Is he serious about me?

[elaine567]

I have to conclude that neither of his long term live in gfs (from what he has told me) were women he saw himself marrying and having kids with, otherwise he would have. Not because he doesn't want marriage and kids.

 

Ok maybe, but surely if he was "the marrying kind", he would have ended the relationships with the "no-hopers" and gone off looking for better prospects, not hung around for years with women he did not want to marry.

My concern is that he led them to believe he was all about marriage and then he never followed through..

His story may be more believable if he was 32 but he is 48... awful long time to be denying his true desires...

I get it that women can spend a lot of time waiting for men to marry them, but most men play a more active role if marriage is on their mind.

[kendahke]

I just think about how much time I've spent with men who weren't the right person (for whatever reason) and don't want to waste time again as my clock is ticking very loudly and I want marriage and family very soon.

 

Understand that no man is obligated to fulfill this wish of yours if it isn't his, also. Make sure who you throw in with wants exactly the same things in life as you--and more importantly--WITH YOU. Plenty of men will tell you they want marriage, kids, the whole 9 yards but what they don't say is that they don't want that with you, but you're good enough to mark time with until that woman does show up. Make sure you are with the right man.

[Curiousroxy86]

Ok maybe, but surely if he was "the marrying kind", he would have ended the relationships with the "no-hopers" and gone off looking for better prospects, not hung around for years with women he did not want to marry.

My concern is that he led them to believe he was all about marriage and then he never followed through..

His story may be more believable if he was 32 but he is 48... awful long time to be denying his true desires...

I get it that women can spend a lot of time waiting for men to marry them, but most men play a more active role if marriage is on their mind.

 

this is an interesting pov elaine.

 

because my thought was...well alot of people men and women stick with people way longer than they should. its not wise. but when your caught up in chemistry, comfort, maybe sometimes out of lonliness, insecurity, not wanting to get back out there you may find yourself in a long term relationship with someone who isnt good for you. I mean alot of women who want to be married do that even though it doesnt make logical sense for what they desire.

 

but in your eyes if a man is staying in a relationship longer than he should you equate that to him not truly wanting marriage deep down or at the least its a major possibility?

 

cant say I full on agree but also dont disregard the idea either. I imagine it could go both ways

[Iris The Butterfly]

Introverted1 to answer your question about whether he’s advancing the relationship. He/we do not talk seriously about the future as far as us together specifically at this point. As far as living together, marriage, kids with each other, no. He has made half- jokes about how we aren’t married or have kids “yet”, he made a ‘joke’ about me being his fiancée, at his work event they put our names as Mr. and Mrs. He had just added me as a plus one and when we picked up our packet it said Mr. and Mrs. and we had a laugh. When I expressed my fears about my fertility he said in a teasing way, “you want to try??” At this juncture we are only discussing what we want out of a relationship and goals in a general sense, and he’s making half jokes about me being his wife and having kids together. I’m well aware when a man talks about those things it’s not based in reality it’s just kind of a fantasy, talk not the walk. I’ve been with other men who talked about us getting married someday, all that. Never followed through. I know that words don’t mean much at all it’s the actions. If someone wanted to marry me they wouldn’t just talk about it they would do it. The same goes for him and his ‘jokes’. He’s not serious about it it just maybe sounds nice to fantasize about at this point.

 

 

The only concrete talk of the future is the family introductions, events a couple months away, he talks about maybe taking me back to his hometown (across the country). No, we do not have concrete future plans as to taking things to the next level. I suppose that may or may not happen within the next 6 months. If it doesn’t amount to concrete plans soon, like within the next 3-6 months, I’ll know.

 

Elaine takes a cynical POV. I cannot say for 100% certain but just because he has had opportunities with previous gfs long term to get married and have kids, doesn’t mean he was stringing them along. He did end the relationships ultimately and obviously didn’t want to marry them otherwise he would have. I don’t know if he led them to believe he wanted marriage and kids with them. Maybe he didn’t. I’d like to find that out!

 

That was the point that Kendahke made. We’ve all been there, biding the time (for whatever reason, usually because we care for the other person, get comfortable, wanted to make it work, liked the drama, didn’t want to start over, etc.) It doesn’t make it right and sadly that’s how people (myself included) end up 35 and still looking for the right person to spend their life with. I’ve spent many years going back and forth with bad partners in my 20s. Finally snapped out of it my early 30s and now I mean business. I used to pass the time too… because I thought I had a lot of it in front of me. Now I won’t date a man for more than a year if he’s not committing fully as in intending/planning for marriage. He told me about the woman he was with in his 20s, they dated a long time. He admitted that in hindsight he really wasn’t that into her, and was just biding his time because he liked her and thought she had a good family. He said he wasn’t “gaga” over her. I can’t say whether at one time he thought about marrying her or they even talked about it. I said in response to that I would hope he’s not doing that with me, and he said of course not, he loves what we have and he was young then, wasn’t really thinking far ahead.

 

I think the biggest factor is that many men and women (myself included) of course will say they want marriage and family, which is true for them. But they don’t want to marry just anyone and have kids for the hell of it, and are holding out for that right person and family unit because they want their marriage to last and be happy. I guess some more time will tell as to whether we both see that with each other. I believe that will be revealed soon enough. For example, my lease is ending in October and he knows that. He also knows I’m not happy with my place, I just moved in October, right before I met him. He talks about wanting to buy a bigger house in the next year, to accommodate a family. I would say maybe the first serious topic that might come up, and that I would welcome… is the idea of living together. I’m not sure if we’re there yet or if that will happen. We will see.

