My BF's fear of being controlled

[Gaeta]

This is EXACTLY what I was thinking.

 

Generally when a guy has this "women are controlling" thing, it Red Flags to me immediately.

 

And eight months in (around six months) is about the right amount of time for the Red Flags to start showing up .

 

Men who also say "women that I date do XYZ." Almost have an in-built narrative that means you'll be the next woman who is described as doing XYZ.

 

I am not saying you are in a Verbally Abusive Relationship. But I suggest you read The Verbally Abusive Relationship to see if this is one of those relationships where YOU are in a relationship and HE is in a power struggle.

 

I honestly fear when men say the C-word. Because men that get "scared" about control instead of simply enforcing their personal boundaries tend to react very poorly to any perceived threat.

 

They are the type that either abuse: Verbally or physically. Or they don't confront you with issues and just cheat around on you to "strike back."

 

I hate dating. I hope I never have to do it again.

 

This is none sense from top to bottom. This is beyond being carried away. It's pure fabrication out of a fertile imagination.

[Gaeta]

I am here to get perspective and advise on facts presented. I am not here to have his character destroyed by all types of bumbo jumbo extrapolations. If this is the road this thread is taking i will have it closed.

[anika99]

I don't think anyone here wants to destroy your bf's character or upset you, I think they just want to remind you to be careful.

 

 

DOT's post wasn't nonsense, maybe it doesn't apply to your bf but what she said is generally true.

 

 

I'm not saying your bf is abusive or controlling. I will say I have had an abusive controlling bf and earlier on he was much the same as your bf. He was incredibly helpful, loving and supportive for the first year we were together. All he seemed to want to do is build me up and assist wherever he could and that did include helping my family and my youngest son. I thought I won the bf lottery.

 

 

It was at about the 7-8 month mark that some odd conversations started creeping in that left me scratching my head. He would become offended by something I said and yet it wasn't the actual words I uttered it was a vague complaint about the way I said it. The tone of my voice or the look on my face. I found this confusing because I didn't think I had a poor tone of voice or a look on my face but as he was clearly upset I would try my best to understand him and to remember his sensitivities so as not to trigger him. I mean he was the perfect bf, no man before him had ever been as loving and caring towards me as him so surely his complaints must have had merit and the least I could do was listen and understand, especially after all he had done for me.

 

 

You know where this is going. The list of things I said and did slowly grew bigger and bigger. At first we could go a long period of time between episodes so I kept blaming myself or making excuses for him. I moved in with him after a year of dating him and at that point he had only become upset with me about 4 times which isn't bad, couples do become upset with one another from time to time, but when he became upset it was always because of something I said or did that I didn't see as offensive. I mean, was I a social buffoon? I thought I knew how to talk to people with kindness and love but according to him, I did not. Once we moved in together he pretty much dropped the act and he started having episodes with me on a regular basis so I moved out but that wasn't the end of our relationship. Because all that kindness and love he gave me in the beginning reeled me in and hooked me and the criticisms that came later weakened me and without knowing it I had developed an emotional dependence on him.

 

 

That story may have nothing at all to do with your bf, or it may have everything to do with him. At 8 months of dating you don't him as well as you think you do. Knowing everything about him as in knowing about his childhood, his past relationships, his thoughts, his philosophies, etc...isn't the same as knowing him. That takes time, more than 8 months, so just be careful. I'm not saying he's a bad guy, and I truly hope he's not and that you two have many fabulous years together.

[TXGuy]

This is none sense from top to bottom. This is beyond being carried away. It's pure fabrication out of a fertile imagination.

 

Hi Gaeta -

 

I'm glad you made the call to bring some sanity back to the conversation. If you had not, it would've devolved into another mountain out of a molehill, snowballing, man-bashing thread.

 

What I think was one of your valid concerns was that fact that you had two 'issues' in one week. That would be a reason to have some concern if there were two issues in one week.

