Why Meeting People Is So Hard

[ZA Dater]

boy that's the truth np

 

I don't really think so, things can be as difficult as one chooses to make them. Difficult is when you swim against the tide in any one aspect of life or don't walk to the same beat as everyone else.

[preraph]

Well said, Normal Person.

[normal person]

I agree with all of this but maybe OP would be better served to look at his objectives and then determine if they are in fact realistic given his circumstance. If not then the circumstance needs to change to try and achieve those goals.

 

He just wants to meet a woman, it's not rocket science.

 

In my opinion given the OP age and lack of experience he is far behind the curve and again not universally popular it will be VERY hard to change that circumstance to something that people will actually want.

 

Again, it's not like what he's after is particularly difficult. Plus, he's 22, he's got plenty of time to figure it out. Most people are committing dating faux pas up to their mid 20s. The thing OP needs to do is rely less on escapism, start challenging himself to get the things he wants, commit said faux pas, and learn from his mistakes.

 

Which is why I am advocating rather find something that makes him happy, we know that dating makes him unhappy so why continue on this path? Focus on something, anything to improve.

 

No. Having a girlfriend would make him happy. But the process of getting one makes him uncomfortable. I say, "well, that's what you'll have to deal with to get something you want." You're advising him to just not bother. It's like you're saying "I know OP wants to be a lawyer, but law school is really hard and might stress him out, so why take that path?"

 

If you want the result, you have to do the work.

 

Putting himself out there is a good idea but where exactly? You say uncomfortable decisions, again this is opportunity cost, sitting in a club versus sitting at home bettering ones education or working towards something, if you are bad at the former then why expend time doing something you don't enjoy?

 

We've had this conversation a dozen times. All I'm saying is that if he dedicates less time to staying home and playing videogames, and more time working towards getting something he ultimately wants more than that, he will have better luck. Videogames do nothing for him. If he wants girls, he should go to where the girls are and figure it out. You're overcomplicating it.

[alphamale]

If he wants girls, he should go to where the girls are and figure it out.

wine tastings are a great place to start

[Cobra_X]

If you take out the physical aspect what is dating really, its just a friendship, nothing more so the solution is to find friends. People need to feel self worth and they need to feel other value them as people. Get those two things remotely right and to an extent you don't need dating at all unless you absolutely want kids and you absolutely want to get married.

 

Dating is about Mating and sexual selection. There are 3 evolutionary drivers. Good genetics (health), ability to provide resources (social status), and willingness to raise the child (attention).

 

Friendship doesn't tick all those boxes very well. I don't think it can help you learn how to be a more successful mate by itself.

[knabe]

So... You're an introvert who prefers gaming over getting out and meeting women and only one-in-five of those women are your "absolute type"? You are your own worst enemy in this situation. You can't really complain about not being able to get dates when you're at home, playing XBox and pondering about 20% of women that fit your "standard".

 

You basically succinctly summed the root problem of every guy who complains about dating on ever internet forum on the web.

 

And none of them will believe it.

 

It would be funny if it weren't so annoyingly sad.

[knabe]

For some unexplained reason, the topic of video games does not sit well with preraph.

 

Here is why, and this is on topic because not only is the OP the stereotypical shy gamer who wants a girlfriend (and so is my son), IT WILL GIVE EVERY GUY LIKE THAT AN INSIGHT INTO ABOUT 95% OF WOMEN ON THIS TOPIC.

 

I'm sorry about the caps. I got a new wireless keyboard and my fingers keep remembering the size of my old one. I'm not yelling.

 

The average early 20-something who spends lots of time on gaming and who has done so for years:

 

Is very shy and introverted

Has not had much socialization outside of the gaming world

Has done most of their interaction with other humans via computer and therefore:

- does not do well with social cues

- does not do well with body language

- does not understand the nuance of tactful communication

- has only interacted with faceless people who may or may not be female and are only communicating within the style of the game

- have grown up in the PUA era of being entitled to women and women more as objects than people

- feels more as though the world should adapt to them than learning how to fit in the world

 

 

None of the above are a slam. They are all thoughts that have been borne out in actual studies, actually. So they do not really know HOW to date, they do not want to take the risk outside their comfort zone, they expect if they finish a quest/equation, they should receive the reward, and that is how they approach dating. If I X, then a woman "should" want me.