Edited March 28, 2019 by littlebridge

[Curiousroxy86]

Well honey I'm rooting for you whether it works out with this guy or not

 

Please keep us posted

[elaine567]

I’ve spent many years going back and forth with bad partners in my 20s. Finally snapped out of it my early 30s and now I mean business.

That is why I said if he was 32 he would be more believable that he was indeed looking for "the one", but he is 48.

He didn't learn and set out to "mean business", no, he was still free wheeling in his 30s and his 40s...

[Iris The Butterfly]

That is why I said if he was 32 he would be more believable that he was indeed looking for "the one", but he is 48.

He didn't learn and set out to "mean business", no, he was still free wheeling in his 30s and his 40s...

 

Yes. He was still searching and his long term exes “were not the right person and also he wasn’t ready” as he said. Not sure if he’s truly ready now or is one of those confirmed bachelors who just wants a girlfriend. More importantly though does he want that with me and vice versa. I think it takes a little more than 5-6 months to be sure on that.

Edited March 30, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Iris The Butterfly]

It seems like most men postpone or delay settling down because they can. Women don’t have that luxury if they want bio children. He waited as did I. The only reason I’m 35 and never married even though I’ve always wanted to be is because I wasn’t with the right person. Either I ended the relationship, they did, or I wasn’t interested in accepting the two prooosals I had. I’m marriage minded but for several reasons I’m still not married. Can’t the same thing be said about me? I never settled down? I was free wheeling?

 

Look, you’re nailing the fears I already have straight on the head. The worst case scenario is that I spend a year with him and he tells me he doesn’t want marriage and kids and it was all a sham, and he’s just biding his time with me and has no serious intentions. That has already happened to me in my life several times (being with men who were just biding time) so I’m overly cautious and have a more clear boundary on time frame.

 

I haven’t seen him for three days and we will finally reunite tonight. Counting down the hours. We both are!

[NuevoYorko]

Plenty of men will tell you they want marriage, kids, the whole 9 yards but what they don't say is that they don't want that with you, but you're good enough to mark time with until that woman does show up.

 

And sometimes it is not that at all.

 

I have a family member who is, according to the rest of us, a "confirmed bachelor." Not in his opinion, though. At the age of 50, he has been in a string of serious relationships where he was "all in" and convinced this was THE ONE, at last.

 

Because of his commitment issues (which he denies but seem blazing obvious to all who know him closely), something within him invariably causes him to cool off and withdraw before things can really get to that point.

 

The thing is, he's 100% sincere when he's in the thick of it. I think that sometimes the concept of a "player" is misunderstood. Some of these guys are not doing it consciously. They mean it all but then something in them makes them detach. They don't mean to, but they are heartbreakers.

 

I know for a fact, because I was around, that at least 3 of the women felt it was going to lead to marriage; he'd given them good reasons to think this way.

 

He also says that too many marriages end in divorce so he won't do it unless he's positive it's right - but the bottom line is, he has commitment issues, nothing is going to be "right" enough, he won't stick. It's a problem he has.

 

In any case, I think it's imperative that a hard discussion be had stat. His history makes him an unlikely marriage prospect, but there are exceptions to everything.

 

OP - you need to woman up. Own it. You are a grown woman, not a young girl. You don't need to pussyfoot around because being direct might wreck the "magic" and drive him away. If that is going to drive him away, wouldn't it be better sooner than later?

 

That is, IF your main goal is marriage and children. If you were just interested in enjoying the moment and whatever the future might bring, I would have a different opinion; I do NOT get the impression that this man is "playing" you. I believe he's truly into you. Just wondering about whether he is willing and able to change everything about the way he's lived his life at this late stage.

[greymatter]

I don’t think anyone here questioned your fertility and many women wait a lot longer in modern times to have kids, for varying reasons. In my case I married someone who didn’t want children and I was okay with that. Eleven years into the relationship/three years into the marriage that changed, and we tried to conceive and it happened on the first attempt. My child was born when I was 38. So I am well acquainted with being an “older” mom although I don’t think of myself that way at all. I am just me. My boyfriend also has teens which is one of many areas of compatibility (in terms of life stage).

 

In my family of origin there are four biological kids and one adopted-because my parents wanted to do that. It’s a good option and there are certainly children in need of adoption.

 

All to say I have hope for you that you may get the family you want. It’s so imperative to do it with the right person. I can’t say that was the case ultimately in my situation but we co-parent and are more amicable than most divorced couples because we are now friends. But it’s not what I would have chosen for myself or my kid (divorce). Having kids with someone is a life-long partnership even if the relationship ends, so choosing well matters. I know you know all of this intellectually but your biological drive may cause you to settle when you shouldn’t.

 

I’m not saying your BF isn’t the right guy for you. You can only tell that by spending more time together and not rushing into major life decisions. Even then there are no guarantees and we don’t really know until we look back - because of that, I worry you will settle and justify it by thinking “I can’t know anyway so why not?” People also change over time like my ex-H did.

 

I just hope that in the coming year you feel comfortable putting your true wishes out there and letting the chips fall where they may. It’s the most fair thing to both of you. Obviously there are no guarantees and we all make the best decisions that we can at any given time. I hope the very best for you and I think it’s great that you are thinking out loud here.

[JuneL]

^ Great post. Suppose your bf was to propose to you, would you say yes without any doubt? Would you not think you haven’t known each other well enough for such a lifetime commitment?

