for all of that you cannot change the mind of others, I cannot sell loyalty to someone who wants fun, like I cant sell a Casio watch to a Rolex owner but you maybe just sometimes you might be able to get the person to see the other side and perhaps appreciate it.

Ultimately the best dates for me have always been the ones where I have had someone attractive and smart sitting across from me but they are also the worst because I know I don't have what they want, be it sex appeal be it confidence, be it charisma, be in fun, be it whatever really. But I enjoy that challenge of trying to sell a different idea. When I started this 20 odd years ago I believed people were receptive to different but as time has gone one I realised they all simply want the same: the best think they can get, which I am not. If  were I wouldn't be in this position today.

What do I want, it would be fanciful to think I could ever have a relationship, that boat is out in the bay somewhere but maybe just maybe one day someone attractive will smile at me, maybe even talk to me, maybe even give me 5 minutes of their time, share 5 minutes of what they enjoy, what they are thinking, what they dream of an aspire to because when its all said and done all I simply want it to matter to someone I like for just a moment and to actually feel some sort of connection. Its a fanciful dream and perhaps the road to it is paved with good intentions but intentions not seem because of opportunities seldom given.

I have given the opportunities but seldom been offered them.

So IF you can answer the above, then dare say it you have all the dating answers I seek. If you read this you may realise what I elude to or you may not. For me dating needs to be about the best experience I can find, I'd take 5 minutes with someone I really like overall over 5 days with someone I feel noting for. Perhaps that's my other issues, I make these women feel nothing, perhaps my lack of success radiates (it probably does but so you would you after the time I have been in the game). Ultimately its a game, the best players always win, the rest of us, well some of us might never win but if I could experience 5 minutes of what I really wanted then I could feel that motivation to continue the game.

Everyday I chase that ideal, believe in it but everyday the reality of life says its fanciful, either I wallow in the reality of it or I believe in what is a good ideal to me. I choose to believe even if the outcome is unlikely because a good belief is better than a terrible reality.

[Emilie Jolie]

36 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

if I could experience 5 minutes of what I really wanted then I could feel that motivation to continue the game.

If that's your goal, drop OLD asap. That's not what OLD is for.

 You gave it a good go, it hasn't yielded the expected results, so time to change it up. Try the 'wait and see' approach for a good while, see how it goes. Whether it works or not is besides the point since OLD isn't going your way anyway, right? You wouldn't be giving up, you would simply try a more natural approach that will take no effort. What do you have to lose?

[elaine567]

28 minutes ago, Emilie Jolie said:

Try the 'wait and see' approach for a good while, see how it goes.

This has been discussed before.
ZA Dater does not move in circles where there are available suitable women, that is primarily why he is on OLD.
 

[Emilie Jolie]

The beauty of the 'wait and see' approach is that zero effort is involved. No moving in the right circles, no clubs, no alcohol, no drinking. Quite literally, you wait and you see. You remain open to chance meetings, you put the pressure of 'results' out of your mind, you tweak your routine a little bit, and that's it.  At this point, the chances of success are equal either way. ZA seems to like logic; that's a logical approach.

 

Edited May 4, 2020 by Emilie Jolie

[chillii]

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

At the end of the day how much differently and more importantly what? What is wrong with my approach to dates? I don't see anything wrong with the "strategy" but if you do please do point out what you feel is wrong. I know very well because I have tried I cant compete with the outgoing guy in terms of fun and its often said me to "make a girl laugh" well guys with that charm and charisma are a lot better at that than me and have the success to show for it. No, I am the tell it how it is sort of guy, if I can say something in 5 words I do and don't use 10.

I'd welcome my beliefs to be challenged, I'd be equally happy to be proven completely wrong but how do you suppose either of those scenarios would happen because I certainly cannot envisage either scenario happening, at least not with more than some interference from someone somewhere.

Mistakes, yes when I get a projection wrong I got back and look at the underlying factors, look at the company, look if I overstated or understated, I look at facts. When I look at dating I look at the facts according to my eyes, facts proven by my experience and again I'd love to have better experiences, please tell me where they can be found which does not involves churches, clubs, bars or meet up events or any other contrived sort of social event.

