I think I ate a breadcrumb

[marky00]

She feels as if she’s won the breakup. She has a new bf and you don’t hate her. She’s done nothing wrong in her eyes.

 

I agree with this. I think this is her mentality right now.

 

No more nice responses from you or even trying to act decent if you bump into her.

 

All you need to do is act civil (so you don't look like a douche) but nothing more than that.

 

This is why No Contact works so well. They get zero validation and have no idea if your sad, angry, hate them or over them. That retards their healing and levels the playing field.

 

I think ideally you need to have one more engagement with her but next time act far more aloof, almost like she doesn't exist once the civilities have taken place.

 

You will feel a lot better moving on once you have handled yourself the way you know you need to. After my Ex dumped me, I only started feeling better when I started ignoring her messages. Bur rather than just ignore, one time after 6 months of breadcrumbs i asked "you have been messaging me many times, what is it you want to say?". She of course didn't respond but then proceeded to breadcrumb me very hard for another 6 months and I never responded to any of them.

 

My point being, the one time I spoke up, I was able to convey to her that the conversation now goes on my terms. I gave her an opportunity to speak her mind and she didn't (and I'm pretty glad she didn't actually because that exchange could have got messy). Every breadcrumb I ignored (especially those after the exchange mentioned above) hastened my healing.

 

Everything needs to be about you now.

[jackofmany]

She feels as if she’s won the breakup. She has a new bf and you don’t hate her. She’s done nothing wrong in her eyes.

 

This has been reverberating in my head since you posted it. It makes me want to puke.

[usa1ah]

This has been reverberating in my head since you posted it. It makes me want to puke.

 

It should make you want to puke.

 

Because honestly if she meant what she said “I still love you”, she would still be with you.....

 

This is a game to her. You never paid her any attention until she came for you. You were probably the only guy that wasn’t at her feet. So she changed that, and now you are here trying to find peace again. All she has to do is throw a bread crumb your way every now and then. Don’t eat any more table scraps.

 

Find your anger for this one and move on. She can never be a friend.

[jackofmany]

It should make you want to puke.

 

Because honestly if she meant what she said “I still love you”, she would still be with you.....

 

This is a game to her. You never paid her any attention until she came for you. You were probably the only guy that wasn’t at her feet. So she changed that, and now you are here trying to find peace again. All she has to do is throw a bread crumb your way every now and then. Don’t eat any more table scraps.

 

Find your anger for this one and move on. She can never be a friend.

 

I don't know if it's a game to her exactly, but its something. She's incredibly impulsive and very attention seeking. I'm sure it drove her crazy for me not to reply to her earlier texts. Now she got what she wanted and it is driving me crazy that I cannot engage in any way to take it back.

 

The time I walked away from her mid-conversation, after she had draped herself on me (she was drunk), she had a look of disbelief on her face. I watched how much attention she got from men when I was with her. It was abnormal.

 

I remember when we were together, before she left town, the guy she is currently with came to a goodbye get together for her. Clearly, I did not know what was up. I saw them talking but I thought nothing of it. A mutual friend saw it too and said to me, "Don't worry about that. He just follows her around like a puppy dog."

 

Well, apparently that worked.

 

Or whatever. I can't know exactly what went down. Because I don't think she told me the truth and I won't ask her.

 

I find my anger now and then, and it helps. It helps too that just about everyone I've talked to about it says, "You dodged a bullet."

 

I was talking to the same mutual friend who said the thing about the puppy dog the other night, and she came up in conversation and he said something along the lines of "That girl's problem is she hates herself. She needs to talk to a therapist."

 

This should all make getting over her easier. But for some reason, I can't quite shake the spell she throws over me. In my less guarded moments, I find myself thinking about her coming back, thinking how if she left me for him she could leave him for me.

 

And of course that would lead to a life of blissful, easy co-existence, right?

 

Yeah, right.

[klicker]

I have read through your threads about this breakup and your ex. What nobody has mentioned is the likeliness that she has a bit of a personality disorder. All the signs are there, you might want to do some reading about borderline personality disorder. I am no expert, but I have had some experience with women like this. What really stands out to me is the triangulating she has been doing with you and her now boyfriend. Why does she continue to reengage you? Why does she seem to want to keep you on the line? It's all a part of the disorder. I might be wrong, but it sounds like it to me. Once you realize that is a part of her pattern, a part of the disorder, you will see how lucky you were to be rid of her. I can tell you, her current boyfriend will end up in a much worse place than you eventually.