[Iris The Butterfly]

NuevoYorko: I know there are men like that. The George Clooneys, right? Is my bf another GC? Maybe. What specifically would this ‘hard discussion stat’ entail? Can you help me find the words? I’ve been holding things back to ease into things, take time, enjoy getting closer. Things DO reveal themselves with time. It doesn’t usually take long I’ve learned. The relationship HAS been progressing. He’s the one who has moved things forward. That’s been a positive sign in my view. Yesterday, he mentioned that he talked to his mom, who often asks about me and knows we’ve been dating. He told her about me within the first couple weeks of dating. He said at the time that he had told her he had met someone he was really interested in and that doesn’t happen too often, that he would feel that way and that he would talk about someone to his parents.... clearly he was feeling it with me. He told her that he met my family (some of them) a couple weeks ago, and she asked how that went. I encouraged him to spill the beans on what he said and he mentioned how he told her about the kids. He was all about the kids and really took to them and they all loved him. I asked what specifically he meant by telling her about the kids and he said, ‘well, just that your family could see how I am around kids.” As if they would pick up on that, as it would relate to me/us having kids together. I told him it was so endearing to see him with the kids like that. My mom mentioned it was sweet to see also. I don’t know… I took that as he wanted to make a good impression on my family, as he should. That’s important. He also said he really enjoyed meeting my family.

 

Coincidentally I got a message last night from my dad inviting US to Easter (with extended family). I was happy that he would include my bf, usually he hasn’t been too warm and inviting with other bfs of my past. I took it as he likes him which is huge.

 

I’m feeling particularly vulnerable right now and a little on edge lately, maybe needier and wanting his attention and affection. I need to ask for that and I will. I saw him last night and although he was affectionate as always I just needed a little more reassurance and attention. Plus all of this is on my mind and I’m falling for him more and more. Don’t want to fall unless he’s there to catch me and like you said, willing and able to change the way he’s lived his life at this late stage. He has had two very long term live in gfs, so it’s not as if he’s been living his whole adulthood as a swinging bachelor. He’s always been in relationships, whether it’s a couple months or many years. I just don’t see him at all as the player type either. Not at all.

 

GreyMatter: Thank you. Some posters have brought up my age/his age and questioned our fertility/ability and said we should get tested and I need to bring that up and be concerned about health issues and how old he would be if we had a child. It’s a sore subject. Like I said I would be very lucky to have a biological child, at this age or older. Actually, I don’t really care how old I am anymore, I’m already past 35… which is ‘advanced maternal age’. I’m far less fertile than I used to be and not using BC and pulling out for over 5 months seems to be effective in preventing pregnancy. I don’t know if my bf can physically have children. Neither one of us has reason to believe we can’t. I’m kind of leaving it up to God at this point. If it happens naturally, wonderful. I’d rather be with a man I love and who loves me and is going to stick around than just have a kid for the sake of having a child and being a single parent.

 

JuneL: In that hypothetical scenario (which I think is highly unlikely right now), I could not say yes to a proposal without any doubts being that don’t know him well enough yet, but I would very seriously consider it and be happy about the idea. At this point I can definitely imagine myself with him long term. Lately I daydream about living together which is something that with my last serious bf made me panic. Living with a man again is something I’ve been very cautious to do since I lived with my two other long term exes in my 20s. I don’t feel we’ve really gotten into the meat of the relationship yet. We’ve had a couple small bumps, we’ve learned some weaknesses, vulnerabilities, skeletons. He and I both are opening up more and more and getting to know each other still.

[Iris The Butterfly]

Update a month later... I feel that things have taken much more of an intimate and deeper turn since I last posted. It's hard to put my finger on specifically but I feel we have opened up and are much more vulnerable, seeing a deeper, more personal, vulnerable side of each other. He was hugging and kissing me last week and he let it slip, "I love my baby". That's not exactly 'I love you' but that may as well have been and I believe him. That same night we both confessed we are in love with each other. He came to meet my extended family at Easter. Is integrating me more into his every day, personal life, struggles, more than before. I have recently (again) communicated what I need and want (as far as the whole package, living together, marriage, family, what I want in a relationship), and he doesn't hesitate to be all in. In my experience when things have reached that level of seriousness the guys who weren't interested in something more kept a distance or started backing out. I wish there were guarantees in life but at this moment it is definitely feeling right. I don't feel the insecurity that I used to, coming from my own fears based on my past... he told me recently after a bump in the road... 'please don't give up on us... I don't want to lose you.' We miss each other terribly after more than a day or two apart. When we are together he is constantly affectionate and giving, can't take his eyes off me. People have said when observing us it is very clear how in love we are and how much caring there is between us. I'm very happy and just wanted to share that.

[NuevoYorko]

He was hugging and kissing me last week and he let it slip, "I love my baby". That's not exactly 'I love you' but that may as well have been and I believe him. That same night we both confessed we are in love with each other.

 

It's a real step between "I love my baby" and "I love YOU." That's wonderful news, I know that hearing those three magic words must have made your heart soar.

 

He came to meet my extended family at Easter. Is integrating me more into his every day, personal life, struggles, more than before. I have recently (again) communicated what I need and want (as far as the whole package, living together, marriage, family, what I want in a relationship), and he doesn't hesitate to be all in.

 

 

He doesn't hesitate to be all in - so do you have a timeline? Being "all in" is 100% about actions. Making it happen; right here, right now.

 

You really use a tremendous amount of words to sort of circle around the core of what's going on. Which, as I understand it, is that you have emotional needs and a ticking biological clock (no criticism here, I get it). It's definitely time for solid, absolutely DIRECT future planning, i.e:

 

Are you talking openly about marriage, or living together?

