True or false: Men prefer average women because less work and competition?

[sabaton]

How do you know this?? I can't wrap my head around how easy it is for you to make those sweeping statements. i think your problem is that you believe your opinion to be a fact. Maybe you don't know many highly educated people?

Because the majority of people are obese or overweight and being overweight or obese makes people sexually unattractive.

 

Which makes the probabilities of highly educated who are also sexually attractive people to exist, low because again, most people are unattractive by default.

 

There's probably highly-educated people who look like Sean O'Pry or Sara Sampaio - but do the majority of them look like that or are close to their level of physical attractiveness?

 

No, I don't think so.

 

 

To be a fact. Maybe you don't know many highly educated people?

That could be it.

 

 

 

I mostly hang out with girls who work for Forever 21, that work at the local Make-up stores, girls who work as hairdressers, girls who model for a living, and girls who spend most of their free time at the beach surfing or sunbathing or playing volleyball or whatever other sport they like.

 

 

The same goes for guys. I only spend time with guys who go to the gym all the time, play soccer and basketball and such on a frequent basis. I also hang out frequently with the guys who were blessed to be casted as actors in soap operas, and who model for a living.

 

 

 

Most of these folks graduated from high school and that's it, or they went to college and they took a softcore college degree that they undertook just so they could get to meet lots and lots of hot girls in college, like I did, studying History because there's a ton of girls there to meet.

 

 

 

I've met a few people who were highly educated and not bad-looking but they were boring to me. To me, that doesn't mean those people were boring to someone else.

 

 

 

 

 

OP, please don't take some of the replies to this thread implying anything about your physical attraction seriously. They don't know you, they're simply making assumptions based on nothing.

I never said that OP was unattractive.

 

 

 

I said that the reason why there's lots of men who don't want to date career women has nothing to do with the profession and the accomplishments and the money and social status that the professional career woman has, but a lack of physical attractiveness.

 

 

Social status, money and such don't intimidate men all that much.

 

 

I dated girls who were studying to become doctors, while I was working at construction digs and carrying sacks of cement all day long.

 

 

 

It wasn't their high intelligence or their social status or the fact that they had accomplished much more at their young age than most people ever will, that made me feel sexually attracted to them.

 

 

 

i dated them because they were hot and I wanted to have sex with them all the time, and even if they worked as street-sweepers, for some reason, i would still want to have sex with them.

 

 

 

And these girls didn't care that I didn't have a masters degree - they wouldn't even care if I was a high school drop-out, that I didn't have a lot of money, and that I didn't care about being ''responsible'' and a ''grown-up''.

 

 

Why?

 

 

because they were bored of the guys they were surrounded by regardless of how smart and highly educated those dudes were, and because of the lack of interest in how much money I have or don't have or my lack of ''AMBITION'' LOL - I was even more attracted to them.

 

 

A man worth considering will want the whole package, and will not for a second consider the 'competition' or not putting in enough effort.

But how do you know this? There's lots of guys who aren't interested in competing with other men, even if those men are worth considering based on whatever criteria the woman has for selecting her mate.

 

 

 

Would you really want to deal with the dozens, possibly hundreds or thousands of men interested in sleeping with your girlfriend, and having to deal with the upkeep and the emotional investment(one of the side effects of dating rich girls is that they don't expect you to pay for anything) it takes to date a hot girl in the long-run?

 

 

I once stopped pursuing a girl because she told me she was approached by two guys at the nude beach she used to go to, and that they had told her that she looked just like Angelina Jolie.

 

 

 

I know, she was flirting with me and out to make herself more in demand, by other men, but what's the point of bothering with that girl when there's others who will be easier for me to take to bed/date, even though they are as attractive or maybe just a little tiny less attractive?

 

 

I don't know one relationship-minded man in real life who cares only about 'niceness' and 'hotness' in a long-term partner.

And? There's billions of men in the world.

 

 

 

I don't think you've met all of those men, just like there are billions of women in the world, with many of those women looking for characterisitics that I lack for(responsability, ''emotional maturity'' financial stability, and the desire to become a husband and a father, which I lack), and still the majority of women and men end up finding someone they're happy with and who fullfills their standards in a potential mate.

Edited October 26, 2018 by sabaton

[elaine567]

I mostly hang out with girls who work for Forever 21, that work at the local Make-up stores, girls who work as hairdressers, girls who model for a living, and girls who spend most of their free time at the beach surfing or sunbathing or playing volleyball or whatever other sport they like.