[jackofmany]

I have read through your threads about this breakup and your ex. What nobody has mentioned is the likeliness that she has a bit of a personality disorder. All the signs are there, you might want to do some reading about borderline personality disorder. I am no expert, but I have had some experience with women like this. What really stands out to me is the triangulating she has been doing with you and her now boyfriend. Why does she continue to reengage you? Why does she seem to want to keep you on the line? It's all a part of the disorder. I might be wrong, but it sounds like it to me. Once you realize that is a part of her pattern, a part of the disorder, you will see how lucky you were to be rid of her. I can tell you, her current boyfriend will end up in a much worse place than you eventually.

 

This is interesting to me.

 

I always wonder if I've done a decent enough job representing my situation. Of course, I can't be objective, so that makes it difficult for me to present her sympathetically, though believe it or not, I do try.

 

What is interesting though is that you are the second person this week to suggest borderline personality disorder. The first was a friend in town, one who is not close to, nor particularly likes, my ex. But I found it interesting he suggested it. I was going to look it up anyway.

 

At a glance, there are certainly traits that line up, more than I expected to find.

 

I'm curious to know what your experience with this type of personality has been.

 

The thing is when I think about things, I tend to idealize her and give her the benefit of the doubt that what she was doing was/is not strictly intentional. But then I think of specifics (for example why use the phrase "in love with you" as opposed to just "love you"; there's a difference and the former is more of a hook than the latter) and I think there may just be some method to what she's doing. When I am sympathetic to her, I tend to imagine her just being blindly impulsive (another symptom).

 

The other thing, and I just realized this today, is that I also tend to idealize her current relationship. This does me absolutely no good. I find myself envying this other guy's position, even though I am the one getting text messages from his girlfriend that would upset me if I were him.

 

If I were a more devious person, I swear, I might screenshot one of those texts and when I ran into him ask him for some help. "Listen," I might say, "Can you do me a favor and ask (x) to stop sending me stuff like this."

 

But I'm not that person. It's just that today was a little rough, so I'll just throw it out here as fantasy.

 

Thanks for taking the time to read all of that. I really appreciate your opinion and I think there may be something to that suggestion. For real.

[Marc878]

You're giving her the best of both worlds. She has a new boyfriend and you're "friends"?

 

So she's good.

 

Block and ignore if you want to move on.

[Popsicle]

How's the new girl?

[klicker]

My experience with a BPD starts around two years ago. I got involved with a woman who works in a business I shared spaces with. She eventually got involved with another married coworker and got me evicted from my business space that I had for 12 years. She went on to destroy that guys life, getting him fired and causing his wife to leave him with the kids. And through all of this, she somehow was able to convince her boss that she is a victim.

I could never figure out her behavior... it really never made any sense.. and I finally come to the conclusion she had BPD.. several factors led to this including her cutting scars on her arms, a sign of BPD. I did a lot of reading up on the subject over many months and learned a lot. I also realized that several of my exes were likely BPD as well. The confusing part is that BPD has many faces and takes on different personalities with each person, so it is not a simple thing to see sometimes.

Like I said, I am no expert. Also, I have never met your ex, but the triangulation thing seems to be a very common thread with BPD. BPd is a disorder that essentially stems from fear of abandonment. So, in many cases, the BPD sufferer needs to keep more than one person on the hook to feel stable. They will push one person away and seek out the other, and, many times this cycle will repeat many times. Eventually they will find another source for attention, and push the closest person away, but keep them on the hook for future use.

Also, they tend to go from hot to cold with their opinion of someone... One day you will be the greatest, two weeks later, they will hate you. It is some crazy stuff. Trying to understand someone with this is seriously taxing. Basically, it simply doesn't make sense to normal people, nor should it.

Honestly, just keep this in mind. It is hard to say if this is the case, but I would say it is no coincidence someone else mentioned this to you. At least you can do a bit of reading up on it and learn something. BPD is more common than you would imagine.

[usa1ah]

How's the new girl?

 

Jack mentioned that was a no go a few days a ago. No details given.

[usa1ah]

How r u Jack

[jackofmany]

How's the new girl?

 

As usa1ah mentioned, that looks unlikely. It's a vibe thing.