I sit at dinners from time to time, go out for time to time and I see the same things over and over again. Sure, they might not be your reality but they are mine. We all have selling points, I have mine you have yours but ultimately you are only ever going to sell if someone actually likes this selling points, you can think they are fantastic but if the market doesn't agree you wont ever sell that item. My selling features, the market doesn't like the and I don't really like the market so there is a stale mate. Either I concede my selling points are worthless or I concede I cant compete in the sector of the market I like. Those are cold realities, no emotion at all.

A great thing is to be proven wrong, a great thing it so prove others wrong but for all of that you cannot change the mind of others, I cannot sell loyalty to someone who wants fun, like I cant sell a Casio watch to a Rolex owner but you maybe just sometimes you might be able to get the person to see the other side and perhaps appreciate it.

Ultimately the best dates for me have always been the ones where I have had someone attractive and smart sitting across from me but they are also the worst because I know I don't have what they want, be it sex appeal be it confidence, be it charisma, be in fun, be it whatever really. But I enjoy that challenge of trying to sell a different idea. When I started this 20 odd years ago I believed people were receptive to different but as time has gone one I realised they all simply want the same: the best think they can get, which I am not. If  were I wouldn't be in this position today.

What do I want, it would be fanciful to think I could ever have a relationship, that boat is out in the bay somewhere but maybe just maybe one day someone attractive will smile at me, maybe even talk to me, maybe even give me 5 minutes of their time, share 5 minutes of what they enjoy, what they are thinking, what they dream of an aspire to because when its all said and done all I simply want it to matter to someone I like for just a moment and to actually feel some sort of connection. Its a fanciful dream and perhaps the road to it is paved with good intentions but intentions not seem because of opportunities seldom given.

I have given the opportunities but seldom been offered them.

So IF you can answer the above, then dare say it you have all the dating answers I seek. If you read this you may realise what I elude to or you may not. For me dating needs to be about the best experience I can find, I'd take 5 minutes with someone I really like overall over 5 days with someone I feel noting for. Perhaps that's my other issues, I make these women feel nothing, perhaps my lack of success radiates (it probably does but so you would you after the time I have been in the game). Ultimately its a game, the best players always win, the rest of us, well some of us might never win but if I could experience 5 minutes of what I really wanted then I could feel that motivation to continue the game.

Everyday I chase that ideal, believe in it but everyday the reality of life says its fanciful, either I wallow in the reality of it or I believe in what is a good ideal to me. I choose to believe even if the outcome is unlikely because a good belief is better than a terrible reality.

 

Your dreaming too small my man , a moment , careful or you'll only get what you wish for, to hell with a moment wouldn't you like a relationship , only 36 no reason why you can't have that it only takes the right person for any of us. lt doesn't matter what the herd have thought , even the drinking thing , right girl will like you don't drink she probably doesn't either, and she'll probably view the world /life , something like you do too. We can't change your mind and thinking but as has been said 100 times we can be our own worst enemy mentally .

 

 

 

 

 

 

[SumGuy]

On 5/3/2020 at 4:15 PM, ZA Dater said:

I think a good rule of thumb is people tend to take any form of success and that leads to confidence in whatever you are doing, when you don't get that its very difficult to carry any sort of positivity over and any sort of confidence.

Do you have a job you enjoy, do you have a full belly, do you have a house that provides you comfort from the elements, if you get sick can you afford medical care, do you feel safe in your neighborhood, do you live in fear of the police or the government?  I'm guessing there are 2 billion+ people in this world that would consider that a success, a reason to have some confidence and hope in life.  I quick google search says the unemployment rate is in South Africa (before COVID-19) is 29%.  To me that says abject poverty and all that comes with it is rife where you live, and you cannot see the good fortune, the success you have that others lack?

[ZA Dater]

7 hours ago, SumGuy said:

Do you have a job you enjoy, do you have a full belly, do you have a house that provides you comfort from the elements, if you get sick can you afford medical care, do you feel safe in your neighborhood, do you live in fear of the police or the government?  I'm guessing there are 2 billion+ people in this world that would consider that a success, a reason to have some confidence and hope in life.  I quick google search says the unemployment rate is in South Africa (before COVID-19) is 29%.  To me that says abject poverty and all that comes with it is rife where you live, and you cannot see the good fortune, the success you have that others lack?

Sure but how much of that relates to dating good fortune? This is often reflected in the matches I get, I wont expand on this but as you know the issues with SA you can probably read into what I am saying here.

I am fortunate in many respects yes and thankful too.