The same goes for guys. I only spend time with guys who go to the gym all the time, play soccer and basketball and such on a frequent basis. I also hang out frequently with the guys who were blessed to be casted as actors in soap operas, and who model for a living.

Most of these folks graduated from high school and that's it, or they went to college and they took a softcore college degree that they undertook just so they could get to meet lots and lots of hot girls in college, like I did, studying History because there's a ton of girls there to meet.

I've met a few people who were highly educated and not bad-looking but they were boring to me. To me, that doesn't mean those people were boring to someone else..

 

There is a whole other world out there...

[sabaton]

There is a whole other world out there...

 

 

Yeah, like what?

[littleblackheart]

Because the majority of people are obese or overweight and being overweight or obese makes people sexually unattractive.

 

Which makes the probabilities of highly educated who are also sexually attractive people to exist, low because again, most people are unattractive by default

 

Academic research shows a link between high education and low obesity levels. Again, you are making assumptions based on your own prejudices.

 

There's probably highly-educated people who look like Sean O'Pry or Sara Sampaio - but do the majority of them look like that or are close to their level of physical attractiveness?

 

No, I don't think so

 

Your prejudices are colouring your judgement.

 

I mostly hang out with girls who work for Forever 21, that work at the local Make-up stores, girls who work as hairdressers, girls who model for a living, and girls who spend most of their free time at the beach surfing or sunbathing or playing volleyball or whatever other sport they like.

 

 

The same goes for guys. I only spend time with guys who go to the gym all the time, play soccer and basketball and such on a frequent basis. I also hang out frequently with the guys who were blessed to be casted as actors in soap operas, and who model for a living.

 

Highly educated people also go to the gym and play sports...

 

I said that the reason why there's lots of men who don't want to date career women has nothing to do with the profession and the accomplishments and the money and social status that the professional career woman has, but a lack of physical attractiveness.

 

 

Social status, money and such don't intimidate men all that much.

 

 

I dated girls who were studying to become doctors, while I was working at construction digs and carrying sacks of cement all day long.

 

 

 

It wasn't their high intelligence or their social status or the fact that they had accomplished much more at their young age than most people ever will, that made me feel sexually attracted to them.

 

 

 

i dated them because they were hot and I wanted to have sex with them all the time, and even if they worked as street-sweepers, for some reason, i would still want to have sex with them.

 

 

 

And these girls didn't care that I didn't have a masters degree - they wouldn't even care if I was a high school drop-out, that I didn't have a lot of money, and that I didn't care about being ''responsible'' and a ''grown-up''.

 

 

Why?

 

 

because they were bored of the guys they were surrounded by regardless of how smart and highly educated those dudes were, and because of the lack of interest in how much money I have or don't have or my lack of ''AMBITION'' LOL - I was even more attracted to them.

 

Having sex all the time is your only drive for a relationship?

 

But how do you know this? There's lots of guys who aren't interested in competing with other men, even if those men are worth considering based on whatever criteria the woman has for selecting her mate.

 

That's exactly what I said?

 

 

Would you really want to deal with the dozens, possibly hundreds or thousands of men interested in sleeping with your girlfriend, and having to deal with the upkeep and the emotional investment(one of the side effects of dating rich girls is that they don't expect you to pay for anything) it takes to date a hot girl in the long-run?

 

 

I once stopped pursuing a girl because she told me she was approached by two guys at the nude beach she used to go to, and that they had told her that she looked just like Angelina Jolie.

 

 

 

I know, she was flirting with me and out to make herself more in demand, by other men, but what's the point of bothering with that girl when there's others who will be easier for me to take to bed/date, even though they are as attractive or maybe just a little tiny less attractive?

 

Based on this, you sound very young. How old are you?

 

 

And? There's billions of men in the world.

 

 

 

I don't think you've met all of those men, just like there are billions of women in the world, with many of those women looking for characterisitics that I lack for(responsability, ''emotional maturity'' financial stability, and the desire to become a husband and a father, which I lack), and still the majority of women and men end up finding someone they're happy with and who fullfills their standards in a potential mate

 

As I said, those people I know who are genuinely looking for a long-term committed relationship want more than 'niceness' and 'hotness' out of their potential partner. You are openly admitting to lacking responsibility, emotional maturity, and financial stability - on that basis, I can see why you heavily rely on the physical side of things.