 

I flirted with her a bit, to see if something was there, but it doesn't appear to be, so I'm just leaving it be.

 

It was a nice diversion though.

[jackofmany]

You're giving her the best of both worlds. She has a new boyfriend and you're "friends"?

 

So she's good.

 

Block and ignore if you want to move on.

 

We're not "friends".

 

If nothing else, she knows that.

[usa1ah]

I think you should flirt some more with her.

 

You might have given up to quick. Remember your brain isn’t running on all cylinders right now. Also, it’s good practice as well as showing your not seating at home feeling sorry for yourself.

[usa1ah]

So Jack how are things?

[jackofmany]

So Jack how are things?

 

Um . . . okay. Foolish, but okay.

 

I know people are going to let me have it for this, but I'm going to tell the story. I'll try to be brief (not my strong suit).

 

There was no follow-up interaction after that last exchange, and as I said, I dropped my intentions for the other girl because, really, I could tell she was not interested and I learned from mutual friends a number of things that suggested we were probably not such a good match, though she is drop dead gorgeous, a trait to which I am susceptible.

 

For reasons entirely my own I had been working on understanding my ex, trying to see how she could act the way she has without being a bad person. I know you or someone else said find your anger for this one and move on, but I found that anger was keeping me closer to the situation. The less angry I was, the less I thought about her and the less I worried about running into her, which, as you can probably guess from the tone of this post, I did.

 

The difference is this time I felt ready. I saw her approaching me and a group of our common friends and I wasn't worried at all. I just smiled said hello and continued talking to other people in the group. We were about to head into a bar and get a drink. One of my other friends asked her to join. She did. I'm not sure how much he knows about what went down between us. I think he just did it instinctively.

 

Anyway, at one point it became obvious to me that she wanted to talk to me and we fell into what was our first real conversation since the breakup, meaning we didn't avoid any topics, nor pursue them too much. To be honest it was easy and sincere.

 

Too easy.

 

At some point she suggested talking somewhere else, like my place (yes, she suggested this) and I said sure.

 

This is not going exactly where you think, but it mostly is.

 

We talked some more. She obviously wanted to explain herself, but I told her I didn't really feel like talking about the breakup. Nonetheless she revealed that she was now living by herself in another town. She mentioned that she always maintained friendships with people she dated. I told her that was just not us, and she agreed.

 

She mentioned something about worrying that I could never trust her again, and I think I said I don't know.

 

But then it got back to saying how we missed each other and then we were kissing. No smash your face into each other kissing, but kissing for real. I will admit I was being intentionally charming. I didn't ask her whether or not she was still dating the other guy. For his sake, I hope not, but who knows?

 

This went on for a bit and it got pretty late and she said she should probably go. This is when, under different circumstances, I would have said, "You don't have to." But I walked her outside to her car, kissed her a few more times, and said goodbye.

 

I have done nothing since. Neither has she.

 

I suspect she is probably still seeing the other guy, as every other time we have had any kind of contact at all she has sent me texts of the "I love you and I miss you" nature, and then this happens and she sends nothing?

 

I think she got herself in over her head.

 

You have to trust me when I say the conversation was sincere. I don't think she meant to manipulate me consciously. I do however think there is something she gets from me that maybe this other guy doesn't give her, just as there is something she gets from him that I don't give her.

 

I am oddly okay, though clearly I have wandered onto some thin ice.

 

She seemed to want me to understand that she was confused about a lot of things when we broke up, that she felt lost. She also seemed to want me to know she wished I had fought for her more. That last part I don't agree with and I told her as much. When a woman says they want to stop being intimate with you and start being intimate with another man, what the hell else are you supposed to do but walk away?

 

Today I have been fighting off the urge -- again -- to text her. To say something like, "I'm glad we talked. Maybe some other time when no-one's been drinking we can try that again."

 

But then I think well that sounds pathetic, like all she had to do was snap her fingers and there I am again. So I've done nothing.

 

I am nervous about what I might have done here. I don't feel all that bad about it from the perspective of her relationship, if she is still in one. That's ego. That's me not giving the other guy respect because he didn't respect me. I should work past that.

 

I probably could have slept with her. And there was a part of me that thought if that situation ever came up, I would do it and then leave her, so she could feel what it was like. But I decided I don't want to be that person, and also I don't think I would really be able to keep my feelings out of it.

 

As it is, things were left in mid-air. Part of me knew something like this would eventually happen, because in my experience it almost always does.