 

They are also innately resistant to them being part of the problem.

 

So yes....when most women hear "I spend most of my time gaming in mom's basement/my dorm room" we automatically assume the above....and data supports our assumption.

 

OP, the hardest but best thing would be for you to take risks, be open, learn to let rejection roll off, and know that the only guarantees in dating are no guarantees. Oh, and learn that women are people, and that they are good people most of the time.

[knabe]

I don't really think so, things can be as difficult as one chooses to make them. Difficult is when you swim against the tide in any one aspect of life or don't walk to the same beat as everyone else.

 

Actually, I would posit that CHOOSING to swim against the stream on principle and to prove a point is the very definition of making life difficult.

 

We all have challenges and we all have crap. I do not think the shy struggling guy who wants a hot babe has it any worse than anyone else on earth. The fact that he THINKS he does is part of what makes him unattractive to women.

 

He just refuses to believe it.

[ZA Dater]

Dating is about Mating and sexual selection. There are 3 evolutionary drivers. Good genetics (health), ability to provide resources (social status), and willingness to raise the child (attention).

 

Friendship doesn't tick all those boxes very well. I don't think it can help you learn how to be a more successful mate by itself.

 

How does this fit for people who don't want kids?

[knabe]

How does this fit for people who don't want kids?

 

Well most people who don't want kids still value care and attention. But....people are not robots, car engines, or math equations. So again....no guarantees.

[knabe]

Putting himself out there is a good idea but where exactly? You say uncomfortable decisions, again this is opportunity cost, sitting in a club versus sitting at home bettering ones education or working towards something, if you are bad at the former then why expend time doing something you don't enjoy?

 

Such a shame that the only place women exist are in clubs looking for men who wear the right clothes.....

 

 

Oh wait, I have been to a club exactly twice in my life, and I have a fiance....and he wears jeans and shorts most of the time.

 

However did he find me? Oh, he found me by being social where he was, and by being open to a variety of people.

[Mysterio]

I am a realist with all things in my life and around me. Everything around me is striving. Strive to be a great son/friend/citizen/stay healthy/keep in shape.

 

When we get to heaven or the next state. Thats where we will get to perfection.

 

I want a woman that strives to be good. Not just good as its a state of perfection that makes it impossible to work with. Life does not work that way. We all have to strive and make an effort.

 

Nothing in my life is 100% ideal, including myself.

 

My ideal life would be being out of debit. A woman that really loves me beyond romance and sex and cares for me as I do her and we are really each others ideal match. She loves rock and roll and the same types of tv/movies/works out and stays fit and trim and we build our lives together. No rush to have kids. Loves pets.

 

We are all striving. Thats the point. Is it really hard to meet people. Depends on the situation. For me. I have always had a easy time meting people. So making friends is easy. Making a love match is hard. It seems to me when I calm my mind down. I will meet a love match when I don't really think about it or try. When I do make a big effort. Thats when things go off the rails.

 

I should just let love come to me in its own time. Yet Society says that I should join Tinder and Match.com etc. It won't do anything for me for the most part.

[Cobra_X]

How does this fit for people who don't want kids?

 

Do women who don't want kids suddenly attracted to fat slobs with nice personalities? No.

 

People who don't want kids are still trapped in the same instinctual attraction patterns. They are still having sex. Just because modern medicine allows for birth control doesn't mean the animal parts of their brains turn off!

[Shining One]

They are all thoughts that have been borne out in actual studies, actually.

Can you share links to the studies you're referring to? I'm curious about their methodology and what assumptions they generate about female gamers.

[whatnot]

I don't think some people realize how hard it is for some people to meet others to date. Finding someone you like, who happens to be single and wants the same type of relationship you do, and also happens to like you back can be hard for a lot of people.

 

If you're the nerdy introverted type who'd rather sit on the couch and play video game then go out to "da club" with your homedogs, then it's harder to meet people to date because you're not the type who goes out much. Why would I want to go to a bar and try to pickup girls and get rejected in favor of tall buff dudes, when I can have way more fun playing League of Legends in the comfort of my own home? I don't care what anybody says, rejection hurts. (especially when it's in favor of tall buff dudes)

 

And let's just say you're in school and you're in a classroom of 25 people. Well chances are, there may only be 1 or 2 girls in that class whom you're attracted to. If you were to strike up a conversation with them, chances are low that they happen to be single and are attracted to you enough to want to go on a date with you.