 

If living together, is this OK with you? Will it be ok for it to go on indefinitely or will you have a time limit for cohabiting before marriage?

 

Who will change their residence; you, him, or will you get a new place together?

 

What's the timeline for this move? I mean, EXACTLY when will you move in together? Not "someday." That period is over. You've been dating for quite a while.

 

Once the move has happened, when will the two of you start trying for a baby?

 

What steps do both of you agree you will take to have children, should any difficulty conceiving arise?

 

And all the other details that go into merging lives.

 

If he truly has no hesitation about being "all in," HE should be asking you to sit down with him to make these decisions. Like, next week.

 

Since he has not, it is up to you. Otherwise, from my point of view, you are not being true to yourself. But first you might want to ask yourself a hard question: Why hasn't he?

 

I do not intend to be harshing on you here, but all the Easter dinners and "I don't want to lose you" kinds of things, though lovely, have little to do with making solid plans for joining your lives together - and following through with them on a timeline that BOTH of you are happy with.

 

 

He sounds like a fine, kind guy, your relationship seems romantically fulfilling for you. I don't question his feeling for you. Are you ready to remain just like this for the duration? Would you prefer having exactly this relationship with him for as long as it lasts rather than risk losing him by asserting your needs? I hope so, because that is what you're doing right now. Which, I want to be clear, I think is 100% fine - just not if what you really need to be happy is "the family unit" including marriage and kid(s). If this is the case, you owe it to yourself to move strongly and directly in that direction.

 

 

In a nutshell - what's next and when?

[Iris The Butterfly]

It's a real step between "I love my baby" and "I love YOU." That's wonderful news, I know that hearing those three magic words must have made your heart soar.

Well, he didn’t say “I love YOU yet, but that seems imminent if he’s saying ‘I love my baby’ and ‘I’m in love with you’. We’ve had very intimate and close moments lately and I think a period of absence ignited that, actually.

Are you talking openly about marriage, or living together?

If living together, is this OK with you? Will it be ok for it to go on indefinitely or will you have a time limit for cohabiting before marriage?

Who will change their residence; you, him, or will you get a new place together?

What's the timeline for this move? I mean, EXACTLY when will you move in together? Not "someday." That period is over. You've been dating for quite a while.

Once the move has happened, when will the two of you start trying for a baby?

What steps do both of you agree you will take to have children, should any difficulty conceiving arise?

 

No. We have not talked about any future plans together as a couple related to marriage, living together or children or conception issues. We have only shared our future goals as far as what we want. We’ve been dating for 6 months, I don’t consider that a long time, it is still sort of new. He just met my family a month ago for the first time. I’ve never met his family as they live across the country but the parents will be coming this summer. Is it bad that we haven’t made plans like that? I’m not sure. If one of my peers told me that they were talking about moving in and marriage and kids with their boyfriend of 6 months, I would be surprised. 6-12 months seems realistic, but I feel at this point it’s not there quite yet. We’re just recently discovering each other’s’ true selves, now that the ‘best behavior’ of the honeymoon stage is fading. I feel like I have more to learn, personally. I’m in love with him but still observing, to be sure.

 

My stance on living together before marriage is something I shared with him early on that he brought up recently when I reiterated to him that I’m looking to live together, marriage, the whole package. My last long term relationship ended when I would not move in with my LDR BF without an engagement. He was asking me to move across the country and I wouldn’t do it without a ring and a wedding date. (One of the reasons). I shared with my current bf that I have lived with two long term bfs in my 20s for several years and will not be doing that again unless I’m engaged/married. That’s what he brought up again when I mentioned it the other night. So- no plans to move in together at this point. We’re not engaged and we’re not married. I don’t know, maybe he doesn’t know if he wants to live with me anyway yet. I guess I’ll find out soon. If I had my way, I would love to move in to his place because he owns his home and I like it better there. He has talked about wanting to buy a bigger place in the next year to accommodate a family. Not sure why he hasn’t done that yet, but it’s a goal. My lease is up in 6 months more and he knows that; he also knows I don’t love my place. I moved in weeks before we started dating. Lately I’ve been thinking about what it would be like to live together… makes me happy to think about.

 

If he truly has no hesitation about being "all in," HE should be asking you to sit down with him to make these decisions. Like, next week. Since he has not, it is up to you. Otherwise, from my point of view, you are not being true to yourself. But first you might want to ask yourself a hard question: Why hasn't he?

 

Good question. It makes me wonder why not, maybe still too early? Or in the worst case scenario… my greatest fear… is that he’s just in it for fun and doesn’t intend on ever taking things to the next level… and I’ll be 36 by this time next year and no closer to being a wife and mother. I would say around a milestone like using the word ‘love’ and meeting the extended family…. plans for the future would (and usually do) start to materialize. When I say ‘all in’ I mean…. he wants to be in a serious relationship with me and have that every day, commitment and connection and wants to put in the effort that requires. Since he is not asking me to move in or when I want to start trying for a baby, should that mean I should be concerned? In my past long term relationships the talks/plans to move in/talking marriage, etc. happened around 9-12 months. It was definitely NOT before “I love YOU”, and was some time after that came up.

 

Are you ready to remain just like this for the duration? Would you prefer having exactly this relationship with him for as long as it lasts rather than risk losing him by asserting your needs? I hope so, because that is what you're doing right now. Which, I want to be clear, I think is 100% fine - just not if what you really need to be happy is "the family unit" including marriage and kid(s). If this is the case, you owe it to yourself to move strongly and directly in that direction.