 

But, I think you only had one little issue in that week. That was the 'who is Sebastian' thing (assuming it went as you said). That one might have been a little hiccup with him ever-so-slightly overreacting.

 

From my view, the second item you mentioned is good news/bad news. The good news is he did nothing wrong, which means you didn't have two little issues in one week.

 

The bad news is that issue is 95% you being unreasonable. This guy drives an hour out of his way every day (each way) to see you practically every day (something you said, not long before dating this guy, you would never do for a man). He sees you nearly every day and treats you very well. He takes a day for himself (when you had no set plans) and you pitch a fit and bring up 'saturday is date night' ('you are not working hard enough for me'). When he calls you on it, you come back with the weak excuse that 'you were just joking.' (While the rest of the commentators here ate that up, these are the same pack of rabid feminists that would be HORRIFIED if some man tried to get a free pass on some comment because he claimed he was 'just joking.') Further indications I think you (not him) was at fault on this one is your reaction after he told you he felt like you were being a bit controlling. Your reaction was to browbeat him until you got him to say that you were NOT controlling. You simply dismissed his perfectly valid, honestly felt, concerns that he opened up to share with you. It came across to me that you were more concerned with winning the argument than listening to how he felt.

 

Summary: I think you were at fault for the Saturday/Date night dust-up. The good news is that likely means you two don't have a big issue to worry about at this point. The fact that he immediately let both of these things go bodes well for you two as a couple.

 

I'm glad you didn't jump on the 'he is a jerk' train that this thread seemed to be going on.

[joseb]

Honestly I think there is too much projecting going on from everyone on here.

 

I get that we all have life experiences that effect us though, so in a way it's hard not to.

 

I'll give my own (biased) opinion.

 

If I had been seeing someone and spending pretty much all my time with her, and the one time I mentioned doing something without her I got the reply you gave, if would immediately raise my heckles. Why? Maybe because of my past experiences, yes.

If probably triggers 50 arguments in my past around the same topic.

Perhaps Ive been unlucky, or chosen badly, but apart from my first ltr, all my relationships after have had an element of this.

 

If this guys past is the same, his reaction might make sense.

 

And no, this doesn't mean I think all women are controlling (and I certainly don't think Gaeta is). It's just been a pretty common experience for me.

Edited July 30, 2016 by joseb

[Ruby Slippers]

If I had been seeing someone and spending pretty much all my time with her, and the one time I mentioned doing something without her I got the reply you gave, if would immediately raise my heckles. Why? Maybe because of my past experiences, yes.

If probably triggers 50 arguments in my past around the same topic.

Perhaps Ive been unlucky, or chosen badly, but apart from my first ltr, all my relationships after have had an element of this.

Now it seems you're projecting.

 

He said if I am disappointed then to express disappointment to him and to not come up with silly rules like Saturdays are girlfriends night.

 

He ended up cancelling his plans to stay with me and it made me feel even worse. I told him he didn't have to do that and he said I am more important and everything is alright.

So he suggested you're being dominating. Then he willingly surrendered his plan and proclaimed your dominance. Sounds to me like deep down he enjoys testing your "rules" then submitting to them.

 

I've gotten this dynamic from your posts about him before - that you're in charge and he enjoys submitting to you to an extent.

[dreamingoftigers]

This is none sense from top to bottom. This is beyond being carried away. It's pure fabrication out of a fertile imagination.

 

Wow thanks for the ignorant reply.

 

 

You might not like my perspective based on both my experience and literature, as well as my decade-long marriage and witnessing the 35 year marriage of my parents..... but that doesn't mean it is "imagined" or "nonsense."

 

It means it doesn't resonate with you. Great. Maybe you are exceptional and your mate isn't projecting his crap on you. Lucky. Must be nice.

 

But hey, you can take the advice or not. Read the book or not.

 

When you post on a public forum, you get a variety of replies from people who have had a variety of experiences. That doesn't mean that they "didn't happen" just because you weren't there or didn't see it.