 

There's always the option of online dating, but online dating is a destroyer of confidence for many average men who don't resemble a greek god. Unlike decently attractive women who can virtually match with every single guy who are ready to have sex at moments notice, most guys will have to swipe right again and again and again and again and again and again -gasp- and STILL only get anywhere from 20-50 matches assuming he's swiping right to every girl. And let's just say he messages 20 of these girls, only which half of them respond, and then another half ghost him mid conversation. He asks the remaining 5 girls out on a date, which only 2 of them actually show up to the date. The other 3 flake.

 

Online dating is a crap hole for men unless you're in the top 10% of male attractiveness.

 

 

Especially as you get older and people start getting married off. You think being single at 30 is bad? Trying being a 30 year old dateless virgin who's options are single moms or those looking to settle down. No hating on single moms or those looking to get married, but most people who are starting out in the dating world arne't looking to get married to the first person they see naked.

 

it's only rejection if you frame it so

 

Ever wanted *anything* and been told "no"? Ever? Hurt your feelings?? when you get a red light and you have to stop instead of go? Hurt your feeling?

 

What kind of "relationship" are you looking for? LOL

 

STOP WITH THE CHARACTERIZATIONS ALREADY!

 

Have fun with it. Walk up to a woman and ask her if she wants to go skiing. See what she says. (don't do it if you don't mean it. Never say anything to anyone that you don't mean.....unless....*they* know...you don't mean it)

 

(I actually did that 20 years ago at work. A woman I'd never spoken with before.....walked up to her and asked her if she wanted to go skiing one day. She said...."Sure!" lol (that was the end of that....but....you get the idea)

[Cookiesandough]

I prefer guys who play video games (in moderation) because I like video games. I like someone who shares my interests. I imagine it's just like people with any other hobby. I like someone who can lay back and chill for awhile. Ambition is great, but I'd be concerned about a person who doesn't want to waste a minute on entertainment. In addition, it is a cultural norm at the moment.

[preraph]

Great points, Knabe.

[Cobra_X]

If you're a gamer, don't date women over the age of 40 or so. Just don't. They have this ridiculous notion that video games are for kids and they will immediately look down on any guy that likes to play games. Meanwhile, they see no problem sitting around scrolling through social media for hours each day. Once any woman has anything even slightly negative to say about you playing games, even if it's a joke, Next the crap out of her. You will save yourself a ton of headaches.

 

My observations in hobby trends is that ladies tend to be a generation behind men. When I was growing up, women didn't watch sports. It was always the guy sitting in front of the TV with his buddies watching the game and women didn't get into it. Now, the people I notice who are most into sports are the 30+ ladies. All the while, the men in the age bracket grew up with our Nintendo and Playstation, so many of us are more into gaming now. If you want to find a girl that plays games, meet a younger one. I have gamed with a lot of younger ladies online, especially back when I was big into World of Warcraft.

 

Holy crap is that statement true of many things! The women I would say 35 and up are completely different. It applies to anime, games, sports, computers... ect.

[JEG88]

I have a question, you say its a numbers game, how many did you meet from OLD before you found your gf?

 

I messaged maybe 200 women or so

Maybe 20 or so actually chatted with me

About 8 actually met up with me

 

This was over the course of a few months. After going on dates with my now-GF for about a month, we became exclusive/official and I stopped doing OLD.

 

So if you think of it from a numbers game perspective, for me roughly 1 in 20 women agreed to meet up with me.

[ZA Dater]

I messaged maybe 200 women or so

Maybe 20 or so actually chatted with me

About 8 actually met up with me

 

This was over the course of a few months. After going on dates with my now-GF for about a month, we became exclusive/official and I stopped doing OLD.

 

So if you think of it from a numbers game perspective, for me roughly 1 in 20 women agreed to meet up with me.

 

Well I would say that's a success on two fronts

 

 

1: You found 200 people you were attracted to

2: You one who wanted to date you.

 

 

If I have found 20 people I found attractive its a lot.