 

If I were looking for a partner, I'd want someone looking to better themselves and challenge themselves all the time, and not just at the gym. Physical attraction and 'niceness' are, to me, the absolute base level minimum requirement you can look for.

 

I don't really care about education levels despite being highly educated myself as long as they are intellectually curious, I don't care about the paycheck as long as they have drive and are self-sufficient, I don't care about the muscles if they don't have emotional maturity.

 

I don't need to meet all men to know a relationship based on 'hotness' and 'niceness' alone is not sustainable long-term if the values do not align.

[stillafool]

Thin or slender doesn't always make someone automatically attractive. I've seen some butt ugly people who had fit bodies. Good looks encompass good skin, good hair, pretty eyes, nice teeth, posture. If you put these things on a fit body then you have a good looking person.

[sabaton]

Thin or slender doesn't always make someone automatically attractive. I've seen some butt ugly people who had fit bodies. Good looks encompass good skin, good hair, pretty eyes, nice teeth, posture. If you put these things on a fit body then you have a good looking person.

 

 

In a Country where the overwhelmingly majority of the Country are obese, being thin or slender makes someone automatically attractive. That's why there are camgirls making fortunes off the desire many men have for non-overweight/obese girls when those same girls look exactly, or are less attractive than the girls I see around working in cofee shops as waitresses.

 

 

And yes, I agree with the rest of what you said.

[thefooloftheyear]

Without getting into too much detail, my company is located next to a business that caters to a variety of mostly intellectuals/academic types...

 

If you stand around and watch the people that go in and out of there, its just a parade of butt ugly...Men AND women...Shoddy dressed, horrible physiques, women with no bras and tits down to their waistline...Stringy hair, etc...Guys with flood type pants, ugly glasses, most of them look like pedophiles...

 

Now. I wont say there are none that are well kept, because I am sure there are...but if this is any indication, then it does lend some credibility to the stereotype...

 

TFY

[alphamale]

Now. I wont say there are none that are well kept, because I am sure there are...but if this is any indication, then it does lend some credibility to the stereotype...

 

TFY

 

stereotypes exist for a reason

[littleblackheart]

 

Sterotype 1 - all non educated people are lazy slobs.

 

Stereotype 2 - all muscle heads are vain

 

Stereotype 3 - all short guys have confidence issues.

 

 

Etc....

 

Stereotypes exist because we don't like to confront our own prejudices....

[sabaton]

Academic research shows a link between high education and low obesity levels. Again, you are making assumptions based on your own prejudices.

That would explain why in the tens of thousands of people I'd see everyday in the college campus, there were only a handful of people who were overweight.

 

 

But there's more to attractiveness than just being fit, or thin or skinny.

 

 

Clear skin, without blemishes like acne, acne scars. A healthy tan, big, clear eyes, full lips, straight white teeth, a full head of hair(for the men) long, thick, lustrous hair for the women, great posture, and being pleasant to talk to - all of that adds and makes up a person's attractiveness and beauty.

 

 

The majority of highly educated career women or men look like that???

 

 

 

Your prejudices are colouring your judgement.

What prejudices?

 

Having sex all the time is your only drive for a relationship?

No, but it's the major area in a relationship that makes me want to have a relationship. Someone I'm sexually attracted to, who is as sexually attracted to me as I am to her. Someone who has a high sex drive and directs that high sex drive at me.

 

 

 

Based on this, you sound very young. How old are you?

Ah. I wish. College was fun. I'm 29 years old.

 

 

As I said, those people I know who are genuinely looking for a long-term committed relationship want more than 'niceness' and 'hotness' out of their potential partner.

I've had long-term relationships that were based on hotness and niceness and the desire the girls had to have sex with me. It was so much fun. There were no bills to pay, no mortgage to pay, because we weren't living together, we weren't renting a place.

 

 

But I had to terminate those relationships because they decided that when they were to graduate, they wanted to get married and have kids.

 

 

 

 

 

You are openly admitting to lacking responsibility, emotional maturity, and financial stability - on that basis, I can see why you heavily rely on the physical side of things.

I heavily rely on the physical side of things because I date to gain constant access to sex. To mutually enjoyable sex.