Or is the implication here being, why worry about dating when you are more fortunate than some?

[ZA Dater]

11 hours ago, elaine567 said:

This has been discussed before.
ZA Dater does not move in circles where there are available suitable women, that is primarily why he is on OLD.
 

Correct, that's exactly why I am on OLD.  Between 19-23 I did pretty much just wait around and see what would happen, I took some classes at a college and didn't really meet anyone there either who had any real interest in me.  I did once get approached but I was so shy it was like watching one of these movies with a bumbling guy who cant get a word out when approached by an attractive lady. As I guess with most colleges the overriding theme was drinking, I don't know if its like that everywhere but it is here and as soon as you don't get into that step you pretty much don't exist.

Did I make the best of that situation, probably not. Low levels of confidence didn't help and the overriding feeling of not fitting in didn't help either. 

In many respects maybe the best thing I can hope for is some inner peace, maybe I should just sit back and do nothing.

[Emilie Jolie]

1 hour ago, ZA Dater said:

Or is the implication here being, why worry about dating when you are more fortunate than some?

While it is healthy to keep a sense of perspective, it is perfectly legitimate for you to have these concerns; this type of longing for a partner, a mutual connection with someone you really like is what a lot of people want, and those who have it, have experienced it, or don't care for it will find it difficult to empathise with those who have not experienced it. 

Sometimes, things don't go our way despite our best efforts, and that's that.

How have you addressed your low level of confidence? What work did you do (emotional work, not professional achievements) to overcome your shyness?

 

 

[ZA Dater]

1 hour ago, Emilie Jolie said:

How have you addressed your low level of confidence? What work did you do (emotional work, not professional achievements) to overcome your shyness?

I can be quite outgoing if there is a topic I can actually participate in but no I am not the guy who can go up to someone random and start a conversation, though in terms of work I can do this sometimes because there is always a common objective but someone at a coffee shop (remember when we could still go those) that's not really possible.

What I mean is a conversation about met who at what club, who slept with who, who is hot and who is not, those topics are useless for me I have nothing to contribute there.

Two people in particular have helped me to be a bit less shy, probably because around them their confidence rubs off on me and I try carry that confidence with me but its not easy, in the dating context its extremely difficult. The thing I believe with me is when I come across someone who is on top of their game as I like to think, I need to then raise my game and this I like, I am forced to be more outgoing and less shy but when I go on a date well this hardly ever happens, funnily enough I don't get nervous anymore about going on dates because well mostly I know how they are going to go based on the conversation up to that point.

One date springs to mind, ok she arrived after having drinks after work and then started with another bottle of wine, after which she was even more friendly, I don't think I could have got more attention if I had tried. That sort of attention was nice but morals kicked in and I sent her home in an Uber because she was in no condition to drive, would another guy have chosen a different approach? The idea was for date 2, which she agreed to but it never actually happened, we did get along well, the conversation was flowing nicely. I felt more confident after having a nice experience.

Thing is though, nice dating experiences are very hard to find and getting even harder yet still. The line of work I am in you need to develop thick skin so while the bad dates don't bother me that much, the lack of good ones does, the lack of good experiences, every year I hope they will get better but they don't.

How I work on shy....I chase confidence, how I work on confidence, I chase great experiences.

 

[Emilie Jolie]

5 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

How I work on shy....I chase confidence, how I work on confidence, I chase great experiences.

That's a super cryptic answer! I feel like you are looking at this the wrong way round - you first need to build confidence. You can't 'chase' or force great experiences; it's a natural process.

I'm not saying it's easy, but it seems to me you need to dig deeper inside yourself to build your confidence from the ground up - your inner strength is your source of confidence, not some external factors that may or may not come through. It seems you have suppressed a lot of your emotional side (we all have one, it's just more difficult to express it for some than for others) - would that be fair to say?

 

[ZA Dater]

31 minutes ago, Emilie Jolie said:

That's a super cryptic answer! I feel like you are looking at this the wrong way round - you first need to build confidence. You can't 'chase' or force great experiences; it's a natural process.

I'm not saying it's easy, but it seems to me you need to dig deeper inside yourself to build your confidence from the ground up - your inner strength is your source of confidence, not some external factors that may or may not come through. It seems you have suppressed a lot of your emotional side (we all have one, it's just more difficult to express it for some than for others) - would that be fair to say?