 

I feel that I have made it very clear that is what I want. I want to live with someone, marriage, family. Would good would it do to continue harping on it? Either he meets me on that path and wants that with me or he doesn’t. I can’t force him to want those things with me. He either does/will or doesn’t. I have a personal timeline when it comes to relationships- 6 months is still too soon in my opinion. If things don’t move strongly and surely in that direction by a year I feel that by then it would be time to move on. Sometimes… I think that the view we have for our lives (in my example, being a wife, mother) is not always what works out. What if he and I continued on and were just a couple? What if I couldn’t conceive? What if my vision for what I thought my life would be just isn’t meant to be? I think about some of my female peers. Some are not married. Some are. Some have kids. Some don’t. Some will not. And I might be one of those people. My gf will be 40 this year and has a long term bf who is in his late 40s, but has accepted that she will probably not have children due to her age (and his). I kinda sorta think the same way sometimes. It doesn’t mean I will be more or less happy if I am married or have children. It is what I want, but I could also choose to be happy without those things, which is what I must do. Right now, I know that I am very happy being with him, being in love, being together, and daydreaming about what might it be like to live together.

[Curiousroxy86]

Happy for you girl and I think the way your thinking is smart.

 

Allow the guy a reasonable timeline to escalate towards proposal without you nagging him. And also allows you time to continue to observe if he is right for you of course. And when time is up and he haven’t escalated further have the lady balls to let him know what your looking for and how he feels about it and if he is not on the same page cut him loose cold turkey. Good luck

 

My personal timeline is two years. However I know you trying to have babies. So to each it’s own.

[NuevoYorko]

We have not talked about any future plans together as a couple related to marriage, living together or children or conception issues. We have only shared our future goals as far as what we want. We’ve been dating for 6 months, I don’t consider that a long time, it is still sort of new. He just met my family a month ago for the first time. I’ve never met his family as they live across the country but the parents will be coming this summer. Is it bad that we haven’t made plans like that? I’m not sure. If one of my peers told me that they were talking about moving in and marriage and kids with their boyfriend of 6 months, I would be surprised. 6-12 months seems realistic, but I feel at this point it’s not there quite yet. We’re just recently discovering each other’s’ true selves, now that the ‘best behavior’ of the honeymoon stage is fading. I feel like I have more to learn, personally. I’m in love with him but still observing, to be sure.

 

Most of my post was a response to you saying this:

 

I have recently (again) communicated what I need and want (as far as the whole package, living together, marriage, family, what I want in a relationship), and he doesn't hesitate to be all in.

 

Maybe 6 months is a bit early for all this, but you're already there. Which is fine, it's your deal. But since it's out there - and he's "all in" - doesn't that bring you exactly to the place where these talks and plans are made?

 

 

Or in the worst case scenario… my greatest fear… is that he’s just in it for fun and doesn’t intend on ever taking things to the next level… and I’ll be 36 by this time next year and no closer to being a wife and mother.

 

Well, a lot of people don't know what they want, or are just tremendously lacking in self awareness.

 

I have always wanted to write a novel. At the age of 50 I have not done it. I'm starting to realize that whatever has been holding me back might prevent me from ever accomplishing this. I will have to do some serious work on myself to get past this, or accept the fact that I may never write a novel. It's not because I never had the time, the inspiration, etc. It's me.

 

Something has been keeping your guy noncommittal for more than half of his lifetime. It's about who he is as a person - not because he hasn't met "the right woman" or any other external circumstances. That is not authentic.

 

I feel that I have made it very clear that is what I want. I want to live with someone, marriage, family. Would good would it do to continue harping on it?

No good at all. I don't think you ever need to bring it up again. The ball is in his court.

 

I'm sincerely happy for you for the positive way you feel things are going and I hope you end up where you want to with this man.

[40somethingGuy]

Doesn't sound like much of a challenge for you. Seems kind of needy.

[Iris The Butterfly]

40SomethingGuy: I don’t need anything challenging, that’s too much drama. I’m very happy with the way things are. He’s not passive or boring and that’s what counts.

 

NuevoYorko: I see what you mean about the ‘writing the novel’ reference. Yes. I would agree, something has been keeping him. If he wants to have a family, I would think that he would have done that by now, but not necessarily. Look at me. I keep going back to this, but I have always wanted to be a wife and mom. I’ve had the opportunities to be both, a couple times over now, and I made the choices NOT to. So it’s not as if the desire isn’t there. I made the choices I did based on my own judgment at the time that I felt was in my best interest. It’s not that I haven’t been willing to commit. I most certainly have committed to my long term relationships but in time discovered the men I was with long term were not going to be good long term partners. Not for lack of desire to have a commitment/marriage/family at all. In fact, quite the opposite. This is definitely something that’s been on my mind though and I do intend to talk about it this weekend with him, actually. From what he has told me about his two very long term serious live in relationships…. It’s not that he didn’t want a commitment, because he was living with them and dating them for a long time…but that something that they did caused the end of the relationship. (i.e. cheating, lifestyle choices).

 

When I’m saying “all in”, what I meant is…. he’s committing to being in the relationship, and KNOWING how clear I am about what I want. If he felt differently, or didn’t want to lead me on, or had cold feet… I think by now he would say things like, “I’m not ready for anything serious. I’m not really ready to have kids right now. I’m not sure, I’d be OPEN to it, etc, let me think about things, let’s slow down, etc.” If he felt differently he would want to keep a distance, not throw himself into my life and meet my extended family, or make plans months in advance, etc. I’ve been through that with other men so I know how it sounds. One thing though is that as I have been getting to know him I do see some behaviors/patterns that might be telling. I won’t get too deep into it but just some observations, mainly related to him feeling not easily able to connect with others, some social anxieties, periods of some depression, definitely tends to be self-focused and can get obsessive about some things. A bit set in his ways, more of a lone wolf. These are not bad things… I can be obsessive, stubborn, unyielding, emotional, etc. No one is perfect. Just things that I’ve observed recently. We learn things about a person after the initial honeymoon period starts to taper off. The walls start to come down.