 

Considering others have posted up your boyfriend's behaviour as being concerning, it isn't that far-fetched.

 

I'll stay off of your threads in the future. If I want a rude response to stuff I post, I'll post on Facebook.

[joseb]

Now it seems you're projecting.

 

I'm not sure how I could premise this and explain where I'm coming from any better. I'm giving my perspective based on considerable varied life experience and a reading of the situation based on Gaeta's explanation, while being cognisant of the possibility of projecting where it's not relevant.

 

In this case I think it is relevant. Gaeta's BF had controlling GFs in the past.

 

Everyone has their quirks, flaws and failings.

I think this guy's response in this case is totally understandable, and all that has been read into it on here is quite incredible to me.

 

That's not to say there might be issues, I for one think they spend way too much time together, and all at her place. It sounds imbalanced.

 

So what do people think he should have done?

Never make plans to meet anyone else?

Or if he does and Gaeta says those things, cancel the plans?

Or call her on it and say I hope you are joking?

I think whatever he did you would be lynching him for it.

[Lois_Griffin]

Fast forward yesterday. He gets a phone call in front of me. He puts the guy on speaker phones and has a conversation with him on speaker phones right in front of me. When he hung up I asked 'who's Sebastian'. They just had a conversation on speaker phones in front of me so I didn't think it was prying on my part!! (was it?)

 

He took it as prying. Again we got into a debate in which he asked me if I think he is hiding something from me cause he's not and he told me about Sebastian before - and reminded me when he spoke to me about Sebastian.

 

I told him he was really over doing it this time how could he perceive my 'who's Sebastian' as prying and he said my tone. It was inquisitive. If I had a different tone and worded it differently it would have been ok.

Is this guy so absolutely wonderful that he's worth constantly walking on eggs for? Because quite honestly, he sure doesn't sound wonderful.

 

It's like he's SCRAPING for things to accuse you of and using stupid, senseless situations in order to accomplish that goal.

[DramaInPajamas]

Here is an incident.

 

Last weekend he told me last minute he had made plans with friends for Saturday. I said: aaawww serious! I thought we were gonna go see Star Trek, Saturdays are girlfriend nights! c'mon! (I said this in a teasing way with huge grin on my face)

 

That was the wrong thing to say! I got a speech on how every night is girlfriend night and in 8 months he only took 2 Saturdays away from me. That I cannot dictate which night he can go out, this is controlling and he can't deal with controlling blahblahblah.

 

I told him I was not trying to control him. He is free to go out I was just expressing my disappointment and I was even teasing. He said if I am disappointed then to express disappointment to him and to not come up with silly rules like Saturdays are girlfriends night.

 

Anyway it turned into a big deal I've never meant it to be. He ended up cancelling his plans to stay with me and it made me feel even worse. I told him he didn't have to do that and he said I am more important and everything is alright.

 

I dont like where this is headed.

 

You sound like a cool, independant, lady who knows her own mind.

 

I am like you in relationships, I dont need them around all the time, I can do my own thing, I like to have a bf and see them rather than need it, if that makes sense.

 

But if he doesnt appreciate that and you cant even joke about being disappointed that you wont see him on a Saturday then that would make me nervous. Are you supposed to bend over backward and give him everything he wants. Not even raise something you are not happy with?

 

But then again, you are at that stage where the honeymoon is ending and it more reality. Perhaps more minor disagreements are inevitable and this is just natural. Perhaps it is nothing to worry about.

Edited July 30, 2016 by DramaInPajamas

[Gaeta]

Wow thanks for the ignorant reply.

 

 

You might not like my perspective based on both my experience and literature, as well as my decade-long marriage and witnessing the 35 year marriage of my parents..... but that doesn't mean it is "imagined" or "nonsense."

 

It means it doesn't resonate with you. Great. Maybe you are exceptional and your mate isn't projecting his crap on you. Lucky. Must be nice.

 

I got my own personal 15 year experience with domestic physical, emotional, financial abuse as experience. I am qualified enough to identify an abuser.