 

I wonder what she is thinking. I bet she is nervous too, especially if she is still seeing that dude.

[Marc878]

The one thing I see is she's not a very loyal person. If she does that behind his back she'll do it behind yours.

 

What's to like about this?

 

Not much I can see.

[jackofmany]

The one thing I see is she's not a very loyal person. If she does that behind his back she'll do it behind yours.

 

What's to like about this?

 

Not much I can see.

 

I agree. I don't know if she is still seeing him.

 

Either way, it's dangerous.

[jackofmany]

I agree. I don't know if she is still seeing him.

 

Either way, it's dangerous.

 

This was edited because it was irrelevant.

Edited March 23, 2018 by jackofmany

[usa1ah]

Damn.

 

Did you at least get some of your questions answered?

[jackofmany]

Damn.

 

Did you at least get some of your questions answered?

 

Um . . . no, not really. All I did was put my head in a blender. That was a random run in, but she owns some responsibility for what happened (suggesting we talk at my place), as do I (agreeing to that, and escalating the contact).

 

She did seem to want to talk about things, but I was the one who turned it into a charm thing instead. It was like my badly bruised ego took over and wanted the validation of her response.

 

Either way, I ran into her the next night too. Talked some more, still not about the breakup, caught a ride home with her and then deliberately did not invite her in.

 

Along the way though a woman who I had had what I believed to be a few casual run ins saw me talking to her and let's just say *freaked out*. I have been super honest with this woman that she could not expect anything from me, and she appeared to be cool with it. Apparently not.

 

The situation is currently a mess. My feelings were not so faded that kissing my ex didn't cause me to start rationalizing all kinds of things. I'm still working on that, because I'm not sure she's done. Except for the fact that the other woman losing her mind might have scared her off.

 

I deeply regret having hurt someone in all of this. I should have known better. For all my complaining about being a rebound and how much it hurt, I let myself do that with someone else. I was upfront with her, but still.

 

As far as my ex though, I don't think I understand her much better at all. Except to say that I believe she genuinely is confused. I think she walks around in her beauty like a toddler walking around with a loaded weapon, not entirely sure why everyone is paying so much attention to her, and prone to shooting someone in the heart when she stumbles.

 

I know people will say no way, she's more manipulative than that. Maybe she is. But I'm just calling it how I see it. I think she has very little impulse control, partially because she pretty much always gets the guy she wants.

[SevenCity]

That's a good analogy, and likely very apt.

 

Women don't think the way most guys do because they have completely different life experiences. The better looking, the more vast those differences are.

 

If she is attractive she has likely never had to make any effort whatsoever into finding male attention. You can see it here when people talk about OLD experience. A lot of the women are shocked to learn that guys do not have the same experience as them. A lot of them post and say how great it was and can't comprehend the struggles that most men experience. I remember talking to a girl at work years ago after a breakup and her response was "Why don't you just get another girlfriend?" Like she couldn't comprehend what that process entails for a guy.

 

I've actually seen documentaries where they show how young girls (when they just learn how to talk) are manipulating people around them to get what they want. They may not be consciously doing it, but they are. It's almost like when a dog wants a treat - they tend to make themselves exceptionally cute. I doubt my dog has the intelligence to say to herself "I'm going to make my eyes bigger and act cuter because I happen to be near the treat container." But she does nonetheless.

 

So yes, perhaps your ex is not aware of her manipulation but it doesn't make it any better for you...actually it might make it worse. At least she might feel guilty after a while if she was doing it intentionally.

 

I tried to get my ex to change her mind for three months and it was torture. I was not aware of another guy but there probably was because with women there always is. We were sleeping together frequently but in the end it did nothing but make it harder.

 

You have to do what's right for you but realize this chick is bad news and will bring you nothing but pain. She is manipulative, disloyal, and self serving. The sooner you cut ties, the less it will hurt in the long run and the quicker you'll get over it.

 

Easy to play armchair quarterback (I recall the pull of my ex was like a heroine addiction), but if I could do it all over again I would have cut ties immediately...or rather never have asked her out 7 years prior...

 

Good luck brother.

[usa1ah]

Um . . . no, not really. All I did was put my head in a blender. That was a random run in, but she owns some responsibility for what happened (suggesting we talk at my place), as do I (agreeing to that, and escalating the contact).