 

 

 

Hooking-up takes time. You have to go to the nightclub/tinder, you have to compete with the other guys, and then there are no guarantees that the sex is going to be good at all, or that she ain't gonna regret it: whereas in a relationship you know each other's desires.

 

 

 

What you like, what she likes, and sex within a relationship is much more safe. You can go off condoms because she's been tested for stds, and you've had a vasectomy so the risk of her getting pregnant is not there at all.

 

 

I can't do that with random girls I meet.

 

 

I don't have emotional maturity because emotional maturity to many people is living life in a completely different manner to which I live.

 

 

 

I frequently get asked by my friends who I went to high school with or college how did I manage to stay looking so young despite my age, to which I reply with, ''by avoiding the responsabilities, obligations, and expectations people would have of me.''

 

 

I say this with a grin but it's quite true. My lifestyle allows me to remain young. In my body, in my face, and in my spirit and mind.

 

I live with roomates. I don't own my own house. I have no interest in ever owning a house. Which makes me be less of a good potential mate to someone who is looking for marriage.

 

I've had girls who sadly decided I was dating material, and wanted me to become their boyfriend before they had sex with me, that expected me to grow up and become what they wanted me to become.

 

I had one girl call me at noon waking me up without meaning to do it, after I had spent the night drinking and getting drunk with my friends and going for midnight swims, and she gave me a huge rant how I was 25 and that I had no goals in life, no direction, that I was a sailboat at sea without a harbor to find, and that she wouldn't date me if I kept being the way that I was.

 

 

She was ranting hard at me, saying that she had been up and about since 5 AM, getting her brothers ready for school, getting her house chores done, working at her job, buying groceries and doing other stuff while I wasn't even getting up to find a job lol.

 

To her, I was emotionally immature and not fit to be her boyfriend.

But for her 18 year old cousin who had just graduated from an all-girl high school I was just the exact right of emotionally mature.

 

 

If I were looking for a partner, I'd want someone looking to better themselves and challenge themselves all the time, and not just at the gym. Physical attraction and 'niceness' are, to me, the absolute base level minimum requirement you can look for.

That's awesome. It's great to have high standards for ourselves and for others. Edited October 26, 2018 by sabaton

[thefooloftheyear]

 

Sterotype 1 - all non educated people are lazy slobs.

 

Stereotype 2 - all muscle heads are vain

 

Stereotype 3 - all short guys have confidence issues.

 

 

Etc....

 

Stereotypes exist because we don't like to confront our own prejudices....

 

Funny story...

 

When I was in college, my undergrad discipline was science/biology based...As such, I had to enroll in a variety of advanced math/physics/chemistry classes.,.

 

Many of the instructors were the type that looked down on us as a bunch of dumb kids, and they were mostly wasting their time trying to educate us, as opposed to doing other more meaningful work...

 

The days were full of derogatory comments, eye rolls, etc, Heaven forbid you didn't understand the material fully...

 

Meanwhile most of them, especially one that I remember clearly, couldn't even dress himself in the morning or know how to properly bathe or use deodorant...

 

Then i'd see him in the parking lot, rolling down the road in his piece of shyt car, that had half the panels falling off them....

 

I think some of them just live in their own world, and don't realize whats happening around them...That's fine, but it doesn't make them better or more attractive in the conventional sense anyway..

 

TFY

[sabaton]

Funny story...

 

When I was in college, my undergrad discipline was science/biology based...As such, I had to enroll in a variety of advanced math/physics/chemistry classes.,.

 

Many of the instructors were the type that looked down on us as a bunch of dumb kids, and they were mostly wasting their time trying to educate us, as opposed to doing other more meaningful work...

 

 

I had a 60 something college teacher who was a world-class authority on what he taught, having writen many books about the subjects he taught, and being prized by his international co-workers, massively.

 

 

He would never waste the opportunity to demean other people, he was also 6 feet tall and one day he said to me, ''it's good that you gave your free seat to that girl, because you might just grow up a few inches''

 

 

And there were many other people I've met with master degrees and PhD's and scholarships in highly esteemed colleges who were always up and about how amazing they were, and how they were better than the rest of us, and how much money they made, and how many Countries they visited.

[littleblackheart]

That would explain why in the tens of thousands of people I'd see everyday in the college campus, there were only a handful of people who were overweight.

 

 

But there's more to attractiveness than just being fit, or thin or skinny.