 

On another note, I love that he plans special date nights. We have a fun date planned tonight and I’m really looking forward to it. Sometimes it’s a surprise which is even better. But he takes the initiative to plan and I really love that. He’s been doing that all along and I’m happy that it’s continued and hope it always will. We don’t see each other maybe but one weeknight or maybe two, so it’s nice to have a weekend date to look forward to. I have a couple girlfriends that are completely attached to the hip with their boyfriends or husbands and very rarely do things without them. They see each other daily, if not already live together. I was really disappointed when I went to meet my girlfriend the other night to catch up over a drink and she wanted to meet up with her boyfriend. We couldn’t have a private conversation. Another girlfriend said she couldn’t meet me because that night was her bf’s only night off. But they live together. I like time together, but there are nights that I still need my time with friends, to go to the gym, to catch up on errands, and so my independence makes being in the relationship easy, since we both seem to have similar levels of wanting to spend time.

[NuevoYorko]

I would agree, something has been keeping him. If he wants to have a family, I would think that he would have done that by now, but not necessarily. Look at me. I keep going back to this, but I have always wanted to be a wife and mom. I’ve had the opportunities to be both, a couple times over now, and I made the choices NOT to. So it’s not as if the desire isn’t there. I made the choices I did based on my own judgment at the time that I felt was in my best interest. It’s not that I haven’t been willing to commit. I most certainly have committed to my long term relationships but in time discovered the men I was with long term were not going to be good long term partners. Not for lack of desire to have a commitment/marriage/family at all. In fact, quite the opposite.

 

 

Not about "the desire." You made good choices to leave relationships where the guy cheated, but you also were the one who chose those guys and also to remain with them after I'm certain you received red flags. I've heard this referred to as having a "broken picker."

 

Since you are so clear on what your goals are, I'm curious: Why did you choose to date a 48 year old man who's avoided having a family for so long?

 

Not saying it was a poor choice, but one statistically unlikely to lead to the outcome you so strongly and articulately seek.

 

When I’m saying “all in”, what I meant is…. he’s committing to being in the relationship, and KNOWING how clear I am about what I want. If he felt differently, or didn’t want to lead me on, or had cold feet… I think by now he would say things like, “I’m not ready for anything serious. I’m not really ready to have kids right now. I’m not sure, I’d be OPEN to it, etc, let me think about things, let’s slow down, etc.” If he felt differently he would want to keep a distance, not throw himself into my life and meet my extended family, or make plans months in advance, etc.

 

Girl ... that's not what "all in" means. you have been around long enough to know that is b.s. His actions and whether your relationship is actually leading towards your goal are the things.

 

Don't hang so much on "meeting your extended family" though. You've mentioned that about 6 times in this thread. I just went to my niece's wedding with a lovely woman I've been casually dating for a few months. We had a good time, and we are not ever going to be starting a family together.

 

Since you're not actually moving towards engagement or cohabiting at this point, I suggest no more bringing it up. He knows.

[Curiousroxy86]

Nuevo I don’t get your advice to bridges...

 

You think she all the sudden should hound this guy after only six months on when he is going to marry her and give her babies???

 

Or do you think she should let him go because of the fact he haven’t married yet at the age he is???

 

Cause to me if a guy says he wants to get married and have kids and he is acting like a devoted boyfriend consistently so far and it’s only been six months like what more can you really ask of the man RIGHT NOW?

 

Do I think there needs to be talk of specifics on marriage and living together plans. Yes. But that’s what a reasonable timeline is for. I can see her checking in how he feels at a year if he hasn’t did it on his own already. Again it’s only been six months. He very well may bring this up on his own which is the whole point of giving a man a reasonable timeline to begin with.

 

Do I think she should keep her eyes and ears open and not be blinded by how good the relationsip feels in case he show any signs of backtracking on what he originally said to her, becoming distant, or show any deal breakers that may signal to her that she should not marry this guy. Abso-effin-lutely. But I don’t think she should take action until she actually see signs that he is giving her that he is truly ambivalent ABOUT HER. He seems to be escalating the relationship fine as would be expected at only SIX MONTHS. Now it’s different if he doesn’t escalate any further then what he is doing after a REASONABLE TIMELINE IS UP. It’s different if he is actually showing signs of distance and changing his talk about marriage and kids and she chooses to ignore it. But I don’t see him doing that YET. So at six months what exactly are you expecting bridges to do specifically???

 

Because I feel like your encouraging paranoia that can ruin something promising prematurely instead of encouraging healthy caution. I could be reading you wrong..

[NuevoYorko]

Nuevo I don’t get your advice to bridges...

 

You think she all the sudden should hound this guy after only six months on when he is going to marry her and give her babies???

No. I guess you didn't read my last post. I don't think she should ever bring it up again, in fact.

 

Originally, yes, I thought it should be under discussion. At that time I had misunderstood. This whole thread is about how 100% goal oriented she is in this relationship. When she reported that he was "all in" with her needs, I did think that this needs solid future planning to substantiate it. Otherwise it's meaningless. Now she has explained that she does not have the same understanding of "all in" that I do.