[DramaInPajamas]

I think this is just the post honeymoon stage. Nothing wrong just normal and that you do start doing things with others more often.

[DramaInPajamas]

Oops double post

[Gaeta]

Is this guy so absolutely wonderful that he's worth constantly walking on eggs for? Because quite honestly, he sure doesn't sound wonderful.

 

It's like he's SCRAPING for things to accuse you of and using stupid, senseless situations in order to accomplish that goal.

 

I have always been a big fan of your post and humor except today.

 

We had this one incident in 8 months and you are talking like he has a history of doing this to me.

 

People aren't perfect, I am not perfect, and you're not either. Sometimes out of the blue we say or do stupid things for stupid reasons. One incident does not make him a jerk, or an abuser, or someone I will have to walk on eggshell around.

[DramaInPajamas]

I have always been a big fan of your post and humor except today.

 

We had this one incident in 8 months and you are talking like he has a history of doing this to me.

 

People aren't perfect, I am not perfect, and you're not either. Sometimes out of the blue we say or do stupid things for stupid reasons. One incident does not make him a jerk, or an abuser, or someone I will have to walk on eggshell around.

 

And these incidents commonly start to occur round about now.

 

Honeymoon has ended. The initial mad rush is less intense. Moving into more longer term. These types of disagreements start round about now.

[Gaeta]

So thank you everyone for dropping in my thread I appreciate the time and efforts of everyone.

 

I am in accordance that first incident about Saturday was on me. We did not have set plans to go to the movies on that Saturday. The man gives me all of his evenings 7 days a week, he's entitled to take some time off with his buddies. My 'girlfriend night' comment was a passive aggressive comment disguised in humor.

 

The second incident is on him. His comment to me was rude and uncalled for. Like a few of you said it's been 8,5 months, we're slowly moving out of our honeymoon phase and testing boundaries.

 

Him and I spoke about it last night. He admits he has a fear of being controlled and is sensitive to some interactions that resemble control. The source of this his mother whom he cut out of his life not so long ago.

 

There is no need for me to walk on eggshell around him. He invited me to express myself openly, I am welcome to express my anger, frustration, concerns and worries. His problems is with 'getting orders' not about getting feed backs.

 

With this conversation we had last night it definitely feels like we're entering the following phase of our relationship. The one where we see each other for whom we really are and where we decide to accept each other with our flaws.

[joseb]

So thank you everyone for dropping in my thread I appreciate the time and efforts of everyone.

 

I am in accordance that first incident about Saturday was on me. We did not have set plans to go to the movies on that Saturday. The man gives me all of his evenings 7 days a week, he's entitled to take some time off with his buddies. My 'girlfriend night' comment was a passive aggressive comment disguised in humor.

 

The second incident is on him. His comment to me was rude and uncalled for. Like a few of you said it's been 8,5 months, we're slowly moving out of our honeymoon phase and testing boundaries.

 

Him and I spoke about it last night. He admits he has a fear of being controlled and is sensitive to some interactions that resemble control. The source of this his mother whom he cut out of his life not so long ago.

 

There is no need for me to walk on eggshell around him. He invited me to express myself openly, I am welcome to express my anger, frustration, concerns and worries. His problems is with 'getting orders' not about getting feed backs.

 

With this conversation we had last night it definitely feels like we're entering the following phase of our relationship. The one where we see each other for whom we really are and where we decide to accept each other with our flaws.

 

Sounds like a sensible approach. Can't be honeymoon forever!

 

You are right, the second on is on him. But it's possible it would not have happened without the first.

[Dis]

Hi Gaeta!