[ZA Dater]

it's only rejection if you frame it so

 

Ever wanted *anything* and been told "no"? Ever? Hurt your feelings?? when you get a red light and you have to stop instead of go? Hurt your feeling?

 

What kind of "relationship" are you looking for? LOL

 

STOP WITH THE CHARACTERIZATIONS ALREADY!

 

Have fun with it. Walk up to a woman and ask her if she wants to go skiing. See what she says. (don't do it if you don't mean it. Never say anything to anyone that you don't mean.....unless....*they* know...you don't mean it)

 

(I actually did that 20 years ago at work. A woman I'd never spoken with before.....walked up to her and asked her if she wanted to go skiing one day. She said...."Sure!" lol (that was the end of that....but....you get the idea)

 

Agree with this completely. BUT if you continually never really make progress then how exactly do you view it? Experience? Learning? How do you categorise it?

 

 

People with extrovert personalities do far better at socialising and by extension dating, its just a simple fact so sitting playing games might be great but it doesn't get you out there. Again its a trade off decision to make, enjoy doing something being gaming or not enjoy doing something going out in the hope you meet someone.

[ZA Dater]

We've had this conversation a dozen times. All I'm saying is that if he dedicates less time to staying home and playing videogames, and more time working towards getting something he ultimately wants more than that, he will have better luck. Videogames do nothing for him. If he wants girls, he should go to where the girls are and figure it out. You're overcomplicating it.

 

I am agreeing with you! People need to decide what they actually want and work towards that goal, its the same for anything in life but all I am saying is if the process makes you miserable then re assess how you do things and whether you are ready for the goal or should you rather step back and do other things and to quote "I used my time wisely, I studied, worked my ass off at building a business to enjoy success while my friends went from girl to girl", hopefully that's mostly a correct quote!

 

 

People should not live miserable lives because of dating, again someone tried to set me up and I politely mentioned I am working on other aspects of life because doing those things is more rewarding for me than simply going back down the dating rejection path. All I am saying to the OP is focus on life, build life up and find some happiness.

 

 

You cant run a marathon without training but you might be able to walk 5 miles without training.

[CptInsano]

I don't think the video game debate here helps the OP a whole lot. I knew a guy, also introverted, who could play chess against himself for hours. Would that be any better in the context of dating?

 

I may also be the oddball here who met somebody for a LTR in the chat function ofna video game, but I would consider that an exception.

 

It's not that the OP is playing video games, it's that he has a rather narrow focus on how to find women. He is interested in only a select group of women and limits himself to online dating, which is likely rather harsh in his age group.

 

He eshews the obvious places, such as student parties, tutoring, student organizations and such. Heck, I have met women on the subway, the bus, waiting rooms and even unisex bathrooms. I know that it is hard to talk to people as an introvert, but it is near impossible to get around it and it will take real effort doing so.

 

What the OP does in his spare time is secondary from my point of view.

[JEG88]

Well I would say that's a success on two fronts

 

1: You found 200 people you were attracted to

2: You one who wanted to date you.

 

If I have found 20 people I found attractive its a lot.

 

I would guess that was after swiping past more than a thousand profiles over the course of a few months too, so it was several levels of filtering over a long time lol

 

I got lazy and largely did that in bursts when I was lying in bed or something, it wasn't a consistent effort to be honest because I got tired of all the fakes, flakes and catfish.

[Cobra_X]

Yeah. My GF is 38 like me, and while anime and games aren't really her thing, she is open minded enough to enjoy some of it. She loves Sword Art Online and was playing my PS4 with me this evening. However, most are not like that. Anime is cartoons which are for kids and video games are also only for kids. Just generational differences.

 

I went to an anime convention this year. It was very close to 50% female. The only women I met above 35 were bringing their kids and generally looked bored with the whole thing.

 

But... I don't think this will be a problem for the OP meeting people because younger women are into these things as well.

 

Well I would say that's a success on two fronts

1: You found 200 people you were attracted to

2: You one who wanted to date you.

If I have found 20 people I found attractive its a lot.

 

His experience does not match what I am told of many other guys in online dating. A 1 in 10 response rate is pretty good for a guy to my opinion. A 50% meetup rate off that is equally impressive. What I hear from average guys is typically 1000 messages, 10 responses 2 meetups.

 

Also... you can't find 20 attractive guys? That is crazy. You are likely too judgmental.