 

Thus, it's not time to talk about the potential future again at all, unless he makes a solid move in that direction.

 

Or do you think she should let him go because of the fact he haven’t married yet at the age he is???

 

No, I just think he's a statistically unlikely candidate for what she wants. She is in love and has suggested that she'll be ok if this relationship stays as it is and does not lead to the type of family she envisions.

 

I'm the guy's age peer. Don't know even one friend or acquaintance who's never been married and / or had children to suddenly do it at close to 50 years old. No doubt it happens all the time but still, statistically unlikely.

 

Choosing a man with his history when having a traditional nuclear family is the main goal is something I think OP needs to look at. It's harder to make a drastic life change the older we get. Also, I wonder how good he'll be at it, when he's actively avoided it. Marriages are not easy. I can attest.

 

Anyway, she knows what she's doing, I'm not there. If she feels good, which I believe she does, I'm happy for her. The ball is 100% in his court.

[Iris The Butterfly]

It would be wonderful to be married and have a family… but sometimes life doesn’t work out the way we plan. I could have a baby on my own if I really wanted, and be a single mom, but as far as marriage as far as I can see there is no way to force the situation. Someone said to me recently, “you’ll get married someday too”… and my response was “I don’t know…maybe not.” It really doesn’t happen for everyone. Not everyone has kids. My bf and I are more than a decade apart in age but we’re both single, never married, and childless. We are the exceptions in our friend group/family. I truly do think some things are just not meant to be, as much as we may want it in theory. Due to our own choices, not meeting the right person, not being a good partner, not being ready, etc. I guess it’s important to be goal oriented, but my only option at this point has been to only date men who also want marriage and children, in general. Whether or not we want that with each other takes time to find out, to materialize. He’s the first guy I’ve dated who has explicity said, “I want to have kids. I’m looking for something real/serious/long term. I’m looking to take things to the next level, etc.” I’ve been with guys who don’t say anything about it, or say, “I’m OPEN to having kids, I’m more open to the idea of settling down lately, etc.” They don’t explicity say the things my bf has. So, I have to take his word for it. After 6-12 months, he could very well have meant what he says, but he could realize that he just doesn’t want that with ME, and vice versa. He asked me my views on marriage and kids before we even met, so I don’t believe he would even waste his time with someone whose goals did not align with his. He stressed how important it is to him to have that nuclear family unit, no half siblings, no ex husbands, etc. He wanted to know that I wanted kids before he even met me in person. That shows me that it is very important to him. Why would I think otherwise at this point?

 

We can’t choose who we fall in love with. This is the most intimate, close relationship I’ve had in over 7 years since my long term, live in boyfriend in my 20s. I’ve dated a lot of one hit wonders, and had one serious relationship since (before this one), dated someone for 5 months last year. It’s a closeness that I haven’t felt for a long time. It’s scary in a way, to know I’m getting in deep. To me, things have changed recently between us, just in the past month. In a good way. I have a friend or two who questions whether I’m settling (NY mentioned that I should take a look at why I’m choosing to be with someone his age who never had a wife or family), and I do think about that. People have suggested, “why don’t you date someone your own age who doesn’t do xyz, or who does do xyz.?” I’m sure I could date men my age, and have, but that doesn’t guarantee we will make a connection or fall in love, or want the same things. Men around my age who are never married or recently single – have no desire to settle down, if they’re out there, I haven’t found them yet, or if I have, they don’t like me or vice versa. I’ve dated more than any woman I know. Dating was never a problem. Finding someone forever has been. Life just happens sometimes and we can’t control or force it. I don’t feel there is anything for me to say or do at this point. I feel we have a very loving, respectful relationship. It’s kind of in that gray area between new and very serious, moving into that new territory. In my past, it took almost a year before I started making concrete future plans and talking about living together, very long term future with previous boyfriends. He knows how I feel about living together before marriage, so we may or may not ever live together… he knows I want a family. He knows I want the whole package. From everything he has told me he feels the same way… wanting marriage and family… sooner than later. I thought that was a really good start, and here we are over 6 months later and it is wonderful. Unless something happens to change what we have or our feelings, I don’t see any reason why this wouldn’t continue/continue to deepen and evolve.

[Curiousroxy86]

well im with you on everything you said. again just dont let the chemistry and the connection you guys have blind you to any red flags is all I will say. if I were in your shoes I would be doing exactly what you are doing right now. I would enjoy the moment and lets things flow but I would not lose my willingness to walk away in case he ends up showing you anything remotely opposite of what he has been saying and showing. because that is one of the biggest issues women (or maybe people in general) have that when they are in love with someone they cant bring themselves to cut it off soon when they should.

 

enjoy it and love just dont be blind

[Iris The Butterfly]

Had a chance to write today. No major updates, just wanted to share. I am very happy. Since I last posted, I've noticed more of talking about the relationship and the future on his end... this coming week will be 7 months since our first date!

 

He asked me a couple weeks ago, "what do you tell people about us?" I said something like, "I tell people I'm very happy with you, they all know you're not just some guy I'm seeing, that it's serious." I asked him the same. He said he talks about me to his family (they live across the country), friends, co-workers (which I already knew he did). More or less that he feels the same way as I do (which I already knew too, duh). He was reminiscing about the home improvement projects he has done for me. I moved into a new place a couple weeks before we met and I haven't spent more than a year living alone ever, so I knew it would be a tough adjustment. But he just happened to come into my life at that time and has made it easier, not so lonely as I thought it would be. He seems to pride himself on being the one to help me around the house. He's put a lot of time and effort into that and I appreciate it very much.