 

 

Clear skin, without blemishes like acne, acne scars. A healthy tan, big, clear eyes, full lips, straight white teeth, a full head of hair(for the men) long, thick, lustrous hair for the women, great posture, and being pleasant to talk to - all of that adds and makes up a person's attractiveness and beauty.

 

 

The majority of highly educated career women or men look like that???

 

Honestly no, but the majority yes. Enough to question where these sterotypes come from. Maybe it's a cultural thing, I don't know.

 

What prejudices?

The majority of highly educated people are not physically attractive because of obesity levels and a bunch of puzzling statements you've been making on this thread.

 

No, but it's the major area in a relationship that makes me want to have a relationship. Someone I'm sexually attracted to, who is as sexually attracted to me as I am to her. Someone who has a high sex drive and directs that high sex drive at me.

 

Ok but if the rest doesn't follow, even that will dry out eventually.

 

I've had long-term relationships that were based on hotness and niceness and the desire the girls had to have sex with me. It was so much fun. There were no bills to pay, no mortgage to pay, because we weren't living together, we weren't renting a place.

 

 

But I had to terminate those relationships because they decided that when they were to graduate, they wanted to get married and have kids.

 

 

I heavily rely on the physical side of things because I date to gain constant access to sex. To mutually enjoyable sex.

 

 

 

Hooking-up takes time. You have to go to the nightclub/tinder, you have to compete with the other guys, and then there are no guarantees that the sex is going to be good at all, or that she ain't gonna regret it: whereas in a relationship you know each other's desires.

 

 

 

What you like, what she likes, and sex within a relationship is much more safe. You can go off condoms because she's been tested for stds, and you've had a vasectomy so the risk of her getting pregnant is not there at all.

 

You've literally just illustrated my point .

 

Plenty of people live life the way you do - responsibility-free. There's nothing wrong with that at all but a committed relationship is a responsibility of sorts, and what OP seems to look for so I guess your worldview and hers are wildly different.

 

Look, maybe you've had bad experiences at university but this doesn't mean all educated people are precious self-centered judgemental snobs.

 

Yes, some of them are like there are judgemental people in every walk of life but the majority of the time, they are people like any others, with their vulnerabilities and strengths. I tend to see the good in most people - I sometimes get disappointed but not enough to make sweeping statements about a whole group of people I don't know.

 

And I think most sterotypes are old clichés that need to be challenged.

 

All this to say again to OP - there will be a compatible person for you that will recognise and appreciate what you have to offer.

[loversquarrel]

Why would anyone be the least bit concerned about competition. There's trust in any real relationship . But she'd also know how to handle herself well and truly by this age . And if she didn't have the values of loyalty anyway, why would you even be with her in the first place.

 

I'm not concerned about competition, but I can't answer for others.

Yes there is trust in real relationships.

One would hope she knows how to handle things, doesn't always work that way though as infidelity is far from a rare occurrence.

Sometimes people don't experience disloyalty until after a relationship has started.

[brigit87]

Ah. I wish. College was fun. I'm 29 years old.

 

 

 

OK. That explains a lot. For some reason I thought you were in your 40's. If you're so active in your social life then I don't understand how you have the time to write such long posts here?

 

You don't have to answer it just strikes me as weird.

[Veronica73]

Without getting into too much detail, my company is located next to a business that caters to a variety of mostly intellectuals/academic types...

 

If you stand around and watch the people that go in and out of there, its just a parade of butt ugly...Men AND women...Shoddy dressed, horrible physiques, women with no bras and tits down to their waistline...Stringy hair, etc...Guys with flood type pants, ugly glasses, most of them look like pedophiles...

 

Now. I wont say there are none that are well kept, because I am sure there are...but if this is any indication, then it does lend some credibility to the stereotype...

 

TFY

 

I don’t discount your experience, but it is all anecdotal. I live in an area with a very large university, and if you visit the coffee shops and restaurants near where the professors live... there is a very high percentage of very attractive people. With money. Much more so than in the suburbs areas. You see beautiful people walking by with their dogs all day long.

[sabaton]

OK. That explains a lot. For some reason I thought you were in your 40's

Why did you think I was in my 40s?

 

 

 

If you're so active in your social life then I don't understand how you have the time to write such long posts here?

It's an acquired skill, to write fast, after years and years of sexting.

