Sex in Marriage - How do you compromise?

[elaine567]

She doesn't see me wanting her to light candles and surprise me by showing up in the bedroom in a sheer outfit with high heels as an expression of love. Or at the very least she doesn't get that I see it that way. That by expressing desire for me she is saying "I love you" in a way I understand and appreciate.

 

But again that is because she thinks she is a fat cow. She has no confidence in her appearance.

She would feel a complete fool in a sheer outfit.

I know she hasn't expressed an opinion of the twice daily porn, but the fact her husband is lusting after no doubt young and thin bodies daily cannot really be a huge turn on for her.

Nor I guess an incentive for her to expose her own ageing, sick and "fat" body, which face it will never compare with the young, lithe and toned bodies of porn stars...

 

I know there will be a backlash "What else is he supposed to do?" but I am sure a wife lusting after young, hot males twice daily on porn channels to get relief, would not exactly be an incentive for her poor, sick, tired, fat middle aged husband to try to compete with.

Just a thought.

[heartbrokenlady]

But again that is because she thinks she is a fat cow. She has no confidence in her appearance.

She would feel a complete fool in a sheer outfit..

 

Exactly. And again, I've been there.

 

My ex wanted me to do that. And we're talking 11 years ago, pre cancer when I was a lot thinner, with bigger boobs etc.

 

I tried. I honestly did. He had a thing about getting me into a mini skirt, with stockings and heels. I put them on and I felt... ridiculous, pathetic, like mutton dressed as lamb.

 

It could have been that HE would have seen the way I looked as sexy. But I was as turned off as it was possible to be. And how can a woman have sex, if she is not aroused?

[OpenBook]

It could have been that HE would have seen the way I looked as sexy. But I was as turned off as it was possible to be. And how can a woman have sex, if she is not aroused?

 

If he had seen the way you looked (I'm assuming you didn't) and it DID turn him on, wouldn't that turn you on too? To see your mate excited to see YOU?

[heartbrokenlady]

If he had seen the way you looked (I'm assuming you didn't) and it DID turn him on, wouldn't that turn you on too? To see your mate excited to see YOU?

 

 

It wouldn't I'm afraid. Imagine yourself in a mankini. If it turned your partner on, would it make you feel sexy?

[Trail Blazer]

If the situation is that bad of course I would not suggest to anyone to stay and suffer, that would be cruel. If you decide you can't take this you should of course consider divorce and all the consequences that come with it.

 

I never said a man desiring his wife is dirty, in fact in another post I said it's the most normal thing of all. What I don't like about the OP's behavior is that if his wife feels tired or sick he gets frustrated because he's not gonna have sex again. Sex should not be something a person is forced to do in marriage, I know someone married someone sexual but life takes its turns and things change. That's why divorces are for; when the change of someone is that dramatic that their spouse can't take it.

I'm hardly going divorce my wife *just* because of a lack of sex. I mean, if it lasts another decade where we only do it once every 2 months max, I guess things will probably get a whole lot worse in many ways as I will harbor a lot of resentment which will spill over to the rest of the relationship and cause irreconcilable issues.

 

The problem is that it's always the person who doesn't want sex that gets what they want. I'm a bad person and husband if I pressure my wife into having sex, yet her position as a wife is unquestioned because there's other reasons that contribute to her not wanting sex. Or, there may be no reasons either, she just may have lost interest and as a husband I just have to accept that?

 

I have 2 kids aged 7 and 11 + 2 adult stepchildren. What should I do? Walk out and say "sorry kids but mom won't put out enough so I'm outta here!". No, that's not really going to happen. I and many other men in this situation are stuck between a rock and a hard place. I don't want to lose my family but I also want sex with my wife. It's a shame that I have this dilemma while my wife is quite happy with thay scenario, so long as I don't tap her on the shoulder too frequently.

 

In short, if I walked out because of a lack of sex, I am instantly the bad guy and risk losing everything, including the respect of my kids. And, I also do love my wife despite everything and don't want to hurt her! I always want the best for all of us, but I feel as though this crisis I'm in is getting more and more unbearable.

[merrmeade]

But again that is because she thinks she is a fat cow. She has no confidence in her appearance.

She would feel a complete fool in a sheer outfit.

I know she hasn't expressed an opinion of the twice daily porn, but the fact her husband is lusting after no doubt young and thin bodies daily cannot really be a huge turn on for her.