 

Just want to start off by saying this doesnt sound like a huge deal

 

It sounds like the underlying issue is....he needs some space and time for himself...we all need alone time....time with our friends.....time away from our partner

 

Forget about the little arugement you guys had about the phone call...thats just a symptom of the problem

 

You guys have spent alot of time together....so now he's feeling like he needs to pull back alittle...all men are like that

 

Men might love all the time spent together in the beginning but after awhile...they need some alone time...some space to breathe

 

Pls dont work yourself up and start to wonder if this is the beginning of the end...its not...this is a common issue in relationships

 

Solution: If I were you, I'd pull back alittle...to ease his tension....maybe tell him straight up that you acknowledge the fact that you two have spent alot of time together and there needs to be some breathing room....assure him that everything is fine but there needs to be alittle more healthy space. This will alleviate any pressure he may feel to hang out nearly everyday...it will give him more freedom and believe me when I say....guys come looking for women when they dont go looking for them...I'm sure after you've given him some space...he'll be all lovey dovey once again and everything will be peachy

 

And Gaeta, I really dont think your man is being a jerk at all...men are men...they need their space....they're not great at communicating this either...no one is perfect so pls dont start dissecting this and buying into the comments that he's a jerk or that this is the beginning of the end...its not...hes not a jerk...hes a man...simple as that. This is a very common problem that has an easy solution

[Redhead14]

She doesn't think he's a jerk nor do we . . . she should not pull back or put "extra space". They are past that "stage" of the relationship. They have had a reasonable and clear conversation about all this. She simply needs to sit back now and observe. She wasn't looking to encroach on HIS space, they simply never had a plan for anything and just riding on the "routine". She's got this well in hand. Don't do anything different right now except maybe talk more about schedules and expectations going forward and compromise if needed.

[preraph]

Let me rephrase it

 

my north-American way is too forward for him means = my north-American way is too forward for him.

 

It means what it means, not that he prefers submissive women. He may be used to more submissive women but it's one big step to make a statement like he prefers submissive women.

 

 

ETA: and he also said at least with me he knows where I stand there is no guessing which he appreciates so, this north American women thing is just something he needs to get used to, it's not something he is rejecting. It's a cultural difference he has identified and he is letting me know about it.

 

News flash: A whole lot of men would prefer women who always let them have their way. Tell him you'd prefer a prince who lived in a castle and provided a staff to pamper and wait on you.

[Dis]

She doesn't think he's a jerk nor do we . . . she should not pull back or put "extra space". They are past that "stage" of the relationship. They have had a reasonable and clear conversation about all this. She simply needs to sit back now and observe. She wasn't looking to encroach on HIS space, they simply never had a plan for anything and just riding on the "routine". She's got this well in hand. Don't do anything different right now except maybe talk more about schedules and expectations going forward and compromise if needed.

 

Actually many other posters said "hes a jerk"

 

I stand by my initial post

 

You sure are snippy even for the internet...I seem to remember you being pretty rude months ago...relax alittle hun...lets all be adults and play nice

[bad username]

It's very odd that he should say that French or European women in general are submissive, because it's simply not the truth. Submissive has a very specific connotation, whereas most European men know enough to expect American women to be different at expressing themselves.

[Redhead14]

Actually many other posters said "hes a jerk"

 

I stand by my initial post

 

You sure are snippy even for the internet...I seem to remember you being pretty rude months ago...relax alittle hun...lets all be adults and play nice

 

I'm never rude, I may deliver tough love/truth once in a while and people don't like Truth . . . and just because other people have said "he's a jerk", doesn't mean a thing to me. This man has been good for Gaeta, and they may be crossing a threshold. Time will tell.

[Gaeta]

It's very odd that he should say that French or European women in general are submissive, because it's simply not the truth. Submissive has a very specific connotation, whereas most European men know enough to expect American women to be different at expressing themselves.

 

His words were that women in France, at least in Paris where he's from, are more subtle in delivering their messages and are not confrontational the way north American women seems to be.

[Redhead14]

His words were that women in France, at least in Paris where he's from, are more subtle in delivering their messages and are not confrontational the way north American women seems to be.

 

Yes, there are "cultural" differences, sometimes, but he is here in America dating an American woman. When in Rome . . . all this actually went pretty well.