 

She did seem to want to talk about things, but I was the one who turned it into a charm thing instead. It was like my badly bruised ego took over and wanted the validation of her response.

 

Either way, I ran into her the next night too. Talked some more, still not about the breakup, caught a ride home with her and then deliberately did not invite her in.

 

Along the way though a woman who I had had what I believed to be a few casual run ins saw me talking to her and let's just say *freaked out*. I have been super honest with this woman that she could not expect anything from me, and she appeared to be cool with it. Apparently not.

 

The situation is currently a mess. My feelings were not so faded that kissing my ex didn't cause me to start rationalizing all kinds of things. I'm still working on that, because I'm not sure she's done. Except for the fact that the other woman losing her mind might have scared her off.

 

I deeply regret having hurt someone in all of this. I should have known better. For all my complaining about being a rebound and how much it hurt, I let myself do that with someone else. I was upfront with her, but still.

 

As far as my ex though, I don't think I understand her much better at all. Except to say that I believe she genuinely is confused. I think she walks around in her beauty like a toddler walking around with a loaded weapon, not entirely sure why everyone is paying so much attention to her, and prone to shooting someone in the heart when she stumbles.

 

I know people will say no way, she's more manipulative than that. Maybe she is. But I'm just calling it how I see it. I think she has very little impulse control, partially because she pretty much always gets the guy she wants.

 

You know she is going to mind **** you if you continue down this path.

 

Do The 180 and stick to it man. Also apologize to the other girl if you can. Like you said your were up front but still know how it feels.

 

Is it another day another stumble?

[jackofmany]

That's a good analogy, and likely very apt.

 

We were sleeping together frequently but in the end it did nothing but make it harder.

 

You have to do what's right for you but realize this chick is bad news and will bring you nothing but pain. She is manipulative, disloyal, and self serving. The sooner you cut ties, the less it will hurt in the long run and the quicker you'll get over it.

 

Easy to play armchair quarterback (I recall the pull of my ex was like a heroine addiction), but if I could do it all over again I would have cut ties immediately...or rather never have asked her out 7 years prior...

 

Good luck brother.

 

Thanks Man. I don't expect it to be easy for the next couple weeks or so. The heroin addiction analogy is also very apt, and one that I swear to you I was just using with a friend on the phone in the last hour or two.

 

When I mentioned that I felt prepared when I saw her that night, I meant it. I didn't feel nervous at all. I might have been on the cusp on that benign indifference we all shoot for. In other words, it was as if I had just walked out of a months long detox.

 

Her walking up and talking was no big deal. Her coming back to my apartment was like having a bad of heroin slammed down in front of your face in the Uber back from your rehab. I'm straining the metaphor, but I hope you get the point.

 

Not inviting her in the next night was hard. Not doing anything now is hard. Just those few kisses and the jones for her threatens to obliterate my memory of just how hard it has been getting here.

 

And I've done that too, what you mentioned, gotten back together with exes, slept with them for a while, even had some great romantic times, only to have it all blow up in the end, worse than the first time around. So I feel you.

 

I've read your responses here, and on some other threads. You seem like a pretty cool headed guy too. I really appreciate your time.

 

I do wish I hadn't hurt the other girl, and also that she wasn't crazy, because I get the feeling she is going to be hard to shake for a while, and I can't quite figure out how to do that without hurting her further and risking another blow up.

[jackofmany]

You know she is going to mind **** you if you continue down this path.

 

Do The 180 and stick to it man. Also apologize to the other girl if you can. Like you said your were up front but still know how it feels.

 

Is it another day another stumble?

 

I've apologized to the other girl. She is crazy, and I'm not sure that will help. That was a bad move on my part.

 

My ex is kind of mind **** ing me already, as you no doubt picked up on. I genuinely don't think she does it on purpose, but she does it. It comes from some deep insecurity, I think.

 

I can't stand that I made someone feel like that. Crazy or not. I can't stand it.

 

Of all people, I should know better.

 

I've got quite the knot to untangle now. Mea culpa.

 

And as SevenCity suggested, the heroin analogy is appropriate. It's like I'm addicted to her. Even when she drove away and I knew it was the right thing, a part of me was dying to see her go.

 

You've been exceptional with your support through all of this. So thanks man. I hope not to have to return the favor some day, but I would be honored to if it were ever necessary.

Edited March 25, 2018 by jackofmany
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