Nor I guess an incentive for her to expose her own ageing, sick and "fat" body, which face it will never compare with the young, lithe and toned bodies of porn stars...

 

I know there will be a backlash "What else is he supposed to do?" but I am sure a wife lusting after young, hot males twice daily on porn channels to get relief, would not exactly be an incentive for her poor, sick, tired, fat middle aged husband to try to compete with.

Just a thought.

EXACTLY. My husband's soft porn habit has sort of subsided (since they came out with studies showing that it actually contributes to impotence - ha!) but I still wonder, when he closes his eyes during sex, if it's to "look" at one of those nubile bodies instead of mine.

 

This thread is one of those that makes others of us (me) face issues we've been sweeping under the rug. I'm just describing my situation because it might be how she feels, too. It's a real thing and - if it IS the same - it needs to be offset by expressions of appreciation in some other area. For example, my husband compliments me when I take extra time on hair and makeup. It gives confidence and is motivating to fix the rest of me, too.

[Trail Blazer]

It wouldn't I'm afraid. Imagine yourself in a mankini. If it turned your partner on, would it make you feel sexy?

 

It would be irrelevant to me how *I* felt if I knew it turned her on. At the end of the day, if the mankini turned her on, it would still be omitted when we did the deed. Knowing that she was turned on would make me do almost anything. I wouldn't wear it anywhere outside of the bedroom though.

[merrmeade]

It would be irrelevant to me how *I* felt if I knew it turned her on. At the end of the day, if the mankini turned her on, it would still be omitted when we did the deed. Knowing that she was turned on would make me do almost anything. I wouldn't wear it anywhere outside of the bedroom though.

I do think that's the bottom line. What turns on each couple and each partner is individual. I know that my husband and I have an understanding what that is.

 

OP's wife has let that slip and he's hurting. All our suggestions are just reactions to the bits of information he's given us. What their mojo is and why it's messed up they need to work out and I think it sounds like they need to sit down together - more than once - and each one really HEAR the other. Mainly, she needs to fix it imho, but he cannot sit back and wait. He MUST communicate how important it is to him and that the status quo must change or else. And he needs to be clear about what "or else" will be. Then they talk about what he needs, what she needs and what they are willing to do as a couple and as individuals to get those needs met.

[OpenBook]

It would be irrelevant to me how *I* felt if I knew it turned her on. At the end of the day, if the mankini turned her on, it would still be omitted when we did the deed. Knowing that she was turned on would make me do almost anything. I wouldn't wear it anywhere outside of the bedroom though.

 

Agreed. I was going to post something similar, but I stopped because I have never been in a long-term (decades-long) marriage, so checked myself & no longer felt qualified to answer.

 

I was also going to say it wouldn't matter to me because 1) it would turn me on to see my partner turned on, 2) I'm not the one looking at it, and 3) it will soon come off anyway.

 

This is how it was in my own marriage. But it only lasted 3 years, and I was in my early 20's. I have no idea (if I had stayed married) how I would feel about having sex with the same man I'd been married to for 20+ years.

[heartbrokenlady]

Her sexuality is the one that is absent though. SHE is the one that needs her engine starting.

 

What can he do to get her engine revving? Because no one has sex without arousal other than prostitutes.

 

 

 

I'm making huge assumptions based on how I feel (we're both women), and for me, it would be love and affection (not him in a mankini ;-) ). Hugs. An arm around me while we're on the sofa watching tv. Him offering to run me a bath. Cooking with me in the kitchen and laughing together.

 

Sharing things, plus physical signs of affection. Keys to an older woman's libido maybe?

[merrmeade]

...for me, it would be love and affection (not him in a mankini ;-) ). Hugs. An arm around me while we're on the sofa watching tv. Him offering to run me a bath. Cooking with me in the kitchen and laughing together.

 

Sharing things, plus physical signs of affection. Keys to an older woman's libido maybe?

All of it and whatever makes her purr. Yes, that's his half of the quotient, which I somehow thought he was already doing, no?

 

But if he's good there and she's still playing like she didn't notice, they've gotta talk and he's gotta lay it on the line: This is what I need and deserve. How can we make this work?

[heartbrokenlady]

All of it and whatever makes her purr. Yes, that's his half of the quotient, which I somehow thought he was already doing, no?