 

Well for me confidence is a function of success and knowing I can accomplish something. Confidence comes from measureable success, I cant simply wake up with confidence. I don't lac inner strength that's probably where my serious personality comes from, I have experienced difficulties I wouldn't wish upon others so when it comes to being strong I don't lack that but conversely that means I am very guarded too so no I don't open up to people often or very rarely and especially not dates UNLESS I can see some inherent potential and some common ground but again those are rare to find.

At the end of the day I will only enjoy any sort of success when I meet someone who simply accepts me for me and accepts I have zero experience but the chances of that person being attractive to me seem near to zero because what would make me appealing to that person who can choose from better? Nothing at all. I can call it as I see and be brutally honest with myself. I have had my opportunities and for whatever reason made nothing of them.

At leas I suppose I can simply blame myself entirely.

[Emilie Jolie]

25 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

At leas I suppose I can simply blame myself entirely.

There is no need to blame yourself. Things haven't worked out for you in that part of your life; I get it, that really can be soul destroying, but this is not a case for blame.

 

25 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

I have experienced difficulties I wouldn't wish upon others so when it comes to being strong I don't lack that but conversely that means I am very guarded too so no I don't open up to people often or very rarely

Have you been able to offload this onto someone you can trust? I feel like maybe opening up more about these experiences may help you feel a bit more comfortable in your skin? Of course you don't have to discuss them on a public forum, but I get the vibe that something is holding you back and feeding some of your insecurities or lack of self-worth. Do you think it would be worth investigating further? I don't want to pry or make you feel uncomfortable, ZA Dater; I really genuinely feel like you would benefit from opening up a little more (to a trusted person).   

Edited May 5, 2020 by Emilie Jolie

[ZA Dater]

3 hours ago, Emilie Jolie said:

There is no need to blame yourself. Things haven't worked out for you in that part of your life; I get it, that really can be soul destroying, but this is not a case for blame.

 

Have you been able to offload this onto someone you can trust? I feel like maybe opening up more about these experiences may help you feel a bit more comfortable in your skin? Of course you don't have to discuss them on a public forum, but I get the vibe that something is holding you back and feeding some of your insecurities or lack of self-worth. Do you think it would be worth investigating further? I don't want to pry or make you feel uncomfortable, ZA Dater; I really genuinely feel like you would benefit from opening up a little more (to a trusted person).   

Most people around me know about that difficult life phase. It was more I had to take on a huge amount of stress and support many people emotionally for quite a long time. Sure, its not something I bring up on dates but having seeing the worst I can usually put myself in someone else shoes which is good considering the people I meet sometimes in general.

I tend to look at dating where one needs to have certain skills, at 16 its ok not to have them, at 36 its quite a lot harder to explain why you don't have them. Sure, I can say I chose work over dating but that's not completely true and people don't buy that. If you had meet a guy who at the age of 36 had no relationship history it would probably be a red flag for most people.

It might not be true everywhere but here its difficult to explain away. Add the fact I don't have much of a social circle and people mostly don't see the risk return ratio being in their favour. I don't blame them.

Maybe I must  just enjoy what I can and not really look to date, which is  a lot easier said than done, because pre covid its quite odd going out and eating alone though I don't really care anymore. Its odd going to social events and never having a partner. People do ask and excuses become harder to find, believable ones anyway. Then again I look at close friends and their disaster like relationships and I wonder if I really want to date. If I had not met nice people I wanted to spend time with it would be easier to walk away completely but I did like that feeling of having some form of companionship.

 

[Emilie Jolie]

1 hour ago, ZA Dater said:

It might not be true everywhere but here its difficult to explain away. Add the fact I don't have much of a social circle

You're right, there is a stigma attached to it, especially in circles where men's 'attractiveness' is still judged on the number of notches above their bedposts. Many men exaggerate their exploits to make themselves sound more appealing, to make things worse.

 

In honesty, I don't know how to help. You will likely have heard it all a thousand times anyway. It's like telling someone who wants to lose weight to eat less and exercise more; obviously, it's not that simple. Just know that you are not an 'odd one out', even though it must feel like that to you. You are you, a 36yo man wanting to find a relationship partner, like many other 36yo out there. 

2 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

It was more I had to take on a huge amount of stress and support many people emotionally for quite a long time.

I don't really know what that means. Do you mean you had to put your life on hold for a while to look after family?