 

He also has made more than a couple references to US having a baby recently too. Not just talking generally... like how HE wants to have kids. But specifically US together. It's hard to put it into context, as he said it in a half joking way. It wasn't like, "I want you to have my baby" or "I think we should try". It was more along the lines of 'if we have a baby....' or 'what if....', talking about 'trying'. I realize whether he intends to do that with me will reveal itself soon. Sometimes (or in my previous experience), men will talk about those things but don't actually do it. It's like.. something nice to think about, daydreaming. But... who's to say there isn't truth in that either? I think there is truth in it. It just tells me if he's vocalizing it he's thinking about it.

 

NY: You mentioned how I kept talking about how he met my family, etc. and that you went to a wedding with someone you're casually dating and it doesn't mean anything. I don't feel there is a comparison. You wouldn't also invite that same person to more weddings several months away, or invite her to your family party, or Easter, or dinner with your parents, right? Taking someone as a plus one to a wedding is a bit different than someone also coming to your family functions, etc. That is reserved for serious prospects only, at least for me. That same night, I brought up those two upcoming weddings in August, with no hesitation he says, "put me down for the steak" without even asking anything else. Last night was my mom's birthday dinner (just the parents). He knows how important it is (to me and in general) to make a good impression on the parents and be involved with the family, and he wants to. He's putting in the effort to do that and that DOES mean something to me.

 

A month ago he started talking about ideas for our Halloween costumes. Then it was "we're going to be watching that same movie for Thanksgiving this year too" (as we did this past Thanksgiving), talking about Christmas presents. It has become clear he sees a future with me. He's talking more 'we' than 'me' I've noticed. I have to wonder what is next and when.

 

I remember when I was dating my ex long distance a couple years ago, we were talking about an event in his city. He said, "you should come here (to his city) to the event next year." We had been dating for about 6 months or so. I remember alarm bells going off, and I thought, "so it seems he thinks or is ok with us still living in separate cities next year?!" As if he didn't see us being actually together then, or at the very least the relationship would still be long distance and he was ok with that. I'm kind of keeping my ears open for statements like that in this relationship that would indicate things not moving in a forward progression. So far, I have not seen anything that would indicate that at all, just the opposite.

 

We are definitely in love and it is clear to everyone who sees us together. I see a future together, at this point after all this, I can't imagine not being together.

But I have some mixed feelings, namely my caution about the fact that he's much older and has never married or had kids, like NY said.... that there is a reason why. Sometimes I could see that in his behaviors or quirks, he prefers to be alone more often than I do, he's a self proclaimed 'homebody' and tends to isolate himself. He gets drained by being around people for too long. Not always, but often. I'm much more social than he is, which just translates to me having a harder time being alone than he does. Because of that, there are times I wish we would spend more time together. Like why don't you want to take me with you to grocery shop or run errands? Isn't that what couples do? (Sometimes we have of course, just not as often). We spend about half the week together. If I had my way it would be every day.... but I realize that part of dating is NOT spending all your time together, it would be too much. You can spend more time together later, like when you live together/are married. Anyway, right now those things are my concerns/issues.

 

I also think about my peers, who are in their mid-thirties, who are coupled but not married. They have been with their partners for 2 years or so and no engagement, no marriage, no kids. They're around my age, some a little older. How are they any different than me and my bf? Does it mean that those of us who haven't married by now have commitment issues or there is something in ourselves preventing us from it? Or is it that we aren't sure about our partners? Is there something about the people we are with (or have been with) that is preventing us from taking that next step? Or is it our own faults? We are all over 35. I know all of us, of the friends I speak of, want to be married. They don't desire kids as much as I do, and my bf says he does. Maybe we are more likely candidates for marriage because we both are very clear that we want kids. I don't know.

 

My lease is up in October and he knows that. I have said that I wouldn't live with anyone again unless I was engaged/married, but I really do think of what it would be like to live with him. I'm not sure though if he's ready for that, or if he wants that with me, or even thinks about it! He hasn't mentioned it. He never talks about US living together, just that he likes having me in his house. My ex used to say that. (We didn't live together, but he wanted me to move in, I said no.) He's lived with two long term gfs in the past, for years. I don't want to be one of the live-in girlfriends again. I did that twice in my 20s. Not smart. Then again, I know people who get married after years of living together... so I don't know if there is any guarantee on that. In any case, I think about what it would be like to live with him and I like the idea. I mean to ask him how he feels soon. Or maybe I won't have to.

 

Sometimes, I don't know, maybe when you know, you just know, isn't that what they say? It's just a feeling. When we first started dating he told me he mentioned me to his mom in a phone call, that he told her he met someone he's really interested in, that doesn't happen too often, and that he would share that with her. He said, "when you know, you just know." And I feel that way too.

 

Just got a text from him that may as well have been 'I love you'. Very close. He's been hinting around saying that for the past month now. "I love my baby" or the other day "I love you, you're so cute", tonight it was "S heart emoji Littlebridge". We have recently made set plans for 2 weddings in the summer, and he talks about all the things we haven't done yet together that he would like to. He's already talking about the movie we will watch on Thanksgiving. So I would say it is safe to say there is definitely a future together and he's not going anywhere.

 

I thought the best thing I could do in dating since I haven't always done this is to be sure from the very start that someone you choose to be with wants the same things as you before even starting something. Of course, when you get to know someone and your connection builds and you see the real person that desire for those things can still be there yet not with that person. So... I guess time will tell if we both continue to feel the way we do now.

Edited May 18, 2019 by littlebridge