 

But if he's good there and she's still playing like she didn't notice, they've gotta talk and he's gotta lay it on the line: This is what I need and deserve. How can we make this work?

 

 

Yes, if he's already doing all that, good on him. If he shows her love, gives her physical affection without demanding sex, doesn't try to force it. Then it's time for talk or maybe even marriage counselling.

[SummerDreams]

I think you are still forgetting what this woman said: if her H were to be killed one day she'd never have sex again. This means it's not something he does or doesn't do. It's that sex is that irrelevant for her. An example that comes to mind is that I hate to eat fish. There are people who can't live without eating fish at least once a week. Now I tell these people "I hate fish" and they are saying to me "just tell us how you want us to cook it and then you'll eat it". But HELLO, I don't WANT to eat fish. That's the end of the story. Now the OP's wife can't deny sex from her H altogether cause she understand his needs and that's the compromise she made herself make: twice a month. The OP is not satisfoed with it. He has to make it known and make some proposals about how this could be fixed. Lets wait and see what he is willing to do. In my opinion the only thing he wanted was to rant about it. I think he has decided to compromise and suck it up, thus the thread name "how do you compromise?".

[4fin]

"An example that comes to mind is that I hate to eat fish. There are people who can't live without eating fish at least once a week. Now I tell these people "I hate fish" and they are saying to me "just tell us how you want us to cook it and then you'll eat it". But HELLO, I don't WANT to eat fish. That's the end of the story."

 

There is a difference in your analogy and the OP's situation. At one time his wife did like to eat fish in your example. Over time I agree eating fish/sex has come off the menu. It's tough looking back over where things were at one point in the beginning of the relationship when she liked to eat fish. I don't see it as the end of the story but the beginning of the 2nd act. If his wife never liked sex I don't think this thread would have ever come up.

[TexasRob]

Merry Christmas to those of you who celebrate the holiday

 

I have been busy the last three days with family in for the holidays, everyone is asleep and I was playing catch up on this thread. As always I appreciate the opinions and suggestions everyone has been so kind to send my way.

 

My wife and I haven't talked much about things with everyone around but we did touch on it briefly in the car today between Christmas parties. No surprise her cold still has not gone away, I tried to get her to go to a 24 hour clinic on the 23rd and 24th because it seems to be moving into a respiratory infection but she didn't want to take the time with family here and so much to do. I worry she is running herself down and will only get worse.

 

Anyway , in the car she mentioned trying to go back to doing yoga after the first of the year. I told her I would be happy to take classes with her again, anything to get her moving and stretch out her joints would be good for her RA. It was a small thing but if she is serious would be a step in the right direction.

 

She did apologize for not being receptive to my advances (when she hasn't been sick) and she acknowledged that its a problem and she understands that I struggle with it. We didn't have time to take the conversation any further but hopefully after the holidays we can finally have a long conversation about things.

 

As I have followed this thread I have come to recognize that my wife and I are at a crossroads in our journey together. We have come a long way and things were a certain way before but now, due to age and health, we are changing and the nature of our relationship probably needs to be redefined. I'm not sure what that means exactly, its something we need to work out together. It is becoming clear that I can't expect the same level of sex from her I was receiving in the past but just how limited that will and whether we can establish a level of intimacy that works for both of us remains to be seen.

 

We have a lot of things in our relationship that work and I don't want to throw that all away, but it is hard to accept the changes we are going through now. I struggle back and forth with how I feel about things. I will try to give you guys an update as soon as we have a full conversation about this and some decisions get made hopefully in the next week.

[Mr. Lucky]

Yes, if he's already doing all that, good on him. If he shows her love, gives her physical affection without demanding sex, doesn't try to force it. Then it's time for talk or maybe even marriage counselling.

 

I'd think individual counseling for the OP's wife would be more valuable.

 

Look, it takes no special insight to understand the value of sex and intimacy in a committed relationship. This is more about "won't" than "can't", something the OP should be mindful of as he moves forward. I hope he's honest with his wife about his feelings...

 

Mr. Lucky

[SummerDreams]

So a person who doesn't like sex is only a spoiled brat who just won't do it for the sake of it?

Knowing it's important can't force someone to do it even though they hate it.

I know fish is good for the health but I'll throw up If I eat it.

[merrmeade]

So a person who doesn't like sex is only a spoiled brat who just won't do it for the sake of it?