 

 

Since I would have to write fast and be succint and interesting to keep the girls sexual interest on me, or some other guy would get lucky - I developed a style of writing that allows me to write a lot of material in a short period of time.

 

 

I don’t discount your experience, but it is all anecdotal. I live in an area with a very large university, and if you visit the coffee shops and restaurants near where the professors live... there is a very high percentage of very attractive people. With money. Much more so than in the suburbs areas. You see beautiful people walking by with their dogs all day long.

Yes, and the vast majority of the girls who attended my college were very attractive, but those were undergraduate degrees with soft social studies like English literature, Psychology, Music, social sciences, journalism, and on and on. I wouldn't consider these people to be highly educated. Doctors and dentists and lawyers and such, yes I would consider to highly educated.

Edited October 26, 2018 by sabaton

[thefooloftheyear]

I don’t discount your experience, but it is all anecdotal. I live in an area with a very large university, and if you visit the coffee shops and restaurants near where the professors live... there is a very high percentage of very attractive people. With money. Much more so than in the suburbs areas. You see beautiful people walking by with their dogs all day long.

 

 

Additionally, your "beautiful" and my "beautiful" could be two different things entirely....

 

TFY

[sabaton]

Additionally, your "beautiful" and my "beautiful" could be two different things entirely....

 

TFY

 

 

I find that perceptions of beauty seems to be the same across cultures and civilizations.

[thefooloftheyear]

I find that perceptions of beauty seems to be the same across cultures and civilizations.

 

 

I don't

 

TFY

[sabaton]

I don't

 

TFY

 

 

Do you mean ideals of male beauty and female beauty? And what do you reckon to be beautiful?

[thefooloftheyear]

Do you mean ideals of male beauty and female beauty? And what do you reckon to be beautiful?

 

 

Denise Milani is what I think is the full package....yet I am sure many guys don't get that...They might be more inclined to say Rihanna as the ideal...I don't...

 

Moreso, I don't see what's so hot about some of the guys that women say are....Like that guy Benedict Cumberbatch.....Really??? Don't see it..Not at all..

 

So...its all in how someone perceives beauty...For me, it has to be more than a cute smile...They got to have all the parts as well..Id think if I was a woman, id probably see it the same way for guys...Id probably think that any guy that was skinny would immediately be unattractive...no matter how blessed he was in facial appearance..

 

That's why I don't believe all beauty is perceived the same universally..

 

TFY

[sabaton]

Denise Milani is what I think is the full package....yet I am sure many guys don't get that...They might be more inclined to say Rihanna as the ideal...I don't...

 

 

Both of those women have wide hips, big butts and in Denise Milani's case, big breasts.

 

 

 

Even if those breasts aren't natural.. the male brain can't tell the difference. Youth, high levels of estrogen, wide hips, big butts, big breasts, and a flat stomach and straight white teeth, and full, thick luscious hair is what makes a woman sexually attractive, and that's comes across every culture in the world.

 

 

 

 

Moreso, I don't see what's so hot about some of the guys that women say are....Like that guy Benedict Cumberbatch.....Really??? Don't see it..Not at all..

 

 

He's rich and famous and popular. There are women who say Steve Buscemi is hot. Or Woody Allen. When a man has money, when he has a lot of money, a lot of stuff can be forgiven.

 

 

So...its all in how someone perceives beauty...For me, it has to be more than a cute smile...They got to have all the parts as well..

 

 

 

 

Id think if I was a woman, id probably see it the same way for guys...Id probably think that any guy that was skinny would immediately be unattractive...no matter how blessed he was in facial appearance..

 

 

That's because of sexual dimorphism. Women are shorter than men on average, and men are usually heavier than women are. A skinny man is an unattractive man. The only exceptions is when he's exquistively handsome, like James Dean was.

 

 

He was tiny at 5'6'' and he was skinny, but he had the facial aesthetics to compensate for his lack of masculinity, and the fact that he was famous and rich didn't hurt.

[elaine567]

 

Moreso, I don't see what's so hot about some of the guys that women say are....Like that guy Benedict Cumberbatch.....Really??? Don't see it..Not at all..

 

TFY

I don't see it either, he is actually pretty ugly in my opinion.

[sabaton]

I don't see it either, he is actually pretty ugly in my opinion.

 

 

He is extremely ugly, but when those women think about how charming he is $_$ he's suddenly as attractive as Chris Hemsworth.