Knowing it's important can't force someone to do it even though they hate it.

I know fish is good for the health but I'll throw up If I eat it.

Good grief, does she really hate it? And aren't we saying that, if they're married, that's part of the deal? What rights are you talking about when the basic one that defines their union has been revoked?

 

The question is how big of an anathema is it for her? He says there was a time that she did like it.

 

I think he needs to feel confident he's given this every possible chance and done everything he can to find a compromise, including counseling. He should tell her when it's the last chance and attach a date to when he thinks he'll officially give up. She needs to be warned, so she can make her choices, too. That's my take on it.

[SummerDreams]

Good grief, does she really hate it? And aren't we saying that, if they're married, that's part of the deal? What rights are you talking about when the basic one that defines their union has been revoked?

 

The question is how big of an anathema is it for her? He says there was a time that she did like it.

 

I think he needs to feel confident he's given this every possible chance and done everything he can to find a compromise, including counseling. He should tell her when it's the last chance and attach a date to when he thinks he'll officially give up. She needs to be warned, so she can make her choices, too. That's my take on it.

 

Well her saying "if my husband were to die I'd never have sex again" seems to me equal or at least similar to "I hate sex".

 

For the rest you say I agree. She needs to know her options.

[wmacbride]

My biggest question in all of this is the why, beyond pain/medication/ body image issues that she no longer is interested in sex, if , in fact, there is a reason that can be defined.

 

Op, if you flat out ask her what she would be interested in, or what she needs to feel aroused, what does she tell you? Has that changed from when you were first married?

 

Just like any other part of a perosn's psychology, what they need to feel aroused can change.

[elaine567]

My biggest question in all of this is the why, beyond pain/medication/ body image issues that she no longer is interested in sex, if , in fact, there is a reason that can be defined.

 

How many reasons does she actually need though?

 

Any one of those reasons may be the "why".

 

Add in the menopause, stress from her high powered job, worry over her kids, a bit of depression, not feeling particularly connected maybe, or just being older, and bored and tired of it all, or she may even be in the middle of an existential crisis...

She seems to have an abundance of reasons for "why" and we haven't even touched on the relationship and what she really feels about the OP..

Edited December 26, 2017 by elaine567

[Mr. Lucky]

So a person who doesn't like sex is only a spoiled brat who just won't do it for the sake of it?

Knowing it's important can't force someone to do it even though they hate it.

I know fish is good for the health but I'll throw up If I eat it.

 

There are certain core values in a relationship one willfully ignores at their peril. I’d give the OP the same caution were he behaving similarly, he’d be putting his marriage at extreme risk.

 

A good, multi-decade marriage is hard work. Time for her to decide if she wants to put in the effort...

 

Mr. Lucky

[SummerDreams]

There are certain core values in a relationship one willfully ignores at their peril. I’d give the OP the same caution were he behaving similarly, he’d be putting his marriage at extreme risk.

 

A good, multi-decade marriage is hard work. Time for her to decide if she wants to put in the effort...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

She does. She has sex as often as she can take it. But she needs to know the true feelings of her H and exactly how the lack of sex makes him feel.

[Mr. Lucky]

She does. She has sex as often as she can take it.

 

I feel like you're being purposely obtuse. If PIV sex is undesirable, there's lots of other ways both partners can express intimacy, affection and sexual connection. To choose not to do so on a regular basis sends a message the OP is hearing loud and clear...

 

Mr. Lucky

[elaine567]

I feel like you're being purposely obtuse. If PIV sex is undesirable, there's lots of other ways both partners can express intimacy, affection and sexual connection. To choose not to do so on a regular basis sends a message the OP is hearing loud and clear...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

OK so we have a woman with RA, now RA very often affects the small joints of the hands and the wrists, elbows and, shoulders so whilst it may be possible, a hand job may not be possible without a lot of pain.

Also jaw pain and involvement of the TMJs is also very common so a BJ may also not be possible.

 

Sex tends to involve fairly prolonged repetitive movements and for someone whose joints are swollen and painful, then repetitive movements can be something to be avoided.

Whilst it is easy for us to minimise her problems, I doubt in reality that many of us would be indulging in sex if it was literally agony, or stirred up pain for days to come, or we were too exhausted to even contemplate it

WE would be avoiding it too, despite any claims